Elves | Why Isn't Middle-earth Overpopulated?

[@rafaelgustavo7786]

A constant theme of Tolkien's is the fact that time cycles are always accompanied by a kind of decay - in the mold of Greek mythology that speaks of an early golden age, and that we would currently be in the iron age. Imperative to analyze that Arda had suffered some catastrophes in the course of its history. The destruction of Beleriand, the fall of Númenor, the great plague of third age, wars, etc. All this tragedy amounts to a technological/scientific decrease for all humanity, and much knowledge that could be the basis of such advances is never fully developed, like the engineering of the Noldor for the construction of great cities as in the first age.

[@docvaliant721]

That's in all indo European/Aryan mythic stories. Goes back to the sanskrit stories of cycles.

[@epiendless1128]

After reading the Silmarillion, my reaction is not "Why isn't Middle-earth overpopulated?" but "how is anybody left?"

[@mingthan7028]

lmao💀💀💀💀

[@dtice69]

"I'm just not feeling it tonight." - Elvish women from the War of the Jewels until the 3rd Age.

[@shanenolan8252]

Lol . Or nor tonight Josephine. ( napoleon bonaparte)

[@alanmike6883]

'I got a headache' anonymous elven woman of the first age 😉

[@mekskraptrakkz5718]

LMAO

[@user-fx2bx1gz4c]

My wife’s an elf

[@shanenolan8252]

@@alanmike6883 lol

[@Mentallect]

Feanor's spirit was so potent because he was infused with the spiritual power of many elves His spirit was a flame, concentrated, and his great acts of creation stemmed from this potency.

[@TheRedBook]

Well, yeah. I do quote Míriel in the video saying that "'Never again shall I bear child; for strength that would have nourished the life of many has gone forth into Fëanor.'.

[@Mentallect]

@@TheRedBook That is why I posted my comment.

[@TalesoftheRings]

Another one that helped me to understand lore even more. What a topic man 🙌

[@TalesoftheRings]

@ODIN Force Dobious claim. It's hard to imagine it, as a devoted Catholic. He lived in a time where the opposite of that was considered normal, but everyone has the right to be guided by their beliefs, as long as they do not endanger others.

[@TalesoftheRings]

@ODIN Force ooh 😄

[@25gramsofbluesky33]

Hello, I hail from Massachusetts and have not commented anywhere on any platform in many years. Since high school I have revisited The Hobbit and the LOTRs more than a dozen times. Around 1995 as a senior in high school I discovered LOTRs, It was a dark and violent time. I hated academia and literature and rebelled against it. Tolkiens writings changed everything. It showed me that there was beauty and a great learning that public education was hiding from us all. Tolkien guided me to Alexander Solzhenitsyn, David Berlinski, Dostoevsky, Dr Jordan Peterson, H.G. Wells, Charles Dickens and many other masterful works. Just recently I have discovered The Silmarillion. I'm blown away! And this channel is by far its best representative. I have begun work on a song based on the subject (it is daunting) but I hope to finish it before winter. Sorry for my long winded post but I had to get this off my chest. Please continue with this brilliant work, it is refreshing and this is much needed in such weary times.

[@Enerdhil]

Morgoth, Sauron, and Saruman always had the numbers advantage against the Armies of the West. I agree that the Elves can't reproduce like orcs, but the orcs we're still formidable foes that did not seem to diminish even after many years. You would think that it wouldn't cause Elves to fade fast and weaken if they just had an average of 4-6 kids instead of 2-3. Imagine Elrond and Celebrian having two more Elrohirs and Elladans. Doubling the number of warriors on their side would surely have helped.

[@TheRedBook]

Orc populations did diminish between the power of Dark Lords. They fell into a more natural population strength when they were left to their own devices. It was the will of Dark Lords that gave them an unnatural advantage. Armies being wiped out yet another army would appear soon after. It wasn't natural and it's perhaps not right to compare such a process to the natural and 'good' Elves. Even the idea of Elves breeding to combat others would probably diminish them because it wouldn't be procreation out of love but procreation for some unnatural reason.

[@TheRedBook]

A supporter on Patreon asked why Middle-earth wasn't overpopulated by immortal Elves and this gave me an opportunity to quote heavily from my favourite volume of HoMe (Morgoth's Ring). A nice follow up question was then asked which I think I will save for my end of the month Appendices video (A new addition to the channel). Please let me know your thoughts on the video and if there are any really interesting questions or comments that deserve a more in-depth response, they will also be added to that response video at the end of the month. Support The Red Book: www.patreon.com/theredbook Also, follow the link to set a reminder for my very first Livestream later this month: kzbin.info/www/bejne/Y6OnnIGYdrB6qbs

[@Enerdhil]

If the Elves had used procreation as a weapon to fight the Orcs, as Sauron spent three ages breeding orcs into a formidable army, then the Elves wouldn't have needed the Ainur to bail them out of Beleriand or the Numenorians to bail them out of the War of the Elves and Sauron, me thinks.

[@TheRedBook]

@@Enerdhil But that seems to be mentally and physically impossible based on Tolkien's writings. While Melkor or Sauron may have been able to breed Orcs at a rapid pace, almost unnaturally it seems, Elves can't keep having children. You'd have mothers dying after producing one child too many. Even the father is spiritually impacted by the birth of new life. There's not an unlimited well of potential for Elves to keep producing children. That's what makes the House of Finwe and Feanor, etc, so impressive.

[@Enerdhil]

@@TheRedBook Imagine Fëanor with no kids.🤔

[@istari0]

@@Enerdhil Well, there's likely two less Kinslayings, no one tries to kidnap Lúthien, and no one tries to take over Nargothrond. Most likely, there's more elves that survive the War of Wrath.

[@Enerdhil]

@@istari0 No Aegnor and Andreth love tragedy.💔

[@MistaGify]

We should also consider Tolkien’s personal views on sex as a Catholic. It is strange that Catholicism is very pro-family, with Tolkien himself having 4 children, yet the faith has historically had trouble openly discussing matters of sexuality. He may have despised allegory, but I believe the conservatism of the Elves on procreation is very clearly him projecting his own conservatism onto them. What do you think?

[@waltonsmith7210]

Yeah, it's like they're natural Catholics. Elvish marriage customs dont really work for humans though, as much as the Catholic Church wishes otherwise lol.

[@lauraheffner5342]

As always, fantastic video all around! You launched the channel in an essentially perfect form and it's extremely pleasing to see you rightfully acquiring more and more subs and devoted fans. Keep up the awesome work Steven!

[@pattenicus]

Great video. Really enjoyed watching it. I imagine that Feanor having seven sons (all of whom were mighty) shows how much spirit Feanor posessed.

[@TheRedBook]

Absolutely. It isn't a coincedence that an Elf born with the strength of spirit of many Elves was then father to a large family of great Elves.

[@Crafty_Spirit]

Fantastic Steven, I moved to a neighbouring country yesterday (leaving friends and family behind for now 😥) and your channel already feels like a piece of virtual home, so that is reassuring. If you ever run out of video ideas, could you... explain to me how Trolls procreate? Is it.... sexy?

[@TheRedBook]

I hope the move works out well! As for Trolls, that's not a sexy thought. The answer depends on how Tolkien's writings are interpreted and the date of the writing. If we take Tolkien's late thoughts on Trolls, they would have naturally existed and been corrupted and warped by Melkor - this means they'd reproduce like any other animal. If they have more unnatural origins, they may still be able to reproduce the traditional way or are 'made' somehow. I prefer the former. Creatures that were corrupted but creatures nonetheless, reproducing when a male troll and a female troll bump uglies!

[@Crafty_Spirit]

@@TheRedBook Fascinating 😁 Thank you for both

[@Enerdhil]

Thanks Crafty. I just lost my appetite.🤮

[@waltonsmith7210]

@The Red Book It seems like Morgoth did in fact create life. Or at least, he exploited loopholes to basically create life more or less even if it's not ex nihilo. Yeah, they're hideous abominations with tortured existences, but still somehow endowed with a basic level of sentience.

[@Enerdhil]

@@waltonsmith7210 Eru is the only One who give sentience to fauna. Melkor can create his own twisted and corrupted fauns to carry out his evil purposes, but he can't give those creatures sentience. That is the problem with him from the beginning. He was also searching for the Flame Imperishable for that specific reason.

[@istari0]

Fëanor is an interesting case (as he usually is). For all his procreative prowess, he had 1 grandchild and 0 great-grandchildren. It seems that his "abilities" in that area were not passed down to his children. I also daresay their obsession with the Oath was not something that would have made them look good in the eyes of elven women. I think it is worth mentioning that in The Nature of Middle-Earth, Tolkien describes the early generations of elves as having more children (the average being 6 at the beginning I believe) and then declining over time. Given that the elves usually didn't have children, I have to wonder how many (or few) were born in Beleriand during the 1st Age. Not only were they suffering losses in the long war against Morgoth but there were few young elves coming along to help replace the fallen. I wonder if the armies of the Free Peoples in the later parts of the 1st Age weren't mostly men even if it was still the elves that were the overall commanders.

[@mikealexander1935]

Feanor was the original elf with Big Dick Energy. 😁

[@joseraulcapablanca8564]

Good stuff as ever Steven, you have hit the nail on the head here. Like with the spirit of sauron passing into the ring, one has only so much of oneself one can give. keep up the good work.

[@grafspe807]

I kind of always understood why the elves and dwarfs were few in number but i never really got why there were many empty lands in Eriador . I get that for story purposes the partys journey though empty dangerous lands doted with ancient ruins would make for better story telling but the wars and tragic events that emptied those lands were long past the memorys of men and one would think that the land between Bree and Dunland would be perfect for ppl to settle which i like to think would happen after Arogon reordered his lands

[@MerkhVision]

Good to know there’s a reason for all those empty but named places on the maps and that it wasn’t just laziness or lack of interest, both of which seem very unlikely for Tolkien lol

[@Mentallect]

Interesting explanation on Elves.

[@charliecrain1830]

Adore these videos especially because of the important differences between human and elf are seen here in the fact that elves are essentially more “spiritual” beings

[@dokkrokket8692]

Wow…very impressive

[@TheRedBook]

Thanks for watching :D

[@JustFlemishMe]

Having read the title, but before watching the video, I'm going to go ahead and assume it has something to do with two Dark Lords constantly spreading war and plague and sending out armies and dragons...

[@danguillou713]

Cool video. Personally I’d always written it off as one of those things where Tolkien just didn’t think about how it would actually work. Nice to be wrong. And apparently, elves do not have a libido, or recreational sex. Eru designed them that way when he made them unaging. Something to think about for the humans who want to cure aging in the real world.

[@nosotrosloslobosestamosreg4115]

For humans too, mind and body age at different rhythm and they both have paths of their own. I, myself, been wondering and weighing the ways my mind and soul age, and they both feel older than my body. But, praised be Eru-Ilúvatar, there still be something shining as on my first breath.

[@waltonsmith7210]

You satisfactorily explained why individual elves stopped having children. But why did their children stop having children, and their children? Did the Fading put a stop to that whole cycle? Sure, many sailed to the West, but what about the Avari? Would an elf born right on the eve of the Dominion of Men fade more quickly than the ancient elves?

[@trekstarsam2494]

By the end of the third age there were very few elves left in middle earth. Elves tend to not reproduce during time of peril. Oropher, for example, is said to be born in the first age, meaning he remembers the fall of Melkor and everything that happened within, most likely did not have Thranduil until the beginning of the second age, as Thranduil has no memory of the war of wrath and fall of Melkor, (at least he never mentioned so). However Thranduil was alive at the end of the second age and fought in the battle of the last alliance, which his father also died in, and therefore, along with Elrond, is very aware of the danger of sauron. Legolas, I’m assuming, was born at the end of the second or the beginning of the third age, after sauron lost his ruling ring and was vanquished and peace restored. Thranduil took up the mantle of king and probably married and had Legolas after his move to Mirkwood. Legolas I assume was not alive during the second age, or else probably would have been fighting alongside his father and grandfather in the last alliance, and would probably have mentioned to the fellowship something the remembered about the battle but never does, so we can safely assume he was not born yet. It would make no sense for Legolas to take a wife at the end of the third age, most of the elves were gone, and Legolas apparently chose not to bear children in middle earth, but was content to travel with gimli until gimli got too old, then they both sailed to the undying lands together. It would make no sense to take a wife in middle earth if you’ve already made plans to leave. Any elf that chose to remain with Thranduil would have diminished, probably the children would have as well. Women probably lacked strength or desire to carry kids after Sauron’s fall.

[@Callisto_Arcas]

Wow. Really enjoyed this! This will be among my favorites of your videos.

[@TheRedBook]

Thanking you :D

[@hazbojangles2681]

Excellent as always.

[@robertsvoboda3508]

If you had talked about the different races of Middle Earth, not exclusively the elves, as I thought going into the video, my answer to the initial question would have been: everybody is either dying or leaving, how could the place be overpopulated? 😄😅😊

[@ironblue4593]

Really interesting video to watch

[@witchhazel4135]

I wish someone could write a book or or a movie about what the world is like in the Halls of Mandos. Was Feanor able to see and spend time with his mother and sons again? Are they able to pursue their interests and crafts? Is there plant life there and colors and water? Is it all indoors or is there a vast outdoor world to explore?

[@mypeeps1965]

Thanks!

[@TheRedBook]

Thank you once again Mr. MacLeod :)

[@josephraffurty9293]

Not only does low reproduction seem to be inherent in elves, but dwarves as well. Though for dwarves, it probably has more to do with them being obsessed with their work and less interested in expanding their population. Could another factor for dwarves be a much lower percentage of women in their population? Dwarf women are pretty much never talked about in The Lord of the Rings, Hobbit, or Silmarillion. Not even sure the appendices talk about them, so Tolkien’s other writings, which I have almost no experience with, would be our only source. Or speculation.

[@istari0]

I don't remember where it's written but there are many more dwarven men than dwarven women and not all dwarven women wanted to have children. TRB talks about this in another comment in this video.

[@jamesgravil9162]

"Dwarf women are pretty much never talked about in The Lord of the Rings, Hobbit, or Silmarillion." Women generally don't feature much in LotR. A common criticism of the story is its lack of female protagonists and the fact that none of them get much character development. It's overwhelmingly male-focused, so that by itself doesn't necessarily mean anything.

[@josephraffurty9293]

@@jamesgravil9162 Yes, that’s true. Though I have heard somewhere that dwarf women are discussed in Tolkein’s writings.

[@darnellsimpsin556]

In Northen myth, Dwarves, and Elves, are viewed as fertility spirits. Therefore, they would have a very high population.

[@Sara3346]

Yes but this is tolkien so you've got a mix of Anglo-saxon/Norse, Greek(wizard staffs for instance are not at all a Norse thing) and Judeo- Christian material(Nor are beings like Eru Illuvitar for the most onvious example)being turned together to inspire his world.

[@JulietsWorld]

Great work!

[@erwingvargas2272]

You kidding me? With all the wars of men, elves, dwarfs and Ainur that have been fought trough the ages I'm surprised there's enough people left 😅

[@earlwajenberg]

The idea that souls reproduce souls in parallel with bodies reproducing bodies is an old (but obscure) one in Christian theological speculation. It's called "traduction." I don't know if Tolkien deliberately used the idea for his elves - he might readily have come across it - but at the least, he seems to have reinvented it. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traducianism

[@Enerdhil]

Also, didn't Tolkien state that Elves fell in love only once and if they could not have their soul mates they would remain celibate for ever. That would also keep the number of male Elves in your armies lower than you'd think it should be.

[@TheRedBook]

Could love more than one as we see with Finwe but in extraordinary circumstances. The fact his wife would not leave the Halls of Mandos meant that rules had to be set for the unique situation where Elves bound together for eternity wouldn't be together eternally. Probably right to say that in the situation where the Elves are living, a situation like that would never happen. Two Elves will only have eyes for each other and they will become bound through marriage.

[@Enerdhil]

@@TheRedBook I think Eru must have removed the love in his heart that Finwë had for Miriel just before he fell in love with Indis. That is very Biblical: the agony of loss being replaced by God's love.

[@davidkulmaczewski4911]

Perhaps you're thinking of a quote about dwarf women, from ROTK Appendix A.... "For not all the (dwarf) women take husbands: some desire none; some desire one that they cannot get, and so will have no other."

[@Enerdhil]

@@davidkulmaczewski4911 I am pretty sure he said something similar about the Elves. I think Tolkien believed in true love and soul mates. He certainly demonstrated it in his own life with his wife Edith.

[@istari0]

@@Enerdhil Actually, I suspect the elven population was close to a 50-50 split otherwise many elves wouldn't have a soulmate. Of course, sometimes that would happen anyway due to accidental deaths or deaths in war. But with the elves having a distinct period of life where child bearing was a priority and then later periods where their other interests would dominate and with their immortality, most of them have the time to do it all. Indeed, if the example of Galadriel and Celeborn tells us anything, married elves might spend decades or perhaps even longer, apart. Then again, with their life spans, 20 years apart really isn't that long by their standards.

[@alanmike6883]

A very good question. Closest place that was was numenor and then the beginnings of gondor and to a lesser extent arnor at their founding. After which, two would be destroyed, one by eru, the other by Sauron, civil war, plague and the witch king while gondor would suffer the same but survive in the end after thousands of years but massively under populated

[@jkranites]

Morgoth had a great elf population plan....I thunk thats why

[@TippSuper]

Great vid! Did u consider this topic throught the subject of elves and men couple ? Or u who read this com

[@LordTelperion]

Also the terrible near-genocidal wars (and plagues) greatly reduced the populations of Elves and Humans.

[@TheRedBook]

Indeed but many forget just how long Elves have been around. Imagine if Elves wanted to procreate as often as humans and could do so for 1000s of years. Middle-earth would be VERY busy.

[@LordTelperion]

@@TheRedBook Agreed!

[@Davlavi]

for the algorithm.

[@mrmeowmeow710]

Damm good video from one happy subscriber

[@aditghifari5039]

Orc, and wars: that why we exist

[@aljnddlgdl]

Elves are delicate.

[@celtofcanaanesurix2245]

lets hope for aragorn's sake that when arwen chose mortality, her instincts became mortal as well

[@Enerdhil]

Before I watch this video, if I had to guess why Elves don't reproduce like rabbits, I would say that perhaps immortals do not have much of a sex drive, for whatever reasons. Maybe "making babies" is not enjoyable for them. But the again, we have Feanor and Nerdanel.🤔

[@JustFlemishMe]

It does make a lot of sense biologically; they don't 'need' a new generation, only to not die themselves, for the species to survive, so it makes more sense to focus resources on survival. This fits with the idea in lore that Elves tend to only have children while relatively safe, too!

[@Enerdhil]

@@JustFlemishMe Especially in ancient history, having a larger army was necessary for survival, though often larger armies were used for imperialistic advancement. The point being the Elves always had the smaller armies until they teamed up with the Numenorians. They were only able to survive through stealth and the power of the Elven Rings of Power.

[@JustFlemishMe]

@@Enerdhil True, but being immortal also gives them the advantage of getting to improve their skill far beyond anything a mortal can do. The Elven equivalent of a modern day Army reserve could get in more training than the most battle-hardened human soldier to have ever lived. Quantity over quality, including in war, is very much a viable strategy for Elves; they're consistently superior to most of their opponents and manage to get their fair share of wins because of it. Obviously direct attacks from Dark Lords are kind of game-changers, but Elves, being immortal, I have to assume are also slow to change, not to mention a decent chunk of the time they were just clinging to life rather than getting to re-think their entire society.

[@Enerdhil]

@@JustFlemishMe Did the Elves really ever advance technologically? Without time limits, motivation to finish anything disappears.

[@JustFlemishMe]

@@Enerdhil Not if you're constantly at war it doesn't. And somehow, making better and better weapons seems like it would be seen as a preferable response to just making more children to swell the armies, from an Elven perspective. There are mentions of Morgoth and Sauron stepping up their game, in fact Gloin explicitly says that, while in many ways the old works were better, the new generation has improved on a few things. Technological advancement, while it certainly looks different, isn't 'absent' from Middle-Earth; the Rings of Power themselves were made by first making weaker ones, mere 'essays' in a craft that hadn't fully developped, and then advancing said craft. And yes, this is much more plainly visible with Morgoth, Sauron, Saruman and even the Dwarves... but the Elves needed to keep up, and for the longest time, it seems like they did. At one point, I reckon during the First Battle in the Wars of Beleriand, Orcs with 'iron weapons' are described as better armed than the Green Elves. By the time of LotR, everyone seems to be packing steel.

[@TheChef420]

An interesting case would be the thousands of years between Elrond and his wife the daughter of Galadriel who is also many thousands of years old when she gives birth

[@TheRedBook]

Yes, I really think this is to do with the development of Elrond's character which I lay out in my Elros & Elrond Accidental Twins video. Almost makes them an exception as you say.

[@mikelitty552]

How many die every year in battles with evil things. Seems like whole villages get wiped out all the time.

[@TarMody]

If a part of the mother's soul is passed from mother to child at the birth of an elven child, then shouldn't Míriel have at least as much spiritual power as Fëanor? Also, if the elves are born through reincarnation, why does Fëanor's soul come from his mother, Míriel? Don't these two approaches contradict each other?

[@nickolas.vicente]

The elves are reembodied, the spirit can diminish but it wouldn't be 'recreated'. And that quote may be a bit ambiguous, you have to consider Finwë as well.

[@tobsw3802]

TLDR: The Elves are just fantasy Pandas

[@rochrich1223]

I'm surprised a magic using, long lived race like the Elves would not have shaped the world of Men using the magic of compound interest. Kings and nations can be enhanced or destroyed with the movement of a couple percentage points.

[@shannonmcglumphy5967]

But most elves didn't dabble in the dark arts! 😆 I'm pretty sure Sauron or Saruman would've discovered its secrets eventually...

[@MrARock001]

If both parents nurture their child's Hroa, why was Finwë able to father more children after Fëanor's spiritual needs killed his mother?

[@JimB.Walken]

Here I thought elves just sprang from holes in the ground....

[@MerkhVision]

Surely that sounds more like Hobbits, doesn’t it? Lol

[@Enerdhil]

Too much to think about after watching this video.🤔

[@TheRedBook]

You've left a few comments I have responded to but I've added them to a shortlist for my end of month video anyway since I think others may be interested - Elves over breeding to combat Dark Lords and the state of Dwarf populations too. They may it into that video depending on how the rest of the month goes for comments!

[@Enerdhil]

@@TheRedBook Thanks. Your video fully convinced me that the Elves refrained from reproducing because it took something out of there fëar. You can also add to that the fact that they were fading while they were in Middle Earth. That adds insult to injury, especially for the female Elves. Yet a bigger Elf Army would have helped, especially in Beleriand.

[@kirandeepchakraborty7921]

What about Marriage between Elves and Man

[@alanmike6883]

Mate I know what would've solved the elven population problem. Every major festival they should've had Charlie put-let's Marvin gaye. Lotta young elves wouldve been conceived 😉😂

[@shanenolan8252]

Cheers

[@VikingVern7]

In response to the title of the video. Prolly cause of all the dying that happens.

[@davidseligman6445]

No one counts the goblins beneath our feet.

[@mikealexander1935]

It is clear that Tolkien did not really think about this reproduction issue with regard to elves. Being immortal, there is no replacement fertility rate. Assume a fertility rate of 1. The average woman has a single birth at an average age of 100. Over 6000 years a founding population would have grown 30 fold. The implication in The Silmarillion is there was a population numbering in the tens of not hundreds of thousands in Beleriand in the First Age that would have grown into millions by the end of the Third Age. No evidence for that. My explanation that elves generally are celibate, but can (and do) reproduce when necessary works with Tolkien's aims. Tolkien's interest was in language and history in the sense of what the Chroniclers recorded. This was how history had been done up to Tolkien's youth and so was natural to his thinking. Tolkien needed his Elven population to be what was necessary for the narratives. My mechanism allows for this. Feanor has seven kids because he was great and that was the kind of guy he was, Elrond had three, while Galadriel had one, and I don't think Gil-galad had any. Elves being asexual eliminates elves proliferating in the background. When you need to numbers to grow (say to population Eregion) they breed, then they stop, the excess ship off to Valinor, and you have fewer of them. Whatever the narrative requires happens in a rational manner. Notice that Tolkien did not do this with Dwarves. He designed a naturally slow-breeding population to handle this issue.

[@matthewmcpherson8831]

They are constantly killing each other

[@eduardosouza4651]

The problem is not why it is not overpopulated. The point is that, once the events of The Lord of The Rings end, there would be an eternal peace, so how in thousands of years would they not overpopulate Valinor?

[@MrARock001]

Wasn't Elrond positively ancient when he fathered Arwen?

[@TheRedBook]

Exceptions always exist in Tolkien. Elrond is an even greater exception as his character was pretty much accidental as I point out in my Elrond and Elros video.

[@MrARock001]

@@TheRedBook I suppose he was also "half-elven" so he's a bit of a wildcard compared to other elves.

[@Enerdhil]

Where are the comments?

[@MagusMarquillin]

It posted a minute before you did - patience.

[@Enerdhil]

@@MagusMarquillin Actually, I just started watching it. I am never the first commenter on any of these comment boards.

[@brucealbert4686]

I know Middle Earth Economic Forum

[@JohnMiller-zr8pl]

👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻

[@nicolefischer1504]

Because everyone fucking dies

[@BlankName88]

I'd still prefer to be a man. The gift of men is the true immortality.

[@ritsoneric]

My coworker and I just had a converstion about this a month ago. We decided teenage elves were so awful, parents could deal with lots of kids

[@Enerdhil]

How about Dwarves? Why did they have such few offspring? Were male Dwarves not attracted to female Dwarves' beards? 😂😆🤣

[@TheRedBook]

When it comes to Dwarves, male Dwarves vastly outnumber the female Dwarves. Tolkien says if they are in peril or have no secure dwellings, then they increase in population very slowly. A major reason for the decline of Dwarves was the war against the Orcs - they basically would never recover from the sheer numbers they lost. Same with settlements being attacked by Dragons. They never had the will to produce many children in the first place (more than 4 children was unusual), they had rotten luck when it came to maintaining populations: war, movement of peoples, lack of security and settlements.

[@Enerdhil]

@@TheRedBook That all makes sense. I wonder if the lack of female Dwarves had anything to do with Aulë not having created any in the first place. Obviously, Eru had to created at least seven female Dwarves to make it possible for each House to have a start.

[@istari0]

@@Enerdhil I think there had to have been more than that otherwise their populations would not have grown large enough to establish their kingdoms plus the problem that their children would have had no one to marry and have children with.

[@thomasledbetter5908]

Because it’s a fantasy setting maybe?

[@TheRedBook]

Fantasy settings like Middle-earth have detailed and established rules given to us by the author. So, no.