Everything You Need To Know About Shimano Groupsets

[@gcntech]

What groupset do you have on your bike?

[@philipcooper8297]

I've got the beginner's choice, Shimano Sora r3000. On my next bike I want mechanical 105.

[@biggertree7063]

My gravel bike came out of the box with a last gen tiagra and 11-36. Shimano really is conservative with their cassette recommendations.

[@livibam]

DA D12 on 3 of my builds, apart from the turbo that has some dodgy thing I’ve never heard of from a website in China.

[@TryboBike]

Ultegra, Microshift, KMC, XT, chinese cassette and Capreo.

[@gerardotelese5337]

Can't afford any of the Di2...not even the Groupset Of The People Di2

[@paulmorrison30]

Shimano Tiagra, the new group set of the people ✊🏾

[@ShannonSouthAfrica]

Viva Tiagra viva.

[@khalilsart8189]

On my country its Sora lol

[@matthewvelo]

Agree, except for the series that was on my last bike which wasn't compatible with any other Shimano gear. Still pretty damned good.

[@owensnicholas]

Came here to say exactly this. :)

[@VladGoro25]

Have full tiagra flatbar road bike. Doesn't want anything else. Best bike i've ever had

[@AleksiJoensuu]

My bike is 7-8 years old and uses a 2x8-speed Sora derailleurs and Claris levers. They still work just fine, shift accurately, and there's absolutely nothing wrong with them. The only thing I could want for is hydraulic brakes, but an upgrade to Avid BB-7's seems to work well. Entry level stuff can serve for a long while.

[@TheCarsandmore]

I have Sora on a 20 year old bike (my current indoor bike). Shifting still works like a dream, very well built. My Ultra on my road bike is better.

[@MrChippinator]

Using a combination of 105 R7000, front and rear mech + shifters, and Ultegra 6700 for the crank and rim brakes. Honestly, I am so happy with 105 that any future bike I buy will likely be 105 equipped.

[@ff2e]

I'm using a 6700 rd and casette with 5700 shifters and a 7000 crank. Mix all the things :)

[@johnossendorf9979]

Time to buy up all the mechanical 105 you can get your hands on !

[@Stefano_Rodriguez]

I just started cycling two months ago and bought my first road bike. Specialized Allez E5 with Claris.I'm enjoying it and already collected 1000km on my bike!

[@TheFloridaBikeVlogger]

sheldon?!

[@charlesjoshi5154]

He makes everything so clear, I love his videos

[@grachtschrap]

I ride with mechanical Ultegra from a few years back. For a experienced amateur like me it is still sooo good man.

[@speedbird8987]

Ultegra gets my vote too!

[@glenngardin3561]

Thanks for not bashing the lower lever group sets! Hoping my next bike has 105 or higher, but my current Sora works well.

[@GospelSami]

I ride a Colnago C40 Rabobank bike from 1997 with a Dura Ace 9speed group set (it was Matthew Haymans training bike). I was an elite rider in late 1990ties / early 2000s without (professional) contract, competed in 80 to 200 km contests. It might look oldfashioned with todays standards, but i can tell you it is still a high end bike. Now i am an old fart compared to the young guys at 53 years of age, but on my good days i still give them a hard time to keep up. Even at 25 years of old biking tech, i can tell you that the Dura Ace group set is the best quality available!

[@You-Tuber2024]

I went from 105 R7000 to a Dura Ace 9200 crankset and I did 20meters and thought “oh my, what a difference”. Any group set you have, if maintained properly will work flawlessly. It’s only when you go from to the other that you actually realise why there’s so much hype around different grades

[@dmitry.gashko]

And also when you go up you just cannot realize the whole difference. You did, when after some time you go back for a moment

[@AtomBom8]

Claris is great. I run it on my commuter and tourer (11-36!). The latest shifters don't have the sticky out cables anymore so they won't rattle against the GoPro.

[@asim9379]

Claris r2000 is great. No issue at all and the mech disc brakes give me no problems either unlike some hydro brakes I've had on another bike.

[@dairesweeney419]

I use claris on my city slash going to the shop bike, works great and would highly recommend to anyone who is looking at a bike just to get around and wants to save a couple of quid.

[@a1white]

Replacement cassettes are a fraction of the price too!

[@johnstrac]

Can't wait for the follow up Campagnolo video !

[@bx_cyclingchef]

My ulterga I noticed recently while doing maintenance found two broken teeth in the cassette. Checked out why. The metal used sucks. Went up to the next Dura Ace and sure enough it has stronger metal just like Ollie talks about. Changing now from ultegra to dura ace. Thanks for the video Ollie. From the Bronx, NY you saved this cyclist from rookie mistakes.

[@senfnacken]

Why did you only show the old Claris components? The newer ones (especially the chainset and STIs) look basically exactly like the Sora components.

[@ministryoftruth8588]

GCN bike-snobbery's your answer.

[@gcntech]

We didn't have any new Claris at GCN Megabase

[@belowthehill]

Upgraded to a new bike with Sora and greatly improved my triathlon race times. Then got a Wahoo Kickr and mounted that bike on the smart trainer with a SRAM cassette, and got a new road bike with 105. The 105 definitely shifts better, but training on the Sora on Rouvy rocks!

[@cherriagana]

With this shortage the only thing that was available to buy for me for 1200€ in my framesize was a gravelbike with Claris. Still does the job and is my commute bike doing 2K a month with it :D

[@gcntech]

Getting great use out of it!

[@RobinT346]

I was in a lift the other day, on my mobility scooter, with a guy and his bike. noticed he had a 105 groupset on his Canyon bike. "groupset of the people!" I said quietly and received a pleased nod in return. our respective partners had looks of "WTF was that all about?" on their faces.

[@junaid42465]

😂😂😂

[@daniely5260]

Cringe

[@dan_lazaro]

@@daniely5260 hey man don't call yourself out like that, makes us feel sorry for you

[@JamesSmith-qs4hx]

@@daniely5260 Comment of the people 👍

[@simonpowell2559]

Cool

[@nickpatten5263]

One of the best and most interesting videos I have seen recently. Very informative. Thank you.

[@MrLoopynutter]

Good video but you showed the older generation of Claris, the newer version comes with a hollowtech crankset and some other "trickle down" tech from Sora

[@johnthackray2820]

I have recently upgraded by Boardman Team Carbon groupset with the 105 R7000 11 speed with rim brakes. I also swapped out the BB30 crank set and installed a Praxis BB convertor to the Shimano Hollowtech II system, so the new 105 crankset runs in the BB. I am super impressed by the shiting quality, silky smooth, so reliable. My only negaative point is the brake pads. I dont find them particiularly great, especially in the wet! Apart from that, I an extremely happy with 105.

[@ronarmitage2377]

I rebuilt my 2010 Cannondale Quick 3 with the Shimano Sora R3000 9-Speed 34/50t 170mm Crankset with Shimano Sora R3000 9-Speed Flat Bar Shifters. I did use the SHIMANO Cassette Sprocket, CS-HG400-9, 9-Speed, 11-13-15-17-20-23-26-30-34 to give me a little range on the hills. I use the bike to ride around town and a little trail riding. I have a Cannondale Synapse Carbon 105 for my road rides which I love and tried to gear the Quick 3 as close as possible.

[@Sir-Prizse]

I think the video was made to make the unpopular new 105 Di2 R7150 groupset a bit more appealing, but funnily enough the old 11-speed 105 R7020 disc groupset weighs only 2478 g and is thus only 40 g heavier than the brand new Dura-Ace Di2 R9250.

[@80robs92]

Except that R9250 is a 12 speed group and R7020 is an 11 speed group. The 12th big sprocket adds weight (30 or 34).

[@Sir-Prizse]

@@80robs92 That's absolutely right, but that the last gen 105 is almost as heavy as the current Dura-Ace is a bit sad, isn't it? The old 11-speed Dura-Ace weighed 2,016g. So you "pay" half a kilo for electronic shifting and the 12th sprocket.

[@80robs92]

@@Sir-Prizse Well with the previous 11 Speed generation, Dura Ace DI2 was slightly lighter than the mechanical shifting Dura Ace. The 12th Sprocket is the difference, the cassettes are heavier. Apart from the cassettes, the whole groupset (Ultegra and Dura Ace) are lighter than their predecessor. But the point is except for Campagnolo neither SRAM nor Shimano offer a 12 Speed mechanical Groupset. And the future will be electronic shifting. It will tripple down to Tiara and Sora. I bought my first Ultegra Di2 R8000 for 1000€. The official retail price of Shimano was 2400€. I think we all should come down an wait what the price will be when all the madness about disrupted delivery chains etc. is gone. i'm pretty sure one can get the groupset or an "upgrade" set for a good, acceptable price.

[@Sir-Prizse]

@@80robs92 I'm open to everything new and because I work for an online bike part shop I'm right at the source.

[@80robs92]

@@gs78798 depends on what sprocket you are going to add. For the Ultegra cassette it is 50g.

[@CycleNLincs]

Love my Compact Tiagra 4600 series with a 12 - 28 cassette. Bought second hand and still performing!

[@alexandersnider734]

Electronic shifting is like 3D TV's. Everyone thought we would want it, and started pushing them ad nauseam, but at the end of the day, it was always going to be too much added complexity for not enough return for the average customer to ever justify it becoming the norm in the industry.

[@chris1275cc]

I'm not so sure about that, once the Chinese companies start dropping electronic groupsets with more comparability/flexibility (the first steps of which have already been taken with the WheelTop EDS OX) the prices will drop considerably and e-shifting will not so much trickle down as get pushed off a cliff.

[@wilfdarr]

@@chris1275cc I'll ride Chinese frames all day long but it'll be a cold day in hell I ride Chinese electronics! They're QC just isn't there and I'd bet most cyclists feel the same: I don't think that'll be what drives the price down! What will drive the price down is the lack of demand. BTW oh shit it's 3:30 and I wanted to get a ride in before the sun goes down...I wonder if my batteries are good... oh wait, I have mechanical 105s and don't need to think about that! See ya!

[@chris1275cc]

@@wilfdarr Yeah and I bet you once said exactly the same shit about those Chinese frames, right up to the point you where happy to ride one. But you don't have to ride them, but many people will that's the point. I don't know where people get the idea there is a lack of demand for e-shifting or why you think the QC of Chinese frames (known to be hit and miss) is any better than for their electronics.

[@wilfdarr]

@@chris1275cc I wouldn't ride Chinese carbon fiber either. The availability of Chinese carbon wheels and frames hasn't dropped the price of real carbon wheels and frames one cent, because everyone knows the score.

[@chris1275cc]

Who mentioned carbon? Not me, and not you "I'll ride Chinese frames all day long" So again what makes you think that the QC on ANY Chinese frame is better than the QC of their electronics? Where do you think most of the worlds electronics are made Japan the US? LOL And yes the price of "real" LOL carbon has dropped dramatically since China started producing it, Carbon frames have gone from being the most expensive part of the bike to being cheaper than a mid tier group-set in less than 10 years. I keep hearing how Chinese cycling stuff including carbon is inferior YET Its Bianchi and Colnargo steerers that are snapping, Scott forks that are breaking, Shimnao Cranks exploding, and how many recalls have Trek and Specialized done at this point?. Where are all the Horror stories from the brands that get their stuff made in China? , I see a lot of Japanese , "American" and "Italian" brands pumping out inferior crap and making lots of excuses.

[@almin9751]

R7000 105 rocking here 😃✌🏻... Not a pro, not into racing, but cycling overall enthusiast that was my approach when deciding to purchase my Tarmac If I eventually get interested into a now and then race or event and only when i wear out my 105 i would jump to Ultegra and I guess that would be my top... Great content as always you Gcn have been my tutors along the way ✌🏻

[@yonglingng5640]

One kind of rider the community needs. 👍👍 I plan to rock 105 R7000 on my current bike too when it's time to spec it for performance riding.

[@ricardorgomez]

I bought a 2000 Scott Aluminum/Carbon fork road bike for about $1000. Fitted with Shimano Sora. It was so amazing. Mind you, I used to race in the 80's and had a top-end 1986 Pinarello fitted with the latest Dura Ace which had the first index-shifting system. The Scott bike was so superior to that Pinarello. Weight. Stiffness. Usability. Unfortunately, sold it as I just didn't ride it as much as I wanted. I see so many people ride bikes fitted with Ultegra and Dura Ace riding 10mph... It's their money and they can choose to do with it what they will. But they could save a ton of money by going with something less. They'll never use the top 70% that these items can deliver. Me, I hope to get a new Pinarello with 105 DI2. Like you mentioned, pretty much offers everything that Dura Ace does at a much less cost. And more options have become available since its release. They now have 172.5mm crank arms. Which was the ONLY thing holding me back from 105 DI2. I was hoping for a 53t chainring but with an 11t rear, I think 52t on the front will be fine. Lovely video. Been looking for a video like this for a while....

[@im-on-youtube]

"Share it with your friends ... if you've got any" - unnecessary personal attack at the end there 😂

[@andersweinemo]

Well, if you watching a whole video about groupsets - the last bit is relevant

[@gcntech]

🤣

[@Lesley_Pokemon]

Di2 would be a dream but my Shimano Sora is doing a great job i love it

[@calvinminer4365]

I'm about to upgrade my 11 year old Specialized Crux from Sora to 105s, so this video was fantastically valuable.

[@andrewpalmer]

I ride Ultegra in the summer months and Claris in the winter. Claris is absolutely fine. The only issue is the big jumps between gears. Sometimes you need to shift up to an easier gear but that jump is too easy. Come on Shimano you know you want to make Tiagra 12 speed mechanical!

[@Relevant_Irrelevance]

"If your budget stretches to 105, I say go for it." And that's why I have an aluminum frame with a carbon fork but 105 as my groupset :)

[@brysonszy6306]

Nothing wrong with that, that'd the ideal setup for any non-racer enthusiast in my opinion. I own an aluminium frame with a carbon fork, built up with a 105 groupset too. :)

[@Relevant_Irrelevance]

@@brysonszy6306 Oh absolutely.

[@Aba-Gobyee]

I'm new bee .Is 105 good for daily 26 mile cycling?

[@Relevant_Irrelevance]

@@Aba-Gobyee Honestly, even Sora is pretty good for that. Watch Connor's latest video appearance on the GCN main channel.

[@simonm1447]

@@Aba-Gobyee if you want to keep maintenance costs low it's an advantage to use wearables from lower group sets. Cassettes and chains are wearables, which are cheaper from lower groups.

[@xMrsmileyfacex]

Super old school with Shimano Light Action SiS. Still works flawlessly.

[@craigfullbrook7219]

Thanks Ollie , that was a nice summary of the Shimano range, good to see a cycling content creator positively critiquing rather than slamming the entry level stuff. I will echo many others comments and say Tiagra is now primed to be the groupset of the people, additionally to clear up the limitations of the gear ratio’s you mentioned the maximum range on the cassette is 11-32….. that’s not entirely correct, many new bikes with Tiagra including Road, Gravel and Hybrids come with the Long (GS) derailleur ship with a 11-34 and as I discovered nipping up the B screw all the way outboard from the hanger/frame you can even run a 11-36 cassette pending your chain is long enough. I think what would have been more valuable here would have been to mention that Ultegra, Durace and (potentially the new 105) have cross compatible components (e.g mix and match cassettes, front mechs, callipers etc) whereas Tiagra has a limited relationship due to compatibility, even older 10speed flagship Groupset components won’t shift correctly with modern Tigara components. I think that’s Tiagras biggest flaw, it would be nice to have a 11/12 speed evolution, but all that said if you’ve never ridden 11/12 speed and only have access to this groupset you’ll still have all the gears you need, wont know what you’re missing.

[@wilfdarr]

My guess is they'll bump the R7000 down to Tiagra and call it a day.

[@h3n488]

Why no mention of Tourney? It has road bike shifters and is suitable for entry level road bikes. Would be interesting to hear about that too.

[@mechanicaldavid4827]

"Suitable" for what? Throwing your bike in a canal?

[@VYKSU]

@@mechanicaldavid4827 Don't be daft.

[@HomieBalogna]

Read the title and find your answer

[@h3n488]

@@HomieBalogna Hehehe, now reading the title again and yes, the answer is really in the title 😅

[@whomadethatsaltysoup]

Just been gifted a Cannondale Cann s2 rd. It comes with disc brakes and a 105 Groupset. Don't know how old it is, and have not, as yet, checked if it is 11 or 12 speed on the cassette. I am very grateful to you for this excellent tutorial on the Shimano range.

[@nvrvnjv6362]

Just got my first barely used road bike with Claris 2x8 (50-34/11-25) for less than $400 so I'm really really happy with it. Looking forward to jump to a brand new one next year.

[@danarditi]

finally an excellent comparative of the SHIMANO group sets line, it could be very useful to know if is IT possible to mix components from different kinds and which upgrade you recommend when you are in a tight budget

[@jonathanrobinson2628]

Excellent and informative video :) Just a random point to note - the larger shifters on hydraulic Tiagra are great for me with my larger hands (I'm 6ft 8") and are more suited to my mitts than my other bike with Ultegra (with rim brakes).

[@craigfullbrook7219]

@Jonathan Robinson - I too grimaced at the comment around the Tiagra shifters not being comfortable! I’m not tall or have big hands for that matter but I find the shifters very comfortable, certainly helps going down fast/technical descents or climbing as you tend to grip the bars more firmly, you can distribute the grip putting less tension on your fingers and thumbs! Not to mention in cold weather when your fingers go numb, having slim slinky little shifters doesn’t help! I also find the (new) ST-4720 have similar feel the GRX shifters, nice vulcanised grippy hoods that soak up a lot more road buzz than the higher end shifters. Tiagra is a solid groupset and I have no issues keeping up with my fellow riders in the local club whom are all running 105 upwards 😎👌🏻

[@gcntech]

Thanks Jonathan!

[@a1white]

Good point on locking it up in a public place. 10 years ago, I locked up my new pride and joy, a Tiagra equipped road bike, in central London. I arrived back a couple of hours later to find my rear derailleur and handlebars missing. This was only an older Tiagra too, with the the external routing on the shifters. It was new and shiny though. Thankfully the insurance fixed it and I still ride that bike now 🙂

[@gcntech]

Ah that's terrible Alex. Unfortunately we always have to be extra careful!

[@AFreezer]

Using an old 9-speed Sora shifter (ones with the cable coming out the sides) and Claris derailleurs. Had a couple of crashes and Rear derailleur getting stuck on the wheel moments, but it still works nicely after some servicing. These entry level stuff is pretty bulletproof.

[@gerardotelese5337]

"1500-2000 for a bike outfitted with mech 105...and you can expect to pay half the price of a bike with Dura Ace for a bike with 105 di2" that's a pretty convoluted way to say the price of 105 di2 without saying it outloud xD. 105 di2 groupset costs about 1750£ and bike with it 4-6000£. 105 THE GROUPSET OF THE PEOPLE...what people exactly have 4-6000£ for their first sport bike?....hope they will keep selling the mech 105 at a reasonable price, because yes 105 di2 has arrived but at that price it's still not here for the beginner and amateur cyclist.

[@JamesSmith-qs4hx]

I'm sure there are plenty of millennials out there who enjoy having their wallets emptied...

[@invisiblescout6335]

@@JamesSmith-qs4hx ?

[@JamesSmith-qs4hx]

@@invisiblescout6335 Well you know, these millennial types with blue and yellow flags in their twitter bios.... The 3 dart finishers. They will buy it because they have no common sense.

[@invisiblescout6335]

@@JamesSmith-qs4hx aight bro

[@grndkntrl]

@@JamesSmith-qs4hx OK boomer.

[@chrisridesbicycles]

You have shortly touched on the topic but could you make a video about the cross-compatibility of the components. Especially with the 12-speed but not HG+ 105 I have lost track a bit. You could also give tips for relatively inexpensive upgrades like the 2-piece rim brake pads where you can change the rubber pad without having to readjust your brakes.

[@gcntech]

Great suggestion Christian

[@davehollingworth5537]

Wondering if anything trickled down? 😂 I started with Tourney - 7 speed joy - and only recently upgraded to 105 (but not Di2). Loving it!

[@bogilvie]

I got into cycling 3 years ago, bought a extremely lightly used 2013 specialized roubaix expert off Kijiji ,never knew the difference between sets and pleased to learn the Ultegra on my bike was the best from Shimano at the time.

[@crapilanofridge7745]

Ultegra 11 speed mechanical with discs. So good I never really have to think about it. Oddly though, I'm not sure the shifting on the cassette is any better than my old campy 9 speed chorus. I am ignoring the extra cogs, better chainset shifting and brakes from another planet on the ultegra :)

[@paulcuthbert]

I commute year round (15-25km depending on the route) and train outside all winter. I've used Tiagra for the past 5 or 6 years on my commuter/winter bike and been very happy with it. It works well, looks great (I love the Ice Grey!) and is relatively inexpensive to replace parts when they inevitably wear out. That said, I'm about to overhaul everything on my bike after 2 years on the same groupset! So not bad going at all. Tiagra is the one for me! (My summer bike is 105)

[@csherminator]

I've got a similar situation here in Poland. I commute around 40 km daily, and during summer my previous 105 was giving excellent results, but during winter the rain, snow, mud, salt and ice (for the falls) destroy the components quite quickly. Changing the cassette and chain so often here it's not worth, so I got a new bike and I actually downgraded my groupset to Tiagra (hydraulic brakes included) and the performance is excellent, with a cheaper replacement.

[@fisharefriends598]

Electronic 105 is so expensive…. No longer groupset of the people I really hope the cheaper group sets never go electronic… fixing that on the road will be a pain

[@Goriaas]

Yeah you have to go one down to Tiagra now. Screw this forced electronic shifting business. "I really hope the cheaper group sets never go electronic" No worries there, cheaper and already almost as good Chinese groupset will take over then , and they kind of already are, look at sensah etc.

[@DanTuber]

One day it will be all electronic. People need to accept that technology is always changing.

[@andrei-desu5361]

@@Goriaas I'm going to have to disagree with sensah being better than the entry level groupsets of shimano. Used to have sensah team pro 11speed, sold it and bought sora. Shifting is better, more comfortable and easier to find.

[@Goriaas]

@@andrei-desu5361 Thenlearn to read buddy. I said almost as good as shimano, I agree they aren't quite there yet I'd rather have tiagra 10 speed than some Chinese 12 speed. For now. They will most likely catch up

[@brysonszy6306]

@@andrei-desu5361 Time to try out Ltwoo RX 12speed. At the shop I work at, we have both Ltwoo and Sensah setups, and I feel that Ltwoo feels and shifts a lot better than Sensah.

[@M.S777-M.S]

I've still got tiagra from about 2009 and it's as smooth as anything when changing, rim brakes way better than the 105 disc I had on another bike.

[@robertcrvc]

What an amazing video! I finally understood all the questions I’ve had about group sets for the last 7 years 😂

[@amritmaraj308]

Shimano Tiagra shifters and Tiagra at the back with a 105 50/34 Crank. Mixed up but I love it.

[@neuspur]

What I always take into consideration: servicability and wear part costs (cassette, chain,....). From that perspective: DuraAce is the best option - if you have a sponsor. In terms of wear part costs: that is the main reason I dont ride SRAM.

[@manoz6194]

I like Shimano cassettes because of replaceable cogs, for instance on my mountain bike cassette I can replace the 5 smallest cogs without replacing the whole cassette

[@TheAkagai]

Well done. Comprehensive but not overwhelming.

[@varrol5031]

I bought Shimano 10x 105s and a 9x Sora for my kids and my bikes which are 20" and 24" wheels and 1x8 / 1x7 - SS versions fit perfectly (standard MTB derailleurs just hit the ground apart of short versions of Altus and Tourney), and the gear change quality is perfect :P They can be matched with older XT/LX 8x shifters or brand new 8x Sora or Altus + many more.

[@gekkofrog92]

Started on a Claud Butler Elite R2 with Shimano Tourney. Wasn’t the slickest but robust. Then onto a Specialized Allez Sport with Sora and what a difference. Currently waiting on my Tifosi with Tiagra with Hydraulic discs. Looking forward to it.

[@jameslee-pevenhull5087]

In the old days of Exage, hubs were available in the groupset, as well as seatpin, headset and pedals. In those days, the bike shop were willing to build you a pair of wheels with your chosen rims and spokes. Nowadays, wheels are Ultegra or DuraAce factory sets. IIRC, EX300 became Sora. EX400 became Tiagra EX500 became 105 EX600 became Ultegra DuraAce kept its name.

[@simonm1447]

I use EX 300 cranks from a scrap yard bike on my commuter bike. If I remember right they launched Exage in the early ninetees

[@billwhite5853]

My first Road Bike had the old Exage 400 groupset. Bridgestone RB2, 1994. I think that was the last year bridgestone produced them in the US

[@Peluche54]

I daily use Claris R2000 8s up to Dura-Ace R9100 mechanical / rim brakes, through Sora R3000 9s and Ultegra R8000 11s, and really, when everything is set up correctly, you can't tell any functional differences. Claris is smoother and less prone to settings deviation (thx captain obvious), Dura-Ace and Ultegra are lighter and feels a bit more "high end" (obvious again). When looking at rim brakes, the dual pivot system from 105 to Dura Ace is the real upgrade from lower end groupsets. Compared to Campagnolo (I have 10s and 11s in various ranges from Veloce to Super Record), it's a bit more robust on rear shifting, where Campagnolo is more satisfying on front shifting. Campagnolo is also more convincing on rim brakes...when dual pivot Shimano calipers are out of the discussion

[@qs7391]

For real , ive jumped from claris to the 8020 ultegra, the differences between them really shocked me😢

[@BrianJohnson-bq9tr]

I own a gravel/cross bike now and I'm currently looking for a second wheelset for this very purpose. Cheers for the video.

[@julianamccaffree7925]

Great video! Very well explained. I would love a video like that but with SRAM groupsets.

[@DavidLamon]

Chose 105 di2 with Dura Ace cassette + crankset and Ultegra rotors for my new TCR, far less expensive that the Ultegra di2 version and kind of the same weight

[@davecasey4341]

I remember with fondness, my Trek Pilot that had Ultegra components, including a 3-ring crank up front. Those were the days.

[@matthewho1053]

Ultegra is my favourite. Only having marginal different in performance when comparing to Dura-Ace while having significant difference in terms of price.

[@sidthatsmoi]

I was waiting for Claris groupset to show up at the end but I guess its so bad they didnt even bother having one in studio! I am happy with my full claris groupset entry level £250 bike. Max speed achieved on flat is around 35kmph. Wondering if I should get a proper 105 groupset road bike to increase my performance 🤔

[@quwers]

Just pedal more.

[@dan_lazaro]

Just as an inspirational piece of information, I got to pro level on Claris 2400 on a Giant SCR bike. Since then, I got sponsored a bike with Sora in the form of the Cannondale Synapse and now I'm on 11 speed Sensah Empire, much more reliable that 5800 105 but I'd still go for R7000 if you can because despite being heavier than Sensah, the rear shifting is better because of the Shadow design. The front though not so much Shimano since the new design for the front mech suck.

[@davehollingworth5537]

Ha! Shimano Tourney anyone?! 7-speed!

[@trainiax]

A speed of 35 km/h is pretty darn good! On the flat, a higher-tier groupset by itself won't create any miracles - a 50/16 cruising gear would feel the same whether Claris or 105. Probably the biggest advantage of a higher groupset would be closer gear spacing making it easier to find a comfortable cadence. Changing bikes (rather than just the groupset) can bring other improvements - although it seems that often the frame and geometry are exactly the same between entry-level and mid-tier bikes (only the components are different). If you haven't done so already, changing to faster tires would probably bring the best bang for your buck on the flat.

[@kennethward9530]

A good follow on video (especially in today's supply chain constrained world) would be a discussion of interchangeability between groupsets. For example, if one replaced a Tiagra derailleur with a 105, would it work well? Would a Tiagra crankset work with 105 11 speed set up? Asking as one who has traveled to big events having to make emergency purchases due to unauthorized modifications to my bike by the airline.

[@paulcollingridge8387]

Agree... More importantly for those of us who do the long miles, can I replace worn parts? My 2006 Tiagra, until last year, could only now accept Claris... And now I can't even get 8 speed triple rings in 50T,so I'm mixing 8 and 9 speed. I think the aim is to get us to throw old bikes away and buy new.... Its like buying an ipad and finding that Apple have deliberately bricked it

[@AlySayuki]

Thanks for going over the Shimano lineup! I had a Bridgestone RB-1 back in the 1990’s with the old 105 group set then 🚵‍♀️!! Looking forward for a road bike for me so will go with Sora because my Trek mountain bike has the same number of gears for my Wahoo turbo so I don’t have to swap cassettes 😅!!

[@glyon4996]

Another great video, thanks! Ollie, have you thought about doing a road test between mechanical vs Di2? Yes the feel will be different but what about the power, speed, timing?

[@tonycalvo1914]

Not too happy about electronic group sets idea and price. Of course they are convenient but the idea of getting something electronic that might run out of battery or get interference from who knows where when u r topping a hill gives me "the chills". What good cross-brand option there is (if any) to have mechanical-disk (or rim) that could even allow to switch chain sets from 52 to 54 etc. Love GCN and your comments are greatly appreciated. Cheers from Panamá🇵🇦

[@WanganRacer5]

I love riding Shimano Sora, it's durable nice looking and just the same Sora sounds so cool to me

[@brokenrecord3523]

My 1st road bike, ~1987, Trek 2100, 105, down tube shifters, ruby red, loved that bike. Next bike, 30 years later Domane with Tiagra - way better!

[@princejemino1793]

i hope you guys make a video about sram groupset for roadbike hahaha btw nice video ride safe guys!

[@willdtw]

Claris does come with mechanical disc brakes on plenty of bikes now

[@a1white]

3rd party mechanical discs though? Not Claris ones?

[@guillermokuster414]

Your videos are always so informative and on point. Thank you!

[@newoldsteel]

Since I ride older steel bikes I’m used to 7-9 speed drivetrains and am not needing more but I like to throw in some sora components in there sometimes and you are right the quality is as equal as 90s dura ace. But I just hate that the crankset only comes in 50 34! Wish they had at least a 52 36 option or something else. Oh well that’s why I have to go new old stock sometimes lol

[@trainiax]

Cranksets are one of the most forgiving groupset components when it comes to mixing and matching. I'm running a 10-speed Tiagra-level crank on a 9-speed Sora groupset without any issues, and many cranks are rated for more than one chain size (I've seen them grouped as 7-8 speed or 9-10-11 speed).

[@newoldsteel]

@@trainiax What's funny is only just last night I found people on older forums saying the same thing. Thanks for that I'll be hunting for better gearing options XD

[@mayurbagul1276]

Loved it but there should be video for those who like to ride hybrid bicycles for both city and gravel terrain.

[@PJD_55]

Brilliantly well explained. Thank you.

[@ankush_tesla]

Dura Ace 12 Ultegra 12 105 12 electronic /11mech rim Tiagra 10 Sora 9 mech disc Claris 8 rim

[@andromedasmascot]

I’ve been commuting on my genisis crox de fer with a sora group set and it has taken me over 2000 miles quite comfortably well worth the money in my mind. Another great video as always.

[@PrzemyslawSliwinski]

6:30 - There are new (road-specific) Dura-Ace (RT-CL900) & Ultegra (RT-CL800) rotors available (in principle) now... ;)

[@colinmcdonald2499]

13:00. Sora has an 11-34 cassette if you have the longer deralieur arm. My first generation gravel bike really benefits from 30x34 ratio.

[@cb6866]

Thanks Doc...it's a lot to learn ! It really depends on the salesperson when you're a noob.

[@GregFliesVR]

The video i was looking for. Thank you!

[@nagasako7]

I'm just getting into biking, but coming from fishing, I know Shimano are the best quality and everyone buys Shimano reels. Interesting to know Shimano are final word in bikes.

[@cosinus_square]

105 Di2 is NOT the groupset of the people anymore, that would be Tiagra now which is 10 speed. 105 mechanical 11 speed in not even in the current lineup. Correct the info please.

[@wilfdarr]

105 R7000 are still in production. If we keep buying it, they'll keep making it. More likely I expect though, they'll drop Tiagra and rebrand the 7000 as Tiagra.

[@cosinus_square]

@@wilfdarr 105 will still be available for the next decade maybe but very unlikely to replace any other groupset in the lineup. Sora and Tourney have been in production for years, that's 1985/1995 technology, because of their price point. 105 Di2 is simply forcefully upselling an otherwise cheap technology.

[@David-jl6hr]

Thank you for sharing great information and details.

[@leoluo6955]

This will be ok again when the r7000 105 becomes the new tiagra. At the moment there is too much gap between 105 and tiagra. Even if I must say…a Claris takes you around with no issues!

[@MrFoxygang]

3 Bikes SRAM APEX (love it ) 105, AND ULTEGRA

[@LoaforDie]

I ride dura-ace since it came with the bike but I really like Ultegra more when I had it on my previous bike. Don’t care too much for weight, not that drastic. But Performance oriented more than weight and Ultegra does more than enough for me.

[@tomm1413]

I love me some 105's they're not too expensive and they are amazing! I have them on my mtb and my road bike And since my road bike is di2 ready, I will probably upgrade to di2 105's when they become more readily available!

[@Koen030NL]

the new 105 is like 1800 euros/pounds... thats expensive to me.

[@thejarrod123]

So glad I got the 105 mechanical.

[@M.S777-M.S]

A video on cross compatibility would be good, mix and match to a budget.

[@chris1275cc]

With Shimano I think people would walk away more confused than they started, best to just go to Shimanos compatibility chart (although that doesn't tell the whole story either) 😅

[@raymundcresencia1359]

You forgot to mention that the claris to tiagra groupset has a flat bar shifters and brakes option too.

[@docmccoy9813]

Very interesting. What is a groupset. Everyday I learn something.

[@MrFoxygang]

You should look at Shimano ALFINE VS ROHLOFF

[@jeffreywilliams3646]

Please do a video on gravel groupsets.

[@andreemurray7039]

Dura ace 9100 mercancal rim brake s very good works very well

[@saschafunk1644]

I tested a 12 speed cassett. I was not able to run the smallest sprocket. The chain was jumping over the teeth. The bike dealer said to me, I am creating to much torque. I said to him, your bikes are not made for real performance. I do not pay 4000 Euro for a bike, that can not bring my power on the road. Greetings from Germany.

[@millermiller75]

I’d be interested to know if there’s a difference in durability or longevity of parts between the group sets.

[@jimhansen5395]

There absolutely is. Dura Ace chainrings, cassettes and chains wear out much faster than Ultegra, and 105. 105 is a much harder wearing groupset than Ultegra.

[@gregoirefourniermontgieux2033]

My local bike seller told me this : Think of the Dura Ace as an F1, you can expect maximum performance out of it, but you would never use it for 50.000km each year and work perfectly without checking and tweaking it. That's something a solid family car would do, like 105 or cheaper 😀

[@millermiller75]

@@gregoirefourniermontgieux2033 so if you ride 5,000km per year maybe you spend an extra $200 per year on dura ace parts vs 105? Cassettes, chains, rotors and chainrings.

[@gregoirefourniermontgieux2033]

@@millermiller75 I'd say so, I guess, and also tune it a bit more often, so that it actually performs to perfection as it is supposed to

[@trainiax]

I would hazard a guess that there's probably not a huge difference in longevity from Claris to 105. The lower tiers are heavier and have fewer gears, but they're very solidly built.

[@Crishuddy]

In Brazil we have Shimano tourney for road bike.

[@simonm1447]

Tourney is limited to 8 speed, what means the cassettes offers less gear spread ratio than 9 speed or higher, but Tourney works fine if it's well adjusted.

[@ministryoftruth8588]

@@simonm1447 Tourney's 7 speed bloke.

[@simonm1447]

@@ministryoftruth8588 you get Tourney derailleurs capable of 8 speed too. TX-800 for example is the 8 speed version. 7 and 8 speed uses the same distance between the cogs. In theory it could also shift 9 speed like other 8 speed derailleurs with a 9 speed shifter (since the cassette has the same width), but I don't think the derailleur's stiffness is good enough for the smaller tolerances of a 9 speed system and the cage may be at the limit with big 36 teeth cassettes

[@simonm1447]

@@ministryoftruth8588 there's the Tourney TZ line, which is 6/7 speed, and the Tourney TX line which is 7/8 speed. The TZ line also don't offer disc brakes and only freewheels, while the TX line offers freehub bodies, 8 speed cassettes and a mechanical disc brake. The rotors of course are also compatible with hydraulic disc brakes from better groups with resin pads. Tourney road bike shifters/brake leavers are offered only with 7 speed options (A 070 Group), but you can still use the 8 speed TX - 800 drive train components and use a single 8 speed Claris R 2000 lever and the 2nd lever for the front chain rings from the A 070 group, and you get an inexpensive 8 speed road bike system