Capitalism Hits Home: Where do Gender Roles Come From?

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[S6 E05] Where do Gender Roles Come From?
In this episode of Capitalism Hits Home, Dr. Harriet Fraad traces back the origin of gender roles to the beginning of civilization to explore how and why certain types of work have been historically and traditionally performed by the female gender.
Capitalism Hits Home with Dr. Harriet Fraad (CHH) is a ‪@democracyatwrk‬ production. The show addresses the intersection of capitalism, class, and personal lives, and explores what is happening in the economic realm and its impact on our individual and social psychology. Learn more about CHH: www.democracyatwork.info/capi...
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[@annaharris626]

Takes courage to tackle this subject, cos it’s challenging such basic divisions. Really admire your courage.

[@PazLeBon]

nobody is asking why the rooster isnt sitting on the eggs. its just human arrogance :)

[@shellb1633]

I love your videos, Harriet, I learn so much.

[@annaharris626]

Lets all be nurturers! Thank you.

[@irelandishsac13]

Religion has in my opinion ruined humanity. Thank you Dr. Fraad for your informative videos.

[@emhu2594]

Humanity has also ruined religion. There is no one more unlike Jesus than the "religious" right.

[@blackvinylgrooves]

Been following you as long as you've been on KZbin, but this is the first time I've been motivated to comment. You make a point about gender identity, that reflects a conclusion I have come to. I am in my 60s, and only learned about gender indentity a few years ago, after I joined a Marxist/socialist party. It was a very difficult concept for me to get my head around. I had never been indoctrinated with gender identity as a child. That could have been because I was diagnosed with autism as a child, and had other neurodevelopmental disorders. It took me a couple of years of study, for me to figure out what gender identity was, but after I did, I also figured out it was something I completely rejected on a personal level. I am truly both asexual, and agender. While I don't want to interfere with the rights, or the choices, of transgender people, you do have to question what some trans people say, about gender identity being innate and inborn, and how people end up rejecting the gender identity they were assigned as children.

[@ac27934]

100%. After several years diving very deeply into this topic, I've come to the conclusion that I'm a gender identity atheist. This doesn't mean I desire to erase the existence of gender identity believers any more than atheists want to erase the existence of religious believers. Thankfully, freedom of religion also means freedom _from_ religion. Now if only that standard could be applied to the gender wars...

[@TheCanterlonian]

saying that gender is inborn and innate isn't something we say because it's necessarily true, it's just something that we say because it's easier to turn liberals into supporters with something that sounds similar to the gay rights movement than the complicated truth that people's desires for how they wish to be perceived by others can change over time and we all deserve to have the right to change our bodies and wear clothes and be perceived according to how we identify even if that means our true identity doesn't always align with our sex. gender identity isn't actually a thing that is static or present from birth but if society has created conditions where people feel a connection to an identity that they have created in their head more than with what is expected of them by society to a point that it's causing distress then there's no reason to deny the ones in distress the right to express themselves in a way that helps them cope with the horrible society we live in. we autistic people should know this more than most since we also live in a society that was not meant for us. perhaps trans people wouldn't really need to transition in an ideal world but until that world is reached there's no reason to deny trans people their right to transition or their right to be referred to by the name and pronouns they wish to be referred to by.

[@CancerRising432]

Thank you so much for sharing the in depth analysis that you provide.

[@darinasa4428]

Hello! I would love it if you were sharing your sources so that I can also use them in my essays. Thank you!

[@DV-dt9sq]

Bravo Dr.Fraad! I love this! 💪✊♥️

[@SimonAshworthWood]

What is easiest (changing the body with an operation & drugs or changing the personality) is subjective. All claims of “ease” and “difficulty” are subjective. It depends on what you value. (Time, money, suffering/happiness, the acceptance of LGBT-friendly people or conservative people, etc..) E.g. I find it easy to change my mind with self-development and I am very averse to altering my body and I believe it’s healthier to accept our bodies as they are (and to live a healthy lifestyle for a long life with minimal health problems), so for me, changing my personality would be easier than getting a sex-change operation and using sex change drugs. If someone is rich or lives in a country with free sex change operations (e.g. Iran), body changes are affordable. What about for a poor person in a capitalist Third World country? What about for a person who prefers their body as it is? What about for a person who fears being persecuted for having had a sex change operation?

[@jillfryer6699]

Ants and bees lived in large communities. They store and build. We cant know if they have language, scented maybe. Lately I've wondered if women's eternal vulnerability to death in childbirth is a factor here. Only in the last few generations has this stopped being quite such a risk. Before that our grandparents and theirs would have all known someone who had died in childbirth or whose child had died. It might take a lot of time to change the human habits and nature that are related to this fact of having to live since the beginning of time under the cloud of the disposibility and then dispensability of women? How much power or reliance can you put in someone, or can they put in themselves, when there is a greater chance they will die sooner? Millennia couldn't help but make us harder, harsher. Must men harden their hearts? Women endure what they must? I really don't believe people didn't know men were part of procreation. By agricultural times or even a few friendly dogs around the place you'd have to be an idiot not to know. Even if Engels had his own reasons perhaps for pretending to think so.

[@SimonAshworthWood]

Yep. The hunter gatherer societies studied by anthropologists all know how human conception works. They simply seem to have a different social structure to the nuclear family one.

[@PazLeBon]

more sexist claptrap

[@yukonnoka]

Have you ever read any of Paul Goodman's books? He was a sexist guy, but he made some great points about the absurd nature of our society in regards to how children are raised and how boys are treated.

[@zacharybrown2406]

The only point that i would be curious for you to discuss. Is that many human societies in history and even indigenous societies had war and sacrifices or lower class people. The Aztec sacrificed there people to the “sun god” . Even though indigenous societies did have more egalitarianism around gender in their society. there wasn’t necessarily egalitarianism in terms of Aztec society sacrificing people, or war between different tribes in pre columbian america. Violence and war existed between many societies throughout the world in history. i’m not trying to defend sexism or anything. But i think the picture painted is that egalitarianism in those societies meant everything was peaceful for everyone when it wasn’t. Although maybe less violent for sure.

[@mr.beautiful]

👍👍👍👍👍👍

[@ac27934]

I hear you. However, I highly recommend reading "T: The Story of Testosterone, the Hormone that Dominates and Divides Us", by Carole Hooven. It really opened my eyes to the surprising realities of the nature side of the nature vs. nurture debate.

[@kevinschmidt2210]

The problem is not with testosterone, the problem is with the oligarchy. By the way, most of the wealth in the world is owned by women. They hold most of the power, so they are responsible for most of the violence in the world.

[@ac27934]

@@kevinschmidt2210 Interesting. This is the first I've heard such assertions. Could you point me to a source for further info? You must not be referring to the Credit Suisse Global Wealth Report, which clearly doesn't support that.

[@kevinschmidt2210]

@@ac27934 I'm not talking about working class women. I'm talking about the wealthy class women.

[@bpalpha]

Woman have testosterone just as men have estrogen!

[@ac27934]

@@bpalpha Indeed! You'll learn all that and much more if you read the book! You'll also learn what the distribution of testosterone is for both sexes. “Circulating testosterone in adults has a strikingly non-overlapping bimodal distribution with wide and complete separation between men and women.”

[@bpalpha]

There is, of course, the story of Lilith which wasn't canonized in the bible. Where the first woman wasn't created from Adam's rib, but as an equal. When Adam commanded the woman to lay beneath him, she refused and the "God" of the bible punished Lilith for not obeying Adam's demands, turning her into the first "demon" and stated he'd slay a thousand of her children a day for not obeying his commands. So much for pro-life in that "God". The Abrahamic faiths also treat women's' menstrual cycle quite awfully. Hindus also do this.

[@gsk38]

Role of women to support and provide services to men - grossly underpaid and abused. Bless all

[@evanw5572]

Notice how our cultural conceptions of what we used to eat before agriculture generally focus on hunting and protein. This would make sense since gathering was probably disproportionately done by women, and so our historical theories today would value it less.

[@DV-dt9sq]

Another interesting observation regarding gender roles... When there was a war in my country many years ago I saw men, husbands, leaving their wife and children to the "mercy" of the enemy. They simply armed themselves ( their male friends would give them weapons) and left hunreds of kilometers away from their wifes who they left unarmed!! What savagery! So women with children were left alone to somehow find a way how to save themselves and the children! Their husbands simply left them unarmed so the when enemy comes they can do with them whatewer they want. And I don't want to write here what they did. Later those husbands would get shiny badges from the army called medals, they would be called heroes in the media and would get big pension. All those women who were actual heroes, because they unarmed managed to save themselves and children didn't get anything! No pnsion, no financial compensation for horrors they went through, no free treatments for ptsp (as soldiers got)... nothing! I would like to say all women of this world that they should arm themselves if war starts in their proximity! Women of all countries arm yourselves!

[@818boy]

👍👏👏👏🌎🙏✌

[@antediluvianatheist5262]

Under no pretext...

[@SimonAshworthWood]

So you want MORE violence? How about we instead disarm everyone & do peace-building to prevent violence?

[@sentientnatalie]

Very well said. My only objection is that under primitive communism, at least, gender roles weren't so cut and dried. For example, you had AFABs who hunted, too.

[@quintusmurray6762]

Ancient women were jacked as hell .

[@asdqwe8837]

"Women hold up half the sky" - Mao

[@PazLeBon]

the sky isn't up tho , we are in it lol

[@asdqwe8837]

@Noah Sark don't smoke too much of whatever you're smoking 😉

[@PazLeBon]

@@asdqwe8837 why not?

[@NoCensorship]

I ❤️ this show!!

[@seamusinboston]

You lost me when seemingly dismissed the 3% of women mass murderers as only helpers.

[@orqg5000]

There's not much research into these issues or there isn't any at all? Huge difference. Are men and women EXACTLY the same brain wise?

[@mrshawnpp]

No. Not only did the ancients observe men and women mature at different ages, modern CAT scans showed that as well. Men about 25 years old and women about 21 YOA

[@jamesrcowan]

An anthropological account of the origins of gender roles (i.e., a general theory of tribalism) must take into account the nature of male and female bodies. There was less risk in sending male bodies to hunt dangerous animals than in sending out female bodies. No doubt, female bodies in the context of a general theory of tribalism were capable of hunting; however, the use of male bodies for hunting involved less risk and was therefore the more viable and effective option. I am not sure what Dr. Fraad means that men and women were equal in the context of a general theory of tribalism. Men and women were certainly not equal in the modern sense of being legally equal. Men were/are larger and stronger and therefore better suited to physical confrontations with animals in the context of hunting. This doesn't mean that female bodies were not capable of participating in hunting. Nevertheless, the domestic sphere that women have historically inhabited stems from historical differences in male and female bodies - at least if we are working with an anthropological account of the origin of gender roles. That said, I agree with Dr. Fraad that abrahamic religions codified gender roles in a way that privileges stereotypical masculine roles over stereotypical female roles. We still live in the context of this legacy.

[@katalinkiss120]

Indigenous and hunter gatherer societies value womens contributions to society on an equal basis to mens. Skills are acquired by both sexes that are crucial to the existence of all. The skewing occurred when the concept of ownership begins and passes through the male line and therefore favours male children. At the same time due to populations moving into other regions to acquire more territory, warfare and aggression are promoted and becomes the realm of the male which moves further afield, away from the domestic realm and the cult of life taking begins. Females are increasingly corralled into the domestic realm which is trivialised and sentimentalised to the point where if a male shows such inclinations they are ridiculed as not being "masculine enough. Women represent giving/sustaining life while men or the warrior represents taking life. This schizophrenia makes us less human by denying our capacities to be fully human with extreme Gender roles suppressing the full spectrum of expression for fear of not being acceptable to society. I think this is at the core of the trans gender debate we are experiencing

[@SimonAshworthWood]

Maybe true in environments where legumes and nuts don’t grow (e.g. arctic & tundra), but hunting was unnecessary where we can grow legumes and nuts. Meat, eggs and dairy cause so many health problems that we live longer, healthier lives avoiding them.

[@beesmonk]

Another fantastic analysis Dr Fraad

[@Illuminated7]

She’s a moron

[@joeldwest]

PAY MOTHERS FORMALLY. IT'S REAL WORK.

[@metorilt]

This wildly in accurate. How do you look at the evidence and come to these conclusions? I mean go study chimpanzees if you don't believe me, farming has nothing to do with gender roles. It is an innate charactaristic of social creatures and there is nothing wrong with gender roles it serves a natural purpose and is crucial to a species survival.

[@katieandnick4113]

What about bonobos?

[@davideserli472]

Madame. Take it easy. Precolombial societies were far from being "equal" (were more equal of course but not equal between man and women) for what we know all of them were patriarchy. And probably it's always been like this. We have sexual dimorphism and it's trademark of a specie that tends to have harem structure. Yet seems the sexual dimorphism diminished through evolution. We can still choose what we want to be but we must stop to tell each other's fairy's tale. Some of those tendencies are rooted in are our genes, please don't make the naïf assumption that what is natural is what is right. If it were so we shouldn't have any policy for gambling, obesity or drug abuse. Let's try to find the better way to make, again, the world the way we dream it. Let's focus on policies and let genetics neuroscience psychology came into gender studies. At the moment it seems just a religious cult.

[@katalinkiss120]

The oldest artefacts depicted women/goddesses. Women or the feminine was revered. There appeared to be no fortifications. Later approx 10000 years ago weapons and monolithic structures portraying masculine figures usurped the earlier ones, often they are found destroyed. This implies there was a way of life that was not warlike and worshipped/revered (possibly for most of our past as humans when) life giving not life taking and was the predominant ethos

[@katieandnick4113]

@@katalinkiss120I truly believe this. I can feel it. Nature prioritizes the female, as we can easily see in so many other species. It makes sense, even on a very scientific/material level, as we need many more women than men in order for the species to survive. I think that something happened, likely some sort of ecological event, 12,000+ years ago, that made it so men were no longer comfortable being “less important” than women. Maybe a disaster that caused mothers to have to sacrifice their sons in order to save their daughters, and the remaining boys saw this and realized how unimportant they were(compared to girls). Just a thought.

[@PazLeBon]

They come from nature lol same as every other animal on the planet, its what made the planet what it is, a success. i.e, i enjoy boxing for example, a sport both parties enter into equally and shows human charactheristics like strength, speed, intelligence, skill and courage. Violence for millenia has also protected our families and stopped wolves ruling the planet :) Violence is always used with negative slant but its a necassary mechanism of survival

[@naturallaw1733]

depends on the Purpose of the Violence. it's Not all the same.

[@coryc.9709]

The mother of the universe is a man. It's axiomatic!

[@davidevans6618]

Gender roles come from natural ability, or Capitalism which likes to cover things up.

[@bluewater454]

“Pink collar jobs”? 😂😂Lol Another creative term concocted by the feminists to give them a reason to gripe.

[@kevinschmidt2210]

Your griping is a troll job.

[@bluewater454]

@@kevinschmidt2210 😄 It’s called laughing comrade, not griping. Try to keep up.

[@ProleDaddy]

Perhaps you mean another reason for feminists to strengthen the wedge drawn between the working class ala femboss?. I know workers like to be exploited and oppressed by the women more than the men.

[@kevinschmidt2210]

@@bluewater454 You're called a misogynist. Try to shut up.

[@bluewater454]

@@ProleDaddy Wouldn’t mind being sexually harassed by one of my female bosses.

[@paulsenjohannes]

From Adam and Eve. Where else?

[@brucegibbins3792]

Gender roles are created from the needs of a society. Men are innately predisposed towards aggression. This trait can mostly be managed, but countries that because they must dominate to maintain their hegemony, need to have a military that when nessesery must have high levels of aggression to be effective. Gender roles, are thought to be nessesery to maintain an existing societal development. This has become much less so now that woman are participating in roles that have a specific purpose that was once thought of as being how nature intended or a belief held by organised religions. In any event and regardless of how much we think and do otherwise equality of opportunity is still aways off.

[@kevinschmidt2210]

Throughout history, most men wanted to be stay at home farmers, and not aggressive warriors. But the 5% of aggressive men are projected unfairly on the rest of us.

[@bpalpha]

Absolute 🐃💩

[@SimonAshworthWood]

Society’s “needs” are subjective. All moral claims (needs, shoulds, good, bad, right, wrong, better, worse, etc.) are subjective. You can say “society needs x”, and I can say “society needs y instead”, and neither of us can prove our claims, because they are subjective, not objective scientific claims.

[@SimonAshworthWood]

Every person can be aggressive. It is how a child is raised that determines their aggressiveness

[@katalinkiss120]

Throughout history men have been manipulated into fighting wars for the establishment by psychological controls based on ideas of "masculinity" and doing their "manly duty" lest they be labelled less than a man - that is - a woman - this is the basis of misogyny - men project all their own negative, undesirable or unwanted traits that are to be despised on to women in general

[@lukeolson5177]

If gender is completely a construct then why does everyone get bent out of shape when someone with an xy chromosome hits someone with an xx chromosome? I'm not a fascist who says that men are men and women are women and their is absolutely no nuance between those polarities but to ignore all biological differences between the sexes seems kind of silly to me. The majority of violent crimes are committed by xy chromosome people for a reason and it's because of testosterone and things of that nature. I have no problem with trans or non binary people but lets no act like there are absolutely no differences between xy and xx people.

[@ProleDaddy]

Trying to make both sexes into the same thing is a way the ruling class has created and strengthened factions among the working class. Women fight men and men fight women. It's all delusional masturbation and a part of the tapestry of oppression.

[@kevinschmidt2210]

Who is doing that, other than your strawman?

[@lukeolson5177]

@@kevinschmidt2210 I must have misinterpreted the point of this video then because that's what I got after watching this.

[@bpalpha]

Try thinking before posting some knee-jerk societal programming response next time.

[@jillfryer6699]

I would say comparative average weight and upper body strength are what a girl's got to keep in mind in the world being talked about here. Forget about the chromosomes entirely. And never ever forget that the muscle bound heavyweights are not to be trusted to fight fair. I am on the edge of understanding Americans feeling they need guns. Its scary.