Arabia at the Cusp of Islam According to Inscriptions | The Implications of Inscriptional Evidence

[@momo19991]

Khalid bin Aswan inscription? We didn’t hear about this? Was it edited out? More content from these two please !

[@induetime215]

The whole interview is on the page

[@AsifBhayat]

The widely accepted initial sentences of Gods final proclamation in Arabic read ‘iqra’ , bi ism rabb’ which matches the tone and language of the inscription.

[@petergrimshaw492]

Wow! So interesting!

[@noone0163]

تقول الرواية عندما قررت قريش مقاطعة بني هاشم وقامت بتعليق الوثيقة في الكعبة بدأت ( باسمك اللهم ) ولو يبدؤوها باسم اللات او باسم العزى

[@Raqi799]

Interesting to know that the name ar-rahman was absent in the inscriptions found in the Hijaz. From this, maybe we can infer that just before Islam, ar-Rahman was a name exclusively used in South Arabia and that the author(s) of the Quran decided to use both Allah and ar-Rahman in order to unify these two regional believes ? And what about ar-Rahim ? Did this name was also associated to a specific region of the Arabian peninsula ?

[@samantarmaxammadsaciid5156]

Ar-Raḥmaan is the proper noun (like Allaah < Al-Ilaah) and Ar-Raḥiim is the (re-enforcing) adjective, since they both belong to the triliteral root-pattern of R-Ḥ-M of the verb RaḤiMa, with the verbal noun Ar-Raḥmat, {... Qul li-LLaahi kataba ᶜalaa Nafsi-Hi Ar-Raḥmata ... = ... Say for Allaah inscribed / prescribed upon Himself the Mercy ...} Qur’aan 6:12 and {... kataba Rabbu-kum ᶜalaa Nafsi-Hi Ar-Raḥmata ... = your-plural Lord inscribed / prescribed upon Himself the Mercy ...} Qur’aan 6:54 Meaning Allaah the Non-Physical Infinite Creator of all and from the prespective of Aadam the physical created Finite (as the representative symbolism of the entirety of Allaah’s creation) as an inseparable separate in alignment.

[@donnie27brasco]

(Interesting to know that the name ar-rahman was absent in the inscriptions found in the Hijaz) No, we don't know. Dr. Sidky, in the clip above, clearly stated that the inscriptions they covered are only a very small part of the areas where there are inscriptions. In fact, the Arabian Peninsula is the largest reservoir of inscriptions in the entire world, and it is still virgin in terms of archaeological research in general, including inscriptions. By the way, how can the name be “exclusive” to the south of the Arabian Peninsula, when Arab tribes always migrate from the south to the north and carry their language and culture with them?. Besides, The name, Ar-Rahman , is also found in an Aramaic inscription in northern Iraq. Also, “Al-Rahman” means “the Most Merciful” in Arabic, and God in Islam has many descriptive laudatory names, and it is natural for some of them to be similar to descriptions of neighboring communities that are constantly mixing with the Hijaz community.

[@Raqi799]

@@donnie27brasco Well, until proven otherwise, with the actual data available, I think we can say that the name ar-rahman is not found in the Hijaz before the rise of Islam. Maybe there is actually some, but until they are found, it's correct to say we don't found any... It's not because the north and the south of the peninsula were exchanging pieces of culture and language for centuries that we can infer that they were exchanging ALL their culture and languages. Even in the situation of a constant exchange between north and south for long time, it is still possible that some word stay exclusive to the south culture. There is a lot of example of such exclusivity in fact. I'm not aware of the use of ar-rahman in Iraq before the rise of Islam. It would be glad if you can give some references in order to check this information.

[@jack_separo]

Rahman was a chief-god of politheistic gods of Yaman people, before it was adopted by Jews and then adopted by christian, then it be islamic god.

[@eq549]

Seems like you are getting some good replies. I want to add, look up the cult of Rahmanan (in South Arabian the definite article "an" is added to the end of a word so Ar-Rahman is the Arabic version). Perhaps these are the Sabeans the Quran mean in 2:62 as well? I heard a theory [I think from Al-Jallad] that by invoking the name Ar-Rahman, the Quran was combining the traditions of the South Arabians (already using Rahman-an) with the North Arabians who were using Allah (North Arabia) and Ar-Rahim (Palmyra/South Levant). This would lead to unification of all Arabs and Arabians into a monotheistic faith (with no intercessors allowed which was common in the Mecca region). The region was called Himyar (which collapsed just before Islam due to Ethopia/Aksum trying to force Christianity) but was called Saba before Himyar. Try to find this PDF by Al-Jallad and Sidky on Academia. He answered some question there in the comments.

[@anaveler432]

This goes through prayer rather than anything /whatnotcomestomind

[@Tobias-kk8zf]

Very interesting.

[@AsifBhayat]

When looking at religious identities then these inscriptions may surprise, however when looking at it from the perspective of The way of Abraham, the primordial way of God Almighty sharing his code with humans through Abraham, Ishmael, Isaac then it doesn’t surprise at all. The only thing this goes against is the ‘pagan Arab Ishmaelite’ narrative found in traditional seerah content.

[@khalidm3m664]

The Arabs of the Peninsula (before Islam) did not speak classical Arabic as we know it, and the evidence is the ancient Arabic inscriptions such as Safavid, Thamudic, Lihyanite, Hasa’i, and Himyarite. They spoke ancient Arabic languages, these inscriptions that filled the Arabian Peninsula are incomprehensible in some or many of them and do not contain any eloquence. As for pre-Islamic (Jahiliyyah) poetry; especially the Mu’allaqat; in which poets of Persian origin excelled, it is Islamic poetry (after Islam), as Taha Hussein and Margoliouth said. The Qur’an is not human speech. In contrast, the speech of the Arabian Peninsula is human. The Arabs of the Peninsula cannot say the same words as the Qur’an, even though the Qur’an is an Arabic language. The Arabs are the inhabitants of the Arabian Peninsula, and therefore they all understood the Qur’an, or say the overwhelming majority of them. Then we should not neglect the pre-Islamic (Jahiliyyah) inscriptions throughout the Arabian Peninsula, which are the speech of the Arabs, and are considered very backward in their eloquence compared to the eloquence of the Qur’an. The Qur’an is Arabic in the Arab tongue and uses their words, but the method and its style is very difficult for them and they cannot do it.

[@thenun1846]

Great discussion!

[@sapapi33]

"These triads of Gods are popular" shots taken.

[@pheeel17]

I don't think so at all. Just a fact about polytheistic inscriptions. For whatever reason, some numbers like 3, 7, 12, etc seem to have cross cultural significance.

[@kilianklaiber6367]

I like your passion although I don't believe in any of these stories called history.

[@Trothoflife]

I think Muhammed himself knew the tales by moonlight stories can only last so long when he made this prediction, sahih muslim 147.

[@marwansch2724]

Christianity is not a monotheistic religion!!! But a trinitarian one.

[@HenrikLauert]

Yes that's what the muhammadans say

[@MuftiMasala]

So Muhammad was an opportunist? As there were a number of monotheistic groups popping up and "the age of jahaliyah" is a concocted islamic scenario

[@YonEAE]

Yes ... Masala Little Brain .. Yes.

[@ponderingspirit]

No. You ignoramus

[@Vibestr]

Feel free to rewatch the video. That's not what they discussed. They said there was a trend to call upon a personalized God which was seemingly "monotheistic". Islam has an absolute monotheism that they share with Judaism.

[@Lonestar10443]

​@@VibestrMost inscriptions from 5th and 6th century used the terms Allah or Al-Ilah. So, it wasn’t personalised monotheism. It was definitely widespread practice at tribal level at least. And this monotheism probably resulted from getting influenced by jews and christians settlers in the arabia.

[@donnie27brasco]

Some Arabs before Islam believed in Hanafiism, which was a monotheistic sect since the time of Abraham, peace be upon him, and the prophets before him. Hanifism means “inclination” in Arabic language, or "leaning toward". The Prophet Abraham was described in the Qur’an as a Hanif, meaning one who “turned away- leaned away” from the worship of idols.

[@Leo-yx7rk]

Repost of another YT comment section conversation for your edification: AP could have recited just about anything and a vast number of Muslims will not have recognised any error. In fact, given the vast number of variations of Quranic verses taught/transmitted over the years, there is strong likelihood someone has made the same or similar recitation previously. Only a week ago, I listened to a Muslima gush loving praise over a passage recited in a singsong incantation in Arabic language. The only problem was that the passage in question was wholly unrelated to the Quran, but was opposed to Islam. The overwhelming majority of Muslims do not know the Arabic language, and do not know many of the actual contents of the Quran, the Hadiths, and other 'supporting' texts. They tend to be taught sounds to form words (frequently mispronounced) without ever being taught what those words truly mean. The Quran has been thoroughly dismantled and debunked. It is littered with contradictions and errors of fact. Mohammad's character has been assassinated, and will remain forever stained by the editing choices of Uthman and the unidentified number of other editors of the Quran over near to 1400 years. (And let's face it, if Uthman had sought to retain only the best Quranic material when he conducted his purge of manuscripts, the Quran and Mohammad's reputation might be presumed to be even worse than it is today!) It is significant to note, Ali Dawah himself has published a video (a clip of which I have seen on YT) in which he publicly admits the 'scientific' claims of the Quran are bogus. This stands as clear admission Ali Dawah is aware the Quran is false, and therefore the claims of Mohammad (aka Allah, his alter-ego/nom de plume) also are false. For Ali Dawah and other dawahganda practitioners to continue to publish and broadcast material he knows to be false to unsuspecting Muslim audiences would be a source of shame to most anybody with a conscience. ​​@atta962 @Herodotus77 In response to someone on another related matter, I shared the following for consideration: "Islam puts people and nations on a path of devolution. Islam broadly discourages secular education, critical thinking, and logical, rational reasoning. Look at the available data. Muslim nations feature prominently in lists of the poorest* and most corrupt nations. The exceptions vis-a-vis wealth tend to be those nations trading hydrocarbons and/or weapons. Look also to fact-based investigative reporting on the wealth extracted from Muslim people by corrupt religious and political figures. This has been shown to be laundered and invested outside their own nations; frequently in developed western nations. I agree many terrible things have occurred under colonial regimes. However it is significant to note many of the corrupt practices of colonial opportunists have taken place with the express permission and collusion of corrupt people within the colonised locales. It is further significant to note, those corrupt practices have been opposed and ultimately defeated by people (including atheists) operating in line with Christian New Testament (and other more peaceful) ideology. Contrary to the public, non-Muslim facing rhetoric, Islam is a violent religious and political ideology with stated aims of colonisation and subjugation. (* Even in wealthy Muslim nations, the wealth overwhelmingly resides in the control of a kleptocratic elite)." Food for thought? 🤔 Thank your mother for the rabbits 🐰 Cheers 🍻

[@emsa7esm203]

It is ironic that you say Islam discourages critical thinking, logical and rational reasoning when your post reeks of lack of critical thinking. You essentially concluded that Islam is false because Ali Dawah does not think scientific miracles are a legitimate and some read into the Quran. You assume that the Quran has been edited over 1400 years. If that's the case then my Quran should be different than one 1000 years ago and yet it is not. You assume that Uthman made sure to only record the "best material", yet there is no historical evidence of him saying, "let's record only the material that I like and discard verses that I do not like." You claim that Islam does not promote critical thinking nor logical and rational reasoning. The Quran throughout is telling us to reflect and think. Telling us not the follow the masses like sheep and think for ourselves. All your other claims are irrational. If Muslims become rich and advanced in science and technology like they were before then your claims collapse. You minimize the crimes of the west but maximize the crimes of the Muslims. You make excuses for the west, but not at all for the Muslims. You are extremely confused if you believe the west stopped colonizing (The French only recently were forcibly kicked out of Africa) because they decided it was too mean to do so.

[@Leo-yx7rk]

@@emsa7esm203 Further, your knowledge of science, history, and politics are all demonstrably and objectively clearly lacking.

[@arefinkamal7654]

Oh a great ,another random guy on the internet who has it all figured out! ​@@Leo-yx7rk

[@Zhwauki]

What a stupid polemical comment take your Christian apologetics elsewhere let us focus on actual history

[@Robert-Re]

the amount of story making skill you have is quite astonishing. I wanna see actual reference which shows what you saying is true not just your own speculation.

[@santhiramorgan8329]

BOTH, HATHEM AND AHMAD ARE OBVIOUSLY TAKING FAITH POSITIONS.

[@sapapi33]

Did you notice that because the evidence lines up with the islamic narrative?

[@king_halcyon]

Why all in capitals? Nothing to be mad about, fool

[@whitefox8291]

What does this imply?

[@adityabobby6054]

I support Israel 🇮🇱💪

[@jawadmaniaci91]

I support Palestine 🇵🇸 Zionism = Nazism.

[@AzurBlue-b5y]

You should search and stand with truth.

[@thenun1846]

​@@AzurBlue-b5yThe truth is neither with Israel, nor Islam

[@AdamNoizer]

Nobody asked, get outta here jeet.

[@jawadmaniaci91]

I support Palestine 🇵🇸. Israel/Zionism = Nazi$m.

[@jemalabdunasir1660]

From the river to the sea Palestine 🇵🇸 will be free

[@محمدحاجغافور]

Islam came to Palestine way after the Jews were there. Omar bin khattab is the one who conquered Palestine, before islam it's clearly was the Jews. All prophets were Jews except Muhammad who never put his feet in Palestine.

[@MrAbc54321]

Which river and which sea?

[@ChopinIsMyBestFriend]

get that shit out of here

[@gareginasatryan6761]

That’s denialism that another internationally recognized country exists in that area is worse than Putin’s denialism of Ukraine

[@user-yh3rw4sp4x]

Free Palestine from HAMAS and ISLAM Amen

[@محمدحاجغافور]

Islam came to Palestine when Omar conquered Palestine, before Omar there was no Islam in Palestine . While all Jews prophets lived and preched in Palestine. So theologicaly speaking Jews have the right to take the land out of Muslims. However ethnicity speaking Palestinians, which were canaanites, were living in Palestine the same as the Jews.

[@Robert-Re]

​@@محمدحاجغافورass argument. theologically speaking they should be cannanite instead of Jews if we apply same logic.

[@user-yh3rw4sp4x]

​@@محمدحاجغافورWhen talking to an abdul: Q. How many qurans? A. One quran Q. Is hafs quran a quran? A. Yes Q. Is warsh quran a quran? A. Yes Q. Is doori quran a quran? A. Yes Q. How many qurans? A. One quran Q. Are all qurans around the world same? A. Yes Q. Do the Sana manuscript and Birmingham manuscript have variants? A. Yes Q. Are qurans preserved word for word, letter for letter? A. Yes Q. In sura 37.12, one quran says "you", another "I"? A. They are different accents Q. How many ahrufs did muhamad recite? A. 7 Q. How many ahrufs did uthman destroy? A. 6 Q. How many ahrufs today? A. 7 Q. How many qiraats did muhamad recite? A. None Q. How many qiraats today? A. 10, 15, 20, 50 Q. Is Bible preserved? A. No Q. Is muhamad prophesied in the Bible? A. Yes Q. Did muhamad marry a child? A. No Q. How old was aisha? A. 6 Typical illetrate Muslims following illiterate Messenger prophet Muhammad pubh (police be upon him)😂

[@FipsAsmussen-m8f]

@@محمدحاجغافور Todays "jews" have nothing to do with the jews of the antiquity. The majority of today's Palestinians are descendants of Jews and Samaritans who converted to Islam