What LPVOs are really for

[@BrassFacts]

I've made a gross, inexcusable error in this video. ... Trex Arms drinks Reign, not bang. I shall commit sudoku now.

[@JohnCBarsoom]

They're all owned by the same parent company.

[@davidmecham9676]

No they aren’t. Monster bought Bang but Rein is not owned by them.

[@CiviTac]

@@BrassFacts we were gon let it slide

[@JohnCBarsoom]

@@davidmecham9676Reign was released by Monster Bev corp 5 years ago, has never been a separate entity.

[@msquared9605]

@@davidmecham9676I thought reign was monster’s version of bang?

[@CiviTac]

What are LPVOs for? Experiencing the frustration of hating your expensive optic while also realizing how effective it is

[@BrassFacts]

you've described hops pov to the T

[@RoniiNN]

Iron sights are king

[@CiviTac]

@@RoniiNN niet

[@josephshields2959]

expensive? I love my RT6 lol

[@meanman6992]

Inside 150 yards, irons or red dot. Beyond that 50-300 yards 3x prism I say. Beyond that, screw the LPVO give me a good 4-24x VPO.

[@BrandonE-ri4km]

Convinced that all gun tubers have a meeting in which they collectively hate on LVPOs, then three months later, they love them

[@BrassFacts]

I have always loved LPVOs.

[@Hbest2019]

⁠@@BrassFactsI’ve always loved Nova.

[@everythingbullpup]

I'm just going budget lol

[@BrandonE-ri4km]

@@BrassFacts yeah, agreed you’re consistent. I think it’s just a combination of broad trends and the yt algorithm.

[@Linguinishitfist]

“You are engaging a rock again” the “again” part got me lmao

[@tophergauruder3647]

Why lpvos? Because we need something to argue about

[@BrassFacts]

he figured it out

[@J.Panxer]

5 points to Griftendor

[@Neo-l2g]

​@@J.Panxer LMAO (Gryffindor*)

[@gary7867]

@@Neo-l2g (Grift)endor

[@AmbuBadger]

Because I'm 44 and fast realizing my eyes can't do what they used to. Getting older sucks.

[@Hoplopfheil]

2:48 for the most loving caress Brassfacts has ever given anything living or otherwise

[@toddinfl]

You forgot about his time with the jack-off scope

[@exorevbivoevturque]

How did you comment 2 days before this video's release? That's clearly some masonic magic

[@frankholub4673]

@@toddinfl That was a lustful grope, know the difference

[@MarksmanDynamics]

bro got the early access

[@Ivan_I99999]

Hop clipped it to watch in private.

[@SunshineHB]

Me and the buddy were out on the range zeroing rifles just last weekend and someone left the target about 350 yards from where we were at, and about 30 yards up a hill. We lasered it and tried to see if we could hit it with our T2’s. We were spotting with 10 X binoculars. The sand was damp and the early morning lighting was weird. we couldn’t see a single impact or puff of dust anywhere. Neither of us brought magnifiers and I didn’t bring the razor 1-6 rifle. Pretty sobering experience to be honest. 350 ain’t that far until you can’t hit it or even walk a shot up to it with a spotter. 😂

[@SinginShooter]

How big a target and how big a dot?

[@richardschafer7858]

That's what iron sights are for. Granted, I'm old enough that I qualified with iron sights at Benning with an A2. 😆

[@danefuentes3877]

@@richardschafer7858iron sight master race.

[@apersonontheinternet8006]

DoD did a study on average combat ranges going back to Vietnam through GWOT and found that the vast majority of firefights happen well within 300m, with most of those being within 100m.

[@tc9841]

Should be able to hit a 300m 8 inch target within 3 shots with a red dot pretty easily

[@DPolk98]

The nutnfancy clones are coming along so well. Can’t wait until they hit senility like the original

[@BrassFacts]

poor nutn :(

[@DPolk98]

@@BrassFactsI’m sure the world is much more fun once you get there :) (or worse, but we don’t blackpill here)

[@doublepiedavid8908]

@DPolk98 there will probably be some gen alpha nutn clone when that happens

[@jurban7998]

Best part of senile tubers is they get to review something unfamiliar every day.

[@snwbrdbum14]

​@BrassFacts "I used to be with ‘it’, but then they changed what ‘it’ was. Now, what I’m with isn’t ‘it’ anymore, and what’s ‘it’ seems weird and scary. It’ll happen to you!" -Nutn

[@bewarethegreyghost]

"We've discussed 'which lpvo,' 'how lpvo,' but we've never really discussed 'why lpvo' " Proceeds to name video "what lpvo"

[@BrassFacts]

my brain sorta had a aneurism, I think I was trying to do the guardians of the galaxy joke but then failed horrifically.

[@GoatSimpulator]

Next on the list is "where lpvo" lol maybe mounting location

[@yodaisgod2]

'who lpvo'

[@MJA5]

“when” LPVO

[@immikeurnot]

I think he missed out not talking about "where LPVO?"

[@usmcvet9446]

You cant hit what you cant see. This is the single piece of logic i use when choosing an optic.

[@gemayeljones248]

Thank you

[@Darkdownshooting]

Depends on the context. If you got a bad LPVO with a lot of eye shadow: Yeah. You can’t hit what you can’t see

[@bubbles2163]

@@Darkdownshootingjust get a decent one. shrimple as

[@bubbles2163]

this is a very smart way of thinking. i’ll apply that to my gear autism adventures from now on, thank u

[@kurticus91]

Your mustache looks like you took one of Hop’s eyebrows and glued it to your lip

[@mghegotagun]

You mean like he took half of each of hops eyebrows

[@shooter-observer1]

they are both equally haunting

[@EarlHildebrandt]

@@mghegotagun Beautiful, "New Facial Hair Lore" gets me one square closer to a Nova Group bingo!

[@robertspiker5544]

I will never unsee this

[@ryanhall9877]

It looks like he had a Hitler stache that grew out, so much longer or thicker in the middle.

[@frankholub4673]

No one pretends that the LPVO is perfect. Indeed it has been said that the LPVO is the worst generalist optic except for all those others that have been tried from time to time. -Winston Churchill

[@leewilkinson6372]

😂

[@johnsmith1034]

-Your mom

[@Pouncer_Fox]

Winston Churchill is a clever man. 😅

[@ronaldlollis8895]

“I wished the boys had cleared hot thru their LPVOs with a thermal clip-on before they lit off their muskets on us! - Gen. T.J. Jackson

[@MasterWitchDoctor]

@@Pouncer_Fox he was an idiot that was a complete failure as far as a military taction is concerned. His blunder known as the Gallipoli Campaign proved his incompetence.

[@timunderbakke8756]

The first two minutes described my journey perfectly. My red dot is perfect until I moved to the country and…. Oh wow. These ranges are still within my theoretical range but nope can’t see squat

[@snwbrdbum14]

Henry from 9-Hole after clearing a 150 to 500 yard course with irons on a service rifle from the 80's: I dunno, sounds like a skill issue 🤣

[@tyronejackson6593]

@@snwbrdbum14I respect Henry big time. But there is a big difference between clearing a known range with targets and irons, and actually trying to find and identify targets in any sort of dynamic environment.

[@NotMitch69]

Take a drink every time the word LPVO is said in this video.

[@IndependentArmz]

I see all you guys that have to drive to use your rifles and it makes me realize how blessed I am.

[@samadams9557]

Amen brother. Fellow property owner here. Can’t imagine being in suburbia.

[@NCshooter1213]

Same here. I'm super blessed to have my front yard range. Yes, FRONT yard. My front porch is my shooting table. At one point, I had 300yrds open to shoot from the front porch, but the brush grew up too tall. Now I'm maxed at 150yrds which is fine for me. I couldn't imagine having to load up my gear and drive 25mins just to shoot some

[@n.speezly1467]

@@NCshooter1213I miss living in NC. I used to get to do this kind of stuff down there

[@KennyPowers-ny7ov]

Nothing like some brass facts while waiting for her to text back

[@ghijkl]

You should probably text her back every five minutes asking why she hasn’t texted with increasing anger so she knows you are into her

[@xxxlonewolf49]

Don't lie, there is no "her"

[@KennyPowers-ny7ov]

She just texted back 😀 (one word response after 8 hours)

[@harryazzole7814]

@@KennyPowers-ny7ovhave some fuckin respect dawg, bitches are more abundant than atoms of oxygen

[@David-cj8wv]

@@KennyPowers-ny7ovRIP my man

[@thomaswilliams3426]

I hunt with a primary arms 1x8 ffp lpvo, I’ve been really impressed with its ability to be so versatile within different terrain and vegetations, if I’m stalking in thick woodlands I can easily adjust the magnification down and then back up when I get to a clearing. This keeps things really simple for me and easy.

[@Elkrunfarms]

You can also mount an RMR compatible red dot over the LVPO on the SLX series PA scopes.

[@JimoftheSlim]

The LPVO is just a back-assward way of getting the correct scopes back to hunters after everyone went to 3-9x scopes in the 1980s-forward. The 1-6x and 1-8x form factors are literally optimal for woodland whitetail, and my Strike Eagle + Tavor 7 has proven to be a much handier hide, stand, and stalking rifle than it has any right to be.

[@EarlHildebrandt]

Everything circles back around to the 1.5-5x Leupold parked on top of my granddad's chopped-down Springfield since 1975.

[@BuckF0eJiden]

The 3-9 is underrated, and it's criminal that you can't really find one with a solid FFP reticle in a 30mm+ tube. I use a Shepherd Rugged 3-9x and a top mounted Holosun 407c on a 16" midlength, and it's been perfect for everything I've wanted to shoot at in the Appalachians.

[@dan.learns.things]

@@BuckF0eJiden agree. Anything further than 10-20 yards is pretty easy at 3x. A big plus is that you can get a relatively small/light scope that doesn't have to give up image quality etc. I really like the Leupold VXR Patrol with Firedot. It has a basic mildot, exposed turrets, good image quality and its really light. With a bit better reticle and either a capped windage or way to lock it would have been excellent but they discontinued it.

[@shino9797]

How do you like that Tavor 7? Eyeing a 20" instead of a 14.5 or 16" 308

[@BuckF0eJiden]

@@dan.learns.things I honestly would kill for an ACSS reticle in a 3-9x44 with a 30mm tube. The R Grid 2B would be perfect in a scope like that. I gravitate towards piggyback dots to avoid changing magnification too frequently. I tend to leave my 3-9 on 6x and only dial up as needed. They're handy for passive aiming through night vision, as well as running a combat zero in addition to a 100 yd zero on your scope. My 16" is zeroed at 65 yds with a ~+4.5" height over bore on the piggybacked dot. It's high around 3" at 150, and low around 3" at 300.

[@Wood-Renovations]

For me as a regular dude raising a family and not independent wealthy... Durability is non negotiable. I'm not willing to spend the coin on something that cost more and has the highest likelihood of become useless to me.

[@themightycrixus1131]

Bro everything will break if you slam it on something hard. Don't psych yourself out

[@coltonowens2742]

#prism gang

[@Chris-yy5pj]

Stick with irons then

[@DominicBorrelli-r4q]

As someone who used to be a serial internet arguer in autistic facebook pages such as mid-tier snobs... I've since reformed my ways and realized that there is no "right" solution when you are spending money on halfway decent gear... There is only a series of subjective decision that you have to make as a buyer that lead to you narrowing down your list of options to a solution that works best for your use case and situational preferences. I love that more of the community at large is starting to adopt this more critically thoughtful attitude and stray away from the CONSOOMERIZM that has led to the United States taking home ZERO Olympic medals in shooting this year...and as a salesperson at a gun store I will continue to espouse this gear buying theory to all potential customers I engage with

[@rhodycars6058]

Bro Olympic shooting is wicked lame

[@thelastlatchkeykid8466]

After watching the Olympic shooting events for the first time, I’m convinced that there are thousands of American men & women who have no idea that they’d be medal contenders in an actual Olympic discipline.

[@BluntGrown]

At least we took gold & silver in skeet today

[@thelastlatchkeykid8466]

@@BluntGrown right? Thank god.

[@Jason-fp7vi]

You guys don't have much a culture for Olympic style shooting except for your army's marksmanship unit, who do a good job but have other things to attend to. So it's not surprising you guys don't place in Olympic shooting as much besides skeet and trap. Regarding thousands of Americans being able to contend for a medal, hm, maybe, not sure. Olympic target shooting might look lame on tv, they do a bad job of showing the scale of it. Consider Olympic dudes are shooting an equivalent of 0.2-ish MOA from standing with only an aperture sight. It's extremely mentally taxing to maintain a zen state like that, no twitching, no hunting for an eye box, breath under perfect control, trigger pull needs to be immaculate, back muscles need to be limber but strong, arms need a lot of endurance. It's a different sport than action style shooting. You guys place way better in IPSC, USA's pretty dominant there and basically own the revolver categories

[@marcgasber6814]

The biggest advantage of an LPVO is that it is still usable when the battery dies.

[@brucetucker4847]

Change the battery in your T-2 Micro every year on your birthday and the battery will never die. Even if you forget a year and leave it on max brightness in your safe 24/7 the battery will never die.

[@ALovelyBunchOfDragonballz]

This isnt the 90s anymore. We measure battery life in years now.

[@mr.stotruppen8724]

Unless you're Eotech

[@GhostofTerra]

That's what I use an etched reticle on a prism scope for

[@SoloRenegade]

I've had modern red dots have batteries last years. The batteries are small, red dots more efficient now, and that is a lame excuse.

[@ChemistyStudent]

I happily gave up 1x for a 2.5-10x. Never going back. There are dozens of us. DOZENS!

[@unknownone8479]

An a AR15?

[@ChemistyStudent]

@unknownone8479 Yup. For where I live the sight lines are long enough that 1x doesn't make sense, and 308 isn't worth the weight tradeoff. Magnification is also underrated for finding targets that are hiding. For the precision rifle class that I took with the same rifle, I was spotting for myself and my partner through my rifle scope and it was working out great. ACSS HUD/DMR 556.

[@unknownone8479]

@@ChemistyStudent ok, that is awesome. My gun shop (Bob's gun shop) just called me, and they found me a 16in BCM. I am very happy; they are out of stock everywhere. I've seen people on Reddit saying the same as you are. I am leaning toward the 2.5x10. Most are saying 1x6, but my gut is saying 2.5x10

[@unknownone8479]

That's the other thing people are saying about magnification on a scope; I always thought a pair of binoculars would serve you better.

[@ChemistyStudent]

@@unknownone8479 I would suggest 18in if you're tall enough to let it hang by your side and not hit the ground. 556 really needs the velocity, and longer is better. Most binos or spotting scopes don't have a reticle in them which makes giving precise dope calls harder. For hunting and sporting purposes, spotting/grid searching with a rifle isn't polite since you risk flagging people. For... Uncivilized times and range classes that's not an issue. Switching from binoculars and your rifle isn't as easy or as quick as you might think and most importantly you can't spot for yourself. My GPR is pretty light, but I can engage a target, and watch the bullet trajectory through my scope the whole time. If I miss, the scope reticle tells me how I missed (eg 0.1mil down, 3mil right) that impact is my new holdover and I can kentucky windage using it as my new 'crosshair'. It makes for extremely rapid follow up shots. 556 has that benefit in spades over 308. For my purposes, it means I can shed carrying a 3-4lb scope+tripod, in favor of more practical stuff like night vision or family supplies. The magnification debate will rage until Lazer rifles come out, I'll just say that you get what you pay for, and 2.5-10 or even 3-9 is a good range of do it all magnification. You can shoot a 2.5x with both eyes open, or binden, it's significantly harder with 4x. The majority of the time you're going to be on the lower magnification range, and only zoom in on something noteworthy, or static targets. Moving targets are easier at lower magnification imo. The reticle really sets the magnification range. That magnification range is another source of error as well, mechanically it is a lot harder to keep everything centered over a 10x magnification range than a 4x magnification range. Likewise it's harder to shoot quickly and precisely at higher magnification; you really have to build the position and get steady at high magnification. For me, 2.5x just works well. My last comment would be that glass quality sets your highest usable magnification. Mirage gets worse the higher you zoom, and is directly relative to objective lens size and glass quality. Better glass, higher usable magnification. I use a Primary Arms Glx and was comfortable out to 750yrds at 10x on a 1.4MOA 556 ymmv. A good reticle, and understanding what it shows you really is a game changer.

[@carloscentenocastro9005]

Everyone asks “why lpvo,” “when lpvo” “which lpvo,” but nobody ever asks “how is lpvo?”

[@Kesssuli]

Good. Thanks :)

[@Aporqpyn]

Or, for that matter, “who is lpvo?”

[@carloscentenocastro9005]

@@Aporqpyn welcome to assfacts where we ask the hard hitting questions

[@alexanderm8880]

Every time Hop says you need to spend $1k+ to get a serviceable LPVO, I simply look at my PST gen 2 in its ADM mount and think "you'll do for another year."

[@SPIRIT-117]

If you want an upgrade from the PST gen2 that is sub 1k check out the Trijicon Credo 1-6 with the hunter BDC reticle. It's a fiber wire reticle (so extremely bright illumination - as close to red dot bright as you'll ever get on an lpvo), it's got crystal clear Japanese glass, it has nice slim bezels that look very similar to the vortex razor 1-6, it's got a basic BDC reticle which works great along with its 1-6 SFP magnification, and best part is it's 18oz instead of 25 for the PST for the PST, 22 for the Razor Gen2E, or 24 for the Credo 1-8 FFP. The combination of (relatively) low cost, 1-6 SFP, Japanese glass, fiber wire reticle illum, and low weight make it pretty much the everymans LPVO, although it is a generalist lpvo and not an "SPR" type lpvo like some of the FFP 1-8s. But a good FFP LPVO doesn't exist below 1k.

[@rangerrecon]

Even my older Sightmark (which was something like $300) works just fine for what I'm doing and it's been dropped and banged more than I'd care to admit...

[@Insert-name-here00]

Funny I have been dragging and dropping my Sig MSR over rocks and thru creeks for three years with no shift or issues. Got it from psa for $290.

[@dustyrhodes1655]

Those giant Pixie Stix you used to get at the toy stores are literally the 8th Wonder of the World.

[@epicfortnitekid8536]

Wait till you try one of those except with crack instead of sugar

[@dustyrhodes1655]

@@epicfortnitekid8536 I'd keister it...

[@VentureSurplus]

That ad had some ups and downs

[@BrassFacts]

lmao. Hi.

[@ImperiumLibertas]

Sup sugar daddy. Thanks for feeding our favorite gear heads addiction

[@JamesMelton]

If it makes you feel better, I made a purchase because of this channel pointing me your way!

[@I_Poke_Holes_In_Paper]

Need that juicy surplussy

[@acosby792]

Same

[@whippedflame8484]

I wish the industry would push a little more into more lightweight 1-4 LPVOs with modern reticles. We really just have the P4Xi and the Tr24. ELCAN supremacy I guess

[@HariboStarman]

Huge untapped market. Whoever makes one first would make a killing

[@neargaming2057]

I think the SFP 1-6x24 is still a very good concept. Minimum exit pupil is equivalent or larger than other variable scope designs and gets more magnification, plus no need for FFP at such short ranges. The big problem is the feature chasing nature of consumers and thus manufacturers. People think even more high end magnification and first focal plane make a better optic but in reality both compromise what you see through the glass. If there was an SFP VC16 with a segmented circle MIL/MOA reticle it would be the best optic possible. Durable, not too optically complex, fast 1X, and still has 6x holds for anything you mount it on.

[@mirok1857]

Guys... That's probably the best optics related co-op I've ever seen. Full of solid experience, facts, different angles of view. At the end-presented with class. Pure mastership 💪

[@BillyWillicker]

P4Xi > RDS/Magnifier - For a 11.5"-14.5" "patrol" rifle, this also counts for ACOG/RMR and Elcan. 1-6 SFP for a 12.5"-14.5" GPR. 1-6 to 1-10 FFP for 14.5"-16" Precision GPR. An MPVO is more suited for a 16"+ DMR/SPR/Precision rig. RDS or RDS/QD Mag. is for 10.3"-11.5" HD/CQC/CQB or 300BO. That's what I've come up to for an opinion.

[@basedWisco715]

TR24R > P4Xi

[@DTreatz]

some differences, but roughly the same, we are in agreement.

[@PeterSierra]

Single best discussion on this topic online. Props.

[@roundrock63]

Watching your downward spiral while giving out great product reviews, thought exercises and general buffoonery with Hop keeps us coming back. Lav ya man

[@Salamitommy-d5m]

I run a PA gen 4 slx nova. The fiber wire reticle is red dot bright and of course you get the 1 to 6 magnify. I really dig it for the price

[@Hbest2019]

@@ChappySinclairreally good for the price.

[@BDM775]

the music in the intro really conveys the weight of the situation

[@randallcl9925]

I am retired and living on SS. For me it always comes down to money, what I can afford, what gives me the most function for the expense?? I recently bought a 10mm PCC and I put a Vortex 1-6x Strike Eagle on it and love it. The image is sharp and clear while the reticle is fantastic with 60% of a circle (with the bottom open) and a center dot illuminated. I would choose this scope over any red dot at any price but I got it on sale for $200! Obviously the big name red dots cost more than that for much less function. I bought the carbine for home protection as well as hog and deer hunting and the LPVO functions well in all those roles.

[@dodsonarmsco]

It is interesting that the lvpo issue really is a rerun of the 3x9 vs. 2x7 power scope arguments back in the 1970s through the 1990s. I have an old 30 carbine set up with a very old Japanese 2x7 scope from the 90s it is an interesting hide gun and compact field gun. Also, taking the concept and combining it with a take down rifle helps with grey man movements hiding target indicators. Did videos about these concepts 8 to 10 years ago. You should look at using a lvpo on a takedown rifle to reduce your target signature.

[@TheBawbSaget]

Holy shit STOP. It's 3-9x, not fucking 3x9. Three by nine? What the fuck does that mean. STOP.

[@thenny9081]

One reason I would also list why someone would be suggested an LVPO or an ACOG, is for crippled people like myself who have severe astigmatism. I look through a lot of red dots and it’s basically like looking at the sun.

[@sectorseven07]

Quick tip- when giving shot corrections just say windage and elevation. Example "Windage good, elevation 20 meters low."

[@aaronkirkby2296]

Brock being a redbull guy warms my heart. This will definitely help me to convince my wife that redbulls aren’t killing me

[@rmp5s]

Just don't ask Kevin Samuels...

[@nickamalfitano3613]

Red bull has joined GARM, a wing of the WEF, probably a good reason not to support them.

[@DMS1791]

I run a 1-8 LPVO with a piggyback red dot. I use the red dot primarily, and the scope is for shots that require extra precision or range. I’ve been using it almost exclusively for almost two years, and I love it. The red dot is a nice height so I can stay behind the optic without straining my neck, and I’m not rolling the rifle some awkward way. Additionally, I can leave the scope at high magnification and use the red dot as my reference sight to get on target before I look through the scope and take the precision shots.

[@PFCAVB00]

LPVOs are one of the best innovations in rifle optics ever. Yes there are downsides, but the ability to get PID to much further ranges without auxiliary equipment cannot be understated. A red dot for close quarters work is one of the most valuable things you can have, but so is a light/laser. The trick is to find a a setup that works for you. Having a fighting rifle that is effective at 0-500m is the goal. I learned how to shoot in the Marine Corps with the RCO(ACOG). When we had to do close quarters work we had to rely on a peq15 heavily. As ive been shooting as a civilian, ive gravitated towards an LPVO+offset red dot. It provides the benefit of both, but just requires some time behind the setup. Moral of the story is, figure out the goal of your fighting rifle. Set up your rifle to accomplish those goals. Train. As you train, you will find what does and doesnt work.

[@ZM1306]

If you are using an offfset dot wouldn't it be better to go to an MPVO? Give up 1x to improve image quality and optic performance?

[@PFCAVB00]

@@ZM1306 if it was a longer 308/6mm/6.5 gun i probably would have like a 3-15 or something like that, but the only LPVO i have is on a 14.5 5.56 gun made to be a do it all type gun. But for out to 500 yards my 1-8 is plenty and it has a very good 1x.

[@briand6262]

@@PFCAVB00what lpvo did you go with?

[@PFCAVB00]

@briand6262 primary arms plxc. Kind of pricy but very good.

[@briand6262]

@@PFCAVB00 which reticle option you go with. Heard some good things about them, but seems most people aren’t big fans of the mil option.

[@richardpowell4281]

My Vortex 3-9 is great for hunting. I could easily dial in for far away deer, but then when one was very close I could dial back.

[@FazedFrost]

@cultleader3572 1-10 are statistically, the worst choice of LPVO. the 1x is not that good as a 1-6 and the 10x is not as good as a 2-10.

[@Booseman51]

When I lived in a suburban/rural adjacent area I was lpvo all the way. I moved to a suburban/urban area and now run red dot magnifier. Love both but primary environment is the deciding factor for me

[@marine6680]

I like the ACOG plus RDS combo for its simplicity, ruggedness, and light weight. A good LPVO that tops out around 8X with an RDS can be a useful combo as well. Having the RDS means I don't need to switch between 8X and 1X on the fly if 1X is needed, and 8X allows better ID and scanning at range. The biggest thing is weight. With even the LPVOs that are on the lighter side while actually being durable, weigh as much as the entire ACOG and RDS combo. In the end, what the purpose of the rifle will be, dictates how I would want it equipped. Purely short range, where anything past 100yds is unlikely, an RDS is king. For a general use rifle able to handle mixed ranges, ACOG and RDS combo. For a more specialized role, bordering on DMR/SPR and the RECCE concept... An 8X LPVO and RDS is a good way to go.

[@Aporqpyn]

This

[@JustEnterAName]

Underrated comment.

[@brettbonine7194]

I had an LPVO and liked it, but now i have a prism with a red dot on top, and i much prefer that setup. I was only using the high end of the magnification and the 1x, so this setup is now lighter, more reliable, and quicker to transition.

[@tfwwhennofitlitgf3300]

Which one do you have? I like my Vortex Spitfire 5x despite the 1moa adjustment.

[@brettbonine7194]

@@tfwwhennofitlitgf3300 I have the spitfire gen 2 5x and I have been pretty happy with it!

[@donjohnson5172]

You guys need to do a LOT more videos together. I like each channel individually, but yall have a chemistry that mellows both guys out a little bit.

[@Solidbuilthomes]

LPVO's are for when you have a rifle designed for everything from 0 to accurate 500-yard shots .... they're perfect for a GPR setup. The Schmidt and Bender 1-8 x 24 PM II ShortDot Dual CC is the perfect LPVO.... super clear at 8X, and a true 1X red dot ....

[@fukkit528]

i dont think an lpvo can achieve a true 1x but then again ive never looked through the lpvo you speak of, i dont have 5k for an optic, most ive spent was for my razor gen 2.

[@Enjoyer.762]

You can only mount that LPVO on a KAC SR25 for maximum flexing on the poors

[@basedWisco715]

@@fukkit528the ShortDot has a red dot mounted in SFP and the reticle mounted in FFP, when you dial it down to “CC” mode (true 1x) it removes all magnification and fixes parallax at 7 meters Fwiw, Razor HDs and several other LPVOs do a pretty damn good job at 1x as well. They’re as close to 1x as basically any optic can get

[@immikeurnot]

@@fukkit528 They don't make a true 1x, or at least if they do, they effectively move your eye forward about 8 inches. The closest I've seen is Trijicon Accupoint, and even that's not TRUE 1x. But they're close enough. People griping about 'but it's actually 1.1x"... You don't really notice it when you're using it. For me, LPVO is for a one-size fits all rifle. No, it's not as good as a higher magnification scope for longer distance. No, it's not as good as a red dot for across-the-room distance. But it's good enough at both.

[@wishuhadmyname]

The S&B 1-8x is fantastic and performs great so I just bought 7 of them ...in Tarkov

[@gprang]

FWIW there are a few eye conditions that make iron sights and red dots pretty challenging. So, LPVO makes it possible to keep shooting.

[@DeanOlcottMusic]

My reasoning for siding with the LPVO may seem silly to some but it’s my reason. Etched reticle. Not having to worry about batteries in a “scramble” sort of scenario to me just seems like the way to go. One less thing to be prepared for leaves me with bandwidth to worry about something else. Lpvo on a QD mount with flip up irons all day! 👍🏻

[@timunderbakke8756]

Red dots with battery life measured in years sort of make that reticle moot unless you need the reticle for greater precision (as covered in the video).

[@illidur]

@@timunderbakke8756 What if the sun farts on your electronics?

[@Dukenukem777]

I find myself agreeing w Hop here. I think it’s important to consider greatest likelihood of long gun use: am I more in likely to need distance or 1x? If most of us consider using a long gun for home defense at all, then red dot is going yo be pretty prevalent, even if you live in a rural setting. Additionally, the whole idea of using an RMR type 1x on an LPVO is kinda silly when you take into account that very high on the list of requirements for a long gun red dot is durability. Dropping your rifle square on an RMR will surely demolish it. If the only trade offs are poor eye box and relief, a red dot magnifier combo are the most versatile for most shooters. Or…an Elcan 😬

[@leewilkinson6372]

This appears to me to be a competition thing, as you can't change the sights between stages, you're more concerned about time on the clock and etc.

[@brianwood7882]

You should check out Sage Dynamics RMR torture testing. For my location and what is likely to happen here I’m going with a 2.5-10 NXS or 2.5-20 NX8.

[@mr.stotruppen8724]

You can put a T2 or an ACRO on top of anything. "RMR" mostly gets used as a catch-all for "micro red dot" these days. I don't know why people still buy them.

[@CPCRC]

Babe wake up! New quarterly brass facts LPVO vid dropped

[@Vuntermonkey]

Know why I like Brass Facts LPVO vids? I keep getting older, the discussion says exactly the same.

[@Joseph-f8j1f]

Two prior setups were a Leupold 1.5-5x20 and then a T2 with 3x Vortex magnifier. They both led to the TA11 I have now.

[@infidel24]

As i get older, my vision gets worse and worse. There was a time when a red dot and magnifier would have worked great for me. But at 55, I've switched to an lpvo on my home security rifle. I am thinking of going with a top mounted red dot for close range. Bottom line, I'm ready for most things. But i hope those thing's never happen.

[@contractor556]

…. All the stocks crashed except the war stocks today. 🫠

[@williwombat1066]

Eye relief is a thing that I find is best achieved with a LPVO.

[@FloorItDuh]

Currently my builds are centered around my GWOT experience and training as general purpose fighting rifles as statistically that is where most fighting takes place. If you live in the mountains or the flat range where there is a lot of distance you have a case use for it but in my opinion LPVO's are for a specific type of shooting which while it does exist, is a statistical outlier. For this reason I use a red dot magnifier combo because for 99% of the shooting I do or expect to have to do it works. Additionally the combination is far more durable as mentioned. I can't begin to tell you how much abuse your rifle will take when you actually live with it, getting in and out of vehicle's, it falls down from the wall you had it leaning against when you went to take a dump right onto the optic, etc.

[@Dan-b2j]

4x Prism optic with a piggy back enclosed emitter red dot is the way my friends

[@Aymeric-f1y]

Bend me over

[@I_Poke_Holes_In_Paper]

Only one they currently works well with nods is the LED acog that forward mounts it. I did that for a while. Ended up wanting a bit more magnification. 1-6 with piggy back rds is King, at least for me

[@ross2398]

Always has been, embrace fixed magnification durability elitism.

[@TooManyChoices1]

Or better yet the 5x 😉👍

[@bismuth8387]

ACOG/RMR gang

[@gtcam723]

I have a new appreciation for the time spent to build a channel.

[@dukepuddingdale]

The LPVO is there to remind me how cute my ACOG is.

[@jamaicanomen]

Brass and hop are my go to people when I need advice on setups/gear. They always come through clutch with solid advice that has been tested. Very trustworthy, no glazin

[@ravenstylea2]

Who shaved off Hop's eyebrows?

[@BrassFacts]

socko

[@smokingcrab2290]

His eyebrows match brass facts stache

[@kevinhullinger8743]

Excellent conversation, I switched from Red dot with 3x magnifier to LPVO and I am very happy with the change. The LPVO is heavier but I found myself engaging targets at 100 out to 300 more accurately and my rifle is stabilized most of the time so it’s not like I’m carrying it constantly. If I trained in primary at night or close quarters the red Dot would be king. It depends on how you train or preferences both have their advantages no doubt!

[@Walru5hunter]

One vital consideration that was overlooked here is that a huge part of winning most confrontations is observation and positive identification . An LPVO gives a single rifleman a huge advantage to observe, ID and range the enemy. Beyond this, people have to make sacrifices in their set ups depending on their intended or expected mission. I have a QD mount with red dot ready to slap on if I need to go full CQB, but in almost all situations a high quality LPVO + 12 oclock red dot piggyback is superior

[@jason200912]

Lpvo is best used for dmr roles. Magnifier and red dot is best for standard rifles in 556 or 762 39

[@ireilly2000]

man so glad theres finally a video essay on lpvos

[@RONIN_SATS]

The solution has been available for years ... ACOG with offset RDS.

[@rmp5s]

This is da wei.

[@georgewhitworth9742]

@@rmp5sHe know da wei

[@Fellow_Daoist]

@@georgewhitworth9742 Show me da wei my brudda

[@PineyJustice]

3.5 or 4x just doesn't cut it all that well. Being able to go to 8 or 10x really is an advantage shooting longer ranges.

[@rmp5s]

@@PineyJustice It's really not that hard to make hits at the very edges of the capabilities of 5.56 with the 4x ACOG...it's even got holdovers for you. You're not going to go much beyond that with 5.56. Not reliably, at least.

[@nicholasdangelo8174]

I saved for a year to get a new LPVO. After tons of research and trying out as many I could get my hands on I went with the Trijicon Credo 1-10 and an offset with a Unity FAST mount. It’s for me the best I found. I would recommend it if you can swing it off course. This is my opinion… Thank you guys for all your good work…

[@BuckScrotumn]

The part at 4:50 is hilarious if you imagine the optic is still attached to a rifle. Just some lunatic walking through a busy parking lot waving a gun around. 😂

[@eeddsdsd]

Backup irons with a scope that goes up to 2 times the number of hundred yards you plan to shoot. i.e. 800 yards 16x max magnification.

[@threat2demoracy5454]

I was with Nova at the end. 😂🤙🏼

[@WatchMeDrown]

Another point of discussion I don’t see very often is how where you are located can influence the choice between lvpo or red dot.

[@hatework4282]

What are LPVOs for? Everything I might leave the house to do. Anything inside the house is Red Dot territory. If you can only have one, go LPVO.

[@Timuroslav]

I have a Red dot with Magnifier on my house gun, an LPVO on my Rifle. I have to say the Bloom on the Red Dot is REALLY REALLY Bad. Also if it's dusty outside or you're doing night stuffs with the Magnifier. the Dust kicks up and blocks your magnifier making it useless. Yes, there's lens caps. But have 4 Lens surfaces to worry about vs 2 of the LPVO. You might as well just us Irons or stick to the Red Dot. A lot of this is LPVO's need to be developed more, It's more promising IMHO.

[@Timuroslav]

So unless you're running Suppressors on EVERYTHING Red Dot Magnifier with no Suppressor. You might as well blind yourself.

[@bubbles2163]

now i’m not a particularly experienced shooter, but would it be true that in a home defense scenario (the most likely one) that point shooting would serve as adequate given the only rifle i have has an lpvo? completely theoretical btw, i have a .40 and an old 590 for home defense and im just wondering about it

[@Timuroslav]

@@bubbles2163 I would go red dot for the 40 with the Pistol. Without Extensive practice shooting 100 yards with a pistol is possible, but FAR from ideal. It also looks bad shooting at a fleeing target 100yd + with a pistol, looks like reckless endangerment. However , if you have 3+ Acres the rifle+LPVO becomes more justifiable as there are Coyotes, bears Mtn Lions. The reality when it comes to home defense is that the common Mantra of Fight your way to a rifle, nothing really beats it. But you need to understand Height Over Bore and you're good.

[@iCookCrystalMeth]

@@bubbles2163If it has a 1x, just use that? It’s not as fast as a red dot but it’s not gonna get you killed lol

[@L0wSkiller]

You got a solid 6 very violent nose-exhales out of me this go around, well played.

[@RenoMay]

Rds magnifier goated

[@andrewhernandez9674]

Turns out compared to even the most expensive LPVOs this is true. And here I thought those things were silly.

[@UnworthySeraphim]

This sad boy typing has been brought to you by astigmatism :(

[@Nitroaereus]

Eotech gang rise up! (if your battery isn't dead).

[@ImperiumLibertas]

6moa while magnified gang

[@Bigbossman12624]

Until, rain, snow or dust is an issue.

[@SoloRenegade]

I ran EOTech with Ampoint 3x Magnifier on a flip mount on my M4 in Afghanistan. I was able to hit to 500m with Ease. Both took a beating, got dinged up and scratch, dented, and still worked. Still have the 3x Zoom. EOTech was issued, so had to turn that back in.

[@thebulky1cometh]

5.56? What size targets are we talking?

[@SoloRenegade]

@@thebulky1cometh 2ft wide people sized targets And others are far better shooters than me and can hit even further easier than I can.

[@thebulky1cometh]

@@SoloRenegade no I'm not doubting you, just curious if I could do it myself. Trying to decide if I could see a 2'X3' target at 500m with only 3x magnification

[@SoloRenegade]

@@thebulky1cometh When I served initially, nobody had optics yet, and the Marines were still hitting targets at up to 600m with irons and M16. Research the White Death on WW2, hitting 800m with irons only. There were also US snipers in the Civil War that were hitting out to 800m with muzzleloaders. US army expects 300m with irons. putting 3x zoom on makes targets beyond 300m that much easier. the only person that asks such a question either, doubts the claim, or has never fired a gun beyond 300m.

[@SoloRenegade]

@@thebulky1cometh "no I'm not doubting you, just curious if I could do it myself. Trying to decide if I could see a 2'X3' target at 500m with only 3x magnification" in summary, you're not doubting the claim, but you're literally doubting the claim.

[@rabbitholereviews]

I completely abandoned LPVO's. I went with red dots or 3.5x, 4x, and 6x ACOG's. BUIS on everything.

[@ImperiumLibertas]

Not a bad setup. Offers true 1x + magnification. LPVOs offer a wider range of capabilities but often those capabilities are not needed. Slap a x6 + piggy backed rds is perfectly effective.

[@21scavage]

What the hell LPVOs were you using?! The ACOG sucks dude. The vortex razor 1-6 is solid. Way easier to use than an ACOG. An MPVO with a top dot is even better.

[@sullathehutt7720]

​@@21scavage hey what kinda dust you smoke

[@DTreatz]

Sticking with razor 1-6 and offset irons

[@GammaRayTrae]

I’m going to pick the LPVO in FFP, I prefer the etched reticle and I have estimated holdovers and a way to range my targets without knowing exact distance. Magnification if I need to be more precise with my shots at distance. Personally I went with the tango 6t and it’s held up to a lot of abuse so I’m not questioning the durability of the optic. I think red dots are good and they obviously weigh a lot less but the LPVO is overall better and they will continue to improve over time

[@TerranPlanetaryDefenseForce]

The utility and capability range of an LPVO greatly overlaps that of 5.56x45mm

[@immikeurnot]

Good point. I don't think I'd run one on a .300 Blackout or a .308, but I've had a couple on 5.56 guns and they've been great.

[@poisonouslead85]

@@immikeurnot I think a FFP 1-4x or 1-6x would work well with 300 subsonics. Pretty much the only time a FFP 6x or lower LPVO is warranted.

[@immikeurnot]

@@poisonouslead85 I've thought about doing it, but still not sold. Not sure I'd bother wanting to reach out past 100 yards with subs. I know they can, I just don't see a lot of point. But to be fair, I do have a 1-4X Accupoint on a 10/22 that's got a Gemtech Mist-22 and pretty much only eats subsonics...

[@evanf7334]

I feel like no one wants to talk about how delicate lpvos are. You ever wonder why there are very few lpvo drop tests lol

[@blindrocket]

Great video! Even if you took the lazy route, that’s fine. Still good info and discussion, backed up by guys that actually shoot and use their stuff. That stache looks like it has a little bit of goose step in it.

[@zoomermillenial9557]

I’m going to design a fish eye 0.5x optic and piggyback mount it on a MPVO

[@MrProfchaos71]

I put one on my get home gun in my truck. Because I figured I would want up close capability but also want to be able to scout ahead using the optic if I was ever in a situation where I had to walk home . I know it’s not a likely scenario necessarily but I wanted the ability.

[@innawoodsinoculation8683]

Hopps eyebrows have the tism

[@cagneybillingsley2165]

this guy is mongolian

[@RunningWithSauce]

He can borrow that hitler stach from BF... lol

[@jamaicanomen]

I need to know the lore behind them👀

[@Pishadoo42]

They match Brock’s mustache perfectly

[@newerest1]

He burned them off his face in a freak drug smoking accident

[@TacticalBunnyCA]

The thing that really confuses me is if you're going to run a red dot anyway, why bother with the "lp" or "1x" part of the optic if you have no intention of using it? Just go mid range scope something like a 3-9x40 that'll always have better light transmission and zoom. There's not a massive weight difference and your training to use the red dot at close range reguardless. Coming from a guy with limited experience/equipment. Who has an lpvo w/ no red dot kept on 1x magnification and zoom is more of an emergency option.

[@ryanaustin5917]

Ha that day had me reevaluating red dot life

[@MrKingArthurhk]

I use a T2 with a magnifier on my shorty 556 that I have a silencer on. Mid distance, CQB is what that’s for.

[@soap5393]

At my age and civilian status, if I broke my LPVO while rolling down the mountain, it's probably because I got shot and am out of the game anyway, so...

[@darkgardener9577]

I like them for general purpose rifles. It's not the best at anything but it offers a lot of "good enough" between the red dot and a space telescope to be a pretty handy optic.

[@johnsheppard7175]

Oh man my lunch break is gonna be a good one.

[@joshportelli]

Thanks for talking durability and Lever Arm!

[@jevinjensen6209]

I believe strongly that while LPVOs are inferior in some aspects, they are superior overall. LPVO gang for life!

[@johnm6736]

Yes, it’s not a red dot, not a 4-16. But can cover a lot of bases. It’s a do all, but do all’s don’t do everything great.

[@YungShooter-eg3vc]

​@@johnm6736I mean, do you need to cover all those bases? Overwhelming majority of infantry engagements occur within 300m, which an acog/red dot+magnifier covers easily. Let alone the fact the majority of people live within a city or suburb which shrinks your avg engagement distance even further.

[@johnm6736]

@@YungShooter-eg3vc not arguing with the logic, but looking actual real world current use… if I’m taking a carbine class or doing practical type carbine practice, I’m going with a dot gun. If I’m on the long range, 300-700 im going with a 4-16x type set up. If I’m like 100-400 im going lpvo. I look at 80% use case for what I’m doing abd ignore the 10% on either side but prob have a contingency for them if possible. Red dawn? Gun to my head and I had to choose just one? Prob lpvo for where I live. If I had a choice, I’d grab the right tool for the job. Just like if I’m doing interior trim, I’m grabbing a 16 or 18 g cordless Milwaukee gun. If I’m framing I’m grabbing an air powered metabo 83 series or coil nailer

[@bradp8168]

Jack of all trades, master of none.

[@jason200912]

Terrible for close quarters but excellent for mid range combat and above.

[@professionalamateur6169]

For indoor use like home defense, I use iron sights. For anything outdoors, I use some kind of magnified scope. Being able to see a farther makes a huge difference in combat when the enemy is 200 yards away and behind cover with only part of their face visible.

[@jonn8163]

LPVO’s are for suckers like me that should be buying a 3X18 or something in those lines with an offset red dot instead.

[@jason200912]

I got a 6-28x on my 308

[@joshandmanuela]

Looking for that etched and illuminated 1-20x FFP LPVO with a true 1x and a fantastic reticle that only weighs 5oz made of Adamantium and Vibranium and able to survive a light nuclear blast for around $500 or so with mount included.

[@rdelrinc]

Lol. Dude, me and you both. But for around $500 it better have built-in night vision and thermal as well.

[@colinmiller4598]

Love your 'Hipster Stealth Hitler' stash.

[@thermaltoyzngear3310]

Ghe biggest advantages of LPVOs are the use of them combined with the wide FOV clip on capable thermals like a POT Voodoo. When using a small wide FOV thermal with an LPVO, you will actually use the intermediate magnification settings unlike without the clip on for normal day usage. Most fixed powered optics (magnifiers included), start off too high for something like an RH25 or even the Voodoo S.

[@politicalpolarbear]

BrassFacts mustache trying to pull the Germany WW2 leader vibe but getting fought by all the side hair. :D

[@Enjoyer.762]

schnell!

[@SatanasExMachina]

The discussion about the pros and cons between the LPVO and the red dot is exactly why I have 2 different mission driven platforms. The one I pick up is dictated by what I'm intending to do. PLXC gang!

[@scottfreh5884]

I have friends in the military that tell me the ACOG's aren't that tough, stacks of them get sent in for repairs. I've sent mine in for repair "4X NSN" that I used back in the day when certain major 3 gun matches required a military optic to shoot Tac. ops. 3 gun sorts out what works and what breaks, ran a Meopta 1-4 with simple T reticle for several years, day visible red dot that is an awesome scope. I'm still using that scope on an AR and it's pushing 20 years old, no repairs no issues. My current favorite is a Trijicon Credo 1-8X28 FFP, almost like cheating.

[@BullMooseFox]

I bring this up every chance I get. I broke an ACOG in the Army. My rifle was leaned against a wall and fell onto the floor and the ACOG broke. Nothing exciting about it. It's a great scope but they aren't unbreakable.

[@SS0895]

The credo 1-8 is an absolute treat to use

[@arcblooper2699]

I don’t think “my military issued optic that’s been through multiple wars broke” is a good metric for an item’s durability.

[@Aporqpyn]

Anything can break

[@apersonontheinternet8006]

This is why I'm still a firm believer that the EOTech is still the king of the battlefield. The 1moa dot is still 1moa even when magnified, the donut makes picking up the dot fast and intuitive in any lighting, the protective shroud gives it unrivaled durability in the field, they still can be used to accurately range targets, and thermal drift and parallax are non-issues. Yes, battery life and price is a problem but everything has its pros and cons.

[@Deadleg1-502]

I’m making the switch to lpvo’s after 18 years of red dot shooting. My eyes are getting rough, red dot smear has gotten worse. I like the idea of a magnifier behind my t2 sounds good, just don’t like the eye boxes and eye relief of them. Gaining some weight to see my reticle better is something I’m willing to deal with. For my first lpvo, is likely the Delta Stryker HD dsmr/Trijicon credo HX hunter reticle. Still deciding between the two. Brass facts: your argument to lpvo has helped swayed me into getting one. Great video. Thanks man.

[@robgrey6183]

Good to hear somebody talking sense about why you DON'T need first focal plane. I live in Nowhere, Wyoming. I keep mulling over what to use in the coming festivities. I've trained with red dots, holographic sights, ACOG's, and LPVO. I may need to use a rifle across the room, or across the pasture, maybe 2-300. I'm tending toward a rugged LPVO in 1-4x, illuminated. I keep falling back on my experience hunting elk, which is extensive. Why? Because it mimics everything you will encounter in "what is about to transpire": - 5 to 400 yds. -Snow, driving rain. -Near dark, or light into shadow. -Carrying it ten miles a day up and down mountains. -Snap shots. For years I carried a rifle, the only one I owned, with a 2.5X fixed scope. A lot of elk, mule deer, and moose fell to that rifle. My elk rifles now wear 2-7X Leupolds with simple reticles. With the right zero and knowledge of holdovers it's effective to 300. You're right about the emphasis on a good, wide field 1X, and eye relief. I don't want to train with any kind of secondary sights, on top or on the side. Ain't got time for dat. If I need to be sneaking around identifying stuff, I'll be wearing my hunting binocs. I don't see why it needs to be any more complicated than that.

[@JCTheSniper15]

Having carried an ACOG for many years on M16s and M4s, they're great at like 1-200 and out. When you're in close you mostly have to resort to point shooting in combat scenarios.

[@snakebite210]

Brassfacts Friday 🎉🎉🎉🎉

[@highdesertdrew]

As much as we get through another discussion about LPVOs, this video did a fantastic job of selling the RDS+Magnifier. Also, FWIW, it's nice and cool in eastern Oregon, might be worth going out to hang with hop up that way instead of suffering in the desert. I got back to some nice 105-110 Temps earlier this week.

[@mikutrash5050]

That mustache... 👀

[@Enjoyer.762]

Dirty Sanchez

[@BrassFacts]

I developed a nervous tick when I was filming this due to stress, and chewed on the corners.