Drinker's Chasers - Disney+ Killed The MCU

Disney+ really is the perfect example of quantity over quality. The endless demands for new "content" for Disney+ resulted in a surge of rushed, low quality Marvel TV shows that did nothing except waste money and devalue the entire brand, speeding up the onset of superhero fatigue.

[@manservantchris]

Endgame was literally the endgame.

[@Spartacus114]

Unintentionally though. The most frustrating part of endgame was that it didn’t feel like the end of anything, the whole last 30 mins of the movie was just setting up the next shows/movies. Completely unfulfilling. Yet because of that fact, it was indeed the beginning of the end

[@wjzav1971]

Funny enough, as I exited the cinema after Endgame, I thought to myself "I think I am done now with the MCU". Not that I hated it, I really loved it. But it was just such a natural endpoint of the franchise for me and seemed like the perfect moment to tie it all up in a bow. You know, like when you beat the final boss in an open world video game. Like, sure, there can be post-game missions to form a bit of an epilogue but you put the game down and walk away and think "That was really nice. But I am done now. Maybe I'll come back in a year or so and replay it". They really should have stopped with Endgame. After beating Thanos and doing time-travel and two of the poster children of the MCU dying/retiring, there was really no natural way to top it. Also, I believe that any story should have its natural conclusion and not go on for too long.

[@MrJeffcoley1]

@@wjzav1971 Exactly. You nailed it. In that regard, releasing the Black Widow movie AFTER Endgame, when we know she dies, is the perfect symbol for post-Endgame Marvel. "What's the point? I already know how it all ends."

[@Willie_Pete_Was_Here]

@@wjzav1971That’s because a story is only good when it ends.

[@frankgesuele6298]

All good things end. Until morons destroy them with woke.

[@Splitter4416]

Disney doomed themselves with normies the moment they turned the MCU into homework.

[@eunit8899]

I can't believe they ever thought that was a good idea

[@calfowler6838]

​@eunit8899 me either..they was trying to do a money grab by making it seems like you had to watch every show and movie to follow the story

[@Concealed.Revealed]

@@eunit8899 Because you are a rational thinking person...They will make way more sense to you, once you realize that they are not.

[@bruhdon4748]

Yeah nothing like entertainment feeling like work & effort just to keep up with.

[@LawfulBased]

Normies? Wokies more like. Never go Woke. It goes against nature and god.

[@KissedPuppet]

Nerdrotic's closing comment was kind of depressing. It felt like defeating an enemy and feeling too exhausted to care, that the fight is just over, and now we stand in mixed collective silence or celebration as it dies. Somebody lost; nobody won.

[@chasehedges6775]

Exactly. No winners, just losers.

[@ninjaswordtothehead]

It's called a Pyrrhic victory.

[@madkoala2130]

Nobody won?! For me this is win-win situation. Finally super hero movies will die down for next 10 to 20 years and model of extreme high budget allready established films will end and Hollywood will finally be forced to back down (just like 70s just this time much worse)

[@Achates72]

I just think Disney got victory disease. The green lit anything and gave them unrealistic budgets. It is fine that The Marvel's was made. If they had the brains to realize it was a 50 million budged project instead of a 250 million project the balance sheets would look different today. There used to be an old Hollywood axiom, give the audience what they want.

[@michellew3934]

Not with a bang but a whimper.

[@YuriBez2023]

Disney self-destructed the very second they didn't hire personnel based on merit. They opened Pandora's box. Let them enjoy it's contents.

[@LawfulBased]

I know it is more than just that but they also got what they deserved when they too started messing with wh°te people. A great part of the paying customer base are wh°te so what where they thinking? I bet a lot of animousity towards Disney also influenced that people stopped paying for services of any kind from which Disney could profit. What goes around comes around.

[@chasehedges6775]

Exactly. They’ve reaped what they sown

[@seb1554]

Add them to the list of Doctor Who, Top Gear, Oceans 8 etc. They can trick people the first time like with Star Wars or Captain Marvel but the long term damage is irreparable and the franchises are ruined.

[@stalhandske9649]

Most fitting comparison, as it also applies to what we commoners, we parched masses yearning for good stories to uplift our spirits from the worldly drudgery and grey landscapes of melancholy, may get from this all - the very last thing that crawled into the World from the bottom of that chest of myth Pandora opened: hope.

[@chasehedges6775]

@@stalhandske9649 💯💯💯

[@danielclark-hughes692]

It's insane that they saw what happened to Marvel Comics and said "Let's do the exact same thing!" Imagine being the company responsible for destroying Star Wars, Marvel, and the animated Disney classics.

[@moresnacksplease526]

“But we’ll get some sweet tax breaks, and we make our money on the parks anyways! D+ is gonna be bigger than Netflix!” 🫢

[@plumbussmith]

That was brought up to Kevin feige in a meeting with the stockholders. He said along the lines of, "We'll do it in a way that it will work. I think we can make it work." They couldn't.

[@webbedshadow2601]

Wow...I don't think Kevin Feige's actually ever read a Marvel comic in his life if he doesn't realize how Marvel comics died after the 2010's and NONE of that should be in the MCU! @@plumbussmith

[@plumbussmith]

@webbedshadow2601 the motivation is by Disney because of copyright issues with the regular characters so they gotta change them and make them their own.

[@InappropriateFab]

Has anyone bothered to check how much Disney has made in profits over what they paid for Star Wars, Marvel, etc.? Billions.

[@rhys5958]

Ended for me with Endgame. Loved it, but the writing was on the wall with that ‘girls get it done’ scene against Thanos 💀

[@MrJeffcoley1]

That scene - the female superhero charge - was the most unintentionally hilarious scene in the movie. I laughed out loud in the theater.

[@Spartacus114]

Endgame was trash

[@manbearpiglett-4110]

Hey now! You woman hating MAN! How DARE you! Women CAN get it done! Now that these silly superhero movies are about to go away, just you wait, sandwiches are going to be made and dishes are going to be washed in record numbers, just you wait, you'll see!!!

[@vincentfalcone9218]

I largely pretend the MCU ended with Infinity War. I'll give Spider Man: No Way Home and Guardians 3 a pass, but that's it.

[@joebeast15]

That’s when The Boys died for me too

[@sterling7]

When I went to see "Godzilla Minus One" (terrific, by all means see it), I was sharply reminded why I don't go see movies in theaters very often. They bombarded us with an ad loop fifteen minutes *after* the picture was supposed to start (which is actually just when a *different* set of ads starts playing), they had ads to advertise in the theater, they had an ad for the new "Trolls" *during* the ad for concessions; there weren't even many trailers since Hollywood hasn't been making movies. And a quarter of the ads were "isn't it great to go to the movies, please go see movies in theaters", even amidst ads for Amazon's streaming service. Thirteen dollars a ticket to get all this nonsense you avoid by watching something at home. "G-1" was worth it. Most movies aren't. And the way the movie theaters are abusing their customers in their desperation to milk profit out of a shrinking clientele is pathetic.

[@TI4438]

Twenty-seven minutes of coming attractions before John Wick 4. Seriously irritating.

[@Mereologist]

Protip: it is sometimes possible to look up on the Internet exactly how long all those previews and ads are and intentionally show up late. And since many theatres use assigned seating now, you won't even necessarily get a worse spot by doing this.

[@hauntedhose]

@sterling7 did u see “Shin Godzilla” ? That was pretty good….Legacy of Monsters monarch is terrible btw , but yeah Godzilla minus one looks great

[@talldorf6445]

Same thing in my screening, actually checked my phone and the movie trailers started about twenty minutes in show time, with another ten until Toho showed up on screen. But damn, was the movie absolutely worth the wait.

[@heartysquid]

Tried a theater recently and was treated to literal KZbin ads during part of it...

[@lawrencetalbot8346]

The actress for echo getting too fat to fit into her costume in between shows us the perfect symbol for the MCU. It got lazy and bloated thinking it could sit back to reap in profits, instead of putting in an actual effort which is what made the prior phases so successful.

[@lukeyznaga7627]

hahahahahahahah

[@queencerseilannister3519]

She had a baby and had a medical emergency and had to have her leg amputated. Isn't totally her fault dude.

[@maverickmic]

​@@queencerseilannister3519 From a variety interview "Before landing the role as Echo, Alaqua was working in a warehouse in Milwaukee when her friends found out about Marvel's casting call. Throughout her life, Alaqua has used a prosthetic leg, and she's using her role as Echo to show that, regardless of what happened to her in her life, she's capable of anything" Seems like she doesn't use her leg as an excuse for achievements so not sure why you have?

[@lawrencetalbot8346]

@@queencerseilannister3519 what medical emergency? She hasn’t shared how she lost her leg. For all we know it could be that she was diabetic and had to lose it. Also there are a lot of people with prosthetics who keep their wait down. I had a golf coach who lost both legs to a land mine and he’s in decent shape. There are even a lot of people confined to wheel chairs who keep the weight down, so what’s her excuse? She’s the one touting her leg has never held her back from life, so surely it shouldn’t hold her back from cutting out the Oreos.

[@drointhewind480]

​@@queencerseilannister3519super unprofessional to get pregnant in the middle of a show

[@juliovictormanuelschaeffer8370]

Videogame-based movies: looks like is my time to shine. Monster movies: damn straight, brother.

[@nicholastotoro7721]

I'm still surprised certain aspects of the entertainment industry haven't done a Leisure Suit Larry movie or parody... 🤣

[@juliovictormanuelschaeffer8370]

@@nicholastotoro7721 wouldn't that be the plot of Porky's?

[@nicholastotoro7721]

@@juliovictormanuelschaeffer8370 You know what... you're right LOL!!!

[@juliovictormanuelschaeffer8370]

@@nicholastotoro7721 well, seeing how Hollywood is full of creeps, I wouldn't be surprised if they made one.

[@GLJosh]

Horror movies have a solid tendency to make a profit, low budget with a built-in audience and producers actually care about their audience, somewhat.

[@stvarnonevjerovatno3700]

Ah, they should make one more MCU crossover: "How to Kill The Cash Cow in 12 Steps" featuring Capt. Marvel, Ms. Palpatine and 85 yo. Indy

[@tjjordan4207]

And Kathleen Kennedy

[@primesonic4459]

​@@tjjordan4207 produced by Kathleen Kennedy 😂

[@flankspeed]

If they actually had the balls to call it "Ms. Palpatine", I'd go see it 😂

[@ReinoldFZ]

I don't know why they bother to have different divisions if they are going to tell the same plot: perfectly far left so-called "minority" will show why is better than popular white man, by virtue on only existing 🤤 and that's their "winning" formula.

[@primesonic4459]

@@flankspeed yeah I'd love to see what nonsense they plan to do with that title too

[@bretticus6722]

Disney should have took a 2-3 year break after Endgame then came back with street level Dardevil and Punisher movies

[@chasehedges6775]

💯💯💯💯

[@MrJeffcoley1]

You're right. Imagine if Disney quit putting out new Marvel movies, didn't make any shows, but simply put all the MCU movies onto Disney Plus. THAT would have been smart, people would get Disney Plus to catch up on all the movies leading up to Endgame. Free content! Already paid for.

[@MomoAfterDark]

@@MrJeffcoley1fuck Disney plus !

[@xaalcarlsonanimations1539]

They would have made bank too. They could have made daredevil at the cost of two Netflix episodes and made nearly a billion dollars. Then done the same for four or five other street level movies. do a crossover and tstart the new phase on the cosmic stuff working up to galactic or doctor doom.

[@tjjordan4207]

Here’s the thing, they did have a year and a half where nothing was released, mainly due to Covid but they did have that period of time where nothing came out. And it wasn’t enough.

[@Gaelek13]

For me and I think a lot of people the MCU ended with _Endgame._ It felt like a natural conclusion and saw us say goodbye to a good number of the characters we'd grown attached to to literally years. It's hard to care when the characters who came after just...aren't that interesting.

[@Savnoc]

Their decision making is baffling. Instead of using the momentum from Endgame to launch an interesting follow-up, they decided to detour into a bunch of stories that no one cared about using characters most people haven't heard of, and they cranked up the political messaging. After Endgame the MCU fell apart and apparently Disney did it on purpose

[@HarrDarr]

@@Savnoc there was a lot of movies that were shit before endgame idk ur watching this thru rose tinted glasses, mcu was always pretty lowbrow and probably peaked with the original avengers

[@The_Mimewar]

The MCU didn’t plan past endgame, and it’s OBVIOUS. I think Disney assumed this comic Book movie wave wouldn’t end

[@darthgamer9861]

that was me. I know people think fatigue isnt a thing, but I saw endgame as a good jumping point.

[@BingBong67489]

@@HarrDarr Even the movies with weak stories in Phase 1-3 (Iron Man 2 and 3, Thor TDW) at least had more engaging characters than what we've gotten post-Endgame. RDJ's Tony is just fun in his own right, and the Thor/Loki dynamic is far more interesting than any new character dynamic we've gotten post-Endgame (except maybe the character dynamic between the three Peters in Spider-man NWH, that was legit great, but it only lasted for one movie).

[@tylergoodman3560]

The biggest lesson from Disney+: Quantity doesn't always equal great quality anything. 🎉

[@earlofdoncaster5018]

Yeah, Disney disproves the maxim 'Quantity has a quality all of its own.'

[@pdub3167]

I stand by the feeling that the downfall of the MCU began with Guardians of the Galaxy 1. Once Disney/Marvel saw how well that formula worked for humor, most projects following put that at the forefront. Yes there was some good ones after this but look how many slowly became nothing but this type of style/humor as GOTG 1.

[@Crimson28]

The Avengers and GOTG had the biggest impacts where every project tried to emulate that Gunn/Whedon humor. Their writing (especially Gunn) allows for good jokes but also good dramatic moments.

[@chasehedges6775]

Well said. Guardians 1 was the best and, in hindsight, worst thing to happen to happen to the MCU

[@iggtastic]

I wouldn't lay that at the feet of the GotG crew. We were already in deep with that style of humor by the time GotG 2 and especially 3 came out, and those were still good. The problem is the attempt to build MCU movies like you would a house. It's all formulae and building codes in the MCU. There's no creativity allowed in the house of mouse. If they find something that works at the box office, then that's what they're going to do. Period.

[@chasehedges6775]

@@iggtastic THIS

[@Oscaragious]

Downfall means it trended downwards since that point. There were several good movies after the first Guardians. That's not the start of the downfall, otherwise you could just say Ironman 1 was the "downfall" of the MCU because most projects afterwards tried to capture its success (some of which succeeding).

[@jivetalk1045]

Disney flat lined the moment they hired the first person with purple hair and a list of pronouns.

[@clogs4956]

That reminds me: I need to get my fringe dyed Decepticon purple.

[@lukeyznaga7627]

excellent and accurate statement, "jivetalk". In fact, THAT IS WHAT happened. I don't care if we offend anybody. Any writer or producer that has Personal prounouns and colored hair is an imbecile.

[@sba8710]

Who was that?

[@DamienDarkside]

​@caveatlector2671 Yes it does. You don't assign blame to a boogeyman, as it doesn't solve anything. As much as we want it to be some bright-eyed twenty something with jay/jazz pronouns, it is more likely to be a middle aged thirty year old woman or male who wears a suit. It also isn't one person either. Some people who has looked at a target market and thought they knew what they were doing and that they knew better. As much as I'd love to blame the mythical Jezzika the Womyn Writer, they aren't real. Just like how Bob Dick the Redneck American with a beer belly, 45 IQ, and beats his wife while saying the n word isn't the base Republican. They want you to blame the mysterious blue haired Twitter person, it takes the blame off the real people who made that choice. Assign real blame and responsibility to those who made decisions, not some stereotype made up by a stereotype. Otherwise nothing gets better.

[@lukeyznaga7627]

very....good ...point. I am listening. this kind of makes sense. @@DamienDarkside

[@sophieamandaleitontoomey9343]

I think there were some good ideas that could have been explored after Endgame. The aftermath of the war with Thanos, mourning the people lost, people being wiped coming back and not knowing how to be a person anymore, just to name a few. It just feels like a wasted opportunity.

[@maverickmic]

It had the opportunity to go small. When a large force is removed there is a power vacuum and it could've focused on the simple small scale but they went multiverse and essentially in the vein of DC, rushing.

[@BIGPOPPJAY]

Many wasted opportunities from Disney. These ideas had so much potential but Disney can't help but make all the worst moves possible. They are dead.

[@matthewpatrick7263]

Imagine if Victor Von Doom's father was the king of Latveria and he was blipped, leaving Victor as king. During those 5 years, he acts as a good guy. Imagine him even fighting against Thanos in Endgame. But then, the end credit shows Victor return to find his father blipped back into in a cell that Dr. Doom set up when he learned that the Avengers were going to attempt to bring people back (perhaps a spy). At first, his father is relieved to see his son, thinking it was some sort of mistake, but then Victor kills him and covers it up.

[@gualacheesesteak]

@@matthewpatrick7263thank god you’re not a writer

[@ithamarlowe6158]

I like Loki and I think they should just put all their money on young Loki god of stories. Especially now that we won’t have kang.

[@SageofCancer]

This is what happens when you let the writers eat Tide pods.

[@danielclark-hughes692]

How dare you!? Even Tide Pods couldn't cause _that_ much brain damage.

[@mickeymao7145]

Also snacking on their crayons while “writing”

[@chasehedges6775]

@@mickeymao7145💯💯💯

[@SgtATON]

Come on now. Crayons are tasty and even Marines aren't as dumb as the writers.

[@jaysonraphaelmurdock8812]

It was the hair color that messed up their brains. 😂

[@dez7726]

Well Disney cornered themselves when they purchased Marvel, Pixar, Lucas Films, Fox because of their content and then changed the formula of that content to alienate the fans they brought with them.

[@dalemanolas5994]

The finance houses essentially wanted to hire Disney for propaganda services. Iger purchased all of those IPs and assets like Pixar in order to gain access to the target audience and to suppress competition. Since then, Disney has just been spewing out ESG propaganda. Why else would a business kill golden geese like Star Wars and Pixar? The financiers want to program children to be more gay/trans/feminist/ext. I imagine that the executives are being "compensated" for their services (bloated movie budgets and secret Cayman Island accounts?) Remember that these executives are in it for the money. They'd only run Disney into the ground if they were being paid to do it.

[@colinwest3301]

She Hulk, 25 minute episodes. 1 million per minute. One episode cost more than John Wick. Quite a bit more. And made them (Disney) minus dollars and cancelled subscriptions.

[@clogs4956]

No fiscal malfeasance here. Move along.

[@TI4438]

Gotta wonder what that money was really spent on.

[@MichaelAChristian1]

​@@TI4438You saw committee of writers. You think you need 20 writers to come up with she hulk "plot". Money siphon.

[@TheWorkmonkey1]

It's honestly baffling how incompetent one business can be. The whole thing is just a huge bloated mess.

[@doberski6855]

Hopefully Reynolds has the clout to protect DeadPool 3 from the stupidity that is Iger and Disney. Nevermind Elon telling Iger what to do, I hope anytime Iger or his minions call Reynolds or Jackman with ideas for DP 3, they either hang up or give him Elon's answer!

[@mgk2020]

We'll see.

[@vonVile]

He failed with Deadpool 2. It was garbage.

[@ThaYoungChad]

​@@vonVileDeadpool 2 was great tf you mean

[@TheVodkaHaze]

Considering Reynolds was not allowed to improvise for Deadpool 3 due to the writers' strike because it would technically mean he was a writer to the film, I doubt he would be allowed to step in.

[@emberparadox458]

@@TheVodkaHaze It all depends on how much filming was already completed and how many much more filming is to take place or re-shoots to be done, so the lack of being unable to improv could be recovered from.

[@unversedhero6028]

One of the main problem with the Disney+ shows was the fact that they were made with the intent of having the movies respond to them, which is in contrast with one of the main reasons why Agents of SHIELD was far more successful, since that show was the one that reacted to what happened in the movies. The movies made the show better and didn't make AoS or the movies feel like homework you need to keep up.

[@Mereologist]

You can't assign hours of homework to an audience that wants to see a movie. They'll just see something else. As you say, the shows MUST follow the movies, not the other way around.

[@gsczo]

As a former MCU enthusiast I've always loved the idea of mixing TV Shows with movies, I've watched Agents of Shield, Agent Carter, all of Netflix series, some random ones like Runaways, One-Shots, etc, but when they finally do it, the actual canon of MCU with original actors, it's a DISASTER. Wandavision was a novelty but after that, oh my... So sad to turn the MCU into a practical joke, things feel so disconnected with poor quality and heavy on messaging, where was the last time I got hyped about seeing a new character joining that universe, I loved to see Black Panther and Spider-Man in Civil War, it was crazy, also most MCU's wins come from Russo Brothers, also Jon Fraveou's Iron Man and ocassionaly a hit like GotG and Thor 3 despite some controversy with its tone. Anyway, Disney deserves nonetheless, I don't know who's to blame, Kevin Feige, Bob? What a sh*t show.

[@Mereologist]

If you're going to do such a thing correctly, you do TV spin-offs with more minor characters and have them contain no necessary lore. There are dozens of good character candidates out there. If you make all the important information for the next movie hidden among five different shows, people will just check out. And they have. And you're completely right - even the spin-off shows have to treat the lore carefully. If you want to have a silly show, you can have it with a silly character, but don't disrespect your money makers or, again, fans will check out.

[@bob1986]

@@Mereologist Everything started just becoming a hook for more Marvel stuff, especially with tv which just was desperation to scam people into subscribing to Disney plus. Marvel was at it's best when it was totally seperate things with occasional character overlap (ie, you didn't need to see Antman to appreciate him in Civil War, they got him across quite easily) that would occasionally meet up for a bigger Avengers movie. Now everyone wants to be the Avengers with a ton of heroes in every film and the universe always being in danger turning it into a massive explosion fest. On the other side though you had AoS which stopped caring about anything from the movies after one season because the production scale made it impossible and staff infighting.

[@Afineaddition]

Marvel will get to the point where they ring up the Russos for another rodeo

[@abrahamnarvaez1730]

The only explanation I can think of for the echo actress is her show was put on a chopping block and then last minute green lite but no one kept her in the loop so come film time she gained weight and no longer had time to lose it because of incompetent show runners not keeping tabs on their lead actress. I don’t think she gain it on purpose and with Disneys resources they have trainers to help her but given she hulk cost as much as it did it’s no wonder the echo actress ended up in that situation

[@DigitalRuler48]

She had a baby

[@abrahamnarvaez1730]

@@DigitalRuler48 then fully show runners failure to keep up with her and plan out the shooting schedule accordingly even scarlet Johansson had a kid in the during winter soldier and they worked around it

[@MylesKillis]

@@abrahamnarvaez1730Scarlett is also a professional and having a baby isn’t an excuse for being fat

[@olafgurke4699]

@@MylesKillis Do you even know how pregnancies work?

[@TheSupart91]

Disney plus is the equivalent of direct to dvd tbh

[@kanrakucheese]

Direct to Video works had sustainable budget though.

[@doctormeatball7618]

Bland characters and aimless storylines killed the MCU. Nobody is going to care about the X-People because all those amazing characters will be neutered by virtue of being modern Marvel.

[@Lochias333]

This. The X-Men are a bit beloved to me, and I have zero interest in seeing them carved up into something unrecognizable in order to fit "modern sensibilities".

[@doctormeatball7618]

@@Lochias333 I can already envision Gambit as basically the Guy Fieri of the MCU

[@kanrakucheese]

Reminder that "X-People" was an actual thing in MC2. The entire point was that anti-mutantism isn't a major issue anymore and the X-men are no longer needed and any attempt at a successor team is ultimately just aimless or a hollow cash in.

[@Lochias333]

@@doctormeatball7618 Or Wolverine being gay. Or Cyclops being from Palestine. Or Nightcrawler being atheist.

[@jaysonraphaelmurdock8812]

Or Ben Grimm being played by Melissa McCarthy. 🙄🤦😝

[@jakegroundwalker5693]

I like how sometimes the background image makes it look like it's Gary's left arm resting on the bar.

[@jakegroundwalker5693]

12:15

[@JD-ho7ew]

The MCU's death was brewing back in 2018/2019 with the creeping pandering in the first Black Panther and Captain Marvel movies. It came to full fruition in Captain Marvel and everything after Endgame. Disney + is just a continuation of the theater failure and the overall corporate attitude at Disney. I cancelled D+ over a year ago and I have no intent to return.

[@tymonsulimastalman1727]

Add Thor: Ragnarok to the list. Against all odds, it was the first to start injecting everything that Marvel is dying over. The funny thing about this movie is that he is appreciated not for all the jokes, girl powers etc, but for the serious elements. What was ultimately cut out of Loves and Thunders.

[@Mirage238]

Woke is being going on much longer. I am so surprised as how long it took for people to realize it. It’s funny how people are blind to toxic indoctrination but at least they are waking up now.

[@gualacheesesteak]

I see what the problem really is . “👱🏼‍♂️”

[@JD-ho7ew]

@@gualacheesesteak and yet it got under your skin enough to comment.

[@sollytom6266]

At 10:15 Gary says what I've been thinking for awhile now...Disney is doing badly because Disney is doing what the decision-makers want it to do.

[@chippyboy2003]

Nerdrotic looks like he has a really long left arm.

[@Daniel_2626]

They should have followed the same formula they had with the Netflix Marvel shows (which were far superior in quality to the Disney+ shows) by having them be in universe but not connect STRONGLY to the movies and the overall saga. It gave the audience the opportunity to watch them IF THEY WISH and it also gave audiences a totally different tone and vibe to the films (street level crime, gritty, adult drama).

[@arttig.3377]

100%. Ms Marvel actually could be fairly successful as s low-budget diverse series targeted towards young Gen Z girls. School life, first love problems, some local villain with a simple straightforward goal.

[@gloweye]

There are no lame powers. Just writers/directors without imagination.

[@chasehedges6775]

Exactly. 👍

[@kanrakucheese]

Plenty of comedy characters with deliberately lame powers (Legion of Substitute Heroes, featuring greats like Color Kid and Mater Eater Lad)

[@RealityCheck6969]

Marvel made around 20 tv shows and a lot of bad movies and now that everyone turned their backs they call it "superhero fatigue". It's just stupid.

[@mr.awesome6011]

I am super hero fatigued though

[@20th_century_Ghost]

If you would've told me back in 2013 that I would no longer be a fan of Marvel Comics in ten years, I would've thought you were on crack. And yet... here we are.

[@kingp791]

It's like the Critical Drinker said before. Disney is a entertainment company that turned into a political party. Doomed.

[@chasehedges6775]

THIS! Disney went from one the best animation and film companies ever to something you just pass by on the street.

[@chasehedges6775]

Disney in 2007: KEEP MOVING FORWARD! Disney in 2023: Becomes uncreative and lazy.

[@InappropriateFab]

Doomed to earn BILLIONS of dollars in profits annually.

[@kingp791]

@@InappropriateFab you do realize the hit they took this year right?

[@elitronprime7322]

One would think after the failure that was Ms Marvel, they would stop production on Echo and Ironheart

[@Badmunky64]

probably too far along to cancel just like with the recent DCU movies. Though I'm sure their hubris is also a factor.

[@SoUnDMaN831]

I’m still in shock over the cost of each She-Hulk episode. $25 million! My goodness!! For that much money I could get Guns ‘N’ Roses to play a full 3 hour concert in my backyard and still have a few million leftover.

[@dinosaurwoman]

I remember an interview with Bruce Campbell in the early 2000s when he talked about how B movies are becoming A movies, and that it won't last. He pointed out how Burton's Batman is a B movie turned into a A movie. And he said there's no way it will last because it will become too expensive and people will burn out. He was absolutely right.

[@seanmcclure]

They had the world in the palm of their hand. Captain America, and the winter soldier should have been a slam dunk. That set the tone for the rest of what has been an embarrassment.

[@jt1559]

Captain America: The Winter Soldier was a slam dunk, Falcon and the Winter Soldier was trash 😉

[@justinpaul3110]

Using obscure characters was as strategy of Marvel when they didn't have the rights to the good characters. Now that they have most of the characters, I don't get why they kept going in that direction. Not only did they absolutely pick quantity over quality but they also didn't plan anything out worth a fuck like they were doing 12 years ago. It's also wild how now Ike Perlmutter is considered the missing link now when he was a pariah 10 years ago.

[@gualacheesesteak]

Ain’t no way you just said they had the previous phases planned out fully when the infinity saga wasn’t even a thing until James Gunn came up with the idea in 10 minutes after the 1st movie😂 And can’t forget about the multiple rewrites for Civil War & Infinity War

[@neanderthor66]

The end of MCU and all of new Disney was firing Gina Carano. That was what started getting people jumping ship.

[@InappropriateFab]

How soon everyone forgot what an absolutely dreadful, talentless actor she is.

[@neanderthor66]

@@InappropriateFab She's not the best actress, however, she's one of the few who can do a convincing fight scene. Also, the reason for her dismissal is BS.

[@kraetah]

The crapfest that was Endgame had me questioning every movie thereafter.......

[@chrislail3824]

A24 continued to make movies through the strikes, they are going to sweep the box office

[@ThaYoungChad]

A24 has been making some bangers lately

[@chasehedges6775]

@@ThaYoungChad Yep.

[@Badmunky64]

Yes, the brand of Disney has been crushed this year, and I don't see it recoverying anytime soon.

[@Tiptronics]

It could recover very easily- but it would require releasing a few shows and films of high quality one after another - and ditching all political messaging in favour of storytelling. But this is what happens when you pervert your storytelling platform to play “politically appropriate opinion of the hour virtue signalling”

[@InappropriateFab]

And by crushed you of course mean made BILLIONS of dollars in profits.

[@Tiptronics]

@@InappropriateFab thats so silly of a response Yes they made billions this year. $8.99B to be exact. You know what they made the year before? $28.321B - a 68.25% decline. Such a naive way of looking at it, yes it’s a lot of money, but it’s a drop in the bucket compared to what disney costs to run. A nearly 70% reduction in profits is not sustainable, and it happened this year, would you not describe that as the brand was “crushed this year”? Also bearing in mind profit was increasing steadily in prior years. Obviously this had a lot to do with cricket rights in india, but the company haemorrhaging on every front is not healthy or good for it’s future. Don’t just see big numbers and think healthy, you’ll be easily mislead.

[@tacosauce4x4]

It's honestly depressing. They should have taken at least a five year break after end game. Let Endgame really sink in and give fans time to want more, not shove it down their throat immediately. Then start fresh with the X-men and slowly wrap them into the fold. It was so dumb to keep trying to one up the threat level to the point of absolute absurdity.

[@charliebronson1274]

Exactly. They should've made a hard stop, reflect and refresh. Then come back strong.

[@McMahonHater]

From Iron Man to End Game,with Spider-Man Far From Home & No Way Home as an epilogue, and maybe Black Widow if you want to be an infinity saga completest. That's a 25 movie run (not including TV series that happened at that time). It was a glorious run, and if they'd stated dedicated to telling good stories it could continue forever.

[@Will_Parker]

It's crazy because both seasons of Loki and even Hawkeye are proof that they can write a good series

[@johnsantos507]

Yeah. 2 series are the best.

[@marcoar4042]

Hawkeye was absolutely mediocre

[@willchurch8376]

I dunno, I think the dismal post-Endgame lineup of films doomed it more than Disney+. Not everyone has Disney+, and if they do, they can always watch something else on it. Anyone who went to the movies to see Ant Man 3 or Eternals or Marvels was trapped for two hours with overpriced seats, popcorn and soda, along with a drive home possibly stopping at a gas station with a thirty dollar fill up. That's a bigger f-you than something on your TV that you can just shut off and walk away from.

[@pawepinkiewicz9318]

25 millions for a episode?! Weeping Jezus, Expanse cost 5 mil for one episode....

[@_XR40_]

The new Godzilla movie, that is getting great reviews, cost 15 million...

[@tylerhunter6379]

Honestly when they first announced Disney+ and will start incorporating shows into the MCU I knew it was gonna hurt the brand and i wasn’t optimistic

[@chasehedges6775]

They had me hyped with The Mandalorian back in 2019. Nowadays, I could care less because everything is a mess.

[@markspaeth8797]

Hell for an episode of She-Hulk you could get Godzilla Minus One and most of its marketing!!!

[@blueskies5588]

Hearing that DIS has been awarded a defence contract after producing more bombs than Northrop

[@barrybend7189]

Where's Firebird our flying, flaming catholic nun from new Mexico?

[@acetheprincep3658]

Razorfist was spot on too, fads come and go, detective noir and westerns were both the hotness at one point. Then people just got tired of them. Anything niche that gets flooded dies. It happens.

[@jaysonraphaelmurdock8812]

Exactly. Razorfist rules.

[@ninjaswordtothehead]

Gary has a strange left arm.

[@kanrakucheese]

Remember when they made a big deal about "What if?" being the first animated MCU work and then did *absolutely nothing* on that front? Loads of great heroes with *weird* powers or appearances (or Power Pack, which was thankfully in purgatory of vague plans for forever and is infeasible in live action) that could have been given an animated miniseries for much cheaper than 25 mil.

[@MonkiFI]

The MCU died for me when they destroyed Daredevil. S1 and 2 I'll always have a fond place in my heart.

[@erroneous6947]

Ya, killing the Netflix shows was a huge mistake.

[@erroneous6947]

Daredevil into punisher crossover was some of the best marvel imo.

[@johnsantos507]

Wait. Daredevil Season 1 and 2 are so bad.

[@davidsummer8631]

The current MCU films have exposed the issue that film budgets have become way too high

[@justinpaul3110]

I did a commercial years ago and I was stunned by how much money they absolutely waste on excessive people on set.

[@michelguevara151]

disney has turned into what walt abhored.

[@chasehedges6775]

💯💯💯💯. Walt would be ashamed and disappointed

[@InappropriateFab]

Walt Disney was absolute garbage.

[@silver2therescue1]

I honestly don't even know if Disney and Marvel can make it to Secret Wars with the way things are going. 2027 is still 3 years away as of next month. They're barely alive as it is.

[@peterd788]

Once you add in UK tax breaks each She-Hulk episode cost about $5 million more than an episode of House of The Dragon, How is that possible?

[@justinrodriguez5957]

I think the worst part as far as Marvel is concerned, they had a measuring stick with the comics in regards to who they should run. And they chose to ignore that.

[@enigmaodell6806]

They could have left off on the high of endgame, waited for 2, 5 years, made a clear plan going forward, then made a triumphant return, and could have printed money again.

[@mrirrelevant7875]

MCU should have completely hit the reset button and started a new direction with a completely different hero front. Could of been the X-Men or F4. Used the previous heros such as Ant-Man, Thor, Hulk, etc has background characters or plot fillers or even team ups. After the snap the X-Men could have easily taken over and they could have started the mutant storyline and really focused on Professor X and Magneto and their personal conflicts on their views of the world. Instead they decided to take the left over Endgame scraps and try to repackage them into heros we dont care about IE Sam Wilson.

[@looinrims]

It’s so stupidly easy to get it right too, put genres with heroes Deadpool is some edgy R rated stuff Ant man was a heist movie Captain America was a serious drama Etc

[@yourikhan4425]

Yeah, the MCU is over. I've stopped caring a long time ago. I still enjoy a good rent about its demise though.

[@ADOGNAMEDCUPCAKE]

They we're enjoyable every now and then but now there not even that anymore lol

[@ar1029]

They fucked themselves when they got rid of the Marvel Creative Commitee which was filled with the most renouned and succesfull comicbook writers from Marvel Comics. They where the reason Iron man and Captain America remained grounded yet true to the comics. They fired them..

[@aldunlop4622]

…and replaced it with an Executive Diversity Committee…

[@martymcnasty6306]

Fresh reminder that Secret Invasion cost 212 million to make. Top Gun Maverick cost 170 million to make...

[@ladylandlubber499]

I find it shocking how many men still have "Die hard MCU fan" or "Only swipe right if you like MCU films" in their dating profiles.... what a joke...

[@davidblue819]

The list of people who would have to get fired to start fixing this starts with all the people at Disney who say who gets fired and who doesn't.

[@kinggizo9062]

any comicbook fans remember watching "Avengers: Age of Ultron" and feeling that dread feeling of: This is the beginning of the end..."?

[@AshPrimeDCFC]

Spider-Man is the only thing that exists in my head canon post-Endgame. Keeps me happy.

[@mxvega1097]

"Unless they pull a Twitter at Disney and fire everyone". Oh, Gary, you terrible tease you!

[@toastyanon8902]

Ike Perlmutter didn’t have so much a steady hand as he kept a lid on the excesses. He was notoriously cheap and not Someone you can necessarily credit the success of Phase 1-3 Marvel to - that said, modern Marvel could definitely use someone like him to reign in the excesses of the DEI streaming catastrophe

[@christophertaylor9100]

It was a combination of him and the brothers Russo that kept the MCU in line and when they were gone the loonies went nuts

[@bluearcher1559]

Godzilla: Minus One cost 15M$, She hulk costs 25M$ PER EPISODE and is actually damaging the Marvel IP. Its crazy to think about the resource mis-allocation that is going on in our entertainment industry right now. For the cost of two she hulk episodes you could make an entire TRILOGY of these new Godzilla movies! Think of all the amazing, original works we've probably missed out on over the years because every movie needs to cost 200-300M and look like shit. Oh, and god forbid it isnt seeping with political messaging - while failing to dedicate screen time to establishing characters, coherent plots, or interesting ideas to make the movie work.

[@sarinat3101]

MCU and Star Wars. Hell of a double kill, Disney!

[@ScotlandSoldier]

Part of the issue is the success of guardians of the galaxy. The studio saw they could take a relatively unknown director and cast and make all the money, and they have been trying ever since to do that again. That’s why you see so many directors who are completely out of their depth being hired for these “blockbusters.”

[@CharlesB147]

You know, it's kind of funny that Japan (and Korea) first dominated the American comic industry (manga and manhwa respectively), and now they're on the verge of dominating the American film industry. Korea already came out with Parasite, Squid Game, Train to Busan, and with Japan rolling up with Godzilla Minus One, it's looking pretty grim for American entertainment culture as a whole.

[@_XR40_]

It's kind of scary. Japanese and Korean movies and shows are good precisely _because_ they aren't like the crap Hollywood churns out. However, if they start drawing large audiences in "The West" they will inevitably start gearing their output towards what they think "western" audiences like and they will start becoming more like standard Hollywood product. It's happened before. When American audiences pick up a fad taste for foreign films, those countries start to cater to it and their film industries suffer when the fad dies out. Think of Italy's spaghetti westerns or the 80s fad for Australian films. As someone that mostly watches Korean and Japanese stuff these days, I really don't want it to be "Americanized"....

[@mco3884]

Disney is like Bizarro King Midas, everything they touch turns to absolute shit.

[@chasehedges6775]

Old Classic Disney: Gold Modern Disney: Filth

[@Wheelie2077]

The Echo actress gained 20 pounds? There's a simple fix for that, they could have cut off her other leg!

[@queencerseilannister3519]

Harsh. She also was pregnant.

[@ryanviningtube]

I think I may have figured out the key difference between oldschool and "woke" heroes: Win or lose, A hero is someone who makes the proper sacrifices. It also seems like they usually follow the non-aggression principal, though not in a stated way

[@Mereologist]

It's been well-observed by comics-watcher channel 'Comics Matters' that when an identity-based hero is inserted into a story, it becomes IMPOSSIBLE to give that character any kind of arc. And the reason is because all the identitarians who now think of the character as 'them' will become FURIOUS if ANYTHING bad happens to the character. If it so much as misses a bus, they'll become a screaming hate-mob who want to cancel you for saying they can't catch a bus when they need to. So the character needs to start awesome, never ever suffer any kind of setbacks, and then win in the end, usually be realizing they were perfect and awesome all along. And when ALL the characters become identity-based characters, about the only thing they can do any more is get together and eat and complain about other people oppressing them.

[@ryanviningtube]

No lies detected@@Mereologist

[@Dash277]

For me it died right around Loki Season1. I wonder if they're even going to bother trying to resurrect it or just position for a sale to Apple.

[@svetlanaandrasova6086]

Same. It was so horrible it killed my interest in Mcu. Havent watched mcu since.

[@VG-fk6nk]

You hung on for a while then. It was over with Endgame.

[@Dash277]

@@VG-fk6nk I think the reason why is I just skipped Black Widow, Shang Chi and Eternals.

[@Tevi_L7151]

don't skip the second season, Loki came to the fore, he is literally better, Sylvie became an irresponsible brat

[@smoore6461]

Fot me one of the WORST offenses was Moon Knight. I read Moon Knight as a kid and whatever they tried to pass off was utter shite! I was very sad when i saw that they destroyed the charecter in such a horrid series.

[@ferrarriohh]

Too much Stephen

[@user-fq4ny4mo1l]

My financial advise to anyone that holds stock in or shares of Disney is simple: SELL, SELL, SELL. All things Disney blow like the north wind.

[@johndurham6172]

Mine gets annoyed when I ask about BlackRock and Vanguard.

[@InappropriateFab]

Don't quit your day job.

[@mikeblom8897]

I think HotD has revived the GoT franchise but even that comes with a few asterisks

[@edwoodsr]

It's like you checkmate your opponent, but they keep saying "what if I do this? OK, how about this..." moving every piece on the board.

[@msj5885]

Great analogy.

[@chasehedges6775]

@@msj5885💯

[@TheDisruptiveOne]

I think Disney+ sped things up. But it is not responsible for the death of the mcu.

[@commotiocordis1037]

Concur. Post-Modern Disney is a spectacular failure that can't be narrowed down to one variable, it's a multi-variable system crash, which is what makes it so spectacular. It wasn't just one thing, this is multiple points of failure that were allowed to scale out of control. It's a complete and utter failure of management at every level.

[@seb1554]

Yeah agree with both of you guys. Disney is rotten from the top and the rot has spread through the whole company. I think they will go back to focusing on their original content which is making animation movies. Genuinely don’t think the MCU and Star Wars franchises can be saved at this point. I don’t say that as some hardcore fan, I mean they have really lost even the casual fan bases and messed up the stories beyond repair.

[@michealbounds550]

Ms. Marvel in the comics isn't the same as she was in the comics now.

[@Sidera17]

Imagine getting into the MCU via Wandavision and Loki, thinking, "This is great! Let me go back and watch the Infinity Saga from the beginning," and how disappointing everything after Endgame was by comparison.

[@Threadoflength]

I would be surprised if the number of people that got into the MCU via those shows was more than 5

[@Sidera17]

@@Threadoflength For me, I was living alone during the lockdowns and was a superhero fan when younger, so I figured, lemme try it, I have time. I was SO mad to discover all the good stuff was already done after I unlocked Fangirl Mode. The entertainment I get now is from channels like Drinker's. I can't see any hardcore fans getting into it from those shows knowing what I do now, and mainstreamers/casuals probably forgot about the shows after lockdown, so you're probably right.

[@saladinbob]

They could recast Iron Man, bring back the actors for Thor and Capt. America, put out Fantastic 4 movies with authentic looking actors and it still wouldn't matter even if Disney purged the people responsible for its downfall because the damage has already been done and the damage is too extensive, now too ingrained within people for it to be successful. Disney has lost the trust of its customers and that for any business is a death sentence.

[@unusualaussie9606]

People got bored, not persuaded. Cause if they where persuaded, Barbie would have bombed.

[@The_Bugsy_Show]

What’s with these franchises’ abandoning their core audience?! Marketing 1:0:1 “if you try to market to everyone, you market to no one.” Disney is getting that kick in the ass they need.

[@Uzarran]

Gosh, the Echo costume is rough. Way too busy, and looks like a real pain to move in. Not to mention very impractical. I could see keeping one of the shoulder pauldrons and the vambraces, but the rest of it shouldn't have made it through the concept phase.

[@malhenning1608]

musicians like jazz. It seems to be a law of nature that the majority of a group of creatives will really love something that their paying customers don't. Eventually they always try to sell it again and like every other time it fails

[@HERRtotheBEAR]

Gary looks like he has an enormous arm

[@xipheonj]

They tried to cancel Echo but for some reason she wouldn't answer any of their phone calls.

[@svetlanaandrasova6086]

Havent watched Marvel in 2 years. I see I havent missed anything.

[@LeoJay]

When will Tatiana get her origin solo movie?

[@NonCopyrightNature]

2 More Years Of Woke Disney Even If They Course Correct🫣

[@ruxy2583]

At least Disney+ gave us the best Phase 4 character,John Walker😂😂

[@WesleyNiman]

Why would anyone go and see a new Avengers movie? Why would anyone care?