Christian School Textbooks DEBUNKED 🌎

Today we're following the story of a study into the Accelerated Christian Education system, the harm they cause pupils and the claims their textbooks make, including that man-made climate change is a myth and evolution is "impossible".
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Sources:
news.sky.com/story/christian-...
www.christian.education/ace
assets.publishing.service.gov...
evolution-outreach.biomedcent...
Timecodes:
00:00 Start
01:34 IMPORTANT ANNOUNCEMENT
05:57 Teaching Religion and Science together
08:34 Primed for Misinformation
10:26 ACE website
11:07 Former Student Speaks
13:42 Debunking Textbooks
19:22 Isolation from others
21:19 Is this legal?
23:01 A letter to ACE
24:21 "Why are there still monkeys"
29:27 Compassion First
31:02 Who's to blame?
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[@EmmaThorneVideos]

Baphy plushies are LIVE and available until June 30th, order your own purple frendo today! Himbs soft and good and only mildly prone to acts of evil 😈 bit.ly/3OYu1Ae

[@hoodie3810]

Already ordered two! (One as a gift for a friend who also loves your channel). Can't wait, he's adorable 🥰

[@EvanKashvi]

I am also soft and good and mildly prone to evil! Twins! 🥺🥰

[@torquemadatheapostate8768]

Awesome. .. . I like girls too.

[@Pootycat8359]

But you don't have any plush Cthulhus! And what about Shub-Niggurath, the "Goat of a Thousand Young"? And Hastur, the "Rider on the Wind"? And Azathoth, that "Bubbles and blasphemes, in the Center of Infinity"? There's also the Wendi...Ooops! ...mustn't say that, or he'll come to get me...

[@Avigorus]

Slept for close to 10 hours this morning lol

[@TheCount991]

I find the “why are there still monkeys” thing both infuriating and utterly hilarious. It’s the same question as “if I’m descended from my grandparents, why do my cousins still exist?” just with a lot of greats attached to the grandparents.

[@eefaaf]

How about "If Jesus came from God, why does God still exist?"

[@PBAmygdala2021]

I notice that the questions they ask aren't "hey I'm eager to learn this information I'm asking from you" but rather "I'm feeling defensive and need to lash out, and these are the things I was taught to say to defend my team."

[@TheCount991]

@@eefaaf ​ That's not really analogous at all. I could answer that with "Because he's God." and that's all that would really be needed. He's supposed to be omnipotent and eternal. He can do whatever he wants. Also, Jesus is supposed to be descended from God (sort of... I swear, the trinity is one of the most nonsensical things I've ever heard) while my point is that we are NOT descended from baboons, but just share a common ancestor with them. My goal is to show why the question doesn't make sense, not to strawman christianity. Plus the existence of cousins is accepted by everybody, even if they don't have cousins themselves, while Jesus being the literal-ish son of God is only accepted by christians. So I don't have to rework it just because I am talking to a muslim.

[@eefaaf]

@@TheCount991 Of course my statement was absurd. That was the point. Furthermore (if I remember correctly), there have been, and perhaps still are, those who DO believe that Jesus replaced Yahweh. So yeah, I was doing my best to be even more irrational than the original.

[@eefaaf]

@@PBAmygdala2021 Maybe you could reply: "If those silly questions come from you, why are you still here?" So much more polite than 'f*ck off!' :)

[@oliviascruggs7292]

I was an ACE student!!!!!!!! I’m so excited someone with a platform is covering this nightmare!!!!!!!!

[@CalebRichardsChannel]

Same here. Even my fundamentalist parents thought they went too far in certain places

[@user-ip9fp8ug5y]

Yeah, I was in ACE until about 7th grade

[@mattmatty4670]

​@@user-ip9fp8ug5y lol yep.

[@josephphelps6913]

I was an ACE student as well. Having lived the "nightmare" , as you so described it (100% true btw). I would never put my children through the same. Not only is it indoctrinating their students. And teaching them straight up lies. It also harms or makes other areas of their life difficult. Like building social skills (which in my opinion is one of the most important things, that you can only get in a public school). It's pretty difficult to function like a normal person, when you've been sheltered your whole life until that point. And then thrown into the real world when you join the workforce. Take it from someone else who knows lol

[@josephphelps6913]

I spent my entire middle school and high school years in homeschool btw. 6th-12th

[@thetypingape2073]

So, I am in the Bible Belt. They just passed legislation to give $7,000.00 credit for each homeschooled child and I am horrified at the idea that our literacy rates are going to plummet, much less scientific comprehension skills. Truly, I am worried.

[@dianasosa1301]

I'm really thankful that homeschooling is illegal in my country.

[@Fr3nchfrii]

I'm worried also. Sending courage and hope from the Pacific Northwest ❤️

[@myceliamdragon6887]

oh don't worry, they are already plummeting mid west america right now, we are turbo F'd

[@LittleMissLounge]

@@Fr3nchfriiHave you seen how little oversight Oregon has over homeschooling 😮? I work (indirectly) with kids, and its depressing. I'd assume Washington is much the same.

[@Fr3nchfrii]

@@LittleMissLounge I've only been here for about 6 years but given what my husband has said about some of the high schools in general, I can only imagine.. I went to highschool in Southern California. I have my own education system horror stories and shudder to think how much worse it's gotten in the past 17 years..

[@Captain_Pudding]

I think it would be terrifying to graduate from this curriculum and enter the real world only to realize you were intentionally taught wrong your whole life

[@louistournas120]

And the odd thing is that this happens in western countries. Of course, it is impossible to fix everyone. There will always be an element that is very dedicated to their religion. But there is too many anti-government sentiment, too much anti-science, too much anti-healthcare.

[@maryeckel9682]

You don't think you were taught wrong at the first shock of contact. You think only you and people like you know the truth. It can take years to deprogram, and if you keep associating with like-minded people, you might never get there.

[@Captain_Pudding]

@@maryeckel9682 yeah, that certainty makes sense *gestures at the current state of the world*

[@cindyfrye3026]

CP, I am sure having the actual real world smack you in the face after being 'protected' from it would be quite terrifying. I'm glad you are out here in the real world now

[@ceicli]

Well, that probably depends on if you are receptive to other ideas. Otherwise you'll probably just be horrified that everyone else has learned the wrong thing! Thus the circle continues! 😔

[@fromthehills814]

I did a year of ACE. Probably the wildest academic experience of my life. Almost got expelled at age 12 for arguing with my teachers about theistic evolution. Made for a scary call to my parents but an AMAZING college application essay.

[@KeeganAWhite]

The idea that there are students out there being punished for being smarter than their teachers is so sad.

[@MrJohndoakes]

@@KeeganAWhite It's a "self-teaching" system perfectly designed for homeschooling. The teachers in ACE/PACES can be any adult, because they have the answer key, so the quality of teachers can be lower than those in a normal private Christian school (and some US states do no require them to have a degree in education or even a Bachelor's degree in anything.)

[@katrina8396]

I was home-"schooled" with this garbage, through 12th grade. Horrid curriculum, truly. Love Dr. Jenna Scaramanga's work exposing this!! She's done a brilliant job.

[@northfall_6456]

Same, leaving high school with 0 friends, terrible social skills, and a miniscule grasp on science.

[@CompComp]

​​@@northfall_6456 Same me too! I had to get a GED. It shouldn't be legal to teach kids conspiracy theories and the Bible only as education. You should also be able to choose public school in HS. Your adult life will be hurt w/o a real education. I knew I was missing out too. I'm in college now. Stuff can get better with a bunch of work.

[@ReneeAnnette]

I was homeschooled, as well, with not this curriculum, and uh yeah--ACE was considered very academically unserious by those of us using the stronger curricula. Yes, I know that those big curricula also have big problems, but they're at least attempting to be as academically serious as they can be given their ideological limitations since they're used by so many big private schoolse. ACE is an absolute mess.

[@VW777]

@@ReneeAnnette What curriculums are stronger than ACE in your opinion?

[@ReneeAnnette]

@@VW777 Honestly? Pretty much any curriculum outside of Gothard's Advanced Training Institute curriculum that is worse for different reasons. Any curricula with actual textbooks would be better. ACE is glorified practice work at best.

[@donaldboudreaux5727]

As a former history teacher, I appreciate you talking about how teaching about religions is important in order to understand our world. Teaching religions is way different than proselytizing one religion.

[@cryptokinku6824]

I was taught using textbooks like these and they were the reason I was a climate change and evolution denier in high school. It makes me very upset to look back on it because I trusted the people and textbooks that were teaching me to tell me the truth and unbiased information. I was lied to. Even my statistics class tried to push anti-abortion ideas onto us. STATISTICS CLASS

[@mormonskeptic6836]

I used to teach biology in public school in a very conservative Christian area in the US. After 3 years I got tired of all the fights surrounding evolution. Now I teach chemistry. Less controversial, except when we talk about the stellar origin of elements, and radiometric dating.

[@subcitizen2012]

It's all part of their plan. Teach kids the wrong things so they underperform, burnout the teachers, justify more cuts to funding, so they can completely privatize the system for profit and ideology. These people are sick. Though I'm sure some of them are good people 🤪

[@mikearchibald744]

LOL

[@uncomplicatedi]

Can your students immediately identify specific topics their pastor have indoctrinated them about? Are they instructed to challenge the information presented? What kinds of things do they say about these topics?

[@MonkeyJedi99]

I applaud you for not just giving up and changing regions or careers.

[@dekai7992]

​@@uncomplicatedi The OC said nothing about pastors or indoctrination. Are you replying to the wrong comment, maybe?

[@StrawberryVein]

Holy heck, I did ACE for my entire homeschooling experience. I've never heard anyone else talk about it before now. It was absolutely atrocious, and downright criminal the things they taught us, and the things they withheld from us. I also vividly remember an activity page where the student was supposed to circle all of the occupations they wanted to do when they grow up. The boy's side had like 60 options and no rules, and the girl's side had homemaker, maid, nanny, beauty shop, and school teacher. And the instructions on the girls side made sure to emphasize that homemaker was the best one and you probably already wanted to pick that one, right? I was like 7 and even then I felt weird and grossed out by this lol

[@bebeenderson7863]

That’s weeeiiird

[@mikearchibald744]

Thank god for the internet eh.

[@sovannah9219]

holy shit i totally forgot about that

[@karldubhe8619]

The homeschoolers wanted girls to grow up to be schoolteachers? That strikes me as very odd.

[@altrag]

@@karldubhe8619 Definitely not odd. The "homeschooling" community wants to produce lots of teachers. Enough to flood the mainstream school system and start pushing their bullshit on everyone else.

[@tristyncarpenter5450]

This is why many in America who believed things like flat earth, pizza gate, illuminati, ect entered Qanon and started believing everything within that. Also, being a conservative Christian seems to be a necessary prerequisite to entering the cult/conspiracy.

[@cheeseofglass]

They're correlated, but it's not the cause.

[@kylegonewild]

Someone who engages in conspiratorial thinking regularly is more prone to being pulled into other conspiracies. If the Earth's flat and Obamna was a lizard man, then why not child sacrificing sex cult run by jews? Hell, they're probably responsible for the crop circles. It can't be the aliens, they've been pissed with us ever since the US let it leak in the 60s about Roswell and refuse to come back.

[@thearmouredpenguin7148]

@@cheeseofglass As you say correlation does not imply causation, but it is a strong indicator that the underlying cause for both being a right wing conservative christian, and other cult/ conspiracy beliefs, may be the same.

[@grahvis]

It has been noted that children growing up in a fundamentalist household are far more likely to confuse fiction with fact. They have been indoctrinated to believe in magical fairy tales.

[@williamthompson1455]

​@@cheeseofglass it's a indirect cause. Not a direct cause. The mind set and education is the main cause. But these thing being so wide spread us a indirect cause keeping these people shuttered.

[@alexbourdeau4438]

I spent 10 years at a Catholic elem/middle school (age 5 to 14). Most of the teachers were lay people, but there were many nuns as well. I suspect my experience was NOT typical. All of the teachers took pride in sharing the newest information presented in the most up-to- date format available. The principal, Sister David, took particular pleasure in having "her" students trounce the public school kids on standardized tests - which we did on a regular basis. Religion was never discussed during science (or any other class) just like science wasn't discussed during catechism. Dodged a bullet, eh? Ended up a geo-archaeologist.

[@throwbackpoet8598]

I’ve definitely heard this a lot more with Catholic schools. Since Catholics were allowed to believe that God created via evolution, while evangelicals chose to see evolution as the enemy of God.

[@billtomson5791]

I had 12 years of Catholic education in the US. I had dinosaurs as toys as early as age 7, each with the length and age of the species imprinted underneath it. I knew about the Triassic, Jurassic and Cretaceous periods by the age of 9 or 10, and was taught in 7th grade about the three prevailing cosmological origin theories of the time. We were well familiar with Darwin and his life and work, and were taught Adam and Eve were an ancient Middle Eastern myth with the serpent symbolic of the Canaanite deity Baal. Can't knock the Church when it comes to education.

[@billtomson5791]

@@throwbackpoet8598 please see comment above.

[@christopherlands2706]

@@billtomson5791 That’s so good! Conversely, I was taught that dinosaur bones were just the bones of dead cows that scientists put together to make dinosaurs so that we’d all believe that the world Is older than it is 🤦‍♀️

[@maryeckel9682]

When I did exam tutoring, the kids who did best were usually from a local Catholic high school. They could read and interpret texts, spell, write cogent essays, etc.

[@alexbourdeau4438]

The biggest problem with homeschools is the teachers! We require public school teachers to have a degree in education - you know - some training in how to teach effectively. There is no such requirement for homeschoolers - nearly all of them are amateurs. And it shows . . .

[@EstebanGrasso]

Although I agree that is the biggest problem, don't dismiss the lack of socializing. I was homeschooled for a couple of years due to medical reasons. My teachers were actually qualified and part of a "elementary public school for kids that can't go to school" so they follow the normal curriculum. When I return to my normal classes, I didn't have any problem with the curriculum but I was hard to get friends for a while.

[@josephphelps6913]

​@@EstebanGrasso I just pointed out the same issue in someone else's comment. In my opinion building social skills is one of the most life skills to learn. Being homeschooled makes it very difficult to transition into the workforce. It was a somewhat awkward for me anyways

[@MonkeyJedi99]

At least homeschool teachers have their parenting certification to fall back on.. Oh, you can become a parent by simply not knowing how pregnancy happens?

[@myheartismadeofstars]

Ironically I begged to be homeschooled as a kid due to bullying and not being able to keep up with class (autistic) and my parents refused for this exact reason: they didn't have the education I needed. So instead I continued to suffer my entire school career, and ended up failing all of my classes and just getting pushed out because I couldn't prove I knew the material (Because I didn't understand it). I didn't even technically graduate because I couldn't get all my credits (this is WITH taking an extra year, AND having a period devoted to helping me catch up). I still have nightmares about school, over ten years later...

[@ShadaOfAllThings]

IDK mate I'd say the teachers I had in school weren't exactly useful

[@jacobmfamexo]

I grew up with ACE, as well as Abeka and Alpha Omega, two other Christian homeschooling curricula. I just wanted to say thank you for making this. I was able to catch up and get a degree, but it took a lot out of me. These courses are just as damaging as they seem and that needs to be made more widely known.

[@BrontiThor]

Same here! I was in an ACE school from grade 3 through grade 12. (age 9 to 18), and the number of conspiracies I didn't know I had learned and had to unravel as an adult is almost too many to count.

[@pigeonVince]

True! Abeka absolutely messed up my learning, it left so much stuff out

[@sovannah9219]

ACE too. Honestly it was the segregation in the comics for me yikes

[@bubbles581]

oh goodness at first I read this like "I grew up with asexuals as well as [some word i dont know] and omegaverse" wow haha meant something a lot different when I reread it

[@sadginger4924]

@@sovannah9219 lol I noticed this too, had ACE as my curriculum 5th-12th grade, bothered me for a while that the black characters and white characters almost never appeared in the same comic strip

[@tmercy1257]

I wasn’t home schooled with this curriculum, but I was home school 6th through 12th grade in a biblical literalist household. I had to teach myself just about everything. I came up with my own assignments and graded them too. I didn’t learn almost anything up until 10th grade where I started taking classes at my local community college. And that was my saving grace. It was really hard at first. I only took two classes a semester and there were days that I thought I should just give up. But I kept learning and now I’m going to a well respected university to study music. I told one of my professors about my past education and she said “wow, you’ve been through a lot.” I didn’t realize how messed up my education had been until that moment.

[@philsmith5705]

Childhood indoctrination should be a crime. Share your story more. God the con may kill millions. Oh. I am happy enough, ditched Sunday school for Star Trek at 11. They kinda threw me out. I was asking questions...

[@ryanmartin949]

I was in an ACE program for 5 years in the late 90s early 00s. What a travesty of an "education" program. My education was terribly stunted due to it. Great video!!

[@kguyton1]

I grew up in Texas, and attended school in the 70's. My elementary school was a private catholic one, but it only went up to 6th grade. After that I was in public schools, and I must say the religious indoctrination was vastly more insidious in the public schools. At least at my catholic school we learned about other religions, but the religious indoctrination in the public schools was more subtle and far more extreme, as was the racism and bigotry. I wouldn't be surprised if some of the people I want to school with were instrumental in creating and pushing these awful curricula now being used all over the world to keep kids stupid and obedient.. Today I am a proud atheist, and just ordered my Baphomet plushie.😀

[@subcitizen2012]

You are spot on. This is their coded language when they say they Jesus, the bible, and prayer need to be out back in school - they want their religio-political beliefs to be enjoined with the state so kids can be indoctrinated into Christian, literal, soldiers. We have to fight the infidels and communists. That's where "real America" left off, a d where they want to pick things back up. They want atrocious, endless ideological wars to poke the nest of the 2nd coming by causing the world to end. Their subconscious motive is mutually assured destruction so they can be responsible for shifting humanity out of mortality and into their conceptions of eternity, so they can be rewarded as the "good" people. It's honestly really terrifying. Anytime I'm driving through small town and backwoods Texas (lived there for 25 years myself) it gives me goosebumps and unease. It's like watching a civilization collapse in real time. Things look like they're doing good there because of the cities, but their Texas is dying if not long dead. Hopefully someday these backward boomers think out and we can enter a new political era where these backwards and false cultural traditions aren't around our necks. I hope I love long enough to see it. Cheers!

[@mikearchibald744]

Its incredible to read this stuff from americans, I'm in Canada and NO religion was EVER mentioned at public school. I went to a catholic university and they were more open minded than my United Church upbringing was. I remember the prof who taught about St. Augustine had become an expert in St. Augustine because he HATED St. Augustine and used every class to berate both him and the pope. At a CATHOLIC school.

[@ChristopherSadlowski]

Texas really is more like a malignant tumor than a state at this point.

[@tinawitte420]

Geez, that sounds horrible! Thanks for sharing!

[@seankane8628]

Could it be because public education in Texas is dominated by the Cult of Evangelical Christianity?

[@LiminalLegion]

I was so lucky to have religious parents who didn't force me into religious "school" systems of any sort. It helped me be able to form my own opinions on the world and religion instead of feeling stuck in a belief system that isn't true

[@MonkeyJedi99]

My parents were "social Protestants", as in they were Protestants because that's where the people they associated with also went on Sunday mornings. - I had no pressure to become religious, and Sunday School was just daycare under the adult church space. My only attraction to religion was the singing. Once I was an adult, I sang in a Protestant church choir for almost a decade as an atheist. Then my D&D habit took over my whole weekends, and choir went by the wayside.

[@thisistheaccountname]

I went to Christian schools. I remember at least one teacher tell us that we should question everything. I remember that because a teacher at one of the public schools said the same thing to us which recalled that memory. I'm just now realizing how different our Christian Academy was from other people's.

[@glenbolderson9279]

Go worship your I-phone.

[@AaronMeaserProductions]

I was homeschooled along with my 9 siblings even through Highschool by my mom. I actually really liked that homeschooling allowed me to pursue creative passions as a youth, but I definitely missed out on a lot of science. My family is full YEC Fundie, so I didn't "learn" about evolution until four years ago when I realized everyone had been lying to me lol. Since then I've completely deconstructed, but homeschooling is not all bad in my opinion. If I had been taught actual science I would have very little to complain about it.

[@jennascaramanga8017]

Thank you so much for covering my research! It's difficult to make people understand why this matters and even harder to get people to pay attention. I loved seeing this covered by someone who gets it. Your letter to them was great too.

[@mretaoin1]

My father was a chemistry professor. I got a good education as a child. Every once in a while someone like you lifts a curtain to show what kind of education that other children are getting, and I'm appalled.

[@quintonberlett6375]

As a former student of this program in the US, Thank you so much for looking into the ACE curriculum and holding them accountable for their garbage education. It has taken me so long to unlearn the misinformation and the fallacies I was taught as fact. Truly, thank you so much for trying to help these students get a better education.

[@TristanMorrow]

This hasn't even premiered yet (06/02/2023) but I'm going to comment thusly (from personal experience) -- if you think Christian _schools_ are teaching conspiracies, wait till you find out about what Christian *homeschoolers* teach...

[@mikearchibald744]

HUGE conspiracies, if you don't believe everything in this one book then you are going to hell for eternity.

[@eliashumphries3301]

I was homeschooled until highschool and ohmygod Don't homeschool your kids.

[@katrina8396]

I know ONE family who did homeschooling right. Mine wasn't it :P

[@waverlygarner6189]

Former Christian homeschooler here. Yeah, it was bad. Thank goodness for the loving people who had patience enough to get me out of that insane mindset.

[@crackheadadventures]

omg REAL, the most "mild" example was when I met a girl who thought pregnancy was 100% risk-free and that the ancient times were better because, and I quote, "it was women's job to make men noble." And that's only what she was comfortable sharing with the outside world. I can't imagine the deep-end stuff she was taught.

[@the-wisest-emu]

I was home schooled and studied the ACE system early on in my childhood. My parents were (and still are) very much conspiracy-minded and motivated. I grew up in a state known to be fairly isolated, in a home-schooling family, and my only real contact with the outside world was with my friends in the neighborhood. The denomination of church I was raised in alienates other Christians, so the "fake" Christians out there were worse than the secular people. I became quite depressed in my late teens after a loss in the family and feeling extremely isolated and hopeless. I really believed that everyone else outside of my little bubble was evil and vindictive, and that they would try to destroy my faith in God if I were to become friends with them. It was the darkest time in my life and I don't care to ever go back to that.

[@MonkeyJedi99]

There's no hate quite like Christian love...

[@elizabethmclain6936]

I’m so sorry you went through that

[@maryeckel9682]

As someone who got brainwashed into a fundie cult in college, it has taken almost 40 years to finally get a diagnosis of PTSD for the way my relationship with reality was shattered. I know the horrible cognitive dissonance of liking people and feeling guilty because they're sinners bound for hell-- my family included. I hope you find healing.

[@cindyfrye3026]

lying to your children with "us and them" statements to purposely keep them isolated is a very good indication of being in a cult I am so glad you survived all of that

[@WhiteLightning117]

oh my god, I literally came here to say that was almost exactly my story. I was so brainwashed that for the last year of my ACE highschool years I paid my own tuition at $300/month. They convinced me I'd never make it in a public school because I was failing in the ACE school. I ended up dropping out and getting a GED. It took me until I turned 24 last year to work up the courage to enroll at my university. I never want to go back to that part of my life.

[@psych_chick]

I was taught this stuff as a JW child and to this day, I check my science knowledge with my scientist husband despite having been in the top students in secular schools. This stuff is very damaging.

[@singing_sloan]

We used Bob Jones University textbooks in our Christian school. Same conspiracy theories, same worldview throughout all subjects. We even and a class called Biblical Worldview. The goal is for these students to go to christian colleges that promote the same ideas, marry another isolated christian, and make lots of little christian babies to continue the cycle. Isolation is key, because if they hear other ideas their worldview might expandand change.

[@ritchie6162]

It’s only getting more difficult for people to hold onto that isolated worldview as social media and exposure to the rest of the world continues to progress. I think it is contributing to so many people (overall) leaving organized religion recently. I don’t have the stats to back that up though so take it with a grain of salt.

[@dwilcox3309]

If this is about Accelerated Christian Education (ACE) then I was one of its unfortunate students in the UK. edit: I obviously posted this before the premier, just in case I seemed a little slow 😅

[@EmmaThorneVideos]

Oh no, I'm very sorry!

[@dwilcox3309]

​@@EmmaThorneVideos thanks! 6 years of schooling to unlearn, I have no GCSEs because of it. Threat of hell if I didn't agree - that really does something to a kid. Love your work.

[@oliviascruggs7292]

I was an ACE “student” in the US! I’m still morning all the missed opportunities and recovering from the poor education.

[@josephphelps6913]

🖐️ US victim here...... I mean student

[@shriggs55]

I have eight grandchildren.Six of them are being indoctrinated with evangelicalism.It's hard to watch-especially as an atheist grandfather,but there's nothing I can do about it.I told my daughter that she should teach her kids how to think-not what to think.We'll see how that goes:(

[@MonkeyJedi99]

Well, you can give them books for Christmas. Maybe "On the Origin of Species"? Then let the indoctrinating parents have to explain why those books are "bad". And kids being kids, they ll have at least a little curiosity about the books, and some of them may actually seek the title out.

[@altrag]

@@MonkeyJedi99 That's advice to take with caution. The kind of parents who would indoctrinate their kids like that have a tendency to also being the kind of parents who would cut him out of his grandchildren's life completely for pulling such a stunt. I obviously don't know OP or his family, so he'll have to judge for himself whether he thinks his daughter (or her husband or whoever runs the show) would go to that extreme. Just cautioning that its a judgement he'll needs to be make. Assumptions can cause more harm than good in these situations.

[@DavidSmith-vr1nb]

​@@altrag "Origin" is hardly a concise explanation of evolution, it's almost 170 years out of date and requires advanced reading skills. Many of the terms used have shifted in meaning over time, it's also pretty dry reading.

[@DancerOfClouds]

I agree, teach them how to think.

[@2lefThumbs]

Sounds tough Joseph, Ihope the situation improves 🤞

[@tormentalopez5373]

Thank you so much for talking about ACE. My principle tried to hold me back my senior year because we were all required to give a “Christian testimony” before graduation. I refused, as I’ve never been a Christian, but my foster family were extremely religious. (I ended up getting kicked out and graduated on time with honors from a “evil public school”)

[@ND-nr6mx]

I remember feeling so weird about giving testimonies in youth groups, missionary school, etc. To me, everything was just moving forward without my control, so how would I know who/what to credit with my experiences? I was hardly a participant in my own life & repressing a lot of trauma that I was too young to recognize, but suddenly I'd be expected to tell everyone why believing in God led me to a better life despite not even having any understanding of outside perspectives.

[@PaintedKnightSky25]

I used ACE from 6th grade-graduation. Man it really was terrible. College was…interesting. Edit to add: ACE is extremely hands off. My mom didn’t do anything with me for schoolwork. I taught myself from the books. I did my required pages in each subject for the day and that was it. It usually only took me a few hours. It was extremely repetitive year over year and definitely focused heavily on memorization not learning and certainly no critical thought. I graduated with good grades and even did well at a small community college where they also did a lot of memorization. I fell flat on my face when I ended up at a larger 4 year college though. Most of my assignments involved critical thought and “reading between the lines”. I didn’t know how to handle that. If it wasn’t laid out right there in the text for me (like ACE was) I struggled so much. I still have yet to complete a bachelors degree (29 yrs old) because of how badly it screwed me over. Last edit: the isolation was TERRIBLE! I was an only child with very few friends. My only friend from ages 9-14 was also homeschooled and went to the same church. At 14, however, my dad lost his job and we had to move to a new state. So I then spent all of my high school years alone in my bedroom with no friends and just my schoolwork to keep me company. The trauma around that is real and still effects me today.

[@obscureinception8302]

Some people claim that their education was the problem when they struggle in life, when really it's just that they are either too lazy to have put in any real effort or just not that smart. Anyone who has suffered through a 'creationist Christian education' though, I think has genuinely suffered a real injustice. I hope that you manage to overcome this.

[@sadginger4924]

I just want to say it was as if I read my own story here, I also had Ace 6th-12th and did the required amount of pages in a day while both of my parents worked full time, I was a kid who in elementary school was thought by teachers to have a learning disability then tasked with putting my education in my own hands with no help from anybody, my parents liked having their kids home all the time and it became the norm but I was so lonely I became obsessed with the idea of God being my best friend which messed with my grip on reality for a few years. I’m agnostic now, you’re not alone

[@cindyfrye3026]

congratulations for being a survivor, Liz

[@leahasakevich6945]

I never really thought about it until I read your comment, but I really struggled in 3rd grade- my first year in public school, after being in a Christian school before. I struggled with reading comprehension and "reading between the lines," like you mentioned. At my Christian school, it really was full of memorization. Thanks for sharing your experience! And I wish you the best of luck on the rest of your bachelor degree!! Think of how far you've come 😊

[@qlue7881]

So, here in South Africa, we have a National curriculum Even private schools must follow this curriculum So science and religion are treated as separate subjects and not blended into one glorious mess

[@PseudosSC]

ACE does have a presence in South Africa. I was in an ACE school some 20-odd years ago, can’t say whether the curriculum has changed but the school still exists and looking at their social media there’s reference to ACE and PACEs.

[@Bexstarartist]

I grew up in white apartheid. Fundimental Christianity informed a lot of teachings and ideology behind the racism as well. We were thought the battle of blood river and how they prayed to god for the success. I matriculated 97 so I grew up in the thick of the segregation. It sounds great that science and religion are separated! I can’t remember, I remember the damaging history lessons! Its history skewed angle on its narrative that is the issue in many cases.

[@qlue7881]

@@PseudosSC I'm not sure how much they deregulated the education system after 94, but the Matric exams are still set and marked by the Education Department, so any school not teaching the National Curriculum is bound to have a very low Matric pass rate

[@qlue7881]

@@Bexstarartist the way they taught history was so bad I don't remember anything from it, except that it was boring as hell and exclusively political History White English medium schools were actually pretty good from the education side, but the bdsm faculty was Nazis level

[@cindyfrye3026]

Lucky you, Qlue. You probably have religion and government separated too. I wish we had that in the U.S.

[@casperl.valentine]

I wasn’t homeschooled but I was raised in an incredibly small private christian school where we were taught the world was 6000 years old + science was basically taboo. I’m only a year away from my bachelor’s degree now but sometimes I equate my scientific background as the equivalent of a medieval peasant. I had to work so hard to teach myself + understand the most basic fundamental things about science + I wouldn’t wish that kind of childhood on anyone

[@derpyslurp8779]

Technically the world is 6000+ years old lol

[@jarvy251]

When I was in high school here in Canada, we had an elective for media literacy, which focused on recognizing marketing tactics and how biases are presented. It was really great and it should probably be mandatory.

[@cindyfrye3026]

what a great idea, Jarv.

[@emmao6578]

I've always felt like the very basics of media literacy is something that most people should have learnt in history lessons because analysing sources is an essential part of it, I'm not sure if the reason this doesn't seem to have helped people is because too much history teaching still focuses mostly on fact memorising or maybe just not enough emphasis on the fact these methods work just as well on present sources/media as they do on past ones.

[@jarvy251]

@@emmao6578 "media literacy is something that most people should have learnt in history lessons because analysing sources is an essential part of it" It's an essential part of ACTUALLY studying history, but what you learn in middle and high school is just memorizing dates, names, and then MAYBE the historical significance and context of those names and dates as a distant third priority. Your source is the textbook you've been given.

[@emmao6578]

@@jarvy251 That's what history lessons were up to a certain level but all my favourite teachers included simple forms of source analysing from a pretty early level and once it gets to GCSE level it is required both in coursework and exams. Although I have just realised that not everyone has to take history GCSE so you've got a point as many people will never be involved at the level that source analysis becomes an essential part of lessons.

[@Steve13C]

It should definitely be mandatory, though finding the time to teach it in an already packed curriculum would be a challenge.

[@DarthLoki]

I spent years 8-12 of my education in a private Christian school in Arkansas back in the 80's and early 90's. It was called P.A.C.E. back then; PROGRESSIVE Accelerated Christian Education. The idea behind it is that the student is accelerated to learn at their own speed. A certain number of workbooks were one grade level, and kids that could memorize things well progressed rapidly. Some graduated early in fact due to this. Now the science workbooks did teach about fossil fuels...what they are, where they come from, and even that they are limited. But even the state colleges of Arkansas wouldn't recognize my diploma. I went to a small community college instead of my original and dream school because of that, and was incessantly harassed by the school faculty to attend a "Christian" college instead. I did finally take my GED to make it official when I was in my early 30's. No classes or studying, I just sat down and scored in the 100% percentile the same day I registered for it. My point is that you're exactly right, Emma. People who have never been exposed to anything except this stuff are victims. Arkansas isn't exactly noted for it's forward thinking and until I was 25, I was terrified of homosexuals. Coincidently that's also when I left my church because I learned how to think for myself. Most people in that environment aren't able to do that. All they'll ever know is what they're told by the people who also never knew anything except what they were told. It's a truly vicious cycle that starts with this pathetic excuse for an education system. It's damaging, dangerous, and divisive.

[@doublehelix3558]

Oh my god. My insane fundie conservative evangelical school used the A.C.E. curriculum. It set me back so hard in college, having to play catch up because the PACEs didn't teach us basic critical science. I was indoctrinated super deep, believing a ton of insane conspiracy theories because that's what we were taught both in the PACEs and in chapel. It's been hard to deprogram from all the harmful rhetoric I was taught.

[@sadginger4924]

How was the adjustment period going from ACE to college? I had Ace 5th-12th grade and am loathing the thought of college but I want to get on with my life ya know?

[@RickNelsonMn]

It is sad such abuses are occurring. I wonder if any university or college would offer an intensive deprogramming course? Perhaps there's a private source for that and textbooks? I think the internet can help via searches for something I'm describing? Thoughts, just thoughts. Best wishes.

[@RickNelsonMn]

​@@sadginger4924 Is there any particular consideration about faith involved with this thinking you ask about? I ask with an openness to all faiths, nonjudgmental, no pushback to someone's contemplating their deprogramming. Especially if that includes retaining some, none or most of their faith. It's also sad to tiptoe concerning this question I ask. Meaning, I fear it may seem impolite or worse the kind of nosey of a busybody? Then I fear the concerns for answering may be prohibitive. Meaning, perhaps an answer affirmative of retaining faith could result in negativity. Smh and sigh.

[@JohnDlugosz]

There should be some kind of class action suit.

[@JohnDlugosz]

@@RickNelsonMn >> an intensive deprogramming course? Maybe Aaron Ra videos? Good point though, someone ought to make a systematic course (text, or videos) to that effect, rather than just challenging random pieces. It could be brainstormed and reviewed by ex-cultists, and presented by one or more science you-tubers.

[@freddan6fly]

Regarding Young Earth Creationism being a conspiracy theory, it has all the hallmarks of a conspiracy theory, for instance rejecting several fields of science with "Nuh-hu", lack of understanding of mathematics and general science. Denial of the burden of proof. In short I fully agree.

[@obscureinception8302]

There is only one requirement for something to legitimately be called a conspiracy theory: The proponents have to imply that there is some sort of conspiracy to hide what they claim to be the truth. Creationists claim that mainstream science is lying, or at the very least intentionally misleading people - and that can only mean that they think that there is a conspiracy to teach people evolutionary theory despite it (supposedly) being known that it is not correct. There is absolutely no doubt that creationist is therefore a conspiracy theory.

[@FearlessNimue]

I was saved from A.C.E. by my parents' divorce. My Mom couldn't afford private schools on her own, so I had to attend public school, where I found myself ahead in every subject except science. Thank goodness I was a prolific reader and was able to catch up! I stayed behind even in college. Still feel like I'm behind today and relearning terms/facts. Thank you A.C.E. 🙃

[@TomGehrke]

Came to chime in on ACE curriculum and I'm shocked at how widespread this was/is. I did ACE in 7th and 8th grade (age 12 and 13) in the mid-80's. Not homeschooled, but rather grouped in a small classroom with 20-30 other kids from 7th to 12th grade. Each child sat at a table with partitions installed to make cubicles. Each student was largely self-directed whereby each subject was broken down into small workbooks or PACEs (Packet of Accelerated Christian Education). Each workbook was numbered so 7th grade Mathematics might be comprised of English PACEs 100-120 that one would be able to work through at their own pace. (Clever, right?) There might be several quizzes incorporated into each PACE and answer books were available at a central location where each student was responsible for checking their own answers. A test was given at the end of the PACE that the "teacher" would grade. An 80% or better would move you on to the next booklet. If you needed assistance from a teacher, the partitions had a small hole drilled in the top where one might plant a small Christian flag to get their attention. As an introvert, this setup was ideal. Socializing was not encouraged. There was no getting up in front of the class. I could work on whatever I liked on a particular day as long as I met overall goals for mid-term and finals. In some cases I was doing 10th grade work while in 8th grade (mainly maths). From 9th to 12th grade my parents sent us to a more "traditional" Christian school where I was ahead in many areas. That said, as compared to a public school, I'm not sure I would have compared as favourably. I did not get into a secular college and after 3 semesters at a private Christian college, I bailed entirely because it was apparent that we weren't being taught anything useful. Everything I've learned since has been whatever I could absorb on my own. Honestly, I feel robbed like many of the other commenters here have expressed. Not that I am not in a good place now. It just seems that for many of us it works out in spite of our upbringing. I'm sad to find that there are so many of us.

[@ReneeAnnette]

I had a friend growing up that went to a very similar style school for a few years. She ended up in public high school the last couple of years (i can't even remember why that happened for her). Even as a homeschooler, I was a bit appaled at the way the ACE school was run. Also PACEs are definitely academically lacking in so many ways. Just wild to think about whole schools using them.

[@TomGehrke]

@@ReneeAnnette I understand how school systems are allowed. (Freedom!) I also believe parents are doing what they feel is best [from their skewed perspective]. But it does kids a disservice. Most parents don't understand education well enough to make those decisions. So all the talk in the US about parents having a say in what is taught sounds nice, but it's only true to a point. "Accreditation" becomes a dirty word. My sister finished at the Christian college with an unaccredited degree in Education. (Oh, the irony.) Today she teaches at a Christian school because... where else could she go? And thus the cycle continues.

[@ReneeAnnette]

@@TomGehrke Oh yeah. I get all that, intellectually; it's just...wild to really sit and think about. I also ended up with an unaccredited degree from a Christian college and am now paying off student loans from the accredited education grad degree I had to get (well, let's be honest, I love going to school anyway hahaha) so that I could move into public school. I was very fortunate to have parents with college degrees who also wanted good academics for their kids even though they were homeschooling and had the tools to ...mostly... tell what that was (hoo boy is my science education nearly absent, though; and yikes on the social studies--just heavily Manifest Destiny bs). I knew a lot of people with well-meaning parents who just really thought/felt that if they centered God, everything else would work out. It uh did not usually. Really by "wild," I mean "very frustrating and terrible." Ugh.

[@TomGehrke]

@@ReneeAnnette Oof. Wonder if there's a support group for people like us. 😅

[@cindyfrye3026]

Tom, I taught in one of those schools, (3rd and 4th combined class). Did you put a little US flag on the wall of your cubicle when you had a question so the roving teacher would come by to try to help you? That's how it was in our upper grade combined group.

[@ghostfrequencies]

i was one of these kids. luckily, my parents put me in school in grade 11, but it was a xian one, so i really did not get any real science information till college. there's such embarrassing gaps in my knowledge; sometimes i'll ask my partner a question about science and he can't tell whether i'm joking because the answer is so basic. it feels like i have so much less information about the world than other people my age

[@louistournas120]

I recommend buying a used physics, chemistry, biology textbook, university level and read it on your free time. Maybe you have some stores that sell used things where you live.

[@ghostfrequencies]

@@louistournas120 that's a really thoughtful reply, thank you. i'll definitely do that, there's a lot of stores in my city i'll be able to find one

[@cindyfrye3026]

Jude, congratulations on making the break into the real world. You are a survivor.

[@ND-nr6mx]

I've always felt developmentally stunted because homeschooling did the bare minimum for my education or my social life. I struggled to connect with others my own age all throughout high school & even college.

[@alexbourdeau4438]

Fred Hoyle was so anti-theist that he adamantly opposed the big bang theory (a term he mockingly coined) even after the cosmic microwave background radiation was discovered. He didn't like how much like Genesis the idea of something from nothing sounded.

[@zemorph42]

So he misunderstood the theory in the same way the Christians still do?

[@MaryAnnNytowl]

Exactly correct. I don't think he ever accepted it, in fact.

[@iamhazelnuts]

Just another "homeschooled for 18 years with my eight siblings lest we be indoctrinated" who loves and needs your videos! Thanks so much ❤

[@cindyfrye3026]

iamhazel, you were very heavily indoctrinated, just not the way 'they' told you would be the 'bad' way. I hope you are becoming un-indoctrinated. It will take a while.

[@iamhazelnuts]

@@cindyfrye3026 it's been a decade of deconstruction for me so far, it is a most rewarding process.

[@user-sg5hp4qp3p]

I attended an ACE Christian school from 6-12 grades. I wouldn’t send my worst enemy’s child to this school. Horrible science program! I can’t even begin to explain how horrific it was.

[@archivist17]

My nieces and nephews were homeschooled, partly in ACE. The gaps and lies horrified me.

[@cindyfrye3026]

It is not fun to watch it happen to your family and not be able to prevent it.

[@BillGarrett]

"I'll tell any lie to get your kids on my team" is such a repulsive attitude and it's one of the thing that angers me the most about religious organizations

[@realjettlag]

One of my favorite explainers to the "why are there monkeys?" types is simply, "It's a family tree, not a family stump." It's so utterly simple, yet many need even that explained to them. I've also heard, "If we're all on a straight road, there'd be no turns and we'd all be asleep at the wheel," which seems to be what those ruling with religion actually desire.

[@lianejaeger8708]

I grew up mostly in religious schools, and it was terribly isolating. I went from kindergarten through grade school, until I finally escaped to public school. When that happened, I knew nothing of science, biology, and certain aspects of history. This was corrected very quickly as I absorbed all this new information like a sponge. Needless to say, my lack of information was reduced drastically. So about the religious school. I will say as far as teachers are concerned, many did not behave in any christian way, and were quite horrible to students, myself included. I have awful stories about that, but it's definitely for another time. For the most part, one teacher taught every subject, so you can imagine that if they did not understand it, neither would we. It was frustrating, and this mostly occurred in math. As for science, the closest we got were a couple algebraic equations that they told us were used for science. One other thing was their "section" on evolution; the two sentences read that " some people even believe humans came from apes, and that we lived in caves as cavemen!!" That was it, I'm not even joking. The major part of this schooling, however, was the intense focus on religion, and we would have a kind of church like worship time in the church at school, as well as bible time in the classroom. We would be quizzed on the books of the bible, and we had to know them in any order that was asked, or it was shameful. They preached and preached, and it really did isolate us. Outside is bad, inside here is good. Outside is broken, inside here has religion and "truth." Lucky for me, I didn't buy everything, but it still did damage I had to overcome. It will also create many obstacles others must overcome, such as being behind education wise, and not having any information about many subjects and ideas of thought they will encounter in further education and the outside world. I hope I explained this well enough, and apologize for such a long post.

[@lobianienjoyer]

Man, my school uses this curriculum. At one point in Social Studies there was a text where it was said that public education is bad because it doesn't teach Christian values or something. I remember that there was also a text that basically said that colonization was good for Africa and slavery wasn't that bad. Oh, and in English grammar I had to suffer through stories that glorified missionaries, with a lot of disrespect towards other cultures, of course. I'm soooo happy that I switched to a normal program. Btw ACE was advertised like it's something incredible and progressive just because it was American lol.

[@lobianienjoyer]

Forgot to mention that other students at my school really hope to get good education abroad with ACE. Yeah. Good luck.

[@cindyfrye3026]

The indoctrination is buried very deep in the curriculum. I am glad you got out when you did.

[@lobianienjoyer]

@@cindyfrye3026 Thank you.

[@emmao6578]

I'm glad you were able to get out of that school of teaching reasonably quickly and that you'd learnt enough by yourself to question these things. Your comment about the textbook mentioning colonisation of Africa reminded me that several current uk politicians including Boris Johnson have said horrible things along those same lines and they don't even have the excuse of extreme christian indoctrination. It may be a bit of an extreme opinion but I honestly think there should be certain things you have to accept as true before you're allowed to hold that much power over a country and the fact that colonisation is bad should be one of them. Edit: I found a couple of those quotes from Johnson - “The continent may be a blot, but it is not a blot upon our conscience. The problem is not that we were once in charge, but that we are not in charge any more,” - “The best fate for Africa would be if the old colonial powers, or their citizens, scrambled once again in her direction; on the understanding that this time they will not be asked to feel guilty.”

[@ctwentysevenj6531]

Here in Australia, many of these Christian schools have sprung up over the last 40 years🙁

[@jimmyh6601]

I always thought of Australia being a modern country, then I heard of Ken Ham!😊

[@sagesemadeni4024]

We have WAY too many of them in the US. They definitely get more educational credit than deserved. Everyone that I've ever met who graduated from those indoctrination factories is a complete moron. They might as well have been home schooled by a cult...

[@shriggs55]

Misinformation rules in these schools.

[@tallyhorizzla3330]

​@@jimmyh6601 you notice though he is peddling his particular brand of ignorance in the US,a far more receptive(read gullible) audience there than here. But it is a fact that there has been a lot of Christian schools popping up in Australia recently.

[@YLLPal]

I went to one, didn't even know what evolution was except in the context of how ID "proves" it wrong. @jimmyh6601 we had him visit my church growing up, before he got his big break and moved to Hollywood, uh, Texas 😅

[@digicatt9320]

I’m actually an ACE student. I learn all my language arts stuff from ACE and MY GOD IS IT AWFUL. The accelerated part from what I know is that you’re supposed to graduate early but everyone i know who has done ACE in anything always had a harder time getting through it than anything else. So it was slower

[@bdhesse]

So I homeschool my kids, but ironically it's for exactly the opposite reason from most of the homeschoolers in my area. If I sent my oldest to public school, there is a good chance she'd leave school with poor reading skills because she's dyslexic and schools in my area simply do not have the resources or understanding necessary to deal with dyslexic students (I know because I used to be a teacher and I had to teach myself about the science of reading). We also simply cannot afford $10,000 a year to sent her to the school that specialises in dyslexia, and she's also too young for that school anyway. So I bought an actually science-based reading curriculum and have been teaching her myself. Now, given that the main reason for educating her at home was reading, I was considering putting her in public school once she was reading proficiently. But now I am not willing to do that. Why? Because the Christo-fascists in charge here (I am not American, btw) are trying very hard to destroy our public education system. They've pushed through a history curriculum that is white-washer, racist, and Christian. Classrooms have 40 kids in them. Anything considered offensive to white Christians is being removed, so no sex-ed, no real science, no real education. It's horrible! So until we can move or enough people finally join in the fight against the destruction of our education system, I will not be subjecting my children to that. As a former public school teacher, it breaks my heart. But to add to the insult, the homeschoolers in my are are almost exclusively WASPs and do use curricula like A.C.E (Abeka, Apologia, Sonlight, Christian Light, Memoria Press, Classical Conversations, etc.) and they are all supporting the Christo-facist government and the destruction of our education system despite planning to never send their kids to public school regardless! It is absolutely infuriating!

[@cindyfrye3026]

BD, I hope you are successful in helping your daughter to read in spite of being dyslexic. I totally agree with you that the fascists are pushing the government to follow their religion/cult beliefs. I very strongly disagree with that policy.

[@bdhesse]

@cindyfrye3026 So far she's doing great! The curriculum we use follows the Orton-Gillingham approach, which was specifically designed with dyslexia in mind. It's actually the same curriculum used in the local private dyslexia school 🙂

[@rosemaryfulton1926]

I'm in the USA and I think the ACE has been around for longer than 40 years. My daughter was in this when she was six and she is 50 now so that's 44 years. It had been around for a few years before that so maybe closer to 50 years. None of that really matters, but what does matter is when I put her in public school, she was behind and had to catch up with the other students. That is telling. Thanks for getting the word out!

[@hash8169]

the 1970s is indeed 50 years prior to the 2020s

[@graceleathers5970]

I was homeschooled and a lot of my childhood friends used ACE, but my family didn’t want to use ACE because they thought it supported evolution too much. I was a child and had no idea what the difference was between what we used and ACE, but wow. I don’t remember what curriculum we used sorry, I know it was an American Mennonite based curriculum (we were not Mennonite). Now I’m in healthcare and deeply wish I could’ve had better science education, because when I got to higher education I needed to really catch up, and made it much harder for me.

[@ReneeAnnette]

Was it Rod and Staff? That's a pretty big Mennonite curriculum for homeschoolers. We used some of their stuff (esp the Bible curriculum).

[@graceleathers5970]

@@ReneeAnnette YES! Thank you! It wasn’t Amish then, Mennonite. Thank you for the correction.

[@PetrosArgy]

This kind of reminds me of how the Amish here in the Lancaster area educate their children (only up to 8th grade and only the basics - reading, writing, math, plus Amish faith and other skills needed to exist in the community), but it goes dangerously further in that it gives the children a sense that their education is, in some way, equivalent to that of the rest of the schools out there. No Amish teenager would think they know as much as an English teenager when it comes to science or even higher maths. Their system isn't an "alternative" one, it's tailored to the needs of their community. The ACE system seems designed to create adults who are at odds with the greater population. I can only imagine how they would react if another group decided to start schooling kids to bring them up as Aztec or Mayan and to view human sacrifice as something normal and necessary for the production of foodstuffs.

[@cindyfrye3026]

good point PetrosAgry. I would love to sign up for Aztec or Mayan (as long as it was in English, I am bad at languages.)

[@swimmyswim417]

20:45 Absolutely!! I grew up in Catholic schools, and even though I have my own criticisms of how they handled things, they were really good at teaching good science and teaching us different ways to interpret the Bible during religion classes. And my dad (the Catholic side of the family) was really good at humoring our curiosity about things like creation and told us stuff like “one day of the creation story is a day in God time, which could be millions of years in people years.” Made sense to us as kids, and still seems like the most logical interpretation. My Catholic English teacher was also bold enough to compare the Noah’s Ark story to other flood myths in our historical epic unit. Which seems like a small thing, but it genuinely was helpful in encouraging us to see and analyze the Bible as a literary text instead of just a religious one. It definitely is possible to have a religious-based curriculum that supports good science and critical thinking/analysis skills. Of course, there were a few areas that Catholic school just didn’t really cover very well. I learned more about sex ed in my first two weeks during college orientation than in all my years K-12 of Catholic school. Maybe if I’d been taught about the full spectrum of gender and sexuality as a kid or a teen, I would’ve realized I was a biromantic asexual a lot sooner and saved myself the trouble of trying to follow hetero/allo standards.

[@cindyfrye3026]

I'm sure Catholic schools taught as little about reproductive rights as Protestant and Fundamental churches did. I am glad you found your true self.

[@Amigafur]

I'm homeschooled, and I recognize that for the vast majority of people, it doesn't work. But my ADHD makes it very difficult to learn in a classroom environment.

[@KnightlyNerds]

If I'm not mistaken Kat Kerr, Evangelical prosperity preacher and "author", writes homeschool curriculum too. If you know anything about her that is a horrifying thought.

[@JazzyLogical]

I was an only child homeschooled my entire life in the middle of nowhere with a mix-match of curriculums like lifepac and more that i can't remember. It took until i was 13 to realise that i could make decisions and have opinions independent of my parents and church besides what to eat and wear. I took the bible very literally and seriously and developed what some call scrupulocity, which is considered a subsect of or very similar to OCD in behavior, but only centered around the fear of being morally bad. I would fall asleep every night praying, then wake up only to pray to grovel and apologize for falling asleep. I would also regularly do the 'salvation prayer', never quite convinced i was 'saved' no matter how many times i did it. During that, it was a grueling 4-5 years of constant self doubt, rumination, isolation, shame, and torture before i slowly made it to a place where i could feel confident in my descision to become atheist. I realised, in that time, that most teens my age were much more independent and sure of themselves, and knew a lot more about science and how the world works than i did. I had to unlearn everything and upheave my structure of how i thought reality worked. This caused dissociation and a disconnect from the world around me that still impacts me today. I'm still 'behind' on many things in life, but i am the happiest and healthiest I've ever been, and i have hope for the future. I try to take in all the knowledge i feasibly can, and my favorite subjects are psychology, biology, evolution, and philosophy. I still am easily tricked with false information because im conditioned to automatically assume truth, but I'm getting better. The further i distance myself from this muck, the more ridiculous it seems. If you made it this far, thank you for reading. If this is in anyway helpful you can use this, i just ask that you use the pseudonym Jay. I'd be more than happy to elaborate further too if it would help in some way.

[@patriklindholm7576]

This shouldn't be here on YT but presented globally to every board of education while local specialists on the subjects discussed on the agenda necessarily were present. Keep it up, E, as long as You can muster the courage and vigour. And after that keep on anyway.

[@cindyfrye3026]

Patrik, I agree with you but would like to edit your comment to "This shouldn't be here on YT but presented globally to every board of education while local specialists on the subjects discussed on the agenda necessarily were present. "

[@someonesomewhere9115]

A Christian school came to my work for a field trip recently. I work on a horse farm. Horses have small keratin patches on each of their legs and one student asked what they are. The real answer: they’re vestiges of toes that horses’ ancestors had millions of years ago. My evolution-free but still correct answer: they’re keratin patches. I could give a more detailed answer if you’d just teach your kids about evolution.

[@VW777]

There is no evidence for evolution- one species becoming another. There is however evidence for adaptation, which is something different.

[@andrewwenner2781]

@@VW777really? Adapting is evolving over time… Why so technical?

[@andrewwenner2781]

I guess u want this school to keep being misinformed by u about what u know the truth is, u can just say it without ever calling it evolution, just explain why those damn chestnuts are there? Their ugly as hell and crusty as hell, I believe it was something they no longer needed or used anymore…

[@ritchie6162]

@@VW777adaptation is a product of evolution. Evolution is the foundation of nearly all biological research. My entire college education in medical biology, biochemistry, and genetics revolved around the foundations of evolution. I’m not taking this garbage about “no evidence for evolution”. It’s real whether people want to acknowledge it or not, no belief system required.

[@2lefThumbs]

My main gripe against home "schooling" is the lack of social influence tbh- many of my school masters were wankers, but interacting with them let me learn more about life than they intentionally taught me. My secondary school was 11-18, and my fellow pupils also showed me a lot about life. Back in those days, the compulsory religious education was called "Divinity" at my school, but did cover other faiths (1970s UK btw)

[@annaairahala9462]

I was homeschooled with a American Christian homeschooling curriculum that was different from this one but taught the same stuff. I'm in a science field now and have since learned many things that were never taught me as a kid. It helped that I was interested in learning things and understanding the evidence even though at the time I didn't believe any of it, so when it came to things like evolution I was more educated than my peers. I'm sure that interest in learning is one of the factors that helped me when going on to post-secondary with not being out of the loop on everything. I do want to say though, homeschooling itself is not a bad concept and does have its advantages. The issue is that there's many factors that can make it bad. Those who homeschool are more likely to be homeschooling for some reason that could be considered harmful to the child, such as these conspiracy theories, and kids do still need to get that social aspect that school provides from somewhere from multiple sources, not just a church or something else. The other factor is that the parents need to be prepared and receive help from outside sources. It has also been used to hide abuse on the child. Unfortunately, many do not address these issues which just results in the harm of the child. Don't know how this could be fixed, but I hold out hope for something

[@meghaffer]

I homeschooled my kid through elementary school. The most frustrating part was finding a good science curriculum. I ended up making up my own lessons because all of the affordable published stuff was religious. (You can buy what's available to public schools, but it's priced very high and access is difficult even after you've paid for it.) So. Very. Frustrating.

[@april6620]

I went to small seventh day Adventist private schools for several years of elementary education (3-6 and again in high school ).. 2 room schoolhouse for kindergarten thru 9th grade. Younger half in one room, older grades in the other.. Some grades didn't even have kids, most grades had 1-3 kids. Whole school had 20-30 kids, depending on the year. Sda's are very fundamentalist, old testament, evangelicals.... there's been some real whackadoos, throughout history, that have been sda or had an sda upbringing. My grandpa was a pastor for decades and many family members held church leadership roles, I grew up helping in the younger kid sabbath school classes, church choir and having to perform special music for the church service...by myself. I was already struggling with undiagnosed ptsd and adhd/autistic. It's the patriarchal purity culture and lying to, or withholding information from their kids, for me. I'm 44yo and still continuing to deconstruct, learning all the things I wasn't taught and untangling all of the trauma wrapped up in my cptsd. Please don't indoctrinate your children... It will lead to decades of issues, low self worth, anger and resentment and so much more. Well done discussion on this topic. I'm encouraged to see this being discussed along with mental health, equality &inclusion, misogyny etc. ❤

[@fatefullydead5585]

Adventist former pastor kid here. I know exactly what you mean. My mom was in an extremely abusive relationship for 25+ years and couldn't divorce or leave bc of the church. Eventually when I went to boarding school they separated, but didn't divorce official till a few years later when my dad was fired after conference finding out him and his wife were separated. The church is sick to make wemon stay in abusive relationships that threaten their safety and the safety of their children. Divorce is perfectly acceptable in the church if your partner committs adultery against you, but not in the case of literal violent and threatening abuse. If you leave under those circumstances and file divorce, you are the sinner. It doesn't matter what your reasons were. They still seem to think something like "talking it out", or "couple's counseling" could fix that. My dad was given 3 months to get back with his wife, or resign. What other Job would do that. My dad was abusive to both me and my mom, but I can still acknowledge that was unfair towards him. There was better reasons for him to be fired than that. A church member saw him hit me as a kid and called the conference. He got off with a single Christian counseling session, and a warning. Apparently divorce is where they draw the line, but child abuse isn't. I never spoke out as a kid bc both my parents would tell me if I did I would get taken away. I was afraid I'd never see my family again, so I never told anyone about it, and lied when asked. That's just one thing. There's a million other fucked up things the church does. My mom has gotten less fanatical, but she still hasn't left the church and works at their church school. I wish she'd just teach public. She used to substitute, and she really liked the local public school. The workload was less, and they wanted to hire her full time bc she was so good when she subbed there. In the church school she's constantly judged bc of her past divorce, and also bc she doesn't believe in senseless punishment, and has a more empathy approach that pisses off some of the more strict parents. She also got someone spread lies and stuff to get her fired this year bc she didn't shy away from teaching basic sex education. Which mind you is still from her Christian perspective, but at least bothered to try to do anything actually informative. She didn't even get very detailed but people were still upset and tried to get her fired. And like she's still pro abstinence, but at least she'll mention contraceptives. I honestly don't know what goes through these parents heads, like they think "If we tell them what a condom is, then they'll have sex" as if the condom is the thing that makes sex happen. We'll they'll have worse problems than their kid knowing about condoms, if they don't. Anyway I'm glad she's becoming more open. Like I've come out to her about being atheist, and she knows I dont agree with most of her beliefs, but she's no longer pushy about religion and respect it. She still had her beliefs, but she doesn't let them dictate how she treats people. Like she uses correct pronouns for my gay and trans friends, even if she doesn't understand it. But she gets that it's just about having basic human decency and respect for others.

[@TimSedai]

Catholic schooled for 13 years over here and thankfully they were science-friendly. In particular the Jesuits in high school really focused on critical thinking ( which interestingly led me away from the faith) so aside from believing in bible nonsense it wasn't as stifling as non-denominational Christian schools are.

[@charisma-hornum-fries]

My physics and chemistry teacher was a nun. She was madly skilled and funny.

[@MonkeyJedi99]

Speaking as an atheist, Jesuits are the one faction of Christianity I have the most respect for.

[@fotnite_]

When I was a freshman in highschool, I took a "Human Geography class" where we went to a whole bunch of different place of worship from different religions as part of a field trip for our unit on religion. Out of all of those buildings, the mosque was definitely the most beautiful.

[@pithicus52]

I looked into ACE because there is a school near where I live (USA) that is in a very small building and advertises that they teach K-12. I wondered how they could teach K-12 in such a small building. I found that ACE schools can put all of their students in one or two classrooms because they sit their students at their desks all day long reading the text books and answering questions in workbooks. The teachers don't teach; they just grade the workbooks. When the students try to go to college they not only have a bad education, but they also have no classroom skills. They have never had any real interaction with a teacher.

[@emmao6578]

I saw another comment talking about this and I just can't comprehend how anyone could invent such a dystopian perversion of a healthy class learning environment.

[@pithicus52]

@@emmao6578 I had not thought to use the word "dystopian", but it is not difficult to see the children in "1984" sitting at their desks like that.

[@elrondhubbard9127]

I was home schooled up until 11th grade because my parents were fundie christians (and I was forced to be also). That shit really messed up my social skills and self esteem. I'm 40 now and just beginning to unpack all the damage the cult of Christianity and home-schooling did to me.

[@cindyfrye3026]

congratulations on surviving Tony

[@justhannah3461]

Thank-you so much for covering this Emma!! I remember I tried to find commentary on this atrocity on YT a while ago, and it was nothing but positive reviews from Fundie parents.

[@aldebaran4154]

I bet it looked like Amazon reviews on pseudo-science/pro-creationist books: "This is great because they put GOD in it. Speak the truth!" 🙄

[@cindyfrye3026]

Hannah so glad your eyes are opened to the actual truth, I hope you help spread it too.

[@manwhoismissingtwotoenails4811]

I love how these schools also have the concept of the kid who "is too smart" like I am trying to get a grade and move on but some people at my school would challenge stuff before they were shut down or made to believe asking questions and not being satisfied with their answers meant they hated God.

[@grayaj23]

I was lucky growing up in that my 4th, 5th and 6th grade teachers all had curricula that included understanding advertising and how it worked. This was in California in the 1970s. We covered things like why bank advertisements look like Greek temples, a delivery company would have Hermes as its logo -- the idea that cultural icons were already mapped in our minds to good things, so advertisements used them because it made the ads more more effective, and that sort of thing. But the best part about it was learning why you can't trust advertising language. We learned that there's no such thing as "the best" so any company can call itself "the best". They taught about how honesty in advertising really works -- that as long as there's no standard of value being referenced, the claims are meaningless. This sort of vaguely got into how polling works, and how intentionally deceptive pollsters can push for the result they want, etc. This all sounds boneheadedly obvious to us as adults, but we were children at the time. I remember we had a contest where everyone tried to find a deceptive ad and explain to the class how it was deceptive. And in reality, I do hear grown adults who say "They can't say it's the 'best' if it's not the best. That would be false advertising!" You ask them "the best _WHAT_ exactly, and according to whose opinion?" and they don't really get the point.

[@terryjwood]

It always makes my day when there's a new video by Emma!

[@oliviascruggs7292]

Someone tell Emma that I want to do an interview about my experience let’s all of us ACE survivors get together and make one

[@randycampbell6307]

Thanks Emma, my wife looked over my shoulder and saw the plushie and was like "Send it, send it now" so expect an order soon :)

[@mirandarensberger6919]

My cat is a sleepy boy. Three cheers to Tanya for getting herself out of that. I cannot imagine how hard it must have been. The thing about parents not wanting to expose their kids to other beliefs is, how do they expect them to function in the real world as adults? It just doesn't make sense. I only hope that these kids are able to find videos like this one and other skeptical content, and also ones with solid scientific content, so they can learn to question what they are told and what science really is.

[@91722854]

25:28 or another possibility is that they have taken Pokemon's evolution to a literal sense in that pikachu has to evolve into raichu and therefore there shall no longer be any pikachu left

[@kokomelon6707]

I am currently in England sixth-form. I remember learning how to evaluate a good source and bad source multiple times. I remember a brief conversation in primary school. There was a more in depth series of lessons on it in year 7/year 8 English. Once again in year 9 science. I can't speak for all schools or students but that is just my experience. The exam boards my school used was a mix between AQA and Edexel for different subjects.

[@emmao6578]

Yes this is my thoughts too, I feel like plenty of classes gave us the basics for this kind of media/source analysis, from my memory it was mainly in history lessons. I'm really unsure why so many people feel differently, maybe we were just lucky in our school/teachers or maybe lots of people just didn't find those lessons interesting so didn't retain that knowledge, no idea the reason but it's definitely something that should already be taught in current lessons if those subjects are taught well

[@hypatian9093]

German here. When I was in 8th grade a new line of history books was introduced which included short sources to the topics (mostly texts, but some artwork, too). The teacher that year wasn't a fan - in the wrap-up of a topic we were told to read these and that was it. The next year, we had a different teacher and she used the sources, asked questions about them and led discussions. These text were of a wide variety and often showed different opinions and sides - and you learned how biased they could be. Even after decades I remember for the French Revolution there was a source by a royalist and by a Jacobin about the same event and they were so different, that it opened my eyes about partisanship and bias.

[@lamars2486]

You just described OBAMAs CORE ED PROGRAM, that the far USA alt rt threw out and push the cult of IBLP. scary. You and I were lucky.😊

[@RainAngel111]

I think the irony of the tornado creating a 747 thing is, if it happened an infinite amount of times with a slight random difference every time, mathematics tells us that eventually every possibility would happen. So, it's just as likely, as long as you continue the experiment infinitely

[@d.o.m.494]

Teaching religion in school is the same as having a subject for tooth fairies and leprechauns.

[@daliaveyani]

My homeschool curriculum used the ace books, I was in it from 15-18 but my younger sibling was in it from 11-18 and we were both insanely unprepared for anything outside of it, also the little comics in it were insane and the "bad kid" all through the books dies in a car crash. They use the word solid foundation tho, absolutely the fuck not, it was basically like no education at all.

[@devanxalethia]

I just found you about a month or less ago, you are already one of my favorite creators! You are a breath of logical air I STG.

[@samhur4294]

From Texas and not surprised the information originated from here. Great video!

[@subcitizen2012]

It's honestly all an extreme tragedy imo. The fact that this stuff is allowed on a religious basis, it's basically protected as a right, especially in Texas (I think it's the largest single market for homeschoolers in the country, I think there's about 1 million home schooled kids in Texas). Mainstream - real - education should definitely be a requirement, but thst is a political bramble in Texas. Maybe someday things will change, but for now, the education system and the politics and rogue religiosity in Texas are well established feedback loops, it's basically a pipe from their arses to their kiths and it's a shit singularity. My father has been involved with creationism for 30 years. He's even been part of a ln obscure group trying to promote it to Catholics for a while now and getting sent internationally to speak (to unreceptive international, educated Catholic audiences lol). But it's just been this lifelong saga for myself and my family, for Texas, and of course the US more broadly. Where do you think the abortion rights go? Or the voting rights? Or the treatment of immigrants? Or the gun rights? All of these are this gordian knot of nonsense. Texas is the belly of the beast of the US. Texas is a Shithole country. I'm glad I'm out of there, but I can't wait to hopefully move far far away from this god forsaken god loving country and never come back.

[@cosmicrae789]

im so glad you spoke about this! i didn't grow up religious, nor was i homeschooled but i have family who believes in NWO and other conspiracies and growing up being told the horrifying lies as truth is the source for a lot of my anxiety. i have a lot of guilt and shame for what i used to believe and have lost a lot of faith in adults in my life who thought it was ok to indoctrinate me. lots of love to you and anyone who has similar upbringings

[@kaitiebug6657]

i have, and still am apart of a strictly biblical curriculum. all of my subjects are based around biblical beliefs. i am taught that evolution is strictly false, and creationism is truth. bible is one of my subjects and counts for a large sum of my overall grade. im currently going into 11th grade, and for years i have felt my education was, and still is lacking. for the past 5 years i've been trying to convince my dad to let me attend public school. i am in America so i understand that public school can be dangerous, but i cant help but feel the soul reason for keeping me homeschooled is because he doesn't want me "exposed" to a non-christian curriculum.

[@TechyBen]

Hey Emma! Thanks for this video. Growing up in a religion (JWs), I have both sides of the arguments, and while a "true believer" at the time, gave 99% of the benefit of the doubt to evolution. Sadly, many *poor* descriptions and arguments were given to me, and many apologetics in the religion. This made it so hard. I think science needs lots more honest of their errors, to show religion to be dogmatic and backwards, so more can escape. Took me far to long to get out (cos UK science education was so bad, and they were using the 1910s examples that apologetics already proved false :P ).

[@Avigorus]

Something I think is a good idea for basically all home schooling, at least in those rare cases where there's a good reason to use it: get at least a good half-dozen kids together, even if they're from different households. Different parents can trade off for different subjects and to give each other a break, and the kids get social interaction with peers. Course, this basically means you need to trust those other parents and is kinda like a small-scale quasi-school setup, but still.

[@xErinxx]

Unless your child and everyone else’s involved is being homeschooled for social or disability reasons etc and not for anti-mainstream philosophy reasons, then yeah. But the biggest reason for kids to be homeschooled in the first place is the latter. When I was homeschooled (until age 9) I was apart of a charter school program and we’d meet up once or twice a month and have a class together so the school could make sure we were at the right level of education. At least half of those kids spouted some pretty crazy beliefs on the regular, and most of them seemed to be the children of religious extremists. They seemed super out there, to me, the (at the time indoctrinated) child of anti-vaxxer health nuts and one parent being a flat earther who believes in “the kabbal”… So yeah it would be great to be able to trade off homeschooling like you said, but in most areas that probably isn’t feasible if almost every other homeschooled kid around you is like that

[@xtinkerbellax3]

I actually think it's really important for home schooled children to socialize with kids who aren't homeschooled. I went to college with a few home schooled kids from the same pod and they were still very socially stunted.

[@annaairahala9462]

@@xtinkerbellax3 Not so much socializing with kids who aren't homeschooled, but rather kids should have many sources from which they get social interaction with peers. I think it's a bit of a stereotype that if you're homeschooled you must be socially stunted when really it's just if you're homeschooled without sources for social interaction then you'll be socially stunted. Having grown up homeschooled I knew many people who were socially stunted including myself due to that lack of interaction (although in my case it was more of a neurodivergent thing, my siblings mostly turned out fine in that regard), but I knew many from other families who handled things right that showed none of the same signs and were no different from their peers. The key difference is that these kids were engaged in more environments with which they could socialize with their peers. I don't think the school environment is specifically needed to facilitate that learning

[@yvonnehorde1097]

@@xErinxx If I could do homeschooling, I might do it with my kids but only if this leads to the national exams, such as, in the UK, GCSEs or A Levels. I would really not like them to lack behind in any way or to reduce their possibilities to get a job or a higher education afterwards.

[@eric2max]

52 years ago, my parents went to the UK from the US for a year; my dad was a professor and went to teach at University of LEDs for a year. They put their oldest son in (primary? I was 6). Got made to stand and pray to “your lord JC or get lightly thwacked with a ruler .I refused because he’s not my lord. I learned to stand and put my hands together, but not pointed up, and pretend. A teacher said it was ok. I got looked at, but it worked. The teachers were nuns I think? They wanted the appearance of conformity. Went back to the US. From age 7 to 10 was teased for not believing in JC. Some parents told their kids not to talk to me and it was ok to fight. It got a little tense when (age 10) I kept arguing my point if asked and parents started coming down teachers and I got real threats from kids (with parental direction).. A very wise teacher told me to just nod my head and let it go or I will probably get in a bad situation. -so the UK nuns were ok with me faking it, but the US system allowed parents to push kids with threat of physically force their beliefs. That teacher, a hero of mine for many reasons, taught me a lot. RIP Mr Fleming. The US has not changed! In some ways it is worse.

[@moron0000]

On an unrelated note: i love the channel symbol and little opening sequence at the start. It's short, elegant and has presence and a personality. I love it!

[@charlottesimmonds]

I had a similar kind of education and somehow I managed to become a professional scientist. It was hard and to say that I have gaps in my knowledge is the understatement of the year. I don't feel embarrassed anymore, my coping mechanism was to turn it into a joke, but it's been a long road and I don't wish it on anyone else Edit: not homeschooled but went to a fundie school where they used these kind of texts, and "alternative science" was taught

[@cindyfrye3026]

Charlotte, a big congratulations. I did not have home schooling but did have a college education by fundamentalists and I taught their program for 8 + years. They didn't pay well. I got a computer programming certificate at a local junior college and it changed my career. It was a lot longer until I could begin to change how all of that affected my life.

[@charlottesimmonds]

@@cindyfrye3026 thank you so much! I'm sorry, I notice now how my comment was misleading. I wasn't homeschooled but went to a fundie school where these kind of texts were used. I was also taught "alternative christian science", which would be hilarious if it wasn't so harmful. Congrats on furthering your education by your own means!

[@fotnite_]

The funny thing about the idea of space and time being separate was that it almost entirely comes from Newton. Descartes and many others in his time believed they weren't separate, and though it wasn't quite in the same way we understand it now, it was a lot closer than Newton's understanding.

[@renatocorvaro6924]

So unrelated to the video itself, but one of the ads that played before this video was for Matt Walsh's hateful garbage movie. So I reported that but obviously I don't expect anything to be done about it. Great stuff as always Emma, keep being awesome.

[@ikhnatonosiris7166]

At this rate they'll be teaching flat earth "science" in schools.

[@llt8101]

I was home schooled for a while and then sent to Christian school. I had a very hard time getting along with my fellow students and still have a very hard time getting along with people outside of my immediate family. As an adult I have been trying to fill in the huge gaps in my scientific education with books. It's hard because I don't often even know what I missed.

[@cindyfrye3026]

It is so hard to know what you don't know. I hope you keep trying to fill in the gaps.

[@llt8101]

@@cindyfrye3026 Yep. Still trying.

[@michaeloud6044]

I had KZbin in the “mini screen” mode and thought you were holding an “Alexa” half this video 😂. Turns out it’s a coffee cup and that makes vastly more sense lol

[@MicahChartier]

I was an ACE student and it hurt my ability to go to college. I keep being told to go back and get my education but responsibilities the family I was encouraged to have at a young age kept me from finishing my degree. It has held me back and kept me from moving forward many times in my life. Thank you for covering this.

[@cindyfrye3026]

Micah, I hope you get the opportunity to finish your education and are able to move forward. There are many free learning programs available. My niece and her husband went to Job Corps and finished high school. They got job placement help too. Best of luck.

[@MicahChartier]

@@cindyfrye3026 Well I am currently the lead student database programmer at a midsized university. I think at this point it would not help me move forward. So I learn for me and not for a degree

[@cindyfrye3026]

@@MicahChartier that makes total sense, good luck with your IT work.

[@Elementalism.]

So i was unfortunate enough to have gone to an ACE school back in 2001-2003. While it wasn't so bad back then, it has definitely gotten worse. To the point where the founder of the ACE school i went to, that i am still in contact with, is appalled by what it has become. And yes, if any lawmaker (any country) is reading this, please, from someone who has had this ACE education: please ban it. It took me years to unlearn and catch up to the rest. I did not get to pursue the higher levels of education that i should have been able to achieve. And even to this day, (in my 30s) i find that things i was taught under ACE aren't actually true. This isn't a "science is more likely to be true" This isn't "science is equally true" This isn't "chrisianity respectfully disagrees with science" This is and has become a Christian fundemental extremist, America is the only great country, trump won 2020 style conspiratorial brainwashing operation. It would literally not surprise me if in the next editions of their textbooks trump will be at the center of half of it, another quarter is full of Qanon beliefs, 15% being how trump won 2020 (which is somehow now science) with hopefully at least the remaining 10% being the left over truth that they have no issue with. Now with my opinions about and experiences with ACE out of the way... I have also been homeschooled by a christian family, for about 4 years, and that could be genuinely be a model for how homeschooling is done, should there be a need to homeschool. (still avoid if at all possible) We got the same school books as those in regular school, along with books from courses by recognized educational institutions. The Bible was not one of those, and christianity was no longer taught (just in church on sundays) Everything i was taught in homeschool was perfectly in line with the schools i would later go to. It did a lot to right the wrongs of ACE, even though unfortunately it ultimately was not enough to get me back on track for higher education.

[@rembrandt972ify]

Fred Hoyle gave us one of the most ridiculous fallacies ever. He also gave us stellar nuclear synthesis, a huge achievement.

[@RichWoods23]

And yet you always see the creationists refer to him as Sir Fred Hoyle because they love their arguments from authority, even as they're butchering his ideas.

[@rembrandt972ify]

@@RichWoods23 Everyone makes stupid mistakes. Newton and Einstein were famous for some of the mistakes they made.

[@RichWoods23]

@@rembrandt972ify Some of their mistakes outlived them. It's only to be expected.

[@SteinGauslaaStrindhaug]

I really appreciate that you put the green dino on the starboard side and the red one on the port side! ;)

[@jaysonwohnne]

Great show Emma. Looking forward to more.

[@scyz2807]

Wonderful content! My sister is an evangelical Christian, did not home school her children, but I think she endorses home schooling. She recently mentioned good people being brought up to heaven while the "bad" people are left behind. It sounded like she thought this was going to happen soon. But then Yashua (Jesus) also said that the end times were coming soon - 2K years ago! I guess the Christian clock is off by just a bit! lol

[@cindyfrye3026]

you should read the ridiculous bits of zany Christian mix up that Dan Brown wrote in his book, The Di Vinci Code. It is just about as much nonsense. At least his book is funny.

[@VW777]

Well don't laugh too soon, you don't know what is on the other side yet; or what the future holds. Can you explain how you were formed in your mother's womb? Where did the bones and hair come from? The same God that created you also has a plan for your eternal soul, don't become like the mockers the Bible speaks of. Pick up the Bible and read it for yourself! God bless.

[@scyz2807]

@@VW777 God has spoken to me and told me NOT to worship him/her. I should, instead, do my best to make this world a better place - in every meaning of the word. God's voice also told me that what we have here on Earth IS Heaven! It is up to us to not turn it into Hell!