Bike Industry Crisis Claims More Victims & Has Tech Gone Too Far? - The Wild Ones Podcast Ep. 21

[@malcontent_1]

I love these new & more conversational podcasts, especially when it includes all three of you. I hope this format remains or returns from time to time.

[@Frostbiker]

I was thinking the same. I'm stressed out with all the crap going on in real life, so it's pleasant to just listen to some friends' banter.

[@CycleXplorer]

It is nice and relaxing to listen to!

[@beermonster1234]

Agreed, loved this

[@D4D22]

Definitely better and less “boys talk bikes” with Emily. I’d really run with it and make her a full member of the trio.

[@Wo9i7sj5l2a]

Bloat

[@brucey2407]

Totally agreed - British cycling take a load of money to provide nothing. There's no need to be a member if you don't race, but if you want to do a race, it's £80 to get licensed, series membership, race entry. Then you turn up to a race, which is run by volunteers. The money goes to a commissaire and escorts, which don't police the race and don't control the traffic. So you pay a load of money to drive across the country to do a race on a course which isn't closed, on crap roads, where dangerous riding goes unnoticed. No wonder the UK racing scene is dying

[@MTBryanH]

Same here in the US. First thing I look for in a race is if a USA Cycling license is required. If so then nope.

[@jimjam218]

The website is also trash. So difficult to navigate and find local events.

[@zedddddful]

If you think about it it's £40 for a year's third party insurance that's worth it for me tbh.

[@Raven__70]

A £1500 bike in 2015 now costs north of £3000 in 2023, is heavier & more difficult to maintain. Is this innovation?

[@maxthomson2948]

The harsh reality of more cost and difficulty maintaining is that it will force industry growth as you need someone to maintain it if you are not up to it

[@CarnivoreDMD]

And WHY manufacturers are offering similar bikes DIRECT.

[@JohnDough-yr2zt]

Oh good! Then you know exactly what to do! Just keep riding your crappy old bike! You’ll save thousands! Genius!

[@Zesmils]

I work in a bikekitchen voluntarily for about 2 years now. For not-bike-people maintenance is a big problem and it would be great for all, if bike become more resilient to the enviornment.

[@michaelrowave]

I was a competent Toyota mechanic before selling my Tundra and committing to doing all my own bike wrenching during Covid lockdown. It quickly became apparent ordering Shimano parts was nothing like Toyota and the number of proprietary tools alone much less the Byzantine system of incompatible components was maddening. It reeks of all the worst little tricks of capitalism. That stings if you are frugal, poor or both. I ride a Franken bike that fits me well thanks in no small part to this channel's fitment videos. There's loads of mtb frames to build off here and soon I will be building first gravel with chinese groupset. The marine air where I live means if you ride every day you will need lots of regular maitenance but if it looks old and funky its less likely to get nicked.

[@Zesmils]

@@pinky6863 For a lot of people a bike is not a hobby, its a means of transportation. So they use it and stop using it when it breaks down. So maintenance is a problem. Also the fact that bikes are getting parked and stored outside is a big factor.

[@richardgate1571]

I left BC and joined CyclingUK. Felt much more at home with them, retained the 3rd party insurance, discounts, gained a newsletter, campaigning for cycle infrastructure, safety etc. I did since have to pay for a day licence to do a cyclocross race 😡

[@dominicbritt]

Specialized have just launched a website selling approved used bikes in the US… full of unsold 2022 SWorks at the moment 😂

[@mcorbett01]

I got knocked off my bike by a car cycling on a bike lane that crossed a road junction. I suffered minor injuries and my bike frame was cracked. British Cycling paid for the legal representation which ended up with me receiving £5300 in compensation from the driver’s insurance company. The bike cost me £2250 new. My BC membership paid for itself many times over.

[@kvloover]

Love the podcast. It stunned me you guys didn't know Andrew. He holds the most strava KOMs and is seen in quite a bit of GCN vids to set a big performance on a climb.

[@dcltdw]

What Jimmi is saying about cheaper bikes: YES PREACH IT Also, would love to see y'all do a dual episode (if you get a chance) with Chris from Propel about e-bikes. Or even a podcast interview.

[@solentfoiler5969]

Cycling caps are amazing for winter riding especially on dark roads. Added warmth under a helmet, and at night when it's raining, glasses become a pain because of the glare from headlights off the wet lenses and fog up when stopped at lights so I don't wear them. The peak stops rain getting into your eyes and also stops you getting dazzled from oncoming cars with a little dip of the head. Totally under rated!

[@felixjackson2670]

Ha….feel the same way about ‘Cycling Ireland’. Was founding member of cycling club in Donegal….’licence’ fee goes up each year - now €20 goes to cycling Ireland for non licence holder who want to ride a Sportif..been racing,mtb’ing,touring,commuting by bike for decades. Do not need a ‘parent organisation’ telling me what I can’t do! or paying them to ride on a public road. Was on club committee for years-walked away from club and never giving the fools in Cycling Ireland my money again! They behave as if cyclists are there to serve them ,rather than their organisation being in existence to serve the cycling community.

[@brockjennings]

Trek is already reconditioning and reselling bicycles. It's called their Red Barn program.

[@IoanSaid]

And they have a great programme for kids bikes too!

[@michaelrowave]

I didn't think I would watch the whole bike weighing piece but it was such a great window into the event and moreso the incredible vibes and energy of its participants. Outstanding work. Please interview Dom Whiting. His KZbin channel has created a very cool, inspiring cycling community within the UK and now the greater EU. It's not racing but its about accessibilty and getting more diverse riders together for the all the love it entails. I have followed his channel from the start and he is really inspiring but I would love to hear his story here.

[@Jediknight620]

Certified pre-owned cars were a big thing for dealerships when I worked in automotive. We would take in trades (of our brands), fix them up with OEM parts, and then resell them with a bit of extended warranty. It was a good way for the dealership to make money and people would buy them with the piece of mind that it wasn't a POS used car. I think Jimmi has a great idea there for big brands like Trek/Specialized/etc to give incentive to people wanting to trade in for a new bike and keep the second hand market fresh with a bike in good shape for a reasonable price.

[@jdmcdorce876]

Trek is already starting to do this with their "Red Barn" program, noting that their least expensive current offering is $1399.99 USD.

[@yramd1621]

Halfords and Canyon both have a marketplace section on their websites with used or refurbished bikes.

[@celyda2]

That Remi Gaillard video is so funny. I have never laughed so hard at a youtube video. Thank you for that

[@BeerMatt96]

Garmin running power is a calculated estimate of power, based on pace, runner weight, pitch/grade of road/pavement, vertical movement, etc., and it relies on the Garmin device's accuracy when measuring those variables. It does not take into account ground surface (trail/track/road/mud/snow), efficiency of stride, wind direction (other than a general estimate for the area from local weather forecasts) or exposure to it. Unlike a bike power meter, there is no direct measurement of force exerted by the runner's foot, however, so it is (to a certain extent) an estimate. There is also a (small) lag similar to (but smaller than) HR lag when effort levels change suddenly (eg: during intervals). Stryd does produce a a running power meter gadget which goes in the shoe and measures force, but (last time I read up on it), there is some debate over whether "running power" should take into account the vertical push of each step, or whether it should just be the horizontal component of each step. This running efficiency question is not an issue with cycling pedal, crank, or spider power meters, but does start to creep in with hub power meters and on-head-unit calculators from third party app writers. In general (again, from what I have read), Stryd power meters tend to give a lower figure than Garmin calculated power, and FTP/CP-60 readings for running are generally higher than for cycling. I'm sure DC Rainmaker has done some work on this. I use a Garmin Forerunner 965, and the power readings are consistent (more so than the readings I got from my 645 Music + Running Dynamics pod), but they are still only calculations, and don't reflect the extra effort when you round a corner and hit a blast of wind howling between buildings, or when the trail goes from firm gravel to slippery mud. My Assioma pedals just read the amount of force I apply to them, so I am confident that it's an accurate reading.

[@xbob]

As a bike commuter, I would love to see charging tech improve. I've done away with lights and gear that need batteries for rechargeable accessories but, it would be great if i could just plug the lights into a charger on my bike that would keep them topped up as I ride. Excellent point, Emily.

[@TheArniec91]

Trek have started a refurbished/second hand market in the US, gc performance covered it a couple weeks ago 👍🏽

[@michaelrowave]

Hmm, i am dubious but should look into it. I know a Trek mechanic here.

[@sempi8159]

Selling last years bikes i guess?

[@pphaneuf]

Had exactly the same experience as Emily when I started using a heart rate monitor, learned a lot about myself! It helped me go from stopping 3-4 times on the Wall of Talla climb to doing it without stopping, big effect!

[@timbridgman8236]

Regarding innovation. I spent spent 4 years cycling around the world so had a surly troll which had 26" wheels a rohloff hub and v brakes. Finding parts in countries that were trying to catch up with the western world was just about possible. I've since looking for a new frame I've found there are now different wheel sizes, different width tyres that some arnt even clinchers. Hub widths.mech hangers,through axels, Headset sizes and combinations. Endless Bottom bracket types that all need specific tool to remove. No mounts for cables, even our local bike shop can't carry the spares for most of the common problems due to the shear number of variables. I think bike design should become more standard so they can be easier to service and maintain..this would hopefully keep people on their bikes

[@alastairfullerton8010]

Best pod cast yet ! Jimmy has finally won me over! Well done 👏🏻

[@Om-xh6sd]

Coming from the states, trust me you don't want e-bikes to be 1000 watts and capable of going 15 mph uphill. It opens the door to an arms race and now we have e-bikes with throttles, weigh over 100 lbs, and can top out at 28mph. what people actually want is an electric moped; you can go even faster and don't have to be a menace to people on normal bicycles in the bike paths. Plus it's surprisingly easy to trick the limiter on them, and they can go very fast. *a lot of bike paths in the state don't allow class 2 and class 3 e-bikes, but they look exactly the same as the class 1 so it's almost impossible to enforce. A lot of the off-road trails have simply blanket- banned all e-bikes because it's too difficult to distinguish between the two.

[@mattvanderwalt6220]

I experienced the cycling body and cost implications with MTB when it became UCI. Suddenly you had to be a member of a club / the main cycling 'federation' - and around the same time they started using timing chips which weren't standard so needed to have a selection depending on which the event used... It effectively ended independently organised events overnight - mainly down to the exorbitant insurance required. Went from racing every weekend to once or twice a year. The feeling you get is that these major cycling bodies do more to damage amateur racing more than they serve the industry as a whole.

[@malcontent_1]

I enjoy my simple, all-mechanical bike. I hope I _continue_ to have the _option_ to buy quality non-electronic bikes in the future.

[@MacMasore]

Probably always but the question is for what level of bike. Electronic motors are always going to have a certain price and you still have a lot of mechanical components in an electric derailleur (for example). You can see it already: the motors in Apex are the same as Red so they can only get that much cheaper

[@malcontent_1]

@@MacMasore Like Emily, I have no desire to charge my bike. The freedom & simplicity of cycling w/ quality mechanical components has been among its most attractive attributes. In the past I've owned mechanical Dura Ace, Ultegra (when it was just called "600") & 105 👈 all w/ downtube shifters, as well as Force 22 Double Tap. It was all good & efficient. We'll see what the industry does to _fluff_ it up.

[@phililpb]

@@MacMasore some people only get their bikes out in the good weather. if every time you do get your bike out you need to replace batteries because they went bad over winter you will fid it is just not worth it.

[@MacMasore]

@@phililpb I don’t say it’s great or even good, just stating the facts. Maybe some people should just invest in a good jacket and tights 😉😅

[@MacMasore]

@@malcontent_1 simplicity is for some also that you don’t have to change cables and don’t have to fiddle with screws to adjust their gears (especially 12speed). Most people also have to charge their Garmin and lights one more thing that you have to charge maybe 5x a year isn’t that much of a hassle. Again for some not for everyone

[@davidd1492]

Andrew Feather may have been on a disc brake bike, but it a different kevel of light at 5.66kg😮 He also works as a solicitor when he isn’t riding really fast uphill.

[@PhM8719]

Regards to the CADE crew: love the episode. Especially loved the talk about a proper organised 2nd hand bike market by manufacturers themselves. Huge sustainability potential too ♻️ Hope this one day sees the light of day 🧐

[@tjohnson200]

Used bikes are the best. All of my bikes are second hand. Two from Bicycle Bluebook (Specialized and BMC Alloy bikes) and three from ebay (vintage steel). All have been fantastic after a little tune-up (tires, brakes, bar tape, etc.).

[@Shadowboost]

Every single one of mine are second hand. All eleven of them

[@Gaskellorama]

Trickling back to the 2000s you used to be able to pick up and Apollo Excel for £69 like Emily said it pedalled and the wheels went round, but we had so many returned on brought back to have bits tightened, or just complaints about the rust, and it definitely wasn't pleasant to ride, so making something in that budget that's pleasant to ride is the key. And on cycling caps bingo on that description, also stop people with less hair from squeezing out the sweat from the front sponge when they stop.

[@1mp0r7g4m3r]

I used to manage the biggest used bike shop in Minneapolis, MN, USA, a huge cycling city. Happy to share lots about the sourcing, economics, and customer base of the used bike market if you want to reach out!

[@johnnydoe66]

I agree with Jimmy on the fact that bikes are fantastic nowadays, but innovation is also good if it actually makes the cycling experience better. Electronic shifting, in my opinion, doesn't make things better. Yes, it's cool, but technically, it's not better. Rims brakes work fine and have for generations, but slowly phasing them out just because disc brakes are new and "better" isn't necessary. I am selling my full carbon bike because I have built up a 1986 Specialized Allez with 2012 Tiagra/Sora 10spd and a good set of aluminum Reynolds wheels. This "neo-retro" build gives me just as much pleasure when riding as my carbon "wonder" bike with its higher end components ever did.

[@cycliststrainingpartner8877]

My cleats are not solely glued on, there is "some" fitting hardware. Absolute pleasure to meet you all on the struggle

[@cyclingSausage]

I always wear cycling caps, even in the hottest weather. Main reason being they wick up the sweat and stop it running into your eyes and down your face.

[@colinricketts1415]

I also use heart rate monitors for non performance reasons.. Also like it for proper training but like you say you can see if your more tired than you thought or possibly going harder than you should be on an easy day. Its a bit scary wearing the HRM when playing football because that's a level of stress don't often put the heart through, but then its a reminder to back of a bit before doing any damage

[@pizzathehut2001]

Have been using a running power meter ( stryd) for about 3 years, helps me set pace, track training all the same things that power on a bike shows,

[@mpkback]

Your point about the speed of e-bikes spills over to mopeds too. Everybody knows and admits that the 30mph limit for mopeds makes them dangerous.

[@treimar]

I have 2 bikes, one with Pinion gearbox and one with Rohloff hub. I don't see such products making massive gains in efficiency. It's simple physics really. You need oil in it and to keep the oil in you need draggy seals. But I love them.

[@ShawnIsBatman]

Ed Laverack would be a fabulous guest! I followed his hill climb season on his KZbin Channel this year and it was absolutely fabulous content, he is a real asset to the cycling community. With regard to the differences w/the World Tour professionals....I used to be a club-level tennis professional, the way I would describe my level to the best professionals at the time (Pete Sampras) - I could hit the same shots that Pete could hit, the difference was, that I could hit the shot successfully 90 times out of 100, where Pete could hit the shot successfully 99 times out of 100. Once you hit the true level of a professional, you are getting into degrees of difference. I would consider Ed a professional-level cyclist, the difference between a professional at that level and a World Tour professional is a matter of a few percentage points, however, each of those percentage points is a huge leap at that level.

[@andrewcockburn7484]

He's pro level at climbing when fresh. Even then, Pidcock showed on Sa Colobra that there is a gulf between him and the top riders.

[@nluisa]

@@andrewcockburn7484 Also, these guys peak for a one off climb. WT riders do high watts with a whole season of racing at the top level, or during multi day races. Ed and Andrew are insane and definitely great cyclists, but the world tour elite is a massive step above what they do.

[@colinvincent6599]

I used to race at a high level in the 90’s and BC we’re useless even then. Even at a European championship the BC rep (who was there) was notable by the lack of being available. It was a similar story generally

[@dhbc1908]

British Cycling sounds just like AusCycling in Australia. AUD 400 (GBP 211) just to have a racing licence with dubious insurance for a year's club level racing which also has entry fees. Not easy for a pensioner.

[@Andy_ATB]

And both are obsessed with Track cycling........and treat MTB less than good.

[@edlaverack]

+1 for having a chat😁

[@Bbill2k2]

Love the podcast, only discovered Cade media a few months ago, slowly working through all the bike trips and some old Vlogs.

[@malikramic6594]

Without marketing there’s no procycling… No Pogacar, no MVDP, no Cavendish, no Tour, Giro, Vuelta. Be careful what you wish for

[@GNerdful]

how about a video on how to do some quick checks before buying a second hand bike? Like to how to test the brakes and things like that. Just some simple things that maybe beginners wouldn't think to or know how to check

[@thomassummers249]

On the topic of new E-bike legislation, my concern with E-bikes are these Deliveroo / Uber eats guys who essentially turn them into illegal electric motorcycles. Both on my bike and in the car, I've had a close call with these idiots doing ridiculous speeds without pedaling and whilst looking at their phones. These guys seriously need to be dealt with.

[@jamesetheridge6224]

100%. When talking about 'e-bikes' we need to be clear that we're talking about production bikes with pedal-assist motors, not illegally modded e-mopeds.

[@mcspikesky]

I'm not sure what's wrong with a 30mph max electric mini-moped class.. Still have to obey the speed limits and rules, but its actually an effective mode of transport.. 1500watts 30mph and you need insurance. I'd love to have some sensible rules not what we have now..

[@thomassummers249]

@@mcspikesky Absolutely! My issue isn't really with the existence of E-motorcycles it's just these unregistered, unlicensed tools riding them around pretending they're bicycles. (Big fan of the counter strike profile picture by the way - 1.6 is probably my favourite game ever!)

[@jamesetheridge6224]

@@mcspikesky Nothing wrong with it at all, but if they can go 30mph with the twist of a throttle, they need to be legally recognised as mopeds, not as bicycles. Licence, insurance, MOT etc etc etc. The issue is that normal people (non-cyclists) see the illegal Deliveroo-mods and think that's what ebikes are.

[@dahorn100011]

@@mcspikesky These Electric mopeds you're describing should be coming under the same licensing category as actual mopeds. Like James above me is saying. If it can go 30mph without more than a twist of the throttle, the rider needs at minimum a CBT, insurance, a registration. I'm also of the opinion you shouldn't be allowed to use vehicles for work on a CBT.

[@dominicbritt]

Those numbers, as amazing as they are, are not quite World Tour as WT riders will hit the final climbs after 5 hours at 47km/h.

[@invisiblescout6335]

They're not gt winner numbers, but feather could easily be top 50 wt climbers

[@Shadowboost]

​@@invisiblescout6335if he survives the week of riding before hand (he won't)

[@PuhutaanPyöräilystä]

At least Finland is growing fast in bike sales. Just hit 80.000 bike-to-work bikes and 70% of them are e-bikes with average price on 3500€. All this in spite we have a nasty, snowy winter.

[@TimR123]

Great advice for the Welsh upgrade question. They have a good road bike that doesn't NEED to be upgraded. Adding a gravel bike to the quiver makes perfect sense. Adds range of use and they still have the road bike for a 'pure' experience. Honestly, that's what I did a year ago. Now I have a modern CF gravel bike and my old - but still comfortable and good riding - rim brake road bike to use.

[@christophechartres3662]

I think Jimmy is talking about Pinion (German company). Unfortunately, they are very expensive (around 3000€ for a 12 gear system, aluminium frame, flat bar). I was about to buy one 3 years ago but now I realize it's too much for a bike ! (I get it it's personal point of view)

[@johnlesoudeur3653]

You have to look at the long term for a gearbox. I bought a bike for £999 around 15 years ago that had an aluminium frame and flat bar but with a Rohloff hub. I have sold everything else except the Rohloff which has been on three different frames and still going strong with a yearly oil change.

[@veloman59]

Haven't had BC license for YEARS for exactly the reasons that Jimmie stated!

[@rident]

There's a wonderful bike bank near me that is volunteer and donation driven which has restored and given away hundreds of bikes to my areas poorest people. Allowing them to reliably get employed and improve their situation. A simple fact is lots of bikes are junked and scrapped with good components and lots of frames can be saved with only a time commitment and some basic tools. Just about anyone, anywhere in the world can setup community projects like this and offer bikes for less than the price of chips. And they probably should if so inclined.

[@jdmcdorce876]

Inflation suggests that the friction-shift/steel frame/rim brake Western Flyer "10 speed" (2X5) that I purchased new in 1976 for $90 would convert to roughly $500 in 2023. Naturally, everyone was jealous of the $300 ($1600 in 2023) Raleigh that the kid down the street had. In all likelihood the Raleigh was a better bike, but my Western Flyer did everything I needed it to do. One could look at the current offerings by Triban (and similar positioned brands) as being a bargain taking into account both advancements in technology and inflation. And people paying more for a specific brand isn't anything new.

[@bengarside79]

Love at 47:31 it's both a statement and a question ... "W(h)att is the the running power metric!?"

[@thekeytoairpower]

IIRC Fearher's opinion is that he could hang with the pro tour for a day or two but would not be able to sustain it for more than that.

[@karlkeusgen8140]

You've been talking a lot about the nationals but never mentioned the female winner Illi with a single word. This is so old school.... Like in most competitions, there is a male and a female winner, not just one.

[@rothaicc]

Being an early investor in Laka, I love hearing aboutthem on all media channels

[@swites]

When I got my pm, I ditched the HR monitor for a few yrs thinking I didn't need it. But now am annoyed I don't have any HR data as well from earlier. As would be good to now compare levels etc how much I've changed.

[@eduardoschneider2010]

I have two bikes: a rim break and disk brake bike. If i tune my rim brakes well, what actually is very easy to learn, there is no big difference. the disc brake does not differ much from the rim brakes.

[@kazaroth]

I presume you don’t live in the UK. Disc brakes are slightly better in the dry and 10,000x better in the wet. In the UK 30% of my club rides were wet this year: in the summer! If you live in Spain, rim brakes are probably fine, otherwise no. Also disc brakes are just better in every way. Why wouldn’t you pay less than 1% system weight for better brakes? Spoiler: better brakes also allow you to more confidently go faster. Electronic gearing: that is a ‘waste’ of weight with no real benefit (except looking cooler), but disc brakes are so much better, I don’t know why it’s still a debate. Rim brakes on bikes with di2 is so weird to me.

[@ncc1107]

My e-bike has a 500W, 140Nm motor and can do 20mph uphill with a load and at full power. 1000W might almost be overkill and just deplete the battery faster.

[@mcspikesky]

I'll tell you right now, that is putting down more than 500Watts to do those sort of numbers. The 'rating' is the continuous output and even they are usually very pessimistic to skirt regulations.

[@theoswinscow]

If you want to do 20mph uphill carrying a load, maybe buy a scooter? Electric bikes are massive here in France, sometimes that's good (when replacing a car or getting people moving again), sometimes it's not so good (replacing a bike, and therefore just another lithium battery powered object in our lives). The Parisian equivalent of the cycle to work scheme is ONLY open to electric bikes which is a travesty... In any case, for most people the speed limit is far from being the major problem/question around ebikes

[@pphaneuf]

Would be cool to see something about non-BC grassroots racing like Thundercrit!

[@MacMasore]

48:00 not an expert on how it works but I know there are powermeters for shoes. Don’t know if you really need them

[@cdamian]

Since you are sponsored by Garmin, I would be interested in how you use the more advanced features. For example: mine often says after a long ride, that I should take it easy for a few days. I often ignore this advice. One thing I recently found more useful is the Stamina information, which helps me with pacing long rides.

[@SecwetGwiwer]

5:56 - Doping control?

[@abhimawa1]

If the manufacturers want to save themselves, they need to find way to make the bikes (and the components) more affordable. Innovate to find more efficient way of manufacturing.Of course, it is easier to sell expensive bullsh*t & get easy profit than innovating more cost efficient products.

[@Sutlore007]

I used to have the same question as the last one, should I upgrade to a new disc brake bike? And I have come up with a plan to buy an endurance road bike with larger tire clearance (39mm-Giant Defy 2024) because I am getting older, more relax bike would be better and I may be able to ride a bit of bad paving road. So, I am not into gravel, I still love speed.

[@sempi8159]

Just get a couple year old cx bike. More comfortable frame way more clearance and rim brakes :) plus alooooot cheaper thannew

[@darrelduke]

love emily! such a great foil to the two of you.

[@jamesetheridge6224]

The innovation which needs to happen is to reduce the production of 'bike shaped objects' by supermarkets, big box stores, amazon etc. Casual/newbie cyclists don't want to do maintenance and will give up the sport if things break easily. We need to encourage people to spend the same amount of money on a quality second hand bike rather than a pile of junk which will be in a skip within a year.

[@jamesetheridge6224]

Just to add... Think about the amount of money and resources piled into making junk bikes, just so Walmart can sell them to people who know no better. How great would it be if all of that was instead used to produce quality, entry level bikes, which cost a bit more, but didn't fall apart.

[@nascarisawesome5018]

40:20 Trek is already taking in used bikes and reselling them as refurbished. It's not cheap, but you still get the advantage of new bike with warranty and all for a little less.

[@StuartBailey76]

Ref bike insurance in UK - a lot of insurers (in the small print) will require you to lock the bike with a 'gold' level sold secure rated lock for it to be covered....

[@ComandanteNissaro]

I love my gravel bike. I'm always up to some 2-wheeled shenanigans wherever whenever. Let's go

[@jrother]

I'm all for innovation for internal geared hubs and gearboxes, especially for practical bikes. And as Jimmi says, vibration damping would increase ridership as well, but upright riding can do that, too. I'm most comfortable on my Dutchie, my torso is not long enough to ride many road bikes comfortably.

[@andreemurray7039]

I must admit I'm looking at different cycle insurance as my BC insurance is rubbish I've had a case going on 4 nearly a year waste of time

[@bulletprufrodo]

Do you have to have bike insurance in Britain? Is it similar to car insurance, where you have medical coverage?

[@bittiapina]

Cycling caps became a necessity for me when I figured out they were the perfect bug net. I hate having to fish out bug that fly through the holes of my helmet and into my hair during summer months and having a cap underneath the helmet helps keep them away. Now I refuse to ride without one when I ride outside in the summer. Also doesn't brands like Canyon already have like an outlet store where they sell refurbished bikes? Also bought my bike at Buycycle and they have a service where they check the bike and service it before sending it to you, so having a second hand bike becomes less sketchy when it's been looked at by mechanics to make sure it's ok.

[@stewartw7302]

I’ve just recently ventured into the second hand bike world. Bought a used Trek Domane 5 series frame, built it up with Used Dura Ace group set, Fulcrum wheels, and carbon bars. The complete build cost £1300. A new bike of similar build would cost between £5k and £10k. Reckon I got a bargain.

[@BruceChastain]

I think there is lots of room for good innovation. For instance every time I try to help someone new into cycling, they're always somewhat surprised or disappointed by how finicky cycling is. Things always need tweaked, and adjusted.

[@treyhorn5645]

Jom The Gravel Cyclist loves his Cyclist caps. I kinda dig them, not for me but cool...

[@alexwipe]

I can’t understand Islabike at all. That must be mismanagement. They haven’t increased staffing numbers, sales are up, and the price is up. It’s a great shame but I think anyone with a decent business acumen could turn that business around.

[@justkeepdigging1956]

The cost of bikes is also meaning people have fewer bikes. Now a lot of riders can only really afford to run one half decent MTB - so they're forced to get an all-rounder. This is a pain for me as a dirt jumper because all the younger riders are looking for stuff they can ride on 160ish travel. This kills the DH market and the DJ market.

[@cb6866]

Thanks Francis , Jimmi , and Emily . Do you see many E-scooters ?? I ride mostly off road , and I have seen more and more of em on the "Bike Path' absolutely flying , silently ! It was a UFO on my radar , dude !

[@swites]

Interesting hearing that guy with the 5.3kg bike in another vid at the HC say if it got too much lighter, the front wheel would keep lifting off the ground on the steep stuff, and be a real pita. Hadn't thought about that before...

[@MarkWarnePhotography]

Jimmy said we need innovation in the second hand space where you part exchange a bike and it gets fixed up and goes into the second hand market…. Has he just described “the independent bike shop”? Having said that, it would be good to see the big players taking action themselves and giving the option.

[@quincybuickerood3070]

The hot takes this week are very abundant. Stop innovating bikes? Think about you said that 20 years ago. We would all by riding 3 bys with sketchy rim breaks. Also the trickle down effect is definitely real.

[@richardgate1571]

I don’t want big business to do second hand. They would just elevate the prices of the market beyond the value they would add. Leave second hand to the current informal sales channels!

[@Shadowboost]

Their pricing is still outrageous and now will normalize those inflated prices

[@michaelmettler5831]

Jimmy, share your watch collection with us ! 😀

[@tyneskipper]

hey guys, can I ask a question? how does one go from flat pedals to cleats? i've always used flat pedals but have been gifted a road bike that i could upgrade pedals - how do you learn to use them?

[@soverania8041]

I use Shimano MTB cleats, which I can adjust them to be really loose. Really helpful to unclip in a pitch for beginners. And as the muscle memory is built you can tighten them up again.

[@stahusstu9721]

In my opinion we need inovation in safty, i stopped to ride bike to work/shops when covid started and theft of bikes skyrocket and now, with inflation is even worse...

[@erikklumpp3464]

Love this episode. Can you have on Brendog( Brendon Fairclough) or the OG downhill rider (Bernard Kerr)?

[@danielfisher-gh8el]

There’s a thing called TLI racing, it’s like £20 for a racing insurance and it costs our club a lot less to run our own races.

[@markjthomson]

Innovation in the touring space... yes, the gears you were talking about are the pinion gears... pro's and cons... you have to have a frame built for them... so heavier and less efficient but for touring they are awesome. They are costly but they will get more cost effective, like the planetary gear systems. Talking about dynamos, I run a pedal cell generator, different to a dynamo, I can put it on multiple bikes, it's powerful and efficient, just need a metal rim... sadly to company has closed it's doors as there wasn't enough uptake.

[@KeirGroves]

I think Francis is right. Great bikes already exist for less than £500. The issue is that there is a global marketing industry trying to convince regular non-competing cyclists that those bikes aren't enough. We've all fallen for it.

[@Shadowboost]

The value proposition is non-existent. TVs from ten years ago rightfully would not sell for even 1/5th of a current new set. Why can't I get a CAAD10 rim brake bike for 500 out the door brand new today? Just keep making the same super nice bike at scale and reduce the cost. But no, that would undercut them overpricing everything else in the lineup

[@megustasonia]

What i truly need is Francis on lead guitar, Jimmy on drums and Emily as the vocal singer. It needs to happen !

[@ChrisRufus76]

Islabikes got so many kids racing in the UK, my lad borrowed one from Team Darenth Cycling Club and we brought him a disk brake 700c Islabikes Lauth for just £700 brand new, for a race bike a child can actually fit on that is an amazing price.

[@toddmeerdink4782]

Great discussion. Jimmy is a sharp guy!

[@ethansutherland3786]

The whole thing around e bike motor limits is that it blurs the lines between e bike and motorbikes, which puts u in a grey area of licensing and insurance

[@thepandaman]

Surely the tech and innovation is stifled by arbitrary UCI rules anyway? Recumbent & velomobile riders always go on about how if the industry really wanted the fastest bikes, they would be 'bents. Meanwhile I'm just grumpy that the bikes most heavily marketed aren't the best ones for your average person. I feel like Jimmi wants the masses on bikes which I'm all in favour for - but I would say they should be oozing with practicality - mudguards, racks & lights as standard, but still with drop bars. There's no point conflating the environmental benefits of getting people out on bikes if it's for sport and not transport.

[@brandondavis5655]

I don’t know if they are doing it in the UK, but Trek is now offering used bikes directly on their web store. You can trade in your used trek at a trek store or retailer, immediately get store credit, and buy a new bike. Then your old bike gets sold to somebody who needs a bike but doesn’t have the budget for a new bike

[@adempewolff]

Garmin running power uses grade, wind direction speed, and some other stuff (allegedly cadence, vertical oscillation, etc.) to calculate a power metric. It seems to be internally consistent (e.g. comparing one run to another), but isn't really comparable to cycling power (which is actually directly measuring mechanical power). For example, a zone 2 run for me (paced via heart rate) shows avg. running power of 270W whereas my zone 2 power on a bike is usually at or below 200W--and 270W is definitely above threshold for me on a bike except at peak fitness.

[@ColinSmith2001]

Wait and see how it turns out, and the switch over won't be without pain, but CUES has potential in the "good enough" approach - Existing 11sp based tech is "good enough", so move everything to that as a common standard and work on price and durability. Maybe.

[@TikeMyson69]

That could be the case if we were reasonable, but I believe we're more emotional and will choose the more expensive stuff.