Curved Vortex Lift (2010)

[@Gargamoth]

You're a really smart guy. I liked the straight tornado, but curving it was special ( making a mini tornado is pretty awesome). Now to make a model using this idea that flies! I hope to see it soon.

[@SomeoneCommenting]

Even if his experiments are not getting to what he really attempts (according to some commenters), you have to admit that he has an awesome way to graphically and visually explain many of the things that are going on like a master. Some other people make videos of their experiments and you have no idea at all of what is going on, even if they work fine.

[@emfimpulse]

That is fantastic! If you pause the video, it appears as though the vortex prefers to create geometry. There are areas where it prefers to keep the vortex straight, and others where it likes to create a corner... It may be interesting to somehow explore resonances, to see if particular geometries stabilize, and possibly create effects? Love it! Keep playing!

[@lennoxtrey3109]

Sorry to be off topic but does anybody know of a method to get back into an Instagram account? I somehow lost my login password. I love any tips you can give me

[@maxtonjake3920]

@Lennox Trey Instablaster :)

[@lennoxtrey3109]

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[@lennoxtrey3109]

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[@maxtonjake3920]

@Lennox Trey no problem :D

[@JoshuaNobles]

Very cool, I have had an idea utilizing curved vortexes for years now, but I have never been in a financial position to experiment with it. The idea I have utilizes induced horizontal toroidal vortexes and propeller in a closed system with the goal of gaining greater thrust from the propeller in one direction. What I have assumed is that a portion of the downward force created by the propeller could be canceled by the toroidal vortex pulling the air around its formation. The rotational velocity of the vortex and velocity of air being pulled through the propeller should need to be similar. Again, this is within a closed environment. One of the cool aspects of a system like this is, in space, you could constantly accelerate. Some, I would imagine, would say it was in the realm of a reaction-less drive, and while propellant-less it is still trying to generate an action by canceling out a portion of the reaction. I really appreciate your videos.

[@garyrowlands8537]

Man, this is brilliant, we are working on some stuff that we think is cool, but this is the next level. I am also interested in the effect he vortex is having above the vortex as well as the lifting capabilities.

[@scottrharris]

@Trebseig The trailing vortices actually produce the lift. They induce a downward momentum flux that results in the force on the aircraft. On an airplane, there is bound vorticity on the wing, the trailing tip vortices, and a starting vortex left on the runway. In the invisicid limit, these vortices form a closed loop. Consider a smoke ring: it moves because of it's own induced velocity. Take a look at the Kutta-Joukowski theorem and the Helmholtz theorem.

[@MadScientist267]

It would seem as though you might get more lift by changing the axis of the vortex... laying it down in a ring rather than standing it up? For example, you mention a smoke ring "propelling itself" through air, note the orientation of the ring, and the direction of travel. Just a thought.

[@СергейТ-ш8м]

На старих фото Джона Серла не видно магнітів - є тільки диски. джерелом енергії є тепле повітря, яке у центр-сходячому вихрі перетворюється на обертальний рух. Основою є диск, який обертається між обкладинками, створюючи в центрі велике розрідження. У верхній обкладинці є отвір (по центру диска він теж є, щоб задіяти обидві сторони диску) над отвором є купол, в куполі по краям є отвори через які надходить тепле повітря. В куполі утворюється вихор який обертає маленьку (порівняно з диском) турбінку - турбінка прикріплена в центрі диска. Зниження температури таке сильне що замерзають підшипники (що є великою проблемою). При розгоні проблемою є виючий гучний звук, тон якого залежить від діамерту диска, причиною виючого звуку є пульсуючий вихор в центрі диска, треба розігнатись ще щоб пройти пульсації (тому і репульсин), вихор стабілізується, звук дискретно змінить тон на вищий, потім зникне зовсім. треба розганяти ще щоб пройти цей поріг, далі в куполі над диском формується вихор який штовхатиме турбіну. Температура повітря - це і є джерело енергії. Дякую...

[@synergy021]

You surely don't seem disabled if you are inventing and exploring science like a true pioneer. That's damn awesome. Great work and keep it up. Also, you have a great friend.

[@babaloo42]

A smoke ring is a curved vortex. Instead of blowing air down from the top onto a disc to get the Coanda affect I would like to blow air upward and pressurize the bottom of the disc while at the same time let the other half of the air through vents in the top and have that air flow over the top and down and then circle back around to the fan again. Once the air gets flowing around what you end up with is a disc trapped inside the top of a smoke ring. Helicopters are inefficient because the air comes back around and the blades have to try and get a push off air that's already moving. But with this design you get the air to come back up the middle and make use of its momentum. It's basically a circular wing with the center covered up(except for the vents out the side of the center piece on the top side). I know it sounds backwards(blowing air upwards) but if no one tries it we'll never know if it works. The point is to get lift by using the same air over and over. Like a smoke ring.

[@juanitawattimury73]

Best Presentation Giesbert Nijhuis , this great tx for uploads

[@JaycubL]

Do you think if you built a Coanda effect oval with two opposite rotating fans that this vacuum tornado arc would form between the two fans? What kind of RPMs are you using? Also maybe if the fans were radial gas turbine engines it would be much more intense.

[@smde1]

Fascinating work. Congratulations ! What happens to a feather if it placed in the vortex ? Watching a feather move from one end of the vortex to the other would be amazing and should show the lifting capability.

[@illmtoloko]

that is awesome! The world need guys like you, you know to push mankind foward. Step by step we improve.

[@GiesbertNijhuis]

@scottrharris Wikipedia: "Wingtip vortices are associated with induced drag, an essentially unavoidable side effect of the wing generating lift." Modern civilian aircraft have these vertical wingtips to prevent wingtip vortex, to improve efficiency. Then again, the -sometimes- visible wingtip vortices are only the core of much bigger swirling air volumes, that can contribute to lift. Birds flying in formation make use of the vortex for more efficient lift. Not of the core of the vortex though.

[@NOBOX7]

very cool work

[@slaliam]

thank you Mister G, this is the second time you impress me , i'm so thankfull, to know about your experiences, that's what i call a good day,

[@GiesbertNijhuis]

@scottrharris Hello Scott. True; wing tips cause vortices, and rotating wings like a rotor or propeller generate curved vortices. These don't generate lift or thrust though, are considered a bad thing: a drag, a loss. An other difference is that these vortices have one end open, causing it to break down. A helicopter with zero airspeed, can create a huge vortex ring, and crash because of that.. I don't know of examples where the centers of a curved vortex are used for lift/thrust. Do you know?

[@seapeoples9461]

fantastic work man, wish you all the success. will follow you on your website.

[@LiamDuffProductions]

I loved that digital Variac controller you have...

[@boogerking7411]

My guess is that it was magnus effect that cause the lift. But since the rotating part is gas and not solid like a kfc bucket in a magnus effect plane, it only achieve a small lift. The rotating center part of the vortex could be causing the pressure difference like with magnus effect and the two ends of the vortex is what's pulling the machine. But since it's gas and not solid that could be directly attached to the machine, the lift effect is only small. It's like pulling an object attached to a stretchable string Edit: On second thought, it's not like an object attached to a stretchable string since the upper part of the vortex is not stretching upwards. My guess why this only achieve a small lift compared to a magnus effect plane is that it's because the rotating part is gas and not solid like magnus effect planes. You will feel more drag if you try to touch a rotating bucket with your finger compared to a rotating gas.

[@GiesbertNijhuis]

@scottrharris Thanks for your reply. Small birds, insects, fish, they use vortices all the time. Dolphins make vortex rings to play with. The wings of an aircraft, yes: how wing circulation, trailing vortex, and starting vortex are connected, together a ring vortex. Though in flight the connection with the starting vortex is soon lost. Wing circulation together with trailing vortex are together like a curved/horseshoe vortex. Still no examples of using the center of a curved vortex for lift.

[@eunaekim9216]

While I do not have a degree in physics, I have a special fascination for absolutely everything related to a vortex.

[@TheGreatStartupWiki]

Are you going to turn it into plasma stream next to see if it reacts differently? Look into how the plasma is created with the plasma cutters. It is easy to create plasma with forced air and the right equipment and if you do this to the moving air that would perhaps have an effect on what happens. Plasma is an interesting thing to work with. Have you tried measuring the side forces when the lift is created? You can do this perhaps by putting it on really good ball bearing wheels?

[@YourUncleScroatie]

A vortex is an angular pressure conversion that occurs at a restriction to equilibrium in response to pressure differential in a fluid mass.

[@rapunzeleh546]

this may sound like a totally dumb question, but the visible part of the tornado... what am i looking at? is that dust in the air? moisture? is it condensing because of temperature change?

[@macdermesser]

Fascinating. I would bet it can work. Good luck in getting it to lift.

[@joshuabrown9643]

Are you certain that the lift effect is not simply a coanda effect produced by the curving of the vortex? Perhaps there is a way to blend this vortex effect with the coanda effect to achieve something more efficient than either individually? Nice work, though. Truly one of the most innovative things I've seen on KZbin.

[@thefalcon217]

Neat idea. You should look at Walter Russell concerning curved vortices. Also Viktor Schauberger. Good luck

[@Woodwose88]

Self-organizing flow technology - Viktor Schauberger. He designed and patented a repulsine flying vehicle based on implosion research, utilising inward-pushing forces of perpetual motion.

[@twizzyrichofficial]

Love you man thanks for all the research i have dreams about these devices for years.

[@zeroswings2]

what equipment did you use... i.e. the motors/speed control to generate the vortex. I'm curious to know where they can be purchased or how to make them.

[@alexdevalk6398]

This looks to me a lot like the Magnus effect without the use of a physical object. I assume your turbines are basically a torque converter separated by an air gap. It would be interesting if you ran a side by side with a Magnus cylinder to see if the lift results are similar. You should take a look at the videos for the open wing, I could see a similar design beeing used for a UFO shape.

[@3rdaxis649]

That is fascinating. Is one fan pushing and one pulling?

[@GiesbertNijhuis]

@johnnyrebangel Hi John! That was indeed the first question to answer: is it possible to create a stable curved vortex? I could image it wanting to jump out of it's place, but it turns out it will stay in one place IF the surrounding air is stable. The balance is very delicate though; if the winds or sucktion-spots aren't in "harmony", the vortex will disappear immediately. Are you going to build one? -let me know!

[@shanakaliyanage6875]

Not sure if this is gonna work but congratulation on your novel idea!!

[@andyjones7121]

I hate being negative, so first, great job, wonderful work and you're obviously a skilled DIYer. However, at first glance, this is like putting a fan on a sailboat to blow itself across the water. I don't think it's a dead end, but I don't think there's any net thrust as is. Its trying to pull itself up as if I could pull my feet and lift myself. Keep at it though, this is how ideas get refined to be working inventions. I just don't see the closed loop vortex working.

[@pilesofgreat8177]

love the simple hook up . . . . very nice

[@trefod]

Novel idea to be sure. I just fear that the output is alpha to an angle somewhere and that the lift itself is then only a fraction of the energy expended. Are there any calculations or models that might indicate the output?

[@universalmoor]

I think You guys are on to something big!

[@norbertfeurle7905]

It has lots of fluctuating, I think to avoid them the whole device would have to move in one direction. Like a vortex from a vortex cannon that is only stable when it is able to move through the medium. When tried to stop it in mid air it needs a lot of energy input to keep it intact, I think that's the same problem they have in these plasma torus fusion experiments.

[@frankcarollo1818]

could u set two of these at a vertical angle facing opposite directions making a curved vortex, each facing downward? that would create downforce equally on both sides producing lift

[@spotonz]

I love what you're doing.

[@arekussu]

Lekker bezig!! Newness is around the corner for those with the courage to cross the street.

[@5sweatingpalm]

Giebert!!! you are a genius!!!! that - kg i seen tells me it's weightless and that means 60 kg less dense than gravitational pull or air itself.. which ever it is... you are like on the surface of water and that -0 kg mark is the deeper part of the ocean!!!

[@tommychan7170]

hmm.... no. The balance probably has a(set zero) button and it is to show how much force it output

[@inventhead]

cool machine dude ,not sure if it uses electric motors ,if so u might wana try electrolux vac motors g4 i know they will lift a 12 lb bowling ball , 110 lb suction just a thought.

[@kurfbigman7946]

Damm I can't think of anything twaty to say. I guess I'll just have to say well done! And the curved vortex looks truly beautiful and indeed, to my eyes also, unique. Keep up the good work, who knows what will come from your continued research.

[@multi_misa72]

now, make a curved vacuum tube and spin plasma vortex in it..i wonder how it would look like, when it's not aerodynamics but electromagnetism.

[@ElectricUniverseEyes]

I love this idea

[@cocemojoe]

vortexes have always fascinated me also. don't give up.

[@tristenturner832]

neat idea but i think i see a flaw in the theory. the lift and weight you measured at the top and bottom of the vortex will cancel each other out. even with the example shown i believe the aparent weight change is due to the way your scale is set up. on left side of the scale, lift will be generated but on the right side a down force will be generated. that of course is due to the acceleration of the air stream. the issue is how you are using the scale. your mass should be centered on the scale, not hanging on the sides. the only thing i can see that might generate lift is the pressure of the faster moving air, but i feel the fans cancel that out. keep working tho, it is an interesting idea and it may lead to other uses of the technology. unfortunately i just cant see this being able to generate lift.

[@engincallahan2943]

Thank you for sharing your efforts with us, have subscribed and curious about more , wish you success! btw way Im not an expert but maybe you need to work the efficiency of your turbines, and maybe even a totally different shape..?

[@ghostindamachine]

Heel erg interessant. Dank je wel voor het delen.

[@GiesbertNijhuis]

I understand vortex and implosion, but the "Crystal Ion" by Karl Haskell... I don't understand it, does it really work? Do you understand how it works? "It is a mechanical device built to spin at high revolutions without the need for any fuel, combustion or compressed air. -- A tornado is created in the engine that implodes on itself which actually speeds up and sustains the airflow back into the tornado". Hmm.

[@zencontroller]

absolutely brilliant.. thankyou for the upload!

[@AirshipNorway]

The air goes from one side, to the other, and then back threw the pipes?

[@andrewhayward2454]

A stroke of genius.

[@kurfbigman7946]

Nmmmeh..... ???

[@PYakMan1]

Superb, I have been reading up on Schauberger and my search lead me to you, so you are in good company....lol. Thanks for info, will ponder this and offer some intelligent comments, if I am able.

[@aaronetheredge3257]

My question is this: How is the vortex being created in the first place? Because if you're using two suctions forces to create it, it's very similar to turbines turned vertical Still, great concept!

[@checkingthetoob]

Way to go dude! Nice video, I believe you're on to something. Definitely got me thinking! :) Looking forward to more videos. You're an inspiration!

[@nimbleokcn]

I'm pretty sure I just linked you to one of your own videos. I win at the internet!

[@TheLangfords]

0.5N "lift", from a machine weighing, what, 100N? That's not lift you're measuring, it's the mass of the air moved out of the centre of the vortex.

[@timmieskills]

Mark Langford weight isn't measured in N

[@TheLangfords]

Tim Dijkhuizen Yes, it is.

[@timmieskills]

Mark Langford no it isn't Newton is a measurement of force, not of mass

[@TheLangfords]

Tim Dijkhuizen And weight is a force, so it is measured in Newtons. Mass is not weight, weight is a property of mass due to the effort of gravity. That's basic high-school science.

[@timmieskills]

Mark Langford the force that gravity has on the object is measured in Newtons, the weight is not

[@schooptec]

may be a curve is not needed to lift an object. to my understanding, tornados lift up things when the vortex hits the ground and attacks the base of the objects

[@GiesbertNijhuis]

@makinamati Have you seen the video of my coanda effect experiment? Darn; KZbin doesn't allow links here. Copy-past then. watch?v=WPUAq3QObp4 I'm hoping that curved vortex lift is possible and more energy efficient than the coanda effect. Also on my laesieworks site are two pages about the coanda effect. Search for "Coanda_effect-P1"

[@superluminal89]

Could a design like this help your project along? Vortex Thruster Experimental Overview

[@ElectricUniverseEyes]

This was fantastic!!! 🤜🏼⚡️🤛🏻

[@domjohnnydomjohnny]

Really cool, thanks for sharing.

[@pcgamersam2750]

so hes trying to make a hover craft?

[@ShadowRifft]

I seen this Video Years ago, and still think its cool👍😎

[@jimmartin7899]

So a sound vortex would not move anything? Only manipulating the water vapor in the air will only work?

[@georgsteidl2249]

sounds sound, is true man "accoustic levitation" U)O

[@ronaldjansen9973]

Keshe van de keshefoundation maakt ook gebruik van het tornado effect maar dan met waterstofplasma . elke week komt er op dit moment een nieuwe video uit zie MrfixitRick

[@billreliz1703]

ur nt first walter russel and shaubauger did this already years ago but still good progress!Maybe u shuld look at Russelian science adn how Shaubuger created a "flying" saucer that could move quite fast..it will guide u into the rite path brother!Good work!

[@MrROTD]

Interesting I have a hydro/mechanical concept for levitation but I wish I had the means to try it out but its too complicated to build a prototype of it

[@derekvolt]

good work

[@the_larsonfamily]

Do you know what happens when a shotgun shell does when it's fired but not in the barrel? Practically harmless, considering. Both work best in a barrel. Concentration of mass in fluid dynamics. Bernoulli's principle I think.

[@LupusMechanicus]

What's the point the hardest part about orbit is tangential velocity. This gets you up but you need to go around.

[@MasterFeiFongWong]

Lifting forces to make things fly is a fun idea. :) I have something that would be neat to see in action if you could build it. imagine an Electro Magnet connected to the inside roof of a thin light structure lets just say for this experiment its a hollow cube. Now on the inside bottom of this cube is a flat square of material that will be attracted to the electromagnet but this flat square of material on its edges is connected to extending bars that are not attracted to the electro magnet and are just big enough to touch the inner ceiling of the cube (This material and its legs barely touching the ceiling of cube are not directly connected to cube structure). Now we know that the electro magnetic force generated by an electrical charge going into an electro magnetic material is capable of lifting far heavier objects then the electro magnet itself weighs. for details research how powerful electro magnets are. Now in this experiment when electricity is applied to the electro magnet. It will begin trying to lift the object attracted to it up and the legs attached to the object will begin pressing against the inner ceiling of the cube. Once the electromagnet is pulling up on the object with a force greater then the mass of the entire structure the object should lift into the air. just as if you had put your fingers into the hollowed out box and lifted it up from the inside. Effectively this is an internal propulsion system that converts electromagnetic force into mechanical lifting force. My example is basic at best and can be improved upon in many ways but I just wanted to explain the basic idea. A more advanced structural design with the same basic principals in play made much smaller say in the shape of a hexagon and much flatter with proper connectors on the outside edges so many of these objects can be connected together into many shapes and perhaps fitted into under carriages of vehicles to either allow flight or to just compensate for the overall mass of a big truck carrying large shipments effectively reducing the fuel it needs to get from point A to Point B is perhaps better. :)

[@haylingpara]

excellent keep up your very good work, thanks for sharing

[@HuynhTatThanh]

Thank you!

[@gregryker2209]

Thats great, ive seen A mucury cenerfugle system, for toroidle power, yur ap would be a great water driving system for a water jet propulsion,

[@7Paul7air]

keep up the great work!

[@TheNeokorben]

THANKS FOR TRYING ,YOU ARE DOING OR AT LEAST TRYING NEW THINGS,HOW MUCH YOU PAY TO PREPARE THIS STUFF?

[@danbodily499]

It is newtons 2 law for flow along a streamline that is why you are getting lift The curve cause a change in pressure form the streamline to the bottom streamline

[@cavanaughsgarage]

Possible that the lift is just coming from the motors/propellers themselves which create the vortex

[@Лёва-н6з]

English do not own. and did not understand why four transparent hose?

[@clintonlau5826]

What about using magnets to create a vortex to push a boat thru water ?

[@HuynhTatThanh]

Thank you so much! :D

[@crimsonofgomorrah]

Dude you're awesome.

[@erikbostrom3717]

I will remember. Giesbert Nijhuis

[@matitjah]

Wow, I look forward to seeing more of it. May God bless you, in Jesus name.

[@scottrharris]

Helicopters generate curved vortices.

[@ylette]

That's a nice fortex.

[@batchosaurus]

excellent !

[@markkmiecik9797]

I think you could get more lift from the same amount of power driving two ducted fans.

[@kmh2o691]

Instead of smoke, I propose that a fiery spiral swirl in the installation

[@usernamenorm]

Wow! Грандиозно!👍🔥

[@sergiorolo3721]

I have an idea for the engine.. that would work perfectly in a flying source

[@mosesmanaka8109]

Are you aware of the Coanda Effect?

[@applxperience]

Nice!

[@captain42979]

Great job forgot to say that

[@arilton3]

JÁ PENSOU EM COLOCAR UMA HÉLIS EM BAIXO MAIS DEPOSITO DE AR PARA JOGÁ-LO PARA CIMA ,