Debate JRobin presup vs TJump

[@ddwreck42]

presup = absolutely worthless

[@ThermaL-ty7bw]

yeah , but apparently ... so are All the rest , theist and atheist alike , people are lazy ignorant and dumb Beyond belief ... and are only getting more lazy ignorant and dumb

[@tomfrombrunswick7571]

Presuppositionalism seems to consist of constant interruptions, insults and the complete inability to engage with the other side. It is to logic as a bar fight is to logic

[@atheistgod5212]

Theists are frustrating. Can't even baby step them through their inadequate arguments.

[@YoutubePremiumMem]

I think he knew he just won't admit it.

[@Youtubehater17]

Why do theists always claim " you're cutting out", " I can't hear you"... when the questions start getting hard?

[@weirdwilliam8500]

Around 30:00 is where the wheels fall off and the presupp garbage is on full display.

[@xxnoxx-xp5bl]

The wheels were off when JRobin couldn't show what the laws of nature he claimed couldn't do things were or why they couldn't.

[@YoutubePremiumMem]

Agreed. He had to double down on his stupid argument.

[@z08840]

you can listen this indefinitely - it's how ridiculous and funny presup is

[@xxnoxx-xp5bl]

Dude literally opened with 'laws of nature can't do x' then refuses to state what he thinks those laws are or why. Debate lost. End of.

[@eljay5746]

JRobin so confident in his ignorance.

[@jeffbenelli6999]

How… How… How does this person not see his argument comes down to God is true because I say so and I say so, because the Bible says so.

[@Leece10]

On top of that the voices in his head reveal that god is true

[@hkg8788]

indoctrination

[@CUTESYMCKITTEN]

The most annoying position, expressed in the most annoying voice, ever! Never again!

[@PhysiKarlz]

Queue the comments: "JRobin is back?" And "Is this new?"

[@30yearsoldiam1]

Nobody asked that and nobody cares.

[@scottbroadfoot3530]

I imagine what my god is and imagine what he can do, but can't prove either thing. Therefore I must be right. Lol. Presups are the dumbest theists .

[@TaylorWalston]

I get frustrated with this idea of world view. In the Jedi worldview does not make the Jedi worldview a valid world view. Theists act like in the Yahweh worldview they have accomplished something that the Jedi worldview has not, i.e. trying to define a reality into existence. When the entire question is does a god exist. If a god does not exist, the Yahweh worldview is just as fictional as the Jedi worldview.

[@gerhardgiedrojc991]

Insufferable, not worth the time to listen to this presup insanity.

[@peterwyetzner5276]

I would question the concept of "the Christian God"- he seems to be using it to mean "the properties needed to explain what I want to explain". After all, the Bible has all sorts of things to say about God and describes him in different ways; and the Hebrew Bible isn't consistent within itself , to say nothing of how different its theology is from that of the New Testament. Likewise the phrase "Christian world view"- do all Christians think the same thing about God, or anything else? And what does that have to do with the reasons why we exist as we do? (I expect that people like JRobin would not define as Christian people who think otherwise.)

[@northernbrother1258]

Ugh JRobin...Darth Dawkins is at least entertaining for half a minute, this guy is a vapid wannabe!

[@eljay5746]

Jrobin wants to be able to finish but doesn't let Tj finish a sentence.

[@劉炎-p9z]

I too like to break logic down step by step, but I really don't know how to deal with people coming with a speech and always want to skip ahead.

[@zpd8003]

if you're gonna claim that revelation is required for knowledge, then your god's knowledge must also come from revelation. If you want make an exception for your god i.e. special pleading, that proves your premise wrong.

[@sgringo]

When did this debate take place?

[@drewbac]

Many moons ago

[@mattikaronen7728]

Such a total smack down! Good job, Tom!!

[@321bytor]

The 'metaphysical void' is between JRobin's ears

[@davex444]

Is it a requirement of being a pre-sup to be an asshole too?

[@chinookcrafts]

Why do presuppers, why do presuppers, why do presuppers, why do presuppers ask questions like this? I mean, I know why. But lord it's exhausting.

[@Nelsonstephenson7654]

“That which is ultimate”. Reality is what’s ultimate. Ask them to describe ultimate and they will just describe god so to a presup ultimate just means imaginary.

[@YoutubePremiumMem]

Tom, you owned him. Nice job.

[@beliefisnotachoice]

Two people making a pretty strong case for atheism.

[@subhuman3408]

1:30:20 this is what they don't understand

[@eaglebeak1924]

It's the same old nonsense. The whole argument is grounded in revelation. He and other Darth minions never mention how they receive these all-important words from their imaginary friend. I assume that it's from a very old compilation of mythical wives' tales written by ignorant, superstitious goat rooters.

[@begshallots]

Why does he repeat everything three times?

[@eaglebeak1924]

I noticed the same thing. I think it's a stammer, but it's a strange type, as it only affects the first few words of each sentence and is always repeated three times.

[@xpressivebex7162]

Basically his whole point is " I appeal to bs n presup of god but I can't explain why or what that means but I do just want to talk about the fact I do" lmao. Honestly how do u think your idea is the right 1 over others but don't even know what tool u used. I cringed everytime he said it follows n tried to rush to dumb conclusions. Bro everything leading to your answer even when it doesn't lol cognitive disonance is strong in this 1 . Thnx for ur patience tjump great video as usual. 😇

[@drivestick]

JRobin is a verbal bully.

[@drivestick]

And wrong.

[@cebro648]

This is embarrassing . Tjump is clearly trying to dictate the conversation so that it can't advance lol . Then he's threatening to mute JRobin to keep JRobin from exposing him. Then, the fanboys in the comment section are pretending that Tjump is making his case lol. What are these laws of nature that all of reality is contigent upon? What is grounding these laws of nature ? And how are they ultimate? These are the questions that Tjump is running from, lol . Atheism is such a desperate religion. And atheist are allergic to learning the burden of proof . This is just embarrassing 😂😂

[@bonfire010]

The fact you think atheism is a religion already disqualifies you from this conversation. 🤣 Love to see proof of God but as we all know Religion is a manmade creation based on ignorance.

[@xxnoxx-xp5bl]

What makes you think laws of nature need to be grounded? TJump also directly answered the question of what grounds the laws of nature by pointing out that they aren't grounded by anything else. A tree is a tree because it is a tree - what is that grounded on? It's just a necessary fact. Atheism is not a religion, it is the rejection of religious claims. There is no wider assertion or belief system involved.

[@cebro648]

@xxnoxx-xp5bl They have to be grounded because if the laws of nature are ultimate. They everything must be contigent of them. They laws of nature would have to be the source of all existence. They can't just ne mere descriptions. God is what is ultimate. God created the laws of nature . And he govern the universe using laws , logic , design , fine tuning , order etc etc . Explain to me how the laws of nature created all of reality? And where did they come from ? Do they just exist? Are they ultimate? Or are they just of tool of something greater . Tjump didn't explain anything . Tjump derailed the conversation and he wouldn't answer the question where they came from. He doesn't want to explain what ground them because his religion preaches that reality is just reality and no explanation is necessary. Because he doesn't have an explanation

[@xxnoxx-xp5bl]

@@cebro648 What makes you think reality was created? Every one of your assertions depends on that. For further context, our current universe isn't all reality, it's just the universe we can observe currently. We don't know what the conditions were before it, or what could be outside of it. The 'laws of nature' simply describe what we currently see within our own universe, not where it came from or its 'ultimate' nature. Please demonstrate what exists outside of our universe, why it was created and why it was God that did it. Also - which God? Because while we don't know the full nature of reality, the God of the Bible (and most historic god claims) can be dismissed fairly trivially. God isn't an answer on its own. To answer your questions: Explain to me how the laws of nature created all of reality? - Who said they did? I don't know that they did or that reality was 'created'. How do you know it was. And where did they come from ? Do they just exist? The laws of nature as a description of our current universe are just observed reality. A tree is a tree because it is not 'not a tree'. I don't think logic was created. Are they ultimate? - What is 'ultimate'? What makes you think anything is ultimate? Or are they just of tool of something greater? - I don't see any reason to assume the laws of our current universe are ultimate or the 'tools of something 'greater.' If reality has always existed, there is not creator and no need for tools - how did you establish that reality was created and hasn't always existed?

[@cebro648]

@xxnoxx-xp5bl So you think that all aspects of reality are just a brut fact ? This laws and the universe popped in existence without causation? What is reality?

[@chivasbarca]

Damn I’ve never seen Tjump getting destroyed this hard

[@hamfastgamwich]

I hardly heard a single coherent statement from JRobin What do you think his best argument was?

[@MDHilgersom]

​@@hamfastgamwich"You're so childish, you're the child." Imo best argument

[@xxnoxx-xp5bl]

How exactly?

[@gerhardgiedrojc991]

Trolling

[@LordJesusChristisGodandSaviour]

God, the Lord Jesus Christ loves you! Restore your relationship with God by repenting of your sins and putting your faith in Jesus Christ, "... that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, and that He was buried, and that He was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures..." (1 Corinthians 15:3-4)

[@DB-kn8hg]

Tjump needs to get a job