Every Smash Veteran's WORST Change in Ultimate

If you can't handle them at their Samus dash attack, you don't deserve them at their Ganon forward smash.
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Twitter: / mrmockrock
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Business Email: [e-mail]
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Music used:
"MockRock is Here" - Yeah, hi, that's me
"Battle II" - Octopath Traveler OST
"Marigold 8 Bit" - Sagara Productions (original by Periphery)
"Wavedash Arena" - Icons: Combat Arena OST
"Celestial Resort (Good Karma Mix)" - Celeste OST
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Thanks for watching!
#SmashUltimate #SuperSmashBros #Smash

[@MrMockRock]

Greninja's down air was also nerfed, for those of you that hate fun. Thanks for watching, everyone!

[@Corvi236]

wait what? i didnt really play greninja in 4 but his downtilt is a great killconfirm now. Was it even better?

[@MrMockRock]

@@Corvi236 Yep.

[@abenxu8731]

Down tilt actually can combo into other moves.

[@RosettaGXA]

Actually Helicopter Kick still kills ridiculously early by holding the stick to the side, it has two angles depedning on that But it lost most of its airdrift so it's even worse as a recovery

[@MrMockRock]

@@RosettaGXA It still kills considerably less early than Smash 4, I probably should have used the other angle to illustrate it in the background footage though.

[@supershawnodeseninja]

"never understood why a high tech bounty hunter was hurling herself around like a linebacker constantly" go watch a speedrun of metroid zero mission.

[@kayorego6420]

So true

[@Sh1ranu1]

She played college ball you know If only they made her dash attack, literal shinespark

[@Cri_Jackal]

Dash attack is literally based off shinespark, flashes and everything. Someone should legit have him watch the shinespark shenanigans.

[@Sh1ranu1]

Cri Cat nah man, you don’t understand. I want her dash attack to send her flying across the stage at light speed

[@supershawnodeseninja]

@@Sh1ranu1 yeah and she should be able to keep her dash attack momentum off ledges without falling.

[@Rothana76]

“I never understood why a high tech bounty hunter was throwing herself around like a linebacker” *sideeyes Samus being raised on a planet with 850x Earth gravity*

[@salsashark4133]

Also speed boosting through multiple layers of stone. Dude hasn't played enough Metroid lol

[@revthescatman137]

How did she survive??? I’m pretty sure that would be MORE than enough to kill her instantly

[@Rothana76]

@@revthescatman137 alien super bird dna

[@jacobgeary5576]

Dem legs

[@seanseen_]

@@revthescatman137 maybe cause she's an alien

[@williamrogers9918]

That moment when ROB down throw has one of the deadliest confirms in game. It confirms into rest if he down throws jigglypuff.

[@k-leb4671]

Underrated comment

[@soni-switch5207]

LMAO.

[@SincradTB]

Lmfao

[@OrigamiAhsoka]

LMAO

[@pkfire7821]

9:50 HE HAS AIRPODS IN HE CANT HEAR US

[@taylorswiftliterallyownsme]

i clicked on the timeskip and i got a wireless earbud ad...

[@cosplayingchao]

Shulk's real downgrade was his face during the victory screens. You get used to them after a while, but he definitely looked cleaner in 4

[@marzipancutter8144]

The devs wanted to make a callback to the "Shulk has Little Macs face on 3DS" Leak I guess

[@sherbertshortkake6649]

@@marzipancutter8144 I will never unsee that. Thanks.

[@OrigamiAhsoka]

Broooo shulk looks so high quality during the game and then his winscreen looks like the Wii shulk

[@creativeandfunnyname3744]

THANK YOU! Finally someone said it!

[@megmed8741]

What's the worst Bayonetta change? Yes. Edit: thanks for the likes, please sub to my channel I need the subs to feed my family

[@gleen9843]

Pretty much everything But those severe nerfs still wasn’t as bad as Sheik, even though Bayonetta had a massive drop on her rank, she is still at least usable, while Sheik became from one of the best to arguably THE worst

[@blahfromswitch2661]

well that's what she gets for replacing everything I ever wanted (also how do you do "cross out text")

[@slipknotfya]

@@blahfromswitch2661 you place a dash "-" at the start and end of where you want to -cross out- .

[@lawrencesantillan8918]

@@blahfromswitch2661 I can't believe people are *still* salty over Bayo I'm actually really sorry for the people who actually liked playing Bayo and who weren't in the competitive scene. I guess that's what's going to happen when people find the "next broken character". She's practically unusable for any player that isn't at a skill level required to be in tournaments (not to mention the horrendous lag in online play).

[@blahfromswitch2661]

@@slipknotfya thanks

[@Elite4W]

9:50 I'm a Lucario main and this HURTS

[@miles6711]

Rip easy aura sphere cancel

[@AureliusArmstrong]

I can agree im also a lucario main

[@solarwolf1336]

Juan Huertas - Also Lucario main, but my aura spheres never do this when I’m trying to cancel combo

[@UnDedDood]

It hurts man

[@john_stromboli]

I'm a SSB4 Lucario main... this hurts even more... At least jump cancel dair is still here... right? Edit: he's now my secondary ☹

[@Zephyrs009]

"Roy Blazer Now kills later making iit harder for him to kill" *Loud Grunting Intensifies violently as He constantly kills Everything with Fair, F-Smash, or Tilts*

[@ldonl9948]

I was dying from laughter here

[@swirled7562]

@@ldonl9948 same

[@joanaguayoplanell4912]

Yeah, like he even used Blazer to kill...

[@froakie1404]

“Roy’s bullshit why does everything kill”

[@swagmaster8350]

You forgot dash attack kills at 60

[@flyingfish1138]

Time to find something bad about Pichu... Update: 3.1 haha haha.....HaHaHa!!!HAHAHAHAHAAHAHAAA!

[@AeroLeaf4]

TheFlyingFish 39 rip ftilt

[@flyingfish1138]

jc_fireshot15 it was unreasonably powerful anyways

[@smashssf2_ssbc15]

He is still a good character

[@therealtoonlink9471]

@SMASH ssf2 Not really

[@ergot4716]

@@therealtoonlink9471 yes he is lol, he's still mid to upper high tier not top tier though

[@javangle6057]

Not one mention of how they removed Charizard's Rock Smash, R.I.P Rock Smash

[@imnotgonnasugarcoatit]

Exactly

[@perryprecis1477]

I wish the switching button for PT were pressing both shoulder pads at the sometime.

[@strawhat8070]

It’s been buffed actually, now it turns you into squirtle

[@Keegan006]

Java Jude still want to snap to ledge with flare blitz hope they add it in a patch up date

[@Endershock1678]

Because his new one is way better.

[@cjdemetrius8265]

I miss when sonic said your to slow

[@bulborb8756]

wonder why they changed that cause the blue blur is always known for being pretty cocky

[@captain_lynn2179]

Too*

[@KillerBlaze]

Biggest nerf

[@somedude4392]

*you’re *too

[@austinculley2871]

I'm hoping that you arent past elementary school with your apparent lack of mastery over the english language my friend.

[@buggus1173]

They don't call him MOCKrock for nothing.

[@Princess_Narii]

shit i wanted to make that joke xD

[@tjmatteini7195]

6:07. Little did he know that his up air is now one of the best in the game

[@selalovesmazoe]

"now" his up air hasn't been changed

[@Naloogi]

F in chat for Luigi Cyclone, now its only use is a kill option.

[@mathiasmelaku512]

Its really good in disadvantage too!! The thing that sucks is it doesn't rise which makes his recovery bad

[@Kritical77]

Luigi is my main and I'm always getting edgeuardes because of his bad recovery

[@metaknight5199]

His new grab kinda doesn't make up for it. Sure, it's a tether grab that's also a projectile when used in the air but...that's it... Luigi will still be my main nonetheless.

[@Kritical77]

@@metaknight5199 wow mk himself doesn't main mk but instead the boi weegee. Respect for you man

[@metaknight5199]

@@Kritical77 I main both though

[@doorknob5223]

"Arkfire":👎 *"PK Fire 2":* 👌

[@bananaspice1967]

PK fire but AAAAAAAH MY LEGS

[@michaelolegario6399]

Ah yes, Bayonetta my favorite "Childhood" character.

[@Punaparta]

I don't know how old you are, but Bayonetta first came out 10 years ago. I was 13 back then. ...on the other hand, the game is still not exactly for kids...

[@hildthehild]

It was released in 2009. If you were 10 years old and somehow played that game...... It counts.

[@joao2479]

Hahaha... *Internal crying along with Vietnam flashbacks* HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

[@jerrisatyourwindow]

BCY WILL ADOPT HIMSELF I was 5 in 2009 and never even heard of her till 2016

[@loganm.theninja1077]

Ah yes, Corrin my favorite “Childhood” character.

[@wingedbluj1674]

7:53 well look at this, in 8.0.0 this move hits like a truck again.

[@limerplaz8208]

No it does not it just does a bit more damage.

[@aidenbar511]

I know it wasn’t a change on release, but I have 4 words for Mega Man *Damage Reduced On Shields*

[@tatoun680]

Anonymous Shark samus too

[@theillusionist1494]

And now... Pichu. Could someone more familiar with Melee tell me how Pichu’s recent self-damage adjustment compares to its self-damage in Melee?

[@OmarhiyonMalcolm]

The Illusionist it’s similar or a little less

[@El_Flacko_Feo]

The Illusionist still a fucking high tier tho

[@arctc2195]

Aiden Barsimantov I wish that didn’t happen

[@The_Moss-Man]

I’ve gotten used to Jiggs turning around after Bair. I miss being able to charge Rollout indefinitely though. People fall for that move more than we give it credit for.

[@jack-zx8st]

Cloud's Nair got meganerfed.

[@MrMockRock]

I think Cloud's Limit, uair, and nair are all totally reasonable choices, he kind of got murdered.

[@jack-zx8st]

Yeah.

[@lamdudy]

It’s honestly fine that they nerfed his nair and up air, they’re still fairly decent moves and they were broken as hell in smash 4, I just wished they removed the 15 second timer on limit since gimping cloud is too easy

[@Tippssy]

Have you seen how he moves his arm in his Nair? It hurts to watch. Zoom in and go frame by frame.

[@ldonl9948]

I never had dlc in smash 4, so when ultimate came out and I tried cloud for the first time, he was my absolute favorite. I just love the character, just wish I could try him in 4 lol

[@lushenguy6756]

Seriously my favorite smash channel: Great voice Great editing Genuinely interesting This guy is going places

[@wonderfulrose477]

[laughs in Bayonetta main]

[@lastotter7282]

Super Lame cries in bayonetta main*

[@blahfromswitch2661]

laughs in bandanna waddle dee/Rayman main

[@buckcuck9885]

AAAVACAAADO

[@TheFantasticWarrior]

LastOtter kzbin.info/www/bejne/qXPEao2Aerp_d80

[@megablueflash1816]

*Yells in Sheik main*

[@jasomega2446]

6:01 a lot of trouble killing alright!

[@MagruBlue]

11:25 That transition was smoother than Melee's movement. How do you not have more subs?

[@tedstephenson3838]

Cause

[@lucendence4710]

It was okay?

[@salj.5459]

That was just a basic transition...

[@shivdmanwii]

@@salj.5459 you missed how cleanly the dialogue flowed didn't you?

[@Smokin_Snowman]

I only liked this because of the second part of his comment. This guy does deserve more subs.. his intro alone was just amazing, and this video was really good. But the transition was.. alright. The audio was kinda cool but it didnt exactly make a lot of sense when it was all worded together.

[@greycryoclasm1350]

You said you would roast my main but little did you know I mained Roy since melee. It’s my boi’s time now!!!

[@Pants.69]

So how How did Brawl Smash 4 before dlc How did What

[@Abonkit]

@@Pants.69 they simply did not play

[@soni-switch5207]

The way you put it, Bayonetta herself was a nerf.

[@eddiemate]

I may be remembering wrong, but I’m pretty sure everything about her character was nerfed when transitioning to Ultimate. She couldn’t even kill with her uair against a 250% opponent as shown in the video.

[@bulborb8756]

@@eddiemate can u really blame the dev's for nerfing her hard cause she was like how meta knight was in brawl

[@eddiemate]

Bulborb87 I mean, I’ve been watching some Smash 4 clips and still can’t really tell personally but based on what everyone says about her, that’s a fair thing.

[@soni-switch5207]

@@eddiemate that's my point.

[@soni-switch5207]

@@bulborb8756 even so, there are limits

[@jennyzhao9271]

I can't believe you are a dark pit main. I didn't even know there are pit/dark pit mains out there. That's why I'm subscribing

[@ibby_h5574]

Jenny Zhao Actually if you check out the Pit's Discord (or Pitcord), you'll see it's surprisingly active with a lot of pit mains

[@glennprice976]

For the Pits, I would say Ftilt not inching you forward anymore is also kind of a nerf because it has less effective range now. Down tilt does that now instead so it's not a huge deal but it would have made ftilt easier to land than it is now.

[@DrMcSpankus]

As a Pittoo main, gotta agree!

[@ArcussArcuss]

As a Pit main, I gotta agree!

[@tezicarus8572]

Same they got buffed

[@Galaxia_EX]

F tilt just sucks in general honestly

[@johnreese5739]

Most of these aged pretty well but I think saying that Mr. Game & Watch's up-air change being the worst for him is not one of them. Considering just how much damage the move can rack and the infinite juggle situations it can cause (as well as the traps he can do if you air-dodge to get past it) really it can't be called a down-grade

[@thicboibigsmoke7220]

Sees Little Mac completely decimated: *Look what they’ve done to my poor boy.*

[@gilbertguerrero2916]

ThicBôî BigSmoke it’s sad honestly. He wasn’t even that good and not only do they make him worse, they made him less fun.

[@splugen]

Dash canceling still gave him a huge boost, being able to dash up and ftilt or sneaking under a landing opponent with dash utilt is great, I love Mac

[@sullivans2004]

*look how they massacred my boy*

[@justicetaylor2695]

Eh, I've actually killed with Samus's dash attack often enough to get past the clear loss of a combo tool. The hitstun to move lag ratio on her projectiles seems to move the combo starter role over to partially charged shot. There have been many times where I eat an opponent's landing with an airial shot followed by a landed shot followed by a dash attack or dash grab. I like to think of it as a falling ladder string.

[@piksqu9544]

Actually, it's literally the best dash attack in the game... From a character i've never seen charge in her game...

[@exetone]

@@piksqu9544 she does charge in her games to be fair, an she's damn good at it too

[@RedFlashdrive]

11:16 I was LIVID when they took out piston punch...I liked that move more than the helicopter kick!

[@Blastbrn]

But hey, now axe kick is kinda busted

[@bees3707]

I'm surprised he didn't mention burning drop kick. It's so bad now because it goes basically nowhere and it can't kill like it used to. At least we have broken ass onslaught, which kills at 60

[@kingkrab4872]

Ehh, people still use it to make mii fighters recovery better.

[@salj.5459]

Alex Lockwood It’s so stupid how you can’t even charge the dropkick anymore. The move is utter shit.

[@therealgj995]

Same man, I also miss Ultimate Uppercut.

[@sappling2p]

“I am saying one terrible thing about your main” Me who mains Chrom and Inkling: Press x to doubt

[@Inky.64]

Me who mains Inkling and Pichu *Press X to doubt.*

[@thespanishinquisitionprofe2151]

Me who mains k.rool: press x to doubt

[@dynaheart]

Me who mains Kirby X to doubt

[@sappling2p]

@@dynaheart what do you mean by that? he talked about up throw

[@BigLord]

11:07 actually... Wanna know something interesting? The knockback on helicopter kick now changes depending on how you hold the joystick at the end of the move. So, if you hold away you'll get horizontal kb. If you hold in, you'll get near-vertical kb on it. Horizontal kb KOs *much* sooner, like around 90% at the ledge. It's an interesting change, and it means that helicopter kick is still a good KO move and an OK recovery. Other than that, I agree with the worst change being Piston Punch = gone. Buff thrust Uppercut dear God that move is almost useless

[@marzipancutter8144]

I kinda like the new Mii Brawler, but I usually prefer the axe kick as the best recovery move with cheese potential and get my ridiculously early kills by having Onslaught or Mach Punch. But it's funny how so many of the nichest of niche special moves of this niche-ass character all have weird Mechanics.

[@BigLord]

@Thomas Jackson this is a year old comment, lol, the move was buffed since then. In fact, Brawler is among the most buffed characters in the game. Actually, that last paragraph? Thrust Uppercut *was* buffed! It's now an amazing move, and my favorite Brawler upB.

[@LunaDachi]

Remember that time he called G&W up air bad

[@greentoonlink]

Toon Link's new F Smash gets (well-deserved) flak, and I agree that bombs not going through projectiles is a terrible change for him, but I feel like the change to his Down Smash is a super overlooked nerf. Before it acted like Cloud's, knocking someone behind you at a pretty low angle; if they were aggressively pressuring you at the ledge you could use down smash to easily force them off stage without the risk of missing a throw attempt. Then in Ultimate, after deciding to give Toon Link a new F Smash to differentiate him from BotW/Young Link, they decided to make his down smash work exactly the same as theirs. Also back throw, what happened to you

[@NNekoC]

I agree on the Down Smash part, but I really enjoy his new F Smash

[@greentoonlink]

@@NNekoC I like it too, but at the same time his old one was better. It's kind've a trade-off as opposed to being an outright improvement.

[@DrMcSpankus]

5:27 that Fox player’s face I’m dying

[@christiandeepe6414]

I like what you did with the piranha plant, the bell, and your Twitter!

[@tiagolobo8479]

He could have put isabelle

[@SuperSaga2191]

"with how weak out of shield options are already" is possibly the worst aging statement now in 2022

[@WilfredCthulu]

RIP Arcfire then dash attack. My favorite thing to do as Robin.

[@Zyrianix]

Guessing you mean Arcthunder since Arcfire to Dash Attack is definitely still a thing

[@WilfredCthulu]

Really? I did mean arcfire, it was the first thing I noticed I couldn't do, because it seems the opponent goes up too high when getting burned now. Maybe I should try it now...

[@Zyrianix]

@@WilfredCthulu If they SDI up they could probably avoid it but that sets up for Up Smash. Best way to land Arcfire Dash Attack would be to hit them while they're hanging on ledge or they neutral getup into it, but at that point you'll be able to run up FSmash anyway

[@WilfredCthulu]

Zyrian Hehe... what a devious plan!

[@bucketohwater]

Any Levin air is a much better followup than dash attack though, so it's actually not that awful.

[@kirbthelegend1617]

10:06 I actually wanted that, in smash 4 his jab didn’t have a finisher so even when you landed it you could get punished.

[@RacingSnails64]

Kirb The Legend ah, that makes sense now.

[@72823m]

Haven’t watched it yet, I’m predicting for samus he says dash attack Edit: Yep...

[@pumpkinhead7466]

6:37 "since i'm a dark pit main" ah, I see your a man of culture as well.

[@ish650]

Same

[@gabagoooby]

You mean a man of cancer

[@deanmoriarty6015]

“ahh i see you’re a man of nairs and pressing B” translation for non-dark pit mains

[@ish650]

Bruh dark pit isn’t a mashing char

[@ish650]

I am positive one of you bobs is a rob main

[@JustAnotherGuy151]

Honestly, I mained Mac in 4; despite his glaring weaknesses, he was a lot of fun to play and he had some good strengths you could work with, too. In Ultimate, he's damn near unplayable. Bad throws, bad combos, bad reach, janky KO Uppercut... he doesn't really have much going for him because his overall speed, to my eyes, didn't change much at all between games.

[@gilbertguerrero2916]

JustAnotherGuy151 this

[@theepoopydoodoo]

As an Ike main I would like a few things. 1. Faster recovery when landing 2. Him to recover from his side b like how most characters can (also for Wolf as well) going into free fall mode sucks. 3. Increased ledge grab from Up B for him and Chrom, there's been so many times where I go THROUGH THE STAGE 4. Bring the old voice back :(

[@99wins31]

He no longer fights for his friends

[@petery6432]

@@99wins31 If you use his Radiant Dawn incarnation, he says that line in one of his victory screens.

[@PowerWillful]

As a fellow Pit(too) main, guardian orbitals really does hit me as a nerf. I've lost so many games because the shield shrank and the opponent hitbox/projectile nicked my leg. They also don't protect him as well from above and below anymore, making diagonal and swing hitboxes way more terrifying than they used to, especially the air. The move doesn't have as much pushback when activated and I feel like they don't materialize as far away from him as they used to, which kind of kills its ledge guarding potential (i.e. making Shulk SD every time he's offstage). But overall, he was buffed or sidegraded almost everywhere else. Feels like the problem is more so that everyone else improved so much that it makes his buffs proportionately irrelevant for the most part.

[@duncedaisy]

Are Peach's "nerfs," really nerfs?

[@yourehereforthatarentyou]

barely

[@asahi7444]

They’re barely nerfs to be honest.

[@joao2479]

Yea she can still float and spam down air for a Luigi dash attack rate hitboxes.

[@edilynew9892]

JoãozinhoGGPlays her dair got heavily nerfed the most and is easily punished

[@sheartingsiren9000]

Yes it nerfed her ko potential really hard

[@eyyy2271]

Yo that intros sick tho, btw pits are dope Fellow main 👌

[@roderrickgaming9949]

Dark pit is better lol

[@eyyy2271]

@@roderrickgaming9949 boi I said pits

[@roderrickgaming9949]

@@wollohshollow Your right :)

[@DrMcSpankus]

Another Pittoo main passing by

[@therealgj995]

What's up my fellow Pits mains. I main both Pits btw.

[@sovietiguanakirillpindado5750]

Mockrock:"childhood icons" Me: you played bayonetta as a kid?

[@yoyoguy1st]

Lucario’s aura sphere charge is actually just broken, and not in a good way. Make it match the visual.

[@randoprime]

Young link had a “fire” down air that would spike near the hilt in melee.

[@aganaom1712]

as far as pit goes, i think you can say the changes to some of the mechanics from 4 to ultimate kinda got rid of his legendary footstool combo which honestly might have been one of the most intricate and complex combos in smash history

[@yareanplachinsky6056]

“g&w up air got nerfed” Sure

[@nightsladerayx9145]

Cloud's Nair is absolutely worse than Smash 4

[@Kienamaru]

Link losing his Zair was probably THE biggest nerf he got.

[@wolfenstarnice4821]

Dark Pits your main!? Pit and Dark Pit is my main as well! I finally found someone else who mains Pit. Yes!

[@ItsameeSmashBrosHeffty]

“Roy is Bullshit why does everything kill” As A Roy main I lost my shit to that

[@ndr8128]

That’s actaully really weird.. I mained Corrin in Smash 4 and now main Dark Pit in Ultimate.. No one mains either of those characters.. That’s weird..

[@chidinmairabor1423]

I main both.

[@lunaring5340]

I've always wanted to be good with Corrin, I'm just. . . Not.

[@atsukoisuri]

The same happened to me. Never say no one.

[@Navdaguat]

Female Corrin

[@victormeas450]

They’re kind of boring to play

[@LARAUJO_0]

6:10 8:39 Yeah these wouldn't exactly hold up today

[@UmbraStarWolf]

Charizard’s worst change is losing its landing option being rock smash and having non functional nair

[@Raminator243]

Bluestar Eclipse I hate his new nair

[@Keegan006]

@Fairy Bottle I kinda Charizard is better the squrtle

[@davidc.]

But going from a low tier to a high mid tier is even better

[@DJTileTurnip]

I never understood why Rock Smash is so loved. -His new Down B is way better anyways-

[@absolutetrash7880]

12:40 Nair is a bigger issue for me, yeah Up air did get nerfed hard but Cloud losing Nair range slaughters his neutral and combos. Also Up air is still pretty solid

[@OfficialBarbarose]

The Bayo part made me cry, we stan in solidarity

[@dinosaint9878]

Jordi Contreras I cannot tell you how bullied I get for being a Bayo main.

[@dinosaint9878]

Jordi Contreras we really do, no shame in stanning a queen

[@OfficialBarbarose]

@@dinosaint9878 pick your head up, Bayo main, your butterfly glasses are falling 😔

[@dinosaint9878]

Jordi Contreras The witch hunts will never end!

[@davidc.]

@@dinosaint9878 When you lose a bunch of GSP and you switch to bowser to gain that back they do

[@thesodaho]

"Ooh Cloud, what to choose..." That shit hurted.

[@professorlugiastudios7168]

I thought mewtwo's side b cancelling all his momentum killed his recovery game offstage.

[@Luigiofthegods]

Nah, Mewtwo's recovery is still free if you can mix up double jump and Teleport well, and Confusion still works just fine as a regular stall option.

[@nyquillusdillwad9119]

As much as I miss snakes proximity mine, I really miss his dacus. It was among the best dacus in brawl, and I think it deserves special mention.

[@carsonmowbray4896]

Another dark pit main! Edgelords rise up!

[@tinooftime7149]

Carson Mowbray WE ARE HERE BROTHER

[@Swag_K1RBY]

Is edgelords also wolf, Ridley and meta knight mains?

[@tinooftime7149]

Aerosolsprite - Ju2t 2top. First you must take the oath!

[@m_e_nere]

I'm late

[@xeli3046]

I feel that Kirby got better in Ultimate, my playstyle did have to adapt a bit but now it's more fun to play him! 😊

[@alnico137]

Pit's down B went from nearly useless except as a reflector read in smash 4 to a very interesting aerial parry mechanic in smash ultimate. How about side B, which has its super armor detector deactivate 1 frame before the hitbox comes out so it gets beaten by rapid jabs?

[@MrMockRock]

This was a thing in Smash 4 as well, and I hated it there too. kzbin.info/www/bejne/sGXYdYiPbJJ8as0m46s

[@Sacred_Sword]

Little Mac existing in Smash Ultimate is a nerf

[@Anthonystuff1]

Just realize my two mains, Meta Knight and Samus, heavily relied on their dash attacks. Maybe I should find more characters like that

[@Raminator243]

Try greninja, my guy. His new dash attack is insane

[@kylewood4488-b9r]

Kirbys has the best dash attack in the game

[@Sean-fz8if]

Have fun with joker.. Rosa's jab is one of my faves as well

[@Andy-th6qs]

"Smash 4 samus had arguably the best dash attack in the game" Meta knight: Am I some kind of joke to you

[@timm8o475]

at least you tried.

[@zernek9199]

For Ryu, his Shoryuken was probably the biggest nerf but I miss my old f-air. You could chain 2-3 F-Airs depending on the opponent and the percent and it was a free 30-40 damage and now that’s only possible at low percents like 0-15. Also you can’t chain N-Airs constantly and have them lead into a d-air spike anymore. Shoryu was still the biggest nerf, though.

[@zernek9199]

Well Ryu and Ken were buffed insanely in 3.1.0 so I’m a happy man

[@nightey975]

11:07. Helicopter kick does have greater kill power than you think. You just have to drift forward while the move is active. Good thing you have busted air control after the move, you can immediately drift back after.

[@starmaker75]

When bayo was nerfing, Sakurai and the team just went “BEGONE WITCH, you not hurt smash anymore, we will nerf even in patches more!”

[@captainmega6310]

Something tells me this wasn't Sakurai's doing... But I don't care 'cause *BURN THE WITCH*

[@barssoysarac6990]

She was fine in the demo. But then she beat precious Ridley and fandom imploded for more nerfs. And here we are.

[@gleen9843]

Barış Soysaraç Fandom wants Bayonetta to get nerfed again because she beat Ridley?! They should’ve realised that Ridley is underpowered instead of Bayonetta was still OP Ah well, at least she’s still usable, unlike Sheik who got completely killed, and even then I think she’ll still get the Meta Knight treatment one day where they’ll buff her again to make her a lot stronger (but hopefully not to the point where they have to nerf her again like Meta Knight)

[@kirbytrax8326]

Gavin Lee They saw bayonetta doing a kill combo on Ridley and started crying because “he’s one of the heaviest characters”. Which is total BS, he’s really light but at the time they didn’t know and Bayo got nerfed even more.

[@barssoysarac6990]

@@kirbytrax8326 Actually Ridley still among heavier characters so that gets a pass. What they willfully ignore was the said match done in a stage that has THE lowest ceiling in the game. Seriously Lucario can probably KO itself by recovering on Green Greens. Also the absolute buffons that calls themselves pro-players decided that 'Bayonetta is OP by default' and 'no amount of nerfs are too much'. Sounds familiar? They said the same bs for Sheik and Corrin in Smash For too. If you want to thank anyone for Ultimate's more frustrating design choices, you can thank not only the development team but also tournament players AND fans that demanded more feedback from fans in balance.

[@monkeykingw]

The Corrin nerfs hurt. MockRock changing his opening to no longer include Corrin hurts even more

[@yourehereforthatarentyou]

intro nerf

[@cullenhutchison6528]

Yes! Bring back Ike fair please!!!! It kills like 40+% later now!

[@plompedu]

S K I L L

[@gulorful8488]

2:03 Her dash is a reference to the shin spark, which is in the exact same pose as the original

[@sarasaland4709]

Half of this list was worst changes to a character in competitive The other half is MockRock relishing the change to a character in competitive.

[@TheTrueBrawler]

So basically what we lost in a nutshell: - Luma's ability to not die instantly. - Ganondorf's famous Ganoncide. - MockRock's "single favorite Smash move for over a decade". - Ice Climber's free zero to death combo. - One of Snake's many types of explosives. - Cloud and Bayonetta all together.

[@phoebe5114]

Loved the video!! Very good analysis and very entertaining! Mind if I add my thoughts? As a G&W main, up tilt got hit harder than up air. It's a solid combo starter if you can land it, deals fair damage, connects perfectly between both hits, it's a good move. The issue is it got wider at the cost of being shorter. G&W has much better sideways options and lost a good chunk of vertical coverage while grounded, so up tilt got a bit worse for juggling and due to the lag it's a little risky as a combo starter. It's by no stretch a bad move, all of his are useful in an average match, but that loss of vertical ground coverage is worth keeping in mind. Flagman is still very useful, but its niche in the moveset was a good one to have. Also down throw to Judge is really hard to land now if you don't catch the DI perfectly. Sure, down throw to 9 used to kill at 0% and Judge still outright kills most of the cast at 0%, so that would be broken, but it happened. This one's not the worst change, though; he lost a busted lucky free-stock option but the rest of his kit got amplified into an amazing glass cannon, so his killing is overall easy and more consistent (Fsmash nukes half the roster at 65% at center stage for example). This is a change I don't mind.

[@corvax8644]

Squirrel loosing shellshift is the most annoying change for me. We was crazy in brawl and fucking insane in project m. He doesn’t feel like a completed character anymore

[@wraitsoth]

While I am not a Ryu player myself, the most common complaint I here about his changes from pros and the one they say is the most detrimental is the fact that he cannot turn away from his opponent in 1v1's.

[@YasEmisDaBus]

So no bairs?

[@backslashgaming5533]

“Wait until we talk about the worst changes for everyone and we’ll have something BIG to sink are teeth in” 5:39 Boi

[@LuDogg805]

As a Ness main, I think it was backthrow nerf that was more hurtful, BUT! - I don't care because they buffed everything else! =D

[@catpip_]

LuDogg805 backthrow os still a really reliable kill move

[@Endershock1678]

The Bun That really says something about Ness if back throw was nerfed.

[@plompedu]

But why?

[@theseb5981]

Still the best backthrow in the game LUL

[@plompedu]

@@theseb5981 Incineroars is better LUL

[@saliddressing793]

Mad respect for using dark pit as your main, it's not every day you see someone main a character so underused

[@jonathanrussell6525]

Huh, it's been so long since I played Sm4sh or Brawl that I didn't even realize Ike's fair got nerfed. I've actually really enjoyed the move because I often chain it into a combo and I've gotten lots of kills by leaping offstage to slam someone in the face near the blast zone, but the old version does look pretty heckin nice. XD

[@ldonl9948]

Man I loved ike in brawl and 4, but ever since ultimate with the new nair being everything I dropped him. I know he is better, but for some reason I like the other ikes better

[@princesscadance197]

10:40 Excuse me? My Lumas are trying their hardest, thank you very much!

[@cheezy5174]

I very much appreciate the use of the Celestial Resort B Side theme from Celeste

[@ayteefour]

As a dark pit main I can say that even though I love the character, his spike game is atrocious

[@decidueyefan3844]

tripd he has a down air that might try to spike but it just doesn’t try hard enough

[@fernandobanda5734]

@tripd Yeah, I think the weakest one on the entire game.

[@jessierose13]

@@fernandobanda5734 Yep. So weak that you often get punished for landing it.

[@slaphand9578]

@@fernandobanda5734 kirby's is also incredibly weak

[@alphabet_god1175]

hmnmmnmmnmmm yah but at least Kirby has up-special spike that kills some characters at 0

[@mizutsunebubbledragon3382]

The Thanos comment for Sheik couldnt be more funnier and relateable. It hurts. 🤣😭

[@superjakendo]

As a Mario main, I do partially agree with the down-throw to up-tilt nerf, but the the nerf was necessary so that Mario wouldn't rely on it too much at beginning percents. I would say that Mario's worst change was that he lost the down-throw to forward-air kill confirm from Smash 4. I used that kill confirm to end MANY matches.

[@SuperMonkeyCherrim]

I’m surprised Mega Man’s leaf shield wasn’t mentioned. That was essentially a true combo into a grab in Smash 4.

[@hypotheticaltapeworm]

For Marcina, they changed the kb scaling from 120 to 102 so it just doesn't kill anyone who isn't light past 200%.

[@M4RZ1P4N]

You talk about characters losing special attributes a couple of times in this video, and I have to say that I sympathize with those who mained characters that had such things. Ganon being the only character whose spike you couldn't tech while grounded made him way more rewarding to play compared to other heavyweights in sm4sh. Sure, those characters could cause tech situations with grounded spikes, but it was nothing like Ganon's. Look at Ultimate & you'll see that that special spike is now universal and not unique for Ganon anymore. :( Falcon is even worse with no sliding dash grab and his lack of reliable combos, and damn I miss Doc's fun & satisfying grab combo game. It just feels like in the rush to make everyone more balanced in this game, they took away the things that made said veterans special and unique to their respective mains.

[@captainmega6310]

Well we all know who to blame for that...

[@OP_Quag]

I completely forgot that Ganon was the only one who could cause untechable grounded spikes in 4. Losing Ganoncide was worse by far but this change should definitely not be undersold

[@absoul112]

I mean Falco also had an untechable spike on the ground.

[@salj.5459]

absoul112 It wasn’t a spike. His down air didn’t spike grounded opponents and it still doesn’t in Ultimate. It just sends them upwards to imitate a spike. A stupid change in my opinion, it makes no sense. It still spikes aerial opponents though (obviously).

[@salj.5459]

Falcon has reliable combos, just look at Fatality’s videos. But otherwise I agree. The entire cast is too sterilized and the game is too balanced. In order to make things relatively equal they took away the best/most interesting parts of most characters. I’ll list a few: Universal- Grab combos suck ass. Electric attacks no longer give extra hitstun and ledge trumps were gutted. There are no more reverse hitboxes. Crouch canceling sucks, almost no DI or SDI, less combos in general due to hitstun canceling, no L/Z cancels and no V cancels, shield drops and pivots removed. Almost every edge cancel is gone. You can’t edge cancel aerials or taunts. Light shield gone since Melee. Edge hogging gone. Footstools gutted. Luigi- Low traction (and thus his long wavedash) and cyclone gone. Grab game nerfed Fox: Shine and lasers (gone since Melee) Falco: Shine and down air Robin: Arcthunder is no fun to use Pikachu: Edge cancels gone Mario: Up B walljump gone since Melee Cloud: Limit gutted (understandably but still makes him unfun) Links: Can’t directional airdodge and then use hookshot. Can’t grab walls with hookshot. Ryu: Shoryuken gutted and no longer invincible frame 1 Donkey Kong: 9-wind has a 1 frame window, doesn’t have an elbow hitbox, and doesn’t even kill much earlier. So basically it’s been removed, that’s how hard it was gutted Diddy: Banana nerfed, monkey flip can’t be edge canceled. Shulk: A few of his Monado Art techs have been removed. Tether characters: Only a few characters can do instant tether grabs anymore Obviously there are are more and not all of these were changes from Smash 4. I just feel like over time the series became more restricted and less fun.

[@antimatterstudios8395]

Cloud, Bayonetta, Shiek, and Rosalina got absolutely gutted in ultimate

[@orangeman9081]

Being honest mii swordfighter will mess you up if you don’t know what your doing, his tornado combos at every single percent and on the entire cast, follow up with an up b and it does 30% and kills at around 90

[@dreamyandsweet]

Kirby's Down Air doesn't link into Footstool eliminating his edge guarding game

[@buttersddragon]

Can't think of anything balance-wise, but fun-wise? Did they make pk fire even more irritating or is it just me?

[@ibby_h5574]

Butters the DoppelDragon It's harder to get out of because SDI is gone (if not then it's probably just worse in ultimate). So yeah PK Fire is more irritating

[@Endershock1678]

Fork It's just worse to make multi it's work better.

[@equinox-XVI]

Its amazing just how drastically Toon Link was changed going into Ultimate. *Nerfs:* _Up Smash:_ Up smash was ridiculous in Smash 4, it combo'd out of glide toss bomb almost unaffected by percent and was a reliable kill move. Now it barely ever kills. _Back Throw:_ People constantly complain about Ness' back throw, but Toon Link was honestly right behind him. I can't even tell you how many stocks I took with that one move. _Forward Smash:_ Nerfed in everything that made it good. Kill power and mix up potential we're basically eliminated. Its frame data is better, but it barely ever makes a difference because the move is just so bad now. _Bomb:_ Probably the hardest nerf of all. Bomb can no longer go through weak projectiles. Airdodge item throws we're removed and bombs travel slightly faster, so his character specific tech, "bomb fakeouts" were nerfed to useless and made harder to execute. Plus it requires you to full hop now instead of the short hop like in smash 4. Glide tossing was replaced by the much less useful pivot glide and even though bomb fair is now a true combo without glide tossing, glide tosses just made it so much more consistent compared to what it is now. The only buff to bomb is that you can z-drop it without using zair. *Buffs:* _Up Special:_ In smash 4, it kinda just didn't do anything. It was an out of shield option and that was it. In Ultimate, it *kills.* _Back Air:_ I'm sure we've all saw the tournament highlight. Bair comboes into into itself and then up-b which can score some disgustingly early kills. Generally, Toon Link was more tech centered in smash 4 making him hard to pick up, but now in Ultimate. It seems they made him easier to use. Sadly, while lower his skill floor, they lowered his skill ceiling with it.

[@ibby_h5574]

Equinox Yeah I totally agree. In smash 4 I found Toon Link a lot more technical and that's what got me into maining him. Now he's just not as fun to play with all the nerfs they gave him