Dissident Right Fight Night: Yarvin vs. Rufo

[@kspfan001]

I had a friend in college that spent 18hrs a day in the lab as part of his microbio masters, and he would spend 100% of his freetime experimenting with all kinds of drugs, including stuff he created in his lab. He invited me over onetime. I found him in a shed in his backyard, the inside of it lied with all kinds of psychadelic tapestries and him sitting in the center of it in a rear-seat captain's chair from a minivan. He said "oh hey just in time. I am gonna try this sativa concentrate I made at work." He lit up a small pipe, smoked it, and then immediately went bug-eyed and started thrashing around screaming at the top of his lungs. I noticed he was being kept in the chair by the buckled 4-point harness he had sewn to it. After a full 2 minutes of this he finally stopped and came back to reality, then said, "yo this stuff is awesome, do you want to try it?" I politely declined.

[@TribuneAquila]

Ah you mean anarchism

[@donniedewitt9878]

Yarvin won when Rufo tried to “um actually you can’t describe historical people who clearly have sets of leftists behaviors as leftists because the term ‘left wing only came to being during the French Revolution”

[@ihavenojawandimustscream4681]

Nonsensical. What does leftist and rightist behaviour even mean? Can we describe Julius Caesar as a leftist because he did land reform and ride a wave of anti-elite sentiments? Can we describe pre-Second Temple Judaism as a Rightist movement because it venerated bronze age warrior culture? These are meaningless idealistic labels that ignored the contradictory totality of human experience

[@ignisimber2818]

@@ihavenojawandimustscream4681 Couldnt put it better myself

[@Carthodon]

@@ihavenojawandimustscream4681 For better or worse, right wing and left wing are the best terms for the idea that there are two main sides who had predecessors throughout much of history. You could use other words but the conflicts today between the urban mercantile class vs. the landowning nobles vs. the peasants has always existed. Caesar absolutely would be considered left wing for the reason you mentioned as well as a bunch of others, certainly in contrast to the optimates. I would say right wing would historically be an overt belief in hierarchy and the institutions which maintain it while left wing would be an overt appeal to change the system for the opposite. The opposing position would effectively say that there are no real threads that connect current factions to those in the distant past, or if there was such a connection it was effectively broken in the french revolution in the creation of something novel.

[@HomerChadson]

​@@ihavenojawandimustscream4681 lol, Caesar was at the head of the "popular" camp against the "elite" camp in a cataclysmic civil/world war, and he ended the trad Republic via coup, all that notably to impose egalitarian redistributist policies. he further manifested such compassionate & co. values that his bio may've been the main source of the redaction of the Gospel of Mark, some hypothesize... if he isn't deemed LW, might as well never use the term. and I don't think LW's a compliment, either. thankfully, Augustus was no libtard. ^

[@juanme555]

@@ihavenojawandimustscream4681 The distinction pre-dates the term that better fits our sensitivities, you are too engrained on your american post-modern framing (and if you are not american then you are a better american than the americans). These eternal factions are the Elitist order above all aristocrats on one side and the populist more egalitarian and transgresive aristocrats on the other side, you think Caesar was not a right winger taking over the depraved leftist failed republic of Rome? why? because of a land reform and having some proles on his side? imagine being this daft...hitler also did land reforms, so did pinochet and Genguis Khan. Napoleon III literally expropriated half of Paris when him and Haussmann modernized Paris, he's a leftist? But i will address your rethorical question in an unironical way, which is more than a sub-midwit like you deserves: "What does leftist and rightist behaviour even mean?" Leftist Behavior : Transgression in the persuit of progress, progress being a more egalitarian, individualistic and less hierarchical society. Rightist Behavior : Prioritizing order, beauty and a traditional notion of "health of the people" above all, this does not at all mean that old institutions, traditions or tropes can't be toppled, it just means that they will be toppled if it preserves/improves order, beauty and the health of the people. I do lament that the right's inherent greater-emphasis on aesthetics goes largely understated, and it does somewhat bother me that the left's greater-emphasis on intellectual development goes severely overstated. You will seriously cringe at your own comments in a few years if you actually challenge your own views a bit further.

[@godsdominatrix439]

59:06 - “For someone who talks about power as much as he does, it seems really ignorant that you’re going acquire this culture capital from being cool.” Sociologist Sarah Thornton -- pigging-backing from Bourdieu -- extends cultural capital to “subcultural capital,” which she defines as being cool or hip. Bourdieu says that all forms of capital can be converted to economic capital (money and property). Thornton admits that subcultural capital may be more difficult to convert into economic capital, but the conversion is still part of the goal. Don’t we have ‘cool’ presidents these days? Don’t we have to have ‘cool’ presidents? Isn’t ‘coolness’ just popularity? Critiquing -- even undermining -- coolness is fine, but scoffing at coolness is not wise.

[@camildumitrescu3703]

Burgis and Yarvin once had a long'ish debate. And then, it hit me: these boys and their respective fans diserve each other to a scary degree.

[@samuelspiel8855]

I just wish our oligarchs would stop poisoning the food. I have to have a ridiculously picky diet of organic food or I get insane breakouts on my skin. When I visit Europe I eat everything with zero problems.

[@tomspaghetti]

This episode paired very well with Erich fromm’s “escape from freedom“

[@Stoddardian]

Is this the "cutting edge" thinking on the left? A bunch of estrogen filled voices?

[@lsobrien]

As opposed to Yarvin, Peterson, Shapiro...

[@gabestrenk5471]

What's consciousness?: A word. Shit like this when you're too much tryhard intellectual you go back to being dumb.

[@Stoddardian]

@@lsobrien Yarvin is actually interesting. The other two are basically liberal grifters.

[@lsobrien]

@@Stoddardian Are you saying there's more to your analysis than simply how much estrogen you can perceive in someone's voice? How daring, truly you are a "cutting edge" (who are we quoting again?) thinker.

[@Stoddardian]

@@lsobrien Were you really that offended? Anyway, the left is intellectually bankrupt. They have no new ideas whatsoever. It's the same slave morality we've been hearing about since the the days of Constantine. All of the interesting thinkers on the left are old boomers like Zizek. The decline of leftist intellectuals is truly staggering.

[@MIKAEL212345]

I disagree with Yarvin on a ton, but I don't know how anyone can disagree with his "politics always moves towards the left" view. Almost any issue you take from the past, the left wing won and the right wing lost (only insofar as "left" and "right" are meaningful categories to describe people and ideas far in the past). Slavery lost. Feudal monarchism lost. Absolute monarchism lost. Religion lost. Religion was only winning when it was left wing coded. Labor laws exist. LGBT issues have only ever moved leftward over the long term. The war on drugs is dead. People now believe in the natural equality of human races and of human sexes. The US has civil rights laws. Over any long time frame, the right loses. I agree with almost every single change here, but I find it hard to believe that anyone would deny that almost every change here went from right -> left.

[@harbifm766766]

To simplify Yarvin visiin...it is tanks in Harvard and imagine the rest

[@samuelspiel8855]

Sounds like a good start.

[@shannonm.townsend1232]

I can hardly manage more than polite interest for Yarvin, since his proposition resembles so closely what we already have, perhaps in a more degraded form with less utility, but status quo nonetheless.

[@VorosMedve]

Surprised Pills went with Yarvin…thought Rufo’s tactic of acting from within the system was much more Luhmannian