EVP Sensor Open 5v Reference Circuit

This video covers some key fundamentals that every single technician needs to learn.
What do you do when you find 0 volts on a position sensor signal? How do you force an output solenoid to energize? What is the purpose of the 5v reference and what to do when it is missing?
Are you confident enough in your troubleshooting to make a call on a bad engine computer? Even if that computer costs thousands of dollars?
00:00 - P1406 EGR Valve Position Sensor Circuit Problem
00:20 - EVP signal is fixed at 0 volts
01:10 - how to identify a power or ground side controlled output circuit with a voltmeter
02:20 - energizing an output with an ammeter
03:25 - how to force an electronic EGR valve to open to verify flow and EVP signal changes
04:40 - testing the EVP sensor (potentiometer) with a voltmeter
05:18 - missing a 5v reference to this sensor
06:52 - using a wiring diagram to identify the 5v reference circuit design
08:00 - measuring the 5v reference at the ECM
09:30 - how to check for a spread apart computer connector terminal (pin drag test)
12:27 - jumping the 5v reference circuit to fix our open circuit
14:30 - retesting the EVP sensor with a repaired 5v reference circuit
16:00 - bad engine computer confirmed
ScannerDanner Tools:
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For more information on this topic, I have written a “field manual” called Engine Performance Diagnostics which is available at www.scannerdanner.com as an eBook or paper book.
Want even more diagnostic training? Whether you are a DIY trying to fix your own car, someone looking to become an auto technician, or a current auto technician that wants to get more into diagnostics, subscribe to ScannerDanner Premium www.scannerdanner.com/join-sc... There is a 14 day free trial.
On ScannerDanner Premium I will bring you right into my classroom at Rosedale Technical College. You will find page for page lectures taken right from my book as well as exclusive classroom type case studies. What is so special about these classroom case studies? I pull live problem vehicles directly into my classroom and we troubleshoot them in real time, using and applying the theory and testing procedures we learn during the classroom lectures. There is no better on-line training of how to troubleshoot automotive electrical and electronics systems anywhere!
Disclaimer:
Due to factors beyond the control of ScannerDanner LLC, it cannot guarantee against unauthorized modifications of this information, or improper use of this information. ScannerDanner LLC assumes no liability for property damage or injury incurred as a result of any of the information contained in this video. ScannerDanner LLC recommends safe practices when working with power tools, automotive lifts, lifting tools, jack stands, electrical equipment, blunt instruments, chemicals, lubricants, or any other tools or equipment seen or implied in this video. Due to factors beyond the control of ScannerDanner LLC, no information contained in this video shall create any express or implied warranty or guarantee of any particular result. Any injury, damage or loss that may result from improper use of these tools, equipment, or the information contained in this video is the sole responsibility of the user and not ScannerDanner LLC.

[@nassimennajih271]

Hi mister Danner, i'm from Quebec , Canada and this morning i just bought your paper book. Here in Canada with the fees it cost 230$ canadian i really think it worth the cost. I' m an electrotechnician in a facility and i'm tired to be scamed by auto dealer with all the parts they want to change, so with your book to learn car diagnosis , i'll be able to take care of my own thing. Thank you for sharing your knowledge with a such passion!!! Cheers from canada,mister Danner ... You are a great man.

[@curtisrandell13]

Where’d you pick it up ??

[@spelunkerd]

What a classic Scanner Danner video. Brilliant as always.

[@sheerwillsurvival2064]

Paul teaching the best diagnostic techniques anyone can learn 👊🏻👍🏻

[@ScannerDanner]

I appreciate that!

[@guledmah5872]

Really the best instructor ever

[@2.3fox]

Thank you for making this video I've been having trouble with this area it's a newer man built engine 88 ford 2.3, in an 89 mustang and after a year I get 31,83,84. Its been tough but now I'm going back outside today after watching this

[@2.3fox]

I think because I first went to replace the EGR vacuum solenoid for the code but I got the code again

[@ScannerDanner]

Define those codes for me

[@felipeangelesgonzalez2074]

Thank you teacher, I learned something new on how to use the voltmeter. Excellent class.

[@mostlymoparih5682]

A lot of logic thrown out there Professor. Great, wait did I say great, I meant excellent video. Happy Motoring.

[@ScannerDanner]

Thank you!

[@8power0]

SCANNER DANNER IS STILL THE MAN.............. WOULD LOVE TO SEE HIM TEST A PARKING SENSOR SYSTEM ON SAY A NISSAN PRODUCT. I KNOW HE WOULD MAKE IT EASILY UNDERSTANDABLE THANKS SO MUCH FOR YOUR TIME AND EFFORT MISTER DANNER.

[@user-uj1xg7hb2u]

Respect to you boss, Paul ❤❤❤❤❤

[@brawdo]

He always makes it look so easy.. i need him as my mentor fr. Instead of hours less than 1 almost everytime that's awesome

[@charlesabura472]

Thanks a lot for the very educational video. Using a multimeter as a jumper was real kool👍

[@Paul-cs2je]

Paul Danner today i am noticed that sometimes my job as an auto electrician gets boring, but when i watch your videos it inspired me and i am become interesting in my profession! Thank you! God Bless you!

[@ScannerDanner]

That is awesome! Thank you

[@MUSICLYRICS-ku8et]

​@@ScannerDannerSir do you offer online courses

[@ScannerDanner]

@@MUSICLYRICS-ku8et sure do! I have over 550 videos and counting with over 450 hours of training. All for just 36 cents a day of $11 a month www.scannerdanner.com/join-scannerdanner-premium.html Hope to see you there

[@waqasazmat81]

This stuff is gold! Thanks as always Paul.

[@dnlmachine4287]

Another Win. Thanks for all you do Mr Danner. Stay gold.

[@nancylewis7142]

Thank You for this video, for your time, for all this info.

[@benjaminrich9396]

"You could probably do this permanently if you wanted to." We've all had customers who were more than happy for things to be fixed like that. :)

[@nservice1625]

I would venture to guess that replacing the controller is probably pretty reasonable on this vehicle though. Fix it correctly and it will not come back to haunt you.

[@Cudagirl1970]

This is the video that introduced me to Scanner Danner...I was having issues with my EGR on my 1994 Bonneville SE. Awesome to do a video on troubleshooting an older vehicle.: so comprehensive, in troubleshooting an electrical circuit, and my particular issue. Mine was a bad EGR, but I used this video to confirm. So glad I found you Danner, you are an awesome diagnostician, teacher, and an ever better guy! Thanks for all you do 😊

[@mohammedmoaiti4190]

impressive as always

[@whitetiger8652]

Excellent video.

[@thomasgureno]

Excellent video

[@Pablo_Automotive]

Thanks again Paul

[@amarabdelli487]

Thanks for sharing

[@moonshadowdrifting]

Another brilliant content producer and over my head tech guru. I'll try!!

[@ScannerDanner]

Stay with me and I can teach you. Thank you!

[@kevinpalmer7452]

A class act 👍

[@djamelabedennacerchiba3233]

Thanks teacher I now got the way . Cause I learned this skill from sdp . But not practically. I mean to say swiping those leads . 😂 Today I got it . Giving ground with ohmmeter Awesome teacher You are the best

[@smid2550]

Outstanding work and very informative. I don't know if I'll ever get all this or not, but I'm trying. Thanks -

[@ScannerDanner]

You will if you have a true interest in this and you keep following 👍

[@shopyard87]

I'm back! 😂 glad that I am to, because you always have great lessons..

[@ScannerDanner]

Welcome back!

[@alrifainidal]

Thanks to my teacher

[@calholli]

When you are uncertain about shorting your solenoid to ground-- just do it through a test light and if you do it wrong, all it will do is light up the test light. It's a great safety.. Sometimes it won't be able to pull enough current, so you'll have to jump through a higher amperage test light, up to a 4 amp headlight if needed.

[@luiNissi7]

Amazing 😮

[@ScannerDanner]

Thank you!

[@jessemackenzie6516]

Awesome trick use it all the time when flashing generator fields. You already have it probed so why not? It goes inline with one of your lessons. You already know your probed in with a good connection, moving your dmm lead to ams as a jumper does not disturb the probed wire that you verified it has a good connection by reading the 12 vdc through the coil. You made the point in a video about always being conscious of your test points. ALways scrutinize ground points and any other rest points to get accurate measurements.

[@careyautorepairs]

6:10 to 6-50 is good info

[@Kebekwoodcraft7375]

Great 👍 but now I don’t know why that 5v is bad you got the problem but not the cause yet ? Is it possible getting a short 🩳 to ground damage the PCM ? If it is will probably do the same on the other 5v references .😊

[@lorrainebwoy]

The 5v circuit is so crucial

[@Phantomas2011]

Hi Paul I feel like a VIP! I got a twofer Two videos on EVP issues 👊🙏

[@ScannerDanner]

Was that you that commented on the original video and reminded me about how good it was? 🙂

[@Phantomas2011]

Yezirrrrrr !!!! As always u r da man!!! 👊😀🙏

[@shanestrains2849]

So the there's one 5v power supply in the computer that feeds multiple 5v wires for sensors? Thanks for the videos I'm learning a lot!

[@ScannerDanner]

That is correct. On this model, there is only one 5v regulator. On newer cars there can be as many as 4 different 5v regulators, in which case you would treat this differently

[@shanestrains2849]

Thanks, I remember watching your video with the Cadillac that had two 5v circuits. @@ScannerDanner

[@alanw5879]

I like this quick diag process for those electronic egr valves. Do you ever pull the ECMs apart in class and check for an open trace on the board?

[@ScannerDanner]

Yes it do! And I have a few of those recorded. One on a failed injector driver on a Subaru and another on a VW or Audi with an open in the sensor ground circuit. Thanks!

[@alanw5879]

I really like the satisfaction of soldering a part onto a module and it actually working again if possible. Saves so much especially when some modules are not available. I like the multimeter trick as well, Ive never tried that before. @@ScannerDanner

[@alanw5879]

I found a burned open trace inside a GM BCM on the GMLAN network trace going to the Radio, there was a short threw the Radio, so the customer just unplugged it. I soldered up the trace and it was all back to normal. That was a rare situation though.@@blakestone8088

[@lupedelacruz4152]

You're the best amigo soon I hope to join your e book with the book i got GOD B U sir and familia..

[@ScannerDanner]

I appreciate that

[@Trev-fl1oe]

Thanks for sharing vid.very informative.i have your book is there a section on short to ground in it.peace

[@ScannerDanner]

Yes, in chapter 1 under multimeter basics. Then also in chapters 2, 3, 6, 7, 8, 18 and 22 short to grounds are covered. Those chapters cover switch inputs, output solenoids and transistor drivers, thermistor, potentiometers, pressure sensors, then fuel injector controls and ignition coil controls. It's in other places too. And it's in my classes that this stuff really comes to life. www.scannerdanner.com/join-scannerdanner-premium.html Hope to see you there!

[@NoName-oe8ii]

Hi Danner, i see you backprobing these wires in the engine bay and wonder if they have any sort of weather seal, and are you potentially damaging those seals since i see the probe your using seems a little thick, thanks!

[@ScannerDanner]

Never had an issue with this type of testing. And when you work in the aftermarket like me and on 40 different car lines, it is not possible to have test connectors and break out leads on everything, so this is the way to go. I'll use piercing probes too and then liquid tape them when I'm done

[@danieljurgill1681]

The drag test on the ECM harness connector checked out. But how do you know there was a proper pin in the ECM side ? That pin could be bent over or be corodded away.

[@ScannerDanner]

Of course, a visual inspection of that would be in order.

[@giopirmisashvili5514]

❤❤❤

[@mikeadler434]

👍👍

[@smid2550]

Another question I had: I have an OTC logic probe that identifies grounds ( green light ) and voltage ( red light ), by simply probing the wire/terminal. Since that control is ground side switched and voltage is present on both control terminals, this tool wouldn't be of any use in an application like this?

[@ScannerDanner]

That is correct and why I do not use them. (One of many reasons why)

[@ryan.mullen]

If it was power side switched, can you still use the DVM on amps to power it but put your lead on battery positive?

[@ScannerDanner]

Yes sir. Just make sure whatever you're trying to jump, that: 1. You are 100% positive on your circuit design 2. You know the amperage of the circuit you are jumping is less than the max meter amperage (typically 10 amps) 3. When you're done to immediately remove your test lead from the amp port.

[@SMT105]

If it was power side switched how would I find out which is the 12v supply, wouldn’t they both read 0v? Would the only way to find out be using a wiring diagram? Sorry I’m new to this👍

[@ScannerDanner]

@@SMT105 great question! Doesn't matter that you are new, the fact that you understood what you would see on a power side switched circuit, says a lot! 0 and 0! Which one is the control wire and which one is the constant ground. Solenoid or component unplugged, take a test light to battery positive and touch on each wire. The constant ground will light! There are some variables, one being do not use an LED type light for this test, make sure it is an incandescent bulb. Watch this! kzbin.info/www/bejne/oYLdZJpqfa6KndU Then come join my classes on my website when you want more. www.scannerdanner.com/join-scannerdanner-premium.html

[@paulmonk7820]

I would verify wire continuity end-to-end ɓefore ordering the computer. 😊

[@ScannerDanner]

I did

[@stevenayala2324]

by leaving it with the jumper wire will it pass inspection tho ?

[@ScannerDanner]

Yes sir, this is 100% a legit fix.

[@jeffco908]

Proper terminal test probes go a long way to not induce new issues by spreading terminals. I can not count how many times ive had to fix spread terminals due to someone else diagnosing a problem prior to it coming to me. If you know what your doing that method can be ok but to teach "feel" is tough to do.

[@ScannerDanner]

It is very basic, don't stuff it in there 😅. No force whatsoever should be applied. But I get what you're saying. If it can be f--ked up, it will be, in the wrong hands.

[@SPMech1]

👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍

[@kevincoulimbe3974]

Do it for EGR valve you're gone overboard if it's battery replacement

[@ScannerDanner]

Battery replacement??

[@The_Redkween]

Paul is a beast!! And he’s buff.

[@sethpayment]

Unfortunately your module more than likely has 2 5vdc power supplies so if you were to attempt to jumper your 5vdc+ from your TPS over to the EGR valve for testing it would still have a code... 1.) because the 5vdc may not be tied inside the module or common... 2.) Because that 5vdc is potentially designed just for 1 sensor and 2 could over load the entire 5vdc circuit on your TPS circuit.

[@ScannerDanner]

Single 5v regulator on all older models (like this one). Newer systems can have up to 4.

[@johnmorton5498]

I'm surprised that those two 5v ref circuits don't have separate 12v fused supplies into the control unit. I'm guessing on your wiring diagrams there's only one 5v ref supply (fused 12v) into the control unit.

[@ScannerDanner]

Yes, on these older models there was only one 5v regulator. It wasn't until OBD2 that we started seeing more than 1

[@infinitedaeth1559]

hey scannerdanner i live right north of you in butler my name is micah i have a mazda rx8 that im having problems with i work on my own car but i cant seem to find my problem i would like to know if i could pay you to diagnose the problem

[@fisherman8271]

Thank you! I've learned so much from you over the years. Absolute stud

[@calholli]

Same..

[@richardnilsen5]

The computer was just changed not long ago now the 5v is bad ? Bad new computer 😫 👹

[@ScannerDanner]

Yes