Centrifugal Clutch vs Torque Converter - Go Kart Build Part 5

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[@tylertruitt377]

the 12 tooth vs 15 tooth probably makes a 10+mph difference.

[@akkudakkupl]

15 tooth is the limit for a properly working sprocket. 12 tooth will jerk the chain all the time and eat itself quick.

[@hungngo4790]

So like the less the tooth the faster the speed ?

[@fixitrippitreckit6963]

Hung Ngo no the more teeth/ bigger sprocket or gear is faster but the bigger the gear the lower the torque

[@matthewjohnson2495]

Tyler Truitt I’d say more than that

[@71sc502]

@@hungngo4790 larger #of teeth= bigger top speed but will take longer. Less teeth wony have as high of a top speed, but will accelerate much quicker

[@ahmaddarwish1486]

You need to take off that restrictive muffler and remove the governor if it's still on, there is so much wasted potential, this should definitely be a 40+ kart, with the torque converter!

[@zed4me]

Don't wanna be any louder. Governor is already removed just gotta get a large front sprocket

[@fatbuddycat]

@@zed4me lol I know the struggle. I bought a Coleman ct200u and jacked the 196cc Hisun way up. Full governor delete, performance carb, intake, exhaust, 22# springs, CS Grind cam, PVL flywheel, 32 degrees of timing, gapped Autolite race plug and an ARC billet rod all through a TAV 30. It is super loud and sounds nothing like a farm implement, she honks too! To stay on the low I would recommend a Tillotson PK-1b carburetor with an intake ($26 for carburetor, $25 for filter kit), remove the spark arrestor (crappy baffle) from the stock muffler (not too much louder), Autolite race plug ($6), largest rear sprocket you can fit (with chain on it, leave an inch of tire side wall) and then preload your TAV 30 to the second setting. This will increase your low and top end without much noise. Now, as for the longevity of that motor (with the governor properly removed from the block) it is going to be necessary to put in a billet piston rod with better bearings and oil clearances even more so than upgrading your springs so you don't unseat a valve and bend a push rod because when that piston rod fails (it will ) it is going to punch a 2 inch hole in your block or the cheap flywheel will stress fracture and explode after becoming unbalanced from the higher RPMs. A PVL aluminum flywheel is about $60 vs over $100 for a billet model. As long as you add 4 degrees of timing with an offset key and install it properly, it is race proven and will handle something like 17,000 RPM for an hour. Your stock motor pushed around 3400 and a governor delete goal is 6700-7000 which nearly doubles power/torque if done completely. I had a friend who blew his Predator out 2 times before he bought one and left it alone. A lot of people think that governor is just some sort of thing there for other applications and doesn't matter. It's not. It is there because the rest of the engine is not designed or built to keep up with its own potential therefore shortening the life of the motor. You already have a sweet cart, TAV 30 and a goal. Save up $100 or less for another motor, break it down and build it. It's not hard, practice placing bolts and things back in threads after removing parts. It's by far the coolest, man card approved puzzle you can put together!!

[@Gone_rn]

Mine hits 50 with the governor and a 12 tooth clutch

[@user-pt1hz2wz7h]

@@fatbuddycat hey dude

[@xaviermccloud4586]

@@fatbuddycat You sounded really gay in this comment.

[@addamsiewdass1832]

i made one without clutch and i tried to use it without a clutch but i dropped it and the wheels were spinning so fast the kart flew off and hit the neighbours wall and now i have to rebuild the frame.

[@andrea4809]

Why would you do that?

[@71sc502]

😆

[@brocku0]

yep gonna need a clutch haha

[@callsaul2345]

Lmao

[@tylerpripps4969]

I bet your neighborhood just loves you...

[@motobrosfz-r199]

What he's doing aint shit compared wht goes around my neighborhood

[@DattITrappan8400]

U mad

[@Bmr4life]

@@DattITrappan8400 He converted it to electric

[@justinryan212]

Tyler Pripps lol what pansy

[@brocku0]

bro i have about 10 guys with mini bikes in our neighbor hood and they dont give a shit, some of them are loud as shit

[@toreyweaver9708]

This was a really great video, man! I've been wanting to throw one of these CVT converters on one of my two mini bikes. We race them only once in a blue moon. Lots of low speed, all clutch riding. Not too good for those little Chinese clutches! I think I'm gonna buy one and rig it up now! Thanks for the video man. Subbed!

[@ericweiss5235]

Loss of top speed is probably your gearing. If RPM top out, you are geared too low. If RPM are too low, and you are not heating the peak of the power band, you are geared too high.

[@FairladyS130]

Yes, a definitive test would require a sprocket change based on maximum rpm reached at top speed. I'd like to see that.

[@trudybergen3510]

Torque converters really help a lot 😎

[@jacesgarage658]

im most impressed by that start

[@Gamen4Bros]

Great video! How did you do the mph in the edit?

[@Wonkawiz]

What app do you use to track your telemetry?

[@captnhowdy01able]

keep the 12 tooth on and change your drive pulley on the the jack shaft to a 6 inch that will give you speed. if you have a 7 or larger that is mainly for torque.

[@THEWHITEBOY503]

What app are you using for telemetry?

[@rgaribay5090]

What are the specs for your engine?

[@COOL_CANADIAN]

The belt torque converter is smoother takeoff I find than the centrifugal chain clutch. I used both on my 196cc bicycle and the chain one I broke spokes but the belt one not as many.

[@mr-salty6145]

what kind of go kart frame is that

[@banghuynh609]

Let me ask what the transmission ratio is

[@vannigiovannigio8861]

Well done video man. Thank you.

[@christopherwilliams8423]

What app are you using? Thanks

[@vegasLo702]

What gear ratio are you running

[@alonsolopez8855]

How much does a go kart like that cost ?

[@TheNitro540]

What torque converter brand is that?

[@agrmohamedrabbani3854]

Why used​ torque converter!? What wi'll happen after join torque converter?

[@ExplorewithZac]

Different number of teeth and governor in the engine. :/ Really great quality video though. What camera are you using?

[@dvbs3608]

No governor

[@sumairrahman7165]

Hay I have a 420cc go kart and I’m going to put a 40 series clutch on it do you think it will spin the tire and should I go chain drivin.

[@jacobsomsky412]

I have a 420cc kart with a 40 series torque converter. You can check my page to watch it drive! I would recommend going with the torque converter but watch the video and tell me what you think.

[@jarrett1890]

where did you get that frame from? I'm kinda interested in that frame now...

[@zed4me]

I bought it off Craigslist. I believe it's from the late 80s early 90s

[@strangewoofer5780]

CVT gives you the max amount of revs for any amount of throttle. Converter increases the torque, but it dies off fast

[@nickthecarguy-channel]

I want to do a tourque converter and then do a crazy small axle sprocket to go really fast top speed, but I’m worried about the brakes on my go kart. They are nearly nonexistent. Anybody have any recommendations?

[@Customwinder1]

nick the car guy fix ya brakes 😂

[@disfunctionalmorons1324]

It depends what skills you have, If you have bolt on replacement skills or fabrication skills and equipment. I've found sport quad rear brakes to be an easy and cheap upgrade. The problem with small sprockets is you lose acceleration and off the line power. Think of it like a 21 speed bike and how hard you have to work to get going in the higher gears. Too small a sproket will burn up the clutch or in the case of the torque converter setup it would cause excessive wear on the belt and the clutches, it will also over work the engine

[@mjk4378]

What engine inside sprockets were you using when you did a run with a clutch? I have a 196 mL clone motor with a Mikuni 22 with a 12 front and 60 rear and Im 250 lbs and I hit 40mph.

[@nazarhadomskyi9008]

Who won?

[@Manti0]

Do you know any way to make a manual clutch for the motor?

[@zed4me]

good question, i dont

[@choppy5oh]

Is it safe to bypass the governor and use a torque converter as well? Or will the belt fly off?

[@deaganriley5019]

its safe... just put a 7 hp on my mini bike and took off the governor. thing flies.

[@Nevadaboise]

How does the engine idle? It there a clutch or just brake/gas? In other words how do you stop moving when you start the engine?

[@zed4me]

Both setups have a clutch.

[@extremerider93]

what app did you use for telemetry?

[@zed4me]

Geo tracker

[@ephenj]

Somone has probably already asked. Anyways what go-kart frame are you running.

[@jaymepaololaciste]

does the tranmission has roller weights? you may make adjustment to reach the top speed....

[@byrdcity6490]

There's no transmission on it.

[@moto6ixmoto83]

how many cc

[@KiriRose]

Witch one can handle kart drifting better?

[@zed4me]

Hard to say, neither does it very well.. although I'd give a slight edge to the CVT

[@darmainrcoker3586]

dide u need a 9 tooth clearly if be slow

[@codgamerswiicodgamerswii7884]

I have a torque converter but when I started my go-cart it took off and rammed into my siding of my house and bashed it in my go-cart is ok though but why didn't my go-cart sit still and idol instead of taking off? I am going to get a clutch for it but I am still wondering what the hell happened lol it scared the hell out of me!!

[@2yrcrosskartbuild]

the belt was yo tight or it was idled up high ur also if ur missin the piece that spins on your torque converter

[@Deucealive75]

If you are slower with the CVT that means you changed the final drive ratio from the start. A better test would be to keep the final drive ratio the same as the clutch arrangement. If you then are slower with the CVT it is because you ran out of engine power at a certain speed/rpm. In theory you should be much faster with a CVT. For this test what was your tooth count on the CVT and rear sprocket?

[@frigglebiscuit7484]

you forget hp loss through a cvt.

[@dkdanis1340]

@@frigglebiscuit7484 won't lose any power with cvt.

[@TacticalPhoenixYT]

@@dkdanis1340 Yeah, it will. about 20% in indeal circumstances. The belt has an inherent loss.

[@sr8shoota]

does the torque converter engage when you give it gas?

[@zed4me]

There's a clutch that engages which then engages the torque convertor which is really a CVT

[@555currencyexchange6]

Where can I getta seat like that

[@chrismarble7585]

Clean that garage man

[@gavinfaync]

Gokarts wont work with my neighboorhod there are 20 degree inclines

[@Marty_Deslions]

Since it has the torque converter, does it want to creep forward when the engine is at idle?

[@zed4me]

No there is a centrifugal clutch still so it only engages above idle

[@Marty_Deslions]

@@zed4me Wait, also the torque converted kart has a centrifugal clutch too?

[@zed4me]

@@Marty_Deslions yes, without a clutch, there is no way for an engine to not stall at a stop

[@dkdanis1340]

@@Marty_Deslions not like regular clutch. When on idle belt isn't engaged but as soon as you press throttle pulley expands out and grabs the belt.

[@Marty_Deslions]

@@dkdanis1340 ok thanks

[@Sloppyjoe96]

is that a nexus 6p?

[@zed4me]

Joe yes

[@andrewvoigt1133]

Smaller driven sprocket for higher top speed not larger. It's also taller rear tires for higher top speed. A cvt makes a smaller rear sprocket painless. Most of the go cart cvt depends on belt slack for a clutch. The belt slack prevents you from using the low end of the pulley. If you combine a cvt with a centrifugal clutch you can get much better launches. That is how Honda set up the gy6 transmission. Though admittedly they did it backwards.

[@vaironxxrd]

Hey Mind letting us know a bit more about the electric bikes? Resources even good forum post you've used to build yours? I have been wanting to build an electric scooter, actually more of a gas scooter by myself for a while. Thanks!

[@zed4me]

Endless-sphere.net hands down is the best resource. I'll be posting more vids with great info

[@AnthonyGarcia-kd9mx]

+zed4me you should make a separate channel for go kart and post like every other day then you can get sponsored and get free stuff for projects

[@zed4me]

If I had the time I would. But I can only post so often due to my schedule

[@AnthonyGarcia-kd9mx]

+zed4me well try the best you can and see many people will like it I promise there like a craze for go karts at the moment so at least try it

[@agrmohamedrabbani3854]

What is the purpose of torque converter!?

[@ppcasm9837]

Glad someone asked instead of assuming a torque converter/CVT is all about "speed" (not the guy in the video, obviously he understands the true concept as he stated facts in the video) When you use a centrifugal clutch, you have what's essentially a "static" gearing ratio. To put this into perspective, imagine having a 2 speed manual (stick shift) vehicle, and imagine you could only use 2nd gear. This would essentially be static gearing, and would yield the result that depending on the gearing ratio used, you could have extremely fast takeoff, and a slow top end speed, or the other way around, but generally losing either/or in trade-off during the process of finding the desired gear ratio to use. Using this same example of the 2 speed manual, with a CVT, you essentially have a "dynamic" gear ratio that would be akin to you starting in first gear, and having the ability of switching to second, allowing not only better final drive gear ratios (the gearing from the driven pulley sprocket to the sprocket that drives the wheels itself) , but also a good mix of top end (top speed) and bottom end (takeoff speed) without sacrificing as much, supposing you find a good final drive gear ratio. This "gearing" is done variably (hence the reason CVT means continuously variable transmission, or as you call it "torque converter") by changing the driver, and driven pulley ride heights based on engine RPMs. When it first starts off the belt is riding down the inside of the driver pulley (pulley on the engine) and riding the outside of the driven (pulley at the axle/drive sprocket) and as the engine increases RPM the driver pulley closes in on the belt, causing the belt to start riding higher on the driver pulley (toward the outsides), which in turn makes the driven pulley at the drive sprocket open and the belt start riding lower (toward the inside), essentially "changing gears" as you speed up and slow down, continuously.

[@domenicozagari2443]

Get a smaller sprocket for the wheels.

[@foreverlalone569]

Which one lasts longer with off road use?

[@gabrielgalaxygh]

Tourque converter all day. The centrifugal clutch burn up fast off road

[@foreverlalone569]

@@gabrielgalaxygh ok thanks

[@gabrielgalaxygh]

@@foreverlalone569 no problem I know Its a bit late but at least it got answered ha

[@tristan6509]

Torque converters can overheat off-road. whatever you use, you'll want a low gear

[@Nevadaboise]

Is there a cable that engages/disengages centrifugal clutch?

[@Nevadaboise]

Or does it tension the chain instead?

[@zed4me]

If you look up how centrifugal clutches work you'll see how it engages. Basically at higher than idle RPM it will engage.

[@Nevadaboise]

Thank You all makes sense now!

[@locedoutbiking2524]

Is the governor still on it

[@zed4me]

no

[@addamsiewdass1832]

nice kart

[@TheTIMONZ4KSU]

what size sprocket are you using?

[@zed4me]

Timonz4ksu I think 56

[@TheTIMONZ4KSU]

Okay thanks

[@acehighflyer123]

Man that Lifan 200cc motor would be a great addition to your build. I love your current setup, but if you really stop to think about it the weakest part of the build is the motor. Stacking another 3000+ rpm on top would fix all your issues with speed as well as getting a more even response throughout the range. Granted the 200cc has its own gearbox so it would undo some the current progress...LOL Cheers, looked like a ton of fun.

[@beefnugget2494]

Shower thoughts: I wonder how well a GPS can keep track of how fast you're moving if you start to climb a steep Road, imagine looking down from the sky if something is moving partially upwards the more it moves upwards the slower it looks like it's moving so how do satellites see that, not sure if I explain that clearly enough but God damn it I'm not an idiot lmao

[@str8xrippin]

Easy... Satellites don't look down like they are looking at ants, no. Your phone sends out data and logging information through it's predetermined information about it's location, topography, speed and elevation. Your phone just sends the data and receives it back, simple

[@DavidRodriguez-fn4yn]

The gps can probably tell your elevation is changing

[@beefnugget2494]

@@DavidRodriguez-fn4yn yeah there's three satellites at three different positions that are able to identify exactly where you are on the earth including elevation

[@lilswizzy2174]

What is that app called?

[@zed4me]

I think digiHUD

[@lewist2413]

Are you in Warwick ri ?

[@dappersi]

1 min from my house lol

[@zed4me]

When am I gonna see what your build is capable of?

[@spaghettii6580]

zed4me was the governor removed in this video

[@riley7796]

actually maybe

[@riley7796]

yes

[@zed4me]

Nik davis yeah it was

[@danielsessions7692]

Can't wait for a NEW VIDEO!!!!!!!!

[@zed4me]

currently working on sourcing all the parts for the conversion!

[@danielsessions7692]

+zed4me CANT WAIT!!!!

[@SqueakyLynn311]

zed4me is that a birel frame?

[@kungumarajkumar5125]

hi! zed4me.... I'm in a 125cc gokart project, please let me know that which is the better transmission, CVT or centrifugal clutch???

[@zed4me]

I talked about the pros and cons of each at the end of this video. Depends on your needs.

[@BuildBreakFix]

Hum..... on the motorized mini bike build i did a while back. We hd a 10t to 60t clutch chain loop to the motor. Then we added a tc same 10 to 60t sprockets. Had nice even takeoff and 15mph higher top speed. Cause it starts out low and ends up spinning the 10t 2.4 times every 1rpm of the centrifugal clutch

[@BuildBreakFix]

To be clear this bike had 10x10mm chain on it! Why the tooth count seems odd ball!

[@DattITrappan8400]

Lol dafoq «Remember (KIDZ) dont text and drive» 🤣

[@KMA674]

drop a couple of teeth on the gear on the axle.

[@nathancampbell850]

You meant smaller driven sprocket right?

[@zed4me]

Yes which becomes the drive sprocket for the next driven sprocket haha but yeah you're right

[@nathancampbell850]

zed4me Ohhh yeah the one off the torque converter is the one you meant.

[@spikemandan]

dont you mean a smaller sprocket? for top speed? you said larger

[@zed4me]

spikeman dan larger front

[@spikemandan]

huh?

[@spudstergus4295]

spikeman dan there are two sprockets one in the front and on in the back. If you want a higher gear ratio you put either a bigger sprocket in the front or and smaller sprocket in the back and if you want a lower gear ratio you get a smaller front sprocket or bigger back speocmet

[@prockon741]

Did you convert to electric yet?

[@zed4me]

Yes

[@prockon741]

@@zed4me I couldn't find the video

[@zed4me]

@@prockon741 it's on the channel there's also a playlist with all the videos on this go kart

[@tanklife9153]

add a honda clone header and upgraded air filter

[@danielvega3062]

You should use a 250cc CDI engine, it’s just 500$

[@jonwhitney2329]

this jay Whitney can we try and keep this going where else do we have to go I have got to stop making this happen be for

[@fookutube501]

Its more like new t/c vs old not so good c/c.

[@minorpyro69]

Good luck getting past 44mph with modifications using the torque converter. i took mine off and put on a clutch and got 58mph.

[@minorpyro69]

and that was with 4.8:1 , 4:1 AND 3:1 gear ratios.

[@zed4me]

Clutch is best for top speed but no way a predator 212 can get you to 58 mph without some heavy modifications

[@theburnhams2925]

Install a 15 tooth sprocket on the jackshaft to compare.

[@mikebolton2388]

I found this old 1968 clinton engine with a built in 6:1 speed reducer in our barn. 1 cylinder and with the speed reducer outputs break 104 ft pounds of torque. It also weighs 116 pounds tho. Lol

[@mikebolton2388]

I think ill use that since its free. Yah 409 cc baby!!!!

[@jacobsebastien3910]

Put a Tillotson Hemi 212 out the box it's 10hp

[@darmainrcoker3586]

my gokart go 57 miles an hour an i have a belt drive its your gear set up everybody no a belt drive should have 9 tooth

[@mjk4378]

My homie put one on his kart and he is hitting 65mph. So your top end theory is a bit off. It most definitely increases torque and top end.

[@Burdette305]

go karts and Nexus? I knew I liked you lol. How many watts is the electric motor gonna be?

[@zed4me]

Goal is north of 5000w, possibly touching 10kw

[@Burdette305]

+zed4me OH DAM! So nothing like the 1000w they put on Razor karts lol.

[@zed4me]

Jonathan Burdette LOL no way. gonna be much crazier.

[@Burdette305]

Is that 5K similar to the 6.5HP Predator?

[@zed4me]

Jonathan Burdette It'll be much crazier because instant torque

[@proudpatriot9062]

I use to run a kid's fun park (FUNWAY USA ) in Foxboro and E Bridgewater as well as F1 Boston... for shits n giggles I took off a 6hp off of one of the kiddie carts and installed a 13hp. ... out of the 6hp too speed was close to 28mph... once I got done upgrading the SHIT out of a kiddie cart .out of a 13hp and some gear munipulation and a more breathable muffler I could get that cart up to 60 mph out on a straightaway. ..trying to corner couldn't be done without rear kickout. ... but was extremely fun.....! Good times. ...!

[@loggyvr8199]

Having bigger tires might help just saying

[@loggyvr8199]

@Nathan Reich ah yes ive never had small wheels, I offroad mine idk that much about street karts thanks

[@gagebishop1335]

I have a homemade kart with heavy ass racing seat and predator 212 governor removed muffler removed 12 t clutch and I can get 50 mph it scoots

[@krazykarl0]

You really need to get a mount for your phone so you can drive with both hands. Just my 2 cents

[@zed4me]

krazykarl0 watch later videos

[@gagebishop1335]

On lawnmower tires

[@vtecbanger3180]

do you know top speed governed?

[@zed4me]

I removed governor right from the start. With the torque convertor though, I believe the stop speed is the same.

[@vtecbanger3180]

+zed4me thank you. I think the same. I have a 16hp build same engine basically and I only hit 37mph with cvt

[@zed4me]

Vtec Banger You need a larger sprocket on the CVT to make more use of it

[@michaelangelod5008]

Vtec Banger a stock little 212cc predator toped out at 40mph on a go cart I had

[@vtecbanger3180]

Michael Supercharger thanks. I did some testing and found cvt will not hit the governor on a stock 212 so I put my built motor on a shifter kart frame with a clutch. I wasted too much time and money trying

[@theq4602]

My cousin built a POS go kart that faster than that crap. only a little 5 horse but it FLEW but being the isiot he was he didn't put enough oil in it and it siezed.

[@austinarab2673]

What was your top speed?

[@dtiydr]

Look at the video.

[@1061shrink1061]

I'm sure your quiet neighbourhood just LOVES you lol. In this country you'd get lynched for driving something like that up and down a residential street.

[@zed4me]

Sounds like a terrible place to live

[@1061shrink1061]

zed4me in fairness dude, I LOVE cars and motorsport, but if I had to sit in my street and listen to someone driving up and down in a go-kart, I'd probably flip my lid! They aren't road legal vehicles and as such shouldn't be used on one.

[@zed4me]

1061shrink1061 ah I see so youre the lyncher lol

[@1061shrink1061]

absolutely ;)

[@MrTheHillfolk]

+1061shrink1061 If it went on all day yea, not cool. But a blast or 2 to test something out is sorta ok. The 1 or 2 blasts will alert people, keep it up, and they call the cops. Of course real dickhead neighbors call right away. It's all chancey

[@T25de]

talking hand

[@leothekidwiththedognamedsu6704]

steering wheel is upside down sir

[@vtecbanger3180]

is the engine still governed

[@zed4me]

Nope

[@CarSpeed-tr3ry]

how can you afford cars, go kart and college? Im really impressed :o

[@zed4me]

Save up. I worked before medical school

[@CarSpeed-tr3ry]

+zed4me you must have saved ALOT :o how old are you?

[@zed4me]

CarSpeed 2015 I worked smart and hard during one year off between undergrad and medical school. I'm 25 now

[@CarSpeed-tr3ry]

+zed4me oh, so you took a year off from school to work? awesome! what did you do?

[@zed4me]

CarSpeed 2015 a bulk of the money came from tutoring but I also worked as a medical asssitsnt

[@fastbikes8075]

I hate electric gotta be charging and takes to long .. I prefer gas just add gas and go

[@roygumpel8415]

Man it's disturbing to Try to watch that time lapse footage!

[@znake114]

You mean drive sprocket.

[@frontleverguy2216]

5:37

[@rosskelly4200]

Do stop signs mean the same in your country? 5:35 In Australia you need to stop and then go, whether there is other traffic or not.

[@famuse257]

this does not have three peddles??????

[@nickbelanger5225]

Totally automatic. No clutch pedal needed

[@alangodin2090]

Even shifter karts only have 2 pedals, they have a hand clutch.

[@Zachattackisrad]

a centrifugal clutch works by centrifugal force, search up how it works

[@vinceking7878]

Do Not do this in the UK!!!

[@heavystarch100]

Im out for the electric crap. But good video. Thanks for the info. But I've done the overpriced electric crap. Its bad in terms of distance and being out in the middle of nowhere.