Elden Ring Lore | The Godskin God Hunt and Destined Death

[@SmoughTown]

What do you think about the Godskin God Hunt? Hit me up below with your theories!

[@auto1nfanticid3]

i thought your obvious conclusion was going to be that the gloam eyed queen was Fia. is there something that excludes her from this role? she is the one who leads you to the lord of dusk ending.

[@SmoughTown]

@@auto1nfanticid3 Hey happy to explain my opinion - Fia is simply a tarnished, Gloam-eyed queen is an Empyrean. She also has no ties to being 'gloam-eyed' and in addition she has he own seperate backstory as a death bed companion, rather than any hints that she has been anything else. She also venerates the prince of death, rather than seizing power for herself - based off the other empyrean's we see in game, I wouldn't see her serving a demi-god.

[@chrispalmer6804]

@@SmoughTown what about the god skin that's at the bottom of caelid divine tower though?

[@SmoughTown]

​@@chrispalmer6804 so presumably he is guarding the Godslayer Greatsword - a relic of his queen but in all honesty I just don't find that placement as interesting.

[@chrispalmer6804]

@@SmoughTown well add to that that caelid has dragons that could be a reason as well ^^

[@cosmicmelon9305]

"To truly know someone, skin them, then walk a mile in their feet." -Some Godskin Noble at some point

[@largecupenjoyer1459]

their feet 🤤🤤

[@TheLordNovo]

@@largecupenjoyer1459 yes officer, this post right here. You are clear for weapons free

[@mrbigglezworth42]

"It puts the lotion on its skin, or else it gets the hose again"

[@geraldyeager7652]

@@largecupenjoyer1459 Mizyaki

[@TheActualMrLink]

Jesus.

[@Thegamblerino]

Great analysis. Only thing i would point out is that the appearence of the godskin noble and apostle resemble more that of a serpent than a dragon. In elden ring dragons have a really "rocky" aesthetic. The tail on the godskin noble seems more like a serpent to me. Also the "rubber" attack from the apostle is nearly identical to the one of the man serpents in volcano manor strengthening the link between the cult and the location.

[@SmoughTown]

Yeh fair on that one was defo torn between serpent and dragon!

[@nunull6427]

Dead ass I thought the noble was just a snake wearing a suit of skin. Even pulls it's tail in and out, specifically the wheel/beyblade of flesh move. Just imagined a snake coiled around inside like a wheel spinning.

[@TechNinjaSigma]

@@nunull6427 oh god, that sounds perfect, the apostles are younger and therefor shorter, and the nobles are longer so they're coiled up and look fat! ECH!!!

[@imethdup5050]

I never even put the slinky attack of the apostle and man serpents together holllly shit that makes total sense

[@Sylentmana]

@@nunull6427 I thought they were a race of lizard people.

[@verybrownsalmon]

The cool thing about Rykard’s design and his alliance with Godskins is the fact, that his body includes flayed bodies of his victims, with no skin

[@Ghghghghgh-]

So he take bodies and they take skin?

[@asdergold1]

Then there's the armor you find in his arena.

[@michaelwerkov3438]

@@asdergold1 whats the armor?

[@asdergold1]

@@michaelwerkov3438 armor from one of Gideon's men.

[@willostrand6555]

@@asdergold1what’s the connection to Sir Gideon Ofnir the AllKnowing?

[@m.a.dmatt6689]

Imagine if there is a dlc ending where we engulf the Erdtree in blackflames, how awesome would that scenery be

[@Entropy67]

The destined death ending is the ranni one if im not mistaken... unfortunately no black fire burning tree 😫

[@holaamigo7138]

@@Entropy67 nah she has the age of stars ending. Destined death ending comes from fia

[@Vanlifecrisis]

The age of stars brings destined death in a more indirect way. Ranni removes all the supernatural shit from the world so people will live and die normally.

[@jessenelson4154]

I was just talking to someone about how I want a Blasphemy ending, where instead of fixing the elden ring with any of the mending runes or choosing Ranni’s, or even burning everything away with the frenzied flame, we set out on the path of blasphemy and seek to consume the world as lord Rykard wanted to do

[@m.a.dmatt6689]

@@jessenelson4154 That might be possible with how Patches and Tanith quest is left hanging atm

[@ajbolt7]

To me it’s clear that Destined Death was NOT affiliated with any other Outer Gods. It was 100% of the Greater Will, the fact that the rune came from the Elden Ring itself confirms this to me.

[@magvad6472]

The Elden Ring predates the Greater Will. Death existed prior to the Greater Will's arrival and influence. The Greater Will, through Marika, attempted to stop death to allow for an eternal reign. The Greater Will as an embodiment of order would of course want to destroy death because death breaks cycles and cycles allow for change to power.

[@ajbolt7]

​@@magvad6472 We have it in writing that "the Greater Will sent a golden star bearing a beast into the Lands Between, which would later become the Elden Ring". That pretty explicitly disproves your statement. Do we have any source indicating otherwise? Anything saying that the Elden Ring predates the Greater Will?

[@magvad6472]

@@ajbolt7 We also have it in writing that "The Dragonlord whose seat lies at the heart of the storm beyond time is said to have been Elden Lord in the age before the Erdtree. Once his god was fled, the lord continued to await its return." That god was not the Greater Will. This is from Dragonlord Plac. Rememberance. What denotes the Elden Lord is the owner of the Elden Ring...that being BECAME the Elden Ring, personified...sure...but how? We don't know, we certainly know it existed prior to the Erdtree and prior to the Greater Will.

[@ajbolt7]

​@@magvad6472 The problem here is that we don't have a clear idea of what denotes the Elden Lord. However, we do know that ownership of the Elden Ring is not what makes an Elden Lord, see Godfrey as an example of this. As such there is no concrete association between the Dragonlord + its god and the Elden Ring. Also I feel I forgot to highlight this in my first response to you: Remember we're talking about DESTINED Death, not just Death. But either way the case you mentioned with the age of the dragons and Placidusax--those dragons were said to be immortal. Without death. This being prior to the Elden Beast, and Elden Ring's, arrival. And one more thing: Marika was acting against the Greater Will when she attempted to "stop death". Destined Death was a part of the Greater Will's order.

[@francescofrancescato1251]

@@ajbolt7 👍🏻

[@flobbingmaster]

Melina seems a pretty good candidate to have been the gloam-eyed queen. The game tells us Marika warred with the gloam-eyed queen, but that doesn't actually exclude the possibility that it could have been her own daughter. Melinas name is quite similar to the other children of Marika x Radagon: Malenia and Miquella. My theory is that Melina was also born by Marika x Radagon. And like her other self born children, she was born with power. Malenia was born with the scarlet rot, Miquella was born with eternal youth and a kind of bewitching ability, and Melina was born with the black flame and destined death. Melina says she was given purpose by her mother in the Erdtree long ago, and i see no real other possibility than that referring to Marika. She also says she lost her purpose long ago, and that she is now burned and bodyless. Loosing her purpose could easily refer to her defeat to Maliketh and the sealing of destined death, since that was what she was born to wield. And while i don't have an exact theory of why she would be burned, it definitely aligns with an association with the black flame. Maybe after destined death was sealed, she lost control of the power of the black flame and it burned her, just like Malenias body is slowly consumed by the rot, so we know they aren't necessarily protected from their powers. This theory definitely leans in the direction of destined death being an outer god thing like the scarlet rot, but we also don't know if Miquellas power was originally connected to an outer god (the formless mother he's connected to at the time of the game is something Mohg connected him to after kidnapping him i believe). Big point in favor of Melina being the gloam-eyed queen is also the frenzied flame ending. Her opened eye is definitely very "gloamy", and she says she will deliver to the player character destined death, which is explicitly the power of the Gloam eyed Queen, which we just defeated Maliketh to unseal. The mark over her closed eye before this is also shaped like the claws of a beast, hinting at her defeat at the hands of Maliketh. Lastly, the fact that she's so eager to be the sacrifice to burn the Erdtree hints at her nature as a bringer death to the age of the Erdtree. She says the world is in dire need of death indiscriminate, which as you point out in the video is likely what destined death is. But she's not just some world ending death bringer. Her purpose was always just to make sure nothing could avoid death forever. Like the gods and the Erdtree, hence the godskins and their specific hunting of gods, immortal beings under the golden order of the Erdtree and the Elden Ring. This is why she abandons you when you take the frenzied flame, because she's not actually interested in just burning everything away, she just wants to make sure the cycle of life and death continues, and doesn't stagnate in immortality. So that's my theory, but there's nothing really definitive, just a lot of questions that seem to point to the same answer. But feel free to tear the theory apart if something seems way off Also: i love that the kids of Marika and Radagon, which is definitely some kind of weird incest, results in children with MAJOR issues stemming from their powers. I feel like i can see the hand of George R.R. Martin in their tragic existences

[@Lithiumc]

I've seen the idea that Melina = Gloam-Eyed Queen thrown around a lot; I think this comment is maybe the best summary of this theory I've read so far.

[@flobbingmaster]

@@Lithiumc thanks a lot ^^ I think it's a really interesting mystery in the games lore with what we know right now. With lots of hints that may point to it, and it can answer quite a few questions if true (especially about Melina). But nothing definitive states it, so it's really about piecing things together and seeing if you can build a solid case for it's truthfulness

[@Simo3311]

Great theory

[@forrest3867]

I’d lean to say that this isn’t even a theory- the evidence overwhelmingly supports the idea. I could confidently say that she is the gloam-eyed Queen.

[@Mateussssss1]

You can summon melina to fight mogott and she never uses black flame tho

[@leoornstein3963]

Volcano manor lore: amazing atmosphere, well crafted story. Volcano manor gameplay: are you ready to have a really bad time!

[@wyvurn11977]

Fr Rykard was easily the most annoying boss I’ve killed so far Edit: Now it’s the Fire Giant

[@randomheadshot4291]

@@wyvurn11977 in my opinion, he was super easy, but not at all enjoyable because it more or less forces you to use a specific weapon they give you for that specific fight and then it performs not as good in any other fight (since it loses all the range you need to hit the boss)

[@walterclements3164]

honestly, I hate when fromsoft reuses cheese or bullshit mechanics from their previous games just because le epic references are part of their brand. I didn't know about storm ruler and yhorm the giant was one of my favorite fights. His moves were badass and fast, yet telegraphed pretty well and his health pool was enormous, but it made sense because he was a giant and literally a one man army. Radahn captures the same spirit pretty well, but I feel like if I used storm ruler I would've easily forgotten about yhorm. Rykard's storm spear or whatever it's called feels like reaching the end of a castlevania game and dracula has a weapon in his throne room that lets you kill him in 3 hits because he conveniently forgot to hide it in the 10,000 years he has sat in the same castle.

[@user-ns4zm8qe9p]

@@walterclements3164 it looks cool though

[@crawlingchaos2811]

@@walterclements3164 agreed but rykards knight left it for you to kill rykard

[@SaintHanger]

Anyone notice the change of voice with the description of some godskin items, the great thrusting sword supposedly “thrusts faster than the eye can see” even though it does so at a pretty standard rate. The passages reek of arrogant classist tones, like the nobles themselves wrote their descriptions.

[@Legacy0901]

Good observation, a LOT of the lore is difficult to properly parse because every single piece of information you get is tainted by the bias of whomever is narrating. This style of information delivery works with NPCs because you know exactly who is giving the information, but it can get pretty murky with item descriptions since they are infuriatingly vague on their source. Sometimes it seems like the source of the description is the item itself, like how incantations have a bias towards the Golden Order and sorceries have a bias towards the academy or how the sword you mentioned has an aristocratic bias. In a future Souls game I'd love to see descriptions come from a consistent source to remove that extra guesswork, we even already kind of have that type of character already established with Sir Gideon

[@AreGeeBee]

Well, the nobles themselves do have that lightspeed jab combo...

[@nebelrebel1557]

Bro they literally jabbed at me till I died and it took like 4 seconds. They definitely go fast

[@brendanjoyce645]

@@nebelrebel1557 yeah but that kinda confirms what op was saying if it’s noticeable when it’s being used and obvious when your being attacked by it why stroke the ego even more by saying exactly what it does in the description

[@agnihistoria7951]

@@brendanjoyce645 Umm I think that is the case, many seem to forget we are kind of demi/god level beings...so normally I don't think it would be notable but we are legit op from a lore perspective.

[@adamfowler350]

The godskin apostles are definitely one of the games most provocative enemies.. Their higher than average difficulty with their theme track made the encounter very unsettling for me.

[@dannywest8843]

100000000%

[@alanoreilly8370]

The skinning of the Albunarics in my view was to grant the wearer more Arcane stats (the Albunaric mask grants 5 arcane points). This in turn raises holy defence, which in turn is a great defence against the Gods. I think the mask we find is a crude first attempt by Rykard at creating his own 'godskin' armour. Rykard in my opinion reaches out to Godskins to perfect the skinning off the Albunarics. This Arcane enhancement granted by Albunaric skin may even suggest the reason for their creation within the eternal city to begin with?

[@Gary_a_normal_human_being]

Interesting idea

[@RAREBASEDGOD]

Makes sense that there's so many imprisoned Albunarics in Volcano Manor too 🤔

[@doppie1677]

All this about the importance of destined death reaffirms to me how simultaneously badass and tragic Maliketh’s character. He was able to defeat the dusk eyed queen who apparently had this army of literal god slayers at her heed and call, and yet he was still blamed and betrayed by Marina for all his loyalty in the end.

[@DrCaesars]

He wasn't necessarily betrayed, but he was blamed for the loss of the Rune of Death which was his fault. He is remorseful and ashamed for his failure, which is why he hides it within his flesh and masquerades as the Beast Clergyman.

[@doppie1677]

@@DrCaesars I still personally see it as a betrayal, he had been fiercely loyal to Marika and she likely spurned him for the death rune being stolen from him, turning her back on him in his time of need as it seems she does pretty commonly with the entire world in the rest of the lore

[@doppie1677]

@@Tatopotatos yeah that’s true, but it wasn’t like he meant to, it was literally just stolen from him, it isn’t like he loaned Destined Death to Ranni, it was out of his control and by the time he was any the wiser it was too late

[@petercottantail7850]

@@doppie1677 well we dont know how ranni actually obtained it, the fact he feels so bad about it feels like he may have let his guard down around her since she "hypothetically" was trustworthy in some shape or form.

[@dangerouslydubiousdoubleda9821]

@@DrCaesars Marika was a bitch for treating Maliketh like that. He literally defeated one of your biggest threats a fcuking empryean who wielded god killing flame AND HER army, and your gonna throw away someone so powerful and dutiful as Maliketh???? betray him? and leave him heartbroken. Literally anyone else woulda fucking died.

[@lucasvhinever2817]

I think that Melina is the Gloam Eyed Queen. When u get the Franzied ending her closed eye opens and seams rather foggy, like dusk or Gloam. Plus, she has burned hands even before she uses the Ember to burn the Erdtree. And she wanted to get to the capital to talk to her mother. And Marika is the only Goddess that has children. Melina prob was the first Emperyan in line to be the Successor and Marika didn't wanted to lose her daughter (we saw what she did to not let Godwyj die). And i think she and Ranni are either very close, or even Twins, the lore has a lot of twins and duality, wouldn't put past them. Specially with the closed eyes similarities with Ranni

[@SmoughTown]

My fave candidate of the characters in game

[@mkhazard]

I think Melina is Ranni's daughter, Ranni got some relationship with Torrent.

[@maxeon0937]

But Ranni isn't Marika's child.

[@lucasvhinever2817]

@@maxeon0937 u see, she kinda is, she kinda isn't. I don't wanna explain for fear of spoiling. If u want to know or are more ahead in the game tell me and I'll explain

[@maxeon0937]

@@lucasvhinever2817 No. I already spoiled myself. You're theorizing that Melina is Marika's child. Ranni on the other hand is confirmed to be Rennala's child. Therefore the only way they could be sibling would be if Melina was a child of Rennala, which very likely isn't the case.

[@nathanjennings8362]

Ironically, the first time I went to Windmill Village, I fought all those creepy old ladies as a no-gear male character. You really brought to light such an incredible lore perspective on something I accidently role-played into. 👍

[@OfficialChrissums]

bear in mind it doesnt say the gloam eyed queen was chosen by the TWO fingers, just the fingers. It was before the severing of the 3 fingers, which i believe represent the other half of the cycle in the flame of frenzy. Frenzy is implied to be essentially chaos. Unrestricted formless change. Order is represented by the two fingers and is unchanging stagnancy. A full hand, with both evenly balanced, represents the natural state of the world and creation. I think the greater will is an outside force trying to impose perfect order on creation, and it required the erdtree and the severing of the three fingers to achieve this. during the final boss fight you can see the trunks of dozens of other erd trees, built in different realms of creation (imo). Its trying to conquer the realms of reality and is using perfect order to achieve this.

[@tsunderetsunami9111]

Sounds good, been thinking hard on Ash Lake from DS1 as the “trees” (probably) connect all

[@excaligaming2435]

I had a similar idea like this, but it's hard to add up. We would need to know, who came first: Fingers or Greater Will. I am kinda sure it's The Greater Will, that would mean it originally embodied the "whole hand" before, meaning it would have needed to split itself at some point. But why? The manifestation in form of The Elden Ring originally was completed with Destined Death in place, meaning it became stagnant the moment it was removed. The whole "finger" thing is so in the dark anyways. Like what the hell are they anyways? They don't seem to be direct manifestations of The Greater Will, because why would they clearly guide you from the beginning of the game, making you collect all the parts of the Elden Ring, just to let stand outside the door in the rain with all it's pieces in hand.

[@jacobbachman4014]

3 fingers are not chaos. They are entropy. “Reducing all to one”

[@jacobbachman4014]

@@excaligaming2435 fingers are basically the greater will’s messengers, like angels. 3 fingers could be an analogy for satan.

[@NuclearRizzicist]

I fully believe the other Erd Trees in the Elden Beast arena are the trees closest to the Elden Ring, being the heart of Ash Lake, and the further off trees that are more natural colored are lands farther beyond. Each Tree leads to a different world, and at the top of each Tree is that worlds dreamscape, tying in Bloodbornes shop at the top of the tree in the Hunters Dream. Every game is in the same world, just different areas and likely points in time. Not sure how to tie Sekiro in, though Fountainhead Palace is atop a mountain overlooking seemingly entire other forests of trees that weren't visible from other areas of Ashina or from Mibuu Village iirc.

[@Telmustard]

Hey I have a running Godskin theory I would love to see your thoughts on! TLDR: Godskins are actually linked to the Oracle Envoys, and the Gloam eyed Queen took the infants they keep in their hats, and used them to create the Godskin Apostles, rather than a link to the Albinaurics. The Original Theory + Later Evidence: So my first build was a Godslayer black flame build and I fell in love with the godskin Apostles when I first discovered them. I thought their pure white skin and inhuman movements was just awesome so they stuck in my mind. So when I got to Leyndell one of the first things I noticed were the Oracle envoys (The marshmellow hornblower guys). They were the only other creatures that had that extremely pure white skin...because they were so reminiscent of the Godslaying Apostles I modeled my build after. I looked into it a bit and a lot of people seemed to believe they were related to the albinaurics...and I really don't think this is the case, as when you kill the Envoys, they don't bleed. They even drop the item 'Strip of white Flesh' which states: "Thin strips of flesh taken from a bloodless creature.". And one of the most defining traits even BETWEEN Albinauric generations is their silvery blood, blood which the Envoys clearly lack. I firmly believe they're related to the Godskin Apostles. On the topic of blood however people might say that the same issue would arise trying to connect the godskin Apostles and the Oracles, as did with the Albinaurics because when you fight them they most definitely bleed....but they bleed RED. But I don't believe they're truly bleeding...their skin is. As when you get the godskin garments the robe states: "Robe made by sewing together patches of smooth skin. Worn by the Godskin Apostles." It's the Human flesh they wear being ripped open and bleeding, not them. Were they to shed their skin I believe we would see no blood, just like the Oracle envoys. I can only speculate and theorize, but I believe the Godskins and the Oracles are mirrors of each other, creating balance. The Envoys embody Beginnings, Progress, A Birth of something new...Their description states: "It is said that when Oracle Envoys appear playing their pipes, they do so to herald the arrival of a new god, or age." Which is in stark contrast to the Godskin Apostles whose description on their armor read: "The apostles, once said to serve Destined Death, are wielders of the god-slaying black flame." They embodied The inevitable Ending, The Entropy, and Death. Two sides of the exact same coin. ***Later Discovery: The helmet you can loot from the Envoys, the Envoy Crown, which is that tight bundle of cloth on their heads, states: "The soft bundle worn on the head by Oracle Envoys. Densely wrapped in several layers of cloth. No one knows what the cloth hides, but some claim to have heard a faint whimpering from inside. It must have been their imagination" I just thought this was a weird quirk with this item at first but then i noticed a possible connection. It mentions hearing a whimpering, which makes me think of a little baby...As if perhaps they carry a baby up in their crowns.The only other time I recall babies mentioned on an item was the Godskin Swaddling Cloth, which is described: "Sacred cloth of the Godskin Apostles, made from supple skin sewn together. The Gloam-Eyed Queen cradles newborn apostles swaddled in this cloth. Soon they will grow to become the death of the gods". ...Swaddling is defined as "wrap (someone, especially a baby) in garments or cloth.". ..If there were babies up in the Crowns of the Envoys, whimpering...They would definitely be being 'swaddled'. This suggests perhaps this swaddling is necessary to raise the Envoy children, and perhaps...The Gloam eyed queen stole some of these infants, and mimicked the Envoy's swaddling in her dark Godskin Swaddling Cloth, trying to mold them into her tools to help her slay the God's. We also know, as stated earlier that Envoys appear "To herald the birth of a new god or age."...Hence why in-game we see them at the Haligtree, where Miquella was seemingly undergoing some form of apotheosis, and where due to our own actions, the most powerful and right-minded Empyrean we meet ascended into a full goddess of rot. And then Leyndell Capital, where we ourselves will sit as Elden Lord, soon to come. It is likely that when the Gloam Eyed Queen began moving against the Golden Order, these Envoys appeared to herald it...As she was capable of wielding Destined Death to strike down divinity, had it not been sealed away later... I believe when they arrived, the Gloam Eyed Queen took some of these Herald's infants and raised them in a macabre reflection, gifting them black fire to turn them from the heralds of the new age to the Bringers of that change Even the magic they use is not dissimilar as both the holy bubble magic and black flame incantations share a root in faith and anyone who is skilled in one would be skilled in the other. ( I didn't know where to slide this in but another connection between the two is how 'power' manifests in them, the most dangerous versions of the Oracles and Godskins alike...distinguish themselves specifically through weight. The Godskin noble is notable bulbous compared to his counterpart and of the three Oracles, the strongest far outweighs his smaller peers. I just found it interesting they didn't add arms, or change their form, or even make them more muscular...no in both cases the power expression was demonstrated in greater weight. Just another connection I noticed but wasn't sure how to put in cohesively)

[@Neverwas_one]

Is it coincidence that placidusax looks like a fist with 2 fingers raised?

[@disorderedfm6502]

One cool thing relating to the Dusk Eyed Queen. There's only 1 enemy who uses it her sword, Vargram whose wolf armor reads, "According to the old legends, wolves are the shadows of the Empyrean. Vargram aspired to such a state himself." And 1 thing I think worth mentioning. Iji is not on fire from Destined Death. You can test it yourself, Destined Death is red and black flames. Iji is specifically set on fire with Godslaying fire, something black knife assassins cannot do.

[@TheBacknblack92]

Maybe they're connected to Ranni. She was working with Rykard to steal destined death and they're in volcano manor. Her entire goal is to break free from the greater will and to do that she must slay her two fingers. Two godskins are still in farum azula. Plus it was her plan that killed Godwyn and further she manipulates you to kill her brother radahn in order to further her own destiny. Ranni is just as blasphemous as her brother Rykard when you think about it

[@gmzlatekirby6539]

There is also a Godskin under the tower you restore Radahn’s great runes. You get the great sword you show in your video

[@maniacalmurderer4123]

“Godskins wanted the dragons power” Godric: naturally, it was the next logical step

[@maybemablemaples2144]

Also Godrick at some point: So, I pulled the dragon head off and started blastin'

[@timothye.2902]

Meanwhile Godwyn: "the best way to get a dragon's power is to befriend then"

[@tokenpoptart3750]

BEAR WITNEEEEEESSSSSS

[@Radahn767]

You forgot the k in his name

[@ivorymantis1026]

I have another speculation idea. The Greater Will is a force of Expansion, ergo "Blasphemy" is compression, or melding. There are items in the game that mention horns budding and growing upon growth. This is a mercurial principal, starting from a conjoined and unified entity before it expanded itself to split hundreds upon hundreds of times. Such is the case of a Tree. It starts off singular, then branches until it's canopy's leaves rival the stars. EVERYTHING that has ever been blasphemous, or regarded as such, has bee in one concept and that is taking those of many and condensing or compressing them into one. The godskin cult members flayed people and added their skins to their body, Godrick grafted the limbs of warriors to his body, Rykard literally consumed champions within the god devouring serpent. All of these principles are aspects of TAKING and combining within a singular self, it is starting at the branches and working the way to the trunk. Until you realize that, in Celtic mythology, the Tree of Life not only grows into the infinite within the sky, but begins from a multitude of ROOTS combining into larger roots into finally the trunk.

[@xkristopher5250]

Thoughts on Melina being descendent / relation to Gloam-Eyed queen? She seems very much into the natural order of death. Oh, and in the flame of frenzy ending reveals her gloam eye.

[@SmoughTown]

Yeh it's one I have been ponderig, Gloam-eyed queen will need some thought and her own video for me

[@OfficialChrissums]

I think the gloam eyed queen wanted to bring destined death, but chose to do so by blending death magic with the flame of frenzy to make black flame. Maybe similar to the witch of izalith her weird experiment with flame failed, and Melina was like "im done with this flame of frenzy shortcut bullshit" and set off to find an actually balanced way to bring destined death that didnt rely on chaos overtaking order. This is why she hates that you choose to side with the flame, because an age oif endless chaos would be just as bad as an age of stagnant order.

[@vinny6547]

I've wondered if maybe ranni may have lead the godskin apostles before her "death" I'm not convinced with the Melina theory just because she's so closely associated with the Golden order and marika but of course I guess marika could of been influencing Melina to further her plot against the two fingers. But to be so close to the erd tree and not attract the attention of the two fingers when leading the faction creating God killing fire. Marika had to banish the followers of Godfrey to an entirely different land to die to keep them out of reach of the greater will. To me dabbling in God killing magic Is right up rannis alley

[@QueenofBrambles]

@@OfficialChrissums it's weird that the frenzied flame, being called chaos, its actually just more order. The end result of entropy. The stated goal is "Burn it all until everything is one thing again" in this way, it can be read as an accelerated heat death or a reset on the Crucible where it's all a big ash soup and a new tree of life can spring forth after. The two proposed states of the end of the universe. I guess you could say it's chaos as in the chaos theory, rather than literary chaos, but it's not an axial opposite to order

[@gregorypachis795]

Smough town your Ds3 lore videos were my favorite lore videos .I waited so long for your return .This video is amazing ,thank you

[@SmoughTown]

That's amazing to hear, thanks so much for the long support!

[@authornathanday6983]

I've absolutely devoured all of your Elden Ring videos over the course of 2 days. Love your analysis and presentation. Looking forward to more content!

[@SmoughTown]

Awesome! Thanks Nathan, more content soon

[@DANBAN119]

9:32 Elden Ring has a lot of characters that the community wants to see explored in dlc. I’ve even seen some people say they want to see Placidusax in his prime, since when we fight him he’s missing 3 of his 5 heads, and his skin was speculated to be golden before.

[@topichu970]

the spiritcaller cave does seem significant, the snail drops the swaddling cloth and the cave is pretty close to the guardians garrison, which is interesting considering blackflame monks exist

[@Cherryjango]

Great deep dive, can't wait for more from you, but I'm enjoying trying to untangle the game's lore before KZbin has done all the work for me. Great choice for your first lore vid on Elden Ring. 90% of Elden Ring lore videos are on either the starter areas or the endings, so your video is pretty unique!

[@jessenelson4154]

A thought that I had always kind of had with the dancers of windmill village was that they were in some way connected to Lady Tanith, and maybe Daedicar herself (because I’m assuming Daedicar and Tanith are separate people) we know that Tanith was a dancer from a foreign land, and all of the celebrants are standing around their windmills dancing, most of them completely oblivious to the fact that you’ve just wandered into their town. We can find the noble clothes and navy hood, along with a knights twin blade in one of the smaller windmill areas, possibly just an unfortunate duo who ran into the celebrants and met a tragic fate, but after some hard thought and consideration (and some exploring) as well as added inspiration from your videos, I’ve come to believe that the godskin apostle in the village and the godskin noble in volcano manner are both serving the same goals, to embolden and empower Lord Rykard to take on the gods, and that the celebrants serve lady Tanith as a means of bringing in more sacrifices to volcano manner. That’s why we find a weapon in volcano manor that specifies it was used for the torture of nobles, and that we find the noble set in the village, the noble was flayed and tortured and the knight who was traveling with her was consumed by the serpent. Of course this is all speculation and can probably have quite a few holes punched through it as I don’t think there is anything directly linking the two places together, and has been formed on what I found to be strange and striking coincidences, but would love to hear any an all opinions on this take. But whether I may be right or wrong, I’ve been loving the videos you’ve been putting out and am greatly looking forward to more!

[@maysilversi8253]

it makes no sense to me how people mix up Marika's and the Greater Will's intentions? Marika is the one that broke the elden ring and took the rune of death out by her own choice. It was not something the Greater Will intended (meaning that Destined Death has to be Greater Will's creation...its literally in the Elden Ring..which the god created :| ). Greater Will is trying to replace Marika which is why Two Fingers found god candidates like Ranni, Miquella, Melenia. But it's difficult because god candidates are hard to come by plus the twins are cursed and Ranni killed her body to not be a viable candidate, so Greater Will is still stuck using Marika. Having us Tarnish becoming Elden Lord may be to keep Marika in check. Both are pretty selfish beings. They are definitely against each other, but also stuck with one another. Some parts of the game are opened ended (like who Melina is), but a lot of the information is given pretty straight-forward. On my own speculation, I think Marika was planning complete anarchy and chaos (Radagon is the Golden Order, but he and Marika have very different viewpoints despite being the same person since Radagon tried to mend the Ring) like the Frenzied Lord ending which may be why Gideon was so scared when he glimpsed into her will? Seems like she's been fed up of being the Greater Will's slave for a while now :0

[@almir9950]

The Greater Will doesn't want you to become the Elden Lord, that's a miss communication between the Two Fingers and The Greater Will. That's why the Greater Will refuses to let you in Erdtree even though the Two Fingers sent you.

[@rushpatriot2866]

Mending a rune to the elden ring does mean it's inherently made by the greater will humans can make runes as well and mend them to the ring

[@GranMaj]

@@almir9950 Based on Gideon dialogue on his boss hit, my interpertation is that the reason why The Greater will resurrect the tarnished so that this land will be locked in a perpetual state of disharmony, since the tarnished whole purpose is to become the elden lord, by first to wage war against every demigod to obtain the great runes, the greater will expect that obtaining each of the great rune it will took dozen's or hundreds of year, or even indefinitely, so that keeps everyone in stalemate while the tarnished keep struggling to become elden lord, which is impossible unless you commit a cardinal sin. But i still don't understand why the greater will even bother to use the tarnished while the world is already on a stalemate.

[@Acesahn]

@@almir9950 But the Greater Will is the thing guiding you to it in the first place? Who else is behind the grace? I figure the Elden Beast thing makes as much lore sense as why Gwyn attacks you in DS1... most likely 'Cuz its cool'

[@excaligaming2435]

@@GranMaj Man, I am trying so hard to figure out the motivations of all the factions. I don't think The Greater Will intends this stalemate of a shit show, because that is not what it embodies. It must be Marika and that is surely the reason why Godfrey is there at the end, because that was the plan all along. Let us do the dirty work and collect all runes, then get it snatched by Godfrey so Marika can have him back at his side, because it was The Greater Will robbing Godfrey of his Grace and discarding him, not Marika. That is why she shatters The Elden Ring, to lessen the influence and power of The Greater Will. That's at least one of my current theories

[@oi690]

One thing confusing to me though is near the end of Ranni's questline, you can go back to find War Council Iji smothered in Black Flames; perhaps Ranni is connected or related to them. Or perhaps the remnants of the godskin will act in service of those in opposition to the Erdtree Order, as you can find a Godskin at Volcano Manor. Also, the fact you can only find duos in two places is important I think: Farum, where Destined Death resides (Maliketh) and the Spiritcaller Cave in the Mountaintops of the Giants. For the second one, perhaps they're there because they're looking for a way to call their queen into being, meaning Melina might not be her after all. Perhaps Melina is her daughter.

[@themalteseninja8307]

Excellent video dude, had to listen multiple times 👌🏼 we need people like you to weave the stories together to make sense of martin’s/ from software’s story lol

[@SmoughTown]

Thank you my friend! Really appreciate the kind words

[@OllieX123]

I’m amazed you found so much environmental story elements around the Volcano Manor! I spent most my time trying not to die then dying.

[@Walamonga1313]

11:17 completely agree. Best track in the game by far. Also, great analysis on this "covenant". I find the Godskin lore the most interesting in the game and I hope that if we get DLC, it has something to do with them

[@nullvektor9922]

I think Radahn has the best track by a mile tbh.

[@moonmessiah9368]

This just blew my mind. Ive been trying to piece together how Ranni and Melina were connected and this just sealed it for me. Melina is the Gloam Eyed Queen (Lord of Chaos ending has her swearing revenge upon you and her restored eye looks very unique even gloam-like) and also Marika's hidden Empyrean. She had control over the Godskin and Black Knives, as they worship destined death which would be her, and would explain how Ranni and her know each other already. Ranni and Melina conspired together and were the masterminds of the Night of the Black Knives. As punishment the Fingers took an eye from each of them with a cursemark. To add on to this Melina essentially starts the cycle of change by finding us and acting as our maiden and then quite literally does it by burning the tree for us. I believe she wanted to replace Marika as the vassal for the Greater Will, not destroy it, which is why she would be upset with us for the Lord of Chaos ending.

[@stevelopez6957]

A very interesting note is how the Godskin have serpentine bodies (noble tails, apostles stretching bodies) and given the man serpents having both aspects hint that the godskin could be an ancient form of man serpents and the modern ones are Rykard’s creations in the pursuit of blasphemy also showing why one is at the manor, The God-Devouring Serpent too could be tied to them as a creature who holds the idea of killing gods in its name

[@Malisteen]

If the gloam eyed queen is someone we've met, I would look to Melina. She has a special eye, she wants you to defeat Merica and move the age of the world forward, in particullar a world with "death... indescriminant". Melina is also a ghost already dead & burned, which fits with Maliketh having already defeated the gloam eyed queen.

[@Kyrieru]

I wish we could see how George envisioned a lot of this stuff originally. Fromsoft's methods are unique and interesting, but it feels like it was more fleshed out than they were able to effectively portray in this format. I'd buy a book about the world in a heartbeat.

[@Kyrieru]

@Ian Visser Things like "The tale of house Hoslow is told in blood" or Radagon's story are super GRR. I think it's pretty clear that he was responsible for most of the history of events, whereas Miyazaki had the job of adapting things to characters/models (with limited models) with specific roles, which is why he comes through in the execution so much.

[@kayhaich]

I think George has it in the pipeline like winds of winter, meaning never.

[@jibus3556]

Strongly feel that George's part was that he wrote out a full story mostly focusing on shortly pre/post-shattering events. He obviously had no experience writing a story designed to be told through a video game, so instead he was tasked with making one that took place hundreds of years ago and Miyazaki and the other fromsoft writers would focus on crafting the video game world off of the history that George wrote(not to say he wrote the lore solo, I still think fromsoft came up with the world and its major story beats, but they probably gave him a loose framework for events around the time of the shattering and told him to go wild). This is why the game comes off to me as if the story its based on is better than fromsofts previous titles, but also a bit more poorly conveyed to the players than usual, as if it wasn't exactly written with being told through the game world in mind. It's like if George wrote the whole story for ASoIaF, but instead of releasing the books, we got a video game based on that world taking place way in the future. Sure it would still make for a very fleshed out and interesting world, but even with tons of environmental clues it'd be nearly impossible to figure out all the major interesting things that happened during the war of five kings era. Totally agree and hope were given something more about the major events that went down around the shattering in the future

[@Kertierain]

@Ian Visser he wrote the backstory and lore

[@Kyrieru]

@@jibus3556 Yeah if they made a game based off GOT, half the Starks would be footnotes. Arya might be a random assassin model side-boss, stone-skin would be a curse status effect. The capital would be in ashes already before you get there. There's only so much they can do with their format since things need to be a somewhat static moment in the world's history, and they don't really have the resources to flesh out every character beyond descriptions. I think they could have executed things better, but I think some people went into it with the wrong expectations, and I don't think G.R.R was under any false impression about how the world would be utilized, which was more as a history and source to draw from in gameplay.

[@mynameismice]

One of the best lorehunters there is, keep it coming bro love you

[@SmoughTown]

Thank you bud! will do

[@kurtallen12]

Dude thanks for covering these guys. One of my favorite bosses/characters in the game and they aren't getting enough love!

[@AlexanderJoneshttps]

Wasn't expecting Elden Ring but also kinda was but good to see more lore content :)

[@zazikikomo7796]

I'm really glad to see this video. It's the first Elden Ring analysis that has any real punch to me, and it covers the mysterious Godskin Apostles so all the better. I was quite frustrated to be told by people that Elden Ring as a story is "all about the outer gods," because once I went through the game, I didn't get the sense that outer gods were all that important at all.

[@punishedbrak4255]

The outer gods are almost like Formless Oedon in Bloodborne; integral to many developments but never directly, most definitely something going on in the background with them, but they aren't the "ones in control"/direct cause of everything. More like a third party with their own unknowable intent.

[@samb123078]

Been wondering about this faction since I encountered them in the divine tower and got the godslayer greatsword. So much thanks for the insight. Made me wonder where gods just running rampant before Marika showed up? Did they actually succeed in killing most of the gods before Marika showed up? Did she separate the death rune in response to the godskin massacre of the gods? Really wish we got more information on them. We’re they a fringe group with delusions of killing gods? Or were they a menace that prompted a massive retaliation from the greater Will?

[@magvad6472]

There were ages prior to Marika and the Elden Ring existed prior to Marika...the dragons specifically were prominent prior to when Marika showed up and held the power of the Elden Ring.

[@jessenelson4154]

I would also like to know why it it that we find the Godskin Noble and godslayer great sword in Caelid of all places. I understand that the beast clergyman can pretty much see the divine tower from his bestial sanctum, but usually these guys are placed somewhere to be in your way or can be encountered by sidetracking just a little bit and seem to have some sort of a goal in mind, but this guy is at the bottom of the divine tower and has two black flame monks guarding him, whereas the one in volcano manner only has one, and none of the other ones you see in game have any monks around them at all. It may just be the classic FromSoft “well if you want to get there you’ve got to work for it” but it seems very suspicious to me that this noble would be here, in Caelid, with the god slaying great sword with him, so close to the beast clergy (don’t want to spoil anything story important for any who don’t know his significance) was he imprisoned there, as there is no way out other then fast traveling, or was he hiding in wait there for something?

[@samb123078]

@@jessenelson4154 my theory was that the sword was sealed there after beast clergy beat them. The noble and the monks were either guarding it for the gloom eye queen’s return or they were in the process of stealing it back until we crashed the party.

[@Gitskreig]

@@samb123078 Given who's forces are all over that tower, I get the feeling they are both trapped down there and guarding the sword in readiness for their queen's return. It is General Radahn's forces filling the tower and I think they were sent by him to get the source of the Black Flame's power as a weapon for their lord to use against foes such as Malenia. Unfortunately, getting down that tower is a perilous ordeal even without the zealots sealed at the bottom and the conflict that led to the destruction of Caelid happened before they could claim it.

[@cakeboss16]

Awesome video. The Godskins had such striking design and wherever they are found it is usually in some interesting place

[@TimsGamesDoneHard]

Love to see you coming back to FromSoft lore! Very excited to see more videos on Elden Ring, there's so much to learn about here and your videos always seem to help me put all the information that's given into perspective

[@Bagel920]

Honestly these guys are the funniest little enemies, just a bouncy guy and his looooooong friend. And then you realize the Godskin refers to actual human skin and it’s just sudden lore whiplash

[@TouruZen]

Just a little bit about the start. Marika actually did stop destined death by removing it from the Elden Ring and giving it to her half brother/shadowbeast Maliketh to guard. To truly die under the Golden Order you would have to return to the roots of the Erdtree. It wasn't until Destined Death was stolen from Maliketh that Godwyn and Ranni died (Godwyn in soul and Ranni in flesh) and it was Marika's grief at the death of Godwyn that caused her to become disillusioned with the Golden Order and caused the Shattering leading to the stagnation of the land and the denizens mostly losing their sanity in the lands between. She was not afraid of her age ending and was actually the key figure in essentially ruining the Golden Order's/Greater WIll's hold on the Lands between which brought ruin to her age.

[@fiaschampion3379]

Death and the end is a recurring theme in FS games. We fear and dread pain and death in real life, afraid of losing what we have. This same primordial fear of the indiscriminate and inevitable is what drove the actions of Gwyn and the Church of Bloodborne and is also present in DS3, Sekiro and Elden Ring.

[@Matt-zp4oc]

I didn't even know there was this detail to enjoy until I saw your video. How am I supposed to notice the placement of the godskin noble in the volcano manor when I don't know what the F a godskin noble is. You helped with that so my next playthrough will have a much richer atmosphere

[@jasondahfolf4325]

5:56 Another reason why Destined Death is not from an outer god that opposes the Greater Will is that it’s also known as the Death Rune, a component of the Elden Ring

[@nebulaz9361]

Killer video my guy. Been in love with these guys since I first discovered them. The first one I fought was in the windmill village and the whole fight, from the music to the boss design and fight itself, are great. Not to mention just how badass they are from a lore standpoint. They’re going around wearing people to prove a point and killing gods n’ shit, it’s really cool. Even if they have apparently fallen far from grace by the time we fight them, I’d love to see them explored further in DLC.

[@TjFoshizzle77]

Great piece! I think I might be onto something: Something that's ruminated with me is that the Gloam-Eyed Queen was said to be an Empyrean. That's really out of place, and a really significant thing to just throw in there. There are only a few people who meet that requirement, and she's definitely not a child of Marika. But what if she wasn't a child, but a sister of Marika. An empyrean who heralded an age of embracing Destined Death, where Marika rejected it. One killed by Maliketh in physical form (Ranni had to learn it from somewhere) by the black flame: Melina. The Frenzied Flame post credit could also be explained as Melina having her power unsealed after we killed Maliketh and released the black flame. That is as close as I can get to reconciling the missing pieces re: Melina's association with Marika, Melina's similarities with Ranni, Melina's association with destined death and her body burning and purpose lost, and the Godskin's missing pieces, and its kinda interesting to me too. Whoever gave birth to Marika could also give birth to another empyrean, and we've seen the power structure change hands before. I'd love to get more on that, a full 3 headed plasidusax, and miquella in the dlcs!

[@cybernesisofhell]

I do enjoy this theory, but the sister of Marika idea is kind of torn apart by the fact that Melina herself tells your Tarnished that she's Marika's daughter: "Me, I'm searching for my purpose given to me by my mother inside the Erdtree long ago, for the reason that I yet live, burned and bodyless." That said, she does immediately follow this line with: "There is something for which I must apologize. I've acted the finger maiden yet I can offer no guidance, I am no maiden. My purpose was long ago lost...". which is a possible implication that she was once the Gloam-Eyed Queen until Destined Death was stolen from her group.

[@retnuHDJ]

Ranni wasn't Marika's child either

[@Zephy_Sky]

@@retnuHDJ but she is radagons. So if radagon and merica are one and the same, wouldn't ranni be technically related?

[@alexbosse8528]

I love that the subtitles interpret "Marika" as America: "america would inadvertently bring great pain and destruction upon her own kind."

[@saltyoak8533]

I think the dusk queen is Melina. Her eyes at the end of the Frenzied Flame ending, as well as her words about the destined death might hint at that.

[@Matt-og6cm]

Best Eldenring lore videos on youtube so far! Keep up the good work!

[@jefftheindianchief8279]

Is it just a coincidence that Vargram came into possession of the Godslayer Greatsword, or am I the only one thinking that he had deeper connections with the Gloam-eyed Queen than originally realized? The Raging Wolf set mentions him acting as a Shadow to an Empyrean, similar to Blaidd's relationship with Ranni, and the Queen herself is confirmed to have been an Empyrean. I wonder if there's more to this story that we just haven't seen yet.

[@avo2986]

It’s very fitting from a gameplay view, as far as the actual utility of the black flame. Since it does percentage damage, it can take out literally anything, regardless of its health, thus making it a pretty good weapon to kill really tanky enemies. This very well fits with who they’re trying to kill

[@TheSunnyOne]

I imagine nobody will read this, but I just want to say that I think by "birth" in this case is when they join the godskin cult. So they join the cult, and are then swaddled in the flayed skin to symbolically rebirth them and raise them up.

[@abdoul5176]

The Gloam‐eyed Queen's lore always fascinated me and your video captures why perfectly! Hopefully we get news on some dlc soon although looking at how Elden Ring's marketing was handled I'm not hopeful.

[@CommanderNixon]

My only disagreement is that Marika wanted to halt the changing of the times. I think she realized that by the point she shattered the Elden Ring that the Golden Order had gained too much power, halting any form of era change. Otherwise I love this

[@joaoluizkfsantos8392]

My crackpot theory is that the queen is related to Melina somehow, either her mother (and father, in case she is an Empyrean) or Melina is a fragment/shadow of her. Not much to support it, but who else would Melina be? She has the power to burn the erdtree by sacrificing herself, and that's her purpose too. A purpose that leads directly to the death of a God and end of an age. And her design on the frenzied flame ending kinda fits the ominous name of Gloam Eyed Queen ig 😅

[@Umezete]

Melina if you talk to her in the capital strongly hints Marika is her mother. She talks of needing to meet her mother and learn her purpose, and her mother is in the center of the Erdtree.

[@joaoluizkfsantos8392]

@@Umezete still fits tho, if the Queen is an Empyrean she could still be a forgotten children of Marika

[@Drone3vil]

Was just about to post this. I also reckon ranni and melina are sisters, both born of marika/radagon, but then hidden, so Ranni became the adopted daughter of Rennala meanwhile Melina was outcast and developed a hatered for the gods that scorned her, she also has the ability to level your character up, so maybe she used this power on the godskins to make them stronger too, until the rune of death was used to seal destined death and the tarnished started returning, melina knowing the prophecy then turned her back on the godskin and began helping tarnished with her abilities and attempting her goal of killing the gods this way. The frenzied flame ending is a massive clue to this as she has the purple eye, the eye that was closed with a scar that looks like the 3 fingers over it, i also think ranni's spirit joins with melina in this ending as their eyecolours (being blue for ranni amd brownish for melina) combine to make the purple colour, and we know gods can fuse e.g rhykard. Ranni also says she "was" an empyrean so did she lose that status when she died? Its clear she intended to keep her soul around as she (and many other sorcerers) had a vessel ready to go. So if her body dies and she leaves her vessel when she says shes going to walk "the dark path" at a very similar time to when you enter the capital and melina leaves aswell. Dont think its a coincidence. I think we're being manipulated by scorned gods who lost too much of their power during the shattering or maybe before. I think it may be connected to nokstella/nokron. Just my 2cents of tinfoil craziness.

[@DonutSwordsman]

You are forgetting, when you first meet she literally says her mom's on the tree. It's not your theory, it's told to you.

[@henrywilljb]

@@Drone3vil the theory that Melina and Ranni are related doesn’t really hold up other than both lost their physical forms and their tattoos which are different. We can team up with Melina to fight king morgott and she uses faith spells of the golden order that are associated with the royal family of the erdtree, meaning she’s definitely associated with queen marika and is most likely marika’s daughter. While in the other hand we have Ranni, who centers around sorcery instead of faith, being the daughter of the queen of the full moon, also her destiny is written in the stars, which were put on hold by her brother radahn, one of the reasons we have to kill him is to release the stars from their stasis during ranni’s quest. The whole destiny written in stars is a trait that only the royal carian family has, so her being the illegitimate daughter of renala doesn’t make sense in that regard.

[@oryhbrx6934]

@SmoughTown that was , by far the best detail oriented lore I've ever watched in you tube since the release of the Elden Ring , great job , keep on !!!! , and thanks for the Video.

[@SmoughTown]

What an amazing compliment! Thanks so much

[@treemasterbob]

Glad to see your starting to cover Elden Ring lore, its my first Fromsoft Soulslike where I've played it from day one, knowing no prior lore. It's been nice discovering about these games on my own for a change, but these games have so much more story going on in little bits and pieces that its nice to have these videos to set a decent chunk of the lore patchworked together for a clearer picture.

[@SmoughTown]

Hope you enjoy your day one experience. My first was Dark Souls in 2011, blew me away! Bought a PS3 the next day and played Demon's Souls

[@ayandautimahmen9512]

This video was so beautiful; going off what you said regarding the Gloam/Dusk-eyed Queen and the Godskin faction's goal I think there is a surprising connection to Melina; Melina using herself as a vessel for the Giants' fire to burn the Erdtree instantly reminded me of the idea that the Godskin faction could be one that ushers in a new age by killing the gods of the current age( Marika, Radagon, etc). When burning she says that the erdtree should burn for the new Elden Lord. There is also her ties to Destined Death( how she promises to give the Lord of Frenzy Destined Death after destroying the Erdtree) and the obvious physical impairment of her right eye; indirectly linking her to the 'Gloam-eyed Queen' moniker. She seems to have all of her fingers dipped in most of the factions lore.

[@darealdovahkiin3652]

This video is amazing. Gives me Hawkshaw vibes and that is the highest compliment I can give. I can’t wait for more!

[@SmoughTown]

Massive compliment thank you!

[@thebunnybun]

I have been waiting for the handful of lore channels to stsrt on elden ring. Im so happy to see this video

[@Emomomotional]

I really want someone to do a video about the fact that I think the Greater Will is all the bodies and souls of everyone in the world. Around every Erdtree is a collection of broken jars and honestly the jars are probably the most well explained lore in the entire game. Even the updates have added more jar quests to flesh out that they're filled with bodies. I think the Erdtree is like the lifestream in Final Fantasy. It could be that the Greater Will is an outer God OR more likely is a God made of the collection of all the people living in the world. I mean the Erdtree literally grows into and is part of the world itself. They regularly talk about how the Greater Will enforces it's will upon the world and how the different Outer Gods are all vying for their power on this world but that this one seems to be the current strongest. There is also jars all over Raya Lucaria like maybe they had part in making the jars to collect the bodies and souls to feed the Erdtrees. Every single Erdtree in the game is literally covered in warrior jars surrounding it and there's no way that's just a coincidence. I think either someone did actually make a God or that the people of the land somehow conjoined their souls together to make this power that got away from them eventually having its own will. Since the game is based on alchemy, there is this idea that alchemy was simply about making gold but the initial intention was a way to make one immortal. The idea was to be able to form the laws of nature to work under your will. Instead of a stone to warp the laws of nature, you have a tree that can be fed continously and once well supported, can actually continue to reinforce itself. I'm sharing this a couple places hoping someone else can jump in. I study philosophy and it seems to fit the underlying themes.

[@MicahWarren-h3r]

I think the pots around the minor erdtrees is more to show how these trees, as well as the main erdtree, are in some way fed by corpses. The minor erdtrees only came about after the shattering, they’re more grown versions of the tiny trees that have an erdtree seed. We can see in the catacombs that the bodies buried there are sort of being absorbed by the roots, I’ve seen a lot of people speculate that the elden beast came down as a falling star to kind of just be a parasite to all life, but I think it’s more something like the erdtree is trying to order life. There’s not a lot of evidence for this, but I personally think that the erdtree isn’t just where life ends, but where it begins. One of the rune items says something like in the age of the erdtree, champions would appear suddenly and then just disappear. It’s like the erdtree can use the souls or bodies or whatever of the corpses it’s absorbed to fashion a champion to fight for it and then absorb it once it’s no longer necessary. I think things like the erdtree avatars, those annoying tree spirits, and even the concept of remembrances as a sort of image of someone who’s died that can be used to create something from them point towards this. Also there’s the concept that an erdtree burial is something reserved for heroes, almost as if the erdtree wants to take the strongest for itself so that it can use them later

[@andrewspear3552]

I'm sure someone said this already, but it makes a ton of sense that a godskin noble would be in a temple dedicated to snakes. Considering they shed their skin naturally and an old skin is predominantly displayed. Love your content by the way

[@common_undead]

I think the fact that there is a Godskin Apostle that has taken over Windmill Village and using it for a constant supply of fresh skin points to the idea that the Gloam Eyed Queen is still alive but just in hiding. The constant supply of skin is for the new Godskins which she's bringing to life, somewhere in the Lands Between. Its also interesting to try to understand the motivations of the 2 fingers and the Greater Will in the context of the Godskins. The Finger Reader Enia states that Marika as punishment was sealed in the Erdtree. Why does the Greater Will and the 2 fingers still prefer Marika to be the Vessel for the Elden Ring, instead of the Gloam Eyed Queen, assuming that the Godslayer black flame is indeed intended to be a part of the Lands Between by the Greater Will? What motivations does the Gloam Eyed Queen have such that the Greater Will prefers Marika?

[@muhammadrahim4712]

it is confirmed that meline,the girl that offers us the accord,is the gloam eyed queen melina is also the daughter of queen Marika,the game's internal files tell us that name. so melina is the gloam eyed queen,daughter of marika and an empyrean.

[@wombatcyote4804]

It's great to see how far this channel has come. The confidence and quality bring inspiration. Keep it up, it is appreciated.

[@thanashs]

I think Marika is the Dusk Eyed Queen , her black knife assassins also wield black flame , she has ordered Hewg to craft a Godslaying weapon and even the Godslayers Greatsword is shaped like her dress tail we see on her design in the Churches and intro ! There are many hints that Marika could be the Queen or not .. it's kinda frustrating not knowing for sure whats going on

[@maureenbouterse]

Whoa, this starts making some sense when you consider that Marika herself shattered the Elden Ring and thus directly defied the Greater Will.

[@thanashs]

@@maureenbouterse Exactly Marika never wanted the Golden Order to begin with

[@aberrantart88]

This is a cool theory. Marika did seal the rune of death/destined death away. If she wanted it back from Maliketh, would it not make more sense to use her black knife assassins to take it back, rather than creating the Godskins?

[@thanashs]

@@aberrantart88I think Marika was forced to become the vessel of the Elden Ring by the Two fingers and she betrayed her brother Maliketh by having him(who was her closest bodyguard and shadow) be a vessel for Destined Death and imprisoned/banished him in Farum Azula that's why the Godskin Duo are there guarding him , makes sense if she is indeed the Dusk Eyed Queen , and she manipulated Ranni to steal a fragment in order to use it for her own ends .. bring Destined Death again in the world (cause despite her being a god the Two Fingers and Greater Will wanted Death out of the Elden Ring) but Marika had sealed it in her brother so she can keep it close to her and in check if it makes sense

[@aberrantart88]

@@thanashs That makes a lot of sense. I still can't get past the fact that the GEQ is said to be an Empyrean though. Marika is really interesting, her motivation and level of autonomy are really big gaps in the Lore. I wonder if she chose to split herself, etc. Something that is for sure is that she had freedom enough to hammer the Elden Ring to bits, but when we find her in-game she's doesn't have that same mobility.

[@tonyogar6936]

Thanks for this. I really enjoyed your take. The Godskin's always intrigued me. I always had the impression that, with where you find them, there was a lot more to them and their place in the lore. Their very calm and calculated fighting style always fascinted me.

[@bartmongiello]

The gloam-eyed queen is Melina. During the lord of madness ending she has one milky eye and the eye that’s usually shut is clearly the color of twilight. Plus she says that she’ll hunt down the player to make him face Destined Death. Who else but the gloam-eyed queen would so brazenly and so surely threaten someone with Destined Death?

[@eziowayne]

Man, I am addicted to your lore videos! They’re amazing!

[@ChefRyoshu]

Love the video. After watching, I agree that it seems to me like the Gloam-eyed queen was meant to replace Marika, as she was an Empyrean. But, Marika stopped this from happening by plotting against the Greater Will and the Two Fingers by using Malekith to defeat/kill the Gloam-eyed queen. Perhaps this is when Marika and the Two Fingers began to have conflict? However, Marika avoided the wrath of the Two Fingers by tricking Malekith, and pinning the assassination of the Gloam-eyed queen all on him. Maybe a jump in speculation but curious what you think.

[@Umezete]

I don't think she tricked the greater will at all, I think she's just irreplaceable. Alot of the story makes sense if you assume the greater will and Marika originally both put up with each other for mutual goals and then enter a Cold War with each other.

[@user-op2bh7rc9z]

I have a very loose theory that the gloam eyed queen was Marika herself, seeing as we’ve seen characters become someone new or take on another name in a sense when they are bestowed grace in such an important way. When Marika became the vessel/vassal of the Elden ring and the greater will I believe that she gave up her former identity, and in the same way that Godfrey pretty much lead a crusade in the name of the greater will I believe she did so for in the same way for the old gods of the lands between. Also the night of the black knives happened before the shattering, a small essence of power was stolen from the rune but not entirely and used to imbue the knifes with the power of death that’s as supposed to be sealed away. Marika shattering the Elden ring could be summarized as a result of emotional decision making in the wake of losing a child.

[@dangerouslydubiousdoubleda9821]

Why would Maliketh kill Marika, the person he's suppose to protect?

[@stancurran7265]

I only discovered your channel last night through your expertly done exploration of the Curse of Mother Kos and Hunter's Nightmare. Now I'm looking forward to more Elden Ring Lore, this was a perfect entry point.

[@SmoughTown]

Much appreciated friend, glad you enjoy the content. More on the way soon!

[@orthonas6417]

Good video I love all the different footage used and the attention to detail with enemy placement! Comparing the Godskin to the Black-Knives is a really apt analogy. Here are my thoughts Godskin Apostles represent the Black-Knife assassins of their age but just like how Ranni still exists at the end of the Age of the Erdtree, I think the Gloam-Eyed Queen survived to the end of her age and that she was actually Marika herself. Marika existed during the Prehistoric time before the Erdtree and would eventually fight for its creation and preservation. But according to Nepheli Loux's religion (which relates to Godfrey's name Horah Loux and sorta confirms their ways as the Prehistoric old ways) they worshipped the Stormlord Placidusax who as the previous Elden Lord would've existed with his own pantheon of gods. I believe Marika was given the power of Destined Death to begin the Godhunt like you imply in the video until she was defeated by Maliketh who then sealed the power within his Blackblade, but he would go on to serve Marika as her shadow just like how Blaidd betrayed the world for Ranni and together they would challenge the gods. As a rough summation like Horah Loux would be huge in that and probably was the one who decapitated a head from Placidusax. Further evidence for Marika's link to the Godskin are with Gideon Ofnir, a known follower to Marika, who possesses some of the only ancient rituals of the Godskin that have been lost to time. Also I believe the Godskin to be serpent like because they represent the original blasphemy of imitation of the Ancient Dragons cuz they snakes and the God-Devouring Serpent was the original blasphemer which is why that echoes again in the current age with Rykard himself. Rykard personally was most likely a Carian Prince, then a royal knight of the capital, then the royal inquisitor, and finally a rebel who became too disgusted with the acts of inquisition he was forced to perform so he committed ultimate blasphemy in burning his minor erdtree and feeding himself to the God-Devouring Serpent. Based off of the Blasphemous Claw you get from Bernahl's quest it was probably Ranni who was the root of Rykard's treason. It references her personal plan to begin the Age of Stars but if she were ever to fail it gives Rykard a better chance of challenging Maliketh. Ranni fails because her fate is locked behind the movement of the stars and Rykard falls to inner greed. Part of me likes to think that Rykard's last conscious act as his serpent-god union was to try and harness the power of Mt Gelmir which caused its eruption, destroying the castle town and sealing him within that giant cavern. Miquella and Marika were both involved with the Night of Black Knives to equal measure as Ranni, I believe that is evidenced by the Black Knife ladies' positions in Ordina as well as Marika's relationship to them as Numenites. Ranni has a falling out with them which is why her servant Iji is later murdered by the Black Knives. I think that connection between all of them extends to the Godskin safeguarding the conspiracy by defending Ranni's body or recruiting new members like Rykard. I believe the Godskin Apostle in Dominula represents that the people there have discarded their worship of the gods and that they support godhunters instead. In Rykard's castle it's attracted by the godhunt. In Farum Azula would make sense as Marika still wanting Destined Death to be sealed off. That segueways into Marika's plan which is most likely to have Godwyn be revived as Prince of Undeath imo Anyway great video

[@theultimatetactician1712]

I'm really happy you're back I love ds/bb lore and listen to it every night. I listen to all the lore tubers on cycle I loved your souls lore thank you for coming back with the Er lore, love u man

[@SmoughTown]

What a wonderful comment to read. Thank you so much, love you too

[@redworm3030]

Ranni is involved with Maliketh. She gave Rykard the Blasphemous Claw. "On the night of the dire plot, Ranni rewarded Praetor Rykard with these traces. Should the coming trespass one day transpire, they would serve as a last-resort foil, allowing Rykard to challenge Maliketh the Black Blade, the black beast of Destined Death."

[@NobleSix-my6ot]

Im 100% sure melina is the gloam-eyed queen. through her death you usher into a new world, her eye closed eye in the frenzy flame secret ending is the color of twilight, and she has strong ties to marika. I have a theory that every empyrean has another half like radagon and marika

[@softsounds8453]

You know what? You're probably right there. Radagon and Marika. Miquella and Trina. Ranni and Melina? I wonder what Malenia's other half might've looked like.

[@Celestishell]

The apostles can stretch their center's, similar to the manserpent enemys, and the noble's tail could be seen as a serpents tail, and there is a noble in the volcano manor area, so I think they may somehow be related or something.

[@DonPetexX]

I'm thinking that the dragons served a different outer God, and the greater will through Marika conquered the lands between making his rule (Erdtree/golden order). My reasoning for this is that the frenzied flame is from another outer good and Ranni is with the God of the dark moon who seems the most hands off entity so far.

[@IdToaster]

I think I might have blacked out while listening; did you mention why there was a Godskin, 2 blackflame monks, and the Gloam-eyed Queen's own sword hanging out in the Caelid Divine Tower with some of Radahn's soldiers? That raises even more questions than the Volcano Manor one, I'd think.

[@SinclairLore]

Amazing ty for the upload!

[@SmoughTown]

Thanks Sin! hope you and Sophie are good

[@TheMagicienWorld]

" A quick vibe check will tell you that things aren't alright " No better words have ever been spoken XD

[@loopygordo]

I just realized this and hope someone sees lol. So the intro cinematic basically reveals that Marika is radagon. It shows them one after another shattering the ring then attempting to repair it, then when the narrator starts talking about the shattering he says "Marikas children, demigods all." And then list all of them as her offspring even the ones referenced early on the story as the children of radagon and renalla. It just blows my mind how I didn't see a lore video pop up speculating on this.

[@talon2162]

If you do goldmasks questline, the realization that they are the same comes to light as well.

[@imethdup5050]

YO thats a good catch, i never picked that up across both my chars,.

[@Striderbankis]

what if the spirit caller snails weren’t just calling died godskins. But were calling godskins that were tasked at killing the One-eyed god of the fire giants but they were slain. That may be why.

[@JustThatLittleGuy]

Ive been super curious about the Godskins after my first playthrough, thank you

[@BananenBoerBob]

In Dark Souls we had three sisters of the sable church of londor. In Elden Ring we have an area called the three sisters. We have Ranni who as you stated symbolised the night. We have Melina who uses light based attacks who could be theorised to symbolize day. That would leave a potential third "sister" who could be the gloam eyed queen.

[@faustsiftar7683]

I didn’t think of that, but there’s also a location in Game of Thrones called the Three Sisters, written by GRRM who worked on Elden Ring

[@quasarstone4951]

As a next theory, I totally suggest Vykes connection to dragons and madness. Vyke was the most respected knight by the dragons. he wielded red lightning and even created his own dragonbolt spell. However he also had a connection to the flame of frenzy and invades you using madness weapons in the village of frenzy. The catalyst Dragon Communion seal boosts dragon incantations, but there's something interesting. The symbol for dragon incantations is not the symbol that is the shape of the seal. The dragon seal looks like the madness symbol but less twisted, yet extremely reminiscent. Could Vyke have been a link between the two?

[@Leonhart_93]

It says somewhere that he was someone very close to become Elden Lord, but then he was just manipulated by the flame of frenzy to become their convenient agent.

[@nightknight9212]

Little did Smoughtown know. The Godskin would be appearing in the rest of his lore videos in some way or another. They just keep showing up.

[@vaevictis5178]

Sitting down to eat lunch and watch this! I thank you in advance.

[@SmoughTown]

Thanks for the support, means alot!

[@XSotaxX]

Godskin Duo. Prolly one of my favourite characters ever.

[@PoguliPogalu]

yeah I dont see how people can think that Destined Death is another outer god like the Greater Will, it's literally part of the Greater Will's logic

[@SmoughTown]

agreed but I guess others see it differently!

[@PoguliPogalu]

@@SmoughTown I guess so, that's also why I love FromSoft releases, the discovery of all the lore and having to decipher what it all means :)

[@SmoughTown]

@@PoguliPogalu 100%

[@toby8044]

Destined Death is literally just another name for the Rune of Death. "The Rune of Death goes by two names; the other is Destined Death. The forbidden shadow plucked from the Golden Order upon its creation..."

[@PoguliPogalu]

@@toby8044 yeah im pretty sure thats why the old lady at the roundtable hold tells you at some point

[@rickrhone8420]

i feel like NOBODY talks about how Rykard's multifingered hand covered in rings looks exactly like the bigt hand creepers

[@SmoughTown]

Watch my Rykard video ;)

[@meowijuana2322]

Subbed. Keep em coming

[@SmoughTown]

Appreciate that - will do!

[@Pdogg3294]

I have lots of research to do on it. But I have a theory that both Ranni and Melina are daughters of the gloom eyed queen. Both have eyes closed, melinas eye during the frenzied flame ending is faded with the normally shut eye showing a twilight color. She also got her quest from her mother. Ranni is somehow the only emperyan out of her siblings which is odd and points towards Ronnalla not being her birth mother but an adopted mother. Both of their goals have a lot an common as well

[@clownsanity]

The Godskin's design is so original I love it!

[@arturkushukov1815]

Regarding the bridge in Liurnia, to me it felt like an ambush designed for me specifically. That Noble teleports in to meet us. Perhaps they were trying to prevent us from retrieving the rune. And since it's used in the Age of Duskborn ending, I'm thinking they specifically wanted Fia's quest to fail.

[@absolutepineapple4115]

Not a bad assessment but there is a very common theme of placing an enemy to guard but also overcome it to prove worth. There is a chance its a test rather than trying to cause her quest to fail.

[@Revellius21]

Tin foil Theory: Ranni the Witch is the Moon Presence from Bloodbourne IF Ranni's plans work out.