Does Babylon 5 Hate Reporters?

[@robertrussell1879]

I have worked with broadcasting for over 40 years, found the B5 viewpoint to be closer to the truth than any journalist will admit.

[@vercoda9997]

I don't know about broadcast media, but as a newspaper editor for 20 or so years, it's rare to see any journalist get a fair shake in any show. The vast, vast majority of Media and Press work in local, regional news, not national or international press - journalists are substantially more likely to be interviewing a local cancer survivor, rewriting a council release about changes to bin collection schedules, or talking about a local school fundraiser at the weekend - yet, almost without exception, journalists are portrayed as grubby, selfish, spiteful, insensitive and untrustworthy characters without a shred of morals or empathy for other humans - the polar opposite of almost every last person I've worked with in several jobs and offices. Even myself, after all these years, my first instinct is to think "Oh, how awful!" as I'm reading or editing a story about someone's bad news, especially anything to do with children. Broadcast media, however, is a different beast, and there are certainly many reprehensible people working in that sector, in places like the irredeemable Fox News over in America, or the wretched GB News in Britain. Many of *those* presenters embody the worst traits of humanity which I touched upon, above, for sure.

[@mr.s2005]

agree, been seeing a guy claiming to work for a local news argue more than a few times with a facebook "friend" and unlike this guy, refuses to admit there being any bias in the media.....while making clear he is very bias and more than willing to spread false information himself

[@gups4963]

@@vercoda9997 MSNBC and CNN are just as bad if not worse. Fox was/is the opposite of them politically, but none of them were supposed to take sides in the first place. The politicians run broadcast media, it's not even subtle anymore

[@TheFiddleFaddle]

My dad used to be a news anchor, retired in the 90s. I remember him talking about his frustrations because the station manager was more concerned about ratings than the news.

[@chrispeterson5505]

J. Michael Straczynski himself worked as a journalist in the early ‘80s. He wrote for the Los Angeles Times, San Diego Magazine, the San Diego Reader, the Los Angeles Herald-Examiner, the Los Angeles Reader, TV-Cable Week, and People magazine.

[@zacharythomas8617]

Underrated comment.

[@tarvoc746]

Comment should be pinned, tbh.

[@walterroche8192]

I found the shows representations of News to be more accurate than comfortable. A rather harsh but factual truth that many people DID NOT want, and still don't.

[@CivilWarMan]

I think B5's stance generally comes down to independent reporters are annoying and antagonistic, but also necessary, because things get infinitely worse when the press falls under the sway of state and/or corporate interests.

[@dermagnus8482]

Like todays "journalists"

[@meoff7602]

​@@dermagnus8482There will always be both in a democracy. The double edge sword of freedom.

[@wongkit9579]

​@@meoff7602 At some point if your news is controlled by Corporate or Government, you're not free.

[@colinscutt5104]

its like you watched the whole show and understood it

[@tarvoc746]

It's the core idea of "Always surround yourself with people who are a pain in the butt" again.

[@JimmyAgent007]

"Commander! Did you threaten to grab hold of this man by the collar and throw him out an airlock?" "Yes, I did." "I'm shocked. Shocked and dismayed. I'd remind you that we are short on supplies here. We can't afford to take perfectly good clothing and throw it out into space. Always take the jacket off first. I've told you that before. Sorry, she meant to say: 'Stripped naked and thrown out an airlock.' I apologize for any confusion this may have caused."

[@Deltaflot1701]

one of my top ten quotes from that show

[@Lonovavir]

Ivanova is a boss. Don't mess with Ivanova, you can't handle the pain.

[@petertrudelljr]

@@Deltaflot1701 was having Battlestar flashbacks... Ivanova > Roslin

[@michaelguth4007]

@@Lonovavir Ivanova is always right. I will listen to Ivanova. I will not ignore Ivanova's recommendations. Ivanova is God.

[@Deltaflot1701]

@@petertrudelljr Ivanova was fun and scary. shame she couldn't stick around for teh final season

[@DanielSolis]

An Emmy for actor who played that reporter when she returned to air. Hoo boy, that still gets me.

[@justinscharf8838]

It got me just seeing the clip here. All the memories of the series up to that point came right back like I had just watched it

[@steveaustin2686]

Maggie Egan is the actress and the reporter's name was Jane.

[@MaconMedia]

I'm a reporter and the public should be VERY suspicious of reporters and those who own the companies they work for. There are some out there who try to use their writing to shape the narrative and shape public opinion with certain political outcomes being the desired goal. A good reporter is worth ten times their weight in gold, but a bad one can destroy a community of a business and contribute to harming public discourse and turn the results of elections.

[@gups4963]

Or cause riots

[@multilis2]

is it an insurrection or a protest if 20 people die and 4 police are shot after Obama gives a speech after Floyd incident? police count as authorities... meanwhile charges dismissed after woman in Ontario similarly killed as floyd in hospital over not wearing mask in covid Era and barely important

[@darth_yoda]

Babylon 5 was in many ways a master piece of narrative story telling in a time were TV shows Sci-fi and fantasy always were running on Monster of the Week type of stories babylon 5 had a single story spending multiple seasons with small side stories here and there that all tied into the main one.

[@pressxtodoubt6346]

One small thing. In "The Illusion of Truth" when negotiating with the reporter, Sheridan lets slip, naively perhaps, that he had no news of his father back on Earth, on the run from the regime, and really wanted to know. At the end of the broadcast, the reporter slipped in that his father continued to elude the authorities.

[@jasonblalock4429]

Which in turn suggests that the reporter actually meant it when he said he'd slip in what truth he could.

[@SoloPilot6]

Watching news coverage of the Presidential election, I have OFTEN been reminded of ISN during the time that it was being run by Clarke's people, especially that gal with the exaggerated smile.

[@petertrudelljr]

Sheriden and Delenn were purposefully written as hopeful beings willing to seeeee the good in others. They aren't political animals like G'Kar and Londo. Delenn is used to not being questioned, her word is rule... she IS the body politic and so doesn't understand the game.

[@dressinggownsessions7296]

"Everybody's got an agenda, whether they admit it or not, but they try not to let it get in the way of the truth." A really great line there. How much some people try not to let it get in the way of the truth is variable to say the least, but it's accurate.

[@dolgarth]

I found out after working with journalists, that they aren't employed to tell the truth. They are employed to sell advertising. The better the story, the higher the viewership, the more expensive the advertising slot. There is a reason what they write is called stories.

[@andreaso8886]

I really loved the newslady, and I was soooooooo happy to see her return like that after the fall of the regime

[@MisterRandom2]

Slight correction: Voice of the Resistance was created *after* and in response to the events of "Illusion of Truth".

[@johnhenry524]

Imo, B5 is the greatest sf series ever, period.

[@johnhenry524]

It was treated very badly by the corporate suits. I hope the remake occurs.

[@DaveNarn]

That was a big bite of the show to chew on for a short presentation. Well done, like Mollari would say ‘I think you’ve got it surrounded!’

[@Wychwood]

Diana Morgan, who played Allison Higgins, the propaganda reporter when ISN comes back on the air, was an actual newscaster. She has gone on to play newscasters/reporters in most of her acting jobs.

[@jimthain8777]

Nope. It was actually a woman called Maggie Egan.

[@JDEhlert]

Maggie Egan played the regular desk reporter, Jane, for ISN. When Clarke sent his forces after ISN when they threatened to break news about him, she was then replaced by Diana Morgan's character. Maggie Egan would then return post-Sheridan's attack on Earth and later in Crusade. As for Diana Morgan, Ms. Morgan did a beautiful job being ever so noticeably 'evil' in those scenes with a false friendliness and less than subtle "I'm laughing at all of you" smile. For me, Morgan then showed up in other shows, such as West Wing. @@jimthain8777

[@Wychwood]

@@jimthain8777Trust me, I know who Diana Morgan is. She was a news caster in the market where I grew up. She is the first reporter who comes on when ISN comes back online after Clark takes over. Her role is that of propagandist. Not Jane, who was on air when the ISN station was attacked. Diana Morgan is Black, Maggie Egan is White.

[@MervynPartin]

During a school trip to the local BBC radio studios in the 60s, we were given a demonstration of the editing of recordings of speech, so it has long been the practice to "modify" news to give a report the desired slant. With today's technology, it is even easier.

[@stevedoktor1766]

Watching these episodes more recently definitely makes you question the modern day news media

[@TheTrueAdept]

... it should have been in question for over a century at this point, as people forget that Yellow Journalism exists. Well, people understood that, but FOX 'News' killed that with their propaganda empire that has been building since the 1980s, turning the Conservatives into cultists over the decades.

[@randomexeter3627]

I feel that the news media's past improprieties should be what makes you question them rather than a few episodes of a TV show. "The Truth" is something that the news outlets have long held as being flexible and subjective.

[@edwardhuggins84]

We do know her name it was said when ISN was taken off the air as Jane

[@erikh8034]

Actress Maggie Egan. She did an interview years ago with the Babylon Podcast. She said it was fans that pointed out to her that the character's first name was Jane so she channeled some Italian heritage and came up with the last name of Nolastaname.

[@edwardhuggins84]

@@erikh8034 I didn't know that ty

[@erikh8034]

​@@edwardhuggins84 You're welcome. The Babylon Podcast is worth a listen. It's a very old podcast that started in 2007 I think so be prepared for audio issues.

[@TheFiddleFaddle]

The female anchor was played by Maggie Egan. That scene where she breaks down after being released was _so good,_ it has stuck with me all these years.

[@Phintasmo]

For such a small role she really nails it and delivers a memorable performance. It was great they were able to keep bringing her back - it paid off hugely!

[@steveseyboldt7206]

An important note to context. The Voice of the Resistance is created in response to the ISN hit piece in Illusion of Truth.

[@sw-gs]

I never liked news episodes but when I for first time watched but when in Endgame ISN (the real one) started transmission I cheered like a child.

[@SomeGuyNamedKeith]

This episode of Babylon 5 is brought to you by Ground News. LOL

[@IceWolfLoki]

"Ivanova seems hostile" - so an accurate depiction.

[@DarkVeghetta]

Babylon 5's take on jurnalism is based, because it's so close to the truth. It neither excuses nor villainizes the news media. Granted, today the old newscasters are far more partizan than at the time of B5's airing, so I'd argue the more honorable elements are mostly gone, but new and independent journalists have taken up the torch, even if they rarely refer to themselves as such, given the bad name the profession has accrued throughout the past 20-some years.

[@xehaexox]

I LOVED "And Now For a Word"

[@kellycochran6487]

"Look mom, a PSYCOP!"

[@CFalcon030]

You missed a very important scene (concerning the topic). I think it's season 1 or 2. Delenn buys Universe Today - Minbari edition because she wants to know what's happening before it's appropriate for her to be told of what's happening. So if a member of the Grey council of the most secretive race in the galaxy finds value in reporting, shouldn't we?

[@zarabada6125]

Technically, it was after she was removed from the grey council, so she would have lost some of her old information sources. In the same scene she also tells us she started reading human news sources after her difficult interview with ISN. Her reason to interact with the media is to stop the media from harming her again.

[@rudiruttger]

I really love how it demonstrates the dishonesty of news media. As relevant today as it was then, if not more so.

[@no2party]

Babylon 5 is a show that gets more terrifying with age.

[@Lickymaballs]

@@no2party not sure why it would get more terrifying with age (unless your afraid of the alien anal probe)🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@Agarwaen]

well, if you refer to things like fox news, or other proto-fascist media sure.

[@rudiruttger]

@@Agarwaenas a matter of fact, your MSNBC is just that sort of media, its character is just like that seen in the state of Russia

[@Agarwaen]

@@rudiruttger aww bless you, you're really this deep into cult-45.

[@MeanOldLady]

"The press should be not only a collective propagandist and a collective agitator, but also a collective organizer of the masses." - Vladimir Lenin “Ownership of the media is always in the hands of the perpetrators.” - Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

[@warrenreid6109]

I really enjoyed the episodes with the reporters and news feeds in them. The one with the janitors was good too.

[@brotherkellymatthewbarnes8882]

Babylon 5 always reminded me of a less comedic M.A.S.H. and you just confirmed that. Thank you.

[@JohnneyleeRollins]

I sure as hell do

[@MROJPC]

B5 is timeless. How relevant is Sheridan’s statement to the ISN news team when he is presented with the opinion that humanity needs to pull back from space, wasting time and funds on alien business, and should instead focus on itself to let the rest of the galaxy take care of itself. JMS loved making WW2 metaphors and 1930’s style isolationism is making a roaring comeback as of 2024 just when dictatorships are back on the rise around the world and attacking democracy on all fronts. Just like the 1930’s there are even wealthy industrialists and politicians and social movements in America showing sympathy or even supporting those dictatorships. “And Now For A Word”, I think, shows broadcast journalism being professional and “The Illusion of Truth” is a warning about how it can be manipulated until it becomes propaganda. When Clark finally instituted a full on dictatorship it is telling that ISN was one of the first targets. One of the best statements on the power of a legitimate news media that is professional and genuinely tries to give balanced reporting is from “Dark Twilight Struggle” where the fall of Narn is broadcast by a human network, but all the different races are bent towards the screens, paying close attention to an alien reporting on current events.

[@ianeichenlaub5084]

You're not gonna make it

[@MROJPC]

@@ianeichenlaub5084 John Connor, “Terminator 2: Judgment Day”

[@argentaegis]

B5 had a lot of news media throughout the series. Early episodes have newspapers and references to stories in them. I always thought the show did a good job of representing the importance of journalism, and it's ability to be distorted or outright corrupted. There are heroes and villains at ISN and we should be careful about taking what we're told as absolute truth. As for Sheridan and Delenn needing media training, yeh...they do. I understand why they don't have more savvy though. Journalism is a cultural novelty to Delenn at the beginning of the show. Sheridan is a line commander and has spent much of his career afield at that point in the show. (Remember, Clark put Sheridan in the spot because he was expected to be an obedient trigger puller.) That they'd need to put together VOR at all indicates a major blind spot in their governance. I think an ISN bureau on B5 (wouldn't you want to have one there?) would have been a great addition to the show.

[@tinfoilhatnews7489]

Babylon 5 hits hard on the Topic. Especially with the situation regarding today issue illustrating the issues of the Church Committee. Operations Mocking Bird.

[@darkhorse13golfgaming]

Since journalists have replaced lawyers as the lowest form of life I don't see the problem 🤷‍♂️

[@StarvinitySaga]

Well done, Phintasmo! Your content exhibits a commendable blend of creativity and enthusiasm. I've recently subscribed, eager to experience more of your engaging and entertaining work. Keep up the great job! 👏🌟

[@Phintasmo]

Thank you so much! You are very kind.

[@StarvinitySaga]

@Phintasmo you're very welcome. Hoping you have lots of inspiration this weekend and coming weeks.

[@MarcEspie]

I'll point out the extraordinary two-parters "heroes" in SG-1, broadcast in 2004, a mere 6 years after Babylon 5 ended. Another moving piece about journalism.

[@stephens021]

Nice to see this one getting some views, keep up the good work.

[@Phintasmo]

Thanks! Always great to have someone rooting for you.

[@badkarma3059]

it's funny watching the news over the past couple years I keep thinking about the Earth Gov news broadcast.

[@habloverdi7047]

Probably because reporters really can be manipulative as hell.

[@STho205]

As JMS was a retired print reporter/journalist from the decade before...i think the entire ISN arc is his opinion of CNN and then eventually Fox...but mostly CNN. Something that had biases but was mostly balanced, but sensationalized and clever out of context editing in the 80s to early 90s....turned to the party press by 1993. They found they could get people elected and unelected and there grew a revolving door between one particular party or administration with the news agency. You just had to be there to see it unfold. After 2005 or so the legacy news agencies started copying the CNN method of the late 90s and just became editorials on air. Now that's about all we have. Party Press....basically public relations for the party of their alliance.

[@Svafne]

This was a fun take on an old classic! Thanks :)

[@michaelclark7447]

I still remember how a reporter was making Delenn feel uncomfortable regarding her change. It was along the lines of: "I understand you changed yourself to appear more like us." "Yes, it's so I can understand and relate to humans more." "But you're not human. You're an alien. You never will be a human."

[@DeannaGilbert616]

Yep…and as a trans woman that hits even harder after watching it since I transitioned.

[@wongkit9579]

​​@@DeannaGilbert616​​Delenn is trans. Just think how some people would react today if they made a show about how a war hero who gets together with a trans woman...... Yet this show is 30 years old and they made it without even a peep of backlash. J Michael Straczynski is a genius.

[@DeannaGilbert616]

@@wongkit9579Yup. Though part of that I think is because she's an alien. It's easier to have an allegory rather than showing it directly. But Delenn's entire storyline for S2 and just how ON POINT it is for a trans woman's experience, I'm certain JMS knew a trans woman personally at the time.

[@wongkit9579]

He did! He went on to do a few projects with the Wachowskis. The creators of the Matrix.

[@DeannaGilbert616]

@@wongkit9579I'm pretty sure B5 was well before he worked with them, which was much more recent. I suspect it was another trans woman.

[@nickm9102]

I feel like ISN during the Clark administration is forshadowing of the current US.

[@Sashowindfeather]

They did it again in BSG too. The "News' episodes are pretty decent to give you outside perspective.

[@3ccdmike]

Thank you !

[@Phintasmo]

You're welcome!

[@zacharythomas8617]

Great content per usual.

[@michaelweigel8253]

Then there's the reporters who always get the names wrong. And girl anchor smiles as she says, "President Clark's extremely popular martial law plan". Yeah, just like the mainstream media does in 2024. Don Henley really had it right in "Dirty Laundry" too.

[@Jagent]

If it does, it doesn't hate them enough. It thinks it does, but it doesn't.

[@DCMarvelMultiverse]

I watched a doc during my journalism ethics class. It showed how certain real truths are edited out of raw and live footage. Plus, there are "journalism courts" wherein panels of journalists appease corporations with a beef with them but a beef the corporation cannot win in actual court. Plus, the marriages between journalists (usually female) and big business types (usually male). Finally, it showed how reporters do their job if the subject does not play ball or calls them out.

[@ChairmanMo]

Willow Bay marrying Weatherman Bob must have helped him big time in keeping the Business Journalists from Cooking Bob for his defilement of Disney.

[@TechnoMageB5]

There's a reason people who know the media only grant live interviews - prevent alteration of what they said or what they're responding to. The Michael Jackson and Lisa Marie Presley interview back in the 90s comes to mind as an example.

[@SageofStars]

The big answer to this is what they represent. From season 2-4 the news media, such as it is, is yet one more arm of the government that is quickly falling into facism and totalitarianism. Similar to how the Military itself gets a different take depending on who's doing it, since they certainly seem to like the ISN woman when she comes back in the final bit of season 4.

[@AnonymousAnonposter]

Don't we all?

[@manwiththeredface7821]

Here's a terrifying thought. An average Joe on Earth could've had no means of figuring out that the report on Sheridan was a bunch of lies. Nor could he have with 100% certainty know that what the Voice of Resistance reported was true or how much of it. All he could see (if he had access to both at all) was conflicting reports. What's terrifying is it's EXACTLY the same today in real life: conflicting reports and if you believe any of them you have no way of telling if you just fell for the bad guys or not. ANYONE who's so confident about their respective stances on things happening today should think about this. What if you're wrong? What if you've been wrong the whole time? I know that convincing someone that they had been tricked (odds are repeatedly for many years) is one of the hardest things to do, ESPECIALLY today when people allow their political stances to define who they are so much (and when you poke at the "facts" they base their views on they take it as a personal attack), but still.

[@Phintasmo]

So true! Always question, especially when something is hitting all your confirmation biases in a way that’s a little too good to be true.

[@danielhall271]

I think that at least some citizen Joes are able to track the incentives of the various parties. And keep track of past behavior, in a fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me way of thinking.

[@BLZ231]

Ironically, the best way to never be wrong is to be brutally honest about the fact that you COULD be wrong. That way you will actually listen to new information and change your views about reality when presented with new evidence. But if you think that you can’t be wrong, that mistaken belief could trap you into a false view of reality with no escape. And of course this is how a lot of con men, grifters, and wannabe dictators indirectly keep their followers in line. Because if their followers ever admit that they were duped, they’d have to admit that they’ve wasted so much time, money, and energy on a farce. They’d have to come to terms with the fact that the person they looked up to was actually a despicable human being who did all kinds of harmful and potentially illegal things, and that their support of this person enabled and facilitated the bad things this person did. In admitting that their idol was a bad person, they would also have to admit that they were a bad person, or at least a fool. Acknowledging this painful reality is a difficult task that not everyone is capable of, and for many they take the easy way out. So they continue to swallow the lies, because a comforting lie is better than a painful truth, even if deep down they know that painful truth.

[@sandal_thong8631]

Part of Delenn's response may be due to her not being questioned much as a leading member of the Religious Caste. But it's also due to her giving the order to wage war against the human race in a jihad, nearly causing their extermination. In some ways that's what Israel is going through. Maybe a thousand people were killed, and now they "are a race gone mad," as a Mimbari said after their leader was killed and they went on a jihad.

[@steveaustin2686]

5:50 The whole point of the s2 ep "And Now for a Word" was to show B5 from an Earth point of view, so that we the viewers could see where Earth was and where it was headed. If you have not read The Lurker's Guide to Babylon 5 on the internet, you should. It has jms social media posts from when the episodes were being produced and aired. It offers valuable insights into the whys behind some of the choices on the show. In case in point for "And Now for a Word" jms said the following. "There's a thing you do in theater training where you're told to talk about a subject, never use the word "I" ...but in the end wind up telling us more about *you* than the subject you're speaking about. So I began to wonder if I could apply this exercise, in a limited way, to an episode of the show. I can't say more than that without spoiling things, but suffice to say you learn a lot about all kinds of people, and the way you learn it says a lot about those involved. It's a *very* subversive and tricky episode, and I *very* much suggest taping it, so you can go back and check something out later. You'll know what. If you don't, you'll kick yourself later." "The device of using a reporter's appearance to go to another POV is not new to either B5 or MASH (though B5 is first to use it in SF). Where I would draw the distinction is in the sense that "Word" is actually very subtly subervsive. It's ostensibly about B5 (the broadcast itself) but you learn a LOT about Earth in the process...how the government wants the Mars situation interpreted ("an Earth-loyal population held hostage by a violent minority"), the government changing back home (suddenly we have an Office of Public Information and a Ministry for Public Morale), how they see the end of the Minbari war, and so on. It's designed to show more than just who's being interviewed; you reflect home as well." "Very few have noted the play on the title. The usual complete phrase is, "And now for a word from our sponsor." So what was the only sponsored commercial shown (in the 2259 version)...?" (ed - it was a Psi Corps commercial)

[@timsimms65707]

B5 was spot on in their depiction of the MSM.

[@tonyf8167]

yeah; JMS pretty much nailed it...

[@uweburger]

B5 show how easily the media can manipulate IF the journalists are willing to go along with it. Integrity is important

[@TheTrueAdept]

No, the reality is that integrity isn't important; it's regulations. Humans need rules, a sad reality that most people ignore. If integrity will get them far, they'll do it in a heartbeat; if it's an impediment, they'll drop it in the next. "WE NEED LESS RULES," quite a few people say. My answer would point them to history and the reports of the NCSB (National Chemical Safety Board), NTSB (National Transport Safety Board), and other regulatory agencies (the NCSB has a KZbin channel, surprisingly enough). People *_WON'T_* self-regulate; they must be made to regulate. That's why many of the settings I've been working on have a very tyrannical edge to them (largely due to this thing called the 'Technological Context' (the sum of human knowledge and its applications) and the moral calculus forcing them to be such in our eyes, not because of 1984-larping or something like that). People won't regulate, so the government has to step in and force them to regulate.

[@kellycochran6487]

@@TheTrueAdept All we have to do is look at history before government-mandated regulations. Bad food, bad water, sketchy medicine, insane working conditions. There's a certain third party that believes that de-regulation is important, and that if allowed to corporations will simply do the right thing because otherwise, who would buy their products. Never mind that if they were unfettered, they'd ALL do it,

[@TheTrueAdept]

@@kellycochran6487 ... it's not just a certain 3rd party, but also many right-wing parties as well.

[@kellycochran6487]

@@TheTrueAdept They're just the loudest and most idiotic.

[@TheTrueAdept]

@@kellycochran6487 who, surprisingly, is being backed by Russia with a combination of HUMINT, information warfare, and memetic weapons.

[@Johnston212]

There is one line that I always remember from this show. "When we changed the dictionary" Sure she was the propaganda police, but it wasn't the news media at that point

[@RN1441]

I wish we hadn't had to see that happening in real time these days.

[@Gellert1984]

That whole bit could be taken in a couple different ways as well, personally I interpreted it as Clarks government classing anyone homeless or unemployed as traitors and dissidents.

[@nathandi_maggio8297]

I've got the DVD version and have watched it from the original TV show and on DVD at least 20 plus times and because of this vid I'm going to have to watch the whole bloody thing again lol

[@skyborne80]

That earlier media episode was great, the later propaganda episode was brilliant!

[@fighterck6241]

4:05 plus the Centauri definitely play on their similarity to humans in appearance. Considering misinfo in our timeline, there are probably hunans who still think that they're related despite that having been debunked.

[@jaxkommish]

Yes, B5 does hate journalists. But not nearly enough. None of us hate journalists as much as they deserve

[@TheTrueAdept]

Especially after Fox "News" showed up. Read into the thought process behind that one and you'll understand why I said "News" instead of News.

[@jaxkommish]

@@TheTrueAdept There is not a national TV news org or legacy print news org that is doing anything other than picking a side and running propaganda for the side they picked

[@EricDaMAJ]

You still trust CNN and MSNBC, don’t you. They’re ALL lying to us.

[@carlosrivas1629]

@@TheTrueAdept OH right and CNN is the most trusted name in new, Darth Vader said so. LOL!!!

[@TheTrueAdept]

@@carlosrivas1629 and surprisingly enough, it's far more accurate than FOX 'News'. Scientifically proven, in fact.

[@Sargonarhes]

Reporters can be trusted as much as any politician, as far as you can throw them. B5 got it correct for the most part, JMS writing was done so well. Although to a fair point he says it's a critique of those on the right-wing, he doesn't seem to realize we see these same things on the left-wing as well. Truth is a double edge sword and cuts both ways.

[@virginiahansen320]

Everyone hates reporters. EVERYONE.

[@Deevo037]

I disagree with that, an open media is a necessity. They may not always tell you what you want to hear but as long as they can say it then we're further away from a fascist state. Sadly some elements of contemporary media have become political propaganda tools.

[@ianeichenlaub5084]

​@@Deevo037they have always been propaganda tools with very few and only temporary exceptions. See all the wars for examples of all news media peddling obvious lies and it being forgotten each time.

[@rdtradecraft]

I have long disagreed with the assertion that even a little truth is better than none. A little truth, mixed in with the right tapestry of lies can lend credence to the lies and make them harder to debunk and more powerful in the minds of the people who hear them. The deliberate omission of key facts can actually turn a little bit of literal truth into the most powerful of lies.

[@harvestcanada]

i remember when the BBC was journalistic powerhouse. now like most of the news programmes. B5 was spot on. look at is happening now! ;(

[@toddfraser3353]

While B5 is a political post, the ones who are managing B5 are not politicians, but military. As serving military they are not accustomed to pleasing the general population. So they normally don't like reporters especially those who deal with political figures, over analyzing or trying to trick them into saying the wrong thing. For the elected politician, they can talk to their base even if it pisses off their political opponents, because they are not their bosses. However a military leader needs to make sure all political parties are not offended as they are collectively their bosses. So journalist are much more problematic for those on B5

[@Daemonworks]

Added complication: military people who are forced into also being politicians and diplomats. They're juggling a lot, and it's increasing out of their training and above their pay grade. There should be dedicated staff for a bunch of stuff that they just don't have... like a press liason officer. It's mostly to keep the cast down, but really fits with the idea that earthgov started going sideways earlier on. Of course these folks have too much on their plate and not enough help: folks were already pulling strings to help it fail.

[@davidweihe6052]

Also, B5 had no Public Affairs officers taking the point for the hopefully rough and honest military officers. Did Gen.Norman Schwarzkopf do the daily briefing or did the US military use Public Affairs officers, I cannot remember.

[@steveaustin2686]

Yeah, the video skipped over the Cmdr Sinclair line to Garibaldi when he was ducking the reporter interview in the s1 ep Infection. Sinclair said that he was told to say what he really felt to a reporter once and the next day he was reassigned to a post soo far out that you could only find it with an ouiji board. His interview with her at the end of the episode (Infection) was spot on why space travel is important in the future. Of course the one where the reporter, Londo, and G'Kar were all run out of the C&C is from the s1 ep "By Any Means Necessary". At the point that the reporter follows Sinclair into the C&C, he has been told by the negotiator Orin Zento that he has to invoke the Rush Act to squash the docker's strike by any means necessary. Which Zento sees as using security to violently force the dockers back to work. The reporter has heard rumors of this, so she is seeking confirmation from Sinclair, which if he confirmed it, would send the dockers through the roof. Ships are badgering Ivanova to dock and she can't have them dock with the blue flu strike. Londo has a G'Quan Eth plant that he refuses to turn over to annoy G'Kar and G'Kar has retaliated by stealing a Centauri idol, although he has an alibi. Sinclair has been without sleep for over a day to the various crisises, so he has lost patience. So has Ivanova, which is why she is happy to run them out of a restricted area like the C&C. So while the video talks about media bias, as B5 did a master class in that showing that during the series good and bad, he indulges in a bit of his own.

[@johnchristopher20]

At least THOSE journalists weren’t for sale.

[@edale2]

2:10 - You said the cutting away to events as if they were happening in real-time makes no sense, but I've seen that exact style of reporting done in real life. The trick is, it's almost exclusively used ni documentary-style reports... which was exactly the style used for the ISN broadcast.

[@ChrisWar666]

I would have also included the outright propaganda of GoodFacts ..

[@steveaustin2686]

The season 3 ep "The Illusion of Truth (8:38) is pure propaganda.

[@HoLeeFoc]

Delen's initial reason for "transitioning" to a human-minbary hybrid had less to do about building a bridge between the two races that would prevent another tragic war. She stated that the population of Minbar had been decreasing for some time. Her discovery that Sinclair carried the soul of Valen, confirmed that to something happened in the past. We later find out that it was Sinclair's transition from human to minbari - on his way to the past of 1000 years ago - and his minbari descendents, opened a portal that allowed the souls of deceased Minbari to travel to Earth and be reincarnated as human bodies. And even though her transition happened prior to the events that unfolded in the two part episode "war without end" before the identity of Valen was discovered, she suspected that the title "a minbari not born of minbari" meant a transitioned being and the only device capable of making this possible, was the ancient device known as the triluminary. And what sentient race was the most likely being transitioned from? The human race of course.

[@exexpat11]

B5 saw 2024.

[@altrocks]

It's important to know/remember that JMS worked as a journalist and that informs his writing about journalists. Also, having Harlan Ellison as a friend and consultant for the show is a surefire way to have highly self-critical views baked in. Before the takeover of ISN they were doing the standard media job at the time of catering to the sensational and ignoring the important, but boring. After the takeover they turn into a fully functional propaganda outlet. Radio Free Earth, basically. In the end of season 4 we have William Edgars basically admitting that before the takeover by the government, it was the corporations actually running things. Given the similarities before and after of how the journalists act, the news is reported, etc, it sends the message that ISN was just doing corporate propaganda before it did government propaganda. Both lead to the same place, ultimately, but that shouldn't be surprising given the original definition of fascism (the merging of the state and business/corporations). So, do they hate reporters? I sing think so. The sympathy and the fondness built for the two who were in screen during the ISN raid should be proof enough of that. I think the bigger message was that the media and journalism are more dangerous and important than most realize (especially in the 90s when it first ran). Just like we see in every other area, the fascists worked alongside everyone else until it was time to start naming names and taking down their opposition. It's definitely overdramatic and sensationalized for television, but not in a completely unrealistic way. If it were done today I doubt we'd see a live raid of the studios. Probably it would just change overnight. A new face would tell us that ISN parted ways with the other on screen people and they wish them the best. Then they'd jump right in to reporting the propaganda and anyone who wasn't paying really close attention would miss the switch, like a magician with a coin trick. Just like the increased aggression toward civilians and the colonies in season 4 that sparks Sheridan to take the fight to Earth, Clark was feeling the pressure. He had enough intelligence on malcontents to know where to send his loyal forces when it came time to seize power. He knew they had enough information to possibly remove him or limit his effectiveness and was forced into moving quickly and without subtlety. It worked, but it also created an instant resistance to him all across the galaxy. But, without the tool that is media under his control, he knew he couldn't survive and keep power. Ultimately, I think that might be the core view of journalists that the show gives. Quietly powerful, informing and influencing everyone more than they realize.

[@jdlech]

It depends on how you define "the news media". B5 shows some reporters out there trying to get the story. But then it hits the editing room and it all turns into propaganda. But you can't really blame the editors either. Because their very lives are on the line; not just their jobs. While you get both reporters and editors willingly supporting the Clark regime, you still get the understanding that most everyone has been cowed - terrorized - into toeing the line. You can see this when certain inconvenient truths slip through along with the propaganda. Like when they "interview" the actor who has clearly been tortured into a confession. They made sure anyone with a brain could tell he had been tortured into it. They reported as they were ordered. But reporters and editors alike let that little truth slip through. And then there's the episode with Penn and Teller, explaining that comedians have a lot more leeway (and tolerance) than reporters. So they can tell the masses things that would get a reporter or newscaster killed. The portrayal is so very realistic.

[@BLZ231]

In the case of the confession, I think it was less the reporters and editors letting the truth slip through, and more of a cold calculated move by Clark’s propaganda machine. The more simple minded viewers would take the confession at face value, while the more sophisticated viewers would be able to tell that the confession was made under duress. The simple minded viewers would then believe and spread the propaganda, while the sophisticated viewers would keep their suspicions to themselves out of fear, lest the same thing happen to them.

[@ricardoabh3242]

Unfortunately I feel realistic in many aspects

[@LeoH3L1]

... because they ARE the enemy.

[@enigma6482]

Season 3 ISN is basically just CNN and MSNBC.

[@czarkusa2018]

So true, the WMDs WERE there in Iraq and conspirators who seek to harm our nation from within are thankfully being brought to justice.

[@cutthr0atjake]

Yes and Yes

[@findiwindles]

From my perspective, the B5 depiction of news media reporters would only be seen as 'hateful' by those who still believe the news media is actually presenting unmanipulated truth, rather than telling whatever version of the story serves the bottom line.

[@mittensfastpaw]

ISN became Fox News when Clark took over everything.

[@DennisConnor-mw9dy]

In the defense of the membari we started it

[@Hakku1403]

yes, and right so

[@DuRoehre90210]

I am wondering how they would present this idea nowadays. Having every news clip some VPN or WHATEVER-BULLSHIT-ADD spoken by the host of the show inplace?

[@Malbeefance]

I'm not sure if B5 predicted cnn and msnbc or cnn and msnbc used B5's ISN as a template.

[@steveaustin2686]

For the early seasons, possible. Fox, Newmax, OANN, etc are the ISN under Clark.

[@firebornliger]

All sapient life should.

[@zacharythomas8617]

Why?

[@jack_m100]

"Journalists" have been disliked for a very long time. Google the anecdote about Gell-Mann Amnesia by Michael Crichton to learn why.

[@Agarwaen]

people who love to hide their corruption have hated journalists for a long time yes.. it's the entire reason for the the long right wing anti-journalism campaign in the us since the 70s.

[@EsmereldaWeatherwax-f1s]

Doesn't everyone hate/distrust them?

[@SSNewberry]

No enough.

[@professord1522]

I found the "journalists" from the show to be mostly manipulative, propagandistic, and dishonest - much like I find most "real" journalists. :)

[@bobo11112222]

ISN, cnn, msn. 😂😂

[@dreamingflurry2729]

Not every dictatorship or autocracy is "faschist" - so yeah, I don't think Clark's government is! Sure it's not a great democracy and very autocratic/dictatorial, but faschist? Hm...show me the evidence!

[@juliankirby9880]

Just remember. In season 4 when Garibaldi and team go to Rescue Sheridan from prison. The guard specifically insults the liberal news media, which means that the propaganda being spat out by the Clark Regime is highly right wing, and B5 is Glorious, Beautiful, Unadulterated Liberal, Globalist Propaganda. And it starts in episode 4 of season 1 when the Clark Storyline is 1st hinted at with the xenophobia mentioned by Dr Franklin at the end of the episode.

[@MeanOldLady]

"Every record has been destroyed or falsified, every book rewritten, every picture has been repainted, every statue and street building has been renamed, every date has been altered. And the process is continuing day by day and minute by minute. History has stopped. Nothing exists except an endless present in which the Party is always right." - George Orwell