Ep. 335 | Best Turkey Gauge - Is More Better?

Mark Boardman and Ryan Muckenhirn gab like hens about the results of their turkey-gauge test. They spin around the topic like strutting Toms in the sun, pecking at it from every angle. Did they pick the best turkey gauge or lay an egg? Tune in as they take a shotgun approach to this age-old debate.
00:00 - Intro
00:44 - Turkey Hunting Stories
8:14 - Choosing the Right Turkey Gauge
13:54 - The test
21:224 - Shot Shells
30:27 - Shotgun Optics
33:42 - Hunting Stories (cont.)
36:36 - Chokes
39:29 - Shot String Theory
45:12 - Choke Tubes, Shot, and Patterning
51:02 - Shotgun Optics (cont.)
53:28 - The Results
1:08:18 - Mark and Ryan's Choice
1:23:00 - Closing Thoughts
As always, we want to hear your feedback! Let us know if there are any topics you'd like covered on the Vortex Nation™ podcast by asking us on any one of our social media platforms and using #VortexNationPodcast.
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[@scruffyarms]

Trying out my J Steven's Arms 100 year old break action 20 gauge today with a full choke barrel. No shots over 50 yards with the Federal TSS starting Wednesday!

[@mattp9574]

12 gauge 2 3/4 4 shot lead inside 30 yards has been my go to and worked wonderfully. It doesn’t kick much and certainly puts down the turkeys in a hurry. Also economical and I don’t have to have multiple types of ammo for upland game and larger game

[@enddockboyoutdoors748]

Great video, I can listen to Ryan all day every day. He’s so good at articulating what he is thinking. 😊

[@drewschliem9951]

20 Guage with TSS is a tough combo to beat with weight and performance.

[@Cbman375]

TSS in the 410 contender is getting a go this year, good luck everyone 🦃

[@kweb406]

15 years ago I got my kids a Mossberg super bantam 20 Camo. About 7 years ago I decided to pull it out of the closet. I put a 336 base on it and topped that with a Venom and using long beards it is a great setup. I sure would like to try the 28 though. Thanks for the podcast.

[@justincarr9065]

New to hunting and love listening to the podcast on my commute to work. I’ve learned a lot and can’t wait to get out there. Keep it up guys!

[@matthewfrees7498]

Got my first Tom this year, running away just under 40 yards, vortex red dot helped deliver quick target acquisition. I was so impressed that I pulled off that shot, and that red dot made all the difference. 20 gauge TSS heavyweight 7 shot

[@g-man2228]

Currently shooting my 870 Turkey gun (Won at a NWTF Dinner) with a Kicks choke and soon to have Red Dot…Would love to have a 20Ga though for weight savings…We’ll see!

[@justinsalzl1517]

I love this talk. Thank you! I’m using Longbeard XR. A box of 10 is $28. A box of 5 TSS shells (I think it was federal?): $70. I’d love to shoot tungsten, but the Longbeard XR performs so well for $3 per shot vs $14. This works for me.

[@zacharypiper6889]

Beloved 16 gauge snubbed yet again not making the table but at least in the conversation. 16 gauge with TSS mixed 7 and 9s is hard pressed to beat on my opinion

[@danhyry6347]

I use one

[@OutdoorsNationTV]

Love the video!! I absolutely love my 12 gauge for many reasons. I got a Remington wing master 887 and I love it! Was my grandpas old gun!

[@adameigner7038]

I have a Remington too! Love that fucker

[@mikepink1337]

Remington SP-10 10ga SuperTurkey choke/brake Federal Grandslam (stiffer wad to hold the pattern tighter)

[@user-pd7qe8he5g]

28 guage is a beautiful thing, had an older trap/skeet shooter once tell me that it was a perfect bore for efficiency. I love mine

[@wmmarknfrancesjennings4060]

I was sceptical going into this, as I am what my friends call a grumpy old fart. I was quickly won over by both Mark and Ryan. They delivered the information enjoyably and without a lot of BS. I find most "talking heads" are very biased and/or trying to sell me a specific product. Their discussion was well supported and as life long hunter I was surprised I agreed with most if not all of their points. I'm currently 65 and I started duck hunting with my dad when I was 12 and took my first turkey the same year. My duck gun was a 20 ga Stevens SxS that kicked worse than any 12 ga I have ever fired. I killed my first turkey with my dad's Savage 24, 22 mag over 3" 20 ga. Thanks for an enjoyable and informative video. Coach Mark

[@michaelmccallister3735]

Been using my 12ga Stoeger M3000 the last two seasons. Bought the gun 2.5 years ago (first gun purchase) as kind of a do it all (waterfowl, turkey, pigs, clays)/see how I enjoy it gun. Seeing this episode definitely has me considering if I were to get a dedicated turkey gun that I'd definitely go 20ga or maybe even .410...more likely the 20 to still have the lead option, but those .410 stats are hard to beat (in a dedicated gun for inside 50 yds). GREAT EPISODE!!!

[@mickmiller6137]

I really like the idea of the TSS, but not the cost. BUT I also think that your 10 inch test is not the best model of how the hunt goes. What you need is the biggest cone you can get with a killing shot density. Again, the 12 is so much better because the killing cone is so much larger.

[@justindownes7578]

Thanks for the opportunity!

[@bobbyfay6277]

I don't turkey hunt often. I do, however, waterfowl, dove, deer (sometimes), pheasant, squirrel, and quail hunt with shotguns. I use a 10/12ga for waterfowl and 12ga/410 everything else. With the price of shells being $12-30 a box to feed those, I really don't see the need for $15 per round. If I turkey hunted more, then I may give it a shot, but lead/steel works good enough. I do love a mossburg, though. My first gun was a 500 and have added a few mossburgs since.

[@mattwatson6359]

Hey love yalls podcasts! Well rounded info for every outdoorsman!

[@JoseElizondo-sl2hj]

Have to try out the TSS loads on my BPS pump.Ive been only using lead for turkey due to affordability of tungsten.Ryan and Mark might have just convinced me.Awesome podcast.

[@davidhattok5497]

I like the 835 with a 3.5 inch #5 but have had great success with my young grandsons using a 410 with Federal TSS.

[@pigroper5]

Great episode. I'm not a turkey guy, but I love the 28 ga. browning citori. More of a qual gun, but loved that thing. Kind of like a 7 ft 2 wt fly rod. A box of shells was like carrying a hand full of 12 ga. The 20 ga is far more practical, but the 28 ga gets me excited.

[@doneime875]

As I've aged, I've become allergic to recoil. I am OVER getting my butt kicked by a 12ga. OVER IT. So, couple months ago I bought a 20ga for turkey hunting. I've got 2 different TSS loads to test still, and the long beard XR 5 shot is amazing it my gun. 20 gauge. Done. Mic drop.

[@balynkrout4942]

Awesome video guys very informative I love all of these cartridge talk videos. Diving into the casing or shell past present and future.

[@roshtainsky]

Really immersive episode!

[@onefast6]

Another great episode! Thanks for all you do.

[@DanielMann-gq8fi]

20 gauge has been my go to for everything except sporting clays. The more you understand how shotshells work, you realize a 12 isn’t really necessary.

[@toddboyer9691]

Ryan, you would have earned an A in my class with the shirt you designed! 😂Just picked up a Browning A5 in 16ga! Great episode, gentleman!

[@lisaannaallen6283]

the 835 had a longer forcing cone than those other guns "back in day"

[@tombotting3345]

Would of been nice to see the Browning sweet 16 in the mix

[@InfamousTactical]

You guys should have had the EBR-12GA reticle in the background. 😂

[@marksmith4627]

Have always used 3-1/2", 12 gage loads for turkey, using the TSS loads the last two years, but would consider changing to 20 gage for the reduced recoil, those 12 gage loads have a fairly substantial recoil, rough when doing a several shot sight-in session. Not just for the shoulder, but the pocket book too!

[@culliganman]

I looked up how many number 9 tss would fit in a 10 gauge would be 814 pellets. I got a friend that shot a gobbler through brush with a .410 at 75 yds. I can't imagine the devastation of 814 #9 tss pellets in a 2.25 oz load.

[@WayStedYou]

probably a broken shoulder if the 12 gauge is already pushing 89 ft/lbs

[@culliganman]

@@WayStedYou Oh for sure a beat up shoulder.

[@jrhunt414]

2 1/4 oz is a lead 10g load, a TSS load would be closer to 3oz. Imagine 3oz of 7s. It’s almost a modern punt gun.

[@gavinteal1857]

Thanks for the opportunity

[@Nick-McCready]

Awesome info guys!

[@Justin-qr1ll]

I'm impressed ,Very informative, I love the 28 and the 410 preformed as well as they did.

[@JDMacBain]

I would love the opportunity to try all the different gauges and see for myself

[@goosewacker]

Those light weights really held their own, with that TSS ammo. Pretty impressive.

[@Eric.schmidt]

I’ve been using 12 gauge for years but I’m very intrigued by the smaller bore turkey loads.

[@danielkearney-li3tz]

i worked at gun stores fore 12 years, this was always a hot topic. great vid

[@bowmanoutdoors2179]

410 tss has changed the game!

[@jayfranklin14]

Love this. Thanks for doing it…now, please repeat with factory chokes so buyers are fully aware of the difference, please!

[@timstechschulte866]

I liked the results of the TSS, but I don't know about the affordability. I am currently using Hevi shot, which is expensive enough. But 1 shell per harvest still isn't bad. Great discussion. 👍

[@canuckmagnum5841]

I used to like the old Remington 12ga 3" duplex load, it used copper plated #4 and #6 in one shotshell.

[@mdp4656]

Awesome discussion, I won a Mossberg SA-20 turkey in a raffle earlier this year. I have not had the time to pattern or test anything on it yet and will resort to my old tried and true Remington 870 with Federal Heavyweight turkey shells. Going to try the 20 gauge TSS at some point this year however after listening.

[@Jeepman90]

12 gauge nova I've had for 18 years worked good for me.

[@ronrash7213]

I have to agree with Ryan, the 20 is more viable because you can run lead or TSS, around here where I hunt you have to drive anywhere from 50 to 150 miles just to get TSS loads, where I can locally lead shotshells.

[@NoahSall-me1et]

Another 16 gauge fanatic here, wish they were more popular. But if I had to pick one from your lineup, I’m going for 20 gauge all day long.

[@kennethAsher1]

Give me that extra ticket! Also love the content i listen to almost every new episode on spotify as im driving to and from work

[@kevincolonel3070]

Now I'm intrigued by the 28 guage. I'll be using my 12ga until I use up my long beard ammo supply, but I'll be shopping for that new 28.

[@michaelhale4041]

Great rundown, guys. Any of those shotguns would be nice to have.

[@philiptrump8472]

I just took a bird on opening day here in WA State. Buddy and I doubled we where both using 12 gauges copper plated. Still works great and is much more affordable than shooting my 20 gauge with TSS.

[@kemosabe53219]

"Sending ducks back to hell" that shirt needs to be on the website😂

[@gavinmccue9516]

Watched love the videos !

[@jacobcline7076]

Great video!

[@tal-ck2eu]

Looking forward to try out the 20 gauge TSS this year.

[@Prepare2Survive]

According to the poaching storybook titled "Walk with the Wildman" the best turkey caliber is subsonic handloaded 38 special 158 grain SWC ammo shot from a rifle length barrel. That combination of subsonic 38spc and longer barrel lowers the sound of the gunshot a lot. Adding night sights or a red dot allows you to shoot them off the roost at night. In addition to that adding a suppressor lowers your chance of getting caught by the possum police (game warden) even more.

[@jmb9099]

I’d love to see a full blown (find the best pattern test process)..! I don’t know what it’s called, but I know there’s a special shotgun patterning target out there that you can take a picture with your phone and it’ll show you your best pattern density spot and give your pellet counts too. That might make the process easier for you to go through again..!

[@lukeabbott9359]

I currently have a 12 gauge and .410 that I run with TSS and a vortex viper red dot. I would love the opportunity to win a 20 gauge in green leaf with the new defender red dot to try out all of next season in attempt to start my grand slam!

[@nuckyduk15]

Alright Vortex..here me out ...Crossfire 1-6x FFP and the reticle is a turkey head that changes in scale as you zoom in 😂.

[@Jeffreyperez-rp6ow]

I'd sure get all choked up if Mr Muckenhirn could finally get the boys together for a Cartridge Talk about the awesome .358 my old BLR and old(er) me have shared memories of a handful of deer, 1 black near and hopefully an elk while I can still hike.

[@pisacson]

Have used the 20 gauge for Many years. Plan on adding a red dot now!

[@joshuabennett7334]

When it comes to 12g you have to factor bore diameter. I have a 535 and a 835 one has a standard 12g bore one has a 10g diameter barrel. The 535 doesn’t shoot 3.5 inch shells very well the 835 shoots them great. A lot of magnum guns are overbore and it makes a massive difference

[@TMFShooting]

Great Video / Podcast 💯💥💥💥💥💥💥💥

[@mikeTyson329]

I’m still sticking with my 12. I have used 3” tss #9 and the blend of #7 1/2 & 9, both are fantastic. I still wouldn’t hesitate to take the old Remington Nitro 3” #4 though.

[@mikeTyson329]

I can confirm, in my 870 super magnum, 3” has always patterned better. I’ve always stuck with the 3”. 3 1/2” is painful 😂

[@mikeTyson329]

Indian Creek is a good go to choke.

[@user-vr6wb2ud3r]

I am a 12 gauge guy but after watching this if I was to get a new turkey gun I would pick a 20 gauge thanks for the great information

[@screes620]

Would love to hear Ryan Muckenhirn's opinion on the 6mm Max. 350 legend case with 6mm bullets, so same bolt face as the 5.56 cartridges, with 35gr of powder.

[@shawncannamore]

I've always used 12 guage, but really thinking about changing now

[@tombotting3345]

I still turkey hunt with my Browning Gold Hunter 12 ga 3-1/2 in Mossy Oak Break up. Load of choice is Federal Heavyweight TSS #9 3-1/2. I used to run Federal Mag-Shok turkey 3-1/2 #4. That mag shok was screaming at 1300FPS.

[@user-re9wd1rz4l]

Thanks, I like your honesty. I want the 20 gauge.😊 Actually I would like all of them.

[@davidemontini8298]

10 guage all,the way browning the best there is 😊

[@calebking9160]

I still prefer the ole reliable 12ga, but almost picked up a 20 before this season.

[@JeremyMiner-camo_archer]

Still running a 12ga 11-87 with Remington Nitro Turkey #6. The cost of Tungsten & Longbeard XR is painful.

[@Colemanade]

I love my 12 gauge 3 1/2in mag but this episode is making me consider buying myself another nice small 20

[@guycarlton201]

10ga for lead or tss, 28ga with tss. Shot a 28 at sporting clays the other day, very enjoyable. Thinking hard about one for early season ducks.

[@kylereagan2018]

I'm sold, 20 gauge it will be. Thanks guys.

[@bradguy50]

Hi guys! I like 20 gauge best

[@Sconezone]

Same here

[@cameronbissell7094]

I would put money down to kickstart that shirt

[@mikeburnside470]

I have not gotten to use TTS yet; I need to make that change!

[@iliakaranadze8683]

20 gauge

[@bradbo3]

Red dots have changed Turkey hunting for me….and my brother and all his neighbors. I was 49 and I couldnt see my brass dot…and fiber optics werent getting it done in low light….and They all made fun of me for using a red dot back in 2018 and I took a big Tom….all the old guys said it was cheating. But the next season every one of them had red dots…including my brother. Most of them had Venom’s just like mine. My brother said he felt stupid for waiting so long to get one…he never misses anymore. Age gets us all…..even with glasses low light is a killer. Never giving up my red dots.

[@johnecrouch2671]

Wow, I don't think they left any pellet unturned. I didn't think this subject would be so in depth. But, it's a timely discussion. When I first started bird hunting I used the venerable .410 because that was what young kids used.Then as you matured you moved up to the 20 or 16 gauge, whichever one was available. Then on the cusp of adulthood the grown-up 12 gauge. So there was no scientific or even ballistic knowledge in these choices. It was more of a social decision.

[@gregstapp1684]

great video ... thanks peeps ...

[@CODsauceify]

Is 10 gauge good for human sized turkeys? Asking for a home owner...

[@marksmith4627]

LOL! for close range, sure!

[@meatsweats.]

28 gauge, the gun is night and light to carry all day and the TSS patterns are impeccable even out to 50 yards.

[@MrVeeco]

Been using the standard Winchester 1200 pump (full choke) and it does the job. But sure would love to try a 20g w/ a dedicated turkey choke and red dot. Just the ticket to get my 9 year old son involved. 🤞. BTW Vortex Nation is one of favorite content channels(love spaghetti shootout) !🍝👈👍 ha ha ha "I think you're a neat guy...." says Ryan to Mark

[@stevekotch822]

12ga 3.5 is my go to for a random hunt 20ga 3 if I've been scouting 410 contender tss if i know exactly them birds patterns They all work

[@sheldonmartin319]

I always used 12 gauge xr longbeard shot,my wide has 20 guage and that works great.

[@gavinboyum3565]

Loving the podcast. Gotta go with 12 gauge though.

[@rrd9434]

Leaning more and more towards the 20ga

[@rrd9434]

@VortexNattion I don't understand this comment???

[@JerryKent-cc9lv]

I’m still looking for the TSS shell in 2-3/4” 20?gauge for my rem 1100

[@user-kx2kw1cp2x]

I've used a 12 ga all my life so far so that's what I'm sticking with

[@DarinLamb-uv6zb]

Really good one guys yeah I’d like to see that 16 gauge I got a A5 sweet 16. Be interested to see you guys do a podcast on that. Follow up on using a 22. I looked up the hunting regulations and apparently you have to use a shotgun but I think those regulations are dated I think shotguns were used back in the day because that was what would work I think a 22s would probably be good with those improvements like you talked about.

[@mauriceharkins9881]

Good presentation on each shotgun. Ammo has come a long way,

[@alsmith4204]

12 gauge is hard to beat. Ammo availability and selection is great.

[@Perry2186]

I'm a 20ga fan

[@20brittwilliams]

Love 12 g but 28 looks awesome

[@erikwilliamson4336]

Big fan of the 28

[@dominicteresi3835]

What would you guys say to doing this test with steel shot