Ep 10.1 Various ways to copy a guitar neck profile? - Building a Guitar from 42000 year old wood

[@Axisflics]

In scale model making I use fresh solder wire to mould around a piece and transfer to paper (or styrene sheet) to make templates for carbon fibre print decals.

[@oldmanzen6682]

I know this is an older video, but I’m hoping you’re still seeing these comments. Considering the scope of your shop now (yes, I’ve been watching that long), I wonder if it would help you to build a neck “copying” jig. I likely can’t post links in comments, so do a KZbin search for Rob Scallon Building a Classical Guitar From Scratch, and (if you’re in a rush) skip to 39:30. They have a fantastic jig setup to copy any neck. I’m guessing it would really help with this kind of thing.

[@Drajan24]

Thanks for sharing that video; it was a really cool way to go about it!

[@jasondavis2000]

Before it gets edited, the original title of this video was "Name of Guitar/project - Episode number and content - Series Name" so all of the other comments make more sense. Loving it! Ben: "I should own stock in masking tape!" Also Ben: Spends several minutes making a masking tape dinosaur. Brilliant!

[@skywipe1949]

I had forgotten about that. I was wondering what that was about. Thanks for the reminder!

[@flapjack413]

Ben, I have that same metal profile copier. I can get an accurate profile with it by taking a width of pins wider than the neck, pushing them up higher than the neck first, then setting it over the neck, and pushing the pins down with my finger just until they touch the neck. This stops the issue of the pins splaying out at the edges when you press the whole straight row of the pins down over the neck. Give it a try sometime, it works quite well!

[@terryjohinke8065]

Like your work. Have been working on guitars since a kid in 1969. My way of shaping a neck is using cabinet scrapers and counting the number of strkes, literally, side by side. I also shape a nek flat in the middle if the guitar player / customer has been classically trained. Also , I ask to see their hands and size of hand , ask them in a DETAILED way what they prefer. To my surprise many don't like the U shape of the Telecaster 52 re-issue- which is 1" throughout.. So I place a great deal of importance on their information to me. I think it's important to a paying customer to talk in detail about what THEY want. Also, as I am Downunder, what parts are best yet not pricey. Hope this helps.

[@AndrewSmith-pc8eq]

That was the longest advertisement for a contour gauge that I've ever sat through!

[@paulpalmer4863]

i use a short length of solder to replicate the shape. glue to a piece of paper, cut with a scalpel. Perfect every time.

[@CalOnGuitar]

Please don’t change the title, it’s amazing

[@HardRockWorkshop]

A flexible curve ruler from a stationary supplier would also do the trick. Shape round the neck, lift off and draw - just make sure it’s hasn’t sprung back as you lift it off.

[@Craftlngo]

I had the same idea and looked up curve ruler. There are also professional bendable rulers that can be used directly as a routing template!

[@MrErViLi]

Possibly even modeling clay or plumbers putty

[@icemanlee666]

How about cling film and expanding foam once it’s sets you could easily cut it down to a cross section, and it sets pretty firm too

[@Paul-D]

I didnt expect to find such wisdom only 4 comments in hahahaha

[@julialacey1604]

When I've done this kinda thing in the past I've used cling film, cardboard and rapid set epoxy. Rough cut the cardboard and use it as a base for the epoxy. After an hour you have a rock hard EXACT mould/template - dead hard, rigid and easy to work with.

[@elgee]

Clingfilm and phymo moulding clay or mouldable plastic which come as pellets that that you have to heat in water. Both work great.

[@BBGuitars]

In the car audio world they have things for tracing out curves. It's some sort of rubber with a flat side and wire in it. Bend it to the shape, remove and trace, done.

[@rakentrail]

Ben, wrap the area you want to copy with thin plastic food wrap and use the two part plumber's epoxy putty to model the shape.

[@Take-the-Ticket]

Self identifier, opinion about, compliment.

[@Patbwoy]

Cut out a slightly oversized rough neck shape out of some wood, line the shape with something like those 2k-putty sticks, the stuff where you have to mix 2 pieces of a Plasticine-like substance by hand until it's uniform, and press it on the neck (masking tape to protect the neck) Once the putty has hardened, take it off, refine it, and you'll have a durable neck jig for future builds. Basically the Plasticine Idea, but with stuff that hardens within a few minutes.

[@ampheadz2965]

It has always been about the chase, & not the capture. In the future may Ben you and your great crew can do a video covering the several different way's one can replicate a existing neck shape without the use of a CNC machine. Much aloha to all at CG...🤙🏼

[@howard922]

Pre photoshop and illustrator we used rotring pens and flexible curve a plastic coated lead strip with an edge for drawing against. Bend round neck mark start and finish lift off and draw.

[@matt_phistopheles]

Last time I tried this I used something like your last approach with the vertical masking tape. I just used a layer of match sticks at the bottom like a sushi roll and then glued more layers of sticks on top. This way I got a perfect copy of the neck shape. That said, I accidentally destroyed the template when I tried to make it smaller. At the end I just eyeballed it and the result was great even though it wasn't a perfect match. To be more precise: Put a long piece of masking tape on the desk with the sticky side up. Now place a layer of match sticks (without heads) across the tape, packed as tightly as possible. After that wrap this construction around the neck like a sushi roll with the tape facing downwards. It should now perfectly replicate the shape of the neck. Now stabilize the shape with more sticks, tape or whatever you like.

[@shoutykat]

Loving the video title

[@WAMilyFamily]

I have an MTD bass with an asymmetrical neck and absolutely love it! Asymmetrical necks are much more comfortable.

[@darrylportelli]

The masking tape trick worked perfect for me to copy a gibson neck ... You have to do a few tries until you get it perfect but it works. I was thinking to do this again and make one out of black cardboard and when its perfect i will scan it with white paper underneath and then i can convert the image to an svg and ultimately 3d print the shape so that i have a repeatable one 😊

[@TheDiaboliq666]

Put electrical tape on the neck. Mix some auto body repair putty (filler). Oil the tape for easy removal. Put the putty over the tape. Once hardened, remove it. Flaten the sides of the shapes on a flat sender. If you deem the things hard enough use directly as gauges, so you only transfer to paper in order to figure out the angles for the faceting. You can build the gauges up for easy holding when measuring. You can also stick electrical tape on the arc of your newly made gauges so you null any difference from applying the electrical tape to protect the neck.

[@johndowd9705]

Use a strand of 3d printing filament, after protecting the neck the same way but using Kapton tape, heat up the plastic with a heat gun then when it cools off, just a thought 😊

[@archloy]

With feeler gauges-like instrument, you could prepare directly your cuts lines directly from the exising neck. But it need at least 2 axes and be set to reference the top of your blank. A bit tricky to make I suppose, but could work

[@christophermatthews638]

This is a suggestion and I haven't tried yet. You could take a large number of photo's and then use a photogrammetry program like Meshroon (others are available for free). This will give you a 3D model which you could produce as many templates as necessary.

[@corwinwhitehorn7759]

And you could program a CNC to carve it for you... multiple times

[@hogthrob]

Also, you can get 3D scanner apps for your phone.

[@TomLeg]

I know nothing about building guitars, but I would try to place some roughly-shaped pieces of cardboard or foam core on top of the tape protecting the guitar neck, tape them in place, and use some plaster of paris or other casting material, to generate negative forms.

[@stuartgreenshields5591]

Have you seen how rifle stocks are shaped? It's done on a special lathe. That's how you do it. You set up your original neck and new neck on spindles in parallel, and mechanically linked so the rotate together. Then set up a parallelogram with one arm on the original and the other arm with a cutting tool, moving down and rotating until you get all the way round. Sand out the machining and you've got a pretty perfect copy.

[@BoBlinhot]

You could have use milliput to get the shape, takes a while to set up hard but you would be left with a lump of epoxy which could be used again

[@joshsocshift]

Came here to suggest miliput/green stuff

[@PaulCooksStuff]

Couldn't you just take a strip of lead, bend it round the neck, then draw on paper/card? Experiment with lead thickness so it's thick enough to hold shape but still easily bent, but not thin enough that it loses shape if brushed or casually breathed upon by an asthmatic dwarf (ie stronger than a Gibson headstock)

[@simonsmith2642]

I had an “augmented D” profile on a strat but hated it and got rid of it. Martin does it on some guitars had a D15M that was Asymmetrical Oval, best neck I ever had very comfortable, I like soft V on my Fenders, and Im watching you, to learn how to carve a standard C into a V.

[@wiltshiredoug9959]

That title is the opposite of click bait!

[@QXZJX]

You are both the Sherlock Holmes and the Dr Frankenstein of the guitar building world❤❤

[@fusion-music]

The iris circle gauge is lovely to have and use and is asymmetric design ideas. They look good too. But they don't help you out with copying a neck as quickly as you were able to do. I still prefer the wire gauge even though it has it's weaknesses.

[@jurrione]

Put 2 sided tape on the neck near the body and the headstock and put a strip of sandpaper on the tape with the sand side on the double sided tape. Then a piece of clear tape on the paper side to prevent the mold from sticking to the sandpaper. Make a cup out of cardboard that fits the neck about 2cm wide. Use tape to fix it to the neck and fill that with polyester, epoxy or bondo. Let it set. Take it off carefully and remove all tape. Then use 2 sided tape to stick sandpaper in the mold. Get your neck close to what it needs to be. After that you can shape the neck near the body and the headstock with the shaped sandingblocks. And obvious you connect those two shapes on the neck for the part inbetween, headstock and body connection with the proper tools. In this way you leave the thickness of the clear tape for a final sanding.

[@whiletr]

With profile gauge you can just not push it by object but gently push wires towards the object, then you won't get that issue described at 1:11

[@rockyetsx70]

How about using a 1:1 tracing pantograph? But with an offset stylus so it can follow the neck surface instead of a line on a drawing?

[@steveprice1595]

Just a thought, but instead of drawing around the shape, use spray paint. You’d be left with the exact profile and have no danger of deforming the line with pressure from the pencil?

[@davidglynnguitars8119]

Interesting. Have you thought about using a 3D printing pen to copy the contour of the neck? Just apply the filament to a protected neck and it will harden quickly and give you a plastic gauge to use on the new neck. My biggest concern would be the 230 degree filament damaging the finish on the donor guitar.

[@baimun]

When I saw the plasticine, It made me think you were going to make a full cast of the neck and then cut it into sandwich bread slices...... which come to think of it, might be the best way to make the guides. Wrap the neck in plastic wrap, cover in plaster or molding putty and once dry, slice it at various fret marker points. Voila!! ☮❤🎶

[@dcs2402]

I use a piece of fairly decent gauge coper electrical wire. Bend it round and it stays perfectly in shape.

[@kennethbillman8204]

I am not sure if this would work but what about putting cling wrap around the neck and mixing some thick plaster, putting the plaster around the wrap and waiting for it to dry, then remove it. it should in theory leave the profile of the neck perfect in the plaster.

[@malcolmhouse9547]

What about tapping the neck as you did then use a strip of lining paper soaked in wallpaper paste and laying over the tape then another strip on top of that then leave to dry , obviously if you have time and not in a rush

[@davecardboard9567]

Would making plaster casts be a viable option....? OK, you'd need to protect the original from damage (e.g cling film or similar) and make up some dams, but you could get pretty close and have something that can be fettled to perfection and use repeatably as a "master" to then make up the profile templates. I've seen such a technique used by plastic kit scale modellers to "take" the internal shape of an aircraft fuselage or boat hull in order to make templates for bulkheads. Or how about a "half a pencil" used to trace an outline onto a profile "near enough" (say 2-3mm too big) that can them be downscaled. Wonder what might have inspired that idea!

[@samwinstanley6820]

I think the easiest way I can think of to accurately replicate something like.a radius is a Linex bendy ruler, they are great for curves but not as good for floor fitting as a metal pins gauge. About a month after starting ADHD meds its normal to think they aren't doing anything anymore. They probably are still working but habits start to fight back, habits are harder to fix than dopamine deficiency. It's a slow burn to change habits, exercise helps a lot. For a lot of meds, avoid fruit or acidic foods (including vitamin pills) within 20 minutes of taking the medication. Embrace your ADHD, you are still going to be random when it comes to problem solving.

[@martinmanuel6228]

A router jig that follows the profile of the original neck and routes it onto the new neck. There are jigs out there to do that for sure and they are accurate and repeatable.

[@fungusv375]

i love how your brain works, i have what i called the levels of madness till i am half way through, generally the hardest way of doing for the easy way to pop in my head . But never got it checked out i'll be 43 on monday and i lived with it this long lol

[@CrimsonCustomGuitars]

Genuinely worth getting a diagnosis even if you never intend to chnagemir get treatment.. just knowing what was driving some of my habits has allowed me to make positive improvements.. truly incredible

[@fungusv375]

@@CrimsonCustomGuitars ok when i can get to use the doctors ill try

[@mikeeybass]

Have you tried a putty that hardens. Might take longer but you would have an exact replica of the curve. Then use the hardened putty or clay to match the curve

[@HOUNDSTOOTHE]

I use a flexible ruler to create curves. It's basically a bendy metal rod in a rubber housing that holds it's shape when flexed. That might work?

[@joestevens8753]

Good job, I like the masking tape, how do you enlarge a profile for a bigger neck?

[@danbuckingham5077]

For anyone looking to replicate this, I highly recommend a video by Randy's Guitars & Broncos, who has an awesome neck carving jig setup for copying bolt-on neck profiles

[@Jimjolnir]

That's freakin' cool, man B)

[@verrysmusic]

Hi Ben could this idea work to copy a neck profile? You soak in super glue a piece of string/rope (gotta experiment with thickness) and place it around the neck on top of a piece of plastic bag instead of the masking tape (has to be something that protects the neck but doesnt stick or glue to the neck), let the super glue harden and gently pull it and cut off the excess of the plastic bag around the string/rope, technically you would have a string/rope shaped like the neck?

[@andrewgilbert4246]

How about some two part knead putty pushed around the neck that is masked off? once set you have the exact shape.

[@RobCrawford23]

What you really want to do is to make yourself a pantograph and that to trace the carve onto the material of your choice. You can either stand the guitar upright to trace the neck or more sensibly flip the axis of the pantograph so the guitar can lay flat. Just ensure the pantograph produces an accurate 1:1 scale result. Of course you can then use the pantograph to trace most anything else and it may be nice to have a variable scaling so it's easier to create that smaller body 335

[@ambsquared]

Probably cost prohibitive, but there are pantograph routers and carvers. You’d mount the neck for the probe to trace, and the router would carve the blank in parallel. Also a cnc machine with a surface mapping probe could get a very detailed mapping, and then mount the blank and the cnc could then follow the mapping to carve.

[@chrispearson5098]

An easier option would be florists foam. It will press to the perfect shape, and you can cut relatively thin slices off each time you want to copy a new profile. Won't stick to anything, either. No idea how long it takes to dry out, though.

[@dickybird6916]

The dust is carcinogenic.

[@philwild5279]

Clingfilm on the neck, put on thermo morph, let it harden, pull away from neck - you get a clean profile and no damage to the wood.

[@aharkness5657]

PCL, en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polycaprolactone often sold as "polymorph" is very useful for copying shapes and making "temporary" things. Easy to soften and mold in small quantities and pretty rigid once it sets. Can be cut an re-molded again. Very handy stuff.

[@slicker1444]

If you use a little dry graphite or any fine powder brushed on with a fine paint brush the compound will not stick to the tape. If you do not want to use powder another is to use Teflon tape. It should not stick to that ?

[@slicker1444]

I would use some flexible metal band or wire to bend around the neck.

[@borgonianevolution]

A pre cut piece of cardstock in roughly the shape then just trace the neck using the pencil and washer trick.The just cut the traced line with a scalpel.

[@silentferret1049]

I would use hot glue and a piece of card stock. Do the same tape to protect the neck then cat some card stock very close to the shape and then lay some hot glue onto the tape and push the card stock into it. Could even get away with using one of those plastic gauges with the hot glue. Simple and cheap and pretty quick and even just use it as the finishing gauge and not have to cut out another.

[@drprick7432]

Base? Would have been easier to use a wider base(!) neck template (made out of wood or acrylic) for the clay, kinda like a dental mould. Use sculpy and bake it then you have a hard version identical to the neck shape

[@walterhambrick8705]

it's interesting that no one has come up with a neck duplicating machine like old key cutting machines. Could that be built reasonably cost effectively?

[@captainsparky]

I have done this exact thing but i put cling wrap on the neck and used epoxy putty

[@sircaptainchaos2388]

for other shapes iv used in the past cling film and car body filler sets hard in minuets

[@MakewithJosh]

Perhaps make your own super fine countour profile gauge out of wood? Not sure if it's possible, but might be fun to find out.

[@ParallaxRS]

Generic comment - general praise for Crimson - followed by a silly question

[@bramweinreder2346]

Custom gauge? Use the profile gauge (the steel one), copy it to a piece of wood or metal, cut within the lines, and file until it's exactly, exactly right. This gives you a template for the kaori neck.

[@DavidLye-no4ht]

Whatever happened to the hand tool build?

[@plexibreath]

Ben, tell us more about that tool you are coming out with to do this.

[@billstolz9587]

Take a 1/4 inch aluminum wire bend it to shape your done

[@hydrophobicgoldfish]

The easiest and most accurate way to "mould" the neck would be a few strips of electrical tape on the neck, then build up a profile on the tape using air-dry clay. Will be hard, durable and exactly accurate. Plus reusable. Can even shape a handle on it if you were so inclined

[@mikec6947]

It seems to me you could have used your metal gauge and gotten a non-distorted contour by starting with the metal tines fully in and gently pushing them in from above to meet the neck. But that would have been a much shorter video. 😉 WWBD?

[@bwilson_guitarworks]

I've done it that way once or twice. Copied it onto a piece of wood, and used small files until it fit the original neck perfectly.

[@mikemilk7234]

Hi, I would have done it differently, I protected the arm with film and made a mold out of a piece of clay, let it dry and then put the shape on paper. the piece of clay was saved for future work. Good work.

[@rvaguitars]

Stewmac makes a flexible spine rule that does this perfectly

[@theoldfartguitarshack4320]

I have had a light bulb moment regarding copying a neck radius, shape or other, before I make a complete fool of myself I will test this idea in the workshop tomorrow.

[@Jimjolnir]

:o Have fun, and let us know how it goes.

[@phatputer]

Weird, how did I miss this episode, oh well bonus content for mee

[@Echo3_]

Use a regular template tape paper to it and use a compass

[@lucemiserlohn]

I'd go about it with some sort of putty or plaster probably, letting that harden and cure and then taking a propoer slice out of it. In the time it takes for that to cure, I can easily do other things, like... procrastinate ;)

[@StevenHadfield]

Milliput epoxy putty and a wooden template, using the first method would possibly result in a permanent set of guides.

[@allanhocquerelle1044]

A little bit of self hardening clay on your masking tape would gives you the perfect shape. However IT would be longer than your méthode.

[@pauldenniss5230]

Base -treble? Should it be Bass - treble?

[@420RcPilot]

So, what is it now...8 months since you said you would finish the handtool only build, before working on any other guitar...? As much as I find it interesting to see you build a guitar out of wood that is essentially not suited for a guitar, I would really like to see that one finished soon.

[@leegosling]

You could probably 3D scan the neck using a mobile phone app and stick it into CAD software and extract the profile from that.

[@Jim_on9s]

Helix flexible curve perhaps?

[@jefferywarburton2116]

A soft piece of single strand wire/paper clip may have held the shape you seek but who's to say.

[@Dylan-mu1vw]

Great title

[@nickkowal6537]

Pattern router. Such as is used for tool/axe handles

[@Q3ToPBuZz]

Genuine question. Why the gloves?

[@FeuerToifel]

comment about how amazing everything turned out

[@brymills]

Could you do something with paper mache?

[@jaydevmistry1913]

Would a flexible french curve work? kzbin.info/www/bejne/g4OaiYSDgaqhjMU

[@NotThatOneThisOne]

That was my immediate thought. Used to use them for replicating graph curves onto grid paper.

[@brocktechnology]

The expression bob's your uncle is commonly believed to be a reference to the appointment of Arthur Balfour to the position of Chief Secretary for Ireland in 1887 by his uncle Prime Minister Robert Gascoyne-Cecil.

[@ladeanadockery6220]

You could use a 3D scanner (and even take that model to NC the neck... )

[@saevars5199]

Suggestion: Put a strip of baking paper around the neck, put the template on, and use a heat-glue gun on one side of the template.

[@martinclayton7260]

My favourite method is to get someone else to do it!

[@Paul-D]

make a resin/epoxy mold of the whole neck. once cured cut it into cross sections of exactly where you want to know the shape. Over engineering solutions since 27/4/23

[@Forest_Fifer]

I was thinking air-drying clay on top of cling film protecting the neck.

[@thierryholweck6883]

Maybe you could adapt a kind of pantograph to copy the neck directly ? Yes, sure you could.

[@dickybird6916]

Milliput is cheap and will give an accurate and solid mold to work from

[@shrimuyopa8117]

There is also another option, where you throw it on the CNC machine....

[@bassvibasics479]

I do wonder if the client watches these videos... and if they wonder when/if they'll get the completed instrument.