Commander Bad Habits You Need to Quit | The Command Zone 507 | Magic: The Gathering Commander EDH

[@Areinu]

Playing at Sorcery Speed, Not apologizing for playing the game - A story related to those things. Once I played a game of Commander where I was in the lead, and I knew that if I survive the next rotation I would win. One of the opponents was playing Korvold. He had nothing on his board, and played Korvold. I had a removal for him, but since he had nothing else I let it live. Then the player proceed to put some other cards on the table, dark ritual, and went off, pumping the Korvold to 27 power, and then he wanted to equip boots to Korvold to give him haste. I had no flying blockers. At that point I played my removal. The opponent basically table flipped, that I should have removed his Korvold as soon as it was played, that I shouldn't have wasted everyone's time by letting him pump Korvold, and that I'm breaking the game for everyone. At that point I wanted to keep up my removal for a bigger threat, as 2 more players would still play, and they had good board states. I only had limited number of answers, and I knew I would need them. And once he played all the pieces needed to loop Korvold there was no good place to play removal, as he potentially could have had protection. The moment he went to equip boots he actually dropped shield and tapped out all his mana, making it a perfect point to attack. I didn't feel bad about it, I didn't apologize when he god mad about it, and when he started to call me a tryhard. I just told him my reasoning, and agreed that I probably made a mistake by not killing Korvold on sight(as you should ALWAYS do), but it's not like I could take it back at that point. It was 2 years ago, or so, and to this day he won't play in a pod with me. I still stand by my opinion that keeping up the removal is just standard proper magic, and not "tryharding at commander".

[@goonerbear8659]

You made a good threat assessment from what you knew at the time. I do that kind of thing quite a bit with my Hinata deck. I at least let my opponents know first to not adjust the game state until the attacking player has declared attackers. Just so they don't do something like scoop or tick down their life totals before I save the table with March of Swirling Mist (which left that guy open to a deadly counterattack) or Disorder in the Court (which was step 1 of the plan to live until I had a giant damage spell, which I got in a Comet Storm).

[@yggdrasilraphael4815]

This is just how you should play (and I’m not even good at Magic 😅).

[@mightyone3737]

Yeah, that Korvold player sounds like a moron, it's 100% the right play to wait until you won't be able to act to prevent damage to you if you wait any longer, but not any sooner so that you prevent damage to an opponent. This is why people love Swords and hate sorcery speed options, you can exile a Blightsteel and save your bacon, and you can also let that Blightsteel eliminate two other opponents before you kill it if you're lucky.

[@Xynic.7391]

No reason to kill it until it's coming at you. Let him take down your opponents for you lol

[@TheRealMonstaa]

That guy sounds like a sore loser to me lol. I think it's only good for you if he doesn't wanna play with you! Saves you the trouble of dealing with his childish tantrums. Great play on the removal though! You did it just perfectly, wasting the opponents resources and all :D

[@brningpyre]

Episode starts at 3:23.

[@austenplant3144]

Not all heroes wear capes

[@DarkPikachuYTV]

@@austenplant3144 doesn’t the flash not wear one if am not mistaken

[@Justadadonthetok]

Genuine question about ads and sponsorships because I'm not savvy to the KZbin rules or sponsorship rules. But is there anything against just doing all the sponsorship babble at the end of the video vs the beginning? I end up 100% always fast forwarding to when the content supposedly starts.

[@JakeAce13]

@@Justadadonthetok If sponsors do their research right they will ask for engagement statistics or find that out themselves. And it turns out - at least from what I have read and heard in videos so take it with a grain of salt - that sponsors at the end of the video are skipped more often than in the beginning and the best engagement usually is in mid rolls since people tend to be engaged with other things or too lazy to skip mid rolls. Long story short what speaks against sponsorings at the end is that they are easier to skip and therefore create less engagement and less engagement usually means less profit for the sponsored channel

[@schrottinator]

@@Justadadonthetok Putting them at the end usually means that people just stop watching the video.

[@Kleion_RFB]

CZ: "Don't apologise for playing the game." Me, a Canadian: "I'm sorry, I don't know what you mean."

[@mattmmb]

Sorry bud. Board wipe...

[@dracon501]

There are times you will see some bad blood play out in a commander game. Player 1 will non stop target player 2 and finally player 2 will bust out a card that has to be countered by player 3 or 4.

[@timmyg316]

My Canadian blood doesn't let me do this. How do you just not apologize. I'm sorry, but I disagree!

[@ryanwillson2751]

Same but British

[@donvielenio8956]

"Sorry for taking so long, and no, you won't get another upkeep soon." --Casting your 7th Extra Turn Spell in row in an Edric deck.

[@FluffyTurbo]

My group always goes "I'm sorry" before doing a game changing play and always someone goes "no your not" they respond "I know" and we laugh about it other good ones is "in response I will cry"

[@hamblance5938]

Whenever there’s a big play with no responses, my pod likes to say “sadness resolves”

[@PalidFingers]

In my group when someone does a game changing play I go "In response, I 'll tap these two lands and look you in the face"

[@allenyates3469]

I play to make big game changing plays more than I do to win. The only time I apologize if my Reaper King deck combos off and destroys all targetable permanents on the board. This obviously makes players salty but it's the only reason I run reaper king. "Sorry, guys. But I'm still doing this."

[@lucasbakeforero426]

I will cry is a classic.

[@definitelybenny]

Some fun ones from my friend group: In response I tap two lands to cast These Hands Crying is a free action Before I pass priority, I give you a disappointed look.

[@TheRandomeDud3]

Bad Habit / pet peeve: having conversations that drown out what people are playing. Too many times I've been in a game where the other players are engulfed in a conversation and not paying attention to what's being played. If you're not paying attention to what I am doing, I will clearly say what I am playing and if your conversation is more important, then I'll assume that my stuff resolves. Don't be upset that you didn't bother to interact with my massacre wurm / natural affinity combo.

[@nomizak]

My pet peeve is when someoen comes up and starts talking to a player for 20 minutes. We are all done with our turns and we are waiting on them to do their turn but they just keep talking. Its annoying to have to say something because then I/we feel like the bad guy for making them stop their conversation. Another pet peevee is when you end a game and the person starts doing trades and takes like 20+ minutes. I was in a pod recently where we finished a game and the guy said he wanted to play again. So we waited like 20 to 30 minutes.(the guy went through at least 2 or 3 binders. At the end the guy said he wasnt going to play with us and decided to play with the guys who he was trading with. That left us with only 2 players because our fourth had already left. Me and the other guy just left because all the pods were full and it was too close to closing to find a new player or two and have a game.

[@Kazz1187]

@@nomizak brutal

[@knoble4797]

My playgroup will know who to blame when this happens next game night

[@FelipeSantos-kj7pj]

Thia happen to me and i fell só anger with that...

[@BorealGames]

A group I used to play with would do this, mind you they were all much closer friends than I was to them and they all worked together too, but we would be playing and they'd be busy talking to the point of not playing the game. Even as I loudly announced my steps and stuff by the time I ended my turn we would all be sitting there for someone to go because they didn't realize my turn had come and gone. I don't play with them anymore lol

[@RazgrizAce67]

I'm a big fan of saying out loud, "Untap, upkeep, draw" at the beginning of turn to help remember. Although a lot of times it sounds like "Unta-pkee-dra" like Kyle Hill does.

[@frorociousexpress]

I started playing about a month ago, I came from yugioh so I have a habit of going "Untap, standby, draw"

[@ancientsequence]

@@frorociousexpress mee too 🤣

[@e6staffsargeify]

The more I hear Kyle say it the more I start saying it like that too lmao.

[@derianardor]

"untap-unkeep-ungabunga" my friends kept saying it then suddenly found myself doing it

[@reb286]

My friends and I had a dumb version of this where we’d put a b in front of every word. Buntap, bupkeep, braw. Started as a joke but eventually we’d just say it at the start of every turn without thinking lol. Makes me smile whenever I think about it

[@gamerscare]

The worst habit of opponents I play against regularly is playing a single player game. They never tell the table what they're doing and just expect people to know what their cards do and when their turn is over.

[@moedark4390]

oh man, ya the guys that are too lazy to state the name of the card they are casting or what step theyre on.

[@gamerscare]

@@moedark4390 They don't run interaction and play like no one else does

[@raphaelkroger3141]

Well i used to tell my playgroup everything i do while doing it and what my cards can do. But often they simply didnt't listen and engaging in private conversations. And having to repeat almost everything you do every turn annoys the hell out of me. So i dont repeat myself anymore. Be respectful and pay attention like you expect others to.

[@coddmodd]

I have a habit of reading/explaining every card. For most

[@imnotacat5299]

​@@raphaelkroger3141 Yes that's annoying, but that's a completely different situation and not at all the subject here. We are talking about the people that literally just tap mana and cast cards without making a single sound. Some people even pass turns by just making a hand gesture.

[@danmorgan7775]

I have to admit my worst habit is missing my own triggers. People are usually quite helpful when it happens and it really only disadvantages me so it's probably not the worst one to have but that is still the one I want to resolve to be better at in 2023.

[@r4nd0m1zer2]

I noticed that the better one knows his deck the less likely he is to miss triggers. Thinking about how cards are used and why their in the deck increases playspeed as well. Pre thinking a turn also helps. I always follow the board state and re-evaluate my optimal course of actions during my turn according to changes that occur in real time. Thanks to that it usually takes me less than 20 seconds for my turns before turns with multiple shuffles before combat steps start happening.

[@Blakkichan151]

Me too, I have ADHD and the struggle is definitely real sometimes but it is definitely something I want to get better at!!

[@ODIRGO]

You could use more cards with activated or ETB effects (that you conciuosly decide when to use), instead of so many cards that activate by themselves at certain moments in the game. I've also noticed a funny thing about players that missed their own triggers constantly, they tend to play decks that require a lot of attention to multiple triggers at a time, for example, all my friends with that kind of problem play Izzet/spellslinger as their prefered deck strategy. Most of the times, the rest of the table end up telling them how to use their own decks (while they are distracted with their celphone or something similar.)

[@ODIRGO]

@@r4nd0m1zer2 people with tons of decks tend to forget how to use them more often than people with only a few of decks.

[@SC_Silver_99]

I occasionally miss my triggers when I'm playing a deck I just built but I after getting a feel of the deck I don't miss them afterwards.

[@ODIRGO]

I have a friend that once played the Phage + Fractured Identity combo and when he won, he kept apologizing to the rest of the table (he seemed sincerely embarazed). I told him he doesn't have to apologize for a combo that he INTENTIONALLY put in his deck. If he feels like apologizing to everyone for doing those kind of plays, then he just shouldn't put those cards in his decks to begin with.

[@martinheraud1744]

What do you mean, phage + identity is so fun !

[@TinyLegs15243]

The attack Craig on the checklist was a nice touch lmao

[@avatarofpapermagic]

And also great advice 😂

[@danielscott9960]

I literally had to pause the video to stop laughing when I spotted that

[@craigmoen1430]

Can confirm that this is a rule everywhere.

[@ijuhi]

Never forget to attack Craig

[@skyraker7489]

With regards to token representation, I find having a standardized 'language' or protocol for how to treat token tracking helps immensely. In my case, dice placement matters- top left of the card is number, middle is counters, bottom right is P/T, and have all freeform tokens follow that method.

[@jehansilva9268]

I love infinitokens as a salt mitigator. When I would usually get a bit salty, I find that enjoying myself by creating goofy tokens takes my mind off of it

[@OmegaMTG]

I've gotten in the habit of when the turn is passed to me, I verbalize each phase as I do them "Untap, upkeep, draw". I guest stream fairly frequently and it just makes the show stream smoother if you declare your actions and steps.

[@Dragon_Fyre]

It also helps to verbalize the end of your turn clearly. You ever have everyone just talking and joking for like 5 mins until someone ask whose turn it even is because one player never announced they were done their turn or no one heard them. It really slows the game down.

[@QWERTY-du4hc]

It's a good way to remind yourself to check what you have.

[@moedark4390]

thats how its supposed to be done

[@moedark4390]

@@Dragon_Fyre yes, no clear end the turn.

[@Threeve703]

Just another comment reaffirming Rachel should be on the podcast nearly all the time.

[@therachelweeks]

You're in luck! That's my new job! Haha

[@Threeve703]

@@therachelweeks It's awesome! You're doing a great job.

[@mikotagayuna8494]

My Commander Bad Habit: Watching CZ and always ending up buying more cards afterwards.

[@andrewtl7988]

Another big phase-move thing I find frustrating at times is when people go right from main 1 to "swing in for 3", without declaring the move to combat phase. Very relevant in some decks to respond in combat but before attackers are declared, and it's frustrating to have to say "can you tell me when you're moving to combat cause I might have a response"

[@troylambert1601]

Let em do it. Turns out you still get to react, but now you have information if they didn't pass priority. They'll learn faster if you punish they're attack with free information.

[@Caio22011]

@@troylambert1601 Yep, they will always have to take the attack back if they know how the game works, if they don't they will just learn

[@kl3r1k3r-7]

And after you tell them the amount of damage they either take it silently without letting you know if they actually took it/the correct amount, OR they then realize that they might have done something different, after knowig the amount of damage

[@bouboulroz]

A friendly reminder that you can refuse any shortcut that isn't an infinite loop and force the game to roll-back and be played step by step.

[@shinobu-39]

I think this is a fair shortcut (in a friendly table) because it's an easy game action to reverse. In the long run, it does save more time to skip passive phases until they're relevant. It's more detrimental to the attacker who rushed anyway because you now have more information. I play limited a lot and this is a common thing that's reversed pretty easily without any infractions. Personally, I always declare I'm moving into combat and then pass priority whether I'm aggro or control. But I do understand taking liberties in more casual aggro-centric tables.

[@VirlymXD]

When my friend was teaching me how to play, he made a simple rule to make me remember how a turn starts. If I forget to untap before I draw, that means "I've elected to skip my untap step". A simple punish, but it really makes you learn fast.

[@keldone3186]

only problem. You CANT skip it.

[@VirlymXD]

@keldone Normally, yes. But when you're learning the game, there's never an upside to skipping it. So it was just a conditioning to not forget the steps.

[@irajohnston5160]

I teach people that they miss it rather than skip it. Speaking more on the quick draw forgetting to untap first player.

[@Dragon_Fyre]

Some players place something on top of their deck. It’s there as a reminder to slow down and make sure you do everything you need to do before you draw.

[@r4nd0m1zer2]

My dad did the same to me. Its a very effective way to teach 😂

[@tuviaschwarcz]

My tip: stop dumping your hand onto the field leaving urself 1 boardwipe away from a bad day. If ur current boardstate is the best already and "winning" and u don't need to drop another creature to secure victory.. leave it in your hand for the time being. Same goes with removal.. save for the best moment not the first scary thing u see

[@moedark4390]

yes, this

[@brandonvoice8941]

But I bet you tell people they can't use mass land destruction...

[@pops91]

I am surprised no one mention the biggest bad habit everyone makes. STOP TELLING PEOPLE HOW TO PLAY.Let them make mistakes because only then they will learn from them. Also a bonus bad habit. STOP BACK SEAT GAMING, SPECIALLY WHEN YOU ARE NOT IN THE GAME OR DEFEATED. I hate when people approach the table and point things out to others or how they should play their hand or even more annoying when they grab the top of your deck to see future turns. Seriously people stop.

[@floridaman6982]

Yeah not everyone wants tips, I play chess too and its super annoying there. Yeah the guy might be higher rated than me, but if I want to become a mid tier player I come find you for help I’m just chilling over here by trial and error

[@airkami]

You mad bro?

[@bdac5653]

For the Bonus habit: Play with max 2 colours until you reliably play without making mana mistakes, from there step up to 3 colours if you want. With Commander being popular, I so often see new players jumping to a 3 colour commander straight away and getting into problems.

[@BoxOfFear]

I’ve never considered this. Every Commander precon I’ve purchased is three colors…😢

[@quayo90]

The “steal your stuff” deck snapping and fidgeting your cards or the “Pizza Eater” grabbing at your cards to read them….Rachel 👀👀

[@kareth117]

Listen, I get that some folks just dread seeing ads and stuff when we're watching videos like this, but I want to say I appreciate that you run therapy ads like that and show it in the positive light it deserves. Men do not see that often enough, nor do they take it to heart unfortunately. Ultimately, guys, go see a therapist. Worst case scenario they say you're fine and have nothing to learn from them (unlikely, we all need therapy at some point) but best case you find out how to maneuver your own emotions and issues. Anyway, thanks for running ads for therapy.

[@PestOnYT]

In the "tapping correctly" category: Some people "tap" their lands just ~45° and when they untap it looks very similar to the other "slightly" tapped cards... This confuses me a lot. The tapped cards should be horizontally and the untapped cards vertically aligned (at least "close to"), not somewhere in-between. Also, if a card costs e.g. a black and a blue plus 3, some people just tap 5 and I ask myself if they tapped the back and the blue or just "any" 5. There, being more explicit on what they tap is helpful.

[@Argeaux2]

I tap the table as I say "Upkeep". That way you are doing an action for each thing on your "checklist". Untap (untap cards) Upkeep (tap table) Draw for turn (draw a card) When I put a die on top of my library, I have the number of pips on the top equal the number of triggers I need to remember. I find that more useful than just the die on any number.

[@VeryShawkward]

This couldn’t have come at a better time! Best way to cruise through the rest of my day!

[@RazgrizAce67]

49:23 OMG yes, glad someone said this. I HATE "the roll to see who I attack" or "roll to see what I use this removal spell on." Just make a decision based on the current board or what makes sense for the long game! I'd much rather get attacked by an opponent who made a decision based on gameplay reasons (even if I think it's the wrong decision) rather than based on a bad dice roll.

[@thaddaustentakel7620]

An addition to 'scrolling during the game' or even 'poorly representing the game state' for me are outside the game discussions/conversations. Especially in my friends group but also sometimes at my LGS there is some small talk that has nothing to do with the game which results in people not knowing whats on the board, keeping up with their triggers, rewinding because of mandatory effects or getting angry afterwards because they had a response but just didn't pay attention in that moment. Sometimes you can look at them, play your full turn telling every action in a loud voice and they still won't know what happened.

[@JakeAce13]

I like to small talk about different topic but only in two cases: A) A player is searching their library or resolving other stuff that takes some time and mentions when they‘re finished. B) We pause the game to talk about a topic that came up. Otherwise when we are clearly in the midth of a turn with many points and possibilities of interaction there is only game talk and game banter. 😊

[@Sodmaster111]

If I couldn't banter with my friends during games id quit EDH entirely

[@thaddaustentakel7620]

@@Sodmaster111 It is ok as long as you dont interrupt the game flow

[@DoctorDucky250]

My main MTG playmate plays Pokemon primarily, where the turns end immediately after you attack. Using his second main phase and other Instant speed things is his main area of focus for getting better 😂 it's a hard habit to break though.

[@s4ad0wpi]

As far as Tokens go, I like keeping a standard deck of cards on me. Need a 3/3 beast? 3 of hearts! 2/2 zombie? 2 of spaids! Copy of another permanent? Turn it face down! It's not perfect, but it's fairly understood at most tables

[@Bob-nc5hz]

20:30 this is also an issue because it becomes a tell if you're only engaged when you have something that you *could* do (e.g. a zero-mana counterspell or something). It's probably fine if you have a deck which is designed to play at sorcery speed and will not do interactions on other players' turns, but if you have a deck with instants, abilities, flash, ... anything which *could* be relevant on an other player's turn, disengaging becomes dangerous to your gameplan (unless you use it to create bluffs).

[@KellyUnekis]

The "stop scrolling" bad habit covers disengaging with the game though. The way they present it makes me feel like it's just reskinned "play interaction".

[@canoli62]

"There are no amoral magic cards. There's no magic cards that are for bad people." Rachel - you just became my favorite MTG commentator. Next time Command Zone does a Salt episode, this should be the theme.

[@canoli62]

Also - Commander Clock is the worst idea in the history of MTG. Its use is worse than any of the bad habits discussed herein. You should all be ashamed.

[@canoli62]

"Slow Down!"... but remember to use our terrible, awful, format-warping timer app. and speed up because we have ADHD and want games to be faster... so messed up. The cognitive dissonance is real.

[@starmanda88]

@@canoli62 good thing it’s optional bro. *relax*

[@mightyone3737]

@@canoli62 I think you might be missing their point, they're saying most players that aren't paying enough attention will result in a much slower game that feels very tedious/repetitive, and that at the same time people rushing through steps can result in 'feels bad' moments like when you've got interaction at step 2 out of 3 and the opponent tried to rush to 3, assuming nobody had anything. You can both hurry up by wasting less time and be more careful by taking your time when it's helpful. A timer is a handy tool if someone in your playgroup tends to get lost in the options in Commander a bit too often, this will help train them to make faster decisions. It's not for everyone obviously, but I think chess is much better with a timer, and I'm bad at timed chess.

[@Loyalsoul56]

@@canoli62 swing and a miss, not the point they were trying to make my guy.

[@mborchik2007]

I think the #1 mistake is definitely reacting before it’s your turn in priority. The amount of times someone who was last in priority immediately responds when I had planned on dealing with the same card is laughable. It’s always better to let someone else deal with the problem if they can. Responding too quickly makes you utilize resources you may not of had to use 🤷‍♂️

[@dr.revenue3636]

Yeah our pod struggled with this for a while, thinking if you had an instant you could just kind of interrupt whenever you wanted and wherever you were in turn order. Us learning together about priority really helped progress, especially as the more you play you run into more complex interactions. And, like you said...if someone else wants to counter that spell...please do!

[@AndyG3173]

One of the playgroups I am in plays that way. They didn't know what priority was, and when I explained it to them, they said it sounded boring and would rather just slam down instants, "first come, first served" style. I can't play with them lol I am very by the book with phases and priority, and they're just chaotic

[@Haph3us]

"There are no cards for bad people" Mel felt differently when Craig played that OG Vorinclex back in the day lmaoooo

[@matthewrobert1810]

“Jerk card for Jerks”

[@tyadosjfwi3945]

Iconic

[@seankeane769]

A good way to help you while tapping for mana is to say out loud what your tapping each mana for… most times, you will catch yourself tapping incorrectly, or realize you could tap better (like using an island for a blue instead of a duel land)… it also helps your opponents keep track too if you make a mistake… they could notice that you tapped your watery grave for a green lol

[@floridaman6982]

One thing is the politics of commander is probably the most important part. If you are going full steam and creating a massive threat it just becomes a 1 v 5. Looking inconspicuous is an art

[@BoxOfFear]

I feel like it was a huge accomplishment, the day I finally figured out to focus on the person with the best board state, and not automatically go after the person with the most remaining life.

[@TheLibertybellz]

Jimmy! I did the 12 resolution thing last year! Did it for about 6 months. Keep em simple enough, and don't just pick something difficult you would be doing anyway. That's what made me fall off the resolution wagon. Best of luck! My resolution is to journal everyday so I can track my progress and better understand my shortcomings.

[@danacoleman4007]

Nice! Good luck!

[@SmashCentralOfficial]

46:35 this is the absolute worst when someone rushes through like 3+ actions and you wanted to stop and respond to Action #1. Now you have all this additional information about the next few things they planned on doing and it's not fair to anyone. The other night someone did this and I was like well obviously I should do X now, but if you hadn't rushed through that whole play I wouldve just done the suboptimal Y option. But because I'm a nice person I'll still do the suboptimal option even though YOU are the one who screwed up by giving ME extra information.

[@Hemlocker]

It's not an easy thing to solve though, because we clearly can't play the game by literally passing priority on every single game action we take. There's a balance to be made, and sometimes it might not be obvious to the acting player that others may want to respond to what they're doing. Not saying there isn't a problem there, but it's also often not the fault of that player.

[@SCKentrol]

The point about apologize: I play in Canada, and we just can't not say sorry for every removal or counterspell or attacking people lmao

[@DoctorDucky250]

Midwesterner here, we have the same tradition.

[@Dragon_Fyre]

Yeah a Canadian sorry is really just a way of being polite and not an actual apology.

[@dr.revenue3636]

@@Dragon_Fyre "I'm playing blue, sorry lads"

[@nathanchampion7016]

they said shouldnt say sorry, you can still say Sorey

[@PantheraLeoKing]

It's equivalent to "My condolences"

[@Narmoriel42]

Poorly representing board state is why I love having blank dry-erase tokens. They're lifesaving, and also you get to make your own silly tokens.

[@ColorwaveCraftsCo]

Haven’t finished the episode yet, but I have a little something to add to the “playing at sorcery speed” conversation. A lot of times, you don’t need to put pressure on yourself to remove every single threat. There are 2 other players that can help you deal with it and many times the scary thing doesn’t even affect you as much as it affects your opponents. I’m just saying this because I used to be so guilty of it and now I’m trying to be better about holding my answers longer instead of firing them off prematurely.

[@buddatello]

I love that Jimmy's Self Help voice is a cowboy partner

[@SakuyaFM4]

The resolving part, there are a few Japanese card games that I play that flip the Untap and Draw Phases, but MTG and Vanguard are so engrained with me that I flip the phases in those games, because TBH they're non-standard. I always declare "Untap Upkeep Draw" or "Stand and Draw" whenever I start my turn, which also helps with upkeep triggers since I have Phyrexian Arena and/or Sylvan Library in decks that can run them, and also I have a Shrines deck.

[@jeppekjr4618]

I’m so happy Rachel is here more now:))

[@apophis456]

A lot of these come from a “you play magic to win” perspective when in commander you play for fun first (yes there’s a grey area of I have fun by winning but I’m not going into that). You should aim to win every game you play but the priority in commander is fun shit

[@danacoleman4007]

Indeed!!!

[@matthewrobert1810]

You can still play to win while having fun. Board games do it all the time. People need to start understanding that

[@apophis456]

@@matthewrobert1810 I literally mentioned that in my comment.

[@matthewrobert1810]

@@apophis456 you mentioned a grey area. I’m basically saying there shouldn’t be one. More players need to think that way

[@apophis456]

@@matthewrobert1810 then problem is that many people who have fun by winning get angry and tilted when they *don’t* win, which is why there’s a stigma around it to beginning with. History shows that they’re not fun people to have in your pods. There’s nothing wrong with having fun by winning as long as you’re not treating casual games like paid tournaments where you’re blowing up lands of players who are behind, playing cEDH combos in casual games, and aren’t a poor sport when you lose

[@Gloryofthereef]

I have little dragon eye counters, and will put one on my library when I have an upkeep trigger so that I remember to do things before drawing. It looks at me disapprovingly when I reach for the draw without interacting first.

[@AC_DriftCaster]

I try not a keep sketchy hands, though there was one hand that was high risk/high reward: Two lands, three 3 mana cost ramp spells, other two were good support cards. HAD to keep it! Proceeded to not draw any land or two/one cost mana rocks for the next six turns...

[@argonnas2]

Bad habit numero uno: not doing the math

[@simopen]

what do I look like, some kind of blocker?

[@peadrianlastname]

I'm here to cast splashy spells and play big plays math is for blockers

[@brningpyre]

Even if you don't feel like it, consider: doing the math makes you better at doing the math, and it gets so much easier in future games.

[@thomashiggins4689]

Do i like look like a blocker with a lack of mana, what is this math? Thats that science shit from breaking bad, right?

[@eduardogutierrez3753]

Math is for blockers, I'm going all in lol

[@sagejackson6886]

As a CEDH player that also plays a fair bit of casual, THANK YOU for bringing up respecting and passing priority. In CEDH, we are forced to very carefully pay attention to priority, as instant speed interaction from 4 players can jump onto the stack at any point in the game. However, in a lot of casual pods that I've played at, players are often very sloppy with passing priority, not jumping phases, and jumping out of priority order. It results in all kinds of oopsies and take backs, misplays, confusion, and overall a big headache. As a public service announcement to magic players everywhere: Please give your opponents an opportunity to interact, and respect turn order. THANKS

[@nerdlabmtg]

Rachel, was a huge get for you guys. Best Free Agency Acquisition of the year.

[@TopLevelJiuJitsu]

100%

[@BigDaveKeasby]

Free agency? Commander Sphere should be getting a hefty buyout

[@nerdlabmtg]

@@BigDaveKeasby they got a compensatory pick in next years EDH draft.

[@WulfLovelace]

I think the apology one though comes from a twofold problem. I started to get into the habit of apologizing because I would play with groups, who were relentless. You would make a solid play like, removing a key piece from their board, like an Ashnod's Altar, and then they would swing 20 damage at you next combat in retaliation. Or lethal commander all over one card. And sure, take a piece off my board, deal me some damage, but kill me or take me off the entire board because I got rid of a single artifact.

[@danielscott9960]

The sorcery speed thing I do on purpose sometimes. My playgroup are learning now that I love alternative cost cards so I will tap out and go but I can return a land to hand or pay life and interact instead and I got people all the time with the false sense of security

[@DCII]

And then from a properly represented board state you can move to a perfectly represented board state by placing all creatures in their proper place (I like to put non-summoning sick in the front row, summoning sick behind) and all together, mana rocks in a group and separate from each other and from lands, lands laid out so your opponents can see, ...

[@MaleusMaleficarum]

And then you get the chaotic play who uses the chaos to their advantage. I know I'm spoiled by the layout of Arena.

[@ethanL337]

I was the new guy at a local gaming shop that was not my regular store. We were playing commander, and one of the players at one point started making infinite 1/1 tokens. And then he said “ I will keep making tokens until you all scoop!” The other two players started picking up their cards. So I started asking, Do your tokens do anything when they come in to play? No. Do they have haste? No. Do you have a win condition that says you win if you have X number of tokens? No. To which I said, “I’m not going to scoop just because you have an infinite number of tokens.” One of the other players pipes in “You can’t block that many tokens when he attacks next turn.” To which I said “He has to make it to his next turn to attack. The three of us still have a full turn to draw a board wipe or come up with a solution.” They reluctantly say “okay sure” and we’re frustrated that I wanted to play it out. The two other players basically fly through their turns and do nothing. I take my turn as I should and I find an answer. I pass to the infinite token dude. And they’re all like “You didn’t do anything! He’s going to win! Just scoop!” I said no. If he wants to win he needs to actually win. So the infinite token dude smugly speeds through the steps to combat and attacks just me. Not even the other guys. Just me. I declare no blocks. He yells “Got you!” And I slow roll the overloaded Cyclonic Rift. They all get pissed and they’re like “He’ll just replay it all next turn!” And I’m like “If things resolve.” And they don’t because I was playing blue in Mimeoplasm reanimator dredge. I end up winning the pod because I found momentum after the Cyc Rift. I spoke to one of the employees after the game and I guess that is the meta in that store. People skip steps. Don’t demonstrate combo loops. And scoop prematurely. I haven’t been back since.

[@thomaspetrucka9173]

Ugh! The premature scoop can be so frustrating to play against. Commander is supposed to be the casual format, not the competitive one!

[@eXJonSnow]

Similar thing is people playing some weird combo and just going “I have infinite golem tokens now.” Uhhhhh, no, how about you actually describe it. Had it one time where the guy didn’t understand how the cards interacted and, instead of making infinite tokens, it was like 40 of them 😂 Def agree with prematurely scooping. I’ve seen people make infinite mana and stall out or have an infinite board of non-hasty creatures that have to make it through an entire turn cycle before they can do anything.

[@DCII]

During my beginning phases I try to make it a point to say out loud Untap, Upkeep, Straw and I very pointedly roll the R in straw as if I were speaking spanish. I use that weird pronunciation as a reminder to help me build the good habit of never forgetting the order. Plus if I do that every time in front of new players it'll help them to remember.

[@joeycrack1213]

One of the biggest problems my playgroup is currently having is extreme saltiness that is affecting peoples decisions.

[@stevenr0]

Totally understand this

[@joeycrack1213]

@@stevenr0 it’s annoying and gives wins to people who shouldn’t haven’t gotten them because people won’t interacts with them because people are afraid of pissing them off

[@animesfreakify]

I'm guilty of this

[@MaleusMaleficarum]

Lol... seriously? I'm much more inclined to be, "Bring it on bro. You just got angry over a game!? Seek professional help."

[@Dryblack1]

@@MaleusMaleficarum That'll definitely go well.

[@LogoMotive11]

Really love episodes like this that address overlooked mistakes in the game like these. I'm sure some of these don't seem like a big deal to some players, but everything mentioned can really affect games deeper than surface level.

[@Cobracon7]

I played during Ice Age, and was told to play my lands in front, stopped playing when they switched it, came back and never adjusted... it drives some people crazy, but I'm not changing it, I keep my field clean...

[@rodrigoavila4133]

bad habit no. 413. countering the first spell you can, when you should be countering the torment of hailfire.

[@Hemlocker]

I think everyone should play mono blue (and not just a Baral deck with 20 counterspells) to learn this skill. It's basically just threat assessment, but with much less time to think.

[@jessianderson3959]

I'd just like to mention seeing as you didn't bring it up when talking about timers; they add a new dimension of strategy to the game & learning to work with that actually increases your real world skills to cope with time pressure, which I for one could use.

[@QWERTY-du4hc]

It also forces you to know how your deck works with each piece of it. It removes the ability to just buy a deck and play.

[@jessianderson3959]

@QWERTY idk about you, but most of the deckbuilders I know already discourage playing a deck at a table till you understand how it works. Like, I expect when I show up to a game night that you aren't spending 15 minutes a turn understanding your deck, that's not at all why I came. I came to play HOPEFULLY 3-4 games, and a player who is taking exceptionally long because they aren't sure what their deck does gets in the way of that goal. While it's fine to figure things out 1 v 1, it's less advisable to play this way when you factor in the other 3 people who came to play's time.

[@ilovebrownies1]

An important point that has probably been covered a lot, but is worth repeating: Plan your turns before it’s your turn. Players not doing this makes games excruciatingly long. Also, something I like to do during downtime when an opponent is taking a long turn is to read flavor text and appreciate the artwork on my cards

[@truedarkaegis]

Yes! There are so many cards that I have looked at more closely while waiting for my turn and noticed things I have never noticed before! Great way to spend downtime (provided you have already planned your next move!)

[@johnganeric4105]

22:56 is may favorite moment from both Rachel and Jimmy, Great show, I love that Rachel is around to stay on Command Zone.

[@austenmurphy3545]

One habit that I find annoying is when you play with a play group often, they know how good your deck can work so they focus on preventing you from doing anything to the point another player runs away with the game. Its one thing to stop a deck from comboing off, but to continually ignore threats from other players while doing so can be rather aggravating.

[@cloudroth6]

I mean that's commander. It has game memory. They are probably fine with the other person running away with the game as long as it's not the deck that always kicks there ass.

[@RJMM]

Build another deck boiii.

[@tylerkley]

Get a new group lol

[@joeycrack1213]

This is another big problem I’m having I have the “you make good decks” tax

[@Bongus_Bubogus]

I love meta gaming in my own playgroup. You should’ve seen the Morophon Tribal-Tribal player’s face when they read the Suleimen’s Legacy I played.

[@IneptCardCollector]

Thanks for linking the episodes y'all referred to. As a new player, the biggest two that keep happening are people attempting combos when they literally can't do them (possibly trying to either show off or assuming newer players like me won't make them explain it and ask a judge if it sounds sus), and taking forever to do something small, then complaining that someone else did something big to them.

[@lisdexik5484]

Biggest problem for my playgroup (me included) on occasion: Not knowing if we played a land each turn because we didn't play it on MP1.

[@therealax6]

A simple fix I've seen is to put a die somewhere as "land plays remaining". This also helps when you get extra land plays from random effects: you always know how many you have left. You just set it to 1 on your untap (or to whatever it should be: if you have Azusa out, set it to 3, of course) and tick it down as you play lands. When the die's gone, you can't play another one!

[@freakycrawler]

Great way to learn your phases as a beginner is to announce them out loud. It helps you and the whole table to keep track of what you're doing during your turn. It makes reacting to your plays far easier for the other players since when you go "Combat" other players can interact with "before you go to combat" and similar things. It's a great habit to develop as early as possible

[@nomizak]

Not tapping correctly solution: Use your opponent's turn to figure out your next turn. I know you have to pay attention to their plays but if a player is taking a long turn you can start thinking about what your next play will be. Dont wait until your turn to figure out what youre gonna do and how you're going to tap for mana. I had a situation recently where I had doubling cube out. So ahead of my next turn I figured out that I would have 5 mana free after paying the activation cost of doubling cube. Then I looked at my hand and figured out what I could cast for 10 mana on my turn. I paid particular attention to any double colored pips since they would take priority if I wanted to cast that spell.

[@griffinith]

Good news! I've successfully completed everything on this list. Now I just need to stop playing at instant in the middle of my opponents turns, and wait patiently until their end step. Also, over extending my board.

[@Fishlampclock]

This was hilarious. I had a friend rage on me because they moved too fast during combat and after damage resolved they wanted to change their attacks. I said, "woah, let's slow things down," and was cut-off mid sentence and they raged at me. 🤣

[@floridaman6982]

Legendary

[@Tombombadyl]

Great video! Could relate to a lot of these, have seen them in games and have done them in games. Ironically, LOVED seeing the two things I HATE come up: poorly representing board state and scrolling during the game. Overall, all of these things really come to one thing you both mentioned, I think: being mindful and present to the game that you're supposed to be actually actively playing with your friends.

[@grimbourne]

Worst bad habit in the game is.... winning! Don't do it! Makes everyone else salty when they lose. Hahahaha.

[@peggle09]

For the first one I have a special playmat for new players that has all the phases on it in order and you can use a dice to mark what step your in

[@JohnEbananas]

Love your commentary Rachel Weeks!

[@danz107]

When it comes to resolving phases on spelltable (particularly upkeeps), I generally just chime in my triggered abilities (most players say "ok, np", and if I need/want to do anything else I'll pause them while they untap if they seem to be hurrying. It works for me. I also like the idea Josh sometimes does of putting a coin or counter on your deck to hold you from drawing to remember upkeep triggers. Also, my board state strategy is to print any un-had tokens from mtgproxy, a few infinitokens just in case, dice by top of card for number of tokens, dice by creature stats to define +1 counters.

[@BosSoxFan15]

One thing I do to avoid being on my phone is offer it as the life total tracker using either the life tracker app or carbon. I find this is a great way to keep me engaged in the game because I can’t scroll on my phone. Also if i get a text or phone call i have to answer players are more accepting of it cause they know it has to be some what serious for me to interrupt the game for it.

[@Steven-rb7ph]

Priority is often important when resolving board-wipes 👍

[@amarmehta01]

Saying the phases out loud helps me keep track of triggers

[@lorenmarozas5090]

Great video, this makes us all better players!!! ❤

[@dennisyoung6122]

Two that fit together... Dumping your entire hand on turn 1, and being threatened more by the person with no real boardstate or hand over the one with a full hand and a lot of mana.

[@kevinluttrell1885]

My least favorite habit is when players tell other players what they should have, or should not have done. Many times i see this happen in an agressive way. I see this a lot at my LGS and even in my play group. It is one thing to make recomendations, political deals, or rule corrections, but blatently telling someone they are making incorect plays takes away from their individual agency and feels super bad.

[@Dryblack1]

Yep, I see this a lot. I always remind them this is a casual game, there's no prize, and I'm not working on starting a pro mtg career. I'm going to make mistakes and who cares

[@carlosquall15]

Couldn't agree more, I hate unsolicited advice especially if they bring the competitive meta in a casual game

[@alexanderrolfes3304]

I put a quarter on top of my library when playing. Helps me remember the upkeep. Picked up the habit from playing mana crypt.

[@gerudo4sale861]

Suggestion: can you add chapter for each topic, trying to rewatch a segment and playing with the bar is a little inconvenient

[@Kinson007]

I try to always have the tokens/emblems for my decks. I get them with the rest of the cards for my deck. If always trying to find tokens, store them, etc is a big hassle, one can always buy the dry erase cards. Ex: write Soldier on it, and in the bottom corner, 1/1. Ta-da, you have a 1/1 Soldier token.

[@Rheinguard]

"There are no amoral magic cards" *Stares at Tegrid*

[@jacobalbert2603]

Not a damn thing wrong with Tergrid...and no, I don't personally run Tergrid

[@ssjecm]

Overloaded Cyclonic lol

[@mibbzx1493]

Craterhoof is amoral 🤣

[@goretoriumgaming8600]

Dies to removal, denied by counterspells. Shrug, run more interaction.

[@princepersona]

A big one is if you are using a lot of effects that require you to search your deck make sure to always check before you start shuffling to see if you need to search again as this will save lots of time. This is a bad habit that makes games take quite a while. Also ask your play group hey I want to do this set of plays to ramp or whatever is it ok if I explain everything to you and then tutor for the end result to save time? Playgroups will give you an answer but at least you are being polite and considerate of time either way.

[@seamusmkeating870]

“There’s no amoral magic cards, there’s no magic cards that are for bad people.” ::stares in Invoke Prejudice::

[@the7A7dude]

Any and all land destruction is amoral

[@nerotoxin0661]

the art was drawn by a stinky person, the card itself isn't bad (I mean it's probably not very good but yk what I mean)

[@moedark4390]

says the guy that no one wants to play with anymore

[@jaywinner328]

The only time I'll apologize is when I incidentally harm somebody. For example, if I Vandalblast because Urza is getting out of hand but I also end up killing a Sol Ring from a player that's clearly far behind, I will apologize for killing the Sol Ring. It was collateral damage. Main thing from the list that I need to work on is board state. I'll stack lands, I'll stack mana rocks and that's fine. But sometimes there isn't enough room and artifacts/enchantments end up needing to be stacked up and that doesn't result in the clearest of board states and I'm not sure how fix fix it.

[@gregslingland3576]

On the note of interaction and powerful synergies being “amoral”, did you mean immoral? My understanding is that immoral things are bad and amoral things are neutral.

[@danacoleman4007]

You are correct

[@samuelrobinson4638]

That BetterHelp add might be the best thing I've ever seen on your channel

[@shamtactics4712]

Excited to watch bc commander night is tonight

[@stevenr0]

Sounds like a good night 🔥

[@dittmar104]

If you do t have tokens and don’t want to by mini white boards I highly recommend getting a little breast pocket notebooks. And then you also have paper to keep notes on for the game

[@jacobnordquist3448]

People who do removal on non-threats super early just as a joke because they have nothing else to do. Please people, hold onto removal until they are actually needed... also if you kill my mid-tier commander as a joke I will full swing each and every turn to punish the aggro pulling move.

[@davidcardoso3525]

27:50 Not having lands is a feel-bad way to start. Also, I once took a 0 land + Land Tax Brimaz deck to victory; the top draw was a Plains.

[@jcomposer12]

"There are no cards for 'bad' people." *Winter Orb has entered the chat*

[@ALTR_no_EGO]

Tergrid? JLK would say Blood Moon...

[@thaddaustentakel7620]

Vorinclex XD

[@DarkPikachuYTV]

@@thaddaustentakel7620 Armageddon hi how are you

[@ALTR_no_EGO]

@@thaddaustentakel7620 Mel did call it a "Jerk card for jerks."

[@jumpsteady1777]

This is literally why this notion has pushed me out of wanting to try commander. I decided to go with krrik deck so of course dropping a winter orb when I can get by not needing lots of land is a solid play to gain a lead. Commander is one of the formats I haven't tried because of this. I would have used winter orb in my elf and squirrel decks if it was modern legal. But my krrik deck was the first appropriate deck where winter orb is legal You play powerful cards/plays in vintage, legacy, modern, draft, pioneer...opponent says GG...but do it in commander and you spark some philosophical debate about cards that are legal but shouldn't be played because you have to win but don't want to win too good. like people have the audacity to think beyond format legality they have an additional and equal say in what is "right and wrong" to play. Like just say gg and go to the next game. Maybe one day I'll get into commander. I have commander decks but am scared to play them because they use removal, board wipes, tax, 1 shots, full board steals. My social anxiety is through the roof meeting new people playing. I can't handle an added layer of what I should and shouldn't play.

[@Jidayun]

That better help ad definitely knew my sense of humor. Nearly cackled at work.

[@MissingNovice]

I take slight issue with the no scrolling during the game bit, cus it really depends on the environment. My playgroup is a buncha nerds with ADD, we're all aware that our usual 5 man pod can take ages to get around the table, and nobody mistakes casually scrolling through memes while other people figure out their turns as them not being interested in the game - especially when they're not holding up mana for something, or aren't regularly asking for plays to be reversed. There's certainly an amount of inattentiveness that can be rude, but at the end of the day we play magic to wind down and escape our responsibilities, and being shamed for looking at my phone is something I'd expect out of like a workplace meeting or a classroom, not a chill game of commander with friends.

[@MaleusMaleficarum]

Can you acknowledge that bri ginger that same behavior to an LGS is a social faux pas?

[@Dryblack1]

Anything is fine if you're playgroup is fine with it. These are more for when you're playing with people you don't know as well

[@MissingNovice]

@@MaleusMaleficarum I did say in literally the first sentence that it depends on the environment. But unless the opponent is literally ignoring the game, I don't really mind. Theres a threshold for sure, but I don't personally find it particularly damning. Some folks brains just get stimulation in different ways. As long as they got enough attention to play the game, I'm not gonna fuss them about it.

[@danacoleman4007]

Sounds awful

[@Greg501-]

Remember: Phase Day/Night Untap Upkeep Draw Scheme Saga Attraction

[@Bongus_Bubogus]

Can we talk about Card Kingdom vs TCGplayer? I’ve seen with online deck lists the price difference between the two. I have a ~700 USD deck, then I used the price comparison to see Card Kingdom’s and it rose all the way to ~1,200 USD. That pays for two months of my rent. Surely it’s not worth the convenience factor for like, at least a 20% increase in price. It also seems Card Kingdom’s minimum prices for even penny cards is 0.25 USD? That’s ridiculous, especially for budget decks those comparisons gotta be fucking *wack*. Can a Folk/Penny/Baroque or any cheap budget player confirm? Another downside is that you no longer support a variety of lgs’s and individual sellers, you only support the one that is charging you more and only has 3 store locations if I’m seeing things right. That’s up to individual morality I suppose. If you like the single package shipped quick, if you are buying a number of cards you’d call an “amount”, you can use TCGPlayer Direct, which gathers the cards before shipping in a single package. If you pay a small fee for membership, you get it shipped in only a few days. You even get access to good discounts with that membership, so if you plan to buy cards *and* you want them shipped fast, TCGPlayer makes more financial sense after a certain price point. Even with the occasional package/card(s) missing from packages (more like 1/30 from my experience using verified sellers (which isn’t more expensive FYI))), I don’t think that justifies not using TCGPlayer over Card Kingdom, it’s a big opportunity cost unless you hate all the money you have.

[@laurainthesky3765]

Agreed 100%. I would only order CK if I had a specific deadline.

[@chrisgebben2043]

I can go further on the pass priority thing it's a little tough to explain but a tougher example i hope i say this right. is "Chord of Calling" every one pass and it resolves you can't respond to the creature they get it enters play in a split second form. like if they get elesh norn grand cenobite when someones board states is 2/2 there's nothing they can do about its already in play at the exact moment the calling finishes resolving.

[@therealax6]

The overarching mistake here is assuming that players get priority while an effect is resolving (after making choices for it): they don't. Likewise with events that simply happen (e.g., a creature entering the battlefield) and special actions (like playing a land). Elesh Norn is a great example, because the -2/-2 effect is a static ability, so it's just in effect for as long as Elesh Norn is on the battlefield. And creatures die to it as a state-based action _before_ anyone gets priority. Knowing when you get priority in the first place is important.

[@KellyUnekis]

Re: "Sorcery Speed" I think we're forgetting that this is a casual format.

[@darkflame9410]

Yeah, several of their "habits" kinda just rubbed me the wrong way as "hey, stop playing casually you filthy casuals" (but said more politely, which somehow makes it worse)

[@KellyUnekis]

@@darkflame9410 I don't feel as strongly about the other points, those make more sense to me. Sorcery Speed felt like it just belonged lumped into Stop Scrolling. It was more like deckbuilding advice randomly inserted into a bad habits video. Battlecruiser is fun and shouldn't be called a bad habit.

[@artemisd6343]

I just played my first commander game. It was all precons and I top-decked a sol ring and popped off. During the middle/end of the game, there was an opponent who was low and I knew that I could eliminate them or swing at the other opponent and pump the first one more. When I was making the decision, the first guy was complaining that he was ganged up on.. I really appreciate your comment about not apologizing because I felt bad in the moment but was also thinking, "it's just a game.."