EG4 12000XP off grid inverter follow up and Q&A

In this video I describe how to achieve the 24kw solar input on the EG4 12000xp. I answer some questions I received from my previous video on the inverter, and also do further testing.
Assistant editor Tabitha Stone
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Affiliate links:
Signature Solar’s link to the 12000xp
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Current Connected’s link. It should qualify for free shipping in November.
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Here is a link to the 4/2 combiner box from watts247 watts247.com/p...
1000 amp Overkill solar bus bar/terminal blocks I was using in the video.
Link to the Sirius Solar panels I mentioned in the video signaturesolar...
overkillsolar....
Ferrule crimping tool kit with a kit
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Ferrule kit with 2/0 for battery cables
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#18kpv
#12000Xp

[@GavinStoneDIY]

I forgot to mention this in the video, but for those of you that don’t need to reach that 24kw limit in solar, you could easily reach 16-18kw without any combiner boxes or extra wiring. Affiliate links: Signature Solar’s link to the 12000xp signaturesolar.com/eg4-12000xp-off-grid-inverter-48v-split-phase-24kw-pv-input-12kw-power-output/?ref=mpmddlkx6M9tPo&XP%20Inverter%20Launch&Homepage%2011%2F1&Homepage%20banner%2011%2F1 Current Connected’s link. www.currentconnected.com/product/eg4-12000xp-48v-split-phase-off-grid-inverter/?ref=xhJJBPDS

[@hendersonsobers396]

Great video Gavin. You've made combiner boxes relevant again.

[@GavinStoneDIY]

Yeah maybe they’ll come back into style. 😎

[@northidahodreaming5657]

Well done! Appreciate the idea to max the PV input

[@MelvinBernard-f8e]

Hey, good evening watching you guys from Jamaica what’s your video all the time and you explain a whole lot of people to understand so thank you for that man learn a lot from your video. All right keep it up man good work.

[@GavinStoneDIY]

Really appreciate that. Thank you.

[@CountryLivingExperience]

Thanks for covering these things Gavin

[@GavinStoneDIY]

Sure thing. This is really what I enjoy. And it makes things much easier when the equipment is built nicely like this.

[@Solar_and_Security]

Combiner Box Video, yup, absolutely, Its the "last" project on my system, I've yet to tackle... Thanks Gavin!

[@exploitthechildless1510]

Thanks for including the data on AC Coupling. A bunch of us have grid-tie inverters

[@GavinStoneDIY]

Yeah that’s a real game changer for some people. Having the option was a great idea on EG4’s part.

[@BigSil57]

Great video. And like others, thanks for the AC coupling info.

[@cyumadbrosummit3534]

The 1200xp is such a good unit, Ive been using my smart load to "dump" excess solar daily into an EV without touching anything. I have also been able to crank my biggest 240v Mig welder to max output without even having the cooling fans kick on ( @ 131 battery amps continuous). I didnt know the smart load would take power in as well as output, if I hooked into line power to take advantage of grid tied solar.

[@OutOfTheForestWoodWorking]

A shockingly good video… Nice to see how to push the limits.. If you have the cycles a combiner box video would be great. I just currently run the solar output to the 18kpv DC cutoff switch. Thanks again..

[@GavinStoneDIY]

“Shockingly” I see what you did there. 🤓

[@Works504]

Great info! Id appreciate a vid on a combiner box for setting up panels with this 12000xp. I unfortunately have a bunch of new old 300watt usa made panels to run with a 12000xp on order. Funny how it takes lil talent to series panels but the benefits of installing series is labor & parts savings. I know something like 25 30 volts dc welds 1/2" thick steel, it always concerned me to series panels to high voltage and not much in the way of fuse safety especially ontop 2 story metal roof😅

[@GavinStoneDIY]

For sure. I’m going to plan on a combiner box video. I’m actually looking forward to it. I think it’ll be fun to make.

[@Langelierdesigns]

What a great unit! I want one!

[@Waldoe16]

Great video! I was doing the math yesterday for fun and came to the same conclusions as you with 9 panel strings and combiner box. I wonder...no light flicker right? I agree with the end of video, running at the limit watts is bad, specially with inductive loads and limited surge capacity because the inverter is already maxed. In my house we have a Sol-Ark 8K and we peak at 3500-3700 watts, very rarely 4000w+ and never have reached 6000w.

[@GavinStoneDIY]

Exactly yeah. Zero light flicker that I’ve observed. Very stable output. Seems to be a very tough design. I noticed the same with the 6000xp’s. These off grid inverters weren’t designed to pull from the grid to balance loads like a hybrid. So they are tough as nails when it comes to inductive loads.

[@XcessCapital]

This is the EXACT video I've been trying to find. I'm trying to understand how to get to as close to the 24k watts without going over the 480 volts. What's unclear to me now though is what is happening in the combiner box. If 2 strings are coming in at approx 370 volts, what is happening on the output? Thanks for the great info so far!

[@GavinStoneDIY]

@@XcessCapital yeah I’m going to be making my combiner box video next. It just takes me a while to get things done with my actual job also. The output of the combiner box would be 2 strings in parallel. So the amperage would raise, but the voltage would brain the same.

[@felipeherdoiza32]

Grreat video! Gavin can the 12000xp use Gen Boost?

[@GavinStoneDIY]

Yes it has the Gen boost option.

[@christophermaroney]

Gavin, thanks for the great video. You mention that larger generators can plug in directly to 12000xp, in your opinion would that include a 14kw Kohler? Thanks

[@GavinStoneDIY]

Yeah usually the larger whole house units have lower THD numbers. So they can hook directly to the inverter without any issues.

[@simon359]

I would love to see how you wire a combiner box. I tried to do this early on when I was first starting and I couldn’t get more than one string to work? I eventually gave up and just ran each string separately to my charge controllers!

[@GavinStoneDIY]

I will be adding that to my video schedule then for sure. I remember when I first started out, it seemed pretty confusing.

[@mattcwagner]

@GavinStoneDIY , do you happen to know at what point the fans kick on for PV input wattage? I have a 6000xp in the basement, and the fans are pretty loud when taking in anything more than 2000w of PV.

[@GavinStoneDIY]

@@mattcwagner I haven’t hit that threshold with the 12,000xp. But my guess would be the same as the output wattage. So around 6kw before the fans start to ramp up.

[@offgridwanabe]

When you AC couple a solar array it comes in AC and when you bring in PV it comes in in DC so my question is can you bring in more than the 24000 watts when you use the ac coupling and the DC strings into the pv ports?

[@GavinStoneDIY]

The unit will only bring in what it needs either way. So it can output and charge at 250 amps. So it wouldn’t need to pull anything further from the panels beyond that point. So I guess the answer to your question is technically no. It wouldn’t need it.

[@bearupfarm1818]

How do you wire both inverter parallel out to the main panel.

[@GavinStoneDIY]

@@bearupfarm1818 are you referring to connecting the inverters output to a sub panel?

[@bearupfarm1818]

Yes,

[@GavinStoneDIY]

@@bearupfarm1818 you can either combine the outputs in a small box first, or feed each to a breaker in the sub panel.

[@Bgoffgrid3634]

When would you use the 1200XP versus the 12KPV?

[@GavinStoneDIY]

@@Bgoffgrid3634 the 12kpv’s continuous output is actually 8kw. So that’s something to keep in mind. If you needed hybrid features like net metering or grid interactivity then I would go with the 12kpv or 18kpv. They both don’t need air filters and are outdoor rated also. The 12,000xp is an off grid work horse. So you can use the grid as a backup. You just won’t have those same standard hybrid features.

[@Bgoffgrid3634]

@ that makes sense now. Thanks for the great videos!

[@kenmcclure5623]

Is it possible to have the generator supply 240v to handle and arc welder and air compressor if the battery system is not large enough to handle the demand? Thanks

[@GavinStoneDIY]

It depends on the amperage those are pulling. If you don’t have enough battery then the unit will be limited. It can’t blend generator and battery together.

[@SolarinStarke-kt2lm]

I guess I don’t fully understand what happens when panels are paralleled…I thought the amperage had to match? In your scenario one string is 13 amps and the other is 26 amps. I understand voltage stays the same but do all amps just stack up? Regardless of panel type? Assuming relatively same voltage?

[@GavinStoneDIY]

@@SolarinStarke-kt2lm this scenario would assume all panels have the same spec per mppt input.

[@SolarinStarke-kt2lm]

@ right but you are feeding one side of the MPPT with roughly 24 amps and the other side ( I assume you meant the other side of same mPPT) with 13 amps. I thought you could only combine same numbers 12 and 12 amps for 24 or 10 and 10 for 20 that’s what confused me.

[@GavinStoneDIY]

@@SolarinStarke-kt2lm technically mppt 1 has 2 separate inputs. And mppt 2 has 2 inputs also. So 4 inputs, 2 mppt’s. So that’s to allow a scenario like this. It’s specifically for paralleling strings of solar. So technically you could combine them all out in a separate combiner box and send one string in with 30-35 amps worth of solar to each unit. But this allows you to send 2 strings in and it’ll combine them for you.

[@bobcole3852]

Do you use extra filters on the inverters?

[@GavinStoneDIY]

No. I’d be worried it would limit air flow.

[@moxrobin]

In your hypothetical could you combine all three sets of 9 panels into 1 set coming to the 12,000xp? And have two of those totalling roughly 22,000w?

[@GavinStoneDIY]

You could yeah. It would just require a second combiner box. I believe a 6-1 combiner would work. That’s 3 strings combined into one. And you’d need another box also for the second string. On the other hand that would save you from running more strings if you have a bit of a longer stretch to your inverter.

[@wbarkwell]

Gavin, can the 12000XP be configured like a UPS where the primary feed to the critical load panel is the grid (as well as charging the batteries) but it will fail over to all battery when the grid is down ? No solar would be involved for this question. One other question - has Eg4 explained why they changed the screen on this inverter ?

[@GavinStoneDIY]

Honestly haven’t thought about this before. It could probably be wired in some way to achieve this. But I haven’t pondered it long enough. I don’t think it would be a standard option like it is with hybrid units like the 18kpv. EG4 didn’t go into detail on the screen change. Honestly it’s easier to navigate than the 6000xp. So it’s a step up in that regard.

[@wbarkwell]

@ Does it look like “AC CHARGE” Operating mode work ? If it does, then what happens when the grid is down?

[@GavinStoneDIY]

@@wbarkwell ac charge does work yeah. It would just be a matter of where the output of the inverter is going. It would continue to power your critical loads panel for sure. So in that sense it could be a UPS for your critical loads panel. I was just thinking more along the lines of your other loads.

[@electromechanicalstuff2602]

Will this inverter bypass to grid when overloaded or just shut down when overloaded? What is the process to manually bypass?

[@GavinStoneDIY]

Yes it will automatically bypass to grid when overloaded if grid is available. Manual bypass could be done a few different ways. You could install a bypass switch.

[@johnlegere478]

The eg4 6000 xp can take in up to 10k watts input

[@GavinStoneDIY]

It can be over paneled to 10kw for sure. But usable solar input is 8kw.

[@aaroncottrill7426]

When using gen was it showing almost a 200w loss?

[@GavinStoneDIY]

Yeah it’s likely just a discrepancy between the input and output. Although it might be accounting for the efficiency loss. That might be some of it.

[@Works504]

Are these manufactured by Midea I wonder? Seems like Mr cool & others outdoor units that look similar with same metal stamped cases and blue fan blades are Midea? Local old time hvac guy here in New Orleans swore by Japanese stuff for years now he's all about Midea.

[@GavinStoneDIY]

The inverter? Fairly certain thats a no.

[@jetkrazee]

Hey Gavin, does it have blending capability? I think that is the correct terminology. Still learning, LOL

[@GavinStoneDIY]

It isn’t grid interactive like a hybrid no. So it’s either grid or solar/battery. Although if you are in grid bypass then solar can still charge the batteries.

[@jetkrazee]

@@GavinStoneDIY so "grid interactive" is where a hybrid inverter can use partial grid and partial solar/battery simultaneously?

[@GavinStoneDIY]

@@jetkrazee exactly. Hybrids come with CT’s (current transformers). Those track the exact amount of current the grid is using so the inverter can supplement as needed. Plus they are able to match the exact phase of the grid. Without those features it wouldn’t be safe. Which is why they describe the 12000xp and 6000xp as “off grid” inverters. They can use the grid to charge or as a bypass. But they aren’t meant to interact directly with it like a hybrid. So on the plus side that does keep the cost of the equipment down.

[@jetkrazee]

@@GavinStoneDIY awesome information man. I appreciate it very much! I assume many hybrids such as the NHX 10K and 12K can be programmed for different thresholds on amp draw from the grid if so desired?

[@GavinStoneDIY]

@ yes indeed. The NHx series and the EG4 18k and 12kpv. You can choose how much they’ll give or take from the grid. And even what time they do. And of course they also have the option of selling back to the grid with a net metering agreement. It’s really nice to have those features.

[@percival23]

I need some help with an hybrid inverter. I want to have my home office (that has lots of electronics) run on Solar power. I need to have solar priority so when when the batteries get down to say 25%, AC power kicks in and keeps the batteries charged up to say 50% ..but will fully charge when solar kicks back in during the day. Which inverters can do this? Thanks for any help you can give me.

[@GavinStoneDIY]

@@percival23 you have a lot more versatility with the 12kpv and 18kpv. They will a have a lot more options. So it depends on your loads, but the 12kpv would probably work really well for you.

[@SeleneHammer-pn8hr]

Doesn't the xp have 3 mppts?

[@GavinStoneDIY]

@@SeleneHammer-pn8hr no. Just 2 really. 4 inputs with 2 mppts.

[@maxgor7959]

Did you experience a warning 28 error? This inverter has a false EPS overload error that hasn't been fixed yet.

[@GavinStoneDIY]

@@maxgor7959 I still haven’t seen this edit myself no. But I’ve read some comments from people online that have. EG4 has said they are nearly done with a firmware that rectifies this issue.

[@juanmedinar20]

Why can't it feed your entire main panel instead of a subpanel? The hybrid invertor has the capability of sending power back to the grid but I don't want that. I want to run this system in "self consumption" mode; in which I use solar first, then battery and if those cannot keep up I use the grid but running my entire panel.

[@GavinStoneDIY]

These are technically off grid inverters. The 12kpv and 18kpv are hybrids. The grid and this inverter can’t be hooked to the same panel in that way. This doesn’t have CT’s, so it can’t sync phases with the grid power. So you can’t have the output and input of the inverter running to the same panel. Unless of course you had a disconnect on the grid and you manually disconnect it in order to use the inverter. But then you wouldn’t be using the automatic transfer switch that the inverter has. I explained this in more detail in my 6000 xp wiring guide video. The easiest way to utilize inverters like this is with a sub panel dedicated to all your loads you want to run off solar.

[@juanmedinar20]

@@GavinStoneDIY I wired my Anker Solix F3800 with HPP with a manual interlock in which I have to the Anker "backup" off when the grid is up. If grid power goes down I turn off the main breaker for the house, the breaker that powers the Anker "Anker Grid" and turn on the "Backup Anker" breaker. I do lose the automatic switch over to battery but it takes 2 minutes to move the interlock and flip the breakers. I run the Anker in self consumption mode and I don't think is a big deal to not have the automatic switch over. It is also way cheaper because I don't have a subpanel and rather be able to power everything in my house then just a few items. My parents just purchased the 12000xp with the EG4 280AH battery and they want to do something similar. Thanks.

[@GavinStoneDIY]

@@juanmedinar20 yeah the sub panel could get pricey if it’s a long way from the grid panel. Otherwise it’s not too expensive really. If someone is comfortable doing the labor you could do it for less than $400 usually. It just makes it so much nicer with everything automatically backed up. That way if you do overload things it will just automatically kick things back to grid. But the interlock is always an option also. And in the future you could move the loads over to a sub panel if you’re feeling spunky.

[@flopackrc5452]

I thought 6xp takes in 10k

[@GavinStoneDIY]

It can be over paneled for sure. But it can utilize 8kw of solar.