Drinker's Chasers - Moon Knight Breakdown

In this clip from Open Bar #15, we share our thoughts on Marvel's Moon Knight series.

[@MrJustbrowsing12345]

I chuckled at the bit where the soldiers couldn't defeat the mummy with their weapons but the woman beat it up and threw it off a cliff with her bare hands 🤣

[@thundermane362]

True, that was cringy too. Then she fell of the edge in such a way that it seemed impossible for her to hold on yet she somehow did, no explanation, nada. It was so stupid. I mean, they could have made this way: when she stabbed the mummy in the eye with the flare, it distracted it enough that she was able to kick it off the cliff with her legs. or some other way that kept her firmly on the ledge. But no, they have to give us an unrealistic scare moment while they maxed her plot armor to 1000%.

[@danielnolan8848]

To be fair, you could argue it's more gunfu suspension of disbelieve then the strong whamen MESSAGE, but that's giving the benift of the doubt to people that routinely missuse it

[@brandonscott9747]

@@danielnolan8848 Exactly. They’ve long since proven that they should never be given the benefit of the doubt. They just don’t deserve it.

[@hansgruber9685]

@@acemagalor2519 …just “become” you’re a soldier doesn’t mean you can’t throw it

[@DeathRex88]

Made me think of Mummy movies where the Mummy always tanks bullets like a sponge but can be beat back with blunt Force.

[@electricbayonet2]

My issue with Layla's powers is twofold: not only is she immediately familiar and skilled with them, but they seem to have nothing to do with her _or_ Taweret. If Steven is any indicator, the powers associated with being an avatar don't come with an inbuilt understanding of them, but Layla is Falcon-ing he way around Cairo within seconds of being able to fly (and a form of flight that she needs to physically control, no less). And for the powers themselves...let's start with Marc's limited flight as Moon Knight. It's closer to gliding than actual flight, but he's the avatar of a falcon-headed god who seems to fly/teleport on a regular basis, and they went the extra mile to make the unfurled cape look like a half-moon. And we can understand why Marc can use that ability because he's been Moon Knight-ing for quite some time by now. And, understandably, the suit Khonshu grants covers all of his body including his face, because as we learn later 'some randies with guns' are actually legitimate threats to avatars, so it makes sense that Khonshu wouldn't want his avatar easily identifiable outside of costume. Taweret, meanwhile, is a hippo that can temporarily possess corpses, and she gives her _explicitly_ _temporary_ avatar a skimpy outfit that shows her entire face and some golden wings that let her soar through the air like Falcon. What. First off, dick move with that lack of a mask, Taweret. Second, what? Flight? You are a _hippo._ I would have expected her primary attribute to be superstrength. I mean, she has that, too, but seemingly no more or less than Marc has. The closest thing to flight I'd expect from her would have been Hulk-jumps. And on a side note one of the most overtly embarrassing moments in the show was during the final fight. When Marc/Steven is losing the fight with Harrow, Layla gets knocked away and then has to shield herself from cultist gunfire. Then after a bit more punching and dialogue, we get a dramatic cutaway to Layla, where she's still standing in the _exact_ _same_ _spot_ in the _exact_ _same_ _pose_ with a cultist about five feet away unloading a Kalashnikov into the one part of her body protected by invincible armor. I actually snorted aloud at seeing that. It was cut like a comedy so much that I almost expected one of the other cultists to start shooting while the first guy had to reload every few seconds. I guess that was happening for the last 30 seconds, constantly? And on a side-side note, how many more times are we going to get the awful 'heroine takes a quick break from an action sequence to inspire a starry-eyed young girl' scene? "R u an Eejiptan sooperhero?!" Fuck's sake, girl, you are _far_ _too_ _old_ to be acting like this, and the guy with the croco-laser staff that almost killed you five seconds ago is still within spitting distance. To quote Scary Movie, "RUN, BITCH, RUUUUUUN!" EDIT: Though to give credit where it's due, I think that the kaiju battle was supposed to be invisible to people who didn't have a direct connection to the gods, like the two monsters that Harrow sent after Steven early on (and then...never again, I guess). That being said, they ALSO established that normies can see the physical consequences of the invisible monsters, so people/governments should have absolutely noticed the enormous damage their battle was doing. And, as Mauler points out, it's baffling that they just have Khonshu grow to enormous size seemingly out of the blue when they had a shot explicitly showing Ammit growing as she ate souls.

[@toddtaylor6506]

Thought the same thing when Layla became the hippo goddesses avatar ..... and got WINGS.

[@Dookieman1975]

They tried to be comic accurate with her being the scarlet scarab (in the comics it was her dad) and I’m pretty she had help from Taweret in her avatar form, because at first she was a skilled fighter but not at that level, while Marc was a mercenary so he should be good at fighting. Not to mention the gods give their avatars superpowers. As much as I loved Moonknight the show ain’t perfect and sometimes doesn’t always make sense (in a bad way)

[@michosadventures]

I don't think the avatars get costumes and powers related to their god's animal look. I mean, Khonshu is a bird and Mark gets a mummy suit, while Stephen gets a regular suit. Harrow gets an ax and purple lasers, not crocodile powers. The other avatars don't even get a suit. I completely agree with the rest of your comment though.

[@ggt47]

Seems really unrealistic for a little girl to come up to her and say during chaos are you an Egyptian superhero?

[@jimstormcrow]

Konshu is a Falcon headed god but in this the skull looked more like an Ibis.

[@theoneandonlymasterjosh2912]

I will say this Oscar is a really damn good actor especially when in episode 5 He really makes it look like there are 2 completely different characters on same screen that are both him it’s impressive

[@stanleysmooth]

I think you could probably take any shot of Steven or Marc talking and cut the audio and you would probably still know from their body language alone which one it is, which goes to show that Oscar is a fantastic actor.

[@alesksander]

@@stanleysmooth Yeah he is fantastic actor yeah. Especially he really did good in Ex Machina. But those movies are mine jam. So biased there. Actually Disney and Lucas film wasted his talent. Anyway he will be fine. 100%

[@electricbayonet2]

The scene where the gods' avatars initially assemble was, in retrospect, a huge warning sign of the quality to come. Khonshu accused Harrow of trying to release Ammit using 'Trust me bro' as his evidence in front of a council that hates him and used absolutely none of the mountain of _actual_ evidence he had against Harrow, up to and including not asking that he _roll_ _up_ _his_ _fucking_ _sleeves_ to show off the Ammit-themed tattoos on his arms. Then later, I genuinely had to rewind when the gods reassembled upon learning that someone's trying to release Ammit, and one of them asked "Who could be doing this?" And one of the others actually had to say "Harrow!" in this voice of astonished realization, as if they weren't there less than a week ago as Khonshu was directly accusing a dude of trying to release Ammit.

[@ZackeTheBrute]

That scene was retarded enough that i kinda gave up.

[@0Sutekinaryuu0]

The assembly of Gods scene was what checked me out the hardest up to that point - hilariously silly; reminded me of Supernatural but less self aware or something idk

[@darthXreven]

a proper scene like that would be harrow tries to resurrect ammet and the gods come in and say NO, we can't allow this, you will come with us for punishment, we can't allow you to put the world in jeopardy....or something like that full stop end the evil one and if you want to continue down that line then the next idiot tries and meets a similar fate later on....how fukkin hard is that?? eww IDK that's like climbing Everest....says the shit writers I'm just going off the conversation IDK I don't watch this shit fukk D+ but gods just picking up on what others say would that have worked?? instant no and removal and the next idiot continues the plan??

[@dualgaming1203]

Literally in the first and second episode Khonshu is established as a cult leading and manipulative person. They had a reason to distrust Khonshu as he has proven to be untrustworthy many times and is prone to violence, which is exactly what Harrow wanted. You literally had to twist the narrative to fit your bullshit. Never in episode 6 have I heard any of the Gods say "*gasp* it was harrow all along!" because they didn't do that. What do you not understand about Harrow being a manipulative villain and Khonshu being untrustworthy???

[@TheAmbientMage]

@@dualgaming1203 you didn't hear them exclaim "Harrow" when he tried to release Ammit? It was pretty ridiculous. Khonshu might be untrustworthy but OP made a solid point that if they made him roll up his sleeves they'd have seen the tattoo. It was poorly done all around.

[@rsmllc2]

It may turn out, if the show gets another season, that Mark is hiding aspects of the third alter ego Jake, and that explains why Steven was not aware of the bad nature of the mother. Notice that Mark shuttles Steven out of the child's room just before mom beats him. It could be he shifted to Steven when things got rough, but unknown to him, Steven shifted to Jake, and Jake is the one who experienced the whipping. This way Steven is protected, to serve as the happy 'stress ball.' Mark does not know how deeply he suppressed his pain, manifested in killer Jake.

[@awalmendy1541]

Yea they asked why isn't Steven the vicious one even though it is pretty obvious that Jake is the one who takes the abuse.

[@TheAmbientMage]

Moon Knight has 2 ways of solving problems: 1. Blackout. Wake up. Problem solved. 2. Layla magically appears out of nowhere and solves the problem. That's it. That's the whole damn story.

[@PersianGhost]

Sounds like terrible writing to me

[@marcusaurelius5149]

The writers had a goldmine with the blackouts and instead chose to shit in it. With blackouts it would allow them to craft a story of discovery where the audience and the protagonist are searching for answers together. Instead, we got Deus Ex Machina.

[@leepicrandomaa]

Thanos: I have all the infinity and is now the most powerful being in the universe. How are you going to stop me? Marc: hol' up mate gonna blackout

[@tokyosmash]

The moment ol’ girl became a hero and came to Marc’s rescue I loudly groaned and rolled my eyes. WE FUCKING GET IT.

[@theblackflame4002]

Which ruined the fact that up until then Layla was a decent character who didn't get over played. She was in charge with Steven because he was a clutz who didn't know anything, but deferred to Marc when he was 'awake' but can't keep that going I guess.

[@frankie3010]

Layla still needed saving from all three of them at different points.

[@SILVERONIN]

Girl Boss trope just sucks

[@dualgaming1203]

This show has the least amount of feminism yet y'all manage to complain about the tiniest details... She said temporary avatar. And I think we should be glad we didn't see a she-moon knight.

[@tokyosmash]

@@dualgaming1203 tHe TiNiEsT dEtAiL Dude it’s typical Marvel BS, the lead male is a bumbling jackass and has to have mighty woman come save him, it’s the same shit in Multiverse Of Madness.

[@posteriorpepperoni]

The reason why Khonshu waited until the after credits scene to kill Harrow is because he can't do anything by himself physically, it's the whole reason the Egyptian gods have avatars. This show had many problems and things that didn't make sense,but this was not one of them

[@connordorman117]

Exactly, also the reason the gods didn't show up was because they sent themselves into another dimension to live in peace, only monitoring things occasionally through avatars, Konshu and Amunet were a special case because they chose to stay behind and try to actively help humanity, so them complaining about the gods not being there to fight Amunet when their avatars die makes no sense.

[@freelancer1121]

During the kaiju fight between khonshu and Ammit khonshu's staff is seen knocking over cars and shifting the sand. Hes a phyiscal presence in this world alright

[@purplefidelity5162]

But that's all thrown out the window when Konshu and Ammit have a kaiju fight in Cairo (could be wrong about location) and you're telling me the gods won't even get off of their fat lazy asses to help with the world not coming to an end?

[@Relugus]

Unlike stupid Raimi and Waldron, the makers of this show understood the concept of avatars. Where was Chthon in MoM? They didn't even have his voice ffs. Total fail.

[@thenexgamer5608]

I did like layla as a character and it didn't necessarily feel like "We can't have a male lead without the female counterpart" most of the time, so this isn't a comment bashing Layla, but it does bug me that they were so desperate to have said female counterpart that they took a male villain from the comics, the Scarlet Scarab, and turned him into Layla. Not even a male hero, but a villain. If you're completely changing characters to fit the mold then that's a problem The "are you an Egyptian superhero" thing for Layla also bugged me because she was Tawaret's temporary avatar, not a full time one. Her answer should've been "I am, for like, the next five minutes and only because I absolutely had to take the power, I didn't actually want it in the first place"

[@oscarjimenezgarrido7591]

Specially when Marlene was such a fucking great character to begin with. Obliterating her completely to be replaced by a made-up token racialized checkbox is insultingly regressive and a disrespect to the very cultural stepping stones that feminist activists should be worshipping instead of sweeping under the rug and replacing with watered-down ersatz.

[@gregorde]

She reminded me of Karen Allen’s Marion from Indiana Jones. I didn’t mind her.

[@dbsommers1]

@@gregorde I will defend that in there have been two different Scarlet Scarabs, since the power is in an object rather than coming from an individual. And the first was from WWII. So changing that can be done easily. Now *why* they did it is a completely different matter.

[@oscarjimenezgarrido7591]

@@gregorde I'd argue Marion Ravenwood, adventurous spitfire daughter of late illustrious archeologist Dr. Abner Ravenwood, created by avid comic book reader George Lucas with the aid of Marvel Comics artist Jim Steranko, reminds you of Marlene Alraune, adventurous spitfire daughter of late illustrious archeologist Dr. Peter Alraune, created a few years prior by Doug Moench. But who cares, right? It's a female character, she can be erased and replaced disrespectfully, with total despise for the original material, for a tokenized alter. In short, Layla reminds you of Marion because Layla is a brownwashed rewrite of the very original comic book character George Lucas borrowed from to create Marion in the first place.

[@acemagalor2519]

I think the “are you an Egyptian superhero?” Thing was more so to inspire hope than actually being honest, like a sort of “this could be anyone” type thing

[@Zeddyboi86]

I think the best moment of the show for me was when we find out that Steven was the made-up personality. We spend all this time with him, just to learn that he’s not real, and it’s just like, “OOOOFF!!!”, that’s a gut punch.

[@JackPool-lq8ux]

This show tried way too hard to be trippy. I like the original comics where Marc Spector was a Boxer/Mercenary turned superhero. Khonshu was more his theme like Bats are to Batman and of course more violet

[@db3040]

Not really. It did a fantastic job of following Jeff Lemire’s defining run

[@oscarjimenezgarrido7591]

@@db3040 It can't hold a candle to Doug Moench's original 70's horror/pulp coolness-oozing material, which was OP's point. Eff nothing-defining Lemire, original Moon Knight was first and, unlike original Batman and other heroes that needed revisions and rewrites to become cool over time, MK was cool as fuck from the get-go.

[@petergut6445]

Well that yes, but it was also incredibly rushed, forced dumb humor and ruined Mr. Knight, couldn't figure out if this was Marc, Steven, Harrow, or Layla's story leading to a messy plot and an underdeveloped protagonist. Marc is ex marine and ex CIA yet you're telling me without the suit he's all but useless? Thanks Marvel, thanks for taking my favorite character, coating him in gasoline, setting him on fire, and then dragged him through the mud.

[@docsavage8640]

The original Moon Knight is where it's at. Nothing generic about it. Revisionist Moon Knight is garbage

[@Dookieman1975]

I thought it was pretty good, better than Loki. it did a pretty good job at being trippy, but it definitely isn’t perfect

[@blankadams3120]

Sorry, I had a thought: I wonder if the writers are aware that in Egyptian mythology, being 'evil' includes lying? When your heart is weighed on the scales, it has to be lighter than a feather for you to be considered 'worthy' of the afterlife? So, Ahmet probably has access to the majority of the souls on the planet. I also wonder if Thor ever had a reason to fight the Egyptian pantheon...

[@DarkFox_-zg2hg]

They're saying that might be next up for GOW. That would be so dope!

[@ahabduennschitz7670]

@@DarkFox_-zg2hg And they also doing some BTQ ind the AWS of the BBT. That will be so awesome

[@plzletmebefrank]

Yeah... There's also the bit where Steven complains about the Ennead and says there're 9... But then lists Horus, who is *sometimes* listed among them... But that would make it 10. If you were gonna make the point about it being 9, explicitly say that sometimes Horus is included or... You know, just don't include him in your list cause it doesn't make sense to?

[@plzletmebefrank]

And yeah... Isn't the feather supposed to be the feather of truth provided by Toth? Not to mention Ahmet has nothing to do with any sort of judgement, she's just the human heart dumpster. I can't remember just right now who actually does the judging. I get the feeling Anubis makes the most sense, but yeah. Just can't quite remember.

[@Lorekeeper72]

@@plzletmebefrank Think Osiris was presiding over the whole thing but didn't Egypt have a whole collection of gods devoted to judging different crimes?

[@funknelson87]

He put the glass in his shoes because he knew his soul was unbalanced and that Ahmet would probably destroy him when he resurrected her, so the pain from the glass was an effort to atone for the pain he caused as avatar for Khonshu. It didn’t work, but she wanted an unbalanced avatar anyway.

[@frankie3010]

A clear example of subtext.

[@vodkavecz]

Also flagellants exist still

[@joshuamarvel4335]

Moon Knight was easily my favorite hero, one of the few comics I chose to read. To see them butcher such a complex and fascinating character hurts, especially with all the runs they could’ve adapted. I would love to have the first part of the 2006 run adapted.

[@lilmovieperp3599]

They didn’t lol

[@DarkFox_-zg2hg]

Ethan Hawke mentioned that the glass in his shoes was to showcase his character's zealotry. He compared it to self-flagellation.

[@math_7911]

Like Ian McShane in Pillars of the Earth, that was my interpretation of it, zealot.

[@92vanguard]

Except that wasn't explained in the show, anywhere. That's what they're talking about. We shouldn't have to research things or read outside stories to explain things in the series. It should all be self-contained within the series.

[@gs4011]

@@92vanguard I dunno, that was the vibe i got from it even without it being explained. Not every little thing has to be meticulously explained.

[@GodwynDi]

@@gs4011 One of the few times it respects the audiences intelligence, and people complaint about it.

[@92vanguard]

@@gs4011 all I got was that he was an extremist. Like the insano members of Christian cults playing with snakes and whipping themselves. Glass in shoes is the next step. But the show didn't say if he was required to do it, or if it was voluntary, and if he was required to do it, what was the reason beyond "flog yourself to prove yourself". And it only appears in the very first scene. It's never revisited. So it's brought in to shock but serves no storytelling use.

[@thisisfyne]

Regarding the finale, here's a few things that would have been far better: - Skip the superhero shit for Layla. Make her team up with Taweret (Hippo God) so she learns how to seal Ammit inside Harrow. This way she's still super useful to the story while leaving the hero spotlight to Moon Knight. This even reinforces her being the smart one in the team (what she admires in Steven) while the physical threats are dealt with by Mark. - Skip the Kaiju shit in favor of a more involved fight between Moon Knight and Harrow, with a greater display of interesting powers and an obvious setup that further pushes the idea that both of them are subservient (even controlled at times) to their God masters. They are willingful puppets, but puppets still. - No deus ex machina with fucking Jake in the climax of the battle (??) - Make the killing of Ammit/Harrow a longer, more involved philosophical debate between Mark, Steven, and Konshu. Free will vs. Determinism was an interesting topic in this series and it could have been a great moment of tension showing different perspectives on the matter leading to a consensus and the conclusion (instead of just Mark deciding on his own and Konshu being like "ok then lol"). Or make Mark agree to stay as Moonknight in exchange for sparing the life of Harrow, in some display of self sacrifice, I dunno, anything but what they did. If felt cheap.

[@rexrip1080]

Fair points. Also they should limit the CGI during the day, there is a reason why most of the fantastic creatures/ themes look better in the dark... Its to cover our shitty texturing/ shading methods (Stalker games are a perfect example on how it is done, if you replace the characters with the more high poli ones, it would look like a recent game)

[@jordanelliot3972]

The point that in myth the conflicts of man are small scale representations of larger battles of gods is lost on you my guy

[@bonaparte6431]

Love this take, it was my favorite MCU show but only due to potential alone. I hope they bring Isaac back for midnight suns

[@Will_RodU]

To be fair, the third dude, Jake, is way better at it than any of them, including Layla. We just got 30 seconds of him and did not actually see him fighting... and, he is a psychopath who clearly murdered at least one of the attendants at the asylum in that post credits, moon night is not a hero, he is an assassin. Fingers crossed we actually get to see Jake in action. Also, yes, the egyptian superhero thing was really cringy... as someone I heard said, "try not to break your arm patting yourself on the back there"

[@styletyany7124]

jake is not a psychopath..thats a disservice ebing done to people with actual DID. He is just more ruthless and has no qualms doing what needs to be done to protect marc and steven.

[@Mr_Peem]

@@styletyany7124 just because they have that doesnt mean they cant be a psychopath… killing people brutally with no remorse is a pretty telltale sign

[@k1ssmyfast]

Drinker! Thanks for recommending Reacher, I gave the first episode a try and ended up watching all 8 hours. Feels good to just see a character take no bullshit and kick ass in the process. Roscoe is written amazingly! a strong female character who doesnt punch above her weight class, decisive about her battles and is still able to hold her own, while keeping a hulking figure in check. This show is fucking brilliant and actually gets "The Message" across better than most media thats out today.

[@k1ssmyfast]

@@lonewolf9578 Im talking about a completely different show.

[@DaveKatague]

Lol I did an all-nighter after the first episode haha

[@CuT7yFlaM]

@@DaveKatague Yeah it was that good! I like how those stories (when done correctly) really pace it well and grasp your attention with the evolution of the plot and uncovering things with the characters. That's just what we're asking for!

[@DaveKatague]

@@CuT7yFlaM I laughed cause I was confused why this was on a moon knight video and realised it was the teacher comment you’re replying to

[@CuT7yFlaM]

@@DaveKatague I thought you were talking about Reacher too lol

[@jackdonith]

Steven is the created personality , the super nice persona, a well read bookword that has a healthy relationship with his mother. What Mark actually wanted, to be a good child and have a loving mother. The violent guy that came from the abuse, the criminal, is Jake. Mark didn't create this persona, it just came up because of the abuse. They didn't see Jake's moments because he was still in the sarcophagus when they were visiting the rooms of their memories. Overall I liked the series. It had its moments, a great episode, great acting...but it had a lot of issues too. Apart from the usual ones, it showed very little Moon Knight and didn't explain some things that should have been explained if it is indeed a single season series. Perhaps some things will be explained in a movie.

[@randomcharacter6501]

The show could've done better to address some of the questions you guys have. Mark created Steven to have a normal life. Subconsciously he created Jake to take the abuse. Jake became the unhinged personality, while Mark who will do what he has to do, still has a conscience. Mark feels guilty for not only his brother's death but also Steven cluelessness. (Thinking he is real when he isn't) Avatars aren't possessed unless they are speaking to another god. Normally the god would just communicate with the avatar like Khonshu and Mark. (Ik there's a Layla scene that breaks this rule lol) Harrow wears glass in his shoes as penance for the lives he took as Khonshu's avatar. I agree the show could've done a better job of making these thing clear but I still thoroughly enjoyed it. It's the best D+ show imo. Although it fell victim to the same CGI fest ending that most of Marvel seems to have.

[@andymouse]

@Random Character Cheers.

[@frankie3010]

Yeah, it annoys me so much about the glass. It is a clear example of subtext that these guys are refusing to notice.

[@vodkavecz]

@@frankie3010 Sadly I feel more and more they fall deeper into Marvel hate, and just focus on what they can nitpick. It's 10% what was cool, and 80% one upping each other on finding what to shit on. Disappointing.

[@brianfewer919]

@@vodkavecz Seems to be an attempt, or a crutch, to maintain their viewer base... much like a politician. Done intention or by through habit, doesn't matter. It really turns people like me away to find more moderate, level minded reviewers. Ironic how the scales keep tipping one way or the other.

[@heikira438]

I get the criticisms, but I still enjoy it because Oscar Isaac is just so good in it.

[@em0_tion]

His stellar acting is the main reason why this show is alive, him and CGI. 😁

[@aikighost]

Yes I saw the plot holes etc and to be honest I still really enjoyed it regardless.

[@damio6865]

@@aikighost agreed Oscar Issac made the show palatable

[@haberdasherrykr8886]

i like his cameo in this show that's named after him

[@Crunch_Buttsteak]

I liked his & Ethan Hawke's performances & some visuals but hated everything else.

[@firestorm8570]

The bit i laughed at the most was when Layla saved the kid: "ArE yOu An EgPyTiOn SuPeRhErO?" I'm sure i heard an echo somewhere saying "ABSORB THE MESSAGE!"

[@dualgaming1203]

well wouldn't *you* be a great parent...

[@em0_tion]

@@dualgaming1203 9:41 Tell them too. We should all be ashamed for not liking an unbelievable character in a TV show. 😂

[@ransakreject5221]

The character of the woman wasn’t in the original script. But the show runner said “we hired diverse female writers and they felt it important they were represented”. So they took a white male comic character not connected to moon knight and made him a “diverse female”. So it’s exactly what we all suspected

[@maestrogringo]

*Critical Drinker Voice: THE MESSAGE*

[@FireJach]

What message? So only Americans can be superheroes?

[@deganhardt77]

Im still shocked they were allowed by Disney to portray his mother as an abusive parent xD They did try and spin it into it still being the dad's fault because he didnt stop her though, per the usual formula. Side note, Steven didnt know about the beatings. They shot it poorly, but they were trying to hint at Jake during that part. Jake is the one who took all the beatings.

[@acemagalor2519]

I wouldn’t say they frame it back into being the dad’s fault, it’s more so that he is also to blame (obviously not as much as the mom) for not doing anything when Marc was very regularly being abused which happens often in abusive households, and a lot of the time the abuse victim can get just as if not more vindictive Against the family member that chose to not do anything than the abuser in question

[@frankie3010]

@@acemagalor2519 well, Marc kinda blamed him, but he os an abused teenager

[@greaterthanharrowk1679]

Lol, not every single thing is agenda, first you make a pt about how it's good that the mom is the abusive one, then you want to bitch about how the dad was made to carry a little blame.

[@blacklivesorblackvotes2985]

@@acemagalor2519 but when the dad is the abuser the mother is never to blame. Typical double standards. So yes they WERE trying to frame it that way.

[@JoJoJoker]

It would have been funny to see him try to keep awake with the most obvious method: meth & coffee! A rednecked up, sleep deprived Moon Knight would be a sight to behold.

[@matthewsmith2979]

In DID (Disassociation Identity Disorder) the new personality is often the protected one. It survives the trauma because of it having an adaptive quality, in Marc's case Steve is unaware of the trauma happening, the trauma happens to the primary self. Often after the first split any trauma after that can create a new personality, it can be anything one person had a new personality after being hit by a baseball. It's interesting that Marc doesn't consider physical violence a traumatic experience.

[@Trollificusv2]

Nuh-uh. I saw on Tik-Tok that you can just have a personality for every occasion, and switch back and forth and back and forth for however long your Tik-Tok is! And then you can draw cool anime style avatars for them!

[@bellaluthiel4858]

What bothered me most about Layla and Marc's relationship is that they were married for a while, but when Stephen answered the phone and later talked to her in person she acted like he was faking being someone else. It was as if she had no idea about his disorder and such. An episode or two later, she talks to Marc about his disorder, and knows who Stephen is like she's known for a long time. And I get that it's possible she'd never actually talked to Stephen before, but she still acts like he's playing a game with her like a jerk instead of needing mental help. It's just really poor writing.

[@bgschannel9357]

Eh, I thought it was pretty normal for her to connect the dots as she went along. This split personality thing that she discovered in Marc was still pretty new to her, so naturally she would be a little jaded about Steven near the beginning.

[@giusi22]

i thought it was mentioned. marc said that he had it under control until recently. so i guess when konshu started threatening him with taking over laylas body and his mother death that pushed steven to come out again.

[@thundermane362]

My biggest beef was, how did the scales balance in episode 5 if Marc apparently isn't even aware of Jake? I mean you could argue that Taweret pulled only Marc's and Steven's hearts, but still, the whole purpose of balancing the scales is to judge the entire person. He can't be judged if he isn't whole, right? Where did Jake go when Marc is in "heaven" and Steven is... what, frozen as stone? Again it all boils down to bad writing. They never tried to iron out the concepts so we got a half-assed, half-baked mythos. It seemed they only did all this so we could have another cliffhanger going into the final episode and that final WTF end-credits scene.

[@NatCatKitty]

That’s true they should have had to find jake by exploring marcs memories like they did and realizing that his mom beats him but who takes the beatings? And they find jake get his heart, and that balances it out. Steven shouldn’t have died they just immediately undid that anyways and in a very cringe way might I add. Anyways then after hearts are balanced they go back to earth with the help of taweret and fight harrow, it’s a big epic fight or whatever maybe Marc can’t kill harrow but jake takes over and kills him and we actually see this happen. Konshu praises him and Layla watches horrified from a distance and when Marc/Steven takes control again they are both shocked.

[@thundermane362]

@@NatCatKitty I was hoping it was Jake who would rescue them and get them out of that place. But no, they held back on introducing Jake until that last scene leaving the entire story a mess. There were many other issues. To be honest though, I did have fun most of the time watching the series. And there I was saying to myself, "they'll answer those questions by the end." After everything has wrapped though and I've had a chance to think it over, I find it is all spectacle and no substance.

[@Relugus]

James is the dark side of the moon, the side you cannot see.

[@connordorman117]

I actually really liked Moon Knight. Episode 5 hit me like a truck, amazing acting and writing, I'll never get sick of watching an actor with multiple personalities and watching Steven and Marc interact was incredibly well done.

[@fagarou]

As someone that read most of the old school original Moon Knight and loved the Ellis > Smallwood run, I was pissed that Mr Knight suit get treated as a joke.

[@theblackflame4002]

Me too. I swore it was like Jim carey in the Mask

[@acemagalor2519]

Personally (also an avid moon knight reader) I didn’t mind, I like how they’re using different suits to exemplify the different personalities

[@Yarblocosifilitico]

yep, one of the things that pissed me of the most. Soyboy Steven and clowny Mr Knight. Pfff...

[@bgschannel9357]

Chill the F out, Mr. Knight's just getting started in the MCU. Pretty sure his character will become more serious as time passes.

[@paulnash9851]

Warren Ellis run on Moon Knight was episodic + spectacular. All they had to do was a straight adaptation. But no. I can however recommend the Russian Comic Book Geeks Moon Knight motion comics, they are simply sublime.

[@destructo6t942]

While I think Moon Knight is the best Disney+ MCU show yet, it's still a 7.5/10 They had a good start with the first 2 episodes but apparently they can never stick the landing.

[@em0_tion]

Try 5/10 and it surely isn't the best. Especially if they have to explain us the mental illness awareness focus and get Oscar for the main role just to make us watch it.

[@bgschannel9357]

I'd give it an 8.5. Best thing the MCU put out this year.

[@MikeSRyo]

I think Steven started as a pain free version of Marc. A few months ago when his mom died he had a mental breakdown and Steven became his own person and forgot everything dealing with Marc. He got a job and apartment, etc. He started waking up in strange places and had time loss which is when he started trying himself the the bed. However even with this there is a lot that doesn't make sense. How did he keep his job? It would have been better if he had been a freelancer who would come in and give his expert opinion on some relic that was found once in a while.

[@Phishytaco]

I love and respect your opinions, Drinker, you're obviously a man with fantastic awareness for the bullshit that modern cinema tries to force-feed us. If I could give some feedback, try to find someone who can offer a differing opinion, not a Disney-Marvel superfan, but an intelligent individual who at least somewhat enjoys this content, and could try to defend or differ in opinion some of the lighter topics. I usually agree with you, but this is starting to sound like an echo chamber, all of you guys have (roughly) the same views. Maybe a genuine talk with someone who feels differently would breathe some fresh air into the Open Bar. A proper Bar-Room Debate, not 4 guys (one of which hasn't seen the content you're reviewing) complaining about the worst parts you didn't like, with no rebuttal or differing view. Just my feedback, take it for what it's worth. That being said, oof. I really did not like most of this show. You all have totally valid points I absolutely agree with. The battered housewife analogy is spot on.

[@jorgenorberto293]

Agree. And this is becoming very predictable, they are always super focused of every single negative aspect while neglecting the positive ones. And I bet that, in this case, none of them ever read anything about the comics of Moon Knight. The way they were confused about the Marc - Steven mechanic tells everything.

[@ryanfisher5729]

He used to have Robert Myer Burnett occasionally who likes some of these shows/movies. Haven’t seen him for a while though.

[@nekonochesire6023]

@@jorgenorberto293 Well a show shouldn't need the viewer to have read the source material to be understood, otherwise that's a failure. Having easter egg that only readers would understand is fine, but more than that is a no.

[@Drawnartist]

Yeah I agree. It does start to become an echo chamber and I'm getting kinda burnt out

[@randomperson-up5vt]

MauLer and drinker both liked it at the start. Can't really remember about az but he gives up at 3 and he doesn't talk all that much. They just don't enjoy it as it progresses or ends. MauLer also admits he liked episode 5 kinda. They just don't understand the some of the choices that are made in it. Like Steven calling his dead mum and thinking she's still alive for example. So not sure why it's a echo chamber. When they do see both bad and good things. It's just the bad outways the good, so that's what they talk about.

[@rodneyginokc]

Moon knight was the best show they put out....which is not saying much.

[@mitchconner4057]

It was shit

[@chasehedges6775]

😂💯💯

[@user-xx6vy9ri8p]

I think Hawkeye was better. But still bad.

[@jensencalms3516]

@@user-xx6vy9ri8p Hawkeye so boring

[@theblackflame4002]

@@user-xx6vy9ri8p I agree with Hawkeye for two reasons. First, it was made to be tongue in cheek, it was very much a reality stretching COMIC BOOK story, second mad props for Clint rescuing Kate in ep 1 a male hero rescuing a female in Disney? Holy crap. Then ep 2 she tries to save him and botches it up...its almost like before she got the swing of things she screwed up and learned from it....wow.

[@johnleonard9102]

Random kaiju battles just mean the writers have no idea how to create an actual good conflict. Like the end of the Pixar film Red Panda or whatever it was called; mom suddenly becomes huge compared to everyone else, and the governments don't respond with their militaries.

[@staciepaul]

I really appreciate these selected clips. I don't have time for the long live shows so I like getting these when they pop up in my notifications. Thanks Drinker

[@gerardyimdesign]

I believe the Ethan Hawke character is putting glass on his shoes is to punish himself for being evil. He’s weighing the scales to judge other people, but it’s not being judge himself. At the end of the show he knows he deserves to die, but he still has a “job to do” so he is doing it reluctantly while also punishing himself. Much like the guy who whips himself in the the Dan Brown story Angels and Demons

[@paulhurt839]

That's right. In the final episode I think, he mentions in his defence something about hoping that his "penance" might be enough to compensate for his bad deeds. Gets a little lost in the whirlwind of plot points that come at you in those last couple of episodes. I like ideas, but it is possible to bury really important ideas underneath a bunch of other non-essential ideas.

[@connordorman117]

That's because you payed attention to the show!

[@paulhurt839]

@@connordorman117 I tried to. Possibly shouldn’t have binged the last three episodes in one night. Hate to sound like the “too many notes” quote from Amadeus, but there is SO much going on, some of the most significant and interesting plot points get lost in the mix. eg amongst several others - (SPOILER WARNING!!!) Mark creates Steven so Steven can live a life where his mother still loves him. Presumably he becomes Steven much of the time at home, then reverts to Mark when he’s being beaten… partly because he feels that, as Mark, *he deserves it*. And that protects Steven. Wow, if that had been clearer it would have really landed… it’s the big reveal of the whole show really. Also, who got the significance of the statuettes of the gods before they started smashing them in the final episode? Whole reason for find the tomb was to get hold of the statue, but even after Steven found it I had no idea why it was a big deal.

[@carontorliak2760]

While I think the show as a whole was just okay, the characters played by Oscar and Ethan rise this show up so much. Their character writing is really good but for some reason the same level of attention was not made to the plot.

[@bgschannel9357]

I really could have settled for more Arthur Harrow screentime. Hawke never disappoints.

[@damio6865]

@@bgschannel9357 yeah I think him and Oscar showed why they are too class actors with this show

[@MirandaSinistra]

Why was a fertility goddess ferrying dead souls? That's the direct opposite of fertility. Isn't the god of the afterlife Anubis in Egyptian mythology?

[@scottf5791]

Excellent point. That bit really infuriated me

[@shawerful5209]

Anubis is imprisoned, thats why she does the work with so much fear

[@johndurham6172]

Yes, they no nothing about the mythology. What do you expect from a gender studies major.

[@dukedukeson8831]

Anubis is supposedly imprisoned with some other gods which is why he wasn't there and Taweret along with being a fertility God is also a funeral god so it kinda makes sense that she would replace anubis's role

[@bananakinflyswatter904]

I felt it had a WandaVision type of flow. Good progress with building interest, but ultimately fell flat near the end. That final episode was so underwhelming. Not even bad- just underwhelming. Marc chickening out about killing Harrow had me rolling my eyes so hard they almost fell out of my head. The post-credit scene was alright, though. Just should've happened earlier. Hell, I didn't even know there was a post-credit thing for this show.

[@robwalsh9843]

I couldn't finish WandaVision, gave up on the fourth episode. I was able to finish Moon Knight. Not great, but some steps in a better direction.

[@NatCatKitty]

Marc/Steven/Jake should have killed Harrow during the climax IMO

[@0Sutekinaryuu0]

Moonman and the Scarab frustrated me so darn much… Really enjoyed Oscar Isaac but we needed more time with his backstory and less time with Layla - if she needs to be brought in, do it later on after we’ve spent more time with Oscar’s characters. I’ve found the finale of every one of the Marvel D+ shows completely missing the mark for me :(

[@darthkek1953]

I loved WV and Loki's ending... and the Mandalorian... I couldn't finish MK or FWS or FETT.

[@cmd31220]

Totally agree. Loki, Wandavision, Falcon+WS, and Moon Knight all had their weakest links at the end. Hawkeye was the only one I thought had a decent end, but that was also the most meh show of the whole bunch

[@darthkek1953]

​@@cmd31220 Loki's ending was a chat with god, Loki falling love with himself - and being rejected - and the creation of the multiverse. What more did you need? Him to do "Get Help"?

[@cmd31220]

@@darthkek1953 no, the final episode was a chat with some random dude no one has ever seen or heard of before, followed by a fight where the strong wahmen that replaced the main character kicks the shit out of said main character, all of which based around a subject that went against the established rules of the show, just to recreate the very thing that was allegedly being destroyed. It was boring, it tried to be deep but just didn't make any internal sense, and it was the final emasculation of a beloved male character in favor of "the message"

[@darthkek1953]

@@cmd31220 that random dude wasn't random, he's an amalgam of two iconic Marvel characters and what they did with him was fucking BOSS. The "strong WhamN" what the fuck are you talking about? A woman is human. She's the natural-born PRINCESS of the fucking KING OF THE FROST GIANTS and was raised as the adopted child of ODIN. Plus, of ALL the female variants in all the sacred timelines, she's the strongest. She's the one that got away, the one that survived the Time Cop hunters. So yes, she SHOULD be fucking strong. But it's not like she rag-dolled our dude Loki. He kept up with her easily. Remember when she tried to use the Charm power on him? He's like, "erm, what are you doing?". She sucker-kicked him because he CHOSE to put his guard down, she couldn't make him. (And let's face it, it's not like our male Loki was much of a warrior, the Avengers bitched him up.) That final episode was deeper, well-written, and acted, than you're able to comprehend. Are you going to start bitching there were STRANG WHAMEENZ in Aliens, Terminator, both Arnie Conan films, Edge of Tomorrow, Kill Bill, etc. etc.?? Because you're bitching like a woman, brother.

[@raptorunhinged2400]

I thought the show was a breath of fresh air from the rest of the MCU, as it didn’t have anything to do with the broader MCU story. I wish Marvel would open up to doing more episodes per season, as I think that a lot of their shows suffer from being so fast-paced. Overall, it felt like there weren’t too many cringey SJW moments, and I was definitely entertained by Oscar Issac’s and Ethan Hawke’s performances, and the story was also quite unique/interesting. p.s. Ethan Hawkes’ character put glass in his slippers to repent for his sins as an avatar to Konshu.

[@heytherehumans4479]

THIS IS THE CALMEST COMMENT HERE IN THIS OASIS OF INCEL

[@mhug86]

8 episodes would have been good. 6 it seemed like they rushed it to wrap it up

[@UC_Fran]

The show needed at least double the episodes and more character development, but i overall loved it.

[@Vidhur]

The point that's made 2:08 is really prevalent and it applies on a lot of historical shows as well. The only show I've ever seen where they actually did alot of effort to make the English sound like it fit in the universe, culture and time was "Spartacus", where they basically speak English as if it was *literally* translated from Roman period Latin into English. Even the profanity sounds like banter from a kindergarten for extremely high functioning autistic kids because of it. That's exactly what I would believe that kind of locker room talk in Latin during the period it plays in would sound like. I felt much more immersed into Spartacus than I should've been just because of this, I found the 300-esque visuals to be overdone, but the language was really good.

[@paulreilly2304]

I'd love a show that stops trying to have epic season-long stories. Can we get episodic shows again? Have a longer arc connecting them in the background, with resolution as the final episode, but also have self-contained stories for the individual episodes. White Collar did that very well.

[@MoreImbaThanYou]

I get the everyone has different tastes, but I honestly do not like episodic shows that much. I prefer the long stories, if written well.

[@GothPaoki]

White collars longer story arc was shit really.

[@MuhammadAli-qh8tg]

Watch suits.

[@Craig-gq4gb]

White Collar underrated af

[@paulreilly2304]

@@MoreImbaThanYou I agree that "if writen well" the longer stories are better. But I don't think every show needs to do that. Variety would be nice. Every show today has the same long story formula. I'd love if some shows would deviate from this, and be more episodic just for the different option. Sometimes I want a 1-hour story with an ending. Not every show has a story which needs a season to tell. And that becomes obvious when the 1st episode is good, episodes 2-5 are filler, then the final 2 episodes have a purpose.

[@CyGea]

Steven improves because he realizes, every skill Marc has, he also has. It's a whole moment while they're fighting on the boat. Steven didn't need to "figure out his powers," he just needed to trust he could do it.

[@thisisfyne]

Basically, yeah. Marc learned to be more like Steven and vice versa as both persona had strong qualities to make a whole better person.

[@connordorman117]

This, they missed a lot of stuff with this review.

[@lukescrew1981]

@@connordorman117 They always do

[@tajaniscott]

Imagine an “anthology” where the first three episodes are each personalities’ approach to being Moon Knight. Then the fourth episode is Mr. Knight solving a completely unrelated mystery before discovering the other alters. Have it so Khonshu made deals with all 4(yes, I want Mr. Knight to be another alter) They can all fight against Khonshu, breaking their deals, try to be Moon Knight and Mr. Knight without him maybe. It doesn’t really matter what the villain is, as long as they challenge his beliefs on vengeance that Khonshu has instilled in him. The 4 can learn to deal with each other, not have Marc and Steven ignore blackouts that lead to fucking bloodbaths. By the end of he series he can ultimately have Khonshu as a personal sacrifice so no one else has to deal with him.

[@stangreen4134]

Still not at all interested. Rather read the comic books from the 80’s if anything…

[@oscarjimenezgarrido7591]

@@stangreen4134 Thank you, you saved me the trouble. All that contrived Lemire Lite fluff can't compare to the original 'he _says_ an Egyptian moon God resurrected and knighted him, but everybody's money is in _he's nuts as fuck and it's all in his head',_ which made him one thousand times more interesting and a complete badass of a character

[@tajaniscott]

@@stangreen4134 understandable honestly, at this point everyone should read their favourite runs

[@dualgaming1203]

That sounds somehow way way WAY more convoluted than the original show. You do realize there aren't 4 personalities in the comics? They were trying to pay homage to the comics? Marc and Steven have never ignored blackouts? Is being shocked = ignorant??? This is meant to be a different spin on the character so why would Mr. Knight be solving some random bullshit? Like.. what?

[@Dookieman1975]

I think they’ll do something like that in season 2

[@Zaygut]

Glass in Ethan's shoes has a meaning or repentance, because he also was an avatar of Konshu, and he was murdering people too. Series didnt explicaty explained that but he mentions in one of the episode that he is repenting for his sins.

[@randomperson-up5vt]

Bullcrap on it being repentance. The guy doesn't give a toss of his past or current sins. He had every chance to not go along with the plan to release a god that's going to consume peoples souls for crimes they didn't even commit.

[@LuxisAlukard]

If you want comic book character with split personality disorder - watch Legion. And I would like to hear these fine gentlemen talk about that show, it's VERY different from any other movie/series adaptation

[@cmd31220]

I really enjoyed the show up until the finale. Then it all came off the rails. -Layla is instantly amazing despite it being very clear that the avatars don't have an inbuilt knowledge of combat -the epic final battle that's supposed to be the climax of the show ends with Mark dead on the ground, then out of nowhere he blacks out and magically wins the fight off screen -the gods fighting in the background meant absolutely nothing -Osiris makes it clear that they're screwed at the end and they need "more avatars than they have left" to win, but then 2 avatars holding hands is enough -The whole "I don't want to kill him" thing at the end comes out of nowhere and makes no sense on a character or narrative level -the hospital scene at the end doesn't make sense since Mark/Steven isn't in the afterlife anymore I will say the one thing I did really like about the finale was the end credits scene because it reminded me of an 80s mafia movie where the mob boss orders a hit on somebody. Loved that

[@maestrogringo]

It was my understanding that the post credit scene was an *actual* psych ward, not the afterlife, since Harrow wasn't killed off until Jake picks him up and straight up murders him

[@cmd31220]

@@maestrogringo I was talking about the short scene before he wakes up in his apartment at the end. Where he tells Doctor Harrow that he rejects the diagnosis.

[@tajaniscott]

Moon Knight Rewrite Personally, I’d want more episodes (probably not as long as the Netflix shows because outside of Daredevil and Season 1 of Jessica Jones, there was serious wasted time within the 13 episodes); 9 episodes is probably the sweet spot Episode 1: I would’ve had Marc getting shot as the opening and then have Steven wake up extremely confused. Steven goes about his business, we get a day in the life, keep the date stuff. Key difference; We save the action till the end. Random thugs adorned in a scale tattoo (who we learn work for Harrow later) attack the museum for unknown artefact (we learn it’s the scarab). While a bunch of people escape, one of the thugs recognises Steven (really as Marc) and takes him to show them the scarab. Steven takes them to a display but it’s a fake, the guy threatens Steven, Marc takes over and kills them, we get our Moon Knight action scene. Marc can “Disney torture” one of them to find out who sent him and what the tattoo symbolises; name drop Harrow. Steven wakes up screaming with bruised knuckles, even more confused. Episode done. Episode 2: Steven tries to go back to work, to see the security tapes, he reaches late and gets fired so he has to sneak in and sees Moon Knight killing the thugs. He does his research thing and finds the duffel bag with and ID saying Marc Spector, some guns and the scarab. Before leaving, Marc begins to talk to him, trying to explain. Steven doesn’t listen and Khonshu attempts to scare him (minus the weird freeze frame). Back in his flat, Steven tries to uncover details about Marc; he must have something hidden around the place. He finds the phone, with Marc warning not to, he calls and gets Layla, keep that interaction the same. To keep a pseudo creepy vibe going, the door is knocked almost immediately, two “FBI” officers are here to speak with him. Marc tells him not to open the door and even Steven is inclined to agree; what would FBI agents want with someone they believe to be Steven. Before they(Marc and Steven) can come to an agreement however, the agents break down the door and take Steven and the duffle bag. The same exposition about the mercenary stuff and we keep the Harrow mostly the same, except no Layla. Jackal and all that falling; Mr. Knight comes out, not Steven as Mr. Knight but a different alter altogether. Both Marc and Steven are confused, as Mr. Knight seems to be a mix of both of them, efficient at fighting but also well versed in certain fields of knowledge; however Marc also notices he’s a bit more brutal than he would ever be. The same knock over to a busy road and Marc forcefully takes over the body, with Steven not approving, to lead it away from the people. Same scene where Marc defeats the jackal but key difference he still has the scarab. Both Steven and Mr. Knight argue to take control of the body; both confused as to the whole process. Marc explains some of the situation to them but the two keep nagging him so he smashes the mirror. Same Khonshu scene, except he teases Marc even more, given Mr. Knight’s existence. Episode end. Episode 3 : Marc stalks after a woman in Egypt, before grabbing her off the street. It’s Layla. Layla exposition; etc. (I’m not gonna lie, I’m not really enthusiastic about the character but I do have an idea for her finale wise.) The two reluctantly agree to work together. Mostly the same episode; except no Gods, yet at least. We can have the sky thingy again ONLY if it’s explicitly stated Marc/ Steven/ Mr. Knight and Khonshu are the only ones that can see it, for what should be obvious reasons. We can have the lack of Khonshu by explaining that using that much power essentially drained most of his power so majority of his essence will return to wherever(it will be revealed) to recharge. This essentially makes Steven/ Marc/ Mr. Knight on par with Cap, strength wise but also with no ceremonial Egyptian armour. Episode 4: Same intro as episode 3, Marc vs the thugs, only to wake up to them stabbed. What he doesn’t know is that one of the thugs alerted Harrow of where Marc was headed. Now the interrogation scene for the kid, this was a really stupid interrogation simply because there’s no way to progress the pain. The reason most interrogations, that aren’t Batman(or someone similar) scaring the shit out of someone, have torture as the means of extraction is because you can say “One stab doesn’t work, how about two? Three? Twenty?” Hanging the kid off the cliff is dumb, the only leverage is talk or drop, which leads to kid and ultimately Harrow momentarily winning; drop, Marc gets nth versus talk and the kid lives and since Marc doesn’t want to hurt kids he can potentially warn Harrow. Back to the story lol. There’s no Khonshu to urge Marc to hang the kid over the cliff and neither he or Steven want to do it. Mr. Knight (finally not in the suit) can force his way into control to get the info through some “Disney torture”. Marc and Steven are horrified but are unable to take back the body. (In case you may be wondering what info Marc is after since he has the scarab, he could just want general information about Harrow’s operation, his numbers, influence, schedule, etc. Mr. Knight calls Layla to go to the dig site. She’s a bit turned off by his come and go behaviour but still agrees to work with him. We can even throw in a joke along the lines: [Mr. Knight now in control of the body, looks into Layla’s eyes while setting up the harness. He spots both his alters in random reflective surface] Marc and Steven, glaring: “Don’t you dare touch her!” [Marc looks over at Steven, disapproval on his face] Mr. Knight is able to get them through the puzzles but each one is becoming increasingly difficult since he’s not as knowledgeable as Steven is. He picks the wrong thing and the consequence of him not sharing the body is they get to Egyptian Zombie mummy. The zombie chases specifically after Mr. Knight. Despite being a less capable fighter, Steven forces control of the body and through knowledge of Egyptian mythology, maybe he evokes some other deity trivia or the destroying the snake skin to prevent self regeneration. Basically make Steven big brain. We can even have Marc and Mr. Knight begin to appreciate him a but more. Anyways, since we don’t Layla taking on the zombie near a cliff, what if the danger is simply, I don’t know, the very old and unstable cave structure, show some real intelligence through the ‘how’ she survives. We can keep the same talk she has with Harrow. Steven can keep his geek-out over the tombs. We can have the same scene with Marc and Layla, the confrontation with Harrow and Marc’s “death”. I’d keep the asylum scene(Marc and Steven are joined by Mr. Knight, note that in the asylum Mr. Knight now has on his full suit, mask and all) but with one major change, instead of running into Taweret , the trio open the doors into a temple of the gods and the trial of Khonshu.

[@tajaniscott]

Episode 5: Most of the plot for the actual episode 5 but like I said this is also a trial for Khonshu. So essentially we learn tgat when Khonshu when to recharge, he had to hide from the other deities, as due to the prior crimes of Ammit, the deities decided to prohibit the ban of selecting an avatar, excluding what they deemed to be world-ending scenarios. He was eventually found out and captured before being able to be fully recharged. We can have certain memories due to the afterlife thing, Steven’s “birth”, Marc’s mum’s death and his and Steven’s reactions, while others are used for the trial, Randall’s death and the creation of Moon Knight. Picture this: [Khonshu stands confident, shackled arms and legs. To his right, Marc, Steven and Mr. Knight. In front of them the other deities stand majestically] Horus: Khonshu, you claim to have humanity’s greater interest at heart, which explains your interference? Is that correct? Khonshu, smugly: Yes. Horus: This would entail the punishment of only the guilty, only those who you deemed to seek harm against the travellers of the night? Khonshu: My avatars have only sought vengeance for those that have caused harm, Horus. Is there a point to your argument? Horus: Randall Spector. [Mr. Knight and Steven looked confused but Marc begins to tear up before his face grows into a scowl] Steven: Spector? As in Marc Spector? Marc: Why’d you bring up that name? What’s that got to do with this? Mr. Knight: It was the kid. Randall Spector was the kid in the room full of dead people. People Marc killed. Marc, tears beginning to well up but a clear rage growing with every word: Why are you bringing that up here? Now? Horus, motioning to Khonshu: Would you care to or should I? [Khonshu turns his head away from Marc and Horus motions to Osiris who casts an illusion of the day Randall died. After the memory plays,] Horus: Now take us back, right before the cave and crack. [The three alters place their attention on the dead bird who bears an uncanny resemblance to Khonshu. The wheels begin turning and all three piece it together simultaneously.] Steven and Mr. Knight hold Marc back, as the memory of Marc becoming Moon Knight plays. The deities prepare to sentence Khonshu, who still hasn’t said a word of defence. Despite the occurrence, Marc still beckons them to stop Harrow directly or give him Khonshu temporarily until he does. The deities refuse but as a token, they restore the body. While the body heals, the trio explore the asylum and memories until Steven stumbles upon his creation and learns about his mother’s death. The two begin to fight while Mr. Knight tries to break them apart when they all begin to do the eye glow and- Real World. Everyone’s gone, Layla escaped and Harrow and his crew left. The body emerges from the water, mischief in his eye and sinister grin across his face. Jake Lockley time. Episode 6: In a warehouse, thugs are moving drugs and human trafficking, etc. They turn to hear a scraping on a barrel. Jake in a makeshifts Moon Knight suit(the black and white one) strolls forward, billy clubs in hand. Fight scene, Jake kills them before they can even get a shot off. However, during the fight, the people being trafficked are lost. He moves towards a crate, pulling out ketamine( haha funny fake comic book meme). He also pulls out a flask beginning to drink and well, use the ket, a single tear leaving his eye. So basically for the rest of this episode we’d have Jake try to get back the victims but realises he can’t exactly put the mystery together. So he forces out Mr. Knight to do some detective work. The rest of the episode are just those two bouncing off each other, in a bad cop, worse cop manner. We can have Jake’s backstory be the thing literally everyone was theorising, he’s all the rage and pain Marc had to deal with bundled up. This causes him to be depressed, hence the drinking and ketamine (yes, I did turn a meme into an actual plot point) Our climax can be Jake realising he needs to work with the others to be truly effective and not just grab the body as he sees fit. So when they do finally approach the traffickers, Mr. Knight can convince Jake into giving Marc the body. Episode 7: Basically just our resolution to Marc and Steven being upset at each other. The four can have hiccups trying to use the body in tandem while getting to Harrow. While they run into Layla, who can also be searching for Harrow, slowly losing her patience with them as their constant struggle with each other for the body, puts even more pressure on her already lacking trust for Marc. Throughout the episode, we can also have Layla and Marc/Steven/ Mr. Knight argue about the effectiveness of Khonshu vs the potential effectiveness of Ammit. By the end, Layla and Marc get separated, with either Marc or Jake fighting Harrow’s followers outside, with Layla going inside to try and stop/slow Harrow.

[@tajaniscott]

Episode 8: The final trek to get to Ammit’s tomb, with Harrow sacrificing more and more followers “for Ammit”. Outside we have Marc and Jake butting heads when it comes to fighting. Conflict, more conflict, resolution. The four alters develop a complete understanding with each other. They then dash off to find Layla. We can keep Harrow offering himself to Ammit but slightly change her reasoning. Ammit: I once took an avatar, pure in mind, body and soul. I thought this to be the perfect path of vengeance. However, after his betrayal, I’ve come to realise that only an impure soul seeking redemption could fulfill my desires. I would have chosen you Arthur Harrow but you do not seek redemption, your thirst is for control. But there is one among us, she understands my mission. She has seen the true failings of Khonshu’s way. I can give you the justice you deserve, little bug. The question is, how badly do you want it? Layla shoots Harrow and we can reference the shot in episode 2 where the followers close in on Steven. We have them part a path for her and she walks through, taking up the cane. Marc runs in just in time to see her complete her transformation into Ammit’s avatar. Layla argues with Marc and Steven about the ethics of becoming an avatar. We can have an actual discussion about how Khonshu and Ammit aren’t exactly after different things, just their methodologies vary. Layla: I mean come on, for how long did you parade around in that armour casting judgement on people? How is this any different? Marc: Because they were guilty! I never killed anyone who didn’t deserve it. Layla: You killed anyone that Khonshu said deserved it. And you believe his judgment to be fair, even after what he did? Steven: Would you be doing anything different, how many other kids could potentially be killed. Innocent children, Layla. Does that sound right to you? Layla: Innocent people die all the time, Steven. Just ask my father. I’m just trying to protect true innocence. [Layla holds the cane now morphing into a staff towards Steven, the crocodile mouth aimed at him.] Steven, whispering: If this suit’s got any tricks up its sleeve, now would be the time to use ‘em Jakey. Jake takes control and throws a makeshift moon blade at the staff, deflecting the blast before throwing down a smoke grenade and zipping away with the grapple. While running, Mr. Knight and Steven attempt to form a plan. They eventually decide to use the tricks of the pyramid against them. Layla’s goons eventually corner them and they intentionally seal themselves off in a room full of ushabtis Marc takes control and releases Khonshu as the episode’s stinger. Marc let’s it be clear, they’re taking his deal and if they survive, keeping it. Marc: Listen to me, you Big Bird. If we live through this, we’ll continue to be your fist of vengeance. God knows I don’t want to but no one else should have to deal with you. Khonshu: Do they agree to that? [In the asylum halls] Mr. Knight: Well if get to keep the suit, by all means. Jake: La guerra nunca termina, el campo de batalla simplemente cambia. (The war never ends, the battlefield just changes) [They look at Steven] Steven: Wherever my brothers go, Marc: Yeah, they agree. Khonshu: Then as long as you have a single breath within your body, you shall forever live as my Moon Knight Episode 9: Our finale fight takes place within the pyramid, so Moon Knight’s (maybe) future appearances actually come as a surprise to other heroes. We can definitely keep the best part of the finale, the alters smoothly switching. Since we have Jake(black snd white suit), Marc(ceremonial armour) and Mr. Knight(tux) fighting, we give Steven purpose by having him come up with a plan with the help of Khonshu. Moon Knight attempts to fight Layla but becomes overwhelmed, with the large numbers from Layla’s new following, as well as Marc’s hesitancy to hurt Layla. Mr. Knight takes control to hatch a plan, taking care of the followers, leaving them only faced with Layla. Marc tries to reach out to her but she won’t listen, in the asylum Steven and Mr. Knight try to talk him down. We can even get Steven hugging Marc saying, “Whenever danger is near, Marc Spector has no fear.” Now knowing what must be done, Marc surrenders the body to Jake who takes on Layla. Instead of the usual blackout when he took over, we can start off with it but then now they’re all fully conscious of everything. Jake fights Layla and after getting on top of her, plunges the moon blade into her. He then gives the body back to Marc, who holds onto the blade while cradling her, Layla: You couldn’t even...give me the time...kill me yourself Marc continues to cradle her and as the life leaves her body, some of the bandages of the suit begin to encase her. Khonshu appears behind him, Marc: What’re you doing? Khonshu: We protect the travellers of the night and seek vengeance on those who would hurt them. Layla will be remembered as one of those travellers. As for Ammit, The bandages now completely encasing Layla’s corpse begins to glow, taking the shape of an ushabti, Khonshu: She will be imprisoned here where her judgements can be cast on her self alone. And for my sake, bury the body somewhere no one would dare look. Marc carries the ushabti to Khonshu’s tomb, burying it there. A cool shot can be composed to have the spirits of Steven, Jake and Mr. Knight beside him. Post/Mid Credit Scene: A woman is being chased by something at night. We get Moon Knight(Marc) also chasing on rooftops. We have him jump down from above, get a cool shot of his cape as the moon, and he lands on a- Vampire. He’s confused and Jake takes over beating it to the ground, before a blade cuts it and it burns as it screams. He looks up to see someone. We hear Mahershala Ali’s voice.

[@electricbayonet2]

I've barely started reading your comment, and already you have a change for the better by having the series start with Marc bleeding out in the temple of Khonshu, only to 'reveal' that it was Steven dreaming. Works perfectly from a character perspective: Steven's life is adventureless and unfulfilling, and that dissatisfaction bleeds together with what he knows from his studies and work at the museum, so dreams of being a globe-trotting soldier of fortune with an Egyptian mythology edge sounds like exactly the sort of thing that he could play off as, well, a dream, no matter how vivid.

[@tajaniscott]

@@electricbayonet2 That was my intention, it was the simplest way to ‘lure an audience’ with something they literally say in the show “our lives are bleeding into each other”

[@BlastbeaterPT]

Moon knight is one of the tv shows of all time.

[@thedudeabides3138]

Enjoy your time in the minority.

[@sauce8277]

🤔🤔

[@TheAyeAye1]

I read the Moon Knight comic back in the day. Thanks for removing the temptation to look in on this show.

[@shadowbane7401]

this good up until the last episode

[@jk802]

Marc was real. Stephen was the innocent that was created to still have a loving mother. Jake (after credits that kills the bad guy) is the crazy murderer because he received all the beatings from Strong Female Abuser/Mom.

[@theblackflame4002]

I have to say I was impressed Disney had the mother as the abuser, and not the father which would be the pattern for the message, I'd have given them a point for it, but these guys can't say anything positive, it ruins their 'message'

[@GSBrofly]

@@theblackflame4002 the father was still a simp for the mom and stood by doing nothing

[@bryanarevalo7072]

@@GSBrofly yea cause that happens in real life too, I’ve been subjected to that sort of abuse, And have had friends who were also abused, Fathers ain’t do shit, if anything, they’d join in

[@ciscoperez6879]

Drinker & mauler are my favorite voices to hear talking about movies/video games. Absolute legends

[@eros5420]

I don't think normal people could see the Kaiju gods... But Amet leveling up by munching on the souls just to have Konshu show up the same size is stupid. Also I really liked Layla refusing Konshu because Marc was haunted by him. But then she just takes on hypo immediately. I'd think shed refuse all God possession. The 6 episodes felt both rushed and too short. Honestly 8 or 10 episodes of slower more dramatic and logically consistent episodes woulda been better. Also the other gods shouldnt of been AWOL at the end. :/

[@TheRealMonkeyrogue]

An aspect they could have leveraged was to make Konshu grow because the greater the vengeance the greater the power he has. Therefore when Ammit grows they could have said "as your power grows unchecked, my vengeance for your blood grows even greater. I am the vengeance of the universe!" Or something equally weak and we could have easily accepted that. Silly. Just silly.

[@replicds]

The glass in the shoes is a form of self flagellation. It's supposed to show he's fanatically religious.

[@theblackflame4002]

for that to the Nth degree check out the movie Saint Maude, disturbing AF

[@robwalsh9843]

Ethan Hawk was superb as a creepy cult leader and a psychologist.

[@akmason74]

My favorite part was where Marc blacked out in the final episode, and the climactic battle happened off screen. I can almost imagine the director telling the audience: "now imagine something cool happening!". I imagined I was watching a better show.

[@Yalbou]

Yep great comment. The final episode was a joke

[@gideonjones5712]

99% sure Mark was the one who initiated the divorce to keep her away. They did actually say why Harrow put glass in his shoes, though not directly: it's part of his whole motivation being penance for his various sins, trying to balance his own scales. Thing was, I don't remember that being explained at all before the finale. I honestly still love Moon Night, but they really rushed the ending, which is a shame. For once I would have been happy if they dragged it out another episode to better explore things and set up stuff like the sealing spell instead of mentioning it to Layla once and later both her and Mark knowing it and doing it because we only have so much running time left. I don't mind Layla's "are you an egyptian superhero?" moment, just because some good old patriotism is the only kind of identity politics I've ever understood, lol. She needed more time to learn to fight with her powers, because while she wasn't incompetent so far, she was never Black Widow. Jack wouldn't feel like an easy way out of that final fight if only they had established some kind of side effects for him after those episodes. I mean sure he has healing armor, but surely you'd be feeling it if you went berserk like that.

[@randomperson-up5vt]

The glass in his shoes as form of repenting is bullcrap. That's not penance for things he regrets. Since we see the guy has nothing against killing people currently and he is gonna release a god to consume innocent peoples souls for things they might do in the future.

[@gideonjones5712]

@@randomperson-up5vt fanatics have caused themselves physical torment as penance for sins for millenia. He tries not to kill people, he lets Ahmet (or however you spell it, the crocodile lady) judge them, and she kills them. Also, as far as he's concerned those people aren't innocent. The god sees all of time and knows what people will do given the chance. So, she decides to not let bad things happen. It's not like the idea of seeing the future and punishing people for crimes they aren't yet guilty of is a new concept, it's been done before it isn't that hard to understand.

[@randomperson-up5vt]

@@gideonjones5712 him putting some glass in shoes is just him being crazy. its not penance of any kind. he doesnt regret his actions nor does he seem them as wrong as you just said. edit: Since he doesnt see them as innocent. On the whole he lets the god kill them for him. Yeah I'm sure when someone kills someone with a gun, its the gun that does the killing. The guy holding the gun is always innocent. Lastly the gods dont know the future. Unless freewill doesnt exist in the show again. edit: if they did know the future they would have known all their avatars would have been killed off and prevented it or just stopped the god from being released. Unless again freewill doesnt exist and just let it happen.

[@gideonjones5712]

@@randomperson-up5vt he regrets his past actions. He doesn't regret the things he's done since becoming Ahmet's avatar because those things are both for a "good" cause and and to make up for his past, including his time as Moon Knight. To him, that makes it justifiable. He's the antagonist, do you want him to be a nice and reasonable guy? Lastly, look, some divine beings get to see the future. That's what they say Ahmet can do, so she does it. They don't say the others can, so they can't. The TVA in Loki kinda destroys free will, but not technically. You can choose something else, but they'll kill you for it. Ahmet doesn't get rid of free will, only looks at events from a perspective where you've already done it. You could do something else, but you won't, so Ahmet sees no point in showing mercy. Just skip to the judgement part now so people don't call you a bad god for letting bad things happen.

[@randomperson-up5vt]

@@gideonjones5712 i don't expect him to be reasonable. the guys a nut who plans to release a God to kill massive amounts of people. I just don't for a second believe that nonsense he regrets his actions before becoming this avatar. His plan is gonna kill untold thousands of innocents. How many people are currently driving are going to cause accidents. Doctors in surgery dropping dead. Pilots dropping from the sky. Even if by bullcrap logic that not all gods can see the future. Guess what there are other gods that can. They would have seen this upcoming disaster. By your own logic that some can see the future. You really can't have gods that see the future and free will but one of them only plan to kill the guilty. Since you might need the guilty to cause the birth or are the reasons for the actions of people in the future. Since you would prevent it and that means the future never happens.

[@nullskull6860]

I thought the show was strong enough to stand on it's own two feet. Although if you'd push it it might tip around a little. It's darker then the other series and while that isn't in itself good it seems to do a fair amount right. The thing is that the writing is good enough so that you honestly don't notice the hickups. I mean the graphics, vibe and style of the show is very interesting and you can actually stay immersed.

[@DarkAkuma86]

7:55 @HeelvsBabyface to answer the question, yes. Though not directly. Walking on glass is an English idiom used to refer to being punished (like the more common walking on air is happy and walking on egg shells is being careful). It has its origin in trial by ordeal, putting yourself through something awful in order to make ammends for your crimes. Harrow was trying to atone for his sins so that he could be worthy to live in Ammit's world.

[@jonugent42]

"He flies now?!" "He flies now..."

[@sparrow4207]

This show makes me appreciate 'Legion' more, and I already thought very highly of that show. Watch Legion instead if you haven't already.

[@em0_tion]

Oh, yeah, that was a mindf🤘ck done right! Moonshine is so poorly made, they don't even belong in the same sentence! 😂

[@caxtnova]

As I understand it, typical therapy for cases of DID puts assimilation of alters as the end goal, so having the alters embrace their coexistence as individual people felt really strange and uncomfortable. It was really bizarre seeing the writers try to have a 'happy ending' but still maintain the status quo of the main character's fractured psyche. If you want to tell a story about someone who has been so damaged as to experience DID, maybe get a psychiatrist involved in the writing process next time? As a TV show, I really liked the mystery in the first episode of only seeing the world through one alter's eyes, but it was discarded way too quickly. That part with the "Are you an Egyptian superhero?" made me laugh out loud. I *think* the reason this wasn't supposed to be an 'Avengers level threat' is that a lot of the action was supposed to be invisible to most people... they spent all that time in the beginning showing how only Moon Knight was capable of seeing the demon dogs. It's a shame that the Marvel TV shows have to suffer from so many issues. None of them have gotten close to reaching their potential. Edit: KZbin seems to be deleting my reply to this, so I'll try an edit instead. In case if the problem is with the links to my sources, I won't include them - but I'm sure if you copy and paste the quotes into Google, you can find the sources if you're interested. According to *Dispelling myths about dissociative identity disorder treatment: an empirically based approach* : "Current evidence supports the conclusion that phasic treatment consistent with expert consensus guidelines is associated with improvements in a wide range of DID patients' symptoms and functioning, decreased rates of hospitalization, and reduced costs of treatment... The claims that DID treatment is harmful are based on anecdotal cases, opinion pieces, reports of damage that are not substantiated in the scientific literature, misrepresentations of the data, and misunderstandings about DID treatment and the phenomenology of DID." With a description of phasic treatment coming from Sheppard Pratt: "In Phase 3, the individual’s DID and PTSD symptoms have usually substantially moderated, and the individual with DID may even experience subjective fusion of some or all self states, with complete merging of the characteristics of these subjective identities. This frees up energy for a focus on living better in the present." Suggesting that assimilation of identities is murder sounds like harmful misinformation to me. Stay safe out there, internet.

[@ldcg106]

While it Integration (the name of the process you are describing) is usually the goal, because it is helpful to some people, others who have gone through it have deliberately de-integrated themselves later on, feeling that the whole is less than the sum of the parts. Still others can integrate and separate at will, but report it as an unpleasant experience. There are people who members of a multiple collective who speak out vehemently against this idea as a form of murder. To multiples who feel this way, it's better to learn how to communicate and work together as a system. Psychology professionals have come to accept this viewpoint in recent years as well, believing that having these people learn to safely coexist is just valid as attempting to merge them.

[@Harpagio]

Well it’s less that “assimilation is murder” and more that Multiple Personality Disorder is completely made up, and is only experienced by people who REALLY want attention. It’s worth mentioning that the book (and later movie) that popularized the disorder, Sybil, was shown to be a lie maintained by the doctors who were treating her, and in 2011 the actual woman, Shirley Manson (not the singer), came out and admitted the whole thing was made up. It makes for fun storytelling but there’s a reason why people treated for this suddenly regress - life is more boring when you’re not playing pretend.

[@nidysgwid2957]

@@Harpagio I strongly recommend that you do much more research into DID before posting comments like these, they can be very harmful. I’m not trying to attack you I genuinely think you should look into it more and not just from the viewpoint that it isn’t real. There is literally a diagnostic criteria, last time I checked the DSM-5 doesn’t have a criteria to diagnose “wanting attention”.

[@hydroxytriptamine3554]

There’s no “typical” therapy for a supposed disorder that is borderline iatrological and its very existence is controversial. Don’t let a “community” of LARPing discord mod redditors with weird fetishes trick you into thinking that a DID is a thing beyond cluster B personality disorders, gender dysphoria and autism

[@hydroxytriptamine3554]

@@Harpagio exactly

[@warsharkproductions6550]

I can't believe the show left out the most essential thing about Moon knight's history. Dracula still owes him money. kzbin.info/www/bejne/laiQg6SJa5uhl80

[@tajaniscott]

Or his ketamine intake 💀

[@lonewolf9578]

At least they did the “random bullshit go!”

[@Relugus]

Spare me the memes.

[@seth8933]

I went in with no expectations. I thought it was the best show Marvel put out by a long shot. I liked the setting and all the Egyptian lore and stuff, and how dark it was in the first few episodes. I think it got a little more boring towards the end, but I am still excited to see how they include him in future Marvel things. I think he's an interesting and fun character. Edit: Disney Marvel show guys. I understand Daredevil is good guys, calm down.

[@donutguy3854]

nah daredevil is the best marval show...maybe even the best live action superhero show.

[@Archonsx]

i went in without any expectations and still thought it was garbage

[@theblackflame4002]

I agree, there's a low bar so I go in with the mentality, 'we'll see' it had its ups and downs. Plus was a lot less 'wokeness' than other shows. Layla was a decent character, not a Mary Sue, although her becoming an avatar in the last episode was a little much. The episode where you find out the origin of Steven was well done, but the ending left me confused and I think it was muddled. I have to say-many will disagree-I liked Hawkeye the best for the simple reason it was 100% not to be taken seriously. When the bad guys are the track suit mafia, you know its just sit back and go for a ride. I liked how Clint rescued Kate in #1(a man saving a woman in Disney?) and #2 ended with her trying to do the same and clutzing it up, these days that alone have it points. The Kingpin thing at the end was awful, but otherwise it was fun.

[@SippingVino]

@@donutguy3854 no ones gonna convince me Disney can write a better show than daredevil season 1 and 3, Emmy level writing on that show

[@oscarjimenezgarrido7591]

@@SippingVino Thanks for specifically avoiding 2. That was the worst butchering of works by top writers like Frank Miller and Garth Ennis I've seen in years, and one of the worst portrayals of Frank _"I trashed my way through a busy intensive care ward full of doctors, nurses, patients and families shooting with a 12 gauge at blurry shapes through walls and frosted glass but its awright and nobody was endangered because I'm an expect marxman ma'am"_ Castle in any medium ever.

[@maldavis369]

The glass in his shoes was penance for his past crimes. When his god came out, he talked about his penance not being enough...think he was referring to the glass in his shoes.

[@doug1066]

The only reason I watched this was for Ethan Hawke and Oscar Issacs. Both had solid performances given the weak script.

[@em0_tion]

+1 and even they couldn't make me watch more than 3 episodes of this barf-bowl.

[@auramdickerson112]

The Hippo female was of the Hathors which are a very loving and joyous bunch. She was of the more realistic portions of the show. While plenty of it was Hollywood off and wrong made for movie, some of it was kinda decent representation for theater. But yeah the whole Egyptian Gods battling eachother is not how it works.

[@InsomniacTC]

Young Rippa a few days back had a great video talking about why these naratives are the way they are and it boils down to the fact pretty much everyone seemingly who works on the show come from a broken family or in a more basic sense they have never even experienced what a healthy normal family looks like. Creatively i get that this kind of stuff is a treasure trove for origin stories and more cerebral characters but the problem is is that these people have never gotten over that and now their whole career literally hinges on them profiting from their own trauma and of course they are going to treat the narative, characters and plot structure like a bull in a china shop. For a creative mind to be boiled down to a person going "Its my mental trauma and i get to pick the coping mechanism" is depressing beyond description as someone who comes from a similar background

[@ExeErdna]

This is true, as somebody that came from that type of upbringing I don't want that to bleed into my work.

[@InsomniacTC]

@@ExeErdna Imagine a whole billion dollar industry almost soley dedicated to reinforcing that mentality. Because its quick, emotional and relates on the most surface of surface levels

[@ExeErdna]

@@InsomniacTC basically they're skipping rocks yet they wonder why few if any go far? to skip effectively needs a good stone and technique. They don't care about either, yet they're basically begging for money like they're not rich. They need to do better so people don't simply pirate the shit and move on.

[@theonlybigmorg]

i really liked the first episode, but episode 2 3 and 4 just kind of happened. episode 5 was my favorite, because it's Marc's emotional story, Steven sacrifices himself to save Marc, and that last scene with Marc standing in paradise was so beautiful it almost made me cry. but then they fucking destroy the emotional impact by playing shitty Egyptian rap music. episode 6 was so bad I almost turned it off. overall I think it was fine, just the storytelling is bad. even though the whole point was that he has two personalities and it's confusing, they manage to just butcher the plot so much that you just end up watching it for Oscar's amazing performance. I'd give Moon Knight a 6.5/10

[@jakealhalabi8194]

Episode 4 at least when the whole hospital thing happens, is probably the most engaging part of moon knight to me

[@theonlybigmorg]

@@jakealhalabi8194 nah I was just even more confused. episode 5 was the most interesting for me

[@plzletmebefrank]

6.5 out of 10 implies it's more good than bad. It's really not. It's more blah, confusing, and below average than anything else. It's not terrible, and manages to be the best Disney+ Marvel show. But... That's not a compliment. 4/10.

[@Yalbou]

The only good/great episodes are 4 and 5. The other episodes are generic marvel popcorn movies. Hard to rate this series. I will give it a 5.5 because of oscars amazing acting and those 2 great episodes

[@theonlybigmorg]

@@Yalbou episode 1 was really interesting too, it got me captivated with the show

[@JeremyTheBreadKnife]

Moonknight was pretty decent in comparison to other marvel series and movies

[@sandisrekis9878]

Lets be honest... Oscar Isaac

[@inthefade]

Testament to how bad everything else by Marvel has become rather than how good Moon Knight is.

[@devlinX]

It isn't a high bar to be fair.

[@mrhumpty]

Only because Hawke and Issac did a good job. The story was just as trash as the rest.

[@chasehedges6775]

@@devlinX 💯💯

[@Kraven83]

8:05 it is not explicitly stated but we have all the info to infer that Harrow is serving Ammit and thinks she'll immediately judge him and find him at fault. The loophole he hopes to make work is that for her pain offsets "sin" therefore he tries to accumulate pain with that torture... In the end, when she's resurrected, she states that it was indeed not enough (he's done too many evil deeds) but she has a change of heart saying that a "flawed" or unbalanced servant could be more useful than the last one who had his scales in perfect balance... and got her imprisoned for 2000 years.

[@travisoutlaw9511]

I think the glass in the shoes was a form of punishment for the "sins" he had committed in his past. The opening scene with the glass and that song playing was probably the best scene in the whole show lol

[@sriharish3552]

I was fine with Layla's character cause she was not blatantly better than moon Knight at everything and it was Moon Knight that beat everyone up brutally in that fight in the end (despite being off screen in a blackout). But there are a lot of inconsistencies that bug me. Why wasn't Jake Lockley's heart required in the weighing scale? How could harrow just easily (and off screen) demolish all the other avatars but struggle against 2? Are the other avatars just dense af? It was built as though they knew what was happening but were secretly corrupt or something, but no turns out they're just stupid. Overall, the plot was a bit lacking but not too bad 7/10.

[@Chad0023]

The heart thing really really bugged me like it didn't evem make any senses relating to that whole death storyline and also how the gods r just absent but their avatars get defeated more like 50/ 50 really.

[@AshPrimeDCFC]

I actually enjoyed Moon Knight. Interesting story and great performances. Heartbreaking at times as well. Not difficult, but by far the best Disney+ Marvel show (not counting the Netflix ones).

[@em0_tion]

Daredevil, The Falcon and the Winter Soldier, even Loki - all much greater than this show parody. There is no universe, pun intended, you can justify the stupidity in episode 4's beginning. Main character's wife dies right then and there, shot by desert goons. 🤷‍♂️ I get needless pistol cocking and no reloading, but that was just horrendous!😂

[@AshPrimeDCFC]

@@em0_tion wasn't thinking of them as forget they're Marvel, haha. Falcon? Ewwww

[@NatCatKitty]

@@em0_tion I disagree (edited list cause I saw daredevil) 1.) Daredevil (honestly feels harsh to compare the other marvel shows to this daredevil is in another league) 2.) Moonknight 3.) Loki 4.) Hawkeye 5.) WandaVision 6.) Falcon winter soldier I didn’t like the last episode of Moonknight though I thought the first 5 where really really good

[@a.d.4536]

@@em0_tion Falcon was a woke boring mess. Yuck!! Daredevil was a masterpiece though

[@NatCatKitty]

@@a.d.4536 omg just watched daredevil and it is the best tv show I’ve ever seen, im in love. 100% best marvel show blows the others out of the water

[@even_steven777]

They never outright explained it but I saw someone say he does it to prove his commitment to Ammit or something

[@jessicahogan7248]

The glass in Harrow's shoes was self-flagellation/atonement for being Moon Knight, the Gods were only to visible their avatars and Layla had fighting skills in Ep3. Marc separated from Layla for her safety but disappeared before divorcing. Layla and Marc are/ were married and still care about each other so obviously she would help, not to mention that Marc was killed so the responsibility to save the day fell to her. If nothing else she's paying him back for saving her in Ep3. Agree that knowing the chant was a little easy but I'm gonna go with Tawret was telling her the words.

[@TheSimpleMan454]

Small point on the language and speech of things from other worlds, like gods and the like: It's a blending of conceptual transference and translation convention, basically telepathy as a universal Rosetta Stone. The idea is they use your knowlege as a filter they run their ideas through to communicate with you. They know what you know, and rearrange it to mean what they want you to hear. Neil Gaiman, Kevin Hearne, and Glen Cook do a good job of explaining this (But they're competent writers so...). I take this as what modern Marvel/DC/TV writers are trying to convey, they're just lousy at it.

[@Palora01]

Also why would gods "living" in modern times NOT speak in a modern way? Especially the one god who interacts with modern people all the time?

[@SsgtDucky]

The 1st episode was the best

[@brickabang]

Agreed. I liked the mystery aspect of it

[@chasehedges6775]

💯💯💯💯💯💯💯. Agreed

[@tajaniscott]

Outside of the kaiju thing and sky thing, it’s probably the least crap. Just a bunch of missed opportunities and unexplained things

[@badbadgr5498]

I’m finding it hard to tell whether many of these things (the asylum, Jake lockley’s role in all this, etc…) is being purposefully left vague because of the psychological instability of Oscar Isaac, and we’re supposed to be wondering what’s real and what’s not. Or if the show is just badly written and makes it hard to sort out. I’d love to believe the former, but judging by the quality of other marvel shows and the fact that this is reportedly not getting a 2nd season, I would lean toward the latter

[@johndurham6172]

I was thinking more power rangers.

[@chasehedges6775]

@@badbadgr5498 💯💯💯💯💯💯👍👍👍👍👍

[@finesse1125]

I really tried to give this show the benefit of the doubt but I just couldn't care enough. Loved the premise, love Egyptian mythology stuff, but the show didn't ever feel like anything was happening.

[@volumedealer2716]

Are you re tar ded?

[@ulisesvalenzuela7667]

Jay's accent makes me smile

[@woutervanbinsbergen3368]

Point from the final episode: Marc's dead, Layla's hiding from the (maybe) 10 goons Harrow brought tot the tomb (of friggin ALEXANDER THE GREAT, pure idiocy). She kills a man behind a pillar and then impersonates him in the group? And she gets away with it until the grand pyramid? What? This was a terrorist cell structure with a small number of people: no more than 30 in total near Harrow. WHY THE F don't they recognize that there's an intruder? Also: In the heart-weighing episode, shouldn't the scales also be unbalanced by the THIRD and unknown personality, as he also has impact on everything? That personality's just tossed in in the aftercredits scene after several dumb, nonsense hints. Makes anti-sense according to the stated rules.

[@eozineable]

There were so many continuity errors, for example Layla coming into the room with dead avatars to extract the surviving one, and the next scene we see Harrow and his goons haven't left the room, so where were they when she came to save the survivor? Also how did she board the convoy that brought her there? it was a small group, and nobody asked why there was a masked woman among them all of a sudden that nobody recognized, and how did she even catch up? she was mourning Mark/Steven while they were leaving, and just casually boarded one of the 5 cars

[@Kraven83]

20:25 my head canon is that Marc creates Steve to be oblivious and still love his mother... but during the beatings it's not Marc who's present: it's the third persona, the very violent one who first endures the pain for both Marc and Steven but then reacts with the same disproportionate violence when it's needed. I also thought they were hinting that the cab driver persona killed Layla's father... i.e. still Marc but not really him. That would have shredded their relationship to bits and it would have been a cool place to go to explore both of them, the supposed good guys.

[@imotogin]

it's the next season's big reveal. it'll be Layla vs Jake to save her husband.

[@ahobbyist9520]

That's exactly what happened.

[@Rashomon69]

I think Marc created Steven to take the abuse, but then Steven created Jake. Marc knows his mom was abusive but doesn’t know how bad it was. Steven was oblivious, because he wasn’t there. That’s why he loves his mom. Jake took the full brunt of the abuse, which is why he turned into a stone cold killer.

[@AnimeSquirrel]

It's the best thing Marvel has put out since endgame, which isn't a high bar but it's something I guess.

[@bgschannel9357]

Definitely. Best thing to come out of the MCU this year

[@seansterling5322]

I saw the glass in the shoes thing as sort of a form of pain as penance for the life he lived before and during his service to Khonshu.

[@GregoryRobertsLx]

I understood the glass in Harrow's shoes as a form of penance for his past wrongs while he was the avatar of Khonshu. He was hoping that his penance would balance out his scales for Ammit.

[@rexrip1080]

Harrow puts glass in his shoes because out of all of his followers he is actually the corrupted one, his heart not being balanced the same as for Marks/ Steven, so he is kind of their reflection, only pushed to the extreme. Everything he is doing in the show is because he is trying to correct his own soul before he gets judged and that is also a reason he is chosen as the avatar in the end. Outside of that, Layla is a bit of a Marry Sue, but also gets punched in a face a bunch of times and is used as a motivation for Mark/ Steven to get their shit together, as are they for her. I honestly do not agree with you on this one. The show is basic, granted, the SCG is a bit shit, but is far from bad. Besides, it is not fair to talk shit about something that you did not try to actually understand or even watch through the end. Also, I would suggest "that dirty black bag", am not really into Westerns but God damn, that shit is good!

[@peterscott2662]

I think you guys have it turned around. Steven is the milquetoast. Mark is professional mercenary, that comes out and lays the beat downs, and Mark knows the Mom was abusive, and Stephen is the sheltered one, who doesn't know about his moms abuse. So that kind of lines up. Except for the third one, that neither of them know about, who is even more badass than Mark.

[@TheGavrael]

I think it’s a plot hole from bad writing. The first time we see Steven it seems like it is right before the mom busts in the lay down a beating, but we don’t see what happens. It’s like Marc wanted out of a bad situation. How Steven couldn’t hear his mom screaming at him is weird. I think you are right that it was intended to be that way, but the origin of Steven just doesn’t make sense in that context. So, I blame bad writing.

[@mfchimichanga]

Someone saw Legion and thought, "I could do that". But then they realized they really couldn't.

[@fly1714]

Moon Knight was at least a 7/10 on a Disney show that i can say is a 7 without my head turning in on itself with its flaws like with Loki.

[@abraxas4261]

If anyone is interested in a story that does this premise well, then they should read 'The Kane Chronicles'. However, it is a children's book series, so don't expect the writing to be all that intricate. Speaking of Riordan's works, that new Percy Jackson series on Disney Plus looks like it'll be shit.

[@paladinshark2448]

The Kane chronicles explicitly address the problem of the gods that theh brought up too. The Egyptian gods *are* absurdly powerful and smart, but are way, way more enigmatic and alien than the Greek and Norse pantheons. They limited in their mortal appearance by just how dangerous they are, and have to incarnate in a limited form. Really felt unique compared to Percy Jackson, the gods felt like genuine deities and eldritch beings beyond our comprehension, only appearing as and communicating as mortals when absolutely necessary.

[@amogus1415]

@@paladinshark2448 except dont they joke around with mortals,like set does it in the second book?

[@paladinshark2448]

@@amogus1415 Set is explicitly an outlier. He’s the god of chaos and a metaphor for the unpredictable desert sands after all. Even his joking and trickster methods are almost all for either seemingly unintelligible purposes, or malicious ones. Even when he’s being a snark he’s an alien weirdo.

[@amogus1415]

@@paladinshark2448 eh,i dont know you dont really get joker vibes from him

[@IchigoKurosaki_]

Still better than dr strange 😂😂

[@JayVicky007]

Hehe, no, it's not. But they're both bad.

[@TheAmbientMage]

Wandavision 2 was better than Moon Knight. It had a ton of problems but it was definitely better.

[@mjy]

Regarding the after-credits scene, we also got to 'meet' the 3rd alternate personality inhabiting Mark/Steven... the one who was apparently responsible for some of the blackout carnage that Mark/Steven couldn't explain.

[@inventgineer]

My take on the whole "glass in the shoes" for Ethan Hawke's character (already don't remember his name lol) was that it was his own personal form of atonement, especially for the killings he did while he was Khonsu's avatar but perhaps also for whatever other crimes he perceives in himself now that he is Judge Judy's avatar. I kept assuming, for the first few episodes, that it was going to be revealed that Khonsu had allowed someone Ethan Hawke loved (wife, kids, mom, etc) to die, by not punishing the people responsible until after the event had happened. After all, they had a BUUUUNCH of lines by Ethan Hawke where he beats that horse dead: "Judge Judy is way betar cuz she doesn't WAIT til AFTER bad stuff" and "I will never forgive khonsu" and stuff. So the whole glass in his shoes was a way to be in constant discomfort and be atoning for the parts of himself that were evil, possibly because Judge Judy expected that sorta shit from her avatars, but also I thought largely as a personal atonement for serving the wrong god and letting the people he loved die..... .........NOPE, nothing cool or logical like that, just NO explanation, NO payoff, big ol Chekhov's gun misfire X'D.