Can Sherlock Holmes Be A Fantasy Epic? The Tainted Cup REVIEW ☕

[@DanielGreeneReviews]

Vote on the Fantasy Awards here: forms.gle/Z4jd3N8eqHzmP12s9 Get the book here: bookshop.org/a/89948/9781984820709

[@rohanmulgaokar5682]

Have you read AJ Raffles? The Anti Sherlock written by Doyle's brother in law. Basically ruled Britain in 1890s there were multiple newspapers where Raffles was used as a synonym for thieves.

[@ghoul4692]

I'm so glad you liked this book, it was my absolute favorite of the year. Din and Ana are incredible characters, and I'm OBSESSED with the world building Bennett has done

[@Luka2023-]

These type of genre bending novels have always interested me from a writing standpoint, because blending such distinctive forms of storytelling for the respective genres and hitting the tropes that readers look for in detective and fantasy books is such a hard task. You really have to understand each genre well to pull it off I think a tv example of this is season one of carnival row, which is an incredible mash up of the two genres

[@cyriltournier]

Caverns of Steel by Asimov is a mashup of detective story, science fiction and social commentary and works. In rpg form most Ch'tuluh scenarios are a mashup of horror and investigation. You have plenty of games attempting something similar: Sword of the Serpentine, Kids on Bikes, Tales From The Loop...

[@OrlandoOrtiz570]

I didn't read Harry Potter nor Sherlock Holmes.... But Harry Potter is literally fantasy/ mystery

[@sentient.ball.of.stardust]

This was one of the best books I've read this year (honestly I've had a great year between this, the Arc of the Scythe and Empire of the Vampire). Murder mystery in a true fantasy setting?! It's the first of it's kind I've read that actually works. I think the absolute best part about it was the dynamic between the two and how perfectly paced the evolution of their relationship was.

[@kellynneumann610]

I actually finished this book just last night! I agree with you-I thought it was good, but not mindblowing. The worldbuilding was really neat, and I enjoyed the characters, but I think I wanted slightly more from the plot. It felt like I was an observer, but I had no opportunity to try to figure anything out myself because Ana is the genius putting me everything together and no one else. All the pieces ended up tying together really well, but there was no “satisfying yet inevitable” twist like I wanted.

[@Nescio8]

I finished this book a few days ago so it's a fun coincidence to see a review for it a few days later. It's a 8/10 for me as well and I agree with most of the arguments in the review. I think it's a well written story, the duo of Din and Ana is great, and I really enjoyed the worldbuilding. I'm excited to see more of these characters and this world in the next book.

[@ahelmstub1142]

I thought this book was the best book I read in 2024 and easily rbj best book

[@s00005]

Good review! I’d like to add that this story leans more toward being plot-driven rather than striking a good balance between character development and plot. I say this because I found myself feeling disconnected for that reason. I hope the next book includes more character moments.

[@spencercorpuz]

I second this. I DNF'd at some point cause I just didn't feel anything for the characters

[@samedeiros391]

I got an eARC of A Drop of Corruption (the sequel to TC) and it is absolutely chef’s kiss. Everything I’ve read by Robert Jackson Bennett, across all the genres he’s dabbled in, has always been incredible.

[@samuelleask1132]

That’s very good to hear

[@kristen7623]

😮

[@nanotyrannus5435]

I think as it is a series, the rug pulling moment might come later. It felt like Bennet wants to have it be about the world, instead of a specific case.

[@asmrglow]

I LOVED this book! so special

[@samuelbeauzile5192]

7:54 you convinced me to read this, i will stop the video and get that book Edit: This book goes crazy, I wish it was longer though.

[@LizOzone]

I think your statment at the start about Sherlock Holmes being the biggest monolith in any genre ever is an incredible oversight of the work of Agatha Christie (Poirot/Marple). She wrote the world's best selling crime novel (Then There Were None), she is the most tramslated writer of all time and her book sales make her the third best selling author OF ALL TIME (after the bible and Shakespeare). Her impact on the genre is immense and she arguably started many tropes such as the summation gathering scene for the end reveal.

[@seanpoore2428]

9:40 hell even A Game Of Thrones is a murder mystery in the Ned chapters

[@royceshatzel]

I’ve been so on the fence about reading this one, thanks for the push!

[@Gwyndbleidd]

I really love murder mysteries in a fantasy setting. Never heard of this book but I will add it to my list. My favorit up to date is "rokka: braves of the six flowers"

[@a.rude.person]

It's been months since I read the Tainted Cup but I remember the atmosphere so well. Man now I gotta watch my favorite Sherlock (Brasil Rathborn) again.

[@TheUnknownSpiderMan]

You should check out “The Divine Cities” by Robert Jackson Bennett as well. It’s an AMAZING take on a police procedural in fantasy.

[@samuelleask1132]

The audio performance is great too

[@パンダの死体]

If you're up something that deconstructs the murder mystery and adds SO MUCH more to not only the genre, but storytelling in general, try out the visual novel *Umineko: When They Cry*

[@koolio12345678]

I first discovered RJB when the second novel in the Divine Cities Trilogy came out and I have been a huge fan of his ever since. I think his worldbuilding and his character work are both phenomenal. Sigrud remains one of my favourite characters of all time. The Founders Trilogy especially felt really grounded to me, the magic system was unique and the parallels to programming/coding language gave it a sense of realism. I loved The Tainted Cup and can't wait for A Drop of Corruption!

[@Aigra]

It's one of these books that I noticed when it was released, added it to my list and forgot about it because I was too busy looking for other books. But this video convinced me to move it to the top of my list. I love a good Sherlock Holmes-ish story.

[@MattVickers]

This was my read of the year, just pipping Sons of Darkness. I've long thought Robert Jackson Bennett to be underappreciated. Just finished the Founders Trilogy, and read Divine Cities years ago. All unique reads, lots of diversity and consistently interesting characters.

[@carolbriscoe9337]

Thanks Daniel. I've been looking for a good mystery. I'll be getting this book.

[@the_flourishing_beast1244]

my good sir for a lot of ppl(myself included) neurodivergence also includes dyslexia and other learning disabilities and many many many more conditions so welcome to our ranks bc you’re already one of us one of us one of us one of us/pos

[@pikap8649]

I agree, once you’re well read into the murder mystery genre, it gets a bit predictable. I love them so much so that even though I don’t get the same satisfaction of the “rug pull” it’s such a comfy read for me that I never get tired of them.

[@pizza6464]

This is climbing my tbr more I hear about it. Really hope it doesn’t disappoint.

[@VeraFran]

The Tainted Cup was my favorite book of the year and was the book that brought me back to reading fantasy. Everything left me wanting more, including the real nature and intention of the leviathans. I can't wait for the sequel.

[@nabiladjemai583]

I took a break from reading it, and came on KZbin just to see you're doing a review on it 😅 I'll be sure to watch your video when I finish the book, but so far, around 25% in, I'm loving it !

[@PhineasPlauche]

Did you see the Sherlock TV show with Benedict Cumberbatch? The first 2 and a half seasons were excellent modern takes on the classic Sherlock tales.

[@hahentamashii]

RJB's Foundryside series is also excellent, and it's a complete series. Something to read while waiting for the second Tainted Cup book to come out.

[@kcsubotai]

Found this video by chance, now I have a new book for my TBR. The cherry of this video was seeing Jeremy Brett's Sherlock 🎩

[@SusanYeske701]

Mercedes Lackey has Sherlock Holmes and Watson in four of her novels set in the Elemental Masters World. A Study in Sable, A Scandal in Battersea, The Bartered Brides, The Case of the Spellbound Child. I love the entire series and it was fun to see the mashup with some pre-existing characters and Dr Watson and Holmes.

[@gh0str4bbit12]

YEEEEES THE TAINTED CUP!!!!

[@jakecarlstad6192]

Awesome. This sounds like a fun book. I gotta put it on my list for next year. I do love some fantasy mystery

[@gavinsmith9871]

You should check out the A Rip Through Time series. It's not technically fantasy, but it involves time travel and a sassy Canadian detective in Victorian Scotland. It's a good time.

[@ElijsDima]

This book exemplifies a current trend in Fantasy that was peaking in 1990s/early 2000s SciFi... the Novel of the Idea. Tainted Cup (as a story) is a vessel to convey the Idea of the world, the worldbuilding/setting it's placed in, and everything else - characters, plot - take second fiddle to the worldbuilding.

[@juliedickson1721]

A re-imagining of the Holmes genre that you may enjoy is Holmes on The Range by Steve Hockensmith. Holmes and Watson are Big Red and Old Red Amlingmeyer, two cowhands that solve mysteries. Old Red is the Holmes, is illiterate but has a mind that can put together all the clues and motivations. Big Red is Watson, who can read and writes up their stories for a detective serial. They travel the West solving mysteries. The language is old west cowboy vernacular and quite funny.

[@SusanYeske701]

My favorite murder mystery series is The Brother Cadfael series. 11th century monk in Shrewsbury Abbey solves murders

[@AlexG-kp8sv]

Since you didn't mention it in this review, I'd guess you haven't read any Nero Wolfe novels - very direct/major inspiration for RJB in this series, and the Ana/Din dynamic is derived from Nero/Archie's relationship from that. If you liked Tainted Cup you'll probably like Nero Wolfe

[@TManNick17]

I love books that combine 2 genres well. I read 250 SFF books this year, and The Tainted Cup was my favorite.

[@BastuGubbar]

9:27 this comes from the guy who literally wrote a fantasy murder mystery and arguably fell in that same hole.

[@Ricedragon2113]

What I need now from Daniel is for him to read and review Robert Jackson Bennett's "Foundryside" trilogy and hear what he has to say about the blending of fantasy and cyberpunk within the narrative of a heist story. RJB is slowly becoming one of my all time faves, with this new trilogy and "Foundryside" (haven't read his "City" trilogy nor his other standalones like "American Elsewhere" or "Mr. Shivers"). I just hope for him to read it at some point in the near future. (That and the "Books of Babel" series by Josiah Bancroft)

[@landonkryger]

Another book I heard pitched as Sherlock with magic is Hexologists. idk if that's the most accurate description, but I really enjoyed it and I'm looking forward to it's sequels.

[@delatoba]

This was my favourite book this year!

[@connorhale341]

Does Santa count as a character? If so, he takes the adaptation cake.

[@championdefender9062]

I'd love for him to review The Murder of Roger Awkroyd. It would be very interesting.

[@Anterak11]

I’ve never seen you review a book from Robert Jackson Bennett before, but I’d recommend to anyone his two previous trilogies which also have great settings and characters. The City of Stairs, the first book of The Divine Cities is still a book I regularly think about. The Founders trilogy also has realistic representation that doesn’t feel forced.

[@trekie140]

My favorite fantasy-reimagining of Sherlock Holmes is The Case of The Mysterious Letter by Alexis Hall. It’s a setting reminiscent of Fallen London, including how Lovecraftian horrors are just part of life alongside LGBT folks, with LOADS of references/homages to classic fantasy and sci-fi. And the puns! Every chapter is a treat, every character is a delight, and the mystery makes perfect sense while also being hilariously bizarre. I also can’t get over that the investigation takes them to a brothel run by Innsmouth fish people called The Erotic Order of Dagon. That joke was written specifically for me!

[@julielocktree]

Oh this book sounds so good! It is going straight on my TBR

[@flamesofyesteryear9627]

Awesome jacket, man!

[@zodlord5669]

the initial set up seems like Speaker of the Dead by orson scott card. Murder mystery set up with victim found with something growing out of him

[@travelien9238]

As Ace I wasn't expecting the call. 😂

[@MissMokate]

that fantasy award survey is making me choose between arcane 2 and delicious in dungeon, where's the abstain option I'm dying here

[@emmypax5084]

Shameless plug here, but for those who like classic murder mystery mashed up with fantasy, my book Death on the Caldera is coming out from Titan books this year. It's basically Murder on the Orient Express with Witches! Might tickle your fancy if you're looking for something to follow up Tainted Cup :)

[@Cinephilemo]

Whats with the badass remixed version of the outro?

[@aaronharvey5625]

I'm a slut for a lot of things in literature, some of the biggest are Murder Mysteries, Detective stories (especially Sherlock esque ones), and wacky irreverent worlds. Thats how this was originally sold to me that made me interested, so when I got this book and began reading it I had a hard time getting into it because of the high fantasy feel and less irreverent humor feel so I DNF'd since then though I've gotten more into traditional high fantasy and this is now the 3rd review I've watched of this book that REALLY makes me feel like I need to give it another shot now knowing what to expect from the world. So anyway, i just put this on hold again from my library.

[@otaku-sempai2197]

Are you familiar with Keith R.A. DeCandido's stories of Shirley Holmes and Jack Watson? I recall attending a reading by DeCandido of his introductory tale of the pair at the final Eerie Con in Grand Island, NY.

[@Filthyanimal9]

Enjoyed the book, def looking forward to the next in series (hopefully this year)!

[@katiefowler5170]

My favorite read in 2024 is Tainted Cup. I wanted more!

[@lordofgraphite]

0:56 jester lavore and nott the brave... enough said 😂❤

[@Montie-Adkins]

You might like Sherlock Holmes and the Servants of Hell by Paul Kane (Holmes vs Cenobites)

[@AlysterJohnEstur]

We need more Gaylocke Holmes books, honestly.

[@brokenredflag]

Best mistery books ove ever read and seen is case closed mangas. Theirs a rezon why is so popular in japan. Sooo good.👍

[@Straker1895]

From someone who has researched the subject throughly, Sherlock beats Dracula, hands down. You probably don't realize that Holmes appeared in approximately 365 silent films alone. In creating The A-Z List of Sherlock Holmes Performers, I'm closing in on 10,000 Sherlock Holmes performers, based on Screens (movies & TV & Streaming), plus Radio & Stage. 🤗

[@alexheady7887]

I believe it was Harry Houdini who said, “If ever I am such a plagiarist as Doyle, who pinched Edgar Allan Poe’s plumes, I will fill all houses.”

[@senorbe]

Jeremy Brett is Sherlock Holmes

[@StarvingArtist600]

If you want a good Sherlock Holmes in fantasy, check out the Abraxis Wren books. It feels very much like RDJ's take on Sherlock.

[@_daniela_s]

I loved the tainted cup, best book of the year for me personally. I usually am not interested in anything Sherlock I might add. I can see if you want those gasp moments that you're a bit disappointed but I didn't even notice because I was so happy with it overall.

[@ethanmagadan1575]

Daniel Greene should check out the Absolute Universe (absolute batman,wonder woman and superman) yay or nay?

[@gouravpareek3635]

fantasy Sherlock book? i got you covered, read lord of the mysteries, specially book 2. it's basically Sherlock but with magic. lotm is really good you should read it.

[@flyingsquirrel1486]

Is wind and truth better tho

[@VetinariClone]

I’m personally a little annoyed by how obvious the author made what’s going on with Kaiju be. I’d have liked… I dunno how to make it subtler while still having the foreshadowing there, but it didn’t do it for me.

[@shraddhagreensoulz7529]

I was listening to audiobook. That was interesting. But now few month later I don’t really remember it. That’s my test that for really great books. This one was not…

[@rohanmulgaokar5682]

If you like Sherlock Holmes you might like AJ Raffles too. He's the anti sherlock and based on a real life queer individual.

[@spencercorpuz]

What's the Chinatown he keeps referencing?

[@RecepUludag-d4d]

I haven't find your review of Lord of the Mysteries. Don't tell me you haven't read it

[@JorElDG1989]

Daniel Please make sure that sound is the same level whole time ^^. Change at 13:23 almost killed me, my cat and started fire xD

[@billyalarie929]

You said a lot of vagueness, not vagaries

[@neondemon5137]

8 out of 10? So it's a 12 out of 10 for normal people.

[@douseks]

No 4 out of 5 ;-)

[@ElijahBarrett-cn3mz]

First

[@TheCosmerenaut1]

Daniel please its pronounced homes not hoLms, stop pronouncing it literally

[@ladyethyme]

But Sherlock Holmes has nothing to do with fantasy, that was the entire point of the books… Even crazy Conan Doyle left out his insane beliefs and fairies and spirits when writing it.

[@Sylnir]

@DanielGreeneReviews Thanks for covering this, Daniel. I just finished this book a couple months ago on my library’s recommendation, loved it, and was looking for a sensible dissertation of it. Appreciate ya! 🫶🏼

[@themythosarchives7520]

“Even in the LGBTQ community, bi people are barely treated better than ace.” Me an ace enby: 😢 we know Dan we know. 🖤🤍💜 ❤️💜💙