The Most Misunderstood Item in Dota

[@revelation6403]

Sorry BSJ, BKB is the most misunderstood item. My cores don't know it has an active.

[@lifenote1943]

:(

[@mayurbansal]

😂😂😂

[@mayurbansal]

Wait... Wut you can use it???? 😱😱

[@alial-kateeb5267]

This tbh

[@judehilot3139]

My cores doesnt even know that they can be bought

[@Dru1D_]

Ramzes: - gets both Midas and Maelstrom - refuses to elaborate - leaves

[@trollinggaming9903]

what hero is he playing?

[@Dru1D_]

@@trollinggaming9903 he does that on Jugg and NP more often than not

[@idktbh6841]

yuragi too

[@lifenote1943]

I mean I guess if your team is getting rolled so hard you literally can't take a single fight... Maybe? But I feel like manta would be better idk.

[@bladegaimin]

@@Dru1D_ with jug and np they’re more of a fighty carries that are able to farm large parts of the map relatively safely. Both heroes benefit from the early attack speed and spend a lot of their time farming while joining all the fights as opposed to other Carries like AM or alch that don’t want to fight early. The Midas speeds up the process of the farm as they can get it early on to ramp their early game levels which both heroes benefit from as well plus it gives attack speed. This natural progression into maelstrom makes sense because then you can clear waves faster while having impact in team fights, maelstrom also gets upgraded into a mjollnir most of the time and super buffs these two heroes. Fury is too slow on jug because while you can push waves and farm camps really quickly, he won’t have as high of an impact in fights with a fury as opposed to maelstrom due to the strength of his shard proccing the lightning. For np he just wants to clear every camp and wave as fast as he can because he can teleport to literally anywhere so it’s best to play the cat and mouse game showing on the map only for a short while thus taking resources that other heroes cant. And during the downtimes where NP has no space to farm the Midas still acts as an accelerator same with jug. That’s how I think of it.

[@darthbinks5987]

I got banned once for cheating after only using Dota Plus from overwolf. I was really upset since it was my first account, so I wrote to steam support and explained that I was only using that app and I didn't know if it was illegal or not. I had little hope but on the next day they lifted vac ban. Sorry if it was too wordy, just felt like I wanted to warn you people.

[@BB8enjoyer]

I got this too in 2020.

[@BB8enjoyer]

But never had much of a problem since

[@ymirfritzlovvvee]

same with me, but i got no ban, valve just warn me to not use the app in game

[@gnatdagnat]

I haven't received so much as a warning or disabled matchmaking, and I use another app too which disables most cosmetic particle effects (visual clutter), and it's been a couple years I think. As a general rule it looks like dota plus is not bannable. Seems like you guys might be victims of fluke or something. But good to know it can apparently happen.

[@KingofDew]

Valve has blocked data they don't want these apps getting in real time. I don't think it's an issue anymore. The info is readily available in my browser, and this app just saves time doing what I've been doing since 2013.

[@Green13Gaming]

I remember the good ol days of farming towers with Lycan/Necrobook 3

[@N3w1M]

Enemy team: 3 midases, wins the game, 0 punishment from my team, because my cores want to farm into that. My team: 2 midases, instantly lose the game, because we play 3v5. They just build midas only because it's in the build. I've lost countless games due to these carry and mid players. They don't think about timings, they rather farm against antimage or some hard carry like that to 45 minute and then they wonder why they lose and flame others. Believe me what I am talking about, 3,5k mmr basic stuff here. I'm playing mostly pos 3, I usually win my lane, push tower around 7:30 to max 13 minute if the lane is going hard and being defended, then I smoke and try to rape their carry in jungle, so it's like their carry is 0/4 or stuff like that, my carry is free farming, but what happens, my carry or mid decide to farm passively their jungle instead of taking farm from them while we push t2 towers, also so he can be closer to fight if that happens and decide if it's good fight for him or not, you know, if that's bad fight, just steal their triangle, don't join fight and go back farming your jungle. Like this he is taking ultra defensive farm far away from team and giving the enemy team space to farm their own jungle so they can recover. Lovely stuff these 3k mmr carry players. Well, ofc not everyone, but usually this is 3k carry in a nutshell.

[@lifenote1943]

Honestly BSJ your explanations, and way of speaking/communicating was fantastic this video. And I feel recently you have improved your clarity so much. Congrats man.

[@rowia.builds]

Dagon farms heroes, does that count???

[@devilbob]

Yes

[@cloakrabbit767]

yes I always build dagon before treads as am

[@Venduhl]

I have seen Midas more as an XP Item then a Gold Item but that explaination was eye opening. Thanks man!

[@gjgjgj]

I use it depending on the situation.. I Midas the largest creep when I want to get faster levels, then I Midas a smaller creep in the camp when I want more gold.. I watched that once in a video, can't remember what channel it was from tho..

[@DuckyVanya]

@@gjgjgj I remember a video like this from either bsj or cookie (d2cookie idk if he makes content anymore)

[@T3hSteamcrusher]

@@gjgjgjin modern dota when heros can be lvl30 and talents are very impactful, you're not really using midas on smaller creeps, because in those rare games when you reach 30 you would just sell midas at this point

[@DanielCodyBloedow]

Fucking A++ content as always... Whenever I'm not feeling enthused to play DOTA, you always hype me up again with your videos. You're the man BSJ. Always learn so much.

[@joelb1299]

Midas is great on just about any hero for clearing the enemy catapults, especially early game. Those are the creeps that target the towers when in range. If you midas them, they're instantly removed and it's easier for your lane to push out. This is especially useful during the enemy glyph.

[@elliejohnson2786]

I think the biggest mistake I keep making on carry is that I lose lane, I tell my team "I am going to farm", then I show up to teamfights anyway and just feed an extra kill and stay dead for 20-60 seconds, missing out on farm.

[@arnesieper8332]

its what midas was always for: if you dont have acces to much farm, midas helps you maximise what you do have same reason why invo likes midas so much. as a hero he wants to spend as little time farming as possible, because he is much more usefull to his team when fighting. but he stil needs his farm; so midas is the natural solution for him. it also helps that he profits tripple from the added XP , because 1 level in his case makes 3 spells better ^^ its nice to see you do a vid about it tho, i often find my carrys to just use the volvo-standard-built instead of thinking for themselves a sickening habbit, really. farming isnt that stressing and dosnt need that much attention, you do have the time to think a few seconds here and there XD

[@clairepatterson8742]

6, 1 level makes 6 spells better. 7 if you count the orb effect itself

[@VienPeaaace]

Rule 23 of Dota If you're ahead, get Midas to get even more ahead. If you're behind, get Midas to catch up.

[@lifenote1943]

always get midas baby

[@suntzu6122]

Rule #1 of dota. You arent good enough to get midas.

[@lifenote1943]

@@suntzu6122 Rule #0 of dota. Don't follow rule#1.

[@Aviduduskar]

I was told by immortal players to never get Midas as mid/carry if the team was already behind on gold. The other thing they said was it was often to get an XP lead too, not just gold.

[@3arooshy465]

yatoro: *buys a battle fury on sven* “reality can be whatever i want”

[@warrenmiranda4943]

Yesterday, I have this juggernaut on my team who bought all these 3 farming items, I guess he's trying to be alchemist

[@SuperThunderPanda]

not even alc buys 3 farming items lul

[@kaansininide8282]

@@SuperThunderPanda he meant getting too rich like an alch

[@deathcare]

I usually get Midas when I play Exort Invoker mid just because it is something I have done a lot in the past, but this video is making me realize that I don't really need to and BoTs are usually better because it allows me to farm the entire map while also being able to show up to fights when I need to.

[@Wyrdangus]

You’re buying Midas on Invoker for the levels anyway

[@Eg9yBoy]

@@Wyrdangus also he has no farming abilities except for maybe alacrity and Forged Spirits both of which are pretty average and everything else is on a 40s cool down, and buying lightnings isn't very synergistic unless you're going a right click build.

[@GermanischeTutorials]

I remember several games during the group phase of Arlington major where carries (e.g. Yuragi iirc) built midas in games where they were really ahead and clearly would have be able to dominate the map (if not did so) - not sure how this fits into this picture?

[@InsertyournameNow]

Hey BSJ! Was wondering recently what is rated higher as a farm item for gyro carry - crystalys or maelstrom? and why?

[@RKWARLORD]

Ive played on and off since 2012 and i have never understood why to buy midas ever. In its current form if you use it with zero downtime it takes you 20 minutes to recuperate the item cost. Yes it gives attack speed and a small exp bonus but overall if you are getting a 8 minute midas its 30 minutes by the time the midas is paid off and you will start to see net gain. Fast forward to 50 minutes and now you have 2300 extra gold total over a 50 minute game when instead the 2200 gold could have been used earlier to get more powerful items that would increase you farm speed anyways and kill potential. In the ursa game he could have had phase, morbid and diffusal and still farmed the same area just as fast with those items instead of midas and earned his later game items earlier.

[@soldieroftruth77]

What’s your MMR? Just curious

[@RKWARLORD]

@@soldieroftruth77 between 1 and 10000

[@soldieroftruth77]

Just trying to verify that you’re under 9k lol

[@RKWARLORD]

@@soldieroftruth77 There it is lmao. If i say high mmr you ignore the comment, if i say low mmr you enter with the "LOL you wouldnt understand like a true mmr grinder like me". How about you explain why what i said was wrong scrub lmfao.

[@soldieroftruth77]

@@RKWARLORD for the same reason bsj just explained. If your farm area is limited. It’s the best option. But yeah I’ll take your random advice over his

[@aminferdowsi9971]

i wish we talk abit more about other farming items too...like Manta or Yasha or Mom...but the video was great...

[@sythanh14]

They belong to a very different spectrum : adding damage and atk speed. The 3 items in this video give you special abilities that nothing else offers : - Extra gold/exp from limited resources - Cleave attack for fast clearing - Cheap alternative of Cleave attack modifier

[@Personnoname114]

@@sythanh14 MoM is a good farming item too, sven, sniper, gyro, it gives you lifesteal which some dont have against jungle creep and its active help you farm faster

[@aminferdowsi9971]

@@sythanh14 well Manta allow u to farm ariea that u cant even go there at first place and for most range agi heros its the choice between Yasha and Malestorm instead of BF and yasha or manta can be used with melee heros as well...a hero like Sven also dont buy BF but consider Mom or Midas or echo saber as options

[@TheJust4aproject]

Midas is only to be used on ogre and is, in fact, most useful for pushing waves.

[@django-unchained]

Finally this channels sound is way more compressed and less screaming :) Will start subbing now! Couldn't listen before because of Audio.

[@krnzzang84]

It only works when enemies turn off “share public match info”. But many have it blocked so it not much useful,

[@sandypella]

I have truly been needing this BSJ, thank you for continue to help our community, it’s much appreciated!

[@ppensen]

But i always thought that if you are having free lane you can "opt" for a midas to accelerate? Does this mean that free lanes should always go battlefury?

[@MunchinOnDew]

Bruh if it's 18:30 and you ran out of creeps to farm, you can just farm trees. Problem solved, Farmer Fury is still in business.

[@Eg9yBoy]

Man, this always felt like a pretty simple concept. Its just basic optimization. Understanding if you'll have space is the skill. Well I'm a 3k player who rushes Midas, octarine and bots on enigma just to farm and split push super quickly, shoot me ;)

[@mefunnyknow]

This video doesnt cover enough.. hope he revisits this video again to talk about Armlet (which carries like WK buys to accelerate their farming), Mjlonirr (is it a farming item ? why do some pros rush Mjlonir on jug ahead of yasha on Jug for example), Yasha for farming increase, maybe even dragon lance whihc helps farm for DR... i hope he talks about these items too :/

[@Winter-bt3os]

Armlet only for a few hero while he is talking about general hero. About dragon lance, not all hero need that item even some range hero doesn’t need it and that is what we call as situational item (but armlet is a must for wk). And a suggestion, learn, adapt improve. Not all thing need to be explained for you and try experimented it. Dota is a very situational game and need a lot of experience to tell that is the best or not 😅😅

[@mefunnyknow]

@@Winter-bt3os thanks for your herlad input… go back and play in your herald bracket and don’t comment on anything related to Dota till u get past 2k

[@Winter-bt3os]

@@mefunnyknow okay and i was 3k? 😂😂

[@mefunnyknow]

@@Winter-bt3os 1k idiot deluding himself to be a 3k noob Sadge af

[@Winter-bt3os]

@@mefunnyknow yeah and a 0 mmr player trying to be tough by flaming and become toxic to real 3k 😂

[@federicocapriotti2180]

what about heroes like invo? Quas wex invo usally gets at around 15/16 min if it's a good game, why's that? Why mida and not another item? Is later mida timing a good thing?

[@forita100]

Hey sorry to bother you but is it ever worth getting other items as farm accelerators instead like yasha for example

[@pcxxy]

so very insightful. thank you for sharing. hope to be able to apply this in my future carry games on heros that need to make that choice.

[@joepapi_tv]

i was told get midas if youre winning if losing then avoid midas and get small effective items such as stat items

[@brettt141]

The best midas is the Catch Up Midas.

[@kaldra1920]

What games would you consider building a fighting item like diffusal blade as a first item instead of a battlefury?

[@tadpoleparker]

he said when the enemy cores outfarm you, and you're having a great lane, you all in with phase diffusal

[@Busker_3000]

I haven't played Dota in a very long time so things may have changed. (YT algorithm been feeding me Dota vids lately) I used to rush Midas on Clinks. He has that ability to eat creeps so with a Midas he could one-hit x2 big forest creeps pretty early in the game. Good gold and exp I found.

[@SeniorDota]

NO WORDS..... - I have played for 2500+ hours and have always wondered about theese exact things. Thank you SO much

[@hands9776]

Ty now i know how and when to build the item i just didnt understand midas

[@angelicdescent6276]

What about spectre? In her case is just the diffusal manta build always the way to go because spectre is best played as a team fight or solo pick off hero? Or is radiance still okay?

[@pika2031]

Echo sabre and aghs is the way to go

[@angelicdescent6276]

@@pika2031 interesting

[@N3onDr1v3]

If your getting kills in lane, an urn is just so much fun

[@anthonylino430]

Thanks for the upload, I've been thinking about this comparison for a while, but haven't known when to get which iteam.

[@kinzrvt]

Thanks for the content. I wish learning dota was this clear always.

[@albinpaul3429]

It was very informative. Please add when to buy radiance also. Is it the same space requirement as battlefury or more?

[@lemonking8869]

ursa with bf is really strong in lane tho , ring of health make him very sustain able in lane and hard to boot out from the lane in my pub, once ursa get bf and bkb and phase boot or bf blink power tread it can kill hero very fast. personaly i like being a chad tank carry ursa with phase boots bf and bkb sange yasha with morbid mask soaking damage like a chad and heal like some unkillable shit

[@ifernclownerellayt3522]

On Faceless void, i tend to buy midas into maelstrom and bkb/linken just like the ana build. Works really good on crusader~legend tier. Hell, I'm even doing the midlane faceless void with meme hammer as a cheesepick when my offlane decides to play a space taking hero like viper/razor. The low mmr meta is both infuriating and hilarious at times

[@Dom-bn1ru]

The question is did u win

[@ifernclownerellayt3522]

@@Dom-bn1ru yah I did. It's a question of timings always. i also take the fv as a initiate tank rushing vessel and aghs + shard if the team really has no hard initiate.

[@yoink9148]

@@ifernclownerellayt3522 When I play and theres a void mid (enemy) i constantly win at 20 mins lmao.

[@ifernclownerellayt3522]

@@yoink9148 coz maybe he's trying to build hitter when their line up has alot of hitters. U know, jugg pos1. Pos3 LC something like that. What they lack is catch and setups. Void with meme hammer is cheap build and meme hammer is reliable on pushing tower pushing which FV surely lacks

[@RodrigoLima-mt1ot]

what about the current jugg midas + mael? and pl midas

[@AvogadroK]

its all about "can you use full potential of the farming item"

[@bauer5354]

how come you dont buy BF on life stealer, he can chill in a lanes easily

[@ravensnflies8167]

my only problem with midas is ppl buying it in turbo games.

[@brooswit]

Way better DotaPlus ad! Okay, I'll try it out.

[@shudd3r]

Battlefury on core Pudge, gotcha. Thank you BSJ

[@shardj5151]

No mention of radiance?

[@paengski4081]

In SEA server, all items are misunderstood

[@Grimbear13]

Great vid, never really thought of them as how much space do I have to farm but it's a good thing to keep in mind.

[@arcanuke3294]

Thank you for helping me justify Midas on pos 5 ogre :)

[@MilkJugA_]

So the catch-up midas is not a meme?

[@jesukxd8494]

How about radiance?

[@Maccelerate]

Watch last 2 mins

[@TheMrCurious]

If Midas requires 18 uses to justify its cost, should we avoid it games that will end faster (e.g. our line up is built for speed rather than late game)?

[@Zenovarse]

It gives you level as well which may be good early game to exchange gold for exp e.g. for voker.

[@Timberjackkk]

Do he has a Playlist with this stuff?

[@ninjadruidassasin666]

what about carries who built none of these items? drow? CK who is an early megathreat with armlet.

[@tanwoeiyong5861]

Just get midas > bf > radiance > bkb > overwhelming blink > divine . True all gold colour item farm

[@alexmiron3296]

Meanwhile My cores: itm 1 orb of corosion itm 2: boots itm 3: midas itm 4:maelstorm itm5: battlefury itm6:no time , cause we lost already.

[@Jebu911]

Great video alltho i havent played carry in a year so probably wont come in too handy.

[@expepem189xl3]

Waw i didnt watch this video for 3 mounths, i just clicked on it when it come out and thinked that i will watch it later, Good job man, that good explanation on how to farm , i understanded that before, but only after watching this video i understand that i forget about areas of farm when i switching to carry.

[@Denden-mx9gl]

The best farming item is BOOTS OF TRAVEL, the problem he said with MIDAS and BF is solved with BOT

[@julianl4430]

So basically i will always buy midas cos in my 3k games my pos5 alch will take whole jungle :-)

[@PhantomMantis1]

BSJ is actually amazing.havebeen followong his thoughts and im winning

[@creativexface]

how about drow ranger? core straight items? manta, h.pike?

[@tadpoleparker]

probably don't play drow rn

[@madhurmadhav5656]

In my pubs 3 cores pick carries and atleast 2 of them buy battlefury

[@jokersmith9096]

I came into this video hoping bsj would tell you animals to stop buying midas in pubs.

[@nicholass3892]

Afraid to download that dota plus app and valve suspends my account honestly

[@vladislavkim954]

BSJ, how to be on faceless void - when mom+mael, mom+midas, midas+mael, morbid+mael, mael, bf, manta?

[@elliejohnson2786]

Why not buy all three? You can be full farming build by 30 minutes, only 10 minutes after the game ends!

[@whyimustusemyrealname3801]

what do you think about maelstrom am bsj?

[@DardellX]

I would say midas is almost obligatory on Arc Warden, it gives too much of a value on him.

[@spiralingspiral72]

What about Mask of Madness?

[@MangoWarr]

This is so useful! Thank you BSJ!

[@lightpotato7844]

Thank you, now ill just find a way how to apply this concept as Pos4 🙃

[@goodfun4742]

I bought midas in early and sell it at the middle of game but before i sell it ill make sure top and mid enmy tower got destroyed

[@turbatbayaraa6186]

where does radiance fit in all this?

[@CptVein]

I'm average and I play in average lobbies but I can make radiance work on WK. I feel like if I can get it under 18 min, it's actually useful in fights. Still, everything you said between rad and bf is absolutly true. If I somehow get an early relic but get shutdown for my medaillon, I'm useless.

[@midostone]

Can you make a Video in the current Patch why you would go Midas AND Maelstrom? Like on jugg :D

[@SuperThunderPanda]

lot of space = bf little space = midas otherwise = maelstorm

[@jvnnyprod]

thanks to Midas, I won a game as Slardar, I started 0/6/1 then ended 6/8/20.

[@-rage-blackout9145]

Thanks to Scepter. I won a game as Dark Willow.

[@Nihhuz]

The first three minutes are so valuable in information.

[@TheMrCurious]

BSJ - should the enemy line up including illusion heroes influence the decision?

[@aiz-tv]

What about going both Midas and Maelstrom on some heroes, i see alot of pro players doing that.

[@flummi-h9k]

I am very new to dota (130 hours) and I was thinking that as well. I play mainly juggernaut, and I typically go hand of midas straight into maelstrom. And it works out very well. I get the extra gold from hand of midas, which allows me to get maelstrom right after much faster, and by that point I am farming at a very high speed.

[@The69Oskar69]

Maelstorm is good against high armor heroes as it deals magic damage. They might go midas first as the situation is bad but with time it gets better and have more map to farm and get Maelstorm to farm+fight. Idk just a thought.

[@ProfJonah]

Ive been going midas first on wk and it’s been good for me mostly

[@LegendaryNightfall]

What about mask? Isn't that considered a farming item for several heroes?

[@truegodmadara9489]

I guess MoM is just worthless now, if you need to farm ancients you can buy morbid, if you want to hit faster you can buy maelstrom which allows you both to pick fights and farm faster. Also MoM use costs mana which is a problem for most carry heroes due to low mp regen and mp itself. Morbid (if ur playin some fragile carry that can't farm triangle w/o loosing half hp) is just more efficient right now. On right-clicking heroes like Faceless Void it's still ok i guess, if u have some passive that helps you to deal more damage overall. But as I said it's just not worth it now cuz u gonna spend another 2k networth on mana regen instead of buying half of the *key item name* and u may also die in a fight cuz mom doesn't give you any extra damage in fight - just attack speed and silence that costs mana. Also having 0 or less then 0 armor in any fight early is just not okay.

[@markawobokun1517]

@@truegodmadara9489 I buy MoM for food in the beginning of game so I can get kills easily which allows me to go into maelstrom and bkb then I go Mkb if opponent has pa or radiance builder

[@markawobokun1517]

Void

[@The69Oskar69]

@@truegodmadara9489 Maelstorm no longer gives attack speed, for quite some time now.

[@iban1228]

Top tier analysis. Thanks BSJ!

[@dajair01]

me: sees a good video title its bsj's...

[@e0nema0tak1v]

In 3k turbo my farming item is desolator and/or diffusal blade :D

[@trollinggaming9903]

Thanks bzm for this video. Learned a lot.

[@MajinCanon]

Only ever built midas on arc warden

[@russellmcintyre7625]

Qojqva is the real mvp, a little nasty but I like it . Just good dotes in general. An animal on the scene

[@artyom8456]

this video is sponsored by what?

[@muhammadnazerinsaripin1925]

I buy midas usually not for exp but for gold and fast atk spd

[@adrnneboiser6959]

My cores buy all of those items just to farm whole game.

[@jojowasukranian8131]

If you don't have dotabuff private you lose winrate because every game you play your main heros will have a bigger chance to be banned, pog. I loooooooooove dota2 extensions

[@jhev107]

My spec teammates thinks a radiance is a farming item.

[@TheFame_Circuit]

I was just thinking about that too, since heroes like spec have dispersion. Battlefury doesn't seem that efficient since desolate passive doesn't work against groups of enemy units. And I think that items that give attack speed are more compatible, since spec suffers from those kind of problems. Midas and Mjollnir seems good for me during a bad game rather than radiance.

[@VendErre]

Helm of dom is also a farming item. I like helm of dom on warlock. Hes the only one who can keep his creep alive and at 100 hp all early game.

[@aidenpearce4915]

Io sends his regards