Case 164: Cindy James

[@plusminus5483]

This is one of the most interesting cases I have ever heard! And your delivery is as always - prestige 👌 thank you man with the soothing voice!

[@mothermoon6702]

We were sitting at the edge of our seats of sheer tension. Thanks , guys, we missed you!

[@zoo2263]

The best casefile I've heard and there's a lot to choose from. Chilling and thrilling, wow what a mad story.

[@jeffreydodge2586]

What a difficult story, but as always you’ve masterly crafted a narrative that unfolds the plot in a compelling and intriguing way. Thank you and your team for all the excellent work.

[@prometheusjones6580]

The theory that she was doing the attacks herself is convincing, but there are some pieces of info which seem to indicate that someone else was involved: who was the fellow that Cindy's friend saw standing outside the house when it was burning? who called the hospital (directly to the emergency room) asking about security guards, when Cindy had just been checked in? who called Cindy from the airport (verified by the cop listening in)? did she plant those cigarette butts in her garage or were men actually waiting there? who were the two men that visited Cindy's husband? who was making the hang-up calls to her husband? Also, it was demonstrated at the inquest that one could hogtie oneself when sober, but could one really do that when hopped up on sedatives?

[@iwatchyoutube6539]

No one is hogtieing themselves

[@glowingunknown5625]

The idea that this was a stalker seems absurd with most of the details. And yet, as you point out, it sure seems like someone else (a man) was involved. Did she pay someone to help her? That's the only thing I can think of.

[@naomiledger1374]

@@glowingunknown5625 I think it's very unlikely someone was helping her, given the length of time over which all of this took place. I can't recall the details in the podcast of the airport call, but for the other questions listed by @prometheusjones6580, I think they can all be explained, even if the explanations seem far fetched,. This whole case is super odd. For me, whether Cindy did it all to herself or whether someone was extremely dedicated to tormenting her for 7+ years, they are equally strange possibilities and frankly, I think it's less likely that someone tormented her for that long w/o a trace of being found. Or indeed someone helping her w/o giving themselves away or any trace of them being found either. Sometimes, the answer is hiding in plain sight.

[@TheMoxxii]

I find it possible that some of the incidents may have been done by her, but she actually did have a stalker who was harassing her. The brain deals with trauma and stress in weird ways, and she was on a lot of medication. Maybe she was dealing with calls from a stalker, and her mental illness (PTSD, or maybe DID) was causing her to unconsiously act out things that she was worried about happening to her.

[@Lez_awake]

@@TheMoxxiithat’s a very interesting theory. I wonder if a police officer was involved in messing with her.

[@cm9439]

It's great to have you back. This is one of the all-time creepiest, freakiest segments on "Unsolved Mysteries," and is haunting to this day. Thanks for taking on this weird, twisting case and giving it your smart, well-researched touch. It's tragic and unspeakably sad.

[@julieann4616]

It’s creepy considering she did it to herself…🤯

[@jpmchausse]

Best true crime channel out there. Always so well done and thorough. Thanks for your hard work!

[@nancychisholm5399]

You were missed! Hope you had a great vacation. WELCOME BACK

[@carlwheezer1030]

My favorite case of all time, and also the first Casefile podcast I ever listened to. Absolutely fantastic telling and a very intriguing and sad mystery

[@ellenwalker4377]

woah, talk about being your own worst enemy! what a wild case. so glad to see you back.

[@mam2327]

This case was both harrowing and psychologically thrilling. I had to get up and turn on all the lights in my apartment after hearing that voice recording. Amazing story telling- reminds me of old school casefile. Thank you!

[@willielarsson9651]

Hope u sleep better:)

[@rachelr.n.3563]

She didn't kill herself...watch Bailey Sarians video about it!

[@OKBgosh]

The voice was so obviously her own...

[@ashleyp287]

Yall do realize she was doing this to herself right?? Ive done so much research on this case. She many things point to her having issues and doing this to herself. I believe she had multiple personality disorder and possibly didn't even realize she was doing this to herself. If u hear the messages of the "prank caller" it's so obvious it's a woman's voice trying to sound like a man. She was always tied up with stockings which I believe she used stocking cuz the material is stretchy and can be torn and holes can be made very easily. I believe she used nylon stocking when tying herself up so that if someone didn't find her she could easily get out of the stocking restraints. She refused a 24hr police patrol in front of her home. If u were being harrased, assaulted and tied up on several different occasions by an unknown person would u refuse police security?? Of course u wouldn't but she did and refused to have police put a tap on her phone. Why is that? Then her doctor put her in a psychiatric hospital for 10weeks! Thats not some lil 72hr hold, this is 10weeks which is a long time. Obviously her doctor saw that she needed serious help. Her doing this to herself is the only thing that makes sense

[@glowingunknown5625]

@@ashleyp287 - I'm definitely of the opinion it was her own doing too. Most of the details don't make sense for a stalker. But there are multiple times that another person (man) is involved. Did she pay someone to help her?

[@SHurd-rc2go]

Another take: Examining the Cindy James Case with Women and Crime. LA Not So Confidential podcast. Thank you, Case Files, for this excellent podcast.

[@robsimpson7319]

The call from the airport?! Was that her husband leaving for South Africa? The cop heard it too... Crazy tale this one. The hardest battles are fought in the mind.

[@Jay-qm8cx]

Casefile is back! Good 2021

[@lynnjoburns2106]

Her policeman boyfriend was a witness to at least one of her anonymous phone calls,how could this b if she was doing it all herself

[@SDD966]

I'm only half way through , but how was the phone call traced to their airport ?!

[@edwardiiiofengland9337]

@@lynnjoburns2106 I honestly believe she hired someone to do that.

[@samih5916]

Finally, been waiting for this.

[@trishheart-lee4360]

The male with the slight accent gets to me. Roy being a doctor and his instant reaction to police at his house was to say “she’s dead” 🤨 Roy had an accent, and he would know exactly how to phone the hospital and bypass the switchboard. After years of attacks etc, that was his response? Sooooo many things don’t add up here. My gut doesn’t sit right with that ex-husband Roy!

[@Vexarax]

I was literally just thinking about this case today and wanting to revisit it, but I'd forgotten her name! Then I was thinking "well instead I'll check out the new Casefile episode as I haven't had a chance to listen to that yet" and _it's the case I was thinking about_ D:

[@kamistormcelestekennedy]

That's awesome!!! ⚡️

[@brenutbutterandjelly]

I'm so happy you posted again! listening first thing in the morning

[@AMYV3]

Casefile is back !!!! THANK YOU 😊

[@danrobinson572]

Finally!! The wait is over😀

[@andreaharris2919]

So happy you're back. I listened to all your posts for a second time hoping for your return!

[@hmscldtrs]

Oh thank God!! I missed you so much!!

[@twelvesmylimit]

My goodness, I haven't even pressed start on the video, so apologies if you've addressed this but...WHERE HAVE YOU BEEN? We've missed you and your amazing work. So happy to have a new episode!

[@michellelammi787]

Sounds like he is from Australia or NZ. Been our Summer holidays

[@twelvesmylimit]

@@michellelammi787 How very dare he? 😉

[@Gabriel-of-YouTube]

They take a holiday at the beginning of the year.

[@calamityj3634]

@@Gabriel-of-KZbin we do . And a second wave of Ciovid restrictions has made it a weird time down here too

[@michellelammi787]

Are you in WA then? No restrictions here in QLD or most of the rest of the country.

[@user-ce8tr1ex2m]

Who was the male that called the hospital asking about their security when she was there after one of the attacks? It seems to me that she was causing the major of event but there was also someone out there adding to them. Maybe husband started it knowing what buttons to push & then she took over the entire thing. He would add small pieces to the thing after making her go completely insane.

[@PS-en7wn]

F Fantastic. Loved it. Glad to see you back.

[@birdswont]

Welcome back. Really missed your podcasts

[@paulacarberry1216]

This case was unreal. I had to listen to it again. Thank you 😊 💓

[@beckbeck5110]

So glad you're back 💙

[@leonbritz]

Don't understand why I have to listen to ads when I'm a premium KZbin subscriber?

[@melbournegirl7]

I don’t understand why you don’t have more subscribers. Love your episodes.

[@Goalartzo]

Yay!! Glad you’re back! Hope you were all able to recharge and have a nice break 😊

[@judyjudy51]

Beautiful quote at the end ♥

[@danielplatt3218]

I listened to this on the podcast app but came here to write that this was potentially the best podcast ive ever listened too. Well done 🙏

[@taracoff6832]

Missed these😍😍😍 I'm so excited

[@Voxzilla]

Glad you're back!

[@tb7667]

The episodes with real audio content, like phone recordings, police interviews (like Stephanie Lazarus and Jennifer Pan) and Jonestown death tape add so much to the podcast. The phone call to Roy was short, but chilling. It really flipped the case for me - definitely a woman's voice.

[@agnescassar7604]

Sad story. Thank you casefile.

[@rinnivaughan]

welcome back :)

[@antonyloc]

Great video! This story and person give me the same feeling as the Sherri Papini case.

[@jcqlnr464]

The thing that seems telling to me is how she repeatedly seemed to turn down help or options for things that would help her. Like moving into a secure apartment building for now. A pet owner myself, I get she wants the dog to get outside but I mean if she was going through this living hell then why would she not at least temporarily move into a secure place?! Also why would she tear up and throw away letters from the alleged stalker? Why not hand them over to the police? Even if they didn't do anything with them at least she didn't have to look at them but it could be something to help catch this stalker!!!? I don't understand her actions if she truly was a victim of this stalking and terror.

[@redpillfreedom6692]

Makes me wonder what would have happened if she moved to the other end of the country, say to Toronto or Montreal. Would they have been that persistent? She did move 3 or 4 times during this time frame, but it was always in the Vancouver metro. The fact they kept this up for as long as they did would suggest they also lived in the general area.

[@rezn8]

Welcome back 🖤

[@Happinosis]

This is so desperately sad.

[@lestereo]

Fascinating case

[@redflorian4672]

Perfect surprise on a saturday thank you

[@justinstoll4955]

Casefile came back strong! Is it wrong to be excited that a show about true crime bis back? But I am.

[@naomiledger1374]

That was w/o doubt the most truly bizarre tale I've ever heard! After initially smh at what I suspected was police negligence (again) regarding their suspicions of her suicide, I'm now of the belief that Cindy must have been very unstable, although clearly highly intelligent, and likely did cause her own death. Could anyone really have protected her from herself? Who knows. But it is perplexing that in all her hospital stays and medical attention and psyche assessments that NOBODY cottoned on to something being not right with Cindy. That part is very perplexing to me. However, whether Cindy was the perpetrator or the victim of another, that poor woman suffered a traumatic existence and I'm not surprised she felt exhausted and wanted it to be over. Very sad, for Cindy and all those in her life.

[@shadowmoon5445]

Wondered where you went, awesome!

[@saramorisani]

Amazing story!

[@jacquelinerussell8530]

Wow agree Kept me guessing until the end I would've bet it was the estrange husband. Truth is definitely more fascinating than fiction 🤔 I once that once you decide to commit suicide you are actually giddy if not euphoric because you know soon it will all be over

[@jeffreydodge2586]

Very true. Classic sign that the person has a plan, is going to act on it and usually does. It is a bad sign if a person who has verbalized self harm becomes happy and peaceful.

[@J_Honor_]

Never even heard of this case as im living under 1990. Its an awesome video still and im getting the jist of it

[@secularbeast1751]

A story well told as always, CP. Never heard of this case before, and as I listened I kept asking myself, with all the things that happened to her prior to he death, how could anyone experience years of kidnapping, brutality, and constant intimidation, without going crazy and carrying on her life as usual ? Then the moment you said she was doing this to herself, all made sense. Poor soul.

[@brucetactic8846]

I still believe she had a stalker at some point who had a fixation for her and she must have encountered her during her married life, triggering PTSD and hallucinations. Just a theory. God knows the truth. Rip Cindy 💔

[@suwaidajalal]

Damn. I couldn't sleep listening to this. And the voice on the answering machine is terrifying.

[@18uprhea]

I recently cancelled my Spotify subscription. What is the best way to support the show? This is my favorite podcast. I really want to show my appreciation on a regular basis so it can continue. Thanks.

[@michaelw9638]

Subscribe to their patreon, you get episodes a week early, along with bonus clips such as Q&A with the host and writers

[@Ceej75]

The Apple podcast app?

[@CasefileTrueCrimePodcast]

Hey there! You can support us by making a monthly contribution on Patreon of either $2 or $5 a month, by going to patreon.com/casefile. But we are just happy that you listen!

[@gritty011]

I have listened to this 3 times since it was posted and I know how it ends but it’s so weird you just have to watch it again

[@evdaribarovski5698]

I had to listen to this story again. I felt so sorry for Cindy and her mental condition. Was she sacked from a job? If so this may have had a profound affect on her self esteem which lead to her deteriorate mentally. But omg where did she get that quantity of the antidepressant medication. Her husband was a psychiatrist maybe he was somehow supplying them to Cindy. Was she seeing a psychiatrist? Or not. Many many questions than answers.

[@ashleyking1146]

I don’t understand how a woman could do all of this to herself as people are implying in the comments. Not saying it’s not at all possible, of course just surprising that someone could go through all the trouble of giving themselves black eyes, puncture their neck, tie a stocking so tight that it leaves marks plus tie their hands behinds their backs...you’re right tho, way more questions than answers

[@jcqlnr464]

And my other question is how did she feel like the police were "brushing her off" when she was clearly holding back information about her attacks and being secretive about it with her own family and the police? So how were they supposed to do more to help her then exactly when she wouldn't give them all the information?

[@carlroy]

I heard the sound of a woman in the tape you played. Cindy waa crazy and I don't know if the attack was part of a sick fantaisie or a cry fo help.

[@Lez_awake]

Me too, it was actually kind of comical when I imagined her face when I was listening to it

[@johng7410]

What an interesting case!

[@suzbay8932]

Welcome back 👍😉

[@Flying_Fetus]

It sounds like she was abusing Ativan. It can cause blackouts that come on very suddenly. She mentions to police taking 6mg- thats a lot of Ativan. Easily enough to cause a blackout.

[@donnablack6280]

You had me in the first half, not gonna lie.

[@ashleyp287]

Very long comment so forgive me BUT: Am I the only one who believes she was doing this to herself? I've read so much about this case and so many things point to her being very unstable and in my opinion probably had multiple personality disorder and didn't even know she was doing this to herself. If u listen to the messages the "attacker" left its so obvious it's a woman's voice trying to sound like a man. She was tied up several times with women's stockings. Stockings are a very stretchy material and can rip and get holes very easily which is why us females are always having "runs/holes" in our stockings. I believe she used stockings to tie herself up cuz she could easily get out of the restraints in the chance that nobody found her in time. Police wanted to out a tap on her phone to see of they could trace where the prank calls were coming from and she got defensive and refused. They also offered 24hr police patrol in front of her home and she refused that too. If you were receiving threatening calls and u were attacked and tied up several different times would u refuse police patrol? Of course u wouldn't but she did. Ask urself why??..sometimes she was attacked outside at night while walking her dog but even after these attacks over and over again she still kept walking her dog all alone at night. Nobody would do that if u kept getting attacked at night..She also changed her story several times on the details when she was attacked. When police call out the discrepancies in her version of events she then tells them a different story of how she was attacked and claims she wasn't honest at first vuz the attacker threatened to harm her family.. but what sense does that make,, if ur afraid the attacker will hurt ur family why even go to police? She goes to police tells them of an attack that happened in her garage and when there's no evidence of an attack taking place in the garage and blood is found in the bathroom she then admits that the attack happened in the bathroom and she didn't wana tell police ciz she was afraid her family would be harmed. It makes no damn sense. then her doctor committed her to a mental hospital for 10 weeks! That's a long time, thats not some lil 72 hr hold, it's 10 weeks. Obviously her doctor thought she had some serious issues to keep her in that hospital for 10 weeks. When u look at everything as a whole the only logical explanation is she did this to herself.

[@amandasiddle6571]

Where have u been i missed u casefile

[@FingerSpazm]

"Over the Christmas break she admits she may have had a little too much pavlova and had a few too many sneaky cocktails" Same Jess... Same...

[@kskssxoxskskss2189]

How is that a police department? Hopefully they've learned since then.

[@theheroine177]

Yay! I thought you retired.

[@redpillfreedom6692]

I thought that her ex-husband might be involved, but it appears he was also being harassed himself albeit to a smaller degree. Seems weird he'd be taking part in it only for the harassers to eventually target him as well.

[@HiNickCares]

59:00 That sounds like a woman.

[@Lizzifer7]

Agree wholeheartedly

[@maebla]

I wondered if anybody else had noticed this. I've actually never come across this case before, but the pathology makes no sense. Any chance she did all of this to herself? That sounds awful as I don't want to blame the victim, but I'm struggling to understand the whys.

[@HiNickCares]

@@maebla I think that is the most likely scenario.

[@maebla]

@Steven McAnus Admittedly I started scouring the comments when they found the body, pretty much thinking the story ended there. I have never flipped flipped on a case so much. It's a real tough one as the 80's was a bad year for the cops internationally and there are numerous cases where they concluded accidental death or suicide, when it was clearly foul play (mostly with women involved). This woman suffered either way and was failed miserably by a myriad of public services. And her family, let's be fair.

[@cm9439]

Cindy left the messages.

[@Hezabelle77]

I was clocking her after that answering machine message to Roy. That was a woman. Then when you think back, all of the incidents happen when someone was expecting her at a specific time.

[@azff]

Casefile...where have you been?

[@luckyluciana3462]

After me ex neighbour I’ve learned the energy someone can put into painting a picture they’re a stalking victim. She went so far as to try and run us down outside our yard because “ I thought you c**ts were my f***ing stalker”. She had the cops over anytime the smallest thing happened . Things escalated over time and thankfully she’s now out of my life

[@lisetteeliseparis7070]

Waittaminit - she opted for a garden and a place for her dog over security? Really?

[@loredanadincu7930]

Her not remembering almost anything from the atacks and also refusing to give her ataker description make me think she did it herself.

[@mcashw]

How does she tie her hands behind her back with duct tape and then nearly kill herself and go into a coma

[@loredanadincu7930]

@@mcashw The narator literaly said that a criminal expert did an experiment and show on her inquiry that she could have posibbly done that. He said the roope was loosed around her wrists. Did you watched the whole video. Also others hear sugested the same thing as me. Why you only ask me questions.

[@Natlatify]

Someone else was definitely involved though - many people saw/heard other people who weren't Cindy around the home, and who called Cindy while she was in the presence of a police officer who heard the silent call?

[@edwardiiiofengland9337]

My jaw dropped at the end. But then you have to think: “surely they would have caught someone in the act?” Yet never did. Yet I don’t think she acted alone.

[@davidmayhew8083]

Lord. And i thought i had problems.

[@JR-xw5nv]

IDK. I know people can go pretty far in hurting themselves, but this seems like went pretty far. And maybe people can tie themselves up, but when also choking and drugged? Likely in extreme pain? Again, it may be possible, but it sounds incredibly difficult.

[@Lez_awake]

I think one of her personalities took over and hurt her. Seems like she had DID and that’s why she couldn’t remember things ( besides the drug abuse, obviously)

[@johnarnold8941]

WEIRD

[@zhouse2472]

I'm not convinced this was suicide...and def a mysterious history of 'events'....in fact, it seemed like Roy could've also been responsible for setting 'things' up. At this point, it's his word against hers on things not proven. Ever hear of a hitman? Wonder if her sister would ever consider a psychic to help investigate....Casefile, you're one of the best and your presentation always brings the victim to life in a way that makes us care for them.

[@Fauntleroy.]

You're dubious about the investigation, yet are prepared to believe a psychic.

[@zhouse2472]

@@Fauntleroy. You obviously haven't seen many of the cases that have been solved w/psychic detective work. In situations like this when families and loved ones are tormented for maybe the rest of their lives, answers are what they long for. TRY putting yourself in people's situations.

[@theknowlodge8294]

@@zhouse2472 - literally none have.

[@codyandrew1196]

@Z House I think you're delusional and couldn't show a single case like that.

[@christinaperrigo]

@@zhouse2472 Sorcery is NEVER the answer.

[@Jimmytheman1]

I’ve been looking forward to this for some time...very spooky story, I think she did it herself because she was a bit loopy and she might have accidentally done too much the last time but who knows...

[@1GreatPlan]

The ending was such a surprise. Why would she do all that to herself. For the attention I guess but then she killed herself. Wow

[@taradeleeuw2344]

Does one find the evolution of podcasts,provokes more reasonable questions of obvious nature

[@xlnuniex]

Its only Roy’s word to investigators against Cindy after her death. I really think Roy had something to do with this

[@redpillfreedom6692]

Maybe but there are several details that have me thinking he wasn't involved 1. Roy was himself an occasional target of disturbing calls, the most obvious incident being that creepy voicemail. The tone sounds like the caller is taunting Roy as if to say "We're gonna kill your ex wife and there's nothing you can do." 2. Being a suspect in the harassment started to affect his social and financial life. Some of his friends stopped talking to him and he nearly lost his job. If Roy was behind it, he was intentionally engaging in behavior that was causing him a lot of unnecessary problems. 3. Cindy herself eventually stopped believing Roy was involved. When Det. Anderson interviewed her after the October 1988 attack, he asked her if Roy might be behind it and Cindy said "No, there wouldn't be a point. It's been a couple years." In other words, they'd been officially divorced for two years and hadn't spoken to each other since. 4. According to Ian Mulgrew's book on the case, Makepeace felt immense guilt for Cindy divorcing him for the rest of his life. Killing her would have just made those feelings worse. Obviously none of these details fully exonerate him but they do incline me to believe he wasn't involved.

[@ivymeadows1944]

Is it possible someone forced her to leave that message, "cindy dead meat soon"? Wasn't it right after that when she was found dead?

[@redpillfreedom6692]

That message was sent October 1988, Cindy died late May, early June 1989.

[@JimMilton-ej6zi]

Wait how did you hear that voicemail and hear sunday? What the heck lol

[@ah-shar-ya2363]

Wow, that was very dramatic. thought she had 9 lives. I started to think she was doing this to herself after the 4th incident.

[@fannyhemmafru2388]

i think it is over whelmingly clear that Roy did this to her so she would "need" him in her life

[@187alan]

It's funny I just listened to this on MrBallen's channel.

[@Fallen_Venus]

Munchausen syndrome... more common amongst nurses. I know of one. No action was taken against her and she continued nursing... I was suspicious of her husband dying of a heart attack, too.

[@Raventooth]

Nais!

[@mrs.schmenkman]

That Audio recording was so clearly female I'm shocked anyone thought it was małe. I had a roommate who completely fits the profile. She was caught stealing meds from her patients and lost her nursing license. That was how she was stopped. Her hubby and five adult kids wiped their hands of her after years of manipulations. Cindy died of death by misadventure imho. She had to keep upping the ante until she went "all-in". Chances are she was getting drugs from the house she had walked to. Hence the leaving the car after the cash withdrawal.

[@xlnuniex]

It was over a mile away from where her car was parked. And they said she deposited her paycheck. Not cashed it.

[@lollim1548]

Omg it's like the film "sleeping with the enemy"

[@susiefoxy8130]

20 mins in and ive decided that Cindy has no boundaries when choosing partners. I dont think there is any attacker either!

[@michellelammi787]

I think the phonecall voice is more feminine than male. I think she did this to herself. Sadly, she was most likely a very ill woman.

[@xlnuniex]

Maybe she assumed it was Roy hiring people to attack her. And left those voicemails. Weird that Roy wouldnt involve the police which was advised by his attorney. Anytime there was great suspicion on Roy… there was no attacks or notes. Nothing. I think Roy had something to do with this.

[@kimturner5826]

This story is TRULY a sad one once the diagnosis of DID was mentioned ALL OF THE LIGHTS CAME ON AND EVERYTHING WAS CLEAR!! That poor woman was TORTURED IN HER LATER LIFE... 😢 however it makes sense that did was that underlying culprit that plagued her.. Her husband being a psychologist by trade saw some SIGNS!! He should have dug deeper into her psyche bcuz THERE WERE SIGNS!! IT'S to bad that her alters were against her or one of them anyway because she didn't have that 1 alter that in my opinion was strong enough to protect her !! DID is likend to me like the disease ALS very misunderstood and a miserable diseases to be afflicted with!! My heart goes out to her husband and family GOD BE WITH YOU!!!!!!

[@texastea5686]

32:16 Cindy Makepeace? 🤔 for some reason, I didn't think they were married

[@Northern5tar]

Poor woman was obviously very ill, but damn she could have landed an innocent man in prison for life.

[@taradeleeuw2344]

Sure

[@chezlamere4276]

That's weird I lived in vanc in the 80's I don't remember any of this case. Maybe it was all those babies& toddlers taking up my brain energy....

[@user-mt4ku7jw1y]

Theres no way she killed herself, not a chance, she defo did have a stalker though