BUGERA PS1 Power Soak vs SUHR Reactive Load / I.R. - Direct Recording

[@thecase1975]

Your reviews are the best on KZbin my friend. I literally have all the “recommended” amp toys that you have backed including the tonebone and the suhr. Great job Euge!

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Oh thanks! Really glad to hear! 🙏

[@mitakuyeoyesin1739]

I agree, they should pay you for this

[@philcrawford556]

Great explanation Euge, thank you! I got the Jens Bogren IRs today to use in BiasFX2, my first time trying IRs and WOW! ABSOLUTELY AMAZING!

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Thanks! Awesome! 👌🤘

[@GJ791651]

This was the last missing piece for my setup! Thank you so much for the review. Marshall TSL in a 4*12, way to loud to play at home or rehearse. Guitar into Pedalboard, TubeScreamer, EQ, Noise Gate, Chorus, Delay into Load Box to my 4*12 or Soundcard. Best sound i have ever had. And I can play whenever I want.

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Glad to hear this man! Thanks!

[@mountainpeakcloud8442]

I got the Bugera about 2 years ago, specifically for my Friedman JJ Jr. I got it so I could push the power section of the amp. My initial impressions with the Burgera was that it made the amp sound richer. I went in knowing that it has a tendency to darken the tone a little, so I would compensate with presence and treble. After a long time I decided to not use the Bugera to see what the amp sounded like without it (as it had been a long time and I forgot what it sounded like), and I have to say the amp sounded a bit more saturated and more aggressive, so I played it like that for a month, and I was about to retire the Bugera and sell it, but decided to try it again last night, and I have to say, I think I prefer the amp with the Bugera, even though there's a little loss in saturation, highs and aggression... I say this, even with some shortcomings, because the amp just sounds richer, more clarity and fuller with it, and actually tames some of the fizz that came with the amp wasn't attenuated. My initially reaction when removing the attenuator was that it was nice to get back that little bit of extra saturation, but that also came with extra fizz, which bothered me as there was a loss of clarity. So, after giving it much time, and switching back and fourth, I'm a supporter of the Bugera. I have a 100W Orange Rockerverb that I used with the Bugera, and now I'm not using the Bugera. I like how the Orange sounds right now without the Bugera, but I may do the same experiment again. There is an argument that on modern high gain amps, the gain is coming from the preamp tubes, so it's not necessary to drive the power amp tubes to get a good tone. I've found this to be the case with the Orange, but I'll try again nonetheless.

[@rizohalen]

Bugera is darker most probably because is a resistive power soak old technology, the advantage of reactive load technology is that it simulate the variation of speaker impedence when it react to different intensity of signal coming from power amp when you play differents frequencies in the range of your instruments

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Well said Rizo. Indeed 👌🙏.

[@johnbfromep]

I came here to learn about this. Stayed for the complete honesty!!! You got yourself another subscriber sir!

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Oh cool! Thanks man and welcome aboard!

[@johnbfromep]

@@EugeValovirta230V no problem! I just watched your other video about the EVH tone. It was so good! Thank you so much for creating such great content and keeping it honest.

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Glad to hear this man! Thanks!

[@michaelgriffith6641]

Always great info. Thanks, I use the PS1 with a cab only , only to play and it works well with all my amps. I don't record with it , I was curious about it's capabilities in that regard so thanks again for sharing your experience with it.

[@marcohermans3207]

I've the harley benton PA-100 version which is basicly the same as the Bugera but with a fan installed. You can use the Bugera without a speaker. It acts as a load box in that matter. Simply choose the preffered impedance or your amp. If you don't trust it,measure it with a multi meter if it is stable . There is a video on youtube how to do that. Use the line out because the XLR sucks. Turn up the attenuator level to 2-3 and adjust the line level accordingly for a good signal into your audio interface. I use my JMP 50 watt combo that way with IR's for recording with good result. Don't push a attenuator into extremes with extreme amp settings cheap or expensive. The JMP is very bright and the Bugera/HB tames the highs a bit at medium attenuation so for me it's a good thing. Sure the reactive loads are better but way more expensive. You get what you pay for. Van Halen used resistor loads and what was good for him should be good enough for the hobby guitar player who wants to attenuate and record himself in his bedroom. People have to understand that when you reduce volume with a attenuator the speakers act differently. They don't move air so the feel and sound is different but perfectly usable if you want to introduce some power tube saturation into your sound. Of you have the money bij a high end one and if jou don't have the money a Bugera or Jet City will serve you fine.

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Well said 🤟🙏.

[@AtTheSourceStudios]

Suhr Clean 15:51 PS1 Clean 16:16 Suhr Distorted 18:33 PS1 Distorted 19:22

[@pedrolourenco2707]

cubase tip: put all tracks on mute, unmute the on you want to hear and solo the second one for comparison! Then unsolo to listen the first one again :D love your videos anyway!!!

[@EugeValovirta230V]

😎👌

[@markjovanelli2607]

I have a ps1 and it works great as a power soak which is all i want to use it for. and the price is a no brainier

[@ace-rob71]

I got the PS1 and I can ensure that it is a Load box so you can disconnect the speaker. the important is that the speaker power out of the amp is always connected to one of the three imput jack of the PS1 which match the impedance. Than you can connect or not a speaker (always matching the same impedance) and or the Line Out, and or the emulated out XLR.

[@EugeValovirta230V]

👌🤟

[@RokDAWG1]

I just recently picked up the PS1 as well. Did you make a video on this? I can’t find anyone actually using it as a load box.

[@ace-rob71]

@@RokDAWG1 kzbin.info/www/bejne/b4bMqZyLdtaBqas this is my other channel for KISS covers. You will find some videos where I use the PS1..

[@RokDAWG1]

@@ace-rob71 Awesome! Thanks!

[@Moirchester]

Euge explains everything very clearly! Pepita is learning a lot, but he needs to treat all that information :)

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Glad to hear! Indeed 😁👍.

[@Greg-rd8qr]

Now I need a better attenuator, thanks Euge 😉

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Any time! 😎

[@sipnscoot3049]

I think the bugera ps-1 sound good. For the price?! Can’t beat it

[@triclops8]

Hello Euge, have you ever tried a UA Ox Box at some point? Would be interested in your opinion. Thanks and have a good start into 2021 my friend!

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Hi, no I haven't tried it. Likewise!

[@bulobeloo]

Thank you very informative - good job hyvä Suomi 👍

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Glad to hear! Kiitos!

[@gastonpossel]

Great video, but the problem is that since you always have the Suhr reactive load connected, your power amp is -wait for it- reacting to that load, even when you record the Buguera. So, I think we are not hearing the Buguera unit by itself (chances are that the Buguera is affecting the signal of the Suhr too, but since it's just a linear resistor and not an inductive coil, maybe it won't mess it too much).

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Thanks! They were connected separately to the audio interface which I adressed on the video (or at least that was the intention 😊) ’cos it wouldn’t make much sense otherway for the purpose of this video 😁.

[@gastonpossel]

@@EugeValovirta230V but were the Suhr disconnected from the amp when you recorded the Buguera? If not, your power amp is seeing it as a frequency-dependent load, thus sounding accordingly at the power stage before the signal goes into the PS1. In electronic theory at least.

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Yes of course 👌.

[@gastonpossel]

@@EugeValovirta230V Thak you. Your video it's very useful!

[@SuperCMO79]

I know this is a really basic question but with the SUHR reactive load you can still play through your cab so you can hear it and send the signal both with and without an IR right? Want the easiest way to on a dime switch and have options. Most important to me is having the Tube amp head coming through my 4/12 but still be able to record .

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Yes but the Suhr doesn’t have attenuation, just a reactive load, so the cab will be full blast 😎💪.

[@deyanangelovangelov7471]

nice video man cheers

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Thanks!

[@JRP3music]

I wonder if the soak can be used in between the Suhr speaker out and speaker. I have a Two Notes Torpedo Captor 8 and speaker outs are full and -20db. I want to be able to turn just the speaker down -6db to -12db. -20 db works at home. I want to turn down slightly with out having to mess with master volume. I send Line out from Two Notes Torpedo Captor 8 to drive stereo fx. The Two Notes Torpedo Captor 8 is connected to a dry only cab. At rehearsal, -20db was useless and 0 db was too loud. I had to juggle each volume of the EVH 5150 III 50 watt EL34 amp. My stereo signal was coming out of full-range monitors using Two Notes Torpedo Cab M plus devices is stereo. Sounds great. It would be nice to slightly attenuate when desired. I had to turn the cab at an angle to avoid being aimed directly at the other band members.

[@EugeValovirta230V]

That is actually a great question👌. But I don’t see no reason why it wouldn’t work. I gotta actually try this. I wonder why I’ve never thought of that?😎. Great idea man!

[@YsAbTones]

Did you plug the Suhr's unflitered out to the hi Z input or the line input of the focusrite ?

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Line input.

[@YsAbTones]

Thanks

[@ConradMH]

Awesome bro!!!!

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Thanks!

[@ConradMH]

You are wellcome E!!!!

[@deathalizer]

great video!

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Thanks!

[@LordD69]

Hey Euge!! Did you have to convert the Borgen IRs in order to use them in the Suhr? I tried loading them in my unit but it doesn't read them as IRs (I used the 24/48 version of the IRs)

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Hey! Oh yeah I emailed to Bogren and they did something to them that they work but can’t remember what it was. Hit them up and I’m sure they’ll help 👌.

[@LordD69]

@@EugeValovirta230V thank you so much for your reply bro!! Yeah I already emailed them!! Btw, your video was pretty much what convinced me to go with the IR version ;)

[@EugeValovirta230V]

💪🔥👌

[@flaneursong78]

What a great video, and methodical approach to the A/B testing, thanks a lot and congrats! I own the Bugera, and I find it quite impressive as an attenuator, even at very high settings of attenuation which is not always the case with higher end attenuators I had tested. I wanted to get a Captor X or Suhr Reactive Load for silent recording but now I don’t know anymore thanks to you 😊 Because honestly the Bugera with IRs was quite close, although you have to cope with the strange behavior that you explained with the soak/line levels and cab interaction... Bit maybe coupled with a good IR box like Nux Solid Studio or else, it good be good enough. Regarding the conclusion, totally agree with you, the Suhr with IR in the box sounds best and more real: do you think that it’s the case when IR’s are embarked into the hardware and not applied afterwards? Thanks again for the great great video!

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Oh thanks! Really glad to hear this 🙏. I think it’s because the IRs are embarked into the hardware.

[@phillamoore157]

Maybe I'm getting old....but, I'm a bit confused as to what the Suhr does in terms of attenuation, and I'm definitely confused with the routing. So, does the Suhr act as an attenuator?.... The common censes is that the PS1's direct is poor. However, ti seems to be a great little attenuator. Which makes me wonder, why not just use the attenuator, and mic the cabinet at a low volume? Or, if the Suhr Reactive load IR truly sounds much better, but only for recording, and doesn't actually attenuate....then I can see why you'd be using both. Absolutely love the video, and comparison, just need a bit of clarity.

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Suhr is a reactive load and Bugera is attenuator. Cabs / speakers sounds the best without attenuation ’cos they need to move air. Attenuation is good if you just want to play at low volumes with the amp cranked. Good reactive load with good IRs is the same than a good cabinet with good speakers, mic’d with good mics into a high quality mic pre 👌.

[@mountainpeakcloud8442]

@@EugeValovirta230V That's a great description of what reactive loads and IRs do, and I've never been able to understand that difference before, so thank you. Just to clarify, so the reactive load allows you to have your amp on without a cab, and reproduces how it sounds with air is being pushed through the speaker, and an IR is basically the sound of a speaker? DoI have it right?

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Thanks! IR is the capture of the signal chain from cab / speaker - mic / mics - mic pre - eq (if not raw IR) 👌.

[@mountainpeakcloud8442]

@@EugeValovirta230V Thank you!

[@SvitlanaLuchynska]

Hi. I have marshall jvm410C combo, speckers connected to 1x16Omh on back panel. Suhr input is 8Omh, may i use it with marshall jvm410C combo?

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Hi, the ohms from the amp should never be higher than the load / cabinet. Always the same or lower. If you feed for example 16 ohms to a 8 ohm load / cab you'll most likely blow up the amp & speakers (if you use a speaker cabinet).

[@SvitlanaLuchynska]

Jvm410c is combo, it have 1 8Ohm output, but has two speackers on 16 ohms content://com.android.chrome.FileProvider/images/screenshot/16115095043612831796325490647310.jpg Connect 8Ohm from combo to SUHR and SUHR out to speakers?

[@EugeValovirta230V]

👍

[@iosifsimon]

I have a question. Is it possible to have both the speaker and the emulated mic ? I would need to connected bugera to the speaker/cabine, to use it on stage so I can hear myself, and use the knob to control how loud it would be, aaaaannd also, in the same time, have the Emulated Mic send the signal to a mixer. Does using the Emulated Mic cut the sound of the speaker? Or vice versa.

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Oh it’s just a direct out so no emulation in Bugera so you’d have to use an IR loader etc. I use nowadays St. Rock’s React:IR which has it all 👌. kzbin.info/www/bejne/baSpep5_bMR3gZY

[@DaveJablonski]

I was really hoping you would have tested the emulated mic xlr out.

[@DelReiRock]

Interesting…. How do they compare just for attenuation? The price difference is big.

[@EugeValovirta230V]

They don’t since the Suhr doesn’t have an attenuation 😎.

[@DelReiRock]

@@EugeValovirta230V Oh, I see. Thanks man. By the way…. Enjoy your vacation time! 😁

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Thanks! 🙏🤟

[@joshread6132]

Awesome video as always EV! I have a question for you... people talk about “tube amp feel” and how great it is, do you still have this experience when your amp is played with a load box with IR into studio monitors/ headphones? I’ve only ever used modelling gear and was curious to see if you think there is a big difference in feel and tone

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Thanks! Yes I have it no matter the other gear involved ’cos a real tube amp is always a real tube amp and it’s such a joy to play with one. Especially Marshalls 👌. Plugins are becoming better and better and especially Softube’s Marshall plugins are awesome but a real deal is still, and I think will always be, a real deal 💪😎.

[@joshread6132]

@@EugeValovirta230V thanks man! I’m trying to convince myself (and my partner!) that I need to buy a tube amp as that is way more fun than practising 😂

[@EugeValovirta230V]

It is 😁👍.

[@Justpassingghrough]

I use the suhr for when I run my tsl 100 and I use the bugera when I play on my jtm 30

[@EugeValovirta230V]

👌💪

[@hootowl6354]

If the Suhr had ohm matching switches for both amp in and speaker out (like the Fryette PS-2) then I'd buy it. Without that, no.

[@EugeValovirta230V]

I have those switches on my amps & cab so this works for me as it is 😎👌.

[@aquilarossa5191]

I am going to email them and ask if the PS1 can be a dummy load. The fact it does not have much in it compared to the Suhr unit could be due to the PS1 being resistive. The little load resistors weigh only a few grams, while the Suhr unit has a speaker motor and the magnet, plus resistors. P.S. People are saying the PS1 is a rebranded Jet City attenuator, i.e., a Soldano design. I do not think that is true. I think it is a copy of one. The Jet City unit could act as a dummy load though. I'll let you know if Bugera reply.

[@aquilarossa5191]

Okay. I went thru all the registering hassle to sign into their support forum. People have asked the same question. Their support crew said it can be used as a dummy load, but they did caution not to exceed 100 watts output from the amp (e.g., a 100 watt JCM 800 can output much more than 100 watts when overdriven). Even after they confirm it is a dummy load, I am still a little apprehensive tbh. Why I am interested is my Two Notes Captor can not cope with my JMP 50 Plexi replica tuned above 8, or above about 4 if I am boosting it hard. The Captor overheats, because the amp is outputting close to 100 watts when cranked that hard. I am thinking of connecting a dummy load to each speaker output on the amp, so they share that 100 watts between them (it's about 92 watts with 420v on the plates biased at 60%). This unit may be an option. I also looked at making a DIY dummy load, or buying another Captor, or the original Suhr reactive one. EDIT: Using two 8ohm loads requires that the amp is set for 4ohms, just like when running two 8ohm cabs. P.S. What was interesting was how the Bugera behaved differently depending if you had the cab or the Suhr connected. I would take my line out to IRs from my Captor, but even then the Bugera being hooked up to the other speaker jack may affect the results.

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Oh cool thanks!

[@aquilarossa5191]

BTW. I originally bought the Captor for my old Laney IRT Studio. That amp had a built in dummy load, but the catch was that if you use it that way, the amp automatically switches into the 1 watt mode, instead of running its full 15 watts. With the same IR, I could not notice any difference between the Laney's dummy load and the Captor's. People with better ears might. The only difference was the amp ran at 15 watts with the Captor, so i had more clean headroom etc.

[@aquilarossa5191]

@@EugeValovirta230V Even though they say it can be a dummy load, I would still be nervous. I do not even fully trust my Two Notes one. I blew up my brand new Marshall 1959RR running it into a Palmer dummy load speaker sim gadget (the amp had a fault though). Not long before that my JCM 2000 DSL100 blew up due to the PCB fault the early ones had. I became known locally as the guy that kills Marshall amps lol. Cheers and merry Xmas etc. P.S. They gave me a refund for the Randy Rhoads amp. A few weeks later I saw it in the Auckland guitar shop window being sold as brand new and for full price. I dunno, that seems a bit dodgy huh (my guess is Marshall sent them a replacement circuit board for it).

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Yeah 1 watt seems a bit too little 😎

[@kazabubu10]

Euge I noticed that my TSL602 has a Speaker Emulated D.I. Out XLR which according to the manual is "Line level, balanced, emulated output signal for connection into PA or recording Mixing Desks etc". Shouldn't this do a similar job to the reactive load or have I got it wrong (e.g. I am not sure it kills the signal to the speakers)?? If your TSL100 has one and you thing its worth it can you compare it with the Suhr reactive load? :)

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Yeah I tried it once and it’s like those usually are; not good. Reactive Load is different technology ’cos it makes the amp ”think” that it’s connected to a cabinet so it behaves like that. Every manufacturer writes like ”this is awesome and this gives you a mic’d cabinet sound” which is true but they leave out the ”non-usable, shitty cabinet sound” 😁. So there’s a reason why the Suhr costs around the same than a good quality cabinet ’cos that’s what it in a way is 😎. The IRs that come with Suhr are okay but nothing compared to the Jens Bogren ones IMO 👌😎.

[@kazabubu10]

@@EugeValovirta230V thanks for the detailed reply man!! But does the DI out allow for silent recording as the reactive load? Or have you tried eq-ing within the DAW get any decent results? The reason I am asking is because I ordered a set of Tung-sols with 2x6CA7 and 2xKT77 power tubes and I want to make a clip comparing power tube differences but currently I have no other way to record the Marshall but the DI....

[@EugeValovirta230V]

If I remember correct it isn’t a load so you have to have a cab or loadbox connected but it’s been quite some time ago when I tried it (once and sounded like sh%# ) so can’t be sure. I’m sure the manual have the answer but can’t google the manual now since I’m a bit busy atm 😎.

[@kazabubu10]

@@EugeValovirta230V thanks a lot for your time man!!! Helpful as always!! I'll go through the manual more thoroughly then since I probably missed it!! :)

[@raybaker9599]

Bugera PS1 Power Soak ist only gut for ein cabinet?

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Did you watch the video? 😉 It’s ok for direct recording but not for professional use IMO. But for it’s main purpose it does the job really well.

[@raybaker9599]

@@EugeValovirta230V Euge, Sorry, I didn't catch I slipped into Deutsch for a moment, Yes, I did watch the video, I just wanted to confirm that I was correct that the model you were using would only run one cabinet.

[@EugeValovirta230V]

No worries man. Ich spreche bischen Deutch 👍😊. That is correct.

[@tomlarosa6647]

The JHS Little Black Box is $45 and is awesome to lower volume. Goes in your effects loop and acts as a master volume. I have a lot of UA’s amp sims, but have not figured out recording direct at all.

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Yeah I’ve heard about that 👌. How come? Just plug the guitar into the UAD audio interface and start playing & recording 😊.

[@gastonpossel]

that defeats the whole purpose of a loadbox/attenuator that is to cranck and saturate your power tubes, and be able to record the output of the power section.

[@FaustoOMG]

For the next video upload a video called in the style of Slash

[@EugeValovirta230V]

Thanks! It’s on my to do - list 😉👍.

[@FaustoOMG]

@@EugeValovirta230V thank you

[@PJyrstinkangas]

4:54 "Line Auschwitz" :D:D:D

[@EugeValovirta230V]

😎

[@BrankoSimic696]

😆

[@Badha78]

Suhr the best.

[@EugeValovirta230V]

It is.