HOW DO I FEEL ABOUT RIVALS OF AETHER 2 (Steam Highlights & Discussion)

[@PurposeDriven7_]

As an Ultimate player I dropped it immediately for rivals 2. Rivals 2s polish online and overall gameplay is so much more fun, combo heavy, and VERY balanced.

[@lordmew5]

Nah stay out of our game. Screw you ultimate and tr4sh players

[@strides777]

I didn't really see any reason to drop one game for the other I just play both.

[@tuesday4564]

POLAND MENTIOND!!!!🔥🔥🔥🔥

[@azizkash286]

Support this game people, let us be free from nintendo

[@ezia-yp9xx]

For now then we return to our cages when smash 6 drops…

[@PurposeDriven7_]

@@ezia-yp9xx F that, drop smash forever. Let us as a community support a dev team that encourages competitive play not actively tries to destroy it.

[@hellojacobw4151]

@@ezia-yp9xxI was a diehard smash fan until I lost to a steve in tournament. I quit the game and rivals is so much mor fun

[@domilink9747]

@@ezia-yp9xxsmash 6 won’t exist and if it does then sakurai won’t be apart of it

[@zachariahthompson6993]

@@domilink9747maybe it’s not Nintendo people long to be free of

[@edgarustian3948]

Orcanes buttons are insane. Once the hitfalling and wavedashing click youll be shmooving with this character

[@atypicaloddity]

When I first played Orcane, I was dead anytime I didn't have my puddle up. Then I watched tournament play, with Orcanes recovering from insane distances even without puddle. The skill ceiling is great

[@darklurkerirl6101]

Its one of the most complex platform fighter character I ever saw. It's limits are really unknown for now.

[@NanoMoth]

To wavedash you don’t need to time the air dodge down, just hold left or right and then press jump and shield at the same time :)

[@alfiewright1396]

The title makes it seem like you're going to discuss the game as a whole, but it's just you playing

[@luckymanx2978]

Ult player says shields are weak Melee player says Shields are too strong 🤷‍♂️

[@juanse5601]

this shit fire

[@cinemapills3839]

This game is awesome ngl

[@user-et3xn2jm1u]

Orcane def takes a long time to learn, nair bounce and fair momentum are really important tools (at least on roa1). Although some of his cheap stuff from 1 looks a bit nerfed so far, like downstrong spam with no endlag, and the generous tipper hitbox on bair. Maybe they nerfed him because orcane benefits a lot from ledges with his awkward recovery, I don't know.

[@BronzeAgePepper]

his bubbles are also a lot less cheesey, they can still be annoying but they feel less effective than in Rivals 1. RAR Fair still GOATed mobility tool and I love that the Nair bounce from RoA1's Abyss mode was incorporated into his normal kit, with a slight nerf

[@atypicaloddity]

I've found that you get a lot more mobility from his fair if you use c-stick while holding backwards

[@ice5615]

genujenly i think the reason orcanes buttons don't feel strong for you is the laxk of hit falling, it makes EVERY ariel so much more oppressive

[@ice5615]

also using parry more against mashers would definitely help

[@alcomedianblobfish]

@@ice5615 Yea, seeing him struggle with Lily and being like "Do I just have to tank it?" really showed that he's struggling with the Rivals part of Rivals 2. Parry on Lily is crazy strong since it's free invuln but if you're not using parry it just feels impossible to deal with.

[@ice5615]

@@alcomedianblobfish it's so extremely useful and new rivals 2 players are not using it like at ALL

[@0hiMark12]

Making Spongebob proud with all them bubbles!

[@milos1967]

0:26 I don't think that orcane's water should change color like that... it looks kinda like...

[@shesaw]

orange fanta!

[@dumptruck4083]

@@shesawtook the words right out of my mouth

[@aggapuffin]

melted creamsicle

[@dumptruck4083]

@@aggapuffin yeah I can see that too

[@crazycary17]

Melted Creamsicle?

[@Wattmelon]

Iirc the counterplay to Zetter’s Up B (at least in Rivals 1) is that it’s easier to predict where Zetter is gonna end up compared to other recoveries since it has a really long startup and goes in a linear motion before he’s actionable. It was definitely more of a downside in Rivals 1 since there wasn’t a ledge in that game, but he also had only **3 frames** of pratland back then that got nerfed in the sequel lol That’s def something more characters can take advantage of than others. Idk how it is for Orcane, but ik characters like Fors and Clairen can abuse it with their disjoints since they’re more likely to avoid trades.

[@beardalaxy]

yeah not sure what he's on about, it's pretty easy to punish. it's also only a single hit (i'm pretty sure?) whereas fire fox is a multi hit. so if you get hit by it, it's way easier to DI out and then punish the landing. the only good thing about the move is that it adds burn.

[@Wattmelon]

@@beardalaxy The startup before the dash has multihit hitboxes around Zetterburn, similar to Fox, and the dash itself is only one hit. Also I’m pretty sure if you get hit, there’s not enough time to punish the landing afterwards (this move has like *barely* any landing lag lol). The main way to punish it is that you wanna have an idea of where Zetter wants to be, then whiff punish just as the active frames end.

[@RandomDude647]

i think the main way to punish it is to use an aerial and trade with it

[@Wattmelon]

@@RandomDude647 That’s another way too! And like I mentioned before, characters like Clairen and Forsburn can hit them without trading cuz of their disjoints.

[@alfonshedstrom9859]

This game fits like a damn glove, man

[@bonkai09]

Hey DB, im gonna try to watch your videos from now on. Im working really hard right and never have time to chill so I hope i can see you progress through

[@itsReplay]

9:03 what’s the move he does after the down tilt here at 9:03? Is that a smash attack or something? I don’t think I’ve seen it before watching this video

[@itsReplay]

Oh is that orcanes grab?

[@obiwanshinobi3940]

The nemo skin for Orcane is so hard!

[@noahscott3680]

Absa was my main in ROA 1 and I can’t wait until she is back in the game!!!!!!!

[@darklurkerirl6101]

Orcane is something else man... Never did i see a character with this limitless potential before. I cant imagine how much his playstyle would devoloped in 2 or 3 years.

[@Lt31337Luca]

Where's the parry button for that Zetter upb dabreeze

[@AnonymousAnonymous-je8mu]

Hey Dabuz you should do a move tier list series like esam I bet you could do a much better job I’d love to see a series like that

[@hellojacobw4151]

It makes so much sense that Davis chooses Orcane

[@Cat-astr0phe]

He just called zeter up b hard to contest lol

[@pipehelix5776]

As a clairen player I think the tippers sometimes are ridiculous, like jab tipper to fsmash is true on most %s, and the reward for hitting the more easier ones is not quite right. Also having OOS options that are viable for countering jump ins would be perfect and would reward spacing more instead of blocking an attack behind you and can't really do anything

[@ofischial]

You have to contest zetter while he is still charging up b

[@lordmew5]

14:25 this is a terrible take. This makes grabs worse, heavy characters worse, offense in game with already oppressive offense even stronger, and leads matter less.

[@dinotech3416]

Yeah , I think I saw a post explaining that if you don’t allow crouch cancel characters start having infinites . Crouch canceling is just another option that you have in your arsenal. Ultimate never makes me feel this way. For example, I started parrying zetters so hard with lox and I learned how to punish different types of players and use the right tool for the job. Ultimate.. use your best move in neutral and aim it at your opponent.. I can’t tell you how many times I tried to outthink my opponent and ultimate and have lag make a ledge trap fail or a bad Steve just camping and carting. Ultimately makes me feel like I’m getting worse, rivals makes me feel like I’m learning more.. and if I did not have grab as lox my game play would be worse for sure haha Anyway, yeah it was a odd take

[@quadman4448]

DABUZ BE DEEP IN WHAT? 2:21

[@morgboat744]

in there

[@liliqyr]

Oh hey, first. Super excited for this game!

[@legendredux1291]

dabuz cant wavedash lol

[@Pslamist]

For those that don't know, if you just air dodge straight left or right, Rivals will give you a full-length wave dash.

[@BrownieEXE]

And will still be better than you, bot

[@chrismarsh4575]

Luckily movement is good enough in this game already that you can get pretty far without wave dashing.

[@Pslamist]

@@chrismarsh4575 - That's what I was gonna say; Dabuz showed that you don't exactly need it.

[@LeandroNany]

Dabuz does not lile to look at the camera😂❤

[@druidofthewolf5996]

I don't think you play rivals 1

[@QwertYuiop-yt3uh]

I will play it if it comes to switch

[@Pslamist]

@QwertYuiop-yt3uh - You might be waiting a few years, bud. I'm the meantime, consider saving up for a nice used gaming laptop or PC. You can do SO MUCH MORE when you're not stuck on a console. Either way, happy gaming to you.

[@YojimboJames]

I think zetterburn is the most brain dead character to play in any platform fighter. Like you can drool on your controller and do well with him.

[@Crazybark]

i hope they dont change a thing

[@pisos2.0]

Not the furry smash 😭

[@AWanderingSwordsman]

I'm glad to see even you dash attack with clairen when you mean to dash forward up tilt. I hate that so much. Why I gotta wave dash every time I move if I want to use tilts afterward? I'm not lookin to have 300 apm.

[@BronzeAgePepper]

you can map tilts to C-stick, but you lose DACUS. your only alternative is making stick sensitivity extremely low. Join the Xbox/Switch Pro controller side so you have more buttons and can map one to Walk Modifier. It's nicer here.

[@AWanderingSwordsman]

@@BronzeAgePepper I HAVE tilts bound to c stick. It doesn't matter. It will just give you dash attack no matter what. There is no way to cancel a normal dash directionly into a tilt. You can wavedash out of the dash and tilt but that defeats the purpose of dashing in the first place and you can baby dash and tilt which is as close as you can get to what I want but it feels like an execution barrier that just has no reason to exist.

[@pareod]

@@AWanderingSwordsman I've been talking about these execution barriers a lot lately. Wavedash spam, dacus, shine wavedash combos. The usual response of "it's easy in this game, you get used to it" will likely be the reason this game stays niche.

[@AWanderingSwordsman]

@@pareod completely agree. I really thought their plan with rivals 2 was to expand things to bring in the smash ult casual crowd but that for sure isn't going to happen. The amount of time you have to put in before your character does what you want it to is too long, plain and simple.

[@Gurl_pNg]

Rivals 1 is prob my fav platform fighter and I plan on picking up Rivals 2 but CC being a problem for a lot of people I watch is kinda a turnoff.(I'm a street fighter player don't get all pissy about my opinion}

[@tashi321]

i got to plat and ppl started cc'ing and I was in shambles forba sec til o adapted but even then it's not really something you can fully adapt to it feels like

[@superdragonsunshine]

Zetterburn is super fucked up ool

[@HighLanderPonyYT]

Great game but it could borrow the "neutral A" and "neutral B" button binds from Multiversus.

[@Pslamist]

@@HighLanderPonyYT - You can change your "air parry" button to neutral special, or that might even be the default. So you at least get n special in the air.

[@HighLanderPonyYT]

Yea, thx! It works mid air by default but not on the ground (you just parry duh). I'll take a look at what you suggested. I'll still be hurting for a neutral A button though. Lol

[@anonymous7024]

He’s so cool The game is so cool But not as cool as

[@daviddaniel8304]

SUPEEEEEEERRRRR SMASSSSSSSHHHH, BROOTHEEEEEEEEEEERRRRSSS

[@morgboat744]

raid shadow legends

[@pareod]

My biggest issue with the game is that it does not go far enough towards make playing easy. In my opinion, playing should be easy so that all the fun choices are in how you play, which is what Ult gets right. The hardest things to do in Ult are B-reverse and stage tech, so it's all about good positioning, good spacing on attacks, good neutral, etc. In Rivals 2, it feels like you have to fight with the game before you get to the fun choices. For example, what does a wavedashing feature achieve? Fast ambiguous movement to complement all other gameplay options, which is a simple concept. But then just make normal movement achieve this instead of requiring that players constantly input wavedash. Even a dedicated wavedash button isn't enough I don't think, cuz you'll still be mashing it all match. I've seen defenses like "wavedashing is so easy in Rivals 2, you get used to it," but the truth is that most players will just quit playing rather than get used to it. Another example: DACUS, or inputting a dash attack followed quickly by a smash attack to get a fast sliding smash attack. Ranno uses this at mid-high percent to confirm down-tilt into up-smash. But Greninja and Shiek can get the exact same thing without needing to learn this tech, just down-tilt into dash up-smash. Again, players will get annoyed that they inconsistently get DACUS and go back to Smash. Which is fine as long as Rivals 2 is okay with being niche like Rivals 1. Another example: Zetterburn shine wavedash shine combos. If the devs want to allow these combos, then just build them into the move. Shine followed by direction gives you a wavedash. It's little things like this all over the place that need to be addressed if Rivals 2 wants a decent following.

[@zeefacterfafter3]

yeah you have no idea what you're talking about

[@marin9412]

Yea except that for Ranno it’s an actual DI mixup and you only have to dacus on DI out, the additional movement options isn’t forced it just adds additional layers of mind games and player choices

[@pareod]

@@marin9412 but if you "have to" dacus when they di out, then it is forced on the player. Otherwise you miss taking the stock. And this brings up another execution issue: you have to reach to di with two very different inputs very quickly, rather than one input spaced differently.

[@lordmew5]

I'll allow you to play dabuz because you're a bra2l player but you tr4sh and ultimate players need to stay out. You hated only melee and pm now you want to play our game.

[@Pslamist]

@lordmew5 - Nah, then playing gives you a chance to beat em up, and get money going to someone other than Nintendo. I welcome them with open arms.

[@alcomedianblobfish]

I don't hate Melee, but I would never want to play it just because of all the random anarchisms it has. Stuff like L-cancelling, the lack of buffer, the horrible visual telegraphing of anything, and how punishing mechanics like ledgedashing are before you become good at video games. PM (and more specifically P+) fixed around half of my problems with Melee, but on top of the things I still don't care for about it it's online is literally unplayable 98% of the time, and as someone who lives in the middle of nowhere that's not something I'm able to give up unless I want to exclusively play against CPUs. Rivals 2 fixes nearly all of my problems with Melee and P+, plus it has a dev team which doesn't hate their most passionate players. I'm sure a lot of other Ult and Sm4sh players feel the same, and honestly when you start to play Rivals 2 (or even P+ for that matter) going back to Ult and Sm4sh feels like running through honey while sleep deprived. The only thing that Rivals 2 took from Melee that I don't care for is crouch canceling, and even then that's strictly a matter of taste and I'm more than willing to get over myself and enjoy what is by far the best platfigher I've ever had the good fortune of experiencing. Rivals 2 taking a ton of inspiration from things like P+ and Melee really gives a golden opportunity to bring a lot of people disillusioned with Ult and it's meta of Sonic Steve and Kazuya, and that group will only mean good things for Rivals 2 as a game. The Rivals 2 devs also clearly think the same thing, and I think it's a really smart choice on their part.

[@lordmew5]

@@alcomedianblobfish i agree with most of what you said, but you are dead wrong about L-canceling. The reason why L canceling works is the same reason things like wavedsshing work. The way smash works as a game is that it gives you basic options. However, you can get better options for more risk. Often, it allows you to keep options open at the expense of a harder window of opportunity. Wavedashing is the perfect example you essentially use it as a burst of movement speed that allows you to keep all options at the cost of being in a bad position if you fail. You could run to the player if you don't need all your options, or you could walk to them if you don't need to approach that fast. You can also just reset back to neutral. You, however, can instead wavedash to them if you need to F smash them. The wavedash is not without risk. If you press L too fast, you miss your wavedash and just jump, which is a risky place, and you lose your stage control too late, and you get a triangle jump that while not useless is wasted time when trying to pursue and has more lag than wavedash or running or doing nothing. This is the fundamentals of why all advanced tech is useful in Smash, including L canceling, and is why these games get worse when you can just remove the barriers

[@benjimiguel17]

game, gatekeeping much? “Our” game? Melee’s still massive, how about you stop playing “My” game, someone who’s interested in 2D platformers and has been supporting Rivals since Rivals 1 release, and not just because it has inspiration from a broken piece of shit made 20 years ago. fuck out of here

[@alcomedianblobfish]

@@lordmew5 But you see, that’s just my problem with L cancelling: there’s no risk. Is simply always optimal to L cancel and by not doing it you’re just at a disadvantage in every situation. It’s boring because it doesn’t encourage any interesting decision making the way wave dashing does, and just makes the game feel like trash for anyone who isn’t perfect at it yet.

[@toxic_cowZ]

TBH it looks like uglier rivals 1, no thanks.

[@slayalastor6397]

What are you smoking ???💀

[@toxic_cowZ]

@@slayalastor6397 just my opinion i really like the way rivals 1 looks and this just looks awful to me, talking purely visuals obviously i can tell its slightly different.

[@HighLanderPonyYT]

I think it's fine but the presentation (VFX, SFX) are definitely one of the weakest points.

[@slayalastor6397]

@@toxic_cowZ that’s true it could be your opinion but no way is rivals1 is better looking then rivals2, it might for you but it’s a fact that’s it is not.

[@user-et3xn2jm1u]

@@slayalastor6397 except that it is, factually, objectively speaking. I can tell because I know how to judge art objectively, making me the only proper authority on these things.

[@tomwalsh2002]

Worst platformer fighter since multiversus season 2 OG SHUT down. the buck store is god awful 20 quid a skin they learnt nothing alienated everything that made rivals 1 unique and ludwig & offbrand need their publishing money back so PAID SKINS are shoved in our faces with ADDED fomo events and a battlepass.... WHAT A JOKE>

[@ConfusedTimeWizard]

😅

[@toxicceoofcharisma]

I'm pretty sure the community asked for this monetization so that's the community at fault

[@zeefacterfafter3]

you can get skins for free pretty easily lmao

[@marin9412]

All characters and gameplay features are going to be free and it’s been explicitly stated that there’s gonna be no fomo, what are you smoking

[@Jay-xs6wd]

@@marin9412fr as an active member of the rivals 2 community we were freaking out until they said no fomo after early bird wrastor

[@marin9412]

« Why is is not like fox in melee » maybe because this is zetterburn for rivals of Arther have you thought of that