Divide and Conquer v5 Khazad-Dûm Faction Overview

[@Captivename]

It's defiantly worth mentioning that in its current version v5_hotfix_v6, That if you choose to skip the Expedition script in the launcher this will also cause you to skip every other script. Apologies if you did mention it and I just missed it.

[@Augimund]

Thank you for mentioning this. The script was new to me since I've been away so I did not know it affected the other scripts. I've pinned your comment because I think this is really good information to know.

[@Captivename]

@@Augimund No worries, I understand its difficult being up to date about everything in the mod. It's been mentioned they're looking at this not being the case for the full release, so fingers crossed.

[@jeffbo7515]

Just played first time khazad dum love it and won my battles on the way with lesd than 100 casualtys 😊*proud* Now i stand before the filthy goblins in my holy halls 😡🤤

[@Rellana1]

@@Augimund First time I played as Khazad-dum By the time I arrived the Goblins had a unit of Heavy Goblin crossbows,which took Balin down to 2 dwarves left,by the time I dealt with them. So be careful of that.

[@bigthoughts2644]

Definitely, not defiantly 😂

[@NPCplace]

Consider mentioning mercenaries relevant to the faction. While say Gondor doesn't really care, dwarves benefit mightily from a unit of merc cavalry.

[@Rellana1]

I used to grab all the merc cav I could find from the Auduin Vale. It made dealing with the ranged trash the goblins field a lot easier.

[@artolan_illusive]

Personally to avoid the expedition problem I just made it once and keep a "clean" save of a turn right after expedition. A strong incentive to do script is that you can get a chance to have Dale cavalry merc.

[@TheRewasder97]

Nowadays you can skip the spedition altogether as one of the launcher options. If you have done it once it's not very interesting to repeat it unless you take the other path.

[@Peatingtune]

As a serial restarter of many years, I consider the keeping of "good start" saves to be a very handy thing for many different games.

[@Sharky_Splitz]

Solid Overview , Khazad Dum's main/elite units are honestly a treat aesthetic wise.

[@feelingpine9123]

Hithaeglir Beast Hunters are pretty effective flankers really. High attack with AP and they're fast (for Dwarves...) at 100% run speed compared to the Hammerguard's very slow 90%.

[@liamcarnahan1346]

The weird thing for me is if that the two routes i find the "risky route" ends up with less casualties then the "safe route" the healing from the wood elves and the fact when i face the trolls that the elven units do not matter means when i get to kazadum I have a fairly experienced army that can push through the mostly trash units of the goblins with no problem

[@roygrutchfield5715]

Agree you should have has a Dwarven catapult, to deal with the Ents.

[@maximusd26]

good change for the mithril building, Ik it's about balancing and gameplay, but why the hell should the dwarves need 100 turns to access mithril ?

[@Milsane]

process_cq 😊

[@maximusd26]

@@Milsane yeah but that's a "cheat" in how the game is intended, which I personally never do in TTW

[@emperorfancypants2512]

The balrog is in the deeps so makes sense they dont go all the way down till he is gone. Could explain the delay

[@Manwu5]

Love your faction showcases!

[@Complain_Bird]

You didn't mention the dragonslayers in the army overview. Are they not recruitable and only accessible through the expedition?

[@tantumverde5256]

only in Grey Mountains. So they are one and only unit u have for now. :(

[@liamcarnahan1346]

I could be wrong because I don't know the geography so well but if you get Danes hall from the snow orcs you can train dragon slayers right?

[@reggie_edgy]

Fantastic as always cheers mate

[@jivenfields]

Yo, do you consider this game better than total war remastered Lotr mod?, Great videos!

[@Augimund]

I absolutely prefer DAC over the rome remastered mod

[@miguelanessoares7039]

I think another good feature the dac team could add is to give the option of the AI going evil or good with Ered luin and khand so you can choose if you want to have a more difficult campaign ir not. For example playing Gondor and you want to face khand for the challenge so you would toggle it so that they remain evil

[@swanknight8134]

Balins Guard uses King Dains voice lines from BFME2

[@MarcelPopa-wj7zj]

I started a campaign with KD with skiped expedition check, and i dont got Oin and the diplomat, they are stil in the retinue of Ballin, turn 106.

[@Jimbobiscuit]

Same here

[@LizardWizard403]

I think skipped Expedition is bugged at the moment, I heard that when you turn it off it turns off al the other scripts

[@dashsocur]

@@LizardWizard403 Yeah, I had to manually fix a couple of files based on instructions from their Discord server. Pain in the rear but worth it. :)

[@insanensane]

When choosing to skip the expedition via the Launcher, i never get Oin as a general, but as an item on Balin. is this because you skipped the script, as in this video you seem to skip the script, yet Oin is with you as a general. and ofcourse having reclaimers as a general is super OP.

[@kleuter0775]

I cant build the hall of the seven?

[@badcactus819]

The only issue I have with Dwarven campaigns is dealing with archers is just not fun. Blackshield archers in particular are a nightmare, especially since Gundabad likes to spam them in my experience

[@lordadorable1140]

Catch them out with merchant cav or siege weapons. Keep them distracted until you move up the infantry

[@badcactus819]

@lordadorable1140 you really don't get enough cav to equip every army with enough cav to tie up the archers. Late game in the erebor campaign often means half a stack of gundabad archers. Bottom line is that the medieval 2 engine /base game design relies on having a base level of cav or at least fast moving infantry. Dwarves lack both and Erebor is also in the unenviable position of also lacking reliable ranged counter fire. They have zero ability to participate in 2 of the three phases of M2TW combat (cav and skirmish)

[@Owlr4ider]

@@badcactus819 To be fair cavalry, especially good cavalry, isn't all that common in this mod so the fact that Dwarves lack cavalry altogether isn't as detrimental as it would be in say vanilla M2TW. As far as skirmishing goes, Khazad Dum has solid archers along with some very good crossbows from the Hall of the Seven while Erebor has that same crossbow unit available from more places, but not everywhere. Sure, they're not really ideal for skirmishing but it's better than nothing, so you can participate in the skirmish phase when you choose to do so. Still I agree the Dwarven rosters, well barring Ered Luin, are built as a rush factions, you're meant to charge into the melee ASAP and stay there until you grind your enemies to dust. At the end of the day your main weapon against enemy skirmishers, and anything else your infantry struggles with really, is your Dwarven Catapults and to a lesser extent Ballistas. Those Dwarven Catapults, unlike their non Dwarven counterparts, are actually quite accurate when using their normal ammunition, and if using grapeshot you're trading accuracy for AoE which may or may not be beneficial depending on what you're targeting. Dwarves are the only factions where I find using siege weapons to be mandatory. All other factions can manage just fine with their infantry, cavalry and archer options, Dwarves simply have too many holes that they must incorporate siege. That's why their siege units are the best in the entire game.

[@usfreedomsmith3077]

My game say the hall of the seven is only for castles at the keep level, and it only provides “recruitment slots allowed: 1 and Number of free upkeep units: 1”

[@XramBrain]

I started with Oin and Ori still part of Balin’s retinue. I was able to send a diplomat to Bree that early and the Balrog did not appear however there was no announcement that it was defeated by Gandalf (Tharkun). Though I managed to bring Balin to the miromere and there had 2 full stacks army that emerged at my gates and eventually defeated them. However, there was still no announcement of the death of Balrog. I am on my 100th turn and still there’s no sign of him.

[@dashsocur]

This is a semi-common problem with the script being broken by that option. I needed to manually fix some of the game files in order to make the script that removes them from his retinue and makes them stand-alone units work. Unsure if it will also fix the Balrog issue: I've tried 2 games since then and one had the Balrog quest while the other doesn't seem to (or at least not yet). KZbin won't let me post the instructions here but you can find what you need through some searching of the Discord server (this is definitely one of those things that would benefit from a more traditional forum).

[@kelsb8121]

How do you unlock hall of the seven? Its locked behind the script of sending diplomats to ered luin and erebor right?

[@Augimund]

If you don't use the expedition skip, then yes you will still need to send diplomats out to the other dwarf factions. Apologies for missing that.

[@kelsb8121]

@Augimund I did that however nothing happened? Is there something I'm missing?

[@kelsb8121]

I sent the diplomats to the capitals of the dwarves

[@Captivename]

@@kelsb8121 did you get a message telling you to do so yet? Maybe you've it before being told to?

[@kelsb8121]

@@Captivename i got the message to do soe and sent my diplomats to their capitals, after waiting a while nothing happened

[@zenonthestoic81]

The link to the overview document in the description says the file was deleted

[@ismeal231]

I think the dwarves in general need extended rosters, but Khazad-Dum in particular is hurting for some more units.

[@Jimbobiscuit]

Agreed, they could do with at least tier 1 strike unit added

[@Sanvone]

Unless something changed the problem with script is that is is poorly balanced. There was no benefit for going around Mirkwood. Going through forest was supposed to be harder due to more&tougher fights. Then you get full retraining of troops just before crossing to Anduin Vale making whole cost null and void. Not even mentioning that you took shortcut so you arrive at KD-East sooner and have more of initial gold left + more turns to build/replenish recruitment pool before Balrog attack. The most interesting thing about script is the difficulty of being 15+ turns behind AI in development. You are on really tight timetable to get everything rolling before script fires. Shattered Alliances as Khazad-Dum is really interesting because you are much poorer at start but also fighting Lorien elves is really fun. Turns out your best bet against elves are... your own archers. I really like KD aesthetic. Volunteers + Travelers and the feeling of kickstarting kingdom. They also have a literal tone of better ancillaries (Mithrill Nugget etc) so it is always good idea to stick around KD-East even as other allied factions. They can get really great Mining/Trade bonuses on their governors as well as one of the highest construction reductions at the cost of worst farming in the game (even elves are better). I also think people kind off sleep on stacking their bodyguards with +personal security for bigger number of models. That said that faction continues to lose it's place as some of their unique roster options got upstaged (First Legion Pikes). Also while their Sword&Board infantry is not slouch it kinda becomes worse and worse compared to elite factions in this regard with each patch. I wish their legionnares would get 1-2 javelins to help their poor mobility while fighting cavalry / mod would allow dwarves to recruit Sons of Fallen as Mercenaries to spice up things a little. Some alliance with High Elves for ability to recruit Lindon Bowmen (T1), or access to Son of Fallen through relugar buildings would also help. Ah and lastly - remove shieldwall from EL Militia and give it to volunteers. As much as I want to like playing them they are counter-intuitive to my super aggresive playstyle. Not a fan of long line battles with them, their slowness means I'm constantly get outmanouvered by AI into worse angles of engagments. Dwarven special abilities also kind off don't work as M2TW only has 3 stages of stamina and heavily armoured dwarves don't really utilize their "second wind" much. Maybe something with increased mass of dwarves could be done (throw relentless trait on medium tier units so you can utilize shieldwall offensively against units with higher model count). That would help offensively as you wouldn't need to slowly track around flanks and could instead encircle enemies from inside of battleline.

[@Eärnur_de_Gondor]

This is very weird. In my v5, I still have to do the trip to Moria from Erebor

[@DrPepper_V1]

Could you do an installation guide of how to do the hotfix?

[@777hexed448]

Just getting into this and watching the faction vids. What faction would you say is a getting starting point for someone getting into this mod?

[@liamcarnahan1346]

Don't know if it is relevant but incase someone else that's new sees this. Gondor or mordor are good because of their size of their relms. If you don't want to start as big any of the elven nations are good but I would avoid the high elves because of the hoard of goblins. The dwarves are strong economicly but would again save kazadum for a later playthrough. The Vale of Dorwinian are also a good choice.

[@jackcall28]

Erebor. Very simple gameplay. Also one enemy at the start. High elves and dunedain are very complicated.

[@captwaffle1361]

Depends. If you are already a total war player (~40-50h play time), try factions with scripts and not too many enemies like Dorwinion, Lothlorien, or Ered Luin. I find these 3 are very enjoyable and replayable campaigns that teach a lot of new DAC mechanics, especially race buffs (elves faster to allow aggression, dwarven morale and very defensive, humans being middle ground). If you are new to total war, especially Med 2, try Gondor, Erebor, or Gundabad. These 3 are very easy in their own ways (Gondor general spam and robust economy, Erebor easy start and powerful allies, Gundabad elite orcs and subjugation script).

[@TheRewasder97]

Please, please, please... Can we get Rohan next? I really want to make a campaign soon :D

[@TheSpearman-vt3nb]

im not too comp savvy and im not sure if i installed the hotfix correctly. there is a new launcher but i see no options for khazad dum. i checked the discord and it said that you can skip the expedition with the full release. did i do something incorrectly?

[@Augimund]

When you use the new launcher, it should present you the launch options which includes the expedition skip.

[@pietervanommen7955]

I'm afraid I did something wrong. I start with only Balin next to Erebor. I see a red arrow pointing towards Dale and I have no clue what to do. When I try to move Balin I can't, because the area is all restricted.

[@nanyohristov1750]

i have a question i use the skip option but i dont get the diplomat and general after turn 2 any reason why its not working?

[@HenryHahn-b3s]

I had the same thing happen.

[@CommanderInBed]

Is it still recommended to play on Very Hard Difficulty? Great vids, thank you so much

[@kamiltomasiewski5426]

My max was hard, kazad dum is quite challenging

[@alexanderfilor4144]

Can they also build the oracani clan hall?

[@XramBrain]

No, but they can build the Hall of Seven which will make some dwarven units from other faction available.

[@jeffbo7515]

❤❤❤🎉🎉🎉 yeah new factions 😂❤❤ Just startef playing modded total war and i LOVE IT ❤

[@Kvothe1994]

I would like to say that going the short way, I couldn't take Erui since Lorien has just took it, and that you can solo goblin stacks with Balin. Apparently when the unit gets tired it looses defence skill. When attacking moria with exhausted balins guard, I was loosing models to Snaga Archers!!!

[@Owlr4ider]

Yes, exhausted units do lose stats, but those are only attack and defense skill, never shield nor armor which are Balin's Guards main defenses. Also defense skill doesn't apply against missiles, only armor and shield(if attacked from the front/left) Balin's Guards don't become any more vulnerable to missile fire by being exhausted. Unless you meant Snaga Archers charging them in melee after spending all their ammo, in which case they're probably flanking you which again negates their defensive skill and shield just as with missiles. I mean, no unit is invulnerable. Even a massive stat difference of 1 or 2 attack vs mid 30s defense can still end up kills every now and than. RNG makes this scenario very unlikely, not impossible, and when you're taking thousands upon thousands of hits eventually some of them will connect...

[@Kvothe1994]

yes I meant in melee. Balin's guard, one of the best melee units, when exhausted started loosing to fresh snaga archers, and would probably have died. I assume it is because their defense skill fell to zero maybe? or at least low enough that it + 20 armor could loose to 1 attack unit@@Owlr4ider

[@Owlr4ider]

@@Kvothe1994 As I said, pure RNG. Even 1 attack vs 20+ armor will still land a hit every now and than, considering Snagga Archers come in units of like 240 goblins or so, your Balin's Guards are literally fighting thousands of goblins taking multiple hits from each as they can't kill them fast enough. Thus after sustaining thousands upon thousands of hits a handful eventually connect and deal damage.

[@Kvothe1994]

@@Owlr4ider you are wrong, at first they didtn loose almost anyone while fighting better units, then they were loosing a little bit, then at the end, surrounded by my own units, they started dying fast to snaga

[@mynamejeff_6966]

Could you do a faction overview of Mordor next?

[@Vhaleraxes]

Então você estava no Brasil, cara? Espero que você tenha gostado do país.

[@maumasmumu1594]

how to start kazadum from kazadum?

[@maumasmumu1594]

Anyone knows ?

[@Owlr4ider]

It was explained in this video... Select skip khazad dum expedition in the launcher.

[@maumasmumu1594]

@@Owlr4ider strange dont see such button

[@Owlr4ider]

@@maumasmumu1594 Are you on version 5.0? If you are than when you run the mod you see a window with optional DaC settings. There are 5 settings you can opt into, the last of them is: 'Skip Khazad Dum expedition'. If you don't see this window and are using version 5.0 than you probably selected the 4th option: 'Bypass Launcher on future starts' at some point, at which point I'm not entirely sure how to bring the launcher back. Reinstalling the mod will probably do the trick but is a rather cumbersome solution for a simple problem.