Empire Unit Roster Tier List Updated Warhammer 3

[@Bolty206]

I'd say the biggest positive that the Emperor's Wrath has over the other Steam Tank variants, is how easy it can be to recruit; if you have the funds to research the tech that unlocks it, you can get it FAR quicker than the time it takes to reach Tier 5, let alone the instant-recruit once you do have one available - it can be a massive early game power-spike if given the chance.

[@SaltyRocksPew]

The earliest I can get it is turn 3 as nuln if I *rush* which is very very good.

[@LordAlucard454]

​@SaltyRocksPew at which point it will make you go bankrupt

[@ilari90]

@@LordAlucard454 only if you don't know how to play

[@mujahidean]

@@LordAlucard454 Skill issue. With the steam tank you've got an army that can destroy literally any other force you will come across for the first 30 turns or so. If you can't make money with that then you really don't understand how money is made in this game.

[@darthnihilus6211]

Didn't Legend also explain the explosion ability wrong? It's an AOE damage ability and not a suicide button

[@LegendofTotalWar]

I recognize I said no units got downgraded when I did in fact downgrade one. Just slipped my mind for the moment and forgot to correct myself.

[@_ProTrax]

Can you also redo Nurgle please, it's been 2 years where they got mortal units and a whole DLC

[@simonmurphy4316]

Nice one! Hope you and the family are going well. I too would love to see an updated nurgle tier list. But I know you hate them so no worries 😂

[@Garret007]

There was just one thing for me that was weird: You took in mind the building for Knights of the Black Rose and the ability it gives them, but didn't even mention the building that buffs the Knights of Blazing Sun, giving them flammable attack, making every enemy they face weak against fire. I would put them on the same tier as Reiksguard, but unlike Reiksguard I find them more useful since Reiksguard mainly only shine in Karl's army.

[@michaelbeasley9401]

@@Garret007 Or even just having a fire wizard to provide the flammable effect when casting could make them much better as well.

[@Thylein]

Why are you never including Regiments of Renown in those lists?

[@kirbyanderson6543]

Legend is way underestimating Nuln Ironsides I think. Not to be the “muh stats” guy but the Ironsides’ projectiles (and Hoch. Long Rifles) are mechanically distinct from standard handgunners’ shot (and Ironsides reload nearly 2x as fast so the DPS penalty from lower model count is completely overcome by fire rate). I’ll copy the main differences below. HG: 0 penetration NIS: 2 penetration, capped at small entities (presumably infantry) HLR: 1 penetration, capped at medium entities (presumably cav) What this means is that the Ironsides and Long Rifles are also specialist ranged units, although these penetration stats are hidden from the player. Ironsides high fire rate (boosted by their dig-in effect) and high penetration on small targets makes them mulch all enemy infantry, from laborers to aspiring champions, as they can basically triple their dps by hitting the first three ranks at once, similar to how chorf blunderbusses have insane dps against infantry. The HLR are a bit more obvious: they’re supposed be taking down cav/flying/monstrous infantry type units well before they can close with your troops, they don’t have as much overall penetration and they sort of waste ammo on low armor targets so higher-tier entities make better targets. On top of all of this, the Ironsides have nearly the same total unit health as handgunners, making individual Ironside models much sturdier than handgunners (more survivability = less ammo lost to entity death). I wouldn’t call Ironsides a “staunch front line” but they make for good Shogun 2-style line infantry, they can hold against chaff units that would otherwise overwhelm handgunners. The Hochland Long Rifles can also counter-snipe dangerous units like Sisters of Averlorn or Eshin ranged units from well beyond their reach (everything except jezzails and cranes but that’s only two races), giving them added utility over the other two options. 260 range alone should be enough to bump the Long rifles up to A. In conclusion, Ironsides and Long Rifles are so effective on the battlefield that they should at least be on par with standard handgunners as the unit improvements are AT LEAST worth the upkeep increase AND model count decrease.

[@nonesuch6833]

Thank you. I knew that both those units deserved better than B rank based on my personal experience of them - Ironsides in particular absolutely melt infantry units - but couldn't work out why they were superior to Handgunners just going off their stats. Target penetration should be something that the game tells you about. Something he also didn't bring up about the HLRs is that they have Snipe, making them specifically good against taking out problem missile units before they can hit back.

[@davecolwell725]

Agreed

[@simonsalgueiro6217]

Legends does this weird flexes all the time, don't understand why. Once mid game starts, recruiting them is super easy

[@friedlbrain]

Can you tell me where I can find this data? I'm playign a Belegar campaign and want to compare Thunderers and Torpedo Irondrakes

[@kirbyanderson6543]

@@nonesuch6833yeah I noticed the snipe but I didn’t think there was an easy way to get them all stalk as well, and iirc snipe only does something if the unit is hidden in trees or stalking so wasn’t sure whether or not to bring it up

[@erensametkaratas6593]

babe wake up. new tier list just dropped

[@gonkdroid9325]

I'm already here, babe.

[@De_Wit]

Nha better put that bra back on, ain't nobody got time for that.

[@Yekta.coskun]

Is this babe you talk about in the room with us now?

[@ilari90]

There's no babe, it's all lies.

[@melvin_doo]

I love seeing this extremely high effort comment on every single KZbin video now. It’s SO funny everytime, as it has been for the past 3 years. “First” always had me ROLFing and now this?!? I can’t EVEN. XD

[@TheGlenn8]

I already massively prefer this format than the other format. This just makes more sense to me.

[@mateusz73]

The biggest redeeming thing about the state troop, emperors wrath, steam tank is that you can recruit it much earlier than you can typically recruit steam tanks

[@blugger]

This It has a very similar impact to Wonder of An Age (land ship ror) but comes out a LOT sooner

[@Aaron537_UNIQUESTRING]

This is why I love it so much. I got it in the first few turns as Karl, and it's just not fair at that stage of the game

[@Fastwinstondoom]

@@Aaron537_UNIQUESTRING First 20 turns is when it is super fun to have a centerpiece unit like this.

[@botep5529]

Ive taken major settlements entirely with that thing only. Just driving around hoovering up kills

[@davecolwell725]

It’s the only empire state troop I don’t save as emergency unit

[@kodybrown9228]

Glad you keep doing tier lists even though they aren’t your favorite. Always here for this content. Would love to see an updated Skaven roster.

[@blugger]

Play Ikit klaw Tier List is WARPLOCK JEZZAILS!!! (With a cheery, "mortars, here-here!" In the background) Playing legendary ultimate crisis, and Ten gold jezzies (there's an undercity building the buffs global recruit rank) with 3-4 poisiim winds as backup will scythe through 3/4 end-times armies You can literally front line with spear rats or even slaves and still come out on top (albeit with plenty of heroes buffering them, ala plague priest summons and chieftains being brolic) The only dedicated melee I've bothered with for actually killing things are brood horrors with packmaster (who summons FREE wolf rats too!). They require micro to hit-and-run but they can shore up the line like no one's business and just mob single entities

[@ilari90]

Why? I think there is one for the current roster already and they haven't changed that much in patches.

[@RealKangarooFlu]

Nothing has changed for the skaven since his last skaven tier list

[@blugger]

@@RealKangarooFlu things have changed, but not nearly enough to merit a new tier list Rip my gloriously overpowered poisoned wind globes

[@maestromarat6195]

The tier list looks solid, the only thing I'd dispute is halberdiers being placed above spearman with shields. Yes Halberdiers have AP damage, but there low melee attack often means they can't make use of it very well, meanwhile spearman with shields have the same melee defense and armor (slightly less hp though) as halberdiers so they are comparably good at holding the line at a cheaper price. On top of that the shields gives some extra flexibility because they won't be hard countered by small arms fire. Aside from that, the Emperor's wrath can be nice early game cause you can often get it leagues earlier than you can get t5 buildings for steam tanks (even though it has a higher price point, one steam tank can be worth as much as 4 crossbow in the right situation) Also knights of the blazing sun 100% should have antil arge so they can make better use of their flaming attacks (against regenerating monstrous infantry)

[@beaver9898]

Nuln Ironsides actually slightly different compared to handgunners because their shots got penetration of 2 while handgunners got 1,so 60 ironsides got dps of 120 handgunners

[@ilari90]

Wow, didn't know this. Also their reload speed is like double of handgunners so they can get rid of enemies faster.

[@LordBruuh]

And they have pretty decent melee defense. SO it makes it easier to make a stack of nuln iron sides that can dish out dmg but also hold the line when doing checkerboard formation. Regular hand gunners will melt even by a menace below on VH.

[@gxrdian]

@@LordBruuh i usually do that with amethyst ironsides, i tend to ignore melee infantry completely when playing elspeth so that my battles get as many schematics as possible, sometimes manual battles can be a little heated but it's definetely worth it, by turn 30ish i'm already at tier IV gunnery school and the best part about using the amethyst units imo is not even their powercreep but its the fact that you can get them anywhere without any buildings and recruit them instantly... a single unit of any of the amethyst variants can single handedly carry many battles, specially the outriders once you get their upgrades with stalk and snipe, you can even close in on other missile units that have superior range and melt them in 1-2 volleys then back off to be invisible again

[@Ebb0Productions]

If you just look at the number of kills/damage after a battle you'll see Ironsides regularly outperform normal handgunners. They don't look that good on paper but the results speak for themselves.

[@tormunnvii3317]

This.

[@zakharov7953]

I think you might be undervaluing Nuln Ironsides. They're way more accurate than handgunners, and in my experience that results in a unit of ironsides doing twice as much damage as a unit of handgunners.

[@paulkirschner4378]

I think they have more penitration as well, not sure about it tho

[@aputin654]

Yeah they're a straight up upgrade. Only thing the handgunners have over them is cost imo.

[@zakharov7953]

@@paulkirschner4378 That's true, Ironsides can potentially hit 3 enemies per bullet while handgunners can only hit one.

[@paulkirschner4378]

@zakharov7953 Good to know, thanks bro

[@tormunnvii3317]

This.

[@strangestecho5088]

The great thing about the Emperors Wrath is that they're easy to add into your frontline armies that are far from your core territory. Being able to instantly toss 1-2 Steam Tanks into any army is quite valuable, and you can often get access to them quite a bit earlier than regular Steam Tanks. You probably should have included Elspeth's Amethyst units, but they are all just S tier anyway.

[@wtf2676]

You can reduce global recruitment time by having 10 buildings? Didn't know that

[@dark_side_cookies]

Yeah I didn't know that until a few hundred hours into WHII. There is a caveat and a bonus to it as well: + If a unit requires two buildings to recruit (like a Barracks and a Blacksmith or Armory type building) you only need 10 of the Barracks, or whatever building its actually recruited from, to get the global recruit bonus. You only need to be able to recruit the unit from one province, so only one Blacksmith is needed. - You can only reduce the recruit time by 1 turn, so having beyond 10 of any recruitment building will not grant additional bonuses. You can still reduce the recruit time further using technology, skills, or bonuses from unique buildings.

[@VampireGranny]

This format makes a lot more sense as it makes it easier to compare tier-to-tier 👍

[@CupcakeConjuror]

I think the main strength of the Elector Count Steam Tank... is that it is a steam tank that can be recruited instantly, no buildings required, really early. You don't need to keep it recruited, but as a reliable emergency unit for a single turn it is a game changer, especially early game where it can just counter anything the enemy throws at you. Festus on your case? Steam tank to his face!

[@udozocklein6023]

well since you can get one every 10 turns, i think it's pretty nice to keep them and use them as actual soldiers rather than RoR-quickrecruit mercenary style.

[@BIGmlems]

Really easy to abuse them of you leave Cathay as gelt and get that bonus, which if your army is loaded with mercenaries then you can choose to steamroll the camps, drycha, or festus while your kot being charged for upkeep for however many turns.

[@BIGmlems]

Vamps not camps

[@Rakiael07]

Right on cue! I'm currently doing a Karl Franz campaign and this tier list could come in handy.

[@blugger]

@@Rakiael07 be warned that melee infantry are mostly ass...but that's only the NORMAL infantry Don't be scared of spamming free company militia (saviors of the early game, imo) and go sparingly on melee troops that aren't the super special elector counts' ones

[@sup1602]

@@blugger They are really only really ass if one doesn't make use of the new empire captains or war priests. Both halberds and great sword units can get some work done.

[@trevorbanks4136]

Same

[@blugger]

@sup1602 I always make use of both extensively Even augmented empire melee infantry with Karl Franz + red line + research rush for...what +12 MA and MD? Spearmen and Swordsmen still folded to Vlad's ghouls, to say nothing of how worthless they are against Vlad, himself, and his harem. In my experience, bring FCM early game and they won't let you down. Later, you bring bigger guns. Melee infantry are there to die before your important stuff (special units, ala elector count troops, obviously excepted) and to pad out armies on legendary where you can't to flood the world with land ships and tanks Which I found was pretty easy to do on very hard, ironically

[@Rakiael07]

@@blugger Isn't it risky to spam FCM? How am I supposed to hold the line vs large units?

[@erwanMosca]

Outrider grenade launcher are S tier in my opinion, they are costly but they definitly melt everything except single entities

[@jessebrown618]

Would you be willing to do a legendary hero tier list?

[@MrBellyar]

Steam tank requires t5 + building + turns to recruit. Emperors Wrath is an instant recruitment Unit that you can get ANYWHERE. An emergency steam tank can be Very good.

[@CommanderTavos99]

As a German, I highly approve more Empire content!

[@WoofyMcDoodle]

what does that have to do with Germany?

[@set_5341]

@@WoofyMcDoodle the Empire just a more competent magical Holy Roman Empire.

[@trapzed5331]

@@set_5341more competent?

[@alexduffy7925]

@@WoofyMcDoodle Because the Empire is based on the Holy Roman Empire, lol

[@WotansCry]

​@@WoofyMcDoodle you never realized that you fight using German imperial army units while playing the Warhammer Empire?!

[@Jelteification]

It's good to prioritze the cavalry building if you want to recruit faster because it gives +1 local recruitment.

[@blugger]

That, and empire knights are literally the only dedicated melee unit worth half a gosh darn until tier 3 (then, it's the ebon rose guys) Very fun to run 3-4 in your early game armies, and ofc they're a lot stronger with volkmar. Whereas I've found mortars to be largely worthless, firing the whole battle to barely make their value back. The artillery building at tier 2 is personally solely for the engineer hero

[@ilari90]

Rarely an issue though compared to getting better units for me at least and more hero capacity. Getting more eco is more valuable. Only cav buildings I usually have are from confederations.

[@ironsilk6634]

As an Empire main, I absolutely agree with this tierlist. This is very well thought out!

[@TheGlenn8]

Empire should have Halberdiers (heavy armor) and you cannot change my opinion on this.

[@blugger]

Great halberds

[@Psykanetic]

I wish the Empire had a heavy armour infantry similer to the warriors of chaos.

[@rocci99]

​@@Psykanetic Empire greatsword?

[@TheGlenn8]

@@Psykanetic I want them to be worse than chaos warriors. Really all I want is a defensive empire infantry that doesn't lose half HP to orc boys but can also defend against cavalry.

[@gustavoaraujopenha8463]

@@Psykanetic So.... greatswords?

[@Sarcasmses]

The only unit placement I complete disagree with is Hochland Long Rifles. They vastly outdamage the other Empire gun units, and all other Empire ranged units, because their bullets have strikethrough. A single shot can go through multiple models and damage them all. Just try a side by side test, even if you turn fire at will off on Hochlands and wait to shoot until they are within range of Ironsides and Handgunners, the Hochlands will vastly outdamage both units even with the lower model count. Then add the range in, Hochlands are clearly the best Empire ranged infantry.

[@blugger]

I rate them more "artillery" than ranged units proper Their burst damage still doesn't compare to a full rapport of gunpowder from outriders or ironsides/handgunners, but their sustained damage over their massive range will outpace them fairly quickly My endgame armies have generally included four hellstorms with four long rifles as a matter of principle

[@quantustremorestfuturus5434]

they do lack ammo though

[@jackbizzell7136]

"B tier doesn't mean bad" good comment that. Some of those B tier units have saved my worthless hide more than once and in the early game they've been pretty damn reliable, especially the militia and spearmen. Militia are the best units in the army for killing low tier Greenskin and Vampire armies. Build an army of Militia watch them shred the shit out of gobbos, skeletons and zombies.

[@botep5529]

Hell yeah militia have a special place in my heart. Playing volkmar one campaign, skarbrand charged my front line and got absolutely melted by a barrage of magic infused pistols fired by mere mortal men.

[@HeloisGevit]

This is the best format for doing unit tier lists.

[@IainDoherty51]

I find it interesting that Legend doesn't value the shields on spearmen. I always found that very worthwhile against a lot of the factions that use a fair chunk of missiles. It tended to stiffen the front line while your own missile units or cav picked off the enemy missiles

[@redcrown5154]

they're great, but they don't do much against most of the empire's enemies

[@paulkirschner4378]

I agree that the shield and little extra melee defense are really good. But the early game enemies almost all are shit melee units with a couple big enemies that you have to kill. Vampires, beastmen, nurgle, greenskins, tomb kings. The only exception being ogres with nuln. So, in all of these circumstances, it is better to get the missile barracks even against ogres

[@blugger]

Problem is the investment of a building slot and not really getting much out of it, even if captains are okay, plus their performance not improving too terribly much. In the early game, free company militia shall die for your sins. Recruit them en masse and never look back, for only they (and pistoleers) have a signar damn prayer against Vlad and Vlad's harem...or at really doing *any* damage at all For mid game, I'll try out flagges, given legend's apparent love for them and since warrior priest causality replenishment is so damn good. Now, in multiplayer, you take five shielded spears (that's the maximum cap per specific unit card) no questions asked.

[@andrewlechner6343]

Yes, but Empire's primary enemies are the vampires and Chaos, who don't have many ranged units.

[@ilari90]

@@paulkirschner4378 Tomb Kings can be pretty ranged heavy sometimes, those archers can do a lot vs freemen for example

[@martimyan7225]

Yeah, mortars meet your expectations IF you expect of them to miss, being dodged, stuck in the troops formation and killing your own infantry.

[@Weberkooks]

I like the new way it's organized, it has a more logical flow imo and really drives home the point that recruitment matters more than stats.

[@andyvanmuilekom7390]

Go by type easier to search if you are doibting between spears and halberds for some reason

[@jimelliott8931]

the caroberg greatswords get focussed down by the ai missiles and being unbreakable means they get wiped out more than greatswords

[@tyedruken9233]

I really like it being done by building tier, helps divide it up by what you want at each stage of the game

[@alilhard]

Always love your tier lists mainly because of the explanations on the pros and cons of each choice. I think the ordering is great to have the video running while playing to inform some building and recruitment decisions in the early stages of a campaign without having to scrub too much through the video back and forth between the different same tier units although I'm guessing it takes more effort to setup so wouldn't be grudging you not doing it every time.

[@muggy5907]

Great tier list again, Legend! For my tier list, I'd just exchange the handgunners and the nuln ironsides. I noticed that the nuln ironsides are more accurate for fast moving entities such as a vampire hero on a flying mount. The Knights of the Black Rose when they have the Iron Resolve skill is crazy. I usually have 4-5 units of them as my front line and charge at the enemy. Really good against the Vampire Counts. I had an army comp of 5 heroes, 5 iron sides, 2 hochland long rifles, 2 reiksguard, 4 black rose and 2 hellstorm and the knights of the black rose all had 1k+ kills each.

[@blugger]

There's a missile unit stat that isn't readily visible called "calibration distance," which is generally lower than the unit's max range. Units firing from that "calibration distance" are a hell of a lot more accurate. Outriders in particular, one of my favorite units, become SIGNIFICANTLY more accurate when firing from half their maximum range. They will absolutely blend basically anything at that range, and they have the speed to dance in and out of it. But Nuln ironsides? Their calibration distance IS their maximum range, meaning they will always fire with maximum accuracy whereas handgunners do not Plus they won't fold to a stiff breeze, so you have a few seconds more to bail them out of trouble

[@ilari90]

@@blugger Thanks, didn't know this. But yeah, i'd put Ironsides on A or S for me with their reload speed and tankiness alone.

[@blugger]

@@ilari90 idk about S, as the long rifles have worked their way into my heart pretty quickly (even playing as Festus, thanks to vandalized empire, I always seem to have around four in any army) But I do like em a lot, especially their look and how they don't just crumble to the loving caress of basic zombies. They've sometimes functioned as a """"""front line"""""" when I simply cannot be arsed with melee infantry, though they still mainly win their """melee""" engagements by fighting the tattered half-a-thing that comes stumbling out of a hail of bullets that killed all its mates. They're not as good as kislev streltzi (spelling?) when it comes to this hybrid role, as they're not quite cool enough to have axe blades on their guns, but sigmar strike me down if they don't seem CONSIDERABLY more accurate! Gunpowder in TWW can be *stupidly* finnicky with elevation and obstruction, so I put far greater value on units that can compensate for that relative to basic handgunners. Free company (early game or volkmar) --> won't die to trash in melee Outriders --> fast as fun, booiii!!!! Ironsides --> perfectly accurate at maximum range (leaving less survivors to reach them in melee before they can reload) and last a few seconds in melee and can therefore be saved Long rifles --> LOOOONG range

[@GutsOfRivia]

The Emperors Wrath being an elector count unit means Karl makes it have significantly cheaper upkeep than a standard Steam Tank and also buffs its damage.

[@predragmarkovic2682]

The one ranking I don't fully agree with is Spearmen (Shields) vs Halberdiers.Imo these units should be in the same tier,they have the same MD,same armor,15vs16 bonus vs Large and nearly the same HP so you get +10 leadership and AP damage in exchange for losing shields and much higher cost.Against any enemy with a lot of range,the Spearmen will outperform, especially when you take into consideration that you get Handgunners at the same time as Halberds,so you have a source of AP anyway.

[@GLORPDORP]

Halberds have a bit more MD than spearmen with shields if I recall, but what really makes them better is the tech upgrade that gives them expert charge defense, that makes a huge difference in their ability to hold against infantry. The lack of missile block doesn't hurt them either in my experience, just hold them in the rear flanks against missile heavy armies. Since missile heavy armies don't have as much front line to hold back against, your lords and heroes should be able to hold the front in those situations anyway.

[@ajeasports1245]

Really liked the new format with the units being grouped by building, hope you keep it for other tier lists too when they eventually come. Cheers Legend!

[@strigoi_guhlqueen8355]

I like this new approach. It also serves as a guide

[@RicWalker]

I disagree about the handgunners. the regulars may have more entities and are cheaper, but they reload slow as F. by the time the regulars shot 3 times, the hochlanders are already in their reload animation for their 6th salvo. If you have to deal with fast units, hochland handgunners get an extra salvo out before they have to run or stand their ground in melee. that extra salvo compared to the regulars can make the difference between an enemy reaching you or breaking at the last second. after about 50 hours playing nuln and reikland testing this, i stopped recruiting regulars. Hochland Handgunners are just that much more reliable. i would switch them in the Tier list.

[@ilari90]

I think you mean Nuln Ironsides, but yeah, their reload speed is almost double, and the melee stats and armour make them survive in auto battles, I'd put them to A or S tier.

[@blugger]

They're also a lot less accurate until they're about at half their max range (outriders too, but those lovely boys have approx 90 speed) Ironsides are perfectly accurate at maximum range.

[@joshwalton25]

Ironsides literally shoot twice as fast as Handgunners. Even with slightly fewer entities, they're in a completely different league from Handgunners.

[@astari24]

I am getting a sudden urge to play my 37th Empire campaign BTW, Helblaster Volley Guns are easily S+ tier for aut resolve. They do absurd amounts of damage that you could basically use them as 'archers' in mid to late game

[@hiddendragon415]

I know right, there is just something appealing about Empire.

[@AspectPL]

You've become really good at doing these tierlists. You're fair and consider even units you don't like. It's a joy to watch. Would like to see more unit tierlists :D

[@dano0911]

YES!! TIER LIST! They are packed with so much information to learn.

[@senti5468]

Really appreciate the new format of comparing units by how they are recruited.

[@prosski7949]

Luminarks provide 20% wardsave in 55m range around them. Stacks with the light mage which provides 10% in the same range. They are a part of an intensively powerful defensive combo.

[@alistairbolden6340]

Reiksguard are extremely good once you get the building that gives them double charge bonus, with that they become some of the best flanking cav in the game. The Carrowberg greatsword increase its damage from about 35 to 55ish thx to Franz on him they are very good infantry, they can even fight chosen with the help of healing or buffs from frenzy/warrior priests. TLDR as each lord use what units that lord buffs, in the case of Franzy Reiksguard and carrowberg greatswords are very good. You can get the Reiksguard charge bonus to over 200 on franz and cav tech, they will delete anything at that point, they deal far more damage than demi griffs but have a different role.

[@PacmanPac-m8y]

i cannot understand why anybody would ever use flagellants when greatswords hold the line better and still deal a ton of damage.

[@tonicus123]

I'd say that the old way was better for evaluating unit to unit as you compared roles and not tiers. Your old tier lists were some of the most organized I've ever seen a tier list video.

[@fruitloops1481]

This format is superior to your old format. Thanks for the updated tier list and format!

[@khankhomrad8855]

I like this new Tier evaluation. It gives you a new perspective on the usual Tier list ranking.

[@garrick3727]

Pretty much agree with the tier list. Additional observations: 1. I prefer Nuln Ironsides to the regular Handgunners because they seem to do more damage and they take up less space on the battlefield, which also makes them slightly more maneuverable. I don't think that justifies a higher tier though. They're good against skaven because menace below is far less effective against them. 2. Steam tanks seem to run out of ammo quicker than most other missile units. They are surprisingly effective in melee though. I often find myself turning fire at will off and using them in melee until a high priority target at range shows up. Great with an engineer lord. 3. I really like mortars because they are cheap and effective, although keep in mind I don't auto resolve much so I am more hands on in sieges. They're good for clearing the walls of missile units. Hellstorm rocket batteries get far more kills, but mortars have more target selection flexibility because they care less about walls and terrain. Great cannons are of limited usefulness, although they are the best against single entities; however, steam tanks just do it better. 4. Spearmen with shields massively outlast halberdiers and regular spearmen. The empire has a weak front line until you can afford several steam tanks, and I find the spearmen with shields just survive better, even late game. Knights of the Black Rose can also hold the line. I tend to use them to get in the way of an enemy that somehow bypasses the regular infantry line. 5. Land ships die easily. The AI seems to target them, and they are not that good in melee. Often, if one unit dies in my army, it's usually a land ship. They do a good job of occupying the enemy though, since they fire in many directions. 6. I prefer outriders to pistoleers due to better range and far more ammo. They do have the disadvantage that they can only shoot forwards though. 7. If you play Elspeth, the Amethyst units just wreck everything, at least the Amethyst Ironsides, Hellstorm and in particular the Grenade Outriders. Landship is the least valuable one.

[@heathcliffheath5947]

i would love a tier list for Bretonnia

[@deathhamstersnikch6685]

They didn't get anything new from the last one he's done

[@heathcliffheath5947]

@@deathhamstersnikch6685 from 2 years ago?

[@Scriptures_K]

Come back in about a decade, they might receive some changes by then. Bretonnia's units still suffer from PS1 graphics compared to every other faction ('cept maybe vamps and undead), it's a shamefur dispray.

[@maestromarat6195]

grail reliquae S tier Everything else D tier, any other questions?

[@Bleed1987]

maybe bretonia gets updated in next patch. i really hope so cause they lack content/faction mechanics

[@Kosss2001]

@LegendofTotalWar you may not have considered it worth mentioning but with Franz he also juices great swords significantly (similar to reiksguard). Thanks for the video, I definitely learned some things to try in my current campaign!

[@jasonhickle7584]

I find that Ironsides generally outperform handgunners damage wise and can outlast them but mileage may vary!

[@IainDoherty51]

Gunderman's Surefires are outright some of the best gunpowder infantry units that the Empire has, and are always a priority for me to collect when I'm playing as Karl Franz or as Nuln. The fact that the enemy can't see them in your formations and the fact that they aren't outranged by most bow units means that they are significantly better at handling enemy forces and staying alive. The Melee stats also mean they're less squishy against things like bats that might try to disrupt your backlines, and thus maintain a lot more balance of power overall

[@frikenlp1999]

You might be able to answer that.. Don't they have magic shots or am I thinking about a RoR unit?

[@IainDoherty51]

@@frikenlp1999 You're thinking of the Silver Bullets RoR

[@BebertLeTentacule]

Not alone here, but love the new format, it make sense with the way you structure your ideas since your first Warhammer tier list.

[@karakaaa3371]

I think the smaller unit count is actually a bonus for Nuln Ironsides, it makes it easier for them to concentrate fire and focus down targets quickly, and it's a smaller frontline you need to protect.

[@zwestlich6587]

i still prefer the old style where you cover the units base on their category, It's easier to compare their ability.

[@ilari90]

I think this way you understand the game more.

[@SkullivanBones]

Would love to small empire rework that replaces the stable building with a stable house based on a minor knightly order that then lets you recruit that specific order's empire knight varient. Of course that come with the benefit of completely removing the vanilla "empire knight" unit from the game since it would be rendered moot by the ability to recruit the specified varient, and also vanilla "empire knights" is boring AF. Each minor order would require a seperate stable house, but they would all upgrade to the livery, and retain the ability to recruit whatever order you picked from the bunch at tier 2. Then the major orders (black rose, blazing sun, (hopefully some day)panthers, and reiksguard) are all still recruited from the tier 3 livery building, but get the current in game added benefits if you build the chapter house in their home regions.

[@SkullivanBones]

Would mod it in myself, but the only thing i've ever messed with was unit stat tables so im a bit lacking in ability 😅

[@botep5529]

My last elspith campaign i confederated volkmar. I gave him an army of 2 outriders, 2 grenade outriders, 2 helstorms, and the rest free company. The bonus volkmar gave , plus the benefits of nulns upgrades made the free company stupidly powerful. Added a hochland scopes engineer and it was such a fun army to use.

[@LordBeff]

I think the two ordering systems are both valid since one tells you what buildings to build, and the other once you've built (or if you capture a settlement with a building already), what to recruit

[@Rastous]

I would rate the spears with shields higher personally as always think the infantries role is to be cheap holders and with higher melee defense and shields they hold better giving more value from your archers/guns.

[@regencyrow1867]

Thank you for pointing out that the Empire are very much a combined arms army, B-tier is perfectly viable, but it is essential you pair them with units which cover their weaknesses.

[@stefanhofmaier5078]

Well done - format is perfect

[@Coerciveutopian]

An important factor for Emperor's Wrath is that you can usually recruit it way earlier than regular steam tanks so it gives you a really strong unit early on (even if it is expensive).

[@Chewkappa]

one thing to note about the Carrobourg Greatswords is that unlike normal GSs they also get increased weapon strength as they level up

[@MrParadux]

The grouping by building is a good idea. That makes comparing them between each other easier

[@himdailungpamei983]

I'm very confident that we will have another empire tier list video when we get the DLC with Boris and Knightly Orders come out, more religious fanatics faction and knights, but probably faction specific to middenland

[@theblackaphid2257]

Good list, the only addendum that would say is the knights of the black rose is absolutely s tier after getting the building and getting life magic in the army.

[@inductivegrunt94]

I can kinda understand the Halbardiers being higher than Spearmen(Shields) mainly due to the enemies the Empire is likely to face early on, Vampire Counts, Beastmen, Norsca, Warriors of Chaos. Those factions lack or have very few non-magical ranged options available to them, so the shield is not that necessary when you aren't facing much in the way of missile units. However I believe the Emperor's Wrath Steam Tank should be S tier since it's instantly recruited so you can throw it into any fight needed once you have it available. It's worth the upkeep to have a massive boost to power in an instant.

[@eaSY1511]

thx a lot! always looking forward to your tier list videos!!!

[@Payythakidd]

I was thinking I missed this at some point and went on you’re channel yesterday to see if you posted this tierlist yet I guess u read my mind

[@Snowstrider0001]

I think the cavalry could be valued a bit higher if for no other reason than their building increasing local/global recruit slots. So even if you're just recruiting armies of trash, having the cavalry building means you can recruit more at once, and potentially save money by not needing to hire a new general or maintain a new supply line to finish recruitment before sending an army out. For instance, in Reikland, you should be able to get 5 recruit slots when using the commandment at T3 with the cavalry building constructed. With 3 global recruitment slots, you'd have 14 low-tier units in an army in just two turns. That's nearly a full trash stack in a very short time, so I think the extra recruit speed provided may serve to offset the opportunity cost of constructing an economic building at a later time. I know your focus wasn't on the buildings per se, but I felt the added utility the cavalry buildings take on by being the replacement blacksmith building is still worth mentioning.

[@Quantorful]

I prefer by unit type because it's easier to come back later and check specific things. It's also easier to cross compare units which fill similar roles, e.g., crossbowman vs hand gunner, which are separate building chains but fill the same role. Also, it's harder to do timestamps for this video in a coherent fashion.

[@Nobdythere]

I can't decide which format I like more. Both are good and have different benefits. I might be a bit biased towards the old way, but that might be nostalgia.

[@thevenator3955]

Nice to see how many units got moved up in tiers, means the empire reworks did a good job!

[@JL-ti3us]

A cool buff for recruiting the knights of the everlasting knights; since their a verenan unit, would be if for each unit recruited it would boost your research rate by something like 2-5% per unit.

[@JesseStinkman115]

The empire is my favourite faction, I don't play almost anything else. Thank you for this tierlist.

[@babayagagaming123]

love this format cant wait for more tier lists

[@General_Lunacy]

I just wanna mention that the state steam tank can usually be recruited long before you ever get a tier 5 settlement. At least in any of my Wissenland & Nuln playthroughs.

[@thesnagglewolf]

First we get a 5 hour disaster campaign, now a new tier kist. Legend releasing some bangers.

[@Merknilash]

I know you don’t like these vids LoTW but I would like a yearly tier list update for factions Also - artillery I’ve been having issues with now that AI cheats to perfectly dodge projectiles Cannons can’t really be dodged and are quite good against approaching infantry blobs, unlike grudge throwers and mortars which just get dodged

[@Tha1mikemike]

For crashes when using an Intel Raptor Lake: make sure you have the latest Bios for your motherboard installed (should state it includes micro code fix). This also includes setting recommended CPU power limits through BIOS in the ~internal CPU power settings~ section. In addition: you will also need to under clock your CPU. Generally, a .5 GHz under clock only on P cores should suffice. This has worked for me. I was getting crashes on CP2077, RDR2, etc. TWH3 will still have the odd crash, but very sparse and related to the game. Also just watched begging of Legend's Belegar Pt.3... very unfortunate. Hope you get everything cleared up soon.

[@wendigo7176]

Cattle ranches (tier 3) lowers pistoliers and outriders upkeep cost by 3%, you can make cheap (if not free) army with them and they are quite usefull. Master engineer, 2 light wizard for Net of whatever spell and 2-4 good unit that counters enemy with range (optional)

[@hal0dude7]

I think for Emperor's Wrath as others mentioned, its value is definitely in how early you can get it, like WAY earlier than when you can recruit steam tanks, and the power spike from just plopping one of these guys into your army, when enemy army's are still full of trash is just crazy. While playing as Elspeth I could just send this thing charging solo into the enemy army once they enter into range of my artillery, they get distracted and blob around it while my artillery and ranged units gun them down.

[@edmonkeys3]

i had no idea the timeframe for global recruitment was affected by the number of buildings that can recruit those people.... You always learn something from the Legend

[@Firefocus-fz2we]

To be fair, if you are far enough in the campaign and have enough money to recruit a Steam Tank you can go for more space-efficient units without significant dent in your economy.

[@joshuablade6974]

Volkmar makes FMC and Crazies S-Tier! Add on a 360 firing arc for the FMC’s and you’ve got a glorious infantry army that can handle anything!

[@doogen]

I much prefer the ironsides to regular handgunners, even in a franz campaign. don't know if their stationary buff thing does all that much but it seems they simply do more dps, which that is the name of the game with missiles. That being said, in a pinch I had to go with 4 surefires once and with the engineer hero near by basically were on-par, maybe the surefires slightly did better, but not by much. Another good thing about the ironsides is they actually seem to do better from the walls once they are secured. In the rare case the enemy AI grows a pair and actually attacks you in the settlement, it's pretty striking how much better the ironsides do.

[@pyrrhus6264]

My early game Elsperh campaigns are all Outrider spam. They practically hard counter Ogres, which is nice when Skragg inevitably attacks in the middle of you dealing with Vlad

[@jamesk2325]

I like this format better because it helps convey strength by game phase

[@jacawandersmok9043]

0:55 i prefer this format;

[@dfyz1407]

Yeap, building is very important

[@Chirox82]

A less obvious benefit to the Emperor's Wrath that brings it up to S rank in my books - it's fairly easy to rush one out in the early game. I usually add my first one to a trash stack of archers and spearmen to turn that army into a legitimate threat. Trash holds the line while I micro the steam tank, it's ludicrously effective for a surprisingly long time

[@pnutz_2]

it's amazing with pistoliers going from being an attack-dogs-with-guns joke on tww1's release to where they are now

[@randomhunter5549]

I agree The Emperor's Wrath steam tank is worse than the base tank, but i have found it has the major bonus of being much easier to recruit which gives it alot of utility and makes it so it's usable far earlier in campaign

[@ninjablood2799]

i hope dwarfs remade tier list will follow soon 🙏 (good video btw)

[@claytonimor34]

I didn't know, man. I generally main the spearmen with shields as my main line holders for the entire game. Sure it's not that big of an upgrade from the regular guys, but the additional shield increases their survivability against the only thing that the enemy can deploy to quickly break the regular ones (ranged) at such a low increase to cost or upkeep that I'm usually running with at least four in an army to hold the line no matter what the enemy brings (except the ogres, who i just shoot and hero kite).

[@pyrhusofeprius]

Yessss!!! Unit tier lists are back!

[@SilverforceX]

Legend, Halberdiers have Charge Def vs All via the research tree. This means they negate fully all the huge charge bonuses that elite infantry gets, no +20-40 dmg or accuracy on the clash. Spearmen lack this trait, making them crumble extremely fast vs elite infantry. Halberdiers basically become the solid line vs all enemies with this trait, they really negate the biggest factor of elite infantry. Its why units like Phoenix Guard, Ironbreakers are so solid at line holding (not their armor, elite infantry are all AP).

[@travisspicer5514]

The knights of the blazing sun get flammable attacks so they would reduce most fire resistance to close to zero and increase the damage per hit for units without flame resistance.

[@osowiec2430]

Have in mind that in the campaing for each elector count capital you own, at least with karl faction, state troops get their upkeep reduced by a LOT so they are kinda way cheaper.