I am quite late to the party and I'm not disputing the results but as an analytical chemist, I would find the results more compelling with a few changes to methodology. First is the assumption that the bags of soil mix were identical. To eliminate any bias, all the soil components should have been thoroughly mixed then split between the two beds. Then composite samples are taken from each and analyzed as a baseline. Small amounts are taken from several areas of each bed and thoroughly combined for testing (each bed is kept separate, of course). This confirms an 'apples-to-apples' comparison and gives a sense of the relative error for each component. Then the rock dust is incorporated and the soil from that bed is sampled and analyzed again to measure the contribution of the rock dust. My concern is the much lower concentration of some of the elements-if they were supposed to be equal before the rock dust, where did they go? Even if the rock dust somehow bound it up, it would have been recovered in the testing (I'm guessing acid digest and ICP). Otherwise they would have migrated completely out of the bed and I don't see any scientific rationale for that to happen, if they weren't present in the plant tissue. Also, in the veg testing phase, it might have been better to take larger samples of more than one pepper, weigh them to get an equal amount then puree and submit that as a sample. Again, large sample, totally homogenized. The sample size for metals testing is typically small-one gram or less-so the need for a homogenous sample is critical. Actually, even better would be to test each sample separately before combining to get an idea of the distribution. So, take 9 scoops of soil from different spots, remove half for testing, combine the remaining halves, mix and test the composite. I know it's expensive and a pain but to quantify such small concentrations it's the only way to be sure. 30 years of lab experience here. Lastly, it would have been nice to see the remaining plant tissues tested-leaves and stems. I'm not a botanist but is it possible micronutrients taken up by leaves contribute to the health of the plant but don't show up in the fruit? Just some thoughts.
@williamwaters4506Ай бұрын
It does not make any difference if you did the test his way or your way because in real life people are spreading this on their gardens in what ever hap hazard way. Some people use a no till method where the rock particles lie of the surface, others till it in. Rock dust is ground up rocks and it will ten of thousands of years for this 'dust' to be decomposed into small enough particles to me absorbed into plant roots. It makes no difference what is in your soil, what matters is the plants ability to absorb nutrients from the soil (cation exchange). This is a complex process. If one tomato plant winds up with eight tomatoes and the rock dust soil plant produces twelve does that mean it was because of the that rock dust? Soil is a living organism that is very complex and is filled with trillions of living creatures that are both visible and invisible (bacteria, worms). Mineral content is only one factor in soil health.
@CountToBen9 жыл бұрын
Fascinating stuff. From the research I've done, it appears that soils with adequate microbiology can actually mine all of the minerals from the parent clay/silt/sand particles. The plants actually can release specific sugars from their roots that attract specific microorganisms that mine for specific minerals. So if the plant needs selenium at one point it will release the right sugar to attract that biology that will accumulate it and then release it as soluble plant-form selenium when it the bacteria/fungus dies back.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
I agree the Mycorrhizal fungi relationship does the same thing.
@tedmcgee68254 жыл бұрын
To make plant sturdy and harder to bite for pest?
@B01 Жыл бұрын
Writing what you wrote 8 years ago is incredible, as it wasn't known for too long that nutrients could be pulled from inorganic matter. Way to stay ahead of the curve!!!
@B01 Жыл бұрын
@@tedmcgee6825 that's actually done by a biofilm of microbes on the plant surfaces. Bacteria and fungi release exudates which are glues and other compounds and create a physical barrier. Healthy plants put out lots of exudates to feed microbes on all their surfaces (especially roots). Unhealthy plants put out less, therefore feed less. Less feeding means less compounds released, less compounds means less shield aka pests bite through barrier easier (empty patches, thinner etc), fungal spores land on the leaf itself rather than barrier, and so on
@OneYardRevolution9 жыл бұрын
Fascinating rock dust lab results, Stephen! While I'm not very surprised that rock dust didn't increase the nutrient density of the peppers, I am surprised by the lower level of trace minerals in the rock dust amended soil. Thanks so much for going the extra mile and having these results analyzed!
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
My pleasure Patrick ! I don't think I could have not gone this far. I need to know what's going on! Thank you for being a great partner and QA QC on this video. I appreciate it and have learnt so much. !
@GriffenNaif2 жыл бұрын
Not surprising at all since soil bacteria, fungi, protozoa, nematodes, arthropods, and earthworms were not already present. Was your potting soil NPK'd
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
The most significant results in the Rock Dust Trial are in. Does Rock Dust increase the trace minerals in soil and increase the nutrient density of the food grown in it? Check out these surprising results! #rockdust #homegardenfieldtrial #trials #science #citizenscience #nutrientdensity #traceminerals kzbin.info/www/bejne/o6ipZId8hN98n80
@chriskeuhlen73729 жыл бұрын
Thank you for your impartial tests. I add rock dust to all of my soil but not directly. I have a worm farm that I use all year in my basement and add the rock dust to the worm food. I wonder if your results would differ once the worms have processed the dust especially since I add egg shells and other nutrients as well. Just a thought. Thanks again Chris in Michgan
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Chris, it takes a long time for minerals to break down. That said if your looking for a more cost effective way to add the same or more nutrients to your soil and worm castings a combination of house hold food scraps spent coffee grounds and eggshells should do the trick. If you have fall leaves to add as a mulch that helps too!
@chriskeuhlen73729 жыл бұрын
You are defining my worms diet :-) I collect the oak and cherry leaves for winter feeding along with food scraps and the occasional super market throw-away along with pulverized egg shells left over cat food newspaper etc. Just thought the worms digestive tract might break down the minerals a bit faster than mother nature. oops guess they are mother nature :-)
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Well Chris it sure sounds as if your well on your way ! No need for expensive products when you have worms.
@rayr59509 жыл бұрын
***** I watched the videos, but unless I missed something I didn't hear what kind of rock dust was used in the experiment? Glacial Rock Dust?, Azomite?, Quarry Fines? Something else? It does take a long time for rock to break down since microbial activity is mainly required to extract the minerals from the rock dust. I think it may be unrealistic to expect mineral availability of any great extent in the first season.
@OhioCoastie949 жыл бұрын
1) Could the minerals missing from both the soil and the fruit have wound up in the stems/leaves/roots of the plants? They had to go *somewhere*, and now I'm eager to know where. 2) Idea for a fourth bed: base mix + rock dust + biochar. 3) Idea for a fifth bed: just compost, but try compost made with all your ingredients right from the start. Assuming you make your own compost, try adding the rock dust, worm castings, & biochar right up front; mix it into the raw browns & greens that first form your compost pile. That's how I get everything to incorporate as the compost gets made & turned, thus "inoculating" the biochar and letting the rock dust & worm castings interact with the composting microbes.
@jasonbyu754 жыл бұрын
Good question. Do the variety of elements in rock dust displace some of the 13 essential for plants at the chemical compound level?
@satrah1012 жыл бұрын
@Dingi hi I had punkins growing in rock dust, the most fruit I have ever had. They started in normal soil, and work along the ground til the rock dust, because the plant was fully developed it stored all nutrition in leaves and stems. The rock dust gave the plant magnesium for energy to move nutrition to the fruit as this energy requires an "ATP magnesium complex" to assists ATP and is needed for this energy. Plant to my knowledge has 2 phases Growth and fruiting stage, growth stage was complete, rock dust will not work in growth stage. The soil pH was 8.5. I still playing around with this concept of high pH with Rick dust. Getting good results. There a nice book call " bread from stone" written in about 1890. It's a great little read. Talks about lack of magnesium problems in soil. No magnesium no energy for growth.
@charlesaanonson39547 жыл бұрын
It is very hard to get farmers in the Philippines to stop farming in areas on the sides of dangerous volcanoes. The reason is because the mineral rich volcanic soil produces very good plant yields. This is proof that rock dust works in the long run, especially in areas that may have excessive amounts of rainfall. Of course, in the very long term, most rocks decompose into clay. Probably the best cheap source of rock dust is the local granite quarry. It is a byproduct of rock crushers.
@therealKINDLE4 жыл бұрын
Yeh I do agree but the amounts you are talking about would not be viable here!
@scroogemcduck14624 жыл бұрын
No, it's just evidence that SOMETHING in the soil near volcanoes improves its fertility, it doesn't prove that rock dust is good for anything
@totopolo23796 ай бұрын
same in japan everything is volcanic, strems have the mineral volcanica profile. Best nutrition for wasabi
@marilync68807 жыл бұрын
First off, rock dust takes years to break down and affect the soil, so I wouldn't draw conclusions from just one season - glad you're following up each year. Further, plants do not uptake minerals without help from the microbes in the soil. Build the soil so that it is full of life, and nutritional value increases. Also the soil is more porous and aerated, so the land is more resilient to drought an floods, and as an extra bonus, carbon is drawn from the atmosphere and stored in the soil. Some principles of building healthy soil full of microbes include minimal disturbance of the soil (no tilling), keeping living roots in the soil year round, increasing biodiversity, minimizing chemical and biological disturbance, incorporating animals into the mix (in home gardens, that might mean beneficial insects, birds, etc.) Microbes consume the sugary exudates from the roots. Bacteria and fungi are essential partners in delivering minerals and nutrients from the soil.
@RobertaPeck9 жыл бұрын
I speculate that the free granite dust I got from a granite fabricator will improve my poor florida sandy soil for decades if for no other reason than it adds a different particle size to help hold water. I also speculate the rock dust soil tested poorer because it takes ongoing bacterial action to release the minerals in the rock dust, so the same amount of soil tested lower do to hidden inaccessible minerals. Regarding a comment below: For meJohn Kohler of "Grow your.Greens" was the primary motivating force in this movement to grow eatables on urban property. I am experiencing in your undertaking (1) a beautifully articulated refinement in practicality and (2) great science!, also beautifully articulated. Your efforts compliment and enhance the efforts of the early way-showers in the evolution of this movement.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
I am quite glad you enjoyed the video. I want to make sure I test all of the garden practices. As for the break down time of minerals we selected a strong acid analysis as such these results represent both the available and unavailable numbers. We did this so we could see everything. I am glad the KZbin community could help you get inspired and grow in your own yard ! I am a huge supporter of growing your own foot regardless of method used ! Keep it up my friend and please feel free to post photos on my Facebook page I would love to see them !
@suburbanhomestead9 жыл бұрын
Wow! For some strange reason for a second it felt like it was one of those paternity tests you see on TV. The suspense was dense :-)
@julvwildcat1909 жыл бұрын
suburban homestead ha ha ha. Your comment made me laugh. I didn't think about it that way until I read your comment.
@ConradCardinal9 жыл бұрын
Rock Dust you are NOT the father!
@julvwildcat1909 жыл бұрын
LOL!
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
suburban homestead lol that was unintentional however very funny :) Conrad Cardinal lol JulV Wildcat I love it :)
@suburbanhomestead9 жыл бұрын
Comedy makes things easier to accept. :-)
@upinyou89 жыл бұрын
It seems obvious to me that the height difference in the bed is the reason for the differences. The heavy elements are leeching out due to a flooding condition in the bed that is 3 1/2" lower. How is this system watered. If it is in a reservoir that should allow the heavy minerals to leech faster as the test showed. Either way any good researcher would look at this and see a major difference I. The control group. Just do it again and do it correct. If you need simple common sense advice on the rest of the Errors in your experiment please let me know.
@ant92283 жыл бұрын
I wish you did a whole series on different soil additives such as trace minerals and different lava rocks.
@generalsdad898 жыл бұрын
Thank you ver much for your video. You have just saved my a huge chunk of money. I was going to spend thousands of dollars to put rock dust over three acres, preparing for the growing season in 2015. This is the third video I have watched tonight that showed no major deference between the test subject and the control. Thank you again:))
@AlbertaUrbanGarden8 жыл бұрын
+Jack Bridges I am glad I could save you some money my friend! There are plenty of free and local resources that you can use to continue to build the soil !
@RobsAquaponics9 жыл бұрын
Just wondering if you think the source of the dust would make a difference.. I have seen one popular brand is rock made from volcanic ash where what we get here is a basalt powder, still volcanic in origin but is formed differently.. Then there is the glacial dust too.. Just curious..
@JeremyConnor9 жыл бұрын
Would be worth experimenting, good thoughts Rob Bob
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
As a matter of fact I have been trying to find two of the leading brands to test just this ;)
@medikouhai3789 жыл бұрын
The WSDA (probably usda too, but I'm in the pnw) provides analyses of commercially available sources like azomite, gaia green, et. al agr.wa.gov/PestFert/Fertilizers/FertDB/Product1.aspx Comparing just those two, they're notably different. (edit: For some reason, the site doesn't allow linking directly to the fertilizer index, although the link above seems to get around that for me. If you're not taken directly to the a-z index, you may have to click a portal at the bottom. Something about being a state gov site I guess.)
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Medi Kouhai very interesting thank you. I still will run them for analysis. It will help me understand what is going on having complete control over the process.
@OneYardRevolution9 жыл бұрын
Medi Kouhai Thanks! I wonder why so many of the minerals (e.g., Fe,Cu,Mn,Mo,S,B) are left blank for Azomite and Gaia Green? And many of the Azominte numbers that are listed are lower than what Azomite claims. Interesting!
@SheriFischerSherGarden9 жыл бұрын
This whole trial has been very informative throughout the growing season and now detailed analysis of the soil and plant samples. It makes you wonder what sort of soil reaction with the azomite caused a decrease in some of the elements. Or some other variable ? Very interesting and looking forward to next years trials.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
I am glad you enjoy it! I am keen to see what the evidence tells us !!
@dakotabob109 жыл бұрын
Very interesting results Stephen. I am glad that I didn't run out to try amending my soil with rock dust. Two thumbs up buddy!
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
I am very glad you enjoyed the results !
@woodville88739 жыл бұрын
Thanks for taking the time to find out if rock dust does improve plant intake of vitamins and minerals.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Needless to say I was kind of shocked !
@johnphillips60218 жыл бұрын
throwing a ton of rock duct into a small area was crazy. it's a pinch of rock dust per plant. the soil more than likely had no microbial bacteria to digest the minerals. your experiment would be the same as giving someone 10000 carrots, and seeing it his eyesight is better after your test. the soils in the US are depleted of minerals, any test can be rigged to shift any way you want, but for me rock dust is as important as compost.
@piauihlein85435 жыл бұрын
Check mineralforteplus spraying 2.5kg on 10.000 meter,very good results.
@CitizenAyellowblue5 жыл бұрын
John Phillips do,you have any trials or experimental evidence to,support your claim? Impressions are not evidence, even if they can be a good starting place for a hypothesis. Suggesting that this trial was ‘rigged’ demonstrates that you don’t understand how experiments are conducted. You might criticise the method, but there was nothing ‘rigged’ here. He explained exactly what materials were used and how he used them, and how the analysis was conducted.
@piauihlein85435 жыл бұрын
@@CitizenAyellowblue at the moment we spray 2.5 kg MineralFortePlus with 300ltr water on 1 ha.(10.000 sqare meters) Check it on MineralFortePlus.de. The results are very good.
@sidneyeaston69275 жыл бұрын
Rock dust is just a farce it may replace the minerals that the source rock has in it but on the whole dose nothing for plants you would be wiser to use silt from a river that has carried the dust from many sources and traces of the bacteria and fungi that can release the minerals and transition trace elements from it.
@sidneyeaston69276 жыл бұрын
Rock dust can improve poor soils. The problem is that one mineral may lock other minerals out of the useful mix, example - phosphate will not dissolve in salt water but if the phosphate is already dissolved salt can be added. Adding large amounts of rock dust will in all cases lock up one or more minerals. The idea is that a little of everything is good in the mix, a lot of one thing is poison. rock dust contains much needed minerals and can be used to benefit plant growth it can also make life difficult for the soil bacteria and fungi if used in large quantities. A few ounces will usually suffice for a large garden applied as a fine dusting once every three years. Plants can only use dissolved minerals in solution when you eat plants you are getting your minerals all ready dissolved and ready for your body to use.
@sherthom56729 жыл бұрын
Thank you for being so committed to examining this and other popular gardening advice. I wonder if the solubility of rock dust is a factor. It may take a very long time for the rock dust to break down where it's minerals are available, and if in the mean time, the rock dust binds the trace elements that are in the original compost/casting soil? Your research leads to a lot of questions that really need full scientific field trials and research to answer. But the most important thing your results did show is that adding amendments is not always helpful, and perhaps has the opposite effect than what we desire.
@OneYardRevolution9 жыл бұрын
Hi Sher. One thing we could have made more clear is that the numbers represent the TOTAL quantity of trace elements - both available and unavailable. So, the unavailable elements are taken into account in the results.
@sherthom56729 жыл бұрын
Even more interesting. I am assuming the increase is in iron and not iron oxide (rust).? Could trace elements be converted to iron (total speculation). Needs a soil chemist to address all the possibilities.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Sher Thom no elements unless exposed to nuclear processes will remain in their own elemental from. for instance calcium in the soil will never change to iron. your right it is very interesting!
@preadp19 жыл бұрын
As a new subscriber to the channel I am impressed by a scientific approach to gardening and its nutrition requirements, and wait for the results. As a keen gardener with experience in Chemical Engineering I can give advice in order to avoid experiment bias and in sampling errors. Firstly I would diminish the variation caused by parentage of the seeds that are planted. By this I mean that the seeds that are used in the trials come from the same parentage and therefore will have similar genetic codes, so that no freaky plants are used that give abnormally high yields. Different plants with different parentage can lead to greater or reduced yields and this must be taken into consideration. Secondly different crops in the same bed can distort the results and each variety have different nutrient requirements, as competition from different crops need to be minimised. It is best if a bed of one single variety of a crop, with the same parentage, is planted at the optimal spacing in rows and plant distance. In this way competition between crops and within the plants of the same variety is minimised. This would mean that 4 beds for each trial, one for each crop and therefore 12 identical beds are required Thirdly I would space the beds more apart so that cross pollination that will take place between the beds are minimised, effecting results. Also getting a representative sample- a sample that represent the whole bed- (of soil) is a complex field and many books have been written about it. AS you can image if I take a sample at different locations and depths, and have it analysis for element composition, the results would be different for each location and depth, so how can one sample represent the whole bed, The size of the sample (in weight) and the number of samples therefore become important, and it becomes an art of where to sample to get the best results. This is when statistical analysis comes into play that will tell you what size of sample that is required and how many. For some systems this may be a few grams, whist for other it may be a few kilos and it is generally excepted that a minimum of 25 samples is required to give a balanced analysis. As you can image this can get very expensive and time consuming, as the results you present could be totally wrong and the results can be reversed. A simple way to overcome this is to sample at various locations and depths and then mix those samples together to get 1 overall sample, and use this as a means of analysis. In this way bias will be minimised. Sampling itself will cause bias in the results, as any device used will cause particle segregation to occur and therefore cause a bias in what particles will be sampled and what will not. I am sorry to go into this, bur sampling can cause all your results to be meaningless. What I would recommend is to sample at the beginning of the trials in each bed, some in the middle and finally at the end. if you need any help in analysing results please let me know, and I will help. Thank you and kind regards for all your effort you put in.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Thank you my friend for subscribing. Make sure to check out the last few videos were we analyzed other practices and presented the results. I am interested to get your thoughts on them. We have taken into account most of what your comments and you can find the set up episode at the beginning of the trial playlist. Ill put the link at the end of this comment. I am restricted in the space I had available hence the stepped beds. I put barriers in place to prevent soil cross over and water infiltration. The same seeds from the same package of similar size and colour were used and the planting locations were identical as well. sampling can be a difficult condition to correct for as you mentioned. I would have loved to sample prior to planting the first year however i was unable to negotiate a deal with the lab in time as I am running of a 0$ budget. we will have a more comprehensive analysis moving into year two. It is a generally accepted limited sampling practice to use the same location in the absence of the ability to better sample the area of interest. as such in following years I will use the same method to sample in the same location to try to keep the information as consistent as possible. Trial Playlist: kzbin.info/aero/PL5mfR-r4BXH1WwrNIH29H-KI4LGrEfHFd Recent Episodes using lab analysis: Fall Leaves vs Rock Dust: kzbin.info/www/bejne/hpyyqIN3hal0kJI Using Coffee Grounds in the Garden: kzbin.info/www/bejne/n5eocqSEZseAhLc
@THERUSTEDGARDEN9 жыл бұрын
Hey... very good. I like the science behind the scenes. I think it is important for gardeners to understand what products are, what they do and how to use them sensibly. I would suggest you might look at the plants themselves. You hit the soil and the fruit which was excellent. You have the roots system, stems and leaves. It is possible in my opinion that the plant itself might have used the elements as they use N-P-K and Mg-S-Ca. Maybe composting the different plants will release elements back into the soil at different levels. Just a thought.
@THERUSTEDGARDEN9 жыл бұрын
Ill have to check out the other videos and see what I missed.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Gary Pilarchik Your right we are going to do a wider variety of tissues next year to see whats going on. Today really all we know is Rock Dust has lower elements in the soil and its not in the pepper tissue. I could not agree with you more Gary I want people to have evidence so they can make decision on their own. There is a playlist of the trial on my page it includes both my videos and OneYardRevolution
@eveny1199 жыл бұрын
Gary Pilarchik I would think they should test the soil as well, like if the ph is off the uptake may be slowed (learned that from you in phosphorous video).
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
eveny119 we did test the soil in the last video of this series :)
@TheMusachioedBrony9 жыл бұрын
Gary, you took the words right out of my mouth. That is exactly what I was thinking!! Having used rock dust for the first time this year, I personally noticed a huge difference between the overall health of the plants that were planted in raised beds where I used rock dust vs those that I did not. I felt overall the plants were so much stronger-ironically, I noticed it the most in my orange bell peppers that I had grown from seed!! I wasn't consciously trying to set up an experiment-it just worked out I had space available in one bed that I had amended with Azomite, and space available in another bed where I had run out of Azomite, so I just had the regular soil amended with compost. Same sun and watering conditions. My orange bell peppers in the bed with Azomite absolutely flourished, and we feasted on them to our hearts content and I still have a ton in the freezer. The orange bell peppers in the other bed grew, but at a snails pace and they never produced fruit. I personally saw how much the rock dust contributed to the overall health of the plant-it was my first year using it, and it made me a true believer!!! It is sad that it doesn't seem to contribute to the nutrient content of the fruit. But for me, a person who for three years has unsucessfully tried to get fruit off bell pepper plants-the fact that my peppers came to "fruition" only in the bed where I had amended with Azomite is proof enough-Bring It!!!
@soaronwingslikeeagles79829 жыл бұрын
Microbes, algae and lichens, etc transform the minerals in rock dust into protoplasm making bio-available minerals for the plant. This takes time. You don't just add rock dust and expect immediate response from the plants because the minerals need time to be unlocked within healthy soil biochemistry. I was disappointed that this was not taken into account or even mentioned within the video - hence the disappointment and even dismissal of the rock dust within your comments section which sadly you have not tempered with the facts. Glad you are willing to keep the experiment going a couple more years. Adding rock dust with lots of compost and Efficient Microbes is how people are correctly advised, and then giving time. Nothing empirical about these results yet - experiment is incomplete.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Well last years study was really to evaluate claims made by people sighting quick responses and huge first year results. You are correct much like a mineral layer below the topsoil it takes time to release the elements. That said there are plenty of sources of these elements as I have uncovered in my testing garden assumptions series.
@MrChip1234729 жыл бұрын
Very interesting results! Makes me wonder about what other soil amendments may be either useless or causing a negative effect on our home garden crops. Makes me think of a conversation I had with a commercial farmer this summer, he told me that if rock dust was as good as some people say then all of the farmers would already be using it. I think he may be right.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
MrChipGardener You know farmers have a really good understanding of whats going on. More and more often I am amazed how much re-learning we are doing of old time farm knowledge! trials are a great way to test other products! OneYardRevolution and i would be more then glad to help you run a trial!
@KB-22222 жыл бұрын
yet a lot of farmers use poisons
@sirgeekcsp9 жыл бұрын
The main concern I have with this is: The starting soil was already very "amended" with minerals/etc. from the Humus and Worm Castings In my garden (which has been growing things for 22+ years) was tired soil. This year I amended with 1/lb of Rock Dust per 10sq feet of garden and I went from an average of 70lbs of San Marzono Tomatoes from 18 plants to 140 lbs this year with 17 plants. This cannot be a coincidence. Plants from the same source and same garden soil. Only change was the addition of the Rock Dust.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
sirgeekcsp the trials are aimed at the application of products like rock dust to representative home garden plots. In a lot of cases these products are targeted at excellent soil. So these trials were designed to test that. We really set out to test the most common claims for the home garden if in these conditions crop yields would increase, Higher Brix Readings, improved trace elements in the soil and higher nutrient density. I understand what you are saying with the results from your garden and I am absolutely happy things improved for you my friend! What both OneYardRevolution and I found very interesting is the controls numbers. These are purchased products however they are easy to make at home with little or no money invested. Patrick has a great series on producing worm castings and I have done a few on different compost techniques that cost nothing and are simple. What these control numbers show us is that these garden processes can produce all of the nutrients required for healthy large crops. The best part is you dont have to spend a lot of money and you can see the rewards for years to come! We will be setting up a poor soil trial in 2015 to test these products there as well.
@sirgeekcsp9 жыл бұрын
Unfortunately, I'm thinking MOST gardens are more like mine (normal topsoil - which HAD been amended with compost for years and with a custom mineral additive based on soil analysis). I'm also thinking most people don't have the time/space to create a compost bin let alone create/maintain a worm bin. Most people are not going to create raised beds, create/buy compost or worm castings - especially if they're just getting into gardening). Heck ! Most people probably haven't even HEARD of Worm Castings or Rock Dust - We didn't until last spring. Also, I've got years of data (pounds of produce from the garden, etc) and I'm going to see what the addition of worm castings does next year.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Let me know what your results say !
@LFN79 жыл бұрын
In addition, tests like this one remind me most medical tests this days that look at the body at one single point in time, when in fact our body PH and fluids are changing throughout the day non stop changing all these levels... Test the plants in that bed next year and the year after see what will happen then report your results..
@TheSajeffe9 жыл бұрын
I'd just like to add my thanks to you, Stephen, as well as Patrick for the effort you've both put into these rock dust and biochar trials. Fascinating stuff. Curiouser and curiouser.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
I am so very glad we could bring this to you. it makes all the work worth it if it helps one person!
@duffland099 жыл бұрын
Perhaps, due to the molecular weight of the dust (being relatively unprocessed by nature), the charged particles attach and drag other trace minerals to the bottom during watering. I would like to see the bottom of the soil tested at the end of the experiment. I essentially think the dust is food for bacteria and fungus. They deliver minerals to the plant. It's all very interesting anyways. Kudos for them testing anyways..
@waylonmidgett8241 Жыл бұрын
Heavy minerals sank like gold during the watering and growing
@Chris1537589 жыл бұрын
A few points: there are different types of rock dust from different sources with different elemental compositions and ratios. Therefore, to be thorough it would be a good idea to test several different types, or alternatively, to mix several types of rock dust together and then mix them into the test soil. When you create two soil mixes from identical ingredients and mix them thoroughly, there should be identical, or nearly identical, concentrations of each element in each sample from each of the mixes. Then, when you add something extra (e.g. rock dust) to the test soil mix, there should be increased concentrations of certain elements that were present in the rock dust in that mix, not lower concentrations. It is unlikely to lower the concentrations of the various elements by adding something extra, especially when that "something extra" is already shown to contain higher concentrations of the elements that you are testing for. There are a few possible reasons why Stephen obtained the results that he did, especially pertaining to the soil samples. Firstly, minerals can leach out of the soil. The raised beds in the video were at different heights above the ground, and it looked like it was possible that leachate from the higher bed could have found its way into the lower bed, thereby transferring minerals from one bed to the other. Secondly, it's highly possible that Stephen mixed up the soil samples, and from looking at the results from the elemental analysis of the two samples, this seems to be the most likely scenario. I could understand if both samples had similar concentrations of each element, but to have lower concentrations of elements in the test sample compared to the control was a red flag that there was some problem with the methodology or the execution. Thirdly, it is also possible that the initial soil mixes were not mixed thoroughly and that would have resulted in areas of relatively high and low concentrations of the different elements in each mix. Finally, it would've been helpful to see how he took the soil samples. For example, if he took a soil sample from an area with lots of roots, then it is reasonable to think that the soil minerals would be depleted in that area, relative to an area with few or no roots. One improvement to the methodology would be, when preparing the soil, to mix the soil for the test and the control together in one large mixer, like a cement mixer or a proper soil mixer, remove the soil for the control, then add the rock dust to the remaining soil in the mixer, mix thoroughly, and then use that in the test bed. This would ensure that the soil mixes were more homogeneous, and differed only in the addition of the rock dust. Probably the most important results were the tissue sample results, which showed no significant differences in the nutrient levels between the peppers grown in the test soil (with rock dust) and the control samples. This would seem to indicate that as long as you start with a rich soil mix (as he did) that the addition of rock dust will make no significant difference in the final result. This makes sense and seems to be a totally valid finding. One caveat that I would add is that if you are working with a relatively poor soil, then maybe rock dust would make a difference in the nutrient levels in the resulting produce. That might be an interesting test to do next.
@OneYardRevolution9 жыл бұрын
We agree that the soil results are surprising. One possibility that you didn't mention is that the rock dust product may not be what it claims to be. To be clear, I am not suggesting that this is the case. However, Stephen will be sending a sample of the rock dust to the lab for analysis to find out.
@Chris1537589 жыл бұрын
OneYardRevolution Good point. That's a possibility that I hadn't considered. Good idea to get it tested too. Btw, I think that this kind of empirical testing is a great idea, and I'm very interested in following future tests. For the record, I have bought Azomite in the past and used it for one season. I did not notice any real difference in my plants, and as a result, I discontinued its use. I'm a firm believer in compost and worm castings, but I'm always open to new information from a good source. Thanks for your work.
@OneYardRevolution9 жыл бұрын
Cryptopolis Stephen just confirmed that he has video evidence of his soil collection and packaging. No mix ups! It sounds like you and I have a similar basic approach - compost and worm castings! Thanks for your thoughtful comments!
@Chris1537589 жыл бұрын
OneYardRevolution That's interesting. I wonder what could've caused the lower levels of Ca, P, S, etc. then? Tannins, found in compost, can chelate cations like Ca++, but they would be present in both mixes and so should affect both equally. It's possible that there was more leaching from one bed compared with the other. Was the water ground water or rainwater? I find that if I have to use tap water (groundwater where I live) that I get a build-up of Ca & Mg in my soil, but if I use rainwater (depending on availability) that it tends to leach more minerals out of my soil. It's a mystery for now, but hopefully we can figure out what is going on in the future. :-)
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Cryptopolis Fantastic response my friend. the beds were made with the exact same component material from the same batch numbers of each product. there is potential for slight variance however this is usually below the detection limit for regulated products in Canada. all beds received all their water from rainfall or my hose. There was no marked difference in water regiment. As OneYardRevolution said ill be running more analysis on the trials to see what is going on here. Starting with analysis of the product. there are lots of possibilities but more investigation is in order before we can speculate. To date though the first years product claims much as you observed are not well supported by this evidence.
@IndoorHydroponix9 жыл бұрын
Kohler just jumped off his roof! This is a fantastic trial and scientific analysis. I think you hit the nail on the head in the beginning by saying remineralization is more beneficial in poorer soils - like farmland that has been depleted because of the industrial practices using petro's and not replacing matter back to the soil. Great job buddy.
@Tommyr9 жыл бұрын
LOL! He's not going to like this video! I knew rock dust was over hyped / rated. Now don't get me wrong, I like some of his videos but he pushes too many products and is now even getting into pot growing crap. What "medical issue" does he have to warrant getting a medical waver for pot? He gets stranger every month.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
I am working with a group near me to see if they would be willing to join the trials. They have some poor farm land soil that would be perfect for this. I am glad you enjoyed the video my friend !
@IndoorHydroponix9 жыл бұрын
Kohler is a good dude, I agree the medicinal stuff is not up my alley - but his overall message about organics is pretty spot on. I think rock dust, teas and bio char are worth examining - but when it comes down to it, green and brown manures (composted) are the key to great plant growth. Everything else is just extra...
@IndoorHydroponix9 жыл бұрын
***** - continue on with the great work!
@Tommyr9 жыл бұрын
skunk farm I don't know about the cry baby per se part but his over hyping of products turns me right off. I'm sure I'm not the only one. He obviously has some money, he travels all over the place. Now he's on a pot kick. I'm not against pot but it's not for me. COMPOST people! It's all you need.
@daddykirbs9 жыл бұрын
Wowzers! Great work ***** ... keep up the scientific studies to help us all become more informed gardeners. I like the idea of using rock dust as a feed supplement for livestock then using the manure as compost. The minerals will benefit the animal first then re-mineralize the soil. This would be a very gradual way, but perhaps more beneficial... time to go test some poop.
@ChrisClement9 жыл бұрын
Pretty awesome. Thanks for sharing!
@billgrover94219 жыл бұрын
I've been adding rock dust and green sand to all my new beds. I should have used my own controls to evaluate its efficacy.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Bill grover thats why we are sharing our evidence. So far the short term claims are not looking good. Blake Kirby im not sure if the products are safe for live stock consumption. based on the results of the control bed analysis the compost has more then enough elemental content.
@daddykirbs9 жыл бұрын
***** some rock dust is used as mineral supplements for live stock.
@datadev19 жыл бұрын
Thanks for taking the test to this level of analysis. It sure beats seat of the pants guessing. I got the rock dust last spring and added it to my plant medium but I think I will hold off before doing any more.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Make sure my friend to keep up with the trials. Although the this is not good evidence for short term claims we still are going to test the long term ones.
@GottabKD7773 жыл бұрын
I was glad to hear your findings.
@jadvla9 жыл бұрын
Stephen,I find all this fascinating. I have been following your videos as well as Patrick's. I do have some questions,or I should say, observations. I follow John Kohlers videos and was stunned with the one where a lady only used a 3 year covering of wood chips,rock dust and mushroom spores and got huge plants that tasted fantastic. It makes me think that rock dust alone, without the other components of soil bacteria from the wood chips,and the action of the spores,as well as the fact that worms would also be abundant and plants would be grown in non-raised bed that would allow mycelium to gather nutrients from a wider area, isn't the answer. But--I've heard experts in soil say that to get minerals into our food,we have to have minerals in our soil. But--these same experts say that unless mycelium act upon the minerals,the plants can't absorb those nutrients. Geoff Lawton had videos where a food forest suburb that had been growing for 30 years had fruit trees that produced fruit that was on the whole sweeter than he had ever tasted, and he believed it was because of the fact that swales gave the trees the ability to mine the minerals deep in the soil. It seems to me that taking components like rock dust, and trying to isolate the function,might not be giving us the whole story. We need minerals in our soil--if we need them and they aren't there, how do we supplement the soil? If not rock dust--what do we use?
@OneYardRevolution9 жыл бұрын
Hi Julie. I don't agree that rock dust is being tested in isolation without the other factors that you mentioned. The trial beds were filled with compost and worm castings, which are very rich in beneficial bacteria. Stephen also mulched with a variety ingredients including leaves, which are similar to wood chips in that they break down primarily through the activity of fungi. I agree that minerals are needed in the soil, but I don't agree that all soils are woefully deficient in minerals. Also, compost and mulch alone can supplement soils with minerals when they are lacking.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Julia DiGaetani further to what OneYardRevolution said it looks like the compost that we used in all three beds had more then enough of the trace minerals in them as well. If you take a look at the soil results for the control this should give us an idea of the base condition. I have a sneaking suspicion with the exception of some extremely poor soils you would find all the required elements in the soil.
@OneYardRevolution9 жыл бұрын
***** Chris, I agree that this process is leading Stephen and me to the question the whole mineral deficient soil paradigm. There are some soils that are, no doubt, deficient, but I think that the idea that most or all soils are deficient is a fallacy. Also, compost and mulch should be able to provide more than enough minerals to most soils when minerals are lacking. (I think we're also challenging the efficacy of rock dust too, though). ;-)
@atizeg9 жыл бұрын
OneYardRevolution Compost, mulch, leaf mold, wood chip are just as good source of minerals as good the soils were where these staff been grown. Companies often fortify their products with added elements ie. selenium what is often low in soils (higher in seawater but for those who don't eat fish).
@OneYardRevolution9 жыл бұрын
atizeg Stephen, please correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the control soil had sufficient levels or surpluses of all the 8 essential elements. In this case, the native soil plus compost and worm castings clearly provided all of the essential elements.
@davidtrees17149 жыл бұрын
Thanks so much for your diligence in supplying this "real data" on this first of the trials. The differences sure do raise questions as to the validity of the claims. Year 2 will be the results I look to the most. Once again thanks so much. Cheers David.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
I am glad you enjoyed the video my friend! I agree next year will be telling!
@MrMac51509 жыл бұрын
Stay analytical, and keep giving us the real facts. good video.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Will do MrMac5150
@imaspacewoman2 жыл бұрын
So Interesting! You have saved me the mistake of forking out 40 bucks for a worthless produce Azomite. Thanks!!
@AlbertaUrbanGarden2 жыл бұрын
I am glad I could help!!!
@GardeningWithPuppies9 жыл бұрын
So glad you and Patrick did these tests. It will save the rest of us a lot of money I'm only out $30. I got in on the big sale that another channel convinced me to take advantage of. Never again. Thanks so much.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Gardening With Puppies Im glad OneYardRevolution and I could present these results my friend! Evidence based gardening is important to both us as and we hope to give you evidence so you can continue to improve your garden!
@Emilthehun4 жыл бұрын
I'm pretty sure rock dust was an idea for poor overused soil on farm lands. There should be no difference when in great soil because they will be able to pick up the nutrients needed.
@dennistmenace42078 жыл бұрын
look at learnhowtogarden channel video is called rock dust in gardening --- the myth and the facts , you cant believe these guys on utube they are salesmen , dont fall for everything that comes down the pipe , this is a good video , listen to what he is telling you . he is not selling you something you dont need !
@poppyb.42559 жыл бұрын
Excellent video Stephen!! Thank you for putting this together. Before Kohler and others were promoting and advertising for products like azomite and gaia green, I remember listening to a geophysicist and soil biologist discussing this very same matter. As I recall, their findings were that most of the micronutrients in azomite are bound up in their calcic forms, and not plant available. I'm not an "ologist" in any form, so I will always take the advice of someone educated in the field who doesn't have anything to sell me.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
this analysis measured both available and unavailable forms of the elements breaking them out using a strong acid digestion from the calcic formations. There is still more to understand but for now we know there are less elements in the rock dust soil and they are not in the pepper tissue!
@HuwRichards9 жыл бұрын
Well I must say I wasn't expecting this! It just proving how you don't need to spend lots of money to improve garden soil. Like other people said, If John saw this he'd not like it at all because he as saying how amazing it is but your results have contraindicated the claims and also what other companies say. It is also harder to trust companies claiming things without the evidence like the trial you have done. I really wasn't expecting this but it really did prove a point and thank you so much Stephen for spending time getting all these detailed results. The next 2 years should be very interesting and I can't wait to join in and see what I get! The science behind growing veg is awesome and I'm excited to see how this trail will d and whether the soil improves over time, a fantastic video my friend! :)
@HuwRichards9 жыл бұрын
My soil is also poor too so it would be interesting seeing how poor soil without any organic matter would do to the control soil and the rock dust or biochar soil. Just a thought anyway:)
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
HuwsNursery Huw we most definitely need you to join the trials. OneYardRevolution and I have been fielding questions about poor soil conditions. Analysis would be a fantastic addition to.
@shellyhladun60829 жыл бұрын
Great work Stephen! I will be interested in the results a few years down the road as it does take years for the rock dust to break down enough for the plants to use it. Thanks for all your time and energy.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Yes but the analysis we completed was for both available and unavailable. what these results tell me is the lower concentrations in rock dust really means it has completely left the soil. I am really glad you like the video! How is your grandchild doing?
@bananaman7529 жыл бұрын
Nice...I bet all them gardeners that use everything but the kitchen sink to grow a tomato plant are mad because they live by rock dust...I am a old time gardener put it in the dirt and leave it!!!! Great compost and soil is all you need with a touch of H2O.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
We are testing the product claims and right now your right it does not really hold up. IN fact I have spent quite a bit of time putting garden practices to the test.
@JerryA926569 жыл бұрын
Any future trials should involve taking a sample of both beds before and after amending with rock dust. I am curious on where you collected the samples as well and how. Did you simply scoop dirt from the top of the box at the same spot or did you re-mix the soil first and then take the sample. Regarding the missing elements. You should take a sample of the plant tissue - leaves and stems - not just the fruit. I would also be curious to see if yield rates are better or worse. While rock dust may not make the food "better" it could make the plant healthier and subsequently have higher yields. Also, were the plants significantly different in appearance, size, etc.? Keep up the good work. Thanks for taking the time to do this.
@OneYardRevolution9 жыл бұрын
Hi Jerry. Regarding yields, four rock dust field trial participants weighed all of their produce for the year from their field trial beds. We'll be releasing the results fairly soon, but I can tell you that the control group had a higher total yield than the rock dust group.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Jerry Anderson further to what OneYardRevolution said. sampling was also completed using industry standards and was recorded for our notes. we do plan in increasing the spectrum of tissues analyzed next year to get a better understanding of whats going on.
@kima37869 жыл бұрын
John Kohler will pull his hair off once he sees this
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
I simply hope the evidence helps people. I would hope no one loses hair !! Make patter baldness claims enough :) we don't need to help
@ab_ab_c5 жыл бұрын
@@AlbertaUrbanGarden Rock dust eliminates male pattern baldness--testing results to be released soon to prove that claim is false also. ;-)
@ab_ab_c4 жыл бұрын
@@AEON. You clicked the wrong reply button. I didn't make the video--I only responded to it--and my response was meant 100% to be humorous. Frankly, your claims about rock dust are likely rubbish. If you had any integrity, you would prove what you preach just like the video author did. Since you have provided no proof for YOUR claims, I can't think of a single reason why anyone would accept what you've written as true.
@darthvader53004 жыл бұрын
@@AEON. Rock dust work, www.soilandhealth.org/wp-content/uploads/02/0203CAT/020302rodale/02030209.html you have to activate it biochemically to initiate the biogeochemical processes to make rock dust powders a success and it depends if you use the right kinds of rocks and grind it in the right level of fineness which is as fine as baby powder and face powder and when it is REALLY EXTREMELY FINE then it should DISSOLVE in water. And you use a fermented compost called humus that has reduced the entire compost pile into humus.
@Eagerphill4 жыл бұрын
@@AEON. I agree with this big time. Its well known that fungi are required for certain mineral transfers like zinc across root membranes. Further what was the break down of the rock dust used, if it was just ground feldspar then all you're adding is silica, so of course you're going to see a reduction in mineral variation, a better test would be to use AZOmite with known mineral breakdowns. Next there was no PH control, which again plays a massive roll in mineral exchange between plants, rock dusts can change soil PH wildly causing mineral lockout. Lastly is the binding effect of carbon additives like the biochar which bore noticeable changes in soil chemistry. So all of these factors combined makes this test nearly pointless. One of the biggest points of interest to me becomes IF there were high amounts of trace minerals in the rock dust where are they? I'd say that there was not enough carbon to hold them in the soil and they ran off with watering. Lastly many full spectrum rock dust products are recommended as foliar applications as leaves will take in certain minerals(like zinc) better from foliar feeds vs roots(especially when lacking fungal partners). I have used both AZOmite and Sonic bloom on my property for years now with the addition of carbon and have seen a MASSIVE difference, in yield, flavour, colour and most of all oddly the smell of my food. I have also been able to confirm that the brig rating of my apples has gone from an abysmal 8 to a respectable 12. This was from topdressing minerals and foliar feeding with the Sonic bloom product.
@sillybunnns9 жыл бұрын
Ok this makes me a little relieved because I had considered purchasing rock dust. But I think the "ideal" soil presents itself in the forest where leafs and wood have decomposed over time, along with the aid of fungi
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
sillybunnns I would have to say I like that idea ;) Its what I model my garden practices ;)
@sillybunnns9 жыл бұрын
:)
@Zerkbern9 жыл бұрын
"Hear! Hear!" for the Citizen Scientist! (or, is it "Here! Here!"...I was never sure what the British meant by this)
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
neither do I lol. Im glad you enjoyed it!
@mbot5659 жыл бұрын
Excellent video Stephen! Thank you both Patrick and you for doing the hard work in doing this trial.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Your welcome!
@PermacultureHomestead9 жыл бұрын
ya I always knew this, rock dust is not in a "nutrient available" form to your plants. Good compost, fungi, and proper bacteria is all your plants need. don't let john from Growing your Greens see this lol, he probably already thumbed this down.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Looking at the results from the control I believe your right. The soil already contains all the elements needed.
@Albopepper9 жыл бұрын
Hi Stephen, thanks for sharing your test results and the corresponding data. A few questions: Have you had the actual rock dust analyzed at a lab? I'm interested in seeing the actual composition of the stuff you used. Also, do you think it would be good to analyze both soil samplings BEFORE adding the rock dust? Two bags of the the exact same brand of castings / compost could in fact have different compositions. Compost and castings can fluctuate so easily. A simple test, beforehand, would rule out whether this is the case. The rock dust soil had only 1/4 as much lead as the control. Wet tissue showed twice as much lead in the rock dust peppers. One might wonder if the rock dust altered the bio-availability in such a way that more lead was absorbed. To be honest, some of these results befuddle me. Why is there more K in your control DRY wt, but more K in the Rock Dust WET wt? That data makes no sense to me.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
AlboPepper Thank you for taking the time to comment my friend! here is the lab results for the rock dust. For comparison purposes I used fall leaves to compare againts. kzbin.info/www/bejne/hpyyqIN3hal0kJI I should have tested the soil before anything happened your right. however as I am doing this all on my own budget I was not in a place where I could get the samples done at the beginning of the year. I will do more testing this year though. I did however ensure all of the ingredients were from the same bag and production lot number. at least in Canada that requites the analysis be with in a very tight parameter to qualify. some of the lab stuff I am still working on but if you want me to ask any of my experts please let me know which questions. kindest regards Stephen
@backyardmetalcasting9 жыл бұрын
Interesting results! It's strange. That the rock dust beds had less minerals. Could it have changed the composition of the soil and allowed the minerals to leech quicker? Where did they go?!
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Well David we know it's not in the pepper tissue. We have to do a lot more analysis to figure out what's going on in the soil. Next is actually analyzing the raw rock dust.
@suburbanhomestead9 жыл бұрын
***** And the control was higher up in slope, so that water could not have deposited extra minerals in it. Now, Stephen, you didn't use the native soil there is that correct, only compost and castings? Would it have a naturally lower amount of silt and clay than regular soil?
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
suburban homestead there are also drains in the beds to prevent leaching from bed to bed. yes I used compost mostly in these beds and mulched with dry grass, leaves and used coffee grounds. Ill be trying to set up a native soil trial next year to add to the results. it will be interesting!
@backyardmetalcasting9 жыл бұрын
***** yes, it is crazy that the results are opposite of what was hypothesized. ..i am interested to find out what is happening. An analysis of the rock dust was on my mind too...maybe it's not exactly what is listed on the bag! ?
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
David D and ***** we will be running analysis on Rock Dust to see what its made of ;) These results have me wondering as well. I could not hypothesize where they have gone. I need more data!
@Hi-gb9cf9 жыл бұрын
I'm speechless. I can't believe rock dust actually lowers certain trace mineral level... After watching this video, I may skip the rock dust trail and only test the Bio Char. Wow, just wow...
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
It is excellent to have independent results! We still would love having you participate on both trials
@kirkjohnson93535 жыл бұрын
If I understand things correctly this might support the ideas of Elaine Ingham that soils ALL have enough fertility but that it is the microbes of the soil that determine whether they are available to plants or not. This was a useful test. Keep up the good work.
@CuriousinNY7 жыл бұрын
Very interesting. Now that it has been two years since this video I'd be interested in learning what the lab results say now. Do you have a follow up video? If so, please provide a link.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden7 жыл бұрын
here are the summary videos on the subject my friend! First three kzbin.info/aero/PL5mfR-r4BXH1WwrNIH29H-KI4LGrEfHFd
@Tommyr9 жыл бұрын
I knew it! Great job Stephen! A certain "green grower" will not be happy to hear this! My contention has always been COMPOST, COMPOST, COMPOST! Thanks for the great work!
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
I am glad you enjoyed it. Two of my pillars that I use for organic growing are compost. That said I am going to test both as I want to know if it's the best way forward.
@barfodet9 жыл бұрын
Robert Pavlin and Camp Rand are quite right. There is Rockdust and then there is Rockdust. Without a thorough analysis of the content of trace minerals and minerals in the Rockdust used, the test is lacking some vital factors. I am the Danish distributor of a Scottish basalt rockdust and the results we see are very good. Maybe not the first year, but the following years.Give it time. Check www.reminscotland.com/ Regards, Claus B Henriksen Denmark
@riverstun5 жыл бұрын
I know someone who plans to garden in the desert... great guy, but he said he had plans to "improve the soil with rock dust". See, here is the thing. Wind erosion is common in deserts. Basically, everything is sandblasted by the wind, which creates tins of rock dust. So I thought his idea was like adding peat moss to a bog. However, if you are gardening in a bog, perhaps rock dust might help. Also, peat would help a desert. In most garden soils, you have a high content of natural rock dust. Particularly if you are on clay or alluvium or sand.So if you are messing around with this stuff, I'd advise getting your soil analyzed first, then comparing it to the analysis of several rock dusts, and see if one of the rock dusts has an abundance of minerals that your soil is lacking. Otherwise, you're just throwing your money away. You're better off buying wood chips with your cash and putting down a thick layer.
@VeronicaMist6 жыл бұрын
Just did some research- it depends on the action in your soil. So measuring it the first year and saying it does nothing is bad information.
@itsnotthesamething9 жыл бұрын
I have incredibly poor soil. Mostly clay and sand. I've been throwing in everything but the kitchen sink, to make it better for everything from gardening, to growing plain old grass. When I mow, I create a dust storm, as do most of my neighbors, but my grass is actually starting to fill in, from all the amendments. I haven't used rock dust yet, but hearing all the rave reviews, I ordered some the other day. Then I find this video...story of my life! I suppose it will probably help my soil though.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
itsnotthesamething I am not sure it will help a clay soil. They basically make the product out of an older clay. compost more compost and more compost like you have been doing is likely the best way to improve your soil my friend! You know what might be interesting to do is a side by side comparison like I have done here. Just to see for yourself what it is all about!
@itsnotthesamething9 жыл бұрын
I pick the poorest spots in the yard, dig in, and add compost or sometimes just plain old dirt I purchase from time to time, simply because I can't make enough compost for everything, and would rather add the good stuff to the gardens. I really do see a difference in my lawn, and my gardens. It's hard work, but it is paying off big time!
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Getting tha compost in there I bet would make a huge difference. You know what I do for my lawn in the fall. I top dress it with old potting mix. This not only helps me get ride of the mix but it builds the soil over time and the grass just loves it!
@therawlifefamily9 жыл бұрын
If you started with soils that had equal amounts of calcium, etc, and you add something that has calcium in it, you shouldn't end up with half the calcium. There is something mysterious going on.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
thats right. There is something going on here. We set up the beds with exactly the same material with the exception of rock dust in one bed. Something is going on however all we know is its not in the soil and not in the pepper tissue.
@cindygothberg636 жыл бұрын
The error in your test is the form of the rock dust. If you used volcanic ash which never crystallized, the key elements are greater than volcanic rock which is crystallized. Crystallized rock takes longer to break down than volcanic ash.. Volcanic ash puts the key elements into the soil faster.
@keyplayr61greenhousehydrop149 жыл бұрын
Excellent video, Stephen! I don't know about everybody else, but you don't know just how much I appreciate all of the time and research that you, and Patrick put into this stuff! It's like I always say, "keep it simple" There is no need in investing in things that aren't going to do you any justice! I mean, man has been growing food forever, without nothing more than what mother nature provides, with great success! Thank you for sharing this with us, my friend!
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
I am really honoured that you would say that keyplayr61 I know I probably speak for OneYardRevolution as well in saying thank you! We both try to keep it simple and will not only look hard at the products out there but our own practices to make sure you have the evidence you need to make decisions!
@seanweir73118 жыл бұрын
Use my rock dust for my worms for grit in their gizzards. Also quite using kelp directly and started feeding it to my worms as well. Worms are happy but I am sure I wasted my money since leaves are free and I still have four bags of them, and ground egg shells work for providing grit. Live and learn.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden8 жыл бұрын
+sean weir that is right Sean you live and learn ! that is a good way to use both if you have them though. Just don't expect magic ;)
@TheItalianGarden9 жыл бұрын
I am very interested, i am glad that you are continuing the trials for two more years. because maybe it takes time to either build up or more must be added then one pound per square foot. awesome findings, thanks.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Well there are application rates that OneYardRevolution and I found up to pounds per square foot however this seems to be excessive. The analysis measured both the available and unavailable forms of the elements. We won't be adding more rock dust to allow the material to develop in the soil and not be masked with new entries.
@mikefa58913 жыл бұрын
You've merely confirmed that YOUR SOIL is already mineral rich - it says nothing about other people's soil.
@jimstormcrow9 жыл бұрын
Well done chap. Good work. We need more of this sort of experimentation,there are too many suppliers of miracle products out there that need to be called on their claims.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Jim i am pleased you enjoyed it. I will continue the good fight :)
@GreenGardenGuy19 жыл бұрын
In the case that you are working with artificial soil mediums then rock dust might actually have some benefit because you have no native soil in the mix. In the case of gardeners working in the native soil rock dust should have little effect other than emptying the wallet. Native soil is made mostly of rock dust. Adding more makes little sense. Some rock dusts actually do contain plant nutrients in greater concentrations than native soil but the products I have seen have no break down on the bag and all rocks are different. Some one out there is laughing all the way to the bank by selling bags of quarry dust to gardeners looking for that "magic bullet". I suggest focusing on good soil health rather than hoping some magic dust will improve yields. The key to good soil is mostly in the life and the organic matter it contains.
@TheLastLogicalOne9 жыл бұрын
Can you explain why the rock dust bed had lower the soil mineral levels as compared to the controls? Also perhaps conduct some tests on the difference in soil microbiology. Goodwork
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Right now we don't know why the mineral levels were lower in the rock dust soil. All we really know is that its not in the pepper fruit. a few weeks ago we ran samples of the two leading horticultural rock dust products. For a point of comparison I also ran fall leaves from my area.
@cambridgee9 жыл бұрын
both beds should have been tested at the start and before amending the rock dust bed. this would produce a better data set and may also generate some insight into what happens during the growing season. it could be that the mineral in the rock dust never were there or that they were leached out of the bed due to watering. the greater amount of minerals found in the control bed does not make sense. They should be similar at least and this result is counter intuitive.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Your right unfortunelty in the spring I was not in a position to get the testing done. that said I will be this spring. I am having two of the leading rock dust products tested to see what they are made of and that might give us some insight into these results.
@ab_ab_c8 жыл бұрын
Another anecdotal claim of rockdust enthusiasts is that it makes produce taste better. If there is ANY merit to that claim, I image it might occur with soils that are so bad before amending them with rockdust that just about any soil improvement would make the produce taste better. When it comes to soil like ours (improved with rich compost for years), I doubt it would make any difference. Given the ridiculously over-priced & over-hyped claims of rockdust by people such as John Kolher et al, I never bought into any of their claims. Thanks for taking the time, incurring the cost, & showing your scientific results to set the record in the light for all to see!
@AlbertaUrbanGarden8 жыл бұрын
+A B after doing two years of this research I tend to agree. I just finished up my 3 part results from 2015 and the evidence is even more strong that it is likely not a product that is of use.
@judirivers-nelson33649 жыл бұрын
WOW!! These are important findings! Have you seen any other test results that confirm your own, Stephen? Based on your findings, rock dust may be a waste of money/resources in the garden. Thank you for performing this test and sharing your findings.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
No there is limited testing that I have seen the raw data on. That is why i posted the results on my website. Ill continue the testing to see whats up. I am glad you enjoyed the video!
@ant92283 жыл бұрын
Awesome trial! I would be curious to see the test redone in a couple of years, inorganic minerals are thought to break down slowly over years correct?
@daniell83314 жыл бұрын
I'm NOT a rock dust advocate, I'm only seeing if I should buy some myself and I probably won't. But I don't like this experiment ...One, because its a sample size of 1 and you cant test for significant differences with this sample size. And Two, because if the plants have all minerals they need available to them they will only take up what they need and both plots had what was needed. This only means that you don't need rock dust not that it does nothing. Another point is that trace minerals cannot be made available to the plant without a good microbial presence to change those minerals into a form that the plant can take up.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden4 жыл бұрын
If you watch the rest of the series I get into the math of dilution and it’s kind of damning.
@tricky19920007 жыл бұрын
It seems you have already used rich soil before you added the rock dust, please try the experiment again with a poorer soil. Some soils are so rich, that anything you do to them can only make them worse.
@dorwssapon9 жыл бұрын
This is confusing Stephen. The introduction of minerals in the water has to be a factor but I fail to understand how Ca, a major element in Rock Dust can register lower. I wonder if the soil was obtained with a core sampler at different depths what the results would yield? Could the Rock dust have simply passed through the shorter raised bed media? Outstanding work and thanks for the info!
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Its hard to tell where the elements have gone. that said the addition of rock dust has resulted in even lower then the base amount. meaning it not only took the calcium from the rock dust but from the soil mixture itself. We do have a lot more testing to do to understand whats going on.
@unnet19 жыл бұрын
What kind of "rock dust" was used in the trials? Basalts, granites, oil shale, igneous, metamorphic, sedimentary?? I would think there could be a dramatically wide spectrum of chemical reactions depending on the chemistry of any given rock type.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Cecil Ellsworth The brands of rock dust used were leading horticultural brands sold in North America. If you interested in whats in them I did a clip comparing the elemental make up of rock dust with fall leaves from my area. Ill put the link below. I do agree though depending on source material if can very a lot. kzbin.info/www/bejne/hpyyqIN3hal0kJI
@harrypotter64746 жыл бұрын
how do you expect to see any improved growth when the control soil is already replete with all the nutrients being assessed?
@tootz19509 жыл бұрын
A fantastic job. I'm looking forward to more testing and results. Thank you very much Stephen.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Your welcome my friend! I am glad you enjoyed it!
@davisdone7 жыл бұрын
Humus is obviously the most important part of any garden soil. But we also add things to address soil STRUCTURE. Things like perlite to help with aeration and vermiculite for moisture retention. I wonder if rock dust is useful for soil structure. After all, most soil found in the "wild" contains it. I wonder how you could test the benefit of rock dust as it pertains to soil structure?
@dibyendumukharjee88229 жыл бұрын
What a conclusion of fabulous trial. Thanks for sharing.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Dibyendu Mukharjee I am very glad you enjoyed the video.
@Tiberiovs9 жыл бұрын
I was actually more concerned with the slightly elevated Arsenic and Aluminium quantities in the trailed rock dust, which for me would be turning rockets from a potential amendment to something with negative effects.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Based on your first comment I am working with an expert to evaluate. We also just submitted samples on two of the leading rock dust products. I'll get to the bottom of this.
@nov519479 жыл бұрын
Steven, as a scientist (Physics), I love these kinds of quantitative (and seemingly unbiased) tests. This will be our first *_big_* year at the Itsy Farm and I will NOT be using Rock dust. Now I am anxiously awaiting similar tests for AZOMITE (A to Z Of Minerals In The Earth).I do plan on using AZOMITE in our outside beds and in the hoop house beds. Heck, I might even do my own tests! Thanks again for great work.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Patrick and I would love to have you participate in the trials. FYI Azomite is among the products being tested by our trial participants and the other results have been similar.
@malcolmt78839 жыл бұрын
'Rock Dust' is one vague description, I mean, different rocks have widely varying elements, and there are definitely some toxic stuff like arsenic in certain pyrites and shales- not to mention minerals that will make your soil highly acidic a alkaline.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Ed Harley You are right. The rock dust tested was a horticultural product being sold for use in gardening and food production. We actually tested two the the leading horticultural products in this clip: kzbin.info/www/bejne/hpyyqIN3hal0kJI
@markzajac3409 жыл бұрын
I think this is a really good and a worthwhile experiment. Thank you for being objective as I heard much good talk about rock dust. Since rock dust might be one way, I just wanted to mention that there are numerous ways to amend your soil with minerals. Rock dust just might be the flavor of the month.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Mark Zajac I am glad you enjoyed the videos. I start off with a question and let the results guide the decisions. We did find a few other ways to add essential elements back to the soil. In fact I compared raw rock dust to Autumn leaves in this clip: kzbin.info/www/bejne/hpyyqIN3hal0kJI
@azeem61 Жыл бұрын
Thanks for the information, much helpful....
@davedaddy1018 жыл бұрын
In parts of Ireland for example, there are claims that the grass is so nutritious because of the slow and steady break down of limestone into the soil. The cows eat the grass and the beef and dairy is of a higher quality.
@ohhowhappygardener9 жыл бұрын
Wow... Very surprising! The fact that mineral content in both the produce and soil was actually lower doesn't make sense. What do you think caused that to happen?
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
I have no idea. all we know is its not in the soil in any form and not in the pepper tissues. We have to do more analysis to understand more!
@joelhenry46435 жыл бұрын
Was the rock dust used azomite? Any studies using kelp liquid fertilizers or worm castings? Thank you
@stevieM829 жыл бұрын
Interesting results Stephen! So if those elements are not in the soil and not in the crop... then where have they gone to? Maybe in the plants? Did you see any difference between the control group and the rockdust group in the ammount of weeds that shown up? Because if you look at it as a system, those elements should have gone to something/somewhere...
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Your right Stevie, All we know is they are not in the soil and not in the pepper tissue. We have a lot more work to do to figure out where they have gone.
@hudencox38949 жыл бұрын
Hi your test results are interesting , I just started gardening about six months now and been following you and onyardrevolution as well as others for some time now .For what I have been reading about rock dust and some other form of minerals, I will like to see what happens with the other tests next year because some minerals takes a long time and the wright conditions to breakdown and be available . Thank you guys for your posting I have learn a lot from you all . Be bless.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Your right some may take time to break down however the tests we used on the soil do measure both available forms and unavailable forms of all the minerals. So even if they are not available to the soil to the plants we did measure them as part of the overall number. Next year will be interesting! I look forward to see where things go!
@scotts.26249 жыл бұрын
I will be interested in seeing the soil and plant results for several years with the same beds. From what I have been told the dusts need to be broken down by microbes first. You are testing for the elements in the produce but what about the molecular compounds. To test for nutrition density you would need to compare those. I am talking about the vitamins, phytochemicals, carotenoids, sugars, proteins etc. The veggies would also need to be subjected to a blind taste panel. I added the dust that starts with A from Utah in my beds 3 years ago and I,ve noticed each year the vegetables taste better and stay fresh longer. Of course that is not a controlled study.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Scott thank you for the comment. The numbers in this video represent the available and unavailable elements. I look forward to the future years results as well ! I did look into that testing however it's a 1000$/test to get done and being self funded it's a bit though.
@sirhcnamrog42248 жыл бұрын
As they were both new beds, the test on Rockdust would be low as it needs micros to break it down so plants can use it, it appears you don't know much on the cycle of soils
@AlbertaUrbanGarden8 жыл бұрын
+Sirhc Namrog infant i did know this and as I mentioned in the video top rock dust advocates claim results even in the first year. As such this test refutes that claim.
@Dicofol19 жыл бұрын
thanks for this test. try bigger plots next time and more plants to even out genetic differences between plants
@loneforest65414 жыл бұрын
Best possible experiment...thanks
@AlbertaUrbanGarden3 жыл бұрын
Glad I could help
@eveny1199 жыл бұрын
The results are very interesting. I have 2 comments . 1- It looked like the rock dust bed was 1 level thus shallower and needed more watering than the deeper double bed of the control The water could have washed away nutrients or the plants could have been stressed. 2- I would think it will take several years for any improvement because rocks just don't break down in 1 season. My questions would be were both beds identical ? facing the same watering and sunlight? because I cant see why the results would be "better" in the control group and simply not the same.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Evening. Both beds had the same volume and exact same composition. The angle is tough. Yes each bed got the same amount of sun and water. You are right minerals generally need time to break down over time. that said the analysis we did measures both the available and unavailable forms.
@Jordie00019 жыл бұрын
Thanks for your reply Stephen, all this research and is well worth it. I cant get enough of it. However I dont feel that playing down the value of mineral rich volcanic dust makes sense. Take for example the rivers of the Punjab in India which overflow during monsoon and enrich the land with silt. The rivers flow from the Himalayan mountain range and take the minerals downstream to the fertile plains. If the land is lacking in minerals then our crops are going to be nutritionally deficient. The science shows that our brains need trace elements some ninety in total. We dont need large amounts but we still need them. Also our metabolic enzyme production is dependent on a proper supply of minerals. I am taking supplements but wish my food contained these things. So I am still working at it. thanks again for your valued research and efforts Joe
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
I dont think I really was downplaying dietary requirements rather this video shows that even though the soil may have surpluses of these elements in the soil does not necessarily mean they are in the crops produced. In this case the pepper tissues did not show any differences in their elemental make up when the soil that they were grown in was different. What might be of interest is a video I did a few weeks ago. I tested two of the leading horticultural brands of rock dust and compared them with another common mineral accumulator fall leaves. I think the results will surprise you! kzbin.info/www/bejne/hpyyqIN3hal0kJI
@samuelarvizu38209 жыл бұрын
it is my understanding that in order for the plant to absorb rock dust it must become soluble.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Samuel Arvizu that is right it needs to be bioavailable. So i tested the total available and the results represent both the available and unavailable.
@stevegillaspie85669 жыл бұрын
Stephen, Thanks for doing this study. The cost of rock dust is too much to have results such as this. I will stick to my slower long term plans with wood chips, this next growing season will be the third my garden is covered in chips. I was hoping to make a quicker work of decomposition and better planting results with rock dust. I won't now. I am very appreciative you did the work. Steve
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Steve I am very glad you enjoyed the video. There is still a lot of work to do but so far the evidence does not support the claims. Wood chips and compost will take some time but you will have some beautiful soil my friend!
@stevegillaspie85669 жыл бұрын
Yes, the only problem I have is patience!
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
it does take some ;)
@stevegillaspie85669 жыл бұрын
Stephen, I have friends that live in Alberta. A married couple Loren and Ruby. I wondered if those names might be familiar to you? They own a bowling alley. I am going to have access to lots of wood ashes this winter do you have suggestions for application rate? Steve
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Compost piles id say one or two loads every time to time. nope don't know Loren or Ruby but I do know the owners of my local bowling alley :)
@ariesred7779 жыл бұрын
Might be worth sending to the lab soil and produce "leafy greens"including other varieties of foods grown in domestic gardens.
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Next year we will include more species and component of the plants.
@curtcampbell29769 жыл бұрын
great video to spark discussion. it doesn't make sense how the rock dust soil would have less nutrients... there is definitely a missing puzzle piece
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
Curt Campbell We are working on figuring that out however we did run just rock dust through analysis and it was fairly interesting!
@PharaohFluidity9 жыл бұрын
+Alberta Urban Garden Simple Organic and Sustainable Im thinking that the addition of all those minerals would have an effect on the PH of the soil, probably raising it. Nutrients are more available to plants at a slightly acidic PH. I just got some rock dust, i might just do a little experimenting..
@AlbertaUrbanGarden9 жыл бұрын
scubadrew9292 in an earlier video we discussed the pH. I'll put a link below. The analysis did take a look at both the available and unavailable nutrients so the analysis number represent the total number. kzbin.info/www/bejne/m3jbl4KMfJKHqbM
@pietikke55984 жыл бұрын
Isn't this not only working in mineral depleted soil. Like where there bin growing crops for Many years and the soil is depleted from many minerals.