Chappell Roan, CompHet, And LGBT Gatekeeping

[@ohthewhomanity]

I’ve never understood why some people think that more people relating to an experience “takes away” from their personal experience. We’re all much more similar than we are unique and this is a good thing. It’s a good thing that we can connect to each other and relate to each other and find community together.

[@Mel-wn9gb]

You can relate to an experience or analysis, but if it's not directly related to you you should respect that. As a white person I'm not going to go to a BLM meeting and make it all about me. Remember intersectionality?

[@ohthewhomanity]

@@Mel-wn9gb What you’re saying applies to the situation you’ve described, but not to this situation. It is true that a white person does not experience police brutality because of their race. But all queer people experience comphet. Acknowledging this fact isn’t making it “all about me.” If anything, the people who say that I as an ace person don’t experience comphet are trying to make it all about THEM. A more equivalent situation would be, say, a different person of color relating to the experience of being profiled and abused by police. It’s different for each person of color, yes. But it would be strange for someone to say that it “takes away” from Black people to point out that other people of color also experience this systemic issue and have a stake in the effort to end police brutality.

[@Mel-wn9gb]

@@ohthewhomanity It does apply to this situation. Compulsory heterosexuality as theorized by Adrienne Rich is about how patriarchy effects girls, women and especially lesbians *specifically* . She explicitly explains why it doesn't apply to all gay or queer people in her essays. I encourage you to read them, because you are taking away from the meaning and intention of the term, and how it might help girls, women and lesbian women.

[@ohthewhomanity]

@@Mel-wn9gb And I suggest you watch the video we’re commenting on :)

[@Mel-wn9gb]

@@ohthewhomanity The video directly refers to Adrienne Rich's essay, so I suggest you read the essay and then watch the video again.

[@ScarySadFlan]

You can relate to any art form in any way you want, whether or not it was the artist’s original intention. Anyone who says you are “not allowed” can go pound sand. 💜

[@elijabutterfly6154]

This

[@D1VINEDIAMONDS]

THISSSS

[@stonks3507]

This so true!!!!

[@Mel-wn9gb]

The theory of compulsory sexuality is not an art form. It's a political analysis of the oppression of girls and women by boys and men.

[@Thunderthighhighs]

As a trans man: men are affected by patriarchy too, often in similar or complimentary ways that women are. I've run into plenty of dudes that, on a personal level, are almost entirely victims of partriachy, and others that are almost entirely enforcers of it. Most people are both to varying extents. This hypersimplistic binary understanding of gender issues is asinine and we as queer people should know better than anyone that this stuff is way too complicated for that.

[@SylvesterLazarus]

I have a friend who once said a really funny thing that always makes me smile when I randomly remember it. We were talking about how people will always say that things are a phase for young people that they will grow out of, including fashion choices and things like that, but also gender identities and queerness. Then my friend just said, "Well you know what was definitely just a phase for me? Heterosexuality."

[@Tries_To_Draw]

Precisely, 10/10 comments

[@falcon_arkaig]

Imo Comhet applies to basically all Queer people, not just Lesbians. I think Bisexual people have a unique experience with it. Because of their sexuality people still expect them to date and marry someone of the opposite gender, and people dismiss their bisexuality and just think "oh you can still marry a man/women (based on your gender) and have a heterosexual marriage bc ur attracted to both men and women." With Asexuals (using this as an umbrella term), you are still expected to date someone of the opposite gender. We still live in a heteronormative society where it's seen as "weird" not to be heterosexual. As an Asexual I remember having to lie about having a crush on a boy (I'm Afab) bc someone asked. I felt deep down (even though I was like 7 years old) that if I said I didn't have a crush people would look at me weirdly. I was still expected to be heterosexual and get a boyfriend or whatever. Comhet doesn't just apply to Lesbians and I think it's stupid to say that considering to inclusiveness of the word. P.S: Though since I'm also a Trans Man some people have called me "just a lesbian". I'm wondering, I'm pretty sure if I was a lesbian people would be telling me it's "just a phase" and "you should get a boyfriend." Lol.

[@Mel-wn9gb]

Compulsory heterosexuality is a critique of patriarchal power, control and dominance over girls and women. The author explicitly states that the theory doesn't apply to all gay or queer people and elaborates in great detail on the reasons why. It applies to all females, especially lesbians who are most virulently attacked and erased by that system because of the threat that they pose to it. I'm aware that the essay is controversial with many lesbian and heterosexual women and is accused of being unrealistic and homophobic, but the theory itself is specifically about heterosexuality as an institution of patriarchy designed to dominate and control girls and women socially, economically and politically. It has some good insights around that that do apply to your comments as a female.

[@falcon_arkaig]

@@Mel-wn9gb Comphet is more dominant with girls and women, but imo it can also effect boys and men as well just in different ways. Boys and Men can and are effected as well by Patriarchy, like how men are seen as if they always think about s*x and they're always sexual when that's not the case.

[@Mel-wn9gb]

@@falcon_arkaig Yes, patriarchy effects men and boys. The point is that the theory of compulsory heterosexuality is not about how patriarchy effects men and boys. It's specifically about heterosexuality as a means of the control and domination by men over girls and women, particularly lesbian women. This is elaborated on in detail in both of Rich's essays on the concept.

[@Mel-wn9gb]

@CollinGerberding Men experience heteronormativity and homophobia. A fundamental point of the theory of compulsory sexuality is that men don't experience the exact same thing that girls, women and lesbian women do.

[@Mel-wn9gb]

​​​@CollinGerberdingQueer and gay men experience homophobia and heteronormativity. While the theory of compulsory heterosexuality encompasses homophobia and heteronormativity, it's not simply about that. It's about patriarchal power, dominance and control over girls and women, especially lesbian women, the specific ways that plays out for us in terms of our female bodies, our health and safety, physical and sexual violence, reproductive freedom, socially, economically and politically - and provides a framework for girls and women to fight the oppression of girls and women by men. The author explicitly explains why it's not about queer and gay men.

[@spaghettification427]

"Stop stealing comp-het from the real queers" lol. Do you mean to say you are erasing Lynn's experience as a queer person, or in other words, compulsively labeling them as heterosexual? It's a misunderstanding of what comp-het is at a fundamental level.

[@Mel-wn9gb]

That's ironic, given that compulsory heterosexuality doesn't mean "compulsively labelling people as heterosexual".

[@Mel-wn9gb]

@CollinGerberding I bieve women's rights are human rights, and 'gender', 'cis' and 'trans' is a conept that violates them.

[@ashleylongley1628]

@@Mel-wn9gbcould you expand on that more? That’s a view that I don’t know if I’ve heard anything worded like that before

[@Mel-wn9gb]

@@ashleylongley1628 Which comment do you want me to expand on?

[@ashleylongley1628]

@@Mel-wn9gb the second one that mentions women’s rights please

[@kerricantelupe8337]

I’m bi, married to a man that I adore, and I definitely still relate to comp-het. Like, I hate that I look like every other straight woman married to a guy, and do my best to look queer in other ways to make up for it. But yea. It’s real.

[@lynnsaga1397]

You are valid no matter what! I wish people understood that bi people with the opposite gender are still bi

[@kerricantelupe8337]

@@lynnsaga1397 Thank you :)

[@himalayansalt32]

how tf you make up for being queer in a het relationship, what?

[@sophie_drachen]

​@@lynnsaga1397 Basically my situation. On the outside, it looks like I'm a hetero woman with a boyfriend, but I am bi, I know in my heart that I do feel more attracted to women. I suppose I experience that comp-het feeling.

[@anastasis-cm5hw]

Comp het is part of the bi experience for both sexes! Not sure who tried to convince you otherwise.

[@emillegal-search-and-seizure]

First of all, the idea that someone isnt allowed to relate to a song is ridiculous on it's face. Like oh, sorry I relate to it, ig I'll stop relating to it then??? Death of the Author doesn't just apply to books, you know. Second, as an aro ace person, I felt comphet soooo hard you have no idea. When I first heard the term I felt an immense wave of relief, because YES, that's what I'd been feeling, most of my doubts about my sexuality were eased because I finally had a word for it

[@elijabutterfly6154]

I am in the aro/ace spectrum and non-binary and I woke up next to him in the middle of the night. I was married for 10 years. I could have had deep meaningful connections maybe even relationships with people of my agab but i was so blind and finaly lost connection to them. It makes me so sad and I can only imagine how they feel about it. I am happy i found myself and started a new life but omfg it is not easy... CompHet is part of the queer experience. It is not exclusively for lesbians.

[@lynnsaga1397]

I'm so sorry that you experienced that but I'm glad you were able to find yourself

[@elijabutterfly6154]

@@lynnsaga1397 thank you. I am glad you did not need to go through that to find yourself. So please don't be sad for me. Enjoy your life as much as possible. You are a wonderful strong precious human.

[@Mel-wn9gb]

The theory relates exclusively to girls and women, and especially lesbians. Your comment very much reflects the concept, if you're female. It's not about any and all gays or queers. It's about heterosexuality as a patriarchal institution and tool of the oppresssion of girls and women.

[@MagickMix]

Pay no mind to this Mel person, they’ve commented up and down this thread as a “cis straight ally” being gracious enough to educate us poor queers on our own identities and informing us how to feel and act. She’s a cis straight Karen kicking up nonsense in a community she is not part of.

[@lacybookworm5039]

Comphet affects everyone who is not straight.

[@RHCole]

It affects straight people, too.

[@ScarySadFlan]

@@RHColeTo a lesser extent, but yes. Many straight people (especially straight women) are demonized if they are not in a relationship, or if they are not married by a “certain age.”

[@SilverCraftLPx]

tbh i think it affects straight people too, just differently in the sense that what's being forced on them isn't heterosexuality itself, but the performative aspects of it. straight people are considered (by large parts of society) to be failures of some sort if they're not dating, married, having/raising kids. i would argue that's "compulsive heterosexuality" too, although not in the same way

[@Boundwithflame23]

⁠@@SilverCraftLPx example to add to your point: child-free couples being constantly hounded about grandchildren

[@simoneurwin9108]

@@SilverCraftLPx I agree with what you are saying but don't you think that the strain felt by that is more so for women, and the force being pushed on them is heterosexuality for/towards men because of the patriarchy defining women as their relationship to men. I just think that is not comphet, comphet is more that strain you describe in relation to female queerness and the fact that queer women are being forced (by systems around them) to unconsiously reject their queerness for their female identity in relation to men. I think what you are talking about is just pressures from misogyny.

[@myrkvith9]

As a bisexual woman - any time I’m with a male partner in any social situation people just assume that you’re straight - you simply can’t shake it in other people. People think if I’m with a gay male friend that we’re both straight. CompHet is the context of the world we navigate every day.

[@LiamODonovan-l6e]

You can relate to any song just because you are on the asexual aectrum, which doesn't mean you can't relate to a certain song.hetrosexuality is almost expected. You are an awesome person. I really hate this hetro normative world

[@petracora]

“You relating to this song is stealing from the lesbian experience” feels way to close to “you using this bathroom is stealing from cis women’s rights” and it makes me uncomfortable. Also like I get being mad if someone says it’s ONLY an asexual song (I personally was on the side of people who disliked the initial notion about the song being a “bi girl anthem”), but that’s literally what these people are doing here. It’s not cool.

[@lilykatmoon4508]

I’m in my early fifties, and have only recently heard of chappel roan because I’ve been watching a lot of queer content lately. I’ve only just come out to myself and everyone in the last four years. I’m still figuring it out, but for now I’m demi-sexual, demi-romantic, AFAB, trans nonbinary individual, lesbian if that term applies, lol. I usually listen to classic and alternative rock, but actually have very eclectic tastes and love music from all genres. This video as absolutely convinced me that I need to become as familiar as I can with this young woman’s work. I’m absolutely going to Apple Music and purchasing what I can. I’ll definitely go watch your other video on her. Thanks for all you do. Sharing your perspective has really helped me learn about ways to look at different queer identities I’ve never really had words for most of my life. ❤

[@lucanusafrost]

I’m the same as you! I’m just a young adult who’s pansexual but I have all the other same labels as you! Welcome to our community! (Also it’s nice to see some older non binary representation :D)

[@shadowman21282]

As a queer man in his early 40s who has also only just discovered Chapple Roan's music, I just want to say I hope it brings you all the queer joy that it bring me. I'll never be able to personally relate to Chapple's life experience but her music hits me in hard in my own way. Growing up in times and places where you were expected to hide if not outright ignore your queerness and seeing this young person sing so openly about love and pain and her queer experience just brings me joy.

[@teaisbetter2508]

Titles and thumbnails like these make me really happy im not on the same side of the internet as most people

[@bobsherwood3542]

No reason why you should not be able to like Chappell Roan. You're entitled to like whoever you wish without criticism. I like your honesty and willingness to be open to other views and I love how you explain things in quite a relatable way.

[@radicalpasta7040]

Death of the author! Its totally fine for people interpret songs in ways that relate to them. I listen to more than a few hetero- love songs that I like to head canon as being LGBTQ+. I know that the creators of these songs didn't necessarily intend non-straight interpretations of those songs but it harms no one to think of them in that way in your own head. Another Chapell Roan song that I am vaguely aware has online discourse around it is the song After Midnight. Ive heard that many bisexual people online have been relating to that song. I think some people are mad about that because Chappell is a lesbian. Im a bisexual myself so maybe Im biased in this discussion but I don't see a problem with bi people relating to a song made by a lesbian. I relate to songs made by both gay and straight people all the time.If anyone is trying to use the lyrics of a song to discredit Chapell's identity or something, I don't stand by that. Gatekeeping identities is generally not a good thing to do. However, I don't see an issue with bi people liking a song and relating it to their experiences.

[@HotDogTimeMachine385]

I wish people would just stop being mean and cruel

[@lynnsaga1397]

SAME!

[@WinxMagicalHero]

This is silly cause didn’t Chappell identify as bisexual when she wrote that song? There are two points of view. And even if the person she speaks of is most likely a lesbian, bisexual woman can also get their hearts broken by a partner who can’t afford to live their truth. That’s probably what happened to Chappell when she was still attracted to men herself. Besides, let not pretend bisexual women aren’t expected to end up with men despite being attracted to multiple genders. Which means that the person she is singing about could also be bisexual

[@BiggyBoops96]

The fact that straight people can relate to music with overt queer themes should be a good thing. Chappell Roan’s Feminiomenon is a song that is written for all women. It is for straight Women in sexually unsatisfactory relationships with men but it is also for queer women that are discovering that men just can’t satisfy them the same way women can. Good Luck Babe is a very queer song, but so many straight women can relate to being the side chick or settling for someone that doesn’t treat you right. Songs may have queer themes but queer people have the same relationship issues straight people do.

[@guineapig5858]

As someone else who is demi (had no idea Chapell Roan was too) of course i relate to compHet. I tried to force myself to feel attraction sooner and was just confused by myself as i didnt even know what demi was. I tried to pretend i had a favourite physique and mostly tried to have attraction for men but i got nowhere. I did get crushes on fictional characters though, but shamed about how all these crushes had different physiques and different personalities but especially if said character was deemed "ugly" im so sorry if im attracted to a character who was severly physically damaged by war. But honestly you shouldn't be so angry about it.

[@Caterfree10]

Kind of wish the coiner of “comp het” being a TERF was acknowledged tbh. It bothers me whenever people use this term while glossing over that part of its origins. It was coined to exclude other types of LGBTQ people. Heteronormativity, frankly speaking, matches the definition of “comp het” used. And actually is inclusive from the jump. The policing of who can relate to any given qu33r song is dumb as hell, but I also wish that the term itself was actually dug into more. Please please I am begging.

[@Mel-wn9gb]

It was coined to describe and articulate the way that heterosexuality as a patriarchal institution effects *girls and women specifically* , especially lesbian women. So no, it doesn't exclude members of the lgbqti community. It excludes those members of the lgbqti community who it's not about, just like BLM is not about white people, or the lgbqtqi community is not about straight people. I'm not sure what your issue with that is. Not everything is about you. Please dig deeper into the theory so that you can understand it better. I don't know how anyone could read that essay and the horrifying ways that girls and women are oppressed under patriarchy and say "but what about the men"?.

[@pan6529]

honestly every queer person experiences comphet in some way

[@lynnsaga1397]

I wish more people understood that and didn't think we were trying to take anything away from the lesbian community :(

[@Thunderthighhighs]

Kinda by definition actually. The whole point of being queer is that you're deviating from your society's dominant narratives about gender and sexuality.

[@Spinelsofficalwife]

As a lesbian I actually do understand why other lesbians want to “gatekeep” things for just them from such little representation we get, it could feel frustrating when we are either pushed aside for everyone else- BUT I think the case with this is that the majority of chappel fans are not trying to take away the meaning of the songs, people are allowed to relate to music in many different ways and I think that what matters is that people who are all different are acknowledging art from a lesbian and loving it. The ONLY thing that i will say is that when you’re covering songs like sabrina carpenter- I don’t hate her but I don’t think she captured the emotion of good luck babe like someone who’d gone through the experience like chappel did, but other than that people should be allowed to enjoy the music they want as long as they don’t harass others for their music taste 💟

[@tinabennett501]

Claiming that bigoted societal pressures only belong to one group sounds really unhealthy. Being the only one bullied doesn't make you special, just weak. We're only going to overcome if we do it together.

[@Mel-wn9gb]

Bigotry effects people in different ways. The theory of compulsory heterosexuality is specifically about how patriarchy oppresses girls and women, and especially lesbians. The very reason the author theorized it was because of the erasure, attacks and male violence against lesbians. Why would you make something about you that's not about you? Adrienne Rich goes into detail about why the theory doesn't relate to all gay and queer people, but females specifically. It's a feminist analysis after all.

[@MagickMix]

Pay no mind to this Mel person, they’ve commented up and down this thread as a “cis straight ally” being gracious enough to educate us poor queers on our own identities and informing us how to feel and act. She’s a cis straight Karen kicking up nonsense in a community she is not part of.

[@Mel-wn9gb]

@CollinGerberding No, because they're men who sex stereotype, objectify, fetishize and dehumanize girls and women for their own benefit, and hence are a part of the very problem.

[@briennethemaid]

​@@Mel-wn9gband like every other sociological concept, comphet evolved to include queer identities other than those of lesbian women. So why gatekeep something that has been proven to be a more or less universal queer experience?

[@Mel-wn9gb]

@@briennethemaid No it didn't. You appropriated it like a white person appropriating BLM. You obviously never read the theory, or you would understand why it doesn't apply to queer or gay men.

[@GreyGlamer]

Gatekeeping by members of the queer community is still gatekeeping. People should be able to like what they like, to enjoy what they enjoy, to find meaning where they find meaning, and if a particular song speaks to your feelings and experiences then I think that's absolutely valid.

[@MidsummerNightmare28]

As someone who is AroAce, I can relate to the song Good Luck, Babe! by Chappell Roan even though not in a way a Lesbian might relate to it. I have experienced comphet before by some peers and family. Me being AroAce personally, I dont want sex or even have a romantic relationship with anyone. Though some people ask me when will I get married and start a family or when will I ever have my first time doing it. It was then I realized that with my past relationships, I never was fully into it, both romantically and sexually. The thought of being in one just made me uncomfortable just like sex. I realized the reason why I even got into these relationships, was cause of the peer pressure by some close people around me. I did it for them, to make them happy when I should have put me first, my happiness first. So hearing that line, "When you wake up next to him in the middle of the night With your head in your hands, you're nothing more than his wife," it makes me feel sad cause I just imagined me being married to someone and feel nothing but sadness all cause I wanted to please my family by getting a relationship. As of now, I'm happy living my truest self.

[@sawyerk641]

Okay so, comphet is a real academic term and that's wonderful and great but lets be real, most people who talk about it on the internet have never read Rich or Lorde--what they have read is the lesbian masterdoc. And the lesbian masterdoc is a clusterfuck of "all drains lead to lesbian," which...no??? Maybe you're ace. Maybe you're bisexual. Maybe you're demi. Maybe you're gender queer. Etc etc. Like the doc covers everything from "if you enjoy male relationships in fiction more than in real life, you might be a lesbian" to "if you're repulsed by d***, then you might be a lesbian." Don't get me wrong it is a WONDERFUL tool and has been for many people...but I think it's so weird in the lesbian community how they'll look at women actively trying to figure out their sexuality and just prescribe them a label. Like, y'all if we actually want to have queer solidarity that means being happy that people have found any answer for themselves and embracing them in family regardless. Labels are not hogwarts houses, you get nothing for telling people they're comphet lesbians. Which, to be clear, I love lesbians--as a bisexual person I have a foot in there community and a foot outside it, or a foot in neither, depending on your view point. I have been told I'm comphet; I have been told I'm demi; I have been told I'm a d*ke. So yeah, just speaking for myself, I don't think comphet should "belong" to lesbian communities anymore than intersectionality "belongs" exclusively to black women. It's always good to acknowledge where stuff came from, and to make sure it's never so far removed from it's original context that it becomes unrecognizable, but we build tools because they help us. Hopefully other people can get some help from them too, and frankly, I think different perspectives adding to the theory of comphet are only going to make it stronger.

[@commodorjack8633]

I believe that we can understand a difference between comphet and Comphet.

[@ainsel98]

I'd say even as a cis gay man, I've had a lot of pressure to continue the bloodline, which was causing a lot of pain in my teens

[@timnewman1172]

I'm a cis/ace man. I grew up under the shadow of a grandfather/patriarch that died the day after I was born, being the only male grandchild to carry on the family name... In that culture living up to those expectations was nearly impossible.

[@roxytocin_216]

I've def experienced this when I came out as a trans woman and I had multiple people's first response be, "So you like men now??" At the time, I thought I was a lesbian, but have since came out as pansexual, but I def still have a preference for femme folks tho:)

[@MiddleAgedMartianDog]

Ugh, I got this when I came out to my wife (admittedly the whole thing was understandably very hard for her), and I was like what in all our years together would make you think I don’t like women, and you in particular, A LOT? She also had real difficulty in accepting she was demisexual before that (she was happy when I told her I was demi because that made it easier to believe I would be faithful after years of insecurity). I guess a demi-demi relationship is a rare queer relationship where you can both not ever realise you aren’t cishetallo.

[@roxytocin_216]

@@MiddleAgedMartianDog I can understand why that would be difficult for her at first, but I hope you were able to work things out and have a happy relationship now

[@evan_escence95]

I listened to it yesterday and not only as an aroace-spec gay man, but as a trans man, it really hit me. I have this exact experience of thinking I was a cishet girl who had to be feminine and date boys and wear makeup, in retrospect as a form of denial. I even thought I would get married to who turned out to be my abusive ex boyfriend. Honestly made me cry. I don't understand why you have to be a specific sexuality or gender to relate to it. How am I with this identity able to relate to it if that was the case then?

[@timnewman1172]

I was today years old when I learned what comphet means... as an older cis/ace guy this definitely applies to me also. Raised in a Coservative Christian culture I was expected to live under traditional roles, to be the provider/husband/father and be a slave to the grind... However, I never fit into that mold. I had a high libido, but my anxiety kept me from even dating for fear of having to perform sexually when I didn't want or feel it... the very thought of even touching another person(and especially being touched!) was sheer panic inducing. This is the main reason why I spent my teens & 20's either stoned or drunk!

[@havocsTeacher]

Lol you can definitely experience comphet when you're not a lesbian. I'm a gay trans man and I thought I was bisexual for a long time because I thought I had to like girls. Turns out I don't! But comphet made me feel guilt for it anyway.

[@LeoOliver-s5m]

I'm a bi trans man and I don't think I experienced much comp het, but I definitely experienced comp cis lol.

[@pjgoldstein6562]

Que?! The song makes sense to anyone who isn't cis and straight and allo. Is it the same as experience as a lesbian might have? No. But i think you could point out that butch and femme have different experiences. Two femmes have different experiences. That said one of the few things that all queer people have in common is that they aren't cishet allos.

[@AdamMerdy123]

Hey Lynn! I discovered your channel recently while working through whether or not I'm aromantic (spoiler alert: I am! Greyro specifically haha). You're awesome! And I wanted to take a minute to respond because while I haven't heard "Good Luck Babe" just yet, I do relate heavily to everything you said. I grew up Catholic, and in a pretty traditional Italian family too. And much like your own experiences in the church, CompHet was VERY real in my upbringing too. I remember our parish priest making the joke that "God created Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve," which my family found very funny. Also, while they were accepting of others being gay (in that "love the sinner, hate the sin" sort of half assed way), with us it was always assumed and preferred that we were straight. Nothing was ever overtly said, but it didn't need to be. It was enough that, when I started developing my sexuality as a teenager, I didn't push much further once I realized I liked girls. In fact, I had panicked nightmares about being gay some nights in high school, and they would ruin my entire next day. In addition, when I DID find myself in relationships, I often experienced extreme panic and anxiety at the thought of committing to and being exclusive to and riding the relationship escalator with someone - no matter how much I found them attractive. I often beat myself up over all of this, feeling like I'd have to just 'get over' my feelings of anxiety and dread around romantic relationships to have the life I thought I wanted. I felt broken, and it was only at age 30 that I started to work all of this out. I've come to realize I'm bi, polyamorous, and greyro, and honestly I'm much happier now that I know. But it was totally CompHet that was responsible for all of this taking me until my 30s and a global pandemic to figure out!

[@beanieboo-M.K.Y]

As an Pansexual non binary person, who has good luck babe as on of their favorite songs... This discourse is incredibly stupid. Anyone is allowed to relate to things despite most the original details (such as gender, sexuality, ect.).

[@skrunklington]

FR like i relate to girl in red songs despite not being lesbian, maybe not in the way lesbians relate to them but through my own lens. like the lyric in "homecoming" that goes "i hate this dress, i feel like a man when i should be feeling so feminine" hits especially hard when you're transmasc

[@MultiSuperdinosaur]

Chapell is Demi too so ppl’s critiques of you are extra unfounded

[@friedoxygen]

I get it. I'm a Cis/Het male, and find pretty much any art created by fellow cishet men to make me really uncomfortable. But music made from the vantage point of queer women tends to be what I relate to best, but I also worry that I'm taking up space in a place where I shouldn't be...

[@leothepuma4915]

Comphet absolutely applies to most queer people. As a gay enby I always here comments at work like, "Oh, how could anyone not like this woman she's fine." And I'm just like, quietly raising my hand 😅

[@missnaomi613]

8:12 exactly! All queer people are affected by CompHet! Okay, time to look for that song!

[@lynnsaga1397]

I hope you like the song! It's one of my current favorites

[@missnaomi613]

@@lynnsaga1397 I found it. I like it.

[@jessicabenge3797]

It is also imposed on transgender women.

[@night_light838]

As a gay, genderfaun, Ex-Mormon, I relate to this video so much.

[@Ian_Jules]

Glad this vid went to the source by citing Adrienne Rich. It seems to me that anyone not fitting a cishet role could easily be affected by comp het. Just like the “male gaze” in movies (coined by Laura Mulvey) doesn’t exclusively affect straight women.

[@Mel-wn9gb]

The very idea of 'cishet' is critiqued by this essay. Not in modern terms, but the entire point is that women are not 'cis' - ie., conforming to sex roles and stereotypes - and that heterosexuality is a patriarchal institution that forces women into that box. The author explicitly says that the theory doesn't apply to gay or queer men, precisely because they aren't subjected to patriarchal power and dominance in the same way that women - and especially lesbians - are. It's not 'gatekeeping'. It's just a specific analysis of women's oppression.

[@Ian_Jules]

@@Mel-wn9gb I’m not saying non-binary individuals or queer men experience comp het in the exact *same ways* as women, or that anyone shares identical experiences. I don’t want to de-center the feminist roots of these ideas. However, if an idea resonates with someone outside its intended audience, it resonates. No one, including the author, can undo that response. I’d argue making connections across boundaries of gender, sexuality, or race is healthy. Theories don’t exist in a vacuum; they can be built on, as long as you’re willing to engage with the source. EDIT/ cisgender doesn’t necessarily mean in keeping with stereotypical gender roles. If anything, terms like cishet are meant to help communicate that these expectations are constructed, not immutable realities.

[@Mel-wn9gb]

@@Ian_Jules That's like saying BLM can be for white people too, so it'sok for white people to apply it to their experiences. The concept doesn't simply mean you're compelled or forced into a particular sexual orientation by society. That's covered by the terms homophobia or heteronormativity. Compulsory heterosexuality is an analysis of heterosexuality as a patriarchal institution that specifically effects women and girls, particularly lesbians, in specific ways which are elaborated on in Rich's essays. If you read the original and follow up essays the author explicitly explains how conflating this with the experiences of gay or queer men misrepresents her entire point. Sure, the ideas can resonate with other people, but that doesn't mean it applies to them. That means they misunderstood and are appropriating the concept. Also the concepts 'cisgender' and 'transgender' are literal sex stereotyping. They and other 'gendered' terms such as 'cishet' and 'nonbinary' are directly challenged by the arguments in Compulsory Heterosexuality. They go against the entire point of it.

[@Ian_Jules]

@@Mel-wn9gb Equating cis with stereotypes conflates gender identity with the idea of gender roles. A person can be cisgender and non-conforming. Unfortunately, since social media doesn't lend itself to close reading, critical genealogy, etc., there's a tendency for people to be sloppy with terms, which is part of the issue. Concepts like non-binary and cishet are not trying to institute essential categories or types of gender. It's more an effort to map the construct, to find language describing our experiences. This hasn't always been communicated well, but 'queer' is actually trying to offer an alternative to identity politics. Lastly, I won't compare gender and race per se. From a critical POV, though, any useful idea has the capacity to be built on or spun out in new directions. Otherwise it's a dead end--in terms of the critical work it can do.

[@Mel-wn9gb]

@@Ian_Jules 'Cisgender' and 'transgender' are literal sex stereotyping. They're exactly what sex stereotyping *is*. So they uphold, not challenge the system. The fact that nobody fits nearly into sex roles and stereotypes is the entire point. And if you take a theory or an analysis about an oppressed group out of context and water it down to mean something different then that makes it a political dead end for that oppressed group. That's precisely why so many women, feminists and progressives opposed the ideology of 'gender'. And why the author who theorized compulsory heterosexuality was explicit about how it relates to girls and women specifically, not queer or gay men. That's a related, but different fight, precisely because they're men, not women. She goes into detail about it in her essays on the topic. I brought race into it as an analogy. It's like people who say "all lives matter" in response to the BLM movement.

[@asmolgaytree]

News flash people, music is art and art is up for interpretation so Anyone can relate to it in a way that fits em! Let people enjoy things! Don't gatekeep awesome queer music! Also I guess I sorta just assumed naturally that comphet can apply to anyone, but as a lesbian hearing it mostly used for fellow lesbians. I do think of lesbians when I hear about comphet first. I'm glad I'm not stuck in that "it's ONLY a lesbian thing" cause I'm ace too and it for sure influences aces too

[@elvacoburg1279]

Thank you for the explanation of what CompHet is, and based on that explanation, I can definitely say that it is a thing for most people, not just lesbians. When I grew up, in the UK in the 70's and 80's, it was assumed that every child was straight and the gender they were assigned at birth, and that when we grew up we would marry someone of the opposite sex and have children. And we were fed this narrative as we grew up and therefore learnt to accept that that was the way things were, and expect our lives to follow this story. Where there were a few gay personalities, but the media always portrayed them as abnormal and very rare, and nothing was ever said about this being a possibility. Therefore as I was assigned mab, it was assumed that I would marry a woman and have children with her. Being the eldest "son", there was pressure to "continue the family name" and all that. Well, I could never see myself as the man in a relationship, and where I did find some ladies attractive, I had no desire to have a sexual relationship with them, I would much rather sit down somewhere with them and have a talk about a subject that we were both interested in for hours. And for the record, I felt the same about men. Then I really threw the spanner in the works a few years ago when I came out as being transgender, but even though I am now transitioning, I still have not desire to have a sexual relationship with anyone, regardless of their gender.

[@PoliceOfficer-b4d]

I think it's so wild how people gatekeep good luck, babe! especially from bi women, like, yes they are attracted to men too, but they might still experience comphet and be scared to realize their attraction for women is there too, I went through that and I have a friend who did too. I think about my friend when I hear good luck, babe! who vehemently denies liking girls but so so so many things she says are not straight things to say.

[@PrismsinaKaleidoscope]

tbh anyone who grew up or participates in a high demand religion probably can relate to comp-het, at least conceptually, because even hetrosexual people in those environments will feel a lot of pressure with the extremely gendered roles and high expectations on how one is "supposed" to exist.

[@actualgoblin]

I'm not affected by comphet specifically, but I think anyone can empathize with the general theme of like. Having to comply with the social hierarchy n stuff. Like I don't want to adhere to sexist stereotypes personally but I literally have to if I don't want to get hate crimed. So its kinda real

[@mollipopster]

Of course your emotional response isn’t wrong. Is there anything more honest than a straight-up unexpected emotional response? And the fact that you had that response and so many others did, as well, just demonstrates that comphet affects each of you. Maybe we need another (broader?) term for it, I don’t know, but the fact is that society (especially certain subcultures-Mormon, oh my gosh, I want to non-invasively hug you…so harsh) defines you as heterosexual and cisgender. There are idiots censuring cis-het women for not having babies, for cat’s sake, let alone someone who isn’t cis-het and doesn’t fit into their little tiny box. Your feelings are 100% legitimate. If comphet is too specific to heterosexuality, we should create new terms. The experience of being forced to see yourself as something that is completely untrue to your true identity is shared trauma. ❤

[@kerinwills]

Another commenter differentiated between comphet and CompHet, which seems perfectly adequate.

[@Alissi-P]

Afaik this gatekeep-y attitude towards GLB in particular started from people misunderstanding and claiming the song was about dating a bisexual girl (which really entirely misses the point of the song) and then because of this a lot of people OVERcorrect and basically claim only lesbians can relate to the song which is pretty clearly not true considering how many non lesbians CAN relate to it.

[@MinyKatana]

I have been faking beeing a cis-het-male for about 40 years until i started to realy explore what i am. So many times it didn´t feel 100% right, but society was expecting me to be a guy, to date girls, so i did. Ok, i didn´t date the "normal type" of girls, i had more skirts or nail-polish than them. So yes, for me comphet is not exclusive to lesbians, it can effect everyone, even cis-het-people. Because it is always bad if something is forced to someone, even if is the right thing for them.

[@Mel-wn9gb]

Compulsory Heterosexuality relates exclusively to women. If you read the theory you'd understand why, but clearly not many people here have read or comprehended it.

[@Shakes_Bear]

Heck, I've experienced this with a couple different partners who were not as trans affirming as they thought they were and would demand masculine traits, dynamics, and behaviors from me.

[@ogpandamonium]

I don't understand how comphet could only be used by lesbians it's a completely agender term. If it's something experienced by multiple types of people why randomly say only certain people can use a specific word to describe it. Do non-lesbians have to say "mandatory hetrosexuality" instead? Also people saying you're stealing from lesbians by relating to the song is so stupid and exactly what homophobes say about stuff like gay rights. More people having and enjoying stuff is not stealing!!!

[@ibpants]

I found out yesterday that Chappell Roan is not, in fact, a chapel.

[@HelloKittyGal16]

I didn't know what to say with a shattered glass I had lost myself.. in the past Too young to say, too much to say Heart on the line (Didn't mind) Too scared to say, heavy heart.... I-ON.. MY.. OWN much to say, too scared to say Can't feel the trust (Won't be...... on my side) Too much to say, too much to say, too much to say That's.. MY.... Fear!!!! Shattered heart Magic got gone Didnt trust in me Just said NO........ Shattered heart to know on my own Not knowing.... my know,.... my Right Not knowing my all...... Shattered glass I've been unlocking a LOT of stuff recently. My on the fly response to comphet and types of lives that live one way, when that's not them, i was just to little and fragile at 3 to take on MY RESPONSIBILITY in, of for myself. Cause i didn't know, and always being, living unsure, cause that not being an everyone life. At least I never met anyone like that, and so MUCH UNLOCKING.............. Also I watched, I Saw The T.V. Glow So a summer of reflecting.

[@melinnamba]

Honestly, out of all types of queer people, aces are the ones who have the broadest experience with compulsory sexuality. Because even people who accept queer identities will often push sexuality unto us, with stupid misconceptions like "you just need to overcome your internalized homophobia" and the like. And in my opinion, Chappelle lamenting that she can't participate in hook up culture and attributing that to purity culture, sounds a lot like someone grappling with compulsory sexuality. Comp-het is just one subset of that. Lesbians might have been the first to give it a name, but that doesn't mean it's a struggle exclusive to them. I don't get why people feel the need to gatekeep comp-het from aces rather than being willing to realize that the issue is much broader than it originally looked. Kinda reminds me of people assuming STDs are exclusive to gay people. And when it comes to relating to art: I am an artist myself, the thing I love most about putting my art out into the world, is that people will see things in your art, that you didn't see yourself and they will relate to it in very unexpected ways sometimes. It's rare to find a piece of art that has only one possible interpretation. If you relate to something, you relate to something and that's valid. Personally I am always curious about why people see something in my art, that I didn't intend to put there rather than feeling the need to tell them they are wrong. And people, who aren't even the original artist, have absolutely no leg to stand on in that regard.

[@melemon810]

allonormativity refers to the expectation that everyone is allo, or, not on the asexual and aromantic spectrum. so I suppose we have our own word for it but it's not as catchy as comphet.

[@Oliver-fu1go]

I’m not LGBTQIA+ I do really like the song, feel the frustration and heartbreak can be felt by anyone. Resonate with the song in different ways.

[@Luna1998]

Haai, first and foremost i (and i hope many other lesbians, queer people) don't really care if you say you as a-sexual that you have comphet, i don't think it harms anyone so i think i doesn't have to be a big deal. But beside that as a lesbian who had a relationship with a man for 5 years think that your points are so valid. Most of us grow up assuming were hetero cis gendered people so ofcourse every queer person deals with comphet. So i think its okay for you to use the term comphet. Sorry for my english i'm dutch

[@plasmktan]

I do feel though I'm sure comphet does apply to bi men or other male/masc-leaning AMAB genders, I don't think it does to the same extent and a lot of this group are often told that they just like men, in a weird sense of comp-homosexuality. Ofc this goes back to the previous cause of patriarchy and how everyone feels to an extent that they are forced to appeal to and center the desires of men. Also, I feel as a fem-leaning attracted and male-leaning AMAB enby I often feel both too straight and too cis for the LGBT community but at the same time too quuer and too trans for straight or man based groups. It's a unique position, people really don't like when you don't fit into their preconceived boxes sadly and it leaves me feeling like I have no community because whatever group I go into I either feel unsafe or feel like I'm intruding.

[@blondieHPfan10113]

Thank you for talking about this! Im a demi aro/ace person who is also an exmormon (I left at age 13 and also have my own issues with my dad so i get that 🙃) I think people who dont understand mormonism/lds teachings don't get how EXTREMELY CompHet the religion is, and just in general pretty bigoted and harmful religion to be raised in, especially for lgbtqia+ people. I relate to this song a lot with my own experiences, and at the end of the day i am glad i found your channel ❤❤❤

[@FoxGameCZ]

I had always felt the pressure of comphet even before I knew it existed. I felt preassured to be cishet and just be this or that way just because I am supposed to be some way. A lot us us were pressured to be cishet.

[@TakesALiarToKnowALiar]

There are a few songs(mostly trans ones)that I feel people can relate to, but they shouldn’t try and make them about something they are not. Most of this is because the artists say they don’t want this song to be about anything else. But people need to realize that this doesn’t apply to every song and since Chappell Roan hasn’t (to my knowledge) said anything about non-lesbians using the music/this song I don’t think it really matters how people use it

[@SebastianSeanCrow]

0:00 looking at the thumbnail… comphet and compulsory sexuality are not exclusive experiences to any particular part of LGBT+ people. We all suffer to some degree, some more than others.

[@elyzabeth5671]

Asexual lesbian here. I think it's great that the song is so complex and beautiful that it can be seen from dozens of different perspective and context. For me it's about my relationship with my girl friend. We're very close, she's my soulmate, we're talking for hours on the phone almost every day (ldr), tell how much we love each other, want to live together and all of that. I would like it to be a relationship. She feels like connection we have is deeper than that and doesn't think she's lesbian. She's also ace but thinks of giving in and having sex with a boyfriend whom she doesn't love just to "satisfy his needs". When she hangs out with him she literally tells me how she would rather be with me right now. Because there is no expectation of sex and no pressure. I feel like we're long past the point of friendship and having this deep of feelings for each other is queer. It's like this joke about "they were roommates", but I'm living through it . This hurts because essentially we feel the same way, but for some reason this doesn't feel "legit" to her. I'm sure that if I were a man she wouldn't think about it twice. Or if sex was involved. Somehow people don't take relationship seriously if there's no sexual attraction. But if I can't experience it, does it mean that I will never be taken seriously? I feel so bad for her. And for myself. And for everybody who can relate to a song, because I'm sure all of those stories are heartbreaking.

[@tudibelle]

Hard relate to that line. I’m a cis-female biromantic asexual. I grew up under my country’s don’t say gay law. I have no idea what I could have been had that law not been in place.

[@wegotthechoccies]

I used to identify as a lesbian because being trans was going to be a lot harder. I love Chappell's music, and relate to it as someone who still likes women. I'm bi and aroace, and anyone is fucking allowed to relate to music. Music is the most transformative art form there is, and anyone can interpret it however they want.

[@zacharybosley1935]

Does comphet only affect lesbians or something? What am i missing here?

[@Leftistmushroom]

It affects anyone who isn't straight video just happens to be about a woman

[@zacharybosley1935]

@@Leftistmushroom ah, I'm caught up now

[@Sismsodmdmd]

Today I learned about demisexuality, this explains what I’m been ranting to everyone about for years. Thank you so much

[@RxLush]

Say “who can feel” anything it’s INSANE

[@Mel-wn9gb]

Can white people feel racism like black people do? Can able-bodied people feel ableism like people with disabilities do? Can straight people feel homophobia like lesbians, gays and bisexuals do? Obviously not, and yet that's exactly what you're doing to girls and women when you say that compulsory heterosexuality applies to gay and queer men too.

[@MagickMix]

Pay no mind to this Mel person, they’ve commented up and down this thread as a “cis straight ally” being gracious enough to educate us poor queers on our own identities and informing us how to feel and act. She’s a cis straight Karen kicking up nonsense in a community she is not part of.

[@donteatthedaisies]

"You can kiss a hundred boys in bars...good luck babe." What ace girl does not feel that, lol.

[@satocreed]

I relate pretty strongly. Im admittedly an amab nonbinary pansexual demisexual person whos very happily married to a bisexual cis woman. Its definitely different than what a lesbian experiences, that said cultural assumptions about my family from the outside do exert a lot of pressure and that gets really uncomfortable sometimes.

[@Raine.in.love.]

As a lesbian trans girl, how I feel CompHet is basically thinking what's the point of transitioning if im still just gonna be with women

[@GOTHAMDEFENSE]

yeah u can relate to it in a different way but you don't have comphet

[@Nathan-yk2le]

Being ace, I think we can relate even more. The societal pressure to be in a physical relationship, especially a het one, is immense. You want to fit in? Pretend enjoy a partner? Well, good luck with that, babe.

[@Sepi-chu_loves_moths]

I think the idea that comphet applies to completely cis, hetero people too is really interesting. I would phrase it a slightly different way though, becuase its less compulsory heterosexuality itself, but more a specific form of heterosexuality. The idea that youre supposed to marry young (women even younger and specifically before testing anything out) and stay faithful forever whilst fulfilling the family gender roles is, i would say, a type of comphet

[@benoloughlin9215]

Idk that’s just kinda patriarchal standards, not compulsive heterosexuality

[@Sepi-chu_loves_moths]

@benoloughlin9215 at that point it's just semantics I guess, but it certainly comes from a similar place

[@kaseyford1490]

Yep Aspecs can DEFINATELY relate to CompHet. I was pressured by society into having and wishing I had a man. Turns out I got one, lasted 2 weeks to a month, I broke up and I've just been here existing by myself for the last 15 years haha! My Conservative bosses throw it on me too. I got 'If you ever decide to find a man'. 😅 Sometimes I think coming out to them would be easier 😅 My brother in law still thought I was Straight too 😢

[@captainayaaya28]

Chappell Roan’s fan’s honestly seem so mean and cruel. A couple of weeks before Good Luck Babe got released I was absolutely adored by her songs like Red Wine Supernova, After Midnight and Hot To Go, they kind of remind me of Lady Gaga, Goldfrapp, Rina Sawayama and Carly Rae Jepsen’s post emotion work, but after Good Luck Babw her fans became so much more judgy and more of gatekeepers. I don’t want to go into specifics but I can’t really say I had a good experience with her fanbase… (also I remember a couple of her fans sl*tshaming Sabrina Carpenter which was gross)

[@e-heromanny4348]

Incoming, an angry Lesbian who will die on the hill that CompHet then now and forever refers only to them and only them and any nuanced discourse on the topic is the equivalent to erasure 😅

[@bobpeters61]

As a demigendered heterosexual, I was also affected by comphet. I was accused of being gay and bullied just the same because of my natural feminine manner I couldn't completely hide no matter how I tried. Might as well have tried to pass as a local someplace I don't even speak the language. They call me a sinner, but the God I worshipped with them wired my brain part female, so who are they to demand otherwise?

[@Mel-wn9gb]

That's homophobia and heternormativity, not compulsory heterosexuality. Compulsory heterosexuality is a political analysis of how patriarchy effects girls and women specifically, and how girls and women can become conscious of and resist it. It encompasses homophobia and heteronormativity in the theory as they relate to girls and women, but it's an oversimplification and misrepresentation of the theory to imply that it's simply about that, and that it applies to anyone and everyone. It applies *exclusively* to girls and women. Exclusion is not a dirty word. Sometimes things just aren't about us.

[@MagickMix]

Pay no mind to this Mel person, they’ve commented up and down this thread as a “cis straight ally” being gracious enough to educate us poor queers on our own identities and informing us how to feel and act. She’s a cis straight Karen kicking up nonsense in a community she is not part of.

[@MagickMix]

@CollinGerberding if you read through all the harassment this Mel person has left all up and down this comment section you learn she is a straight, cis, white woman who is a TERF. She is nothing but a collection of disrespect and bigotry, not to mention the audacity to come to queer spaces and harass us. I actually don’t know if you can see it now because I’ve reported her for harassment here.

[@RebeccaHuang-ls9gs]

As a questioning bi? Ace? Aro? Enby? Girl? Yes. Just so yes

[@missanthropy6174]

I’ve definitely experienced comp-het as a bi girl, but over the years I’ve come to the conclusion that my attraction to multiple genders is genuine and not a result of comp-het. Like, I’m definitely not a lesbian. While I feel very confident in that, what I’ve struggled with more is bi-phobia and mostly from within the community. So many times I’ve been on a date or in a conversation with another queer woman and as soon as I say I’m bi, they roll their eyes, lose interest, dismiss me as either actually straight “going through a phase” or actually lesbian trying to stay closeted. I’ve also literally been told “good luck babe” by a lesbian after I started dating a guy. Now don’t get me wrong, my identity isn’t always acceptable with men either, but it’s different than how gay women treat it and with regards to my feelings about this song, it’s not what’s relevant. It also doesn’t help that I’m poly and very skittish of commitment in general. So when listening to “good luck babe” it immediately makes me think of how I’ve tried to advocate for myself only to be met with a bi-phobic dismissal that gets projected onto me. “Girl I told you I wasn’t interested in commitment or monogamy, don’t act shocked when I kiss a hundred boys in bars. I’m about as likely to commit to one of them as I was to commit to you- which is to say not likely. Stop pushing your narrative on me and stop expecting me to choose one side of a binary.”

[@Mel-wn9gb]

Compulsory heterosexuality is an analysis of the patriarchal institution of heterosexuality and how it effects girls, women and particularly lesbians. It's not about 'excluding' other groups such as gay men from 'comphet'. It's just that it's not about them. It's a feminist analysis of women's position under patriarchy. Not gay or queer men's position under patriarchy. That's a related, but different topic.

[@seto749]

True - and a nice way of acknowledging that nobody outside the G cares about it.

[@Mel-wn9gb]

@CollinGerberding It's not an experience they can have, because they're male.

[@Mel-wn9gb]

FYI, the woman who wrote Compulsory Heterosexuality would be considered a 'terf' if she were alive today.

[@Helbr3cht]

Correct me if I'm wrong (and god I hope I am) but on the outside looking in as a pansexual man, there seems to be a lot of toxicity in the lesbian community. Especially transphobia. Pls don't get mad at me I'm not trying to be rude just curious. EDIT: I want to clarify what I was trying to say but keep the original writing there for context. I was trying to say some very loud discourse in that community revolved around trans lesbians and how lesbians negative experiences are weaponized by terfs to degrade and dehumanize trans women

[@Mel-wn9gb]

By 'transphobia' do you mean it's toxic that lesbians won't date or have sex with men who 'identify' as women - whatever that's supposed to mean? Because that would be sexism, misogyny and homophobia, not transphobia. If only people could stay in their own lanes, respect each other's boundaries and practice what they preach there would be a lot less toxicity overall.

[@Helbr3cht]

@@Mel-wn9gb I was thinking that they act as if trans people are a threat to women's rights and lesbian existence: kind of sounds like something you would say. Why would you watch a channel like this when you very clearly don't believe in the gender identity of trans people. Why can't people stay in their own lanes?

[@Mel-wn9gb]

@@Helbr3cht Correct. This is my lane, firstly because the theory under discussion applies specifically to girls and women and I am one. And second because you're implying that lesbian women in particular are 'toxic' for asserting their boundaries, which is in itself toxic on your part.

[@Helbr3cht]

@@Mel-wn9gb I have no issue with women who do not wish to sleep with trans women, but I believe that it is used by some people (like J.K. Rowling) as an excuse to deny trans people their womanhood and rights. Now, I can understand from your comments that you do not see trans women as women, but men, and there is nothing I can say to convince you of the contrary. I want to make this very clear: what I meant was a vocal minority of lesbians use their sexual preferences and some anecdotal experiences to deny trans women their identities, and in turn add to a pile of hatred leading towards legal restrictions on the existence of an entire group. This is not just lesbians, it is all over the queer community, and especially with straight people, and it upsets me to see it. I want to wish you a good life and hope you do not use your personal beliefs to spread hate that may contribute to violence.

[@Mel-wn9gb]

@@Helbr3cht No. You see girls and women asserting their boundaries and rights and frame that as 'hatred' and 'bigotry' to shame them into prioritizing the feelings, wants and desires of men over their own human rights. This is exactly what the theory of compulsory heterosexuality touches on. It's no coincidence that the author of the theory would be smeared as a 'terf' if she were alive today, just as I've been here. The reality is the rights of girls and women are being violated by these ideas, not the other way around. Sex equality, the right to be free of sexism, sex discrimination, sexual harrassment and violence, the freedom to consent, feeedom of thought, speech and association, the right to privacy, safety, duty of care and dignity. In my country just last week a legal decision supporting a 'transwoman' means girls and women are no longer recognised as female humans, but in terms of the very sex stereotypes and roles that we've been fighting against for hundreds of years, and we no longer have the sex based rights that have been recognised as legitimate and neccesary for decades. Clever trick fellas. The patriarchy is certainly tenacious.

[@bobsherwood3542]

So... basically she is a hypocrite and needs emotional support rather than validation.

[@joshuacoleman8000]

No.

[@bobsherwood3542]

​@@joshuacoleman8000Sure thing