Did Africa Have The First Iron Age?

Did iron working reach sub saharan Africa from the north or did it in fact have the earliest iron age? Oooooh lets see!
thumbnail by Ettore Mazza
ettore.mazza?ig...
Thanks to Pete Bensen for helping with recording.
/ stefanmilo
Sources:
1. Kaufman, Brett, et al. “Ferrous Metallurgy from the Bir Massouda Metallurgical Precinct at Phoenician and Punic Carthage and the Beginning of the North African Iron Age.” Journal of Archaeological Science, vol. 71, 2016, pp. 33-50., doi:10.1016/j.jas.2016.04.002.
2. Sanmartí, Joan, et al. “Filling Gaps in the Protohistory of the Eastern Maghreb: The Althiburos Archaeological Project (El Kef, Tunisia).” Journal of African Archaeology, vol. 10, no. 1, 2012, pp. 21-44., www.jstor.org/stable/43135565. Accessed 2 Nov. 2020.
3. Humphris, J., Scheibner, T. A New Radiocarbon Chronology for Ancient Iron Production in the Meroe Region of Sudan. Afr Archaeol Rev 34, 377-413 (2017). doi.org/10.1007/s10437-017-92...
4. Alpern, S. (2005). Did They or Didn't They Invent It? Iron in Sub-Saharan Africa. History in Africa, 32, 41-94. doi:10.1353/hia.2005.0003
5. Almathen, Faisal, et al. “Ancient and Modern DNA Reveal Dynamics of Domestication and Cross-Continental Dispersal of the Dromedary.” Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences of the United States of America, vol. 113, no. 24, 2016, pp. 6707-6712. JSTOR, www.jstor.org/stable/26470279. Accessed 4 Nov. 2020.
6. africanrockart.britishmuseum....
7. Anderson H. Chariots in Saharan rock art: An aesthetic and cognitive review. Journal of Social Archaeology. 2016;16(3):286-306. doi:10.1177/1469605316661388
8. Connah, Graham. “The West African Savanna.” African Civilizations: an Archaeological Perspective, by Graham Connah, Cambridge University Press, 2016, pp. 149-184.
9. “Sudanic Genesis: Nubia.” African Civilizations: an Archaeological Perspective, by Graham Connah, Cambridge University Press, 2016, pp. 69-110.
10. Holl, A. (2020, June 30). The Origins of African Metallurgies. Oxford Research Encyclopedia of Anthropology. Retrieved 6 Nov. 2020, from oxfordre.com/anthropology/vie....
11. Craddock, Paul. “New Paradigms for Old Iron: Thoughts on É. Zangato & A.F.C. Holl's New Paradigms for Old Iron: Thoughts on É. Zangato & A.F.C. Holl's ‘On the Iron Front.’” Journal of African Archaeology, vol. 8, no. 1, 2010, pp. 29-36., doi:10.3213/1612-1651-10157.
12. Deme, Alioune, and Susan K. Mcintosh. “Excavations at Walaldé: New Light on the Settlement of the Middle Senegal Valley by Iron-Using Peoples.” Journal of African Archaeology, vol. 4, no. 2, 2006, pp. 317-347., doi:10.3213/1612-1651-10078.
13. Franke, Gabriele. “A Chronology of the Central Nigerian Nok Culture - 1500 BC to the Beginning of the Common Era.” Journal of African Archaeology, vol. 14, no. 3, 2016, pp. 257-289. JSTOR, www.jstor.org/stable/44295242. Accessed 9 Nov. 2020.
14. Junius, Henrik. “Nok Early Iron Production in Central Nigeria - New Finds and Features.” Journal of African Archaeology, vol. 14, no. 3, 2016, pp. 291-311. JSTOR, www.jstor.org/stable/44295243. Accessed 9 Nov. 2020.
15. Chirikure, Shadreck. “On Evidence, Ideas and Fantasy: The Origins of Iron in Sub-Saharan Africa Thoughts on É. Zangato & A.F.C. Holl's ‘On the Iron Front.’” Journal of African Archaeology, vol. 8, no. 1, 2010, pp. 25-28. JSTOR, www.jstor.org/stable/43135498. Accessed 9 Nov. 2020.
16. Erb-Satullo, Nathaniel L. “The Innovation and Adoption of Iron in the Ancient Near East.” Journal of Archaeological Research, vol. 27, no. 4, 2019, pp. 557-607., doi:10.1007/s10814-019-09129-6.
17. Rehder, J. E. The Mastery and Uses of Fire in Antiquity. McGill-Queen's University Press, 2000.
18. Rehren, Thilo, et al. “5,000 Years Old Egyptian Iron Beads Made from Hammered Meteoritic Iron.” Journal of Archaeological Science, vol. 40, no. 12, 2013, pp. 4785-4792., doi:10.1016/j.jas.2013.06.002.
19. University Of Arizona. "Making Iron The Old-Fashioned Way Is A Tricky Business." ScienceDaily. ScienceDaily, 14 October 2005. www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2005/10/051011073801.htm.
20. Erb-Satullo, Nathaniel L. “The Innovation and Adoption of Iron in the Ancient Near East.” Journal of Archaeological Research, vol. 27, no. 4, 2019, pp. 557-607., doi:10.1007/s10814-019-09129-6.
21. Radivojević, M., Rehren, T., Kuzmanović-Cvetković, J., Jovanović, M., & Northover, J. (2013). Tainted ores and the rise of tin bronzes in Eurasia, c. 6500 years ago. Antiquity, 87(338), 1030-1045. doi:10.1017/S0003598X0004984X
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www.stefanmilo.com
Historysmilo
historysmilo

[@StefanMilo]

Iron't you glad I made this video? Check out From Nothing's: kzbin.info/www/bejne/aaizapd7iJeXoa8 & Ollie Bye's: Not finished yet but I'll update this soon.

[@jimmyshrimbe9361]

Love it!!

[@IFY0USEEKAY]

Yes!!! Some tin wrong though. Your puns are bad.. Iron mine worse than yours? Steel you try....

[@DelijeSerbia]

As a Serbian I really wish we invest more in Vinca. There are so many discoveries that could be made there.

[@aidanmagill6769]

Boooooo

[@ptonpc]

The Irn Bru and Daddie's sauce helped

[@joshuastarkloff9602]

Africa of the antiquity is so interesting. Outside of Egypt, Carthage, and Nubia not much is really known for non history nerds

[@TaariikhdaAfrika]

The city states in the Horn are pretty well known, no?

[@OkurkaBinLadin]

@@TaariikhdaAfrika No.

[@TaariikhdaAfrika]

@@OkurkaBinLadin I thought most people with even the slightest bit of interest in trade in antiquity would know of them. Not to even mention D'mt and the succeeding Aksumite Kingdom that was very much up and running in antiquity, I'd say they're pretty well known.

[@ovoj]

@@TaariikhdaAfrika to you but most westerners bought the racist drivel of colonialism and savages and still believe it till now so the concept of advanced African civilisations other than Egypt is straight up heresy to them

[@jonajo9757]

Kinda irritates me when people think Egypt and Nubia as the only civilizations worth mentioning. When will they mention that fucking Mansa Musa, the richest man in history spent so much gold in Egypt that he fucking destroyed their economy for an entire decade!?

[@phoule76]

When I get kicked out of the house and have to sleep in the car, I also pretend I just wanted to see the sunrise.

[@rani.andretti]

:(

[@SenorTucano]

Time to get a new girlfriend mate

[@prettylights8873]

@@amenrakwamehotepporchprima9307 oi bloke how many broads named "Peter" do ya know????

[@TahtahmesDiary]

@@prettylights8873 Maybe they were talking about assuming what kind of love interests Peter has? 🤔

[@prettylights8873]

@@TahtahmesDiary nah, was definitely referring to the "mate" bit.

[@SC-zq6cu]

The problem with iron artifacts is that it becomes very hard very quickly to get well preserved iron samples from older time periods. For example: Bronze artifacts from ~2000 BCE are sometimes better preserved than iron artifacts from ~1200 CE.

[@lukasgaizauskas1127]

Yes, but the slag from the production process would still be preserved

[@SC-zq6cu]

@@lukasgaizauskas1127 Yes but slag won't tell you who used the iron or where it went.

[@SC-zq6cu]

@Marty Magpie Not true if there is a lot of it.

[@SC-zq6cu]

@@amenrakwamehotepporchprima9307 The kind of dryness needed to stop iron from rusting over thousands of years is pretty rare on earth and also not coincidentally occur in areas where very few people live if at all. iron rusts very easily.

[@SC-zq6cu]

@@amenrakwamehotepporchprima9307 North Africa and the sahara region where people live aren't that dry. Look at the iron stuff used in those places. A lot of rusting still happens. Less than that of humid areas of course, but it isn't negligible and will eat up the iron over a thousand years. 6 iron artifacts that were found. Many could've been made, most lost. And besides those 6(or 2) were made in early days. Its not like nobody made anything from iron in later more recent times. As no. of iron artifacts increased those 6(2) would've become not so valuable. Of those 33% that are desert about a third is the cold desert of antarctica. The total desert surface area is about 18,911,884 sq. mi. The total area of antarctic desert is 5,405,000 sq. mi. A little less than 1/3 rd of the total desert surface.

[@HistoryTime]

A wonderful surprise to wake up to

[@spencerellis83]

I went to sleep to history time 🙌🏼

[@StefanMilo]

You say that to all the history channels

[@evanlaughlin6345]

@@StefanMilo m.kzbin.info/www/bejne/j2LOd36snbF0qrc

[@GumaroRVillamil]

A surprise to be sure, but a welcome one

[@dagothher]

fancy seeing u here

[@FromNothing]

Amazing content as usual man. Love it alot and perfect compliment to my mapping part of this collaboration.

[@Zoltar69]

Your videos sent me here! Thanks for all of your videos.

[@FromNothing]

@@amenrakwamehotepporchprima9307 There's never a shortage of content to produce from African history.

[@jonasMasterCraft]

I your videos! :D

[@bobcharlie2337]

No matter which side of the argument you are on, it's clear that there needs to be research and excavations in Africa. It's really cool to learn more about the iron age on the continent of Africa.

[@warrenny]

Like a lot of "arguments" these days, almost no one is on the "other" side. It's just the same boring cliches thrown about. Scientists of all branches of learning have been mining every corner of society and the planet looking for information and answers. No one serious is leaving out any particular group, race, culture, etc. in the pursuit of knowledge.

[@Heavyisthecrown]

@@warrennyexactly they aren’t being left out. Also if a bunch of people went there and started digging and Hod forbid they were white?!? 😂 they’d be racist. Also everyone’s all about the western world leaving everyone alone. So they can do it themselves. Why doesn’t Africa discover its own history if it wants to? I doubt they need or want any help. Any help will be highly scrutinized and I doubt anyone wants to open that can of worms in todays world

[@A3Kr0n]

It's not the age of the wood that matters but how you wiggle your stick.

[@gloriascientiae7435]

this knowledge can cause quite a situation in the carbon dating department

[@curtisthomas2670]

"the older the wood the etter the heat"

[@edwardgreen4684]

I just couldn't grasp this radio carbon dating time gap issue until I saw that metal horses head with a fairly light tiarra and it all just magically fell into place

[@coffeeabernethy2823]

In science, if you've had an idea, most likely someone else has as well. So it's entirely possible, maybe even likely, that just like calculus, iron working was invented more than once, in more than one place.

[@askforcorn]

Convergent innovation!

[@cadian101st]

It almost certainly was. Writing was developed independently multiple times, as was agriculture, among many different innovations.

[@coffeeabernethy2823]

Convergent...

[@askforcorn]

@@coffeeabernethy2823 absolutely

[@kim1570]

Correct, just like the morphic field. There's a field of knowledge that organisms of the same species can tap into and sort of download information from, independently at different geographical locations.

[@MrrMatts]

What a man smashing out all these interesting videos! I've been struggling with sleep recently, and I say this in the nicest possible sense, your videos are fantastic to have on if I can't get to sleep. They are wonderfully calming and if I still can't sleep, at least I'm learning about some fascinating topics. Thank you for your hard work and big love to you Stefan!

[@istvansipos9940]

if you speak at least 1 foreign language, try counting. 1 in your first language, then 2 in a foreign one and so on. I had to use this method twice (yeah, I sleep well in general), and I don't remember reaching 40 (Hungarian, English, German)

[@PeachysMom]

@@istvansipos9940 I do it with the alphabet backwards and forwards in all the languages I know

[@dogons2k12]

> - Pringle, Heather. "Seeking Africa's First Iron Men" (PDF). Science. p. 2. - Holl, Augustin F. C. (June 2020). "The Origins of African Metallurgies". Oxford Research Encyclopedias. 22 (4): 415-438. *Below are lectures (which can be found on youtube) by Professor Chris Ehret (University of California)* Ancient Africa in world history: Innovation, Invention, and Impact Lecture by Chris Ehret (University of California) Africanity of Ancient Egypt Lecture by Chris Ehret (University of California)

[@erievhs]

Thank you!

[@jackdelvo2702]

Pottery was the first manmade material. To make pottery you need high heat, a kiln. Mess around with high heat for long enough you notice its effects on various other raw materials besides clay. So where ever pottery is produced given enough time and curiosity metallurgy follows.

[@mpetersen6]

Then basically metallurgy could have begun with the Jomon. Personally I think one of the first copper ages could well have been in the Lake Superior region due to the generous amounts of nearly pure float copper.

[@charlesaanonson3954]

The same thing could be said about gold. Smelting gold takes some pretty high temperatures as well. Iron spear and axe points were very valuable and useful. Anybody that knew how to make them could get rich very fast. The message would spread widely and quickly.

[@mpetersen6]

@@Eidolon1andOnly If they have glaze on the pottery they've got kilns. One thing I think societies need to make the jump to metals is a readily accessible and workable source of metal. And that really only works with things like float copper and iron nickel meteors without smelting.

[@ivanclark2275]

You may not like it, but this is what peak archeology looks like

[@marcv2648]

So you're saying there's nowhere to go, but down from here. Is that good or bad?

[@romariocoffie4702]

@@marcv2648 How is he saying theres no way to go but down?

[@marcv2648]

@@romariocoffie4702 Because he said peak. There is nowhere higher than peak. It's only downhill after that.

[@prettylights8873]

@@marcv2648 more history channel episodes

[@fbsfgr]

Peak UNESCO sponsored political "archeology" that was looking for a set answer before they awarded their study. What a fucking joke.

[@misanthropicservitorofmars2116]

“I know this is an archeology channel but the memes should be fresh” That’s a man I can get behind.

[@YaBoiDREX]

Thank you for this video! African archeology is criminally ignored.

[@visaodissidente5560]

Bullshit. Many highly sophisticated European cultures are also neglected, such as the Danubian Civilization.

[@YaBoiDREX]

@@visaodissidente5560 Okay? Didn’t say they weren’t.

[@MrJovon321]

@@YaBoiDREX The weird paranoid reflex some folks have when it comes to anything concerning Africa or 'duh blacks'

[@grahamcole5203]

I think Egypt and Sudan are in Africa

[@curiousman3655]

@@visaodissidente5560 bro calm down 😭😭

[@jacksonneptune4083]

It's remarkable that you managed to bring this type of dense and esoteric debate to an popular platform like KZbin. Keep it up!

[@TommoCarroll]

The use of Irn Bru constantly throughout this video made me more happy than it should. This was so interesting, I love when topics challenge preconceived ideas/stuff we just assume is fact!

[@rooknado]

Irn Bru?

[@wizard680]

13:05 Its 2020, the pandemic has hit so hard that our favorite youtube is forced to use a plastic spoon as a mic.

[@debralucas2224]

"Captains Log."

[@Cheeseatingjunglista]

What? He's got a "new" mic spoon? What happened to the old tiny white plastic spoon? What sort of cruel swine breaks the Sacred SpoonoMic baton/mace/fasci, an object crucial to our as yet un-named cult of Milo Info Cargo. This has to stop

[@benr.4238]

Na, that's just standard Stefan Milo. 2020 Milo now eats bacon sandwiches in the rain at a park.

[@douglasphillips5870]

Poetry is a reasonable precursor to iron. Potters could have accidentally smelted crude iron in kilns then developed the technology to work it.

[@josephdavis1704]

Poetry, my favorite precursor to iron.

[@lostpony4885]

Yet irony is wasted sans pottery

[@suzbone]

By the end of your first sentence, I was super excited to read whatever poetry you were gonna come up with, Douglas lololol 😅😂

[@bartolomeothesatyr]

Poetry stirs the heart, inflamed passions lead to conflict, conflict drives ironworking for weapons of war. Makes total sense, even if it was an autocorrect typo.

[@tinkerstrade3553]

I confess, I've left my own autocorrect misplaced words in a post. Sometimes the change would give it a flavor that tickled my fancy. "There's many a truth in misspelled words." - S. Freud, (Or he should have said that!)

[@0li_vi_er]

Good video. But I noticed one very important mistake: 2:43 "Scottish soft drinks are made from iron". They're actually made from the two main things you find in Scotland. Shortbread and heroin.

[@kiritugeorge4684]

When it comes to Africa, the outside world always comes at it with the highest levels of doubt, skepticism and underestimation, even when Africa produces good evidence on par with other regions of the world.

[@ohlangeni]

Absolutely. Invention of Writing (the writing system in use in the world today) is placed doubt in favour of borrowing from Sumer far away when the Sumerian cuneiform is different from the sound-system invented in Sudan (Ta Seti), the Hieroglyaphics used in Kush and Egypt. The African writing system (often called Egyptian by Europeans) commenced in the same millenia 3,320BC as the Sumerian cuneiform.

[@Grimloxz]

Absolutely sir. In almost every area of significance this attitude is always present…

[@JonathanMartin884]

I actually use West African iron technology to make this exact point in my world history class.

[@TristanCleveland]

Yep.

[@rosalynbeatty8310]

@@ohlangeni KZbin-- Ancient African Writing Scripts or Systems. West Africans had this invention.

[@EmperorTigerstar]

1:43 That’s fine. Emperors beat kings.

[@StefanMilo]

I wouldn't ever insult you by calling you a king.

[@zachfreeman2502]

How are you everywhere?

[@zachfreeman2502]

@Franky Padilla Emperor Tigerstar, he seems to comment in like half the videos I watch.

[@trollerjakthetrollinggod-e7761]

@@zachfreeman2502 He's the Emperor. Can't escape his rule.

[@merrymerryjerry6736]

@Franky Padilla Nah, rock flies right through paper!

[@TheHistocrat]

This had to come out right when I don't have time to watch it didn't it

[@Jobe-13]

HONESTLY

[@levitatingoctahedron922]

that's fine, it's absurd revisionism.

[@miyojewoltsnasonth2159]

@@levitatingoctahedron922 What specifically is revisionist?

[@averongodoffire8098]

@@levitatingoctahedron922 What’s revisionist about it?

[@levitatingoctahedron922]

@@averongodoffire8098 I already shared the relevant historiography the first time it was asked but my comment was censored. If you want unbiased historical information this is not the channel.

[@judeangione3732]

Thanks for explaining the basics so clearly. Also, your video makes me realize how much I really know about African history. Thanks for the links.

[@kraekennedy]

As usual Stefan, I thoroughly enjoyed this video. I have been watching your videos for quite some time now and wanted to take the time to thank you for all your time and effort involved in sharing such interesting information with the world. I am fairly new to KZbin and you were one of the first channels that I subscribed to. I can't thank you enough, for reawakening my insatiable thirst for all scientific knowledge! 👍

[@StefanMilo]

Thanks that's very kind. I try my best

[@kraekennedy]

@@StefanMilo 👌

[@akhilsasikumar7961]

Hi, I too love learning about hominins of the past. I am interested in neuroscience and artificial intelligence. If you wish, I would like to connect with you

[@gregrefon]

You're the man, brate! Thank you for the content. Brilliant as always.

[@oz1352]

Great stuff man, you never fail to make good content!

[@justtalking4279]

There is a good read published by George Celis 1991 on the last bloomeries in Africa. The technology presented there is so strikingly different from what we know today from the early iron workings in Mesopotamia, that it truly looks like being a native invention especially in western Africa.

[@BingShing]

Since I am too poor to send money I’m definitely going to share and like this video it’s absolutely awesome! Thank you for everything you do!

[@jasontwynn7356]

Awesome video as always. I've seen all your videos a few times. I've had a head injury and can't remember what I've watched,so no one in my house will watch anything with me anymore. So I watch stuff over and over like it's the first time I've seen it. Keep up the good work

[@jeh5176]

I don't know what if they had the first iron age but they certainly have the oldest mine which is the Ngwenya mine on Bomvu Ridge. It goes back to 40,000 years.

[@jagmannenarbrand8373]

idk, the oldest use of iron is there. But it was just used for art not tools or weapons. I believe they traded iron mask to other places. edit: oldest use of iron that we know of as of late. we could find older iron stuff in another place

[@Pauuanthakali]

Saw a video of traditional African iron smelters making a mud furnace, collecting red soil (iron ore) and gathering village strong men to pump the bellows for days to get iron bloom for their farming tools.. thought perhaps early metal producing cultures just used ore of what was readily available.. copper producers had copper ore.. iron producers had iron ore..

[@Pauuanthakali]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/iKamn415obyqprM

[@MrBottlecapBill]

It's pretty clear that Tut had an iron blade in his tomb. Which means........they at least had a working knowledge of how to work metals(iron) in the 1324 BCish era. Just because it was from a meteor doesn't mean they didn't need to know how to craft it. Meteors rarely fall in the shape of a knife blade. Or at least a few people of the time knew. I have to assume these people knew what meteors looked like before that and would have kept their eyes open for them as valuable resources(maybe for centuries). If this is the case, it's only a matter of time until they found a source of natural iron. The rust colour is a dead give away. From there the whole iron working age starts. Easy peasy, sort of. I suspect if you look at the oldest iron working sites you'll also find the easiest to access sources of ore. Something visible to the eye as iron and chunky. Maybe a huge ancient impact crater? I know in my area I've often picked up rocks thinking they were meteors only to find out they were large chunks of natural iron. I suspect easy to access sources of iron were more abundant and easier to salvage than sources of copper so I see no reason one would need a working knowledge of copper smelting first although it would have helped......pottery is a lot older than metal working and firing pottery is nearly the same process. We also have to understand iron artifacts rust away much quicker than copper. It's possible they were using it far longer than anyone has imagined, but the evidence is just gone.

[@frankscott1708]

Excellent deductions.

[@neutralfellow9736]

As you said, King Tuts dagger is a meteorite, which they cold worked. It was not made by smithing.

[@lindenshepherd6085]

I don’t think you can cold-work iron, though?

[@neutralfellow9736]

@@lindenshepherd6085 Sure you can, just hammer it.

[@lindenshepherd6085]

@@neutralfellow9736 I've worked in a forge for a while, and I was always warned against cold-working iron because it expends far more energy than its worth if you can heat it up in any way, and depending on the carbon content it could just break. Brittle iron doesn't take well to hammering.

[@lucasgillis]

You're making great videos, with good work on the sources. Your humility always serves your point, it's great to follow your channel and i am glad to have discovered it [recently (nonetheless, i've already watched tons of it)]

[@prophetofbara1214]

Very Great Video Milo! Looking forward to watching the rest of you're catalog. 💖

[@dylanmosley6237]

Thank you, thank you, thank you for this video. Quality information about sub-Saharan Africa’s pre-colonial and ancient cultural heritages is undervalued and often convulted and obscure. I know you’re scientist and just want to focus on the facts, but for me connecting with African history has a personal meaning. I am gay and mixed race (black&white) and live in the rural midwest (Trump country). Racial tensions have always been part of well, the modern world, and part of the racist narrative are that all the important technological innovations come from Europeans. Our national educational systems almost never encourage students (regardless of race) to investigate black African contributions to history and I think it leads a lot of people to be ashamed of their identities. I knew I grew up feeling ashamed of half my biology because it was considered ugly, primitive and worthless. Access to this kind of technical information in videos like this is so important for people who have busy schedules or who don’t always have the educational background to delve into these topics. So, again, thank you for your important work.

[@tpxchallenger]

Thanks for posting that. Quite a memoire. I cant imagine growing up gay and mixed race in the Trumpian midwest. I've just started plunging deeper into African history by way of Old Kingdom Egypt. I got algorithm to a really interesting Afrocentric channel called Mr Imhotep. I don't believe that the Celts were actually Black African or that everything comes from Africa but was stolen, but I think there is a very strong case for a much more African neolithic, pre-dynastc, and Old Kingdom Egypt than is credited. Anyway, best wishes on your jump into history!!

[@1_Fish.2_Fish.Red_Fish.]

Whoa.

[@ttld678]

Truly a golden nugget on KZbin right here. Keep up the good work lad and never lose sight on what makes you whole and only work on what’s makes you happy.

[@Cobbido]

Got proof?

[@thomaswatson4843]

I'm so happy when you post man. I love your vids. I also love that every history channel I follow comment on your stuff it's so wholesome

[@stusacks2220]

I recently and accidentally fell on your videos Stefan and find you very interesting and fascinating. I look forward to watching all past work. Excellent stuff. Thank you!

[@PanglossDr]

That was really interesting. I have long had a feeling that many technologies developed independently at different times and places. A perfect example is the antikythera mechanism. This required a very high level of knowledge of maths, astronomy and mechanics plus the skills in metalwork to produce it. All of that was lost and had to be re-invented centuries later.

[@markfergerson2145]

Couple of complicating points- when the British ran into sub-Saharan peoples like the Zulu and Maasai, they already had iron. Second, the Sahara has not always been a desert and used to be populated, and much easier to cross than it is now. Yeah, I know, the usual date for last desertification is ca. 13kya but all of it all at once? I doubt it.

[@kim1570]

By the time any Europeans, Portuguese, Spanish, British or Dutch, even Arabs, penetrated the interior of the continent, Africa had already had a very long history of iron use and in some cultures, even steel: thinkafrica.net/steel-in-africa/ This is some of the technology that bantus used to expand through the central, eastern and southern parts of the continue and turn a lot of wild land and forests into farmland. And yes, the Sahara was once flourishing with tropical life. The desertification process has been an ongoing and slow process over the millennia.

[@kim1570]

*Expand through the central, eastern and southern parts of the continent.

[@ikengaspirit3063]

By the time if the Iron Age the Sahara was mostly desert and Semi Desert.

[@MotivateMoments2023]

The last desertification was before 5000 years

[@qwertyuiopgarth]

Thank you. As someone else said, a wonderful surprise to wake up to. If I had known there was a new Stefan Milo video I would have gotten up earlier!

[@superlitin1]

Having an exam in archaeometallurgy in two days, perfect timing for this video :-)

[@lolazal1]

I hope you didn't rely on this, and actually read some BOOKS?!

[@superlitin1]

@@lolazal1 Lol of course, just complimentary to what I was studying :P

[@richarddelotto2375]

... I messed around with "ornamental metals" for a while, made "knife-like objects" as well. One thing I noticed about the serious, skilled practitioners is that they were ALWAYS experimenting with materials and techniques. I have no problem conceptually with "smith-shamans/wizards/mages" discovering and spreading their art through apprenticeships and the like. (Drawing the "sword from the stone" may be an elaborate metaphor for smithcraft...)

[@cameronanderson8737]

Usually put your vids on when I hop in bed, plan backfired and I just knocked out due to your soothing voice, god dam you Stefan. But seriously good work on the video, been watching your channel for a while and I’m grateful you tried this out. You’re a talent.

[@petewhiting912]

Fantastic channel. I've spent an entire day watching your amazing content. Something to keep me company during lockdown.

[@fridaymanly]

Thank you, may Oggun (the deity of Iron) of Western Africa protect you 💚

[@jobwesleycoxjr5103]

It sounds like a random word in Yoruba rather than some other West African language

[@Om-bo2oe]

@@jobwesleycoxjr5103 it does, it is.

[@makeytgreatagain6256]

@@jobwesleycoxjr5103 it is a Yoruba god (Nigeria) the idiot that made the comment knows nothing of africa except it’s a “west African god@

[@rondias6625]

Once again outstanding thoroughly done research.. unbiased and thought provoking keeping an open mind..keep on keeping on sir..thank you for sharing intersting info..have a better one

[@krishna-e-bera]

Spoon-mic appears at 12:15 Thanks for a solid and entertaining intro to the topic!

[@3nthamornin]

you are one of my absolute favorite channels. youve taught me so much about my favorite topic. thank you

[@asabattista]

There is a very interesting book called “the lightning bird“. Among many other things it elaborates on the use of iron ochre ( the blood of the earth)as body paint in south Africa, with evidence of it’s mining up to (if I’m remembering g correctly) 20,000 years ago. It seems that this would have put them in a perfect position to transition to an iron age

[@zevalica5318]

If you have time, you can find that in Serbia they found iron needle, discovered on the site in 2002, is considered to be one of the oldest surviving metallic objects on the planet. It was made from the stainless iron, without any hollows. It is 64.5 cm (25.4 in) long and dated to the 14th century BC (c.1300 BC). It considered a technological wonder even by modern standards as iron of such purity hardly can be produced even today. It is 98,86% pure iron and apparently can't rust.

[@Dss-bm3rz]

Love this channel. Poorly edited, nerdy and just how I like it!!

[@conlinbryant5037]

Very convenient! I was just looking into this! I know my ancestors were already working copper for a while before developing iron working as soon as shipwrecks from Asia started landing on the coast of British Columbia in the 1800's. A very cool Tlingit short sword from Alaska is made from meteoric iron.

[@Zane-It]

Are you haida?

[@robertbrownm]

I thought this was a spoon mic channel. Now I know about ancient Iron working. Miss you buddy!

[@IvorMektin1701]

There's a great video on West African iron smelting using the old methods. The whole village participates.

[@rodpaget9796]

When I was in africa ivory coast...the villages made their own iron in a clay tower about 8 ft tall. Seemed one could make iron by mistake with the method of a clay oven. Just put a iron oxide lump in or the iron rich soil and hot fire and I bet Iron was around a lot longer than thought,

[@IvorMektin1701]

@@rodpaget9796 I'm sure it was accidentally discovered several times, but I'm baffled who figured out to keep reheating and hammering the bloom after they got their pool of copper. That's a metric butt ton of hard work. My dad was a metallurgical engineer and he had a copy of Herbert Hoover's translation of De Re Metallica by Agricola. It was published in 1556. It might have some ideas...

[@MrBottlecapBill]

@@IvorMektin1701 Everything ancient peoples did was hard work. Hard work was never a barrier for them.

[@IvorMektin1701]

@@MrBottlecapBill Hard work without an apparent benefit.

[@tisFrancesfault]

@@IvorMektin1701 I think we sometimes over think the developments at times. it would not surprise me that the smith was bored and just hammered the bloom while hot because lets face it, you would too, and noticed a interesting change. Maybe one guy, maybe generations of dicking about with bloom led to the discovery of iron.

[@1_Fish.2_Fish.Red_Fish.]

Found ur channel recently and have on a tear catching up. Well done sir.

[@AndreLuis-gw5ox]

Great video! This is the first one I watch, and its not only a very interesting topic, but you present it in a very nice and scientifical way. Just a note, am I the only one who thought the audio was too low and sometimes hard to understand what was being said?

[@StefanMilo]

I did fuck up the audio on this one, my apologies

[@AndreLuis-gw5ox]

@@StefanMilo no problem! Loving your channel!

[@danechristmas6570]

Saw thew original documentary about two years ago, and they actually did the smelting in a clay kiln...( Of course they did a lot of ancestral worship and before the actual smelting ) But when I saw that hot, molten iron flowing out of that clay kiln, I was flabbergasted!

[@jacksonneptune4083]

6:14, the old wood problem is something unique to North American contexts and does not apply to iron furnace technology. For iron making, only specific species of wood with certain properties appropriate to making charcoal are carefully selected to use in furnaces.

[@bgw33]

Always pleased to have an unlatched Stefan Milo video appear in my feed. Thanks for well researched presentations

[@bgw33]

Unwatched not unlatched

[@emmasimon4005]

Ha, I was writing a comment about how ceramic production is hypothesized to have lead to the discovery of metal working, then got to the section where you talk about it. Great video!

[@computerager]

Some Europeans assumed Africans couldn't have invented iron-smelting. Would it be 'ironic' if we eventually discover that Africa invented it first? Perhaps this isn't a 'ferric' good joke.

[@akata7644]

My God, That should get you banned from this channel

[@sedwillful]

@@akata7644 hater

[@admiralsquatbar127]

A new Stefan Milo video? You had better steel yourself, The dad jokes are going to come thick and fast. Iron see my myself out.

[@craigds3745]

Oh, the irony!

[@darylbuttery1513]

Luv ya work. Welcome back, I’ve missed your investigations

[@MrTapierwithmustache]

Without even looking at the video I instantly recognized the Two cimbals on a cliff vid. That stuffs gold!

[@craiggersify]

I think your focus on archaeology entitles you to excavate old memes

[@hillockfarm8404]

What about the iron being used as practice material for students since it was first considered worthless? Would make good use of mistakes when fire got to hot.

[@pendox99]

What a wonderful Video.....Thanks Stephan!

[@therob4371]

Thank you Stefan. Every video you make adds to my world.

[@Campbellteaching]

I love this kind of stuff

[@edgeeffect]

I've been an AMATEUR metallurgist for years... and watching this video, the penny FINALLY dropped as to why cast iron is so brittle and wrought iron is a totally different thing to that. Yes I must be a bit of a dullard... but still... thanks for the simple explanation that even I can grasp. ;)

[@igawori7331]

Dude! Love the way you present your material. Laugh so much at your turn of phrase. As a Brit living in the States, it is refreshing. Bravo!

[@davidhoggan5376]

Love your lectures friend. Very grateful that you're keen on sharing knowledge.

[@DCMarvelMultiverse]

I hope the look of the geography has been taken into account here. A slightly different geography, weather patterns, and any additional research into cultural evolution and genetics of surrounding areas could prove to be essential in figuring this out. Where people lived, how they lived at differents times, what the waterways and land looked like back when in relation to trade, etc.

[@rigs9801]

One thing that might mitigate the "old wood" problem for the central african finds is examining charcoal burning methods in that region in the present. Charcoal burning is likely one of humanities most ancient industries, and the methods do not change much with the passage of time. Growing up in West Africa, I often saw charcoal burners as a kid, and was shocked to find that the methods used in places in Eastern Europe are incredibly similar. It would stand to reason that methods in heavily forested areas in particular, such as central africa, would hardly change at all over centuries or even millenia. If charcoal burners prefer certain trees, it could give some clues to exactly how old wood used for charcoal could be.

[@ikengaspirit3063]

Yeah, the fact that people citing old wood problem don't do more research to confirm shows they are more concerned about proving the consensus than getting to facts.

[@AntheaCarson]

Thank you for doing these

[@thinktonka]

In defense of your editing skills, I find them clever, witty and right on!

[@eldjibheryr3546]

i'd like to take this opportunity to admire your choice of single malt whisky.

[@alsaunders7805]

Agree! 🤓🥃🍺

[@kevinwise912]

Good morning anthropology peeps, gotta love waking up to my boy Milo

[@brycetsawyer]

I love the plastic spoon mic! Great informative vid! 😘😘

[@anndwyer8617]

Such a pleasure to listen to someone who speaks fluently without ums and ahs at the beginning and/or end of every sentence. Great subject matter also. Thank you

[@gequitz]

Another banger! Hope we can get something on West African Hominins one day

[@rodpaget9796]

When I was in africa ivory coast...the villages made their own iron in a clay tower about 8 ft tall. Seemed one could make iron by mistake with the method of a clay oven. Just put a iron oxide lump in or the iron rich soil lump or two, charcoal, and hot fire and I bet Iron was around a lot longer than thought,

[@Mr.Universe]

@Shane Ashby Not at all the smelting techniques in many of African societies that produced Iron tools/weapons were very advanced were not surpassed until European industrial revolution.

[@Mr.Universe]

@Shane Ashby yes that is the case my historically inept friend..there are even some African cultures that produced steel thousands of years before steel was a thing but that's a subject still being studied...imagine being so bias in 2020 my god....

[@almishti]

Iron is in fact very difficult to process, no one 'makes it by mistake' in a clay oven, to think someone could betrays a complete lack of knowledge of metallurgy. There's a reason the Bronze Age happened centuries earlier than the Iron Age in the Mediterranean; and on Cyprus, the main source of Mediterranean copper for centuries, iron ores occur naturally mixed right in with the copper ores, yet for centuries the Cypriots just discarded the iron slag and never bothered developing the process for refining it, in part b/c it's so much more complicated than that for copper.

[@rodpaget9796]

@@almishti Look up Bog Iron and get back to me....I saw what the africans did first hand in an area of dirt that was almost iron ore.....I am not talking about damascus steel either....

[@rodpaget9796]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/pJLadJRjacmKnbs

[@AWildBard]

I'm glad you matched your drink with your jacket. Well done.

[@Aquarius61]

Human endeavors have always been centered around observations and experimentation, even in very early human times . I'm sure that a lack of understanding of temperature control and material purity issues created the ideal circumstances that allowed over heated copper with iron impurities to be noticed. It's not that big of a leap to consider that if they recognised what that impurity was in its raw form, they would attempt isolating iron dust(likely similar to the dark grey or black silt like material found in Japanese river beds) to make the first form of pig iron. And besides, I'm of the understanding that the Villanovans in North-East Italy(the precursor culture that became the ETRUSCANs) were playing with iron in their copper smelting locations at around between 1200-900 BCE.

[@bumpty9830]

The _reason that Africa has less_ archeological excavations is worth mentioning, think. Archeology is a luxury. _Largely due to European colonialism_ ongoing to this day, there is an enormous amount of avoidable human suffering. It would immoral to direct labor efforts to luxuries like archeology while people are starving. We can expect archeology to become a higher priority for Africans when their natural resources are spent improving their own lives instead of increasing the wealth of neo-colonial owners.

[@aidanmagill6769]

Wow this was interesting but I did spot one majorly (and one minor) egregious fault: that bacon sandwich seemed to be soggy with rain😮, how dare you sir! The incorrect brand of Brown Sauce can be overlooked because at least it's still the appropriate condiment.

[@TukozAki]

Fascinating! If I listened to you well enough, further discoveries would "easilly" bring lights on this debate. E.g. that "luminescence-dating" (is that what Stefan said?), and there has been little field work done to this date. Interestingly, new knowledge could either come from dating the furnaces in Centrafrique and northern Senegal, or finding evidence of early trade with the Carthaginians and their allies. Anyway, this enlightens how great States regularily emerged and grow in sub Saharan Africa, that early in human history.

[@EVtripper]

I love the plastic spoon mic. I'm going to use that hack. I love your videos. Thank you for the great info and content.

[@norml.hugh-mann]

I thought YT required that all videos either contained a "holier than thou" attitude by the narrator or repeating narrative of mega-conspiracies involving religion, wealth, ruling the world by aliens.

[@MrBottlecapBill]

Maybe the evidence of early African iron working is being suppressed by the systemicly racist governments of the world? It's pretty clear archaeologists are just a group of white males trying to hold onto their view of history at the expense of other races. How's that? :D

[@cysilversoul]

Bottlecapbill It’s important to remember that historians =/= politician.

[@hulahula6182]

Africa peaked at iron age lmao

[@norml.hugh-mann]

My point( which I admit is vague) us how intriguing and pleasantly addicting Stephen Milo's content is without the " junk food for the brain" that more popular but inaccurate hosts that like to omit key facts to push nonsense seem to think people want and algorithm rewards for some reason...but my gosh...the truth is always more interesting to me (and I am guessing many of yall feel the same)

[@petergriffin3723]

West Africa to me was the cradle of Sub-Saharan African civilizations like Greco-Rome was to Europe, bringing agriculture, metallurgy, science, pottery, seafaring, etc throughout the rest of the continent. The largest, most powerful, and earliest empires existed in West Africa, of course not neglecting the many achievements and civilizations found in other regions of Africa.

[@HansenFT]

Was it though? Proto indo europeans probably came from the steppes in todays Ukraine..

[@HansenFT]

I was talking about greco-romans being cradle of european civilazation btw. Celts had seafearing, metals etc. So had the nordic bronze age too, and I believe several other european cultures that was not greco-romans.

[@lif3andthings763]

@@HansenFT That was the minoans.

[@supahotjoe6493]

Wrong. Cheikh Anta Diop proved that Kemet-Kush (Egypt & Sudan) plays that role for africa. On the linguistic part, he made a comparison between ancient kemet language and Wolof, and the words are almost the same. Other others did the same with ancient egyptian language. Ask chatgbt it will tell you.

[@dalesmith7536]

Fascinating. Thanks for this.

[@jessd7947]

u my good man deserve a subscribe. keep up the good work!

[@thelivetoad]

i love that there is such a debate. hopefully it will refocus attention on an overlooked but fascinating swathe of cultures and their histories

[@thelivetoad]

@@paulrevere365 Ummm...no, that's exactly the word that is least appropriate

[@thelivetoad]

@@paulrevere365 I see: your def is boring = primitive. Very primitive perspective.

[@akata7644]

@@paulrevere365 Developing carbon steel before anyone else is primitive?, construction the largest adobe earthen structure that trumps Arabia is primitive?, monopolizing all trans-saharan trade for 200 years is primitive? Making two voyages to the Americas is primitive? We are analyzing history, not being "woke". Take your shitty politics out of here

[@thelivetoad]

@@paulrevere365 Well my point was not about them but about you. I could ask you to prove your point but clearly you are incapable of reading. Well enjoy your bigotry. Enjoyed the mud wresting but I have more interesting things to do -- ie, almost anything else which doesn't involve you.

[@beninwarrior4579]

@@paulrevere365 If they used iron, then how were they stuck in the stone age?

[@adrianfortmoviereviewsbook9821]

I need your stale memes. I have a stale sense of humor.

about carbon content in iron/steel: the melting point of iron needs to be met in a reductive environment in the presence of carbon monoxide, to reduce the ore and not immediately burn (oxidate) it again. carbon content reduces by working the iron and can not be raised again. while cast iron has a 'to high' carbon content, but can be cast to bars, reheated and worked, to form it, which reduces the carbon content in the process. sarazene blades where forged in arabia and/or spain, from wootz steel originating in srilanka. the carbon content needed, so that the steel can be hardened by quenching, is quite narrow. as one can imagine, finding out those things takes quite some trial and error. 'bog iron was used because ovens didn't get hot enough', may be true, but more likely, ovens that where hot enough existed, but burned the iron in the process, so smelting was used instead. smelting lets you with little to no option to control the carbon content, nor do meteors, to forge something that could be quench hardened, ment to not work it to long and not need to many beats (those sparks that fly of are mostly carbon) mow imagine you have a limited amount of meteor iron, to make a blade from... tu-anc-amunes blace happens to be very well made, and was quench hardened. while that's deductive evidence, when you know a little about it, it's almost impossible, someone made it, without prior experience in working iron to yield hardened steel. no way to make it on first try, in my humble opinion and that's so unlikely, that in other evidence based science, that would be considered almost certainly true... yet in history and archeology, certain groups are not supposed to be 'first'. if we ever overcome that and start to seriously dig in africa, i would expect many 'firsts' to be predated thousands of years, as had to be, when we stopped to pretend chinese history is a fairy tail. who knows, maybe the san stopped making steel fifty thousand years ago, because why such a hassle if you happen to know how to make several deadly poisons from stuff, you don't have to mine first. pinnacle of civilization: make a stick, or shard of bone fired from what seems to be a child's toy a deadly weapon ending up with a twenty our work week in one of the harshest environments there is. dedicating the time to making culture, or some more san, people both of which are quite enjoyable. it's been downhill ever since then.

[@phemstros]

This channel is absolutely classic and this video is on point. Wish I had discovered Stephen Milo because he is right about this!

[@JennieWrenStar]

A lot of doubts could be hidden racial discrimination?

[@christaylor7709]

Absolutely, whether they actually admit that or not. Some "scholars" no matter the evidence because of unconscious racial bias, will never accept that some Africans were doing some things before Eurasians. Even if the evidence is looking directly at them, they'll still deny it. No matter what.