Director Of Joker Reveals The Fate Of Zazie Beetz's Character

Todd Phillips’ Joker isn't a movie that wants to offer definitive answers to everything, as there are plenty of ambiguities by the end, but there is one fan question that the director has answered for good.
At first, the film leads us to believe that Arthur Fleck is having a relationship with Sophie, played by Zazie Beetz, but it is eventually revealed that the future Joker has been fantasizing the whole thing.
A lot of fans speculated that Arthur kills Sophie when he learns the truth, and now Joker director Todd Phillips has revealed the fate of Zazie Beetz’s character.
#Joker #Movie #Actress
Read Full Article: www.looper.com/173846/joker-d...

[@Looper]

How did you interpret Sophie's last scene?

[@juice2467]

I thought he didnt kill her just in the same way he spared Gaggy (the midget) even though he murdered someone right in front of him...

[@coryryder9070]

it was to drive the idea that it was all a daydream or fantansy and thats why the whole movie was in the eyes of joker it was the joke the lady wouldnt get the whole movie

[@IamNinjaOfNinja]

He killed her for showing fear against him when he is not a murderer yet in her eyes, he absolutely hates rejection at that point of the time and was ready to kill . The police siren came, but no one would actually notice the murder anyway so the police siren could still be to trick audiences. Joker killed the psychiatrist at the end, and imo the psychiatrist was way more innocent because she was trying to help.

[@ReecytheRapper]

Looper i think he murdered her and the babygirl

[@Rondo9prime]

He most likely killed her because at this point in the movie he was really going through his darkest and had already just killed his mother

[@mirza5766]

The midget was spared because he was nice to Arthur. So was Sophie in his fantasy

[@deucespades9416]

Thats why it needs a sequel, with being the joker for the whole movie, joker rarely spares people , and a lot of people got good treatment

[@andrewwhitley2568]

The joker doesn’t have a “code” like that like superheroes do. In the comics he kills any and everyone, even babies just because it’s funny. So it’s not out of reach that he would kill her.

[@devinkipp4344]

@@andrewwhitley2568 this isn't a comic book though.

[@deucespades9416]

@@andrewwhitley2568 THANK YOU, like i said i would like to have a sequel, as him fully joker, he. Wasnt fully joker yet, great movie but to me still not better than jack or ledger, hell jack killed his best friend bob for batman stealing his balloons, you think he wont kill a chic he dont even know like that neighbor

[@dubesquire6329]

@@deucespades9416 she was only nice to him in his head. She didnt even really know him when he was in her house.

[@JorgeMurillo777]

If you don't want to see the whole video, short answer: He didn't killed her.

[@joshuagaytan9376]

Jorge M. Cucalón thank you for ghat clutch answer

[@mykalmcdo]

Thank you good man

[@Kevin-zz9du]

These type of youtubers are cancer. Gotta summarize half the movie before saying yes or no... as if anyone clicking on this video hasn't seen the fucking movie.

[@rishabhpandey2529]

Thank you kind sir!

[@MrFMS12]

cause its from Looper.

[@jd1ggs102]

It’s obvious that he didn’t kill her. He didn’t kill the little person either cause he never wronged him either.

[@molotovb]

She did wrong him - she was revulsed by him, rejected him, kicked him out of her apartment.

[@jd1ggs102]

molotovb invalid point. Wouldn’t you kick someone out of your house if you barely knew them? Let’s be real here.

[@molotovb]

@@Tito996 Exactly why she would have called the police, why she would not just be cool with a psychotic stalker living across the hall.

[@molotovb]

@@jd1ggs102 Perfectly valid point. She would have tried to reject him and kick him out, he would not have been okay with that. She would not have been okay with going back to normal life when a psychotic stalker lived across the hall. The only scenario that makes sense is that he *did* kill her.

[@jd1ggs102]

molotovb by that logic he would’ve killed the little person cause he was obviously frightened by him killing the guy that got him fired.

[@dinotoebean]

Notice how Joker dances before or after he kills someone, every time. Never danced when he met Sophie.

[@littlekettle5759]

Damn that's a really good point! Even after killing his ex coworker? My memory is a little foggy on that one

[@Urasims]

@@littlekettle5759 He dances down the stairs right after that scene.

[@tedcomet3121]

Not his mom

[@trongtran8951]

After killing her, he opened jazz music to do make up.

[@dinotoebean]

@@tedcomet3121 he was in the washroom; dying his hair and dancing to "Thats Life" by Frank Sinatra. After he killed her

[@TheShipleyman]

I never thought he killed her.

[@Griwhoolda]

Same.

[@MelieneGardner]

Me neither. In fact, I was surprised it was a question later on.

[@lindahoe6714]

Raped

[@Darion350]

@@lindahoe6714 There's no evidence to support that. I think he just walked out. She hadn't done anything to him and he showed mercy to those who hadn't put him down. I think she was left pretty shaken but unharmed.

[@lindahoe6714]

@@Darion350 not sure only time will tell hopefully her and the baby where ok

[@StephenMGreen]

**Movie/Film exists** Looper: *We're about start an entire series out of this...*

[@IamNinjaOfNinja]

Because they already sucked Endgame dry with their KZbin monetising and have always been a Disney Marvel Bitch. Look who is Looper sucking now lol

[@k.-flynn]

We can make a religion out of this.

[@crispyjack428]

@@k.-flynn why dont we?

[@muaaz6124]

@@IamNinjaOfNinja Don't forget those game of thrones videos explaining the obvious

[@brendan9868]

Muaaz those game of thrones explained videos pissed me off. They were thrown all over my suggested and these twats just explained what we already knew lol.

[@LoveMeBack]

She asked if she could call someone maybe his mother for him. She was nice to him. Like the little man.

[@gr8esthandleever]

What about the psychiatrist at the end? She didn't do anything wrong but she got killed.

[@LoveMeBack]

Nick Salazar Maybe that was another one of those illusions😉

[@blindanajr8849]

​@@gr8esthandleever i think at that point he has become the true joker and will kill people indiscriminately just for fun. arthur still chose to kill himself and hoped that his death will make more sense to people even when he knew murray invited him just to make fun of him. The arthur inside of him really died at the talkshow but instead he was then reborn as joker and finally decided to kill murray for a change. when he answered murray's question at the talkshow about killing the three douce at the train, he said that he felt good and think of it just like a joke as he laugh it off saying that fun things are subjective. arthur got into alot of troubles in the past because of his uncontrollable laughs and people always get irritated by it as they asked him: "what's so funny?" or "do you think it's funny?" before they proceeds to gave him some trouble despite arthur's best effort of giving them answers. it was as if they just would't connect with him. so at the ends scene in the asylum, when arthur was having his laugh, the psychiatrist also asked him the same question as those people. hence arthur answered only with "you wouldn't get it" before then made a joke out of her. (that's my take)

[@gr8esthandleever]

@@blindanajr8849 it was made clear by the director that this character has a code so the ending doesn't make any sense. He would have also shot other people on Murray's show if he was truly the joker. I just think they kinda drop the ball at the end.

[@gr8esthandleever]

@@LoveMeBack but he doesn't imagine hurting people that don't do him harm. It still wouldn't make sense.

[@poratsgt5638]

"I thought my life was a cringe compilation." "But now, I see it's a Try not to laugh challange"

[@teddng1828]

gamer with 10 fingers stolen comment

[@TheMasterTroll360]

i hate this lol

[@jazzy45rocks]

😂😂😂

[@latexsoul]

Each time I see something about “Joker”, I just become more and more of a fan of this movie.

[@thinqaboutit5301]

Me too. I click ANYTHING I see with Joker in the title. I saw this film the week it came out, and I cannot stop thinking about it.

[@latexsoul]

thinq about it 👍 Same here!

[@Griwhoolda]

Same; I'm obsessed.

[@2kdemiks816]

fr my first view of the movie, i thought it was dark and absolutely terrible. but for some reason after seeing mixed reviews, i kinda like it

[@temorsitez1949]

Couldnt Agree more

[@MrHemuk]

When the movie cuts to him rushingly leacing the apartment, you can see the door closes behind him with force, leaving it pretty clear that she closed it as soon as he left.

[@cyndykated358]

Good observation!

[@frankfinnsweenryan]

Nice catch!

[@daltonyoung6866]

And he had a laugh attack after it. After each kill he wouldn’t laugh.

[@isaacman112]

@@daltonyoung6866 the only kill that actually made him laugh was Murray's.

[@nataliemunoz8600]

Watched twice and didnt noticed!!

[@EpoxyMuffin]

He also restrained himself when children were around.

[@papaskazoo5860]

One thing I definitely appreciated.

[@DoMMy627]

Not really, he murdered Murray on live television and there must have been many children watching that show. Although Arthur was pretty far into his decent by then so it’s a give or take.

[@skywalker6648]

@@DoMMy627 I think you meant, Descent.

[@DoMMy627]

Sky Walker Oh my bad, I meant descent. Although he was decently crazy.

[@skywalker6648]

@@DoMMy627 No problem. 😁

[@manasbansal7946]

The best scene was with Arthur and the dwarf who could NOT open the door.

[@davidbroughall3782]

That was the most darkly humorous thing I've ever seen.

[@helvete_ingres4717]

that and the gun in the children's hospital ward was the darkest of dark comedy

[@thedumbdog1964]

Why is your picture gmail?

[@lepari9986]

Couldn't*

[@darnit1944]

Im not even laughing at the movie, why do people think this is funny? It's disturbing as fuck seeing Gary so scared and traumatized like that

[@Steger13]

I said he didn't because she never was bad to him and she had a kid.

[@bahaa9138]

S G “had”

[@jasonsalistean9192]

It’s the joker since when did someone doing bad or not matter?

[@gr8esthandleever]

@@jasonsalistean9192 right. The psychiatrist at the end was killed and she did nothing to him

[@Steger13]

@@bahaa9138 inbthe novie she had a kid. Joker didnt kill her or the kid. He didnt kill the midget friend so why would he kill a kid and his mon?

[@DrippySaddam]

Nick Salazar the psychiatrist wasn’t killed

[@arikvarden]

That’s what I liked about Arthur/Joker🤡 He didn’t kill anyone that didn’t do him wrong except those that antagonized him or did him wrong! At least he starts out like that, if there is a sequel or next movie where Joaquin will play the joker again let’s say with Batman in it, I imagine he will lose his mind even more in time and kill anyone for fun!

[@etoenjoyer7367]

He killed the woman from Arkham at the end tough

[@mcgraidymacatangay1701]

catKING exactly that means he’s now mental enough, this was for sure years years later

[@extraplain2412]

If I have a problem with the film it's that Arthur was too justified. Sure we needed to sympathise with him but a bit more complexity would of done wonders. Still a good film with a great performance.

[@darrenfaber2334]

@@extraplain2412 He is an unreliable narrator. He paints his backstory in a sympathetic light. However, that doesn't mean what you are seeing is an accurate representation of his character.

[@extraplain2412]

@@darrenfaber2334 Yes I know it's open as to whether any of it happened and if it is happening in his own mind that explains why he is the hero of his own story but I think they missed an opportunity to show how crazy he really is. He never really struggled with his own mind only the effects of what other people were saying and doing to him.

[@ChaseHLee]

I’ve also had a full relationship with Zazie Beetz in my mind.

[@senecanero3874]

She becomes Harley quinn

[@gr8esthandleever]

@@senecanero3874 she's not a psychiatrist

[@DrippySaddam]

Nick Salazar so what

[@omario.]

@@gr8esthandleever we dont know that

[@modybv4933]

Seneca Nero no

[@N8R_Quizzie]

Well he dances, and doesn't laugh when he kills someone. He does laugh when he's under extreme stress. That was the biggest giveaway for me.

[@AZ-kr6ff]

He didn't dance after killing his mother, or the guy that gave him the gun...or am I forgetting?

[@AZ-kr6ff]

@HOW DARE YOU I own the movie. I'll watch it again.

[@theScotch]

It’s been over a month and I still can’t get this movie out of my head.. very well made movie all the way around.. best scene was the dance in the bathroom to Frank Sinatra’s that’s life in my opinion! Edit: thanks for all the likes! Joker fans check out my review of the movie and vocal cover of Frank Sinatra’s Thats Life! Appreciate it ;)

[@quimninja]

Agreed brilliant film.acting was phenomenal

[@devantethedcguyreactstoo252]

GeezShow really?? This movie was ok...it wasn’t as good as people hype it up too be...

[@gmoney2372]

DevanteTheDCGuy Reacts too it's because you're small minded and stupid and you clearly didn't understand what you saw.

[@devantethedcguyreactstoo252]

G Money I’m stupid because I didn’t enjoy a boring dumb movie??? ...it was a movie about mental illness and the plot was weak and just uninteresting to me...

[@CynsCorner]

SAME - I can't either. It's still embedded into my brain so bad ... I want to see it again, and I've seen it three times already lol

[@JulzGein_]

We can all agree every theory that involves “it was all a dream” are incorrect and boring. Edit: Thansk for the Gold kind stranger!

[@aarondamico2627]

Yes I totally agree with that. Would suck all the fun out of it for me if that was the case.

[@etoenjoyer7367]

They ruin the whole movie IMO. Fuck them

[@urgfswallows]

Thank you! Finally someone is using their head here! What a breath of fresh air!

[@recht_voor_zijn_raap5506]

Todd Phillips himself has said the dream theory was bogus. Thank God.

[@EmmichiB]

Recht_voor_zijn_raap oh my god this just made my week. I’m so glad that theory was incorrect. I heard it so much and I blew it off everytime. It’s very obvious throughout the movie was was real and what wasn’t. Some people have a smaller cinema IQ than others.

[@cosmicreader1312]

Joker doesn’t really have a code that’s what makes his character interesting and in some ways terrifying.

[@matcaballes]

He probably does. You just don't know or understand it. That's terrifying too.

[@OnionKnightRises]

He does, at least this Joker does. He hasn't reached the point where he just did terrible things for the fun of it, JP's Joker had reasons for doing the bad things he did. She was practically a stranger, and he didn't just go gunning down strangers for no reason, there was always something that made him do it

[@jeyarbie4653]

@@matcaballes OOh, nicely done.

[@yashkamboj8970]

@@OnionKnightRises Although in the end, he does kill a stranger - his psychiatrist in the hospital. I guess he was just trying to gain her sympathy by making up this back story and in the end, he kills her and runs away. He is the joker with no moral code indeed.

[@caseyk5245]

Aye Jaye he does until he kills his therapist

[@huntertran5422]

Looper: makes a 5 minute response video to a simple yes or no question This is the only channel that can pull of this level of bushitting I swear XD

[@crook7493]

4 minutes just to say that he didn’t kill her....and we all knew

[@SoloQSights]

When people asked "Did she die?" I responded with "Why would she?". Totally illogical if Arthur/Joker killed her

[@511dydy]

Why did arthur kill the psychiatrist at the end though?

[@directdecker30]

@@511dydy We don't know that, bloody shoes or not...

[@alchemy-the-animated-series]

Ariaditya Pramestu yeah what if he just slipped on some ketchup?

[@511dydy]

@@directdecker30 yeah, lets just give the homicidal maniac a benefit of the doubt.

[@511dydy]

@@alchemy-the-animated-series sure man, a narcissistic serial killer and we still defend him.

[@dtraversodt]

In a movie filled with heartbreaking, terrifying scenes, the last scene with Sophie is the scene that will stay with me forever. Imagine in your despair, someone you thought you were close with was not even around during rare times you were truly happy

[@aidenjaxhernandez]

Was anybody else surprised that the relationship was all in his head the whole time? I sure was

[@vanred7550]

I actually wasn't that surprised. I kind of predicted it since I've seen some movies that had the same theme (fantasizing with dating a person only to turn out that it's not true). Arthur being insane added to the predictability. It was a good twist though, I had hoped that the "imaginary girlfriend" thing is not the direction that they were going for and let Arthur really have a relationship with Sophie. I was happy when they were in the scene talking at Arthur's door and Arthur asking her out to the comedy club

[@davec3651]

2 things: Arthur hadn't killed mother yet. That scene was shortly after the Sophie scene. I would have loved to see Sophie's reaction watching the Murray show. Their reason for removing that scene certainly makes the Wayne murders in the alley stand out for being the only scene Arthur wasn't present in..

[@molotovb]

It also simply made no sense that Arthur would have left her apartment after being rejected, that she would have done nothing, perfectly okay with a psychotic stalker living down the hall from her.

[@Ravenbones]

@@u-l-t-i Welcome to the Internet.

[@ValerieJNorse]

@@Ravenbones and How Dare You -- Neither of you needs to be so freaking rude. Maybe you think that snarling your pathetic hostility makes you sound like experts, but you're exactly wrong. People listen to the reasoning of someone who sounds reasonable. No one listens to people who express themselves like you.

[@pangolothian]

Never in my mind did I question what happened to her. I just figured he left her apartment when she started asking him to leave.

[@Pepsolman]

Keeping the audience guessing is the beauty of this film.

[@jaynemurphy1667]

I don't think he killed her. Zazie is one of the prettiest actresses I have ever seen.

[@mishynaofficial]

That's the argument, totally.

[@flashthompson4546]

This question was torturing me since I saw the movie

[@jamesrekula1841]

“If I'm going to have a past, I prefer it to be multiple choice!” That was my only expectation walking in to see Joker and it did not disappoint.

[@alisterfolson]

I figured that she wouldn't die I was more interested the little person; I thought he would kill him, which is why he locked the apartment door

[@Darion350]

I thought he would be killed too. I thought Joker was toying with him with the lock that was out of reach. I was surprised when he let him get away.

[@Burnincyclon3]

I'm honestly not sure what I would enjoy better; The brutality of him toying with the midget. Purposely locking the door, and offering him escape just to turn around and kill him. Or rather the scene we got where he laughs, and pities his short friend.

[@CynsCorner]

Yes, I was quite scared for the little guy for a little while there during that scene.

[@BaronVonBielski]

Pete Smith so the joker planned for him to not be able to reach the lock? You’re an idiot.

[@jerrysetlerr770]

He maybe just locked it in case everyone lost their minds.

[@tylerskiss]

Yet they made the specific choice to add in the sound of approaching emergency vehicles directly after he leaves her. That was a deliberate sound design addition. Strange, if they really had no intention of suggesting that he harmed them.

[@thedumbdog1964]

Cyril no it’s just a shitty city, nothing different

[@Darion350]

How would the ambulance have know about her death so soon if he had killed her? He would have had to call 911 himself and the ambulance would have to have had amazing reaction time and be parked just a few blocks away. It wouldn't have made sense.

[@tylerskiss]

@@Darion350 Excellent point. In reality it would take some time, but film works by using what's known as the Kuleshov effect, so in order for a message to reach a viewer, they would need to feed you the information in the next image/scene. Again, I'm going strictly by the sound design- it was a conscious choice to include that, so someone wanted the implication even if it wasn't EMS responding to that apartment.

[@dumbspideyfanboi9060]

@@tylerskiss It could just as easily be another way of making Gotham seem like a horrible place. With Police cars and Ambulances constantly passing by because of the frequent emergencies taking place.

[@snackzyder7138]

Anyone else notice that every woman besides his mother he interacts with was african american- his 1st therapist, the woman on the train, the fake girlfriend, his last therapist... perhaps its true that he never left the asylum the 1st time and hes only had interactions with his mother and his therapist.. imagining the whole movie in his head

[@brisadecanela87]

Right! Excellent comment! 👍

[@snackzyder7138]

@@brisadecanela87 also the woman behind the curtains at the main show at the end was also african american

[@specificsoup]

I don’t think it’s supposed to be “the whole movie was fake” but maybe he changed and embellishes the “story” and that includes sort of selectively remembering people a certain way, filling in characters based on who he’s interacting with in the present. If that makes sense. I did wonder about that. I knew the first and 2nd therapists were supposed to look SUPER similar and be like parallels of each other for sure.

[@ourochroma]

Todd Philips: we only show things from Arthur's perspective The scene of Bruce as his parents that where killed at the end of the movie: Am I a joke to you?

[@darnit1944]

I hate it when they made Tom Wayne an asshole. He's supposed to be a philanthropist who donated most of his wealth to the poor, building infrastructure, helping everyone but sadly got killed by the people he is supposedly helping.

[@sauravmehra4503]

Darren Atm he may be a good guy this is from joker's perspective ...He sees him as the bad guy...Like in some littlr ways we have perceptions about certain people friends, colleagues because we see them only from one angle sometimes we don't even know what kind of person someone is but we have strong sense yeah guy/ girl deffinately bad...We have that judgement about certain celebs that they are too nice or too arrogant but in reality we may be completely wrong...They never show thomas did bad things ...he got rid of the psycho penny arthur why wouldn't he? she was delusional and complete lunatic!

[@darnit1944]

@@sauravmehra4503 They clearly portray Wayne as the typical bad greedy businessman who pursues politics, tells false promises. And in the end, he punches Arthur. That's what i dont like about his portrayal.

[@yokoshima1229]

If Joker have sequel and Bruce turn out to be Batman, then this Batman will turn out to be fake hero like in Boys

[@NoFILanthropy98]

@@darnit1944 I actually loved that they portrayed Wayne as a POS. It's much more realistic than making some billionaire the only thing that stands between order and chaos. Wayne is the one who created the chaos through his greed.

[@jimmydroid7838]

On boy, that's good to know, been losing sleep over this one detail. Thanks Looper!

[@fieryeurochick3194]

I just assumed she survived. He had no reason to kill her.

[@javier77street]

Miss Priss not only that but she has a little girl.

[@Error50505]

@HOW DARE YOU i dont understand how no one notices the ambulance outside he's windows. Like im pretty sure he killed her

[@Error50505]

@HOW DARE YOU i dont believe that tbh and that would make the. entire scene really stupid. The music was super intense before he walked in her room he was ready to just murder someone, your telling me the intense music is still going to play as he just walks out of her place and lets her live? This is the joker were talking about. He doesnt care who he kills or why

[@Error50505]

@HOW DARE YOU its like she was like "oh man that suck.. Yeah none of that was real sorry arthur i hope you get better but you need to leave my place now. And aurthor is just like aw okayyyyyy and walks out.... Tell me that doesnt make that scene stupid. The vibe from the moment he's sitting in her couch and she walks in was that he was going to kill her, then add on when he realizes none of it was real with her.. Come on he snapped and killed her bro. If you dont believe re watch the scene if im correct before that scene he had just killed hes mom im the hospital hence the intense music showing hes really snapped and he's going to murder anyone.

[@MontyQueues]

they cut out a scene where he gives flowers to sophie, look at the shot in the trailer

[@z-rex6068]

Eddy Que What in his clown makeup? I wish they’d kept that

[@imeldayolanda]

yes. the flowers and a letter.

[@vinukabest3]

That was when the script made the relationship between them real.

[@imeldayolanda]

@@vinukabest3 I wonder, why did they put that scene in the trailer but didn’t make it in a final cut?

[@phil8821]

@@imeldayolanda They release trailers before they're done editing the movie. Take a look at Rogue One. Because of massive re-shoots, most of the trailer wasn't even in the final release.

[@Kaff231]

An absolutely Brilliant movie and performance! BEST movie of 2019..This is the kind of film study that will have us talking about for years to come.

[@DitchBankBandits]

She’s got the power of good luck

[@ruchirrawat8804]

i don't think he found his "happiness" killing people who were nice to him

[@misshelloareyouthere]

Sophie & Arthur: I wanted them to get together BUT the Joker has to raise

[@mikekennedy304]

I love that u put the transcript in the description so that I don’t have to actually watch the video to get the answer 👍

[@Harzner]

This is the best news I've got! It was a question that was keeping me thinking for two weeks...

[@eansba88-]

In my head, she died and her orphan daughter went on to become catwoman.

[@zay6042]

Kinda would make sense.

[@cyvader101]

😦😯😦😧

[@zoebella3123]

eansba 88 wait that’s actually a really good theory

[@Rezerwaty]

That's dumb

[@eansba88-]

@@zoebella3123 cant take full credit, me and another fella were spitballing in another thread, but yeah, it totally fits. From her age, to backstory... i dig it.

[@JD37]

The question is this: Did anything besides the final scene actually happen? The mark of a true classic.

[@3DaiYo4Kai56]

Cool. Thanks looper.

[@IamCanadian3333]

The reason why I thought Arthur killed Sophie was that in his mind, she did wrong him by leading him on and then pretending the whole thing never happened (again from his twisted perspective)...hearing those sirens right after as he walked down the hallway also made me believe she did die... But honestly, I'm happy she survived.

[@unikeko96]

It' Gotham. Of course there is sirens everywhere.. 😑

[@andrewjackson5295]

I thought he did kill her. Do y'all remember the sirens when he's back in his room and the lights from the police cars?? Not only that but he was laughing hysterically because he was trying to cry but couldnt

[@_Meriwether]

The sirens didn’t stop at the apartment block, they passed on by. It was a red herring.

[@richarda3764]

Completely agree. Sirens and his laughing confirmed he killed her.

[@unikeko96]

Use your brains people. It's fucking Gotham. That's why there is sirens everywhere 😑

[@lmicky5361]

Yeh I did think that too- I actually thought from that point on if he did kill her- then this is where he actually gets locked up/sent to the asylum, and fabricated everything from that point on in his head. As a fantasy. Which cut to him telling the social worker or psychiatrist at the end. But considering the consistent pattern of only killing people who wronged him. It didn’t make sense to have killed her. She didn’t seem be a threat or a negative character. Unless her catching him out from following her and making it clear she not interested -was her wronging him? So I totally get why they left that possibility open- and to put the sirens in to throw us off and get us thinking. Which of course worked. But Tbh with him sparing the lil fella and only got revenge on those who really deserved it. So I’m hoping he didn’t kill her.

[@Error50505]

@@_Meriwether actually you can hear the sirens shortly before you can even see the lights getting closer and closer indicating that it was arriving at he's apartment building

[@doctorsam5771]

This whole Sophie angle was the most brilliantly written and scariest plot twist I've seen in a movie since Fight Club. Joaquin's performance might be godlike but Phillips doesn't get nearly enough credit for this movie.

[@ninawildr4207]

Love your comment so true!

[@Mia-tu4zi]

Yeah! And just imagine Phillips was the same director, for the movie "Hangover" . Those two movies compared together, is like day and night.

[@cking4869]

“Sophie never wronged Arthur” Good to know it’s canon that Joker at least isn’t a white knight.

[@prestongervais]

I really, simply, love the fact that it left us wondering.

[@Joetheshow445]

I never thought for a second that he killed her. Him finding out he didn’t have a girlfriend was intending to be the icing on the cake for how tragic his life was and the final sad moment where he decides to kill himself on live televiison

[@NoFILanthropy98]

when did he kill himself? He killed Murray

[@JStack]

Some small details: Arthur does not make contact or touch anything involving Sophie, until the scene when he walks in and runs fingers along pictures the daughter drew. Small detail to confirm the imaginary relationship. If he had murdered her and the daughter, when his former coworkers come to visit him, there would’ve been a mention of police presence or a scene down the hall, etc. thinking he murdered her there makes me feel like they missed the point of the movie and angle of storytelling entirely.

[@andrewwhitley2568]

What do you mean he doesn’t make contact with anything involving her? He straight up makes out with her in his imagination.

[@JStack]

Andrew Whitley that’s not a product of her daughter’s work. Arthur had seen her, and as a result, could imagine making out with her.

[@gamer83294]

there were police sirens at the end of that scene though. thats what made me assume he did.

[@mylefnepple1936]

B JP it’s just a question about a great movie.

[@gorgeouslymade1754]

Yay!! I didn’t think he did ♥️ great film!

[@kaiobikeg8749]

Finally watched it last night. Great film. Best thing with a DC character to come out in a looong time.

[@woozy96]

To clear out everyone: - As soon as Arthur (Joker) left the room without grabbing the door to close, you can hear the door shuts hard which means Sophie did it. She is alive and her kid, too.

[@veerchasm1]

They got married, had a baby and called him Nate...

[@imeldayolanda]

what?

[@MiaDontBe]

Jackyboy Vosotros wut

[@beevee2312]

I was shocked when a lot of people assumed he killed her. I never thought so for one second after that scene.

[@TheChristian50]

The scene that was cut was Arthur giving her flowers on the way to the Murray show when he was walking in the hallway, you can see he had the flowers in his hand during the trailer but not in the movie.

[@aldoo4640]

It’s been a month since the movie cam out how many videos are you gonna guys do

[@clown-cult96]

Thing about Arthur is he only kills people he has need to, or feels he has the need to, whether or not he's actually right. There was no reason to kill Gary or Sophie, according to Arthur, so he didn't.

[@gr8esthandleever]

There was no reason to kill the psychiatrist at the end but he did. That theory is not good at all

[@kylewilmath6201]

I'm not going to lie that scene with sophie towards the end had me on edge.

[@Retired_LT]

I thought the scene could’ve been up to interpretation. When he enters her apartment and tells her he had a bad day, his fantasies of their relationship are challenged by the reality of her shock at his presence. Assuming the film truly is from Arthur’s perspective, the audience learns he was delusional at the same time as Arthur. I don’t think you could fault someone for interpreting Arthur really going off the deep end.

[@sersomeone9704]

Yes, he spared the midget, but he also killed his therapist so he probably doesn't have a code

[@UnratedGamerpr]

Now that he is the joker it doesn't matter who is good / bad to him, but he did cared when he was Arthur and he actually needed that compassion.

[@ezekielmarlowe6888]

The therapist didn't listen.

[@themoreyouknow7418]

The therapist quite obviously didn’t actually care and was (badly) faking it because it was her job. Actually quite a good commentary on the mental health system (or at least how people in it can feel it’s like) when you think about it.

[@edzothedon1487]

Wait when did he kill the therapist? I don’t remember that

[@yyperi]

@@edzothedon1487 In the end we see him running and leaving behind bloody footprints. That indicates that he killed the terapist in Arkham, possibly by stomping her to death.

[@Ickabodxx]

I'd just like to give the director props for just coming out and saying it. I thought he put her in the fridge, glad that's cleared up

[@Ravenbones]

Why would he have put h er in the fridge. He put HIMSELF in the fridge.

[@Ickabodxx]

@@Ravenbones Checking to see if a body would fit. Serial killers seem to have some history of doing this.

[@Beetwixt_N._Janeen2112]

This film is absolutely BRILLIANT! I cannot wait to add it to my collection - Quino Roxx! 👏👏

[@PlanetTrainWreck]

A question that should have remained unanswered I went back and forth on it

[@testifakit]

But there is also a thing called "the death of the author" so people can interprate it anyway they want and they are right

[@JosephMarchione]

I feel like her daughter is selina kyle

[@nathanaeladdison3631]

JMProductions bruh... imagine 😳. That would mean she’s a couple years younger than Bruce tho.

[@that199Xgrrrl]

I’ve also read this theory somewhere in Reddit. And recently, there were behind the scenes pictures released. One of them we take a glimpse in Arthur’s journal, and we see cut out pictures of cats and women.

[@JosephMarchione]

@@that199Xgrrrl that's interesting. I never read anything else about this theory. It was honestly just my first thought. We know catwoman comes from poverty and shit so that would just be a fun connection. Its fitting we never learn the womens name

[@that199Xgrrrl]

JMProductions I also came up with another theory, though this may sound stupid... 😅 I was thinking but what if Joker and the upcoming The Batman film are secretly connected? Just recently, it was announced that Zoë Kravitz will be playing Catwoman (who could be the older Selina Kyle) and the film will reportedly take place in the mid or late 90’s. In that time, Bruce will be around his 20’s (he was about 8-9 in Joker, where the year takes place in 1981). But honestly, idk. 😅 It just came to my mind. I know Joker is just a standalone film and said that it won’t have sequels, which I fully respect the decision and I’m okay with that bc the film is a brilliant masterpiece. Though we gotta admit, we want to see and get to know more about Arthur. Even Joaquin is interested of playing Arthur again, if they could make a good story for a sequel. But at the same time, I couldn’t imagine how he would meet and face off against Robert Pattinson’s Batman..

[@JosephMarchione]

@@that199Xgrrrl if they wanted to connect phoenixs joker and Pattinson's batman theres no reason story wise why they couldn't do it so far. Maybe they are secretly connected. But I dont think Phoenix would ever sign on to do a typical comic book film

[@KemetNubian1]

Happy to hear that Sophie survived. After my first viewing of the movie I was sure Arthur killed her. Todd's explanation makes so much sense. This is a genius of a movie. Would love to see more like it. I've definitely gotten so burnt out on the overused, green screen, special effects garbage we've been force fed in theaters recently.

[@ValerieJNorse]

I wouldn't say "force-fed." People go to see those special-effects movies in huge numbers. Producers wouldn't make those massively expensive movies if they didn't know people would show up.

[@ethanmichaelcrane934]

If there's one thing the Joker is known for, it's his strict moral code.

[@nicmic8521]

The midget was going up on Sophie while Arthur did his tv bit. True story.

[@Headbangerr-en2cc]

She barely recognized him in the last scene, and she was thinking about calling his mom. They never spend night together, and they never were together in hospital.

[@Headbangerr-en2cc]

@@dbdperson9595 right 🤣

[@recall3550]

It’s really sad when you think about it. He’s so alone that he has to imagine ppl are with him like her..

[@jerrysetlerr770]

I never really thought he did ,but there was a siren going off after scene when he was back in his apartment .

[@politech2722]

If Joker only ever killed people who wronged him, he wouldn’t really be a super-villain, would he?

[@guhapurnima01]

What do you see in the last scene??? The blood marks on his shoes indicating that he killed the soft spoken kind hearted psychologist he met. Does it make him a hero? It's there where your expectations and all the empathy for the man get shattered. It's his film, his origin story and he wanted to show him in positive light. As they say even the nastiest man has his version with positive tinge. Here the devil has made you empathise with him. That's the biggest joke you won't get.

[@battlerushiromiya6457]

At the end of the movie he just becomes the Joker. And it still needs to evolve in the criminal sector, Arthur is not the Ledger Joker who had been in that for years.

[@dayzdove]

He's starting. Baby steps

[@trippy-shoota]

So by your logic if I was this joker I would kill the person that cut me in line

[@jupiterjazz2245]

Man I vision zazzie as my dream girl too. Such a beautiful lady!

[@courage-3954]

Moctezuma M they put her in movies for a reason dude. Relax

[@Dominicn123]

Damn the scene they cut of her at the end was of her watching the horrors unfold on live TV, that means the ending and everything really was real!! From the television talk show killings to being inaugurated as king at the riot, damn.

[@swaroop7021]

Zazie didn't upload anything about joker movie on her insta account why?

[@thebessienessie836]

Tbh would have left more of an impact if he did actually kill her and her son, showing his fall into lunacy and blurring the lines between self defence and cold hearted murder even more

[@platinum11110]

@The Bessie Nessie dude, he killed his own mother who was at a hospital bed, the line of the self defense argument is shown enough

[@davidbroughall3782]

The whole arc of the movie was Arthur's descent into evil. To kill her her would have disrupted a carefully laid out pattern.

[@caiseric]

s o n

[@imrickjamesbitch6574]

David Broughall He said that bitch was too fine to kill.

[@Noface678]

The Bessie Nessie you mean her daughter? People like you who can’t even remember the small details like that shouldn’t have opinions.

[@recht_voor_zijn_raap5506]

*Joker exists* Looper: "Its free real estate"

[@trollface5467]

Please just shut up that joke is so old

[@karlfran0404]

That was one of the great things about the character - i knew Fleck wouldn't have done this.

[@RichardMusiol]

You'd think people lock their doors especially at night. Even Arthur did before he killed his former coworker and that was in the middle of the day.

[@trentbelford6118]

What if Sophie’s daughter is cat woman in the Robert Pattinson movie

[@Noob-vd4oq]

This joker and Robert pattinson's batman is not the same universe

[@TheAdamChaney]

I almost don't want to know. EDIT: Well, now that I know, I know that the answer is no.

[@i-7710]

^^

[@sgky2k]

At the initial phase of the film in the bus, did she return the card back to him? Cause when he gets the beating in the train, IIRC he searched his pocket for the card and got disappointed. I had a feeling this is gonna get him in trouble during that bus scene. That, and him dropping gun... depicts the writing of this film.

[@KEVMAN7987]

I'm looking forward to the Blu-Ray commentary track.

[@funtimes6406]

But didn’t he maybe kill the therapist at the very end. He had bloody footprints and all

[@TheMidnightBell07]

@@AethericVisions Hey, Joker was bleeding internally and I think that was his blood.

[@jangguttok7437]

if he only kills those who wronged him, well then, did he kill the social worker at the end of the movie? the blood implies yes.. but wht did she do wrong to him to be killed?

[@jangguttok7437]

Sunny Days the one tht fleck said didn’t listen was the earlier one.. the last scene was showing a different woman.. she asked if fleck wud tell her the joke tht fleck was laughing to, n fleck said she wudnt hv understood..

[@warnerg80]

I swear I saw a Arthur in the crowd when they talked about the riots the first time around. It was on the tv in black and white.

[@Ididdledyourwife]

We're all these clips from the trailers or was the whole movie released??

[@user_-qr5ey]

Is it just me or who thinks that the midget is going to turn into the penguin

[@MsMaxinejoy]

🤣🤣🤣

[@newguy90]

In the comics, Joker's original sidekick before Harleyquin was a little person dressed as a jester named Gaggy. I always thought the character was a nod to that.

[@MrCaptainZach]

Should of never revealed whether he killed her or not. Come on, it removes some of the fun out of the movie

[@metalsadman]

Well plebs kept asking, director just want them off his backs. Even if thats his answers, it's still a mystery what's her fate anyway.

[@MrTokedo]

This movie is fucking awesome. His laugh alone is pure gold.

[@bhlakbatosai]

The dwarf was the giveaway. He let him live EVEN after witnessing the murder because he was only out to get people who wronged him.

[@jimmymcgill2961]

2:15 skip to here and don’t give this channel any more of your time

[@Charles-of2vz]

Thank you

[@aaronmstevenson]

Given the laughing he did afterwards, I’m trying to recall if he laughed that way after killing others. I only remember he didn’t laugh painfully when on the Murray Franklin Show. I lean towards he killed her.

[@unikeko96]

In your dreams... 😑

[@shimerrill967]

Could’ve.. but why ?.. is the question

[@lucascastro4094]

Exactly, also when he went in he locked the door behind him. Also another clue is that after he probably killed her, there was same music of the brass getting higher and higher, the same music of when he was about to kill Murray.

[@glyle2504]

He didn’t kill the people that didn’t particularly wrong him. Or that he didn’t THINK wronged him. That’s the thing.

[@tiffanyclark-grove1989]

Thanks for clearing that up. I felt it was out of his character.