Comicsgate Doesn't Understand Manga

Ooh, boy. Starting 2024 with a spicy one.
Y'all know this is just my opinion, right?
Chapters:
0:00 EVS Says Something Really Dumb
1:29 Disclaimers
2:02 ComicsGate Lore
3:24 "Wokeness"
5:03 Ethan Van Sciver
5:51 Comics MATTER w/Ya Boi Zack
6:19 This is Cultural, Not Political
7:08 The Comicsgaters Have a Point
8:03 Manga is Crushing Western Comics
8:21 The RippaVerse
10:34 EVS Failed at Edgy Humor
11:12 A Bit of Validity to EVS's Comments
11:57 Superheroes are Boring
12:31 The "Universe" Problem
14:22 "Wokeness" Continued
16:01 Bait & Switch
18:11 How the New Superman Pitch Probably Went
19:15 Grooming?
19:48 DeCoNStrUcTiOn
20:10 The "Ugly Women" Debacle
30:50 Manga is Better... Here's Why
31:20 Manga Has So Much Variety
32:49 "Manga is Easier to Draw"
33:56 The Form Factor of Manga is Superior
35:00 LGBT Content in Manga Feels Less Tokenized
36:36 A Lot of Manga Artists are Women... So What?
37:16 Content For Everybody is Content For Nobody (READ PINNED COMMENT)
39:25 Manga Actually Have ENDINGS
39:59 Manga isn't Perfect and Has Problems As Well
41:44 Wrap Up
42:40 Log Off
44:06 Ending
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#comicsgate #manga

[@johnbrockiii]

ADDITIONAL COMMENTS: At 39:25 , there was supposed to be a South Park clip, but it was removed due to copyright. You can see the clip here for the full context: kzbin.info/www/bejne/b6WzpKlmZaiUl8k As an addendum to the "ugly women debacle" segment, I am aware of the Stellar Blade discourse and would have mentioned it, but this video was rendered right as that discussion was happening. It seems Asia knows how to use their scanning tech appropriately. Would like to add that all the guys drooling over Shin Jae-un (hey me too - she's beautiful) are also the guys that tend to believe in that "over 25 wall" stuff the red-pillers talk about it and turns out, she's 32. Sooooo... just sayin'. Also, good lord - what did Apex Legends do to Aerith?! There was a minor audio sync issue in the latter bits of this video. My apologies. I will get that sorted by next week. I know, I'm more annoyed by it than you. That brief mention about localizers was before everything went down with Jamie Marchi and looking into it, I might just have to do a whole video on localizers. Also, don't buy the Persona 3 remaster/remake while I'm on this subject. That dig at Vaush at the end was in reference to a cut segment where I went over the JoCat incident and was upset that it made me agree with that nonce. And I am 100% serious about being down to throwdown with that cretin. (LEGALLY - I will sign whatever documents necessary. There also seems to be a civil war brewing between the EVS stans and the Rippaverse simps. And it seems to be imploding the whole comicsgate movement more and more as it goes on. I don't care. Whatever, man. Just enjoy comics/manga.

[@CollegeDroputPowerpoints]

I want to apologize on Van Scivers behalf. Ive followed the man for years along with ya boi Zac and Eric July and I want to say manga and comics can coexist. Just ignore people like this they dont define actual comic goers.

[@TheHapaDon]

EVS tends to shoot out his mouth without doing any research. His worst offense was shitting on the Hong Kong protesters treating them like antifa rioters and not understanding the HK law that allows China to extradite basically any into mainland China where they will most likely be "disappeared". He calls manga easy to draw which is true but it is due to the much higher page rate delivery requirements which Western arts don't have the ability to produce monthly, much less weekly deliveries. Is EVS going to shit of Jack Kirby for his "simple" art of the day? No, Kirby had to deliver books on time. Manga doesn't tend to cover "superheros" because for the most part Japanese audiences don't give a shit about superheros. Frankly I find a comic book about a robotic frog kind of fucking lame. Yes, EVS can draw, but Western comics are a different media than manga. One of the reasons Western audiences are gravitating to manga is they don't have to wait 6 months between books. There is far more story than 20-24 page floppy. Female audiences also like manga as there is far more variety in storytelling that Western comics. Western comics used to cover far more sci fi, westerm, horror and drama, but is now primarily focused on people in tights and capes. Western comics killed themselves and it dying before the wokies took over in in the mid-2010s. The leftist did nothing but put the nails in the coffin and prevented any possible recovery of the industry.

[@bravo0105]

evs is his own worst enemy and is no less petty, spiteful, and vindictive than those that shoved him out of dc. marvel and dc had a large part in strangling themselves with the collectible boom and bust in the 1990's from which they never recovered...at the same time manga slipped into the US market. What really did marvel and dc in, externally, was when manga translations were no longer mirror flipped and were published in the original right-binding format with cost savings passed on to customers...their sections in bookstores grew exponentially from that point.

[@trebot9292266]

my favorite bit is he's just the artist. he writes nothing and acts like he's anywhere in the know.

[@bravo0105]

comicsgate is nearly as irrelevant as marvel and dc floppies as it devolved into a circular firing squad of infighting and witch hunts that mirrored the marvel/dc stalinist whisper network it called out. evs was shoved out of dc for open support of the Orange Man...in many regards he's become the thing he hates as he's no less combative as the types who ran him out of dc. He loves conflict and ended up turning on early allies and supporters, limiting his appeal and potential audience. evs goes out of his way to make enemies of others that initially have no grievance with him and often agree with his criticisms of corporatist entertainment. Regarding manga, evs clearly resents it and his hostility is likely fed by envy of its wild success and mass appeal that American comics once had.

[@johnbrockiii]

His twitter feed really does read like some teenage girl's gossip. Dude honestly needs to log off. Maybe work on his comic he keeps pushing instead. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[@hyperkaiju9721]

I think CG is clearly less relevant than marvel and DC garbage floppies. As bad as the big 2 are, there are still more people buying those books than buying CG books. Comics is a niche hobby already, CG is a tiny sliver within that niche.

[@lodunost]

I think maybe the people in Comics Gate are reading the wrong genera of Manga or Manhua. Some styles are easier to draw. But you look at Berserk, The Hero Who Seeks Revenge Shall Exterminate With Darkness, Some of the My Hero Academia panels, some of the Toyoko Ghoul panels. A for anime, MIDNIGHT EYE GOKU, Dragon's Heaven which drew every grain of fucking sand. AKIRA or RECORD OF LODOSS WAR. There are even older manga that are incredibly detailed and the themes are wild. I just think that these kinds of conversations are small minded. Comics have changed. An some great comics are coming out. The problem is that people want to be told a story and not preached to. The style of art in the story doesn't matter so much. But the message and story does. There are many different styles of drawing Anime, manga, and stuff and genres but the old heads refuse to see anything past what the mainstream shows. Mainly because it's cost effective to do it in that style and saves animators and artist time and money. I wish that people would go back to making comics and art and stop with this political bullshit. I want to good story not told what to say or directed to be a specific way or use a specific word.

[@Sakuyamon]

Its not even that manga dont include realism. Some mangas are realistic, some look darn close to america comics. And its a dumb statement to start with because a lot of american and european comics got very simplistic styles too. Just look at "Peanuts"... button eyes and stripes for hair. It would be narrow minded to call either "too simple" or "too detailed" since every artist is different and have different styles. Sure, anime often have the big eyed and simplicity, but wests animation has simplified cartoons just as much. Like Gumball. I wish people wouldnt try to sit on high horses...There are great works in both manga and comic, but if one is to narrow minded to check it out, one will miss great stories and great art. I can agree with comics gate that I dont want to be preached at, but I dont want this superiority attitude either...-_- We should celebrate manga and comics together, not divide like this.

[@MasterIceyy]

Even if you look at REDice with their manhwa like Solo Levelling, Omni reader, etc they have some of the best digital art you'll see especially considering the chapters are released weekly. I'd like these idiots to go read the legend of the northern blade and tell me that shit isn't some of the coolest art you've seen in your life

[@lodunost]

@@MasterIceyy I have not heard of, "Legend of the Northern Blade." I shall pick that up and add it to my collection. Have either of you seen panels for the original JAPAN only manga for, "Jurassic Park?" It's super rare and in fact someone here on KZbin managed to track one down after all these years and upload himself flipping through it. Very cool relic of the past that is sadly lost to time and limited release. Art is meant to be subjective. Art is amazing and should be celebrated. Currently one I'm reading is called. "Namae No Nai Kaibutsu." Cool art, great storytelling about a boy growing into a man. Falling in love and being consumed by this spider and transformed. Amazing work that shouldn't be dismissed.

[@MasterIceyy]

@@lodunost Legend of the Northern blade is a korean acton Manhwa, it's about a boy who is part of the northern sect, who kept China/Korea safe from an invading force for centuries until they betray his father who sacrifices himself so his son can live, it than fellows the son learning his fathers martial arts, and uncovering the secret of why they betrayed their cause. The action scenes are drawn so incredibly well, that you can almost see the movement coming through the screen, the artist even has his own youtube where he uploads himself drawing the panels. I agree, art is amazing and should be celebrated in all forms, I've read and fallen in love with stories that had art that wasn't "Good" art, but the intention, and meaning behind it conveyed so much of the story itself. I don't know why dudes like Ethan have to try to disparage Manga/Manhwa art as being lesser than Comic book art, they can both be good. They also shouldn't criticise considering one of the most famous comic book artists ever was Rob Liefeld

[@AllyFin]

And there are many manhwas, where many panels are like standalone digital art pieces themselves. All while being produced weekly.

[@Nasaratsu]

"Manga is teeny boppper"... Looks at Berserk

[@lunarvision]

That’s like a big brain saying “Music is teeny booper…” Such a low IQ take.

[@totomen666]

Manga has it's own genres, yes there is genre for teenagers and girls, but most of it aimed at more broad audience.

[@MUCKEY2000]

... "manga" fans don't understand manga.

[@2265Hello]

The reason why manga is better than comics plain and simple they make actual stories and not just the same type of stories over and over again (well at least not the degree of western comics). And more importantly they are more accessible most major western comics aren’t the most accessible and last I checked over priced. And indie stuff takes some digging and most ppl don’t bother to look for that stuff.

[@CollegeDroputPowerpoints]

If you mean modern comics yes but in general no. I think it's hypocritical to say manga isn't repetitive when it has terms for reoccurring things like beach episode or filler arc. I am not going that far

[@2265Hello]

@@CollegeDroputPowerpoints I’m talking about modern comics and yes i addressed ,lightly, that manga has a similar problem

[@bravo0105]

One of the things that's key to manga's success is that, with few exceptions, series are concluded and sunset before they overstay their welcome. Look at dc and marvel...they're limping along on a core of characters from the 1930's and 1960's. NOTHING lasts forever and all good things come to an end...otherwise the Fonz jumps the shark and a zombie of something that was once great stumbles on into irrelevance.

[@MasterIceyy]

@@CollegeDroputPowerpoints Beach episodes are more a trope than a repetitive story, although you're correct, there are a lot of repetitive stories especially with genre's like isekai and fantasy, but they're mainly drawn by the same person who wrote the novel, this makes it easier to get published as the companies don't have to pay for additional staff

[@trollheyman2703]

Ethan has a brother named Noah van sciver who is also a comics artist. And noah seem so much more normal, relatable and level headed. Ethan has some sort of mental health problems from being terminally online.

[@johnbrockiii]

I can't help but love Ethan's antics. He's so nutty, I can't look away. I'll have to look into Noah and see what he's worked on, though. Thanks for watching.

[@bigman7856]

The culture war and it's consequences have been a disaster for the human race. For real though, It's been an irrelevant for YEARS now, but we still feel it's effects to this day. Look at where all the original combatants are now. Most have made amends. I envision a world where everyone can have their own catered media and enjoy it in peace. I feel like we've nearly reached this point. CBpro is doing his thing, and good on him. He has an odd take on manga, but I dont expect someone of his vintage to really get into it. younger right wingers seem to be on point with this(for the most part), like ItsAGundam or Asmon if you consider them right wing.

[@stuart6478]

Yes superheros are boring. I see you went down the comics gate hole early on and ditched to roast them like I did. They complain to much and it was focused then it fell apart. Comics are garbage for exactly the reason you pointed out. Black ink is actually hells expensive which is why color is so evenly costly. Color doesn't improve the reading experience I would even say it hurts it.

[@metal87power]

It's true. Japanese attitude towards superheroes is awkward. They are stronger at martial art based shonen adventures than superheroic stories. Recent adaptation of Marvel characters is a proof, Spider-man adaptation made in power rangers style is another reason, even My Hero Academia is strange. Saitama is at least straightforward satire/parody so Japanese sense of humor works.

[@LittleJohnnyBrown]

I don't think adding more weirdness would hurt a genre that begin as cringe.

[@resistancepublishing]

Using Wikipedia to get an understanding of something is like reading tea leaves and chicken bones to predict the future. Not very educated information

[@mintx1720]

The problem with comics is it has to compete with things like youtube, which comics will never win. The only thing they can do is charge their own customer base lots of money. Same with books really, unless they can cut cost by not paying the creators, book prices will still be ridiculously high because nobody is reading them.

[@CollegeDroputPowerpoints]

Hey Stuart if you see this you mind not spamming your ramblings in comments? Thank you

[@JTMusicbox]

Never heard that reference material at the front before. Can’t decide if it’s intentionally made up to incense people as a false flag or if the guy is actually that ignorant. Both types are out there for sure but this is so on the nose that my incredulity kicks into high gear. I’ve heard that statically human females have IQs with a narrower bell curve so that fewer are idiots and geniuses and men are more widely scattered but I’ve met plenty of genius women so who’s to say. Also manga is such a wide net that narrow comments on it are also silly.

[@bravo0105]

evs is bitter at the wild success of manga in the US and how it's displaced American floppies in the market. He knows that floppies will never claw back the market marvel and dc ceded to manga and that infuriates him...his stuff isn't going to have the mass appeal to where retailers like target will carry it.

[@The8BitChampion]

A few months ago EVS would have responded to this video but now he's to obsessed with Rippa and Yellowflash to see anything else.

[@johnbrockiii]

fr dude acts like a teenage girl

[@psychedelicacyfu4002]

Hi John, I friended you on Twitter under another user name because f u ck yt. Hope to see you on there more often. We need more people like you in the Indiesphere!

[@stuart6478]

Ha ha the funny thing about not making new characters is that they literally exist in the books that sell so its not just stupid its evidence of a failing business.

[@Wandermidget]

Let's face it. Marvel and DC are just excuses to keep merchandise pumping out, because while the comics side of Marvel and DC mostly suck, they still make billions off the lunch boxes they sell to children. And many of the issues people complain about "comics" are mostly associated with the blunders of Marvel and DC. That would be like me associating all of manga with Weekly Shonen Jump. Once you move past them, you'll find out comic books are just as varied in art style and genre as manga are, and 99% of them have a beginning, middle, and end, just like manga. Comics may be niche now and manga is mainstream, but that doesn't mean all comics aren't worth reading or are irredeemable, just most of Marvel and DC's current catalog.

[@EmoEmu]

Where's the lie though? ;)

[@stuart6478]

Oh man the regular size book is definitely a reason I do not buy comics unless I'm buying the series . And BTW mister miracle which was great, fell completely apart by extending the universe past its actually end point. I hate America's whole never ending story garbage. It needs to stop ha ha. Marvel is going to fall apart so bad people could easily hate it in the next few years. Like repulsed. How long will people hold on to grampas childhood?

[@psychedelicacyfu4002]

Lol

[@RubyKing1997]

Yoooo

[@YumegakaMurakumo]

KZbin keeps censoring me. Are you on Twitter by any chance? We need more people like you.

[@johnbrockiii]

twitter.com/johnbrockiii1

[@mid-westmusic3472]

I thought evs pronounced manga in a decent fashion.

[@johnbrockiii]

bro, dude literally said man-gah. It's pronounced mahn - ga. I know it's a nitpick, but it drives me nuts when people pronounce it like that.

[@mid-westmusic3472]

@@johnbrockiii I see your point.

[@mid-westmusic3472]

⁠​⁠​⁠@@johnbrockiii both of them relegating manga readers to only being one kind of demographic or intellect. When comics and manga have so many different kinds of genres and is more accessible than ever before. is really egregious. I stepped in to soon on the pronunciation of manga part. Comics is really in its death throes and it seems weird for EVS just to do this.

[@nintai6656]

Just more proof that the further you are from political neutral the crazier you are, but can we stop telling people to touch grass? They have touched too much grass, leave Marry Jane alone!

[@brokenman58]

Wtf is "comicsgate"? It never existed. It was women complaining about their bad writing being called out being sexist. XD

[@firstamericanmanga6827]

it started out as some professionals who were kicked from marvel and dc for their political views doing their own thing. now they are just becoming a bunch of assholes.

[@johnbrockiii]

Idk, I guess it's like "GamerGate" - a buzzword that meant nothing that caused permanent damage to the industry.

[@TrevorNickell]

Getting mad at EVS over not getting Manga is like getting mad at your dad for not getting how to play a modern video game.

[@yapeseguy9261]

many CGers in EVS's own chat tear his ass up for shitting on manga and anime. its hilarious.

[@johnbrockiii]

Fair. But, y'know, like... content. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[@yapeseguy9261]

oh well then by all means@@johnbrockiii

[@AllyFin]

Ehh, depends how old the dad is in your example.

[@JustAnotherDave75]

I know you aren't big on American comics, but there have been some awesome female comic writers. Louise Simonson, and Devin Grayson are renowned and celebrated as solid writers. Nocenti took over Daredevil after Frank Miller's run. She was writing when I got into Daredevil.

[@johnbrockiii]

Thanks! I'll go check 'em out!

[@Umm62]

Ethan don't represent all of CG. CG artist and writers mostly Didn't leave, they was politically discriminated against and pushed out. No different than current day Hollywood. If your working for DC, Marvel, Hollywood your opinions on Twitter can only be Leftist or end up being cancelled. HOW MANY examples do you need?

[@jimathybindlenim6359]

Says the left and the right are constantly whining. Says that everyone should chill. Spends 45 minutes whining. No grass was touched

[@Umm62]

Eric july 1. He is not a conservative, he is a libertarian. 2. Is not Comicsgate 3. Has hired a elite art editor recently. 4. Has hired 2 sister writers that are Liberals. Eric dont politicaly discriminate like the main stream.

[@stuart6478]

I have never seen so many men cry than in Manga. Stop. I haven't seen an adult anime since the 90s. It's kind of gross

[@stuart6478]

But comics are for children aren't they?

[@nickypool415]

It's a medium for everyone ​@@stuart6478

[@BasementPepperoni]

Your oversimplification of "woke" is just as bad as CG's oversimplification of Manga.

[@piperian3962]

No it isn’t

[@BasementPepperoni]

@@piperian3962 Oh? Please, explain then if you will

[@Umm62]

Agreed.

[@johnbrockiii]

Hey, man video was already reaching 50 minutes. Can't go over the etymological history every single word and phrase of modern parlance without the duration of the video feeling excessive. And, yeah - there's a bit more too it, but the video was more about EVS's dumb-dumb comments on manga, not the history of comicsgate. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[@Riftmaker17]

Manga sucks balls, the glory days of manga are over, if you followed manga for a long time you would notice that today's manga is just copy pasta of old manga written for modern times the stories are exactly the same just with different characters.

[@firstamericanmanga6827]

the genre i cannot stand right now is isekai where the normal person is transported in (insert alternate dimension here). its so dumb and over done. i love the 80s and 90s stuff.

[@Riftmaker17]

@@firstamericanmanga6827 There is 0 originality in Manga everything is copy paste from the old stuff this is why they are able to spew out so many mangas so fast.

[@firstamericanmanga6827]

@@Riftmaker17 tell me you dont know anything about manga and the process without telling me. you are retarded

[@GeromeSmith-me9im]

Yet manga still eating western comics lunches