Comparing Grasshopper and Dynamo!

Grasshopper and Dynamo are both great computational design tools however I think it is worth showing how they perform at similar tasks. I use both tools in my daily work but for very different things - this video might show you an example of why this is the case...
I hope you enjoy the session and learn something new! Feel free to comment any feedback/questions below, or follow my channel if you enjoyed this.
Learn more about Dynamo at;
primer.dynamobim.org/
Feed your Rhino with custom packages here:
www.food4rhino.com/
Software used;
Autodesk Revit 2019: www.autodesk.com/products/rev...
Dynamo: dynamobim.org/
Rhino 5: www.rhino3d.com/download/rhin...
Grasshopper: www.grasshopper3d.com/
Google Remote Desktop: remotedesktop.google.com/access/
Flashback Express: www.flashbackrecorder.com/exp...
Hardware used;
Webcam: support.logitech.com/en_us/pr...
Laptop: laptopmedia.com/laptop-specs/...
Microphone: www.rode.com/microphones/nt-usb
Intro/Outro Music: www.purple-planet.com/

[@PedroMartins-vj2zz]

Hello there! In my opinion, this comparison is not totally fair, once the programs are optimized for different purposes. Clearly, Grasshopper has been designed to perform better in the design of free form elements with the information given by the user. Dynamo, on the other hand, is linked with Revit and so is more focused on correctly getting the data (in this case the amount of information can be huge) of the model elements. Also, we have to keep in mind the difference of year of development of both softwares!

[@AussieBIMGuru]

Totally agree - I do mention all of these points in my preamble and conclusion (and also mention rhino inside). In some regards they are not fairly comparable, although they do have the potential to 'move' into each others turf, so one day maybe they will be. I also hear/see a lot of 'conflict' betwern users of the two (typically by elitist types) so I wanted to show both sides of a fence. I really just wanted to show my channel that grasshopper is a far more suitable geometry based visual coding alternative as my channel has been focused on dynamo to date. Many users that reach out to me are facing issues with dynamo freeform geometry tasks which it struggles to handle (one user even asked 'how can i make dynamo go faster!'), Both tools have their uses (and i still regularly use both!).

[@FirasNoori]

Happy to see such a valuable video!! Cheers mate

[@AussieBIMGuru]

Thanks Firas, I'm glad you enjoyed it!

[@MercifulArchitect]

Really helpful, thanks for the content!

[@AussieBIMGuru]

Glad it was helpful!

[@phuongdang3790]

Hello Gavin, I am starting my parametric learning path. I'm familiar with Revit and just learning Rhino for a few weeks. Can you give me and advice should I focus on Dynamo or Grasshopper first? Both are quite difficult for me. Thank you and keep this great works!

[@AussieBIMGuru]

Hi Phuong, congrats on your new journey! I would focus on whichever better suits your everyday needs. If you focus on form modelling and competition/feasibility work then Grasshopper will be better to learn first, if you focus on documentation/construction and Revit based work then Dynamo will suit better. Ideally take the time to try out both eventually, I use both in my workflows currently for different things.

[@FinArt119]

Thanks man! Grasshopper for Geometry Dynamo for Revit Data

[@AussieBIMGuru]

As a general rule of thumb yes, although from time to time they have different use cases.

[@arkplato2186]

Thanks for the video. Great presentation.

[@AussieBIMGuru]

You're welcome!

[@asapworkout4678]

Lovely one I have been confused about learning grasshopper due to industry usage for tekla structure, However with this video am sure I need to focus on Dynamo first

[@AussieBIMGuru]

I'm glad the video helped weigh up the two platforms! Personally I use them both a lot but I expect for engineering the benefits may differ. Some engineers use Grasshopper for bridge and load analysis using Karamba and sofistik.

[@robingdwl]

Very valuable video, even though the two programs have slightly different priorities AFAIK and comparing them directly can be difficult. Is Dynamo able to make use of more CPU-Cores or even GPU-accelleration? Grasshopper is limited in that regard for many components.

[@AussieBIMGuru]

I haven't seen any parallel processing nodes in Dynamo before, although I know Ladybug for Grasshopper has a few (e.g. the sun hour analysis node). It looks like some people have experimented with parallelism in dynamo although I suspect maybe in sandbox where it isn't shackled in Revit as its head. Maybe touch base with Kean who wrote this article; www.keanw.com/2019/05/parallel-operations-in-dynamo-and-refinery.html

[@AJ.911]

Thank you for your presentation, I have some concerns I would like be answered on As a Bentley user who used to work with GC(GenerativeComponents) I see a shorter workflow for generating what you did in GC. Yes, I understand that GH is much more advanced and has a lot more features than GC. But, from BIM perspective where your job is to create and optimize buildings and roads with output data and schedules, I see that GC is much easier and user friendly in this case. I would like to hear your opinion about what I said if you worked in GC, as I have been advised to learn Dynamo or Grasshopper lately, which one should I start learning? and what outcomes shall I expect by moving to grasshopper/dynamo from GenerativeComponents?

[@AussieBIMGuru]

That's a great question, and from what I've seen of Bentley GC it does work really well for certain workflows. The aspects where Grasshopper really beats GC and Dynamo are where you use the custom developer packages such as Ladybug, Kangaroo and Generative design tools like Galapagos and Wallacei. I agree Grasshopper is not as user friendly to a new user, I always encourage people to learn Dynamo/families (or in your case GC) and only use Grasshopper if they actually need it. In my case I mostly use Grasshopper for solar analysis (Ladybug) and complex mesh operations and processing (native as well as weaverbird). Noting that we can now use Grasshopper in Revit using Rhino Inside. Here's an example of me using Ladybug/GH; kzbin.info/www/bejne/n6XdaKaDgN2bprc

[@AJ.911]

@@AussieBIMGuru Thank you for your well detailed answer, I will surely check the attached video. As I said, from my experience as I work in buildings, I am not expecting more features I can't get from openbuildings or generativecomponents. But lately I have been advised much to shift to grasshopper which left me now to do my own research to see what capabilities I can get from GH if I started to learn it. as it doesn't look user-friendly to me at least. But obviously much faster engine. Thank you again for your answer and time, I appreciate it!

Hey Gavin! I'm watching this video again 7 months later, timeless content! Are you doing this comparison video again anytime soon? The autodesk released new versions of dynamo/revit and the generative design tool, this may be changed a bit the scenario, right?

[@AussieBIMGuru]

Good to know it holds up well! I'll probably wait until the second patcb of 2021 as the gen design tool is pretty rusty currently - barely stands up to galapagos right now I'd say!

[@loulwakharbotly2082]

Hello and thanks for your efforts Can I take advantage of the thermal properties of the Revit model inside Grasshoppers Because I found the thermal analysis in the grasshopper bigger and it had more definitions In other words, is there a mechanism for linking the Revit model to the Grasshopper environment?

[@AussieBIMGuru]

Hi there! You can, although it will require Rhino Inside in order to read element properties and process them via Grasshopper. I have a mini-series on how to migrate geometry, as well as get/set parameter values between them here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/ap6Vgmxmas5-Y6c

[@lineseeking]

Very useful! Thanks :)

[@AussieBIMGuru]

You're welcome!

[@foolishfactotum]

Hi Gravin, Nice video. Can you add Bentley's GenerativeComponets to this comparison? It is one of the first and older than most of the available computational design tool. Would be great to see the comparison of all three.

[@AussieBIMGuru]

Unfortunately I don't use (or access) Bentley software. From what I understand it has fallen behind its competitors over time, and that Bentley's focus has been on other areas for a while such as infrastructure.

[@RM-xk6iu]

Hi all. Archicad user here, although i can find my way on Revit when needed. Im planning on learning parametric/generative design but im not sure which platform would be better for me. For one i hear its better to use a native format, in this case Dynamo inside the Revit environment, while i keep hearing great things about Grasshopper, but you need a pluging to use it with Archicad and Rhino. My reason for learning it is not to generate organic forms and curvy facades (well, maybe a little bit of that), but rather to study volumetric options of growth over time (for self built housing) and analysing spatial and formal configurations given some initial constraints. So my question is this: which option would you recommed for working on this?

[@AussieBIMGuru]

Great to hear from other platform users! Whilst dynaml has project refinery, I would suggest looking into Grasshopper live connect for ArchiCAD. Wallacei, Galalagos, Octopus and Possum in Grasshopper are far superior to any other option. Wallacei has a great youtube channel showing how it all works (multi-goal, can display result 3d previews side by side etc.). For a single numerically measured goal, galalagos is usually enough. Hope that helps!

[@RM-xk6iu]

@@AussieBIMGuru thanks for answering so swiftly! This is absolutely helpful. I'll check everything out, decide on the platform and then jump head first to learn it.

[@AussieBIMGuru]

@@RM-xk6iu you're welcome, and best of luck!

[@rq9772]

Hola, ¿cuáles son los plugins imprescindibles o recomendados para grasshopper?...

[@AussieBIMGuru]

Recomiendo Weaverbird, Human, Human UI, Galápagos, Wallacei, Elefront, Pufferfish, Lunchbox, Rhino Inside Revit, Metahopper, Anemone. Hay muchos más, pero estos son algunos que uso a menudo.

[@FirasNoori]

It is always the big question I face with my students regarding the comparison between Dynamo and Grasshopper!! I do not use Grasshopper but always watch from far away what happens with it and how it works, yet I feel Dynamo has the upper edge with the Adaptive Components, and its ability to fully integrated with Revit!! yet Grasshopper as I feel it much faster with pure geometry as it has no need to do the work twice as Dynamo needs to do it in its viewport and then go back to make Revit redo it, especially if you use Dynamo to direct model Revit elements. All the best dear, and keep the good videos!!

[@AussieBIMGuru]

Thanks Firas, I used to be Dynamo purist until recently also, but I must say having spent some time with Grasshopper I'm 100% sold on it's value. Highly recommend looking into it further when you have time - I actually have some videos coming up on 'Rhino Inside' - a tool which lets Grasshopper run in Revit and access the IronPython and API features - it seriously threatens Dynamo's worth in future I think. Adaptive families are indeed fantastic, but don't necessarily rely on Dynamo, just a computational tool telling them where to go, Rhino Inside can do this! I intend to keep using and educating on both platforms in future however - Dynamo's influence on the discourse of computational design is worth so much on its own regardless!

[@FirasNoori]

@@AussieBIMGuru I had to make the hard choice last year to choose which one to study, and I picked Dynamo as it is totally and mainly designed for Revit. I am also aiming to use it as a tool for my PhD work, I tried to deal with Grasshopper, but I hated the idea of opening a new line to study!! so Rhino and Grasshopper seemed to me back then as new 2 targets to learn!! and the issue is always the time! it flies away !! I started to record and post here on youtube all my learning steps and people seem to like it, and that gave more motivation to grow and learn more about Dynamo. Cheer mate and have a nice weekend!! Always waiting to see more of your great videos!!

[@AussieBIMGuru]

@@FirasNoori that's OK I did dynamo only for 2 years - focus is critical. I think you made the right choice, if you use Revit Dynamo is a much better way to contextualize your learning. Great work, and best of luck! Should you ever have any queries or challenges feel free to reach out :) And thanks for the kind words!

[@FirasNoori]

@@AussieBIMGuru All the best mate, looking forward to work on a project one day with you :) and I have lots and lots of challenges!! tell me if you have some spare time !! cheers

[@AussieBIMGuru]

@@FirasNoori always happy to give tips, feel free to send any queries to my email in the banner!

[@mavs013]

实际上我是先学的Grasshopper，因为实际的项目需求，但是我知道Revit有个类似的图形化编程插件，那时候还不是内嵌在Revit里的，版本号还是1.3，是独立安装的，我后来尝试在Dynamo里面重新做了一遍，几个感受，Dynamo里面实现Grasshopper同样的功能需要更多的节点或者步骤，相对更繁琐，而且Grasshopper里缩放基本没什么问题，Revit里的Dynamo节点多了缩放就会卡，那时候我刚学，处理数据并不十分得心应手，所以导致节点很多。另外发现Grasshopper里的功能和第三方插件更多，比如image sample做穿孔铝板，还有lunchbox在Dynamo里停止维护和开发了，而在Grasshopper里继续支持。尽管这样我个人现在还是用Dynamo，学Dynamo更多，因为我用Revit更多，Rhino对我而言更多的是造型软件，并不算一款真正意义上的BIM软件，希望后面Dynamo开发越来越好，效率越来越高，第三方插件包越来越丰富和强大。

[@AussieBIMGuru]

Yes I've come to use Grasshopper much more since this video and when dealing with geometry I nearly always use Grasshopper and Rhino Inside Revit. Dynamo is definitely much better at dealing with the Revit API and data management and its list management system is more intuitive than data trees I feel. Rhino may not be a BIM software, but can sort of be used like one. I use the Elefront package often to bake attributes into objects. Dynamo is growing but I worry that the package and version management is becoming quite challenging and prohibitive, these days I prefer to work in pyRevit and find it easier to scale. Thanks for sharing your thoughts and experiences!

[@zahraouiyounes1489]

can i use it with matlab ? and how ??

[@AussieBIMGuru]

I don't think either can run matlab. Most workflows I see extract data from either one as CSV format and run their workflows in stages.

[@chamhashm7232]

So which one is better ? Rhino or dynamo ?

[@AussieBIMGuru]

Good for different things. Grasshopper is better at complex geometry and dynamo is better for working closely with revit API, elements and data.

[@archist9789]

I expected Grasshopper is faster than Dynamo, but I didn't think it' so super faster. We had a plan to use Dynamo last year (will will keep using Rhino+Grasshopper), but it was cancelled. We decided to wait for the release of Rhino 7+ Rhino.Inside.

[@AussieBIMGuru]

If your workflows tend to center around geometric, generative or analytical workflows then Grasshopper is typically superior. If you use BIM model workflows in Revit, Dynamo will likely still trump Rhino Inside for this in regards to ease of use and deployment. Dynamo is almost as fast as Grasshopper at moving data around lists, it is moreso the previewing and analysis of geometry that it is slower with.

[@wahabfiles6260]

how does Dynamo compare to Node Red?

[@AussieBIMGuru]

The main thing they have in common is their visual programming UI. Beyond that Node Red is focused on web platform automation and interoperability, whilst Dynamo is generally used within software such as Revit. Both are relying on API's from the various platforms they integrate into.

[@wahabfiles6260]

@@AussieBIMGuru makes so much sense. I though Dynamo could be used as stand-alone GUI but as I understand from your comment is that its only used with Revit

[@AussieBIMGuru]

@@wahabfiles6260 it can be used standalone (e.g. dynamo sandbox), but generally it is ran inside other applications such as revit.

[@wahabfiles6260]

@@AussieBIMGuru perfect! thanks

[@izvarzone]

It's like Houdini

[@AussieBIMGuru]

I haven't used Houdini but i can see some similarities in the UI and scripting.