F-Zero GX Machine stats don't make sense

[@akc12]

I haven't watched the video at all yet but I see you linked the GameFAQs vehicle guide in the description. A lot of information in that guide is inaccurate and subjective. I do not recommend anyone to take that guide seriously.

[@Link-Zero]

Alright, thanks for the heads up. I have planned to make a follow up video to this one in the near future anyway and will make sure to include that in it. @custom-r has linked your doc in his comment which will be used for more accurate information :) I also pinned your comment so this is easily available!

[@akc12]

@@Link-Zero No problem, and thanks for pinning it. I've gone ahead and watched your video. Some of your observations regarding a machine's boosting strength are inaccurate and incorrect since the method of eyeballing its effectiveness lends to inaccurate observations. One example is the Mighty Typhoon and Sonic Phantom comparison. You thought Phantom's booster is stronger but that might have been because it has a much higher unboosted top speed and a longer boost duration. I have measured the approximate Booster Top Speed for all of the machines by using Dolphin's tools to perform frame perfect boosting (with MT) and found the following Booster Top Speeds 100% Sonic Phantom: ~1668.9 100% Mighty Typhoon: ~1698.9 And regarding Silver Rat. Most people think it's booster is trash, and admitedly its short boost duration hurts it a lot. But with proper MT boosting, it can actually reach higher speeds than a surprising number of machines. Of all non-custom machines at 100% Settings, its 1640.25 Booster Top Speed ranks at 21st. Again with its short boost duration in reality it performs at least slightly worse, but that is still far from being the worst in the game. But it does not deserve that A rating for sure. All of the data I collected and measured are in the following link, which is also linked in the spreadsheet Custom-R linked. You can utilize a Filter View to sort it how you like. Feel free to make a copy of it though I am still updating it - docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1YnAJUkcdRs2nNrxTJ-ZXNS3PDD4IPQFlK0LBo_XbcBY/edit#gid=1384729615&fvid=1797803102

[@elquiltro92]

@@akc12 still waiting an update for Grip, Turning Grade, Agility Grade, Advanced Tech Grade and Difficulty stats. This guide looks awesome and very accurate gameplay wise.

[@DarkSchneider005]

That is because they copy pasted all the stats from F-Zero X (which actually followed the stats more consistently) except Wild Goose now has A in body. It's also funny how both the best and worst boost are listed as B.

[@KopperNeoman]

That's because X's custom machines had a point buy system for those grades - the game directly used them for stats, like weight.

[@lammericium-241]

f zero gx vehicle stats summarized a funny flying taxi can be faster than a doctor’s space ambulance and thats ok

[@adcyuumi]

I played this game daily for YEARS, and I still miss playing it. One detail about handling that people often miss is that what messes you up in a race is generally losing/gaining grip when you didn't expect it to happen. Some of the "worst machines in the game" due to how easily they slide are the ones I liked to use - the Mad Wolf and Night Thunder were two of my favorites, specifically because they slide predictably rather than unexpectedly. Once you learn how to drive a machine that ALWAYS slides at high speeds, it's not that hard to still control them and take the lines you want. It feels very smooth and less risky than driving a high grip machine that fails to grip once in a while (and they ALL do). I was ridiculously good with Night Thunder, relative to other stock machines. It felt like the right fit for how I drove.

[@VestedUTuber]

I think you'll love the Wild Goose then.

[@spekyyeti4625]

Thank you for this video, really well researched and enjoyable! Ive been playing GX recently, its become one of my favourite games ever, but i must admit it is a little frustrating that the majority of the stats in the game are inaccurate, and you have to try each machine individually to truly get a feel for them. My personal favourite machine is the Rainbow Phoenix, handles beautifully and is great all round, and least favourite is the Night Thunder, for the same reason as you said here in that its too unstable and annoying to use!

[@Baschemon]

I made GX way harder on myself by admittingly only using Pico for roughly everything. I personally just enjoy driving/using the Wild Goose over the other machines. (Don't get me wrong, I do use Big Fang, Dark Schneider, Deep Claw, Hyper Speeder, Astro Robin, & Magic Seagull, I just personally prefer Wild Goose.)

[@misterpayah7723]

Beyond debunking most of the stats, I think this video is excellent as a mini-review of how each machine 'feels'. Each machine in this game feels quite unique to handle and it's nice to hear this described qualitatively based on your testing. Impressions like this are much more useful than the stats I think.

[@NoNameNoWhere]

It's fun to hear his opinion. However, the machines feel so wildly different from each other and people's preferences vary so much that it's difficult to generalize how good each vehicle is. What feels good to some players may feel terrible to others. I think the biggest take-away is that the stats don't really mean anything in this game.

[@itsbmeGaming]

@@NoNameNoWhere Yeah. The most important thing is to use the machines you like driving the most.

[@CappnRob]

I think what makes GX fascinating and why the stats are inaccurate is because they only tell half the story. The stat spread graph is the other half, along with weight and even the physical size of the machines. Silver Rat is so weak because it’s just pathetically small, so it’s boost can’t go that hard and it has no protection to speak of. The stats were all copied over from X as well, but given how most machines seem to generally match those stats in GX just on a spectrum, I find the whole thing interesting lol

[@bigroaststyrone8135]

I think a future F-Zero game (if there is such a thing lol) would benefit from a performance rating graph instead of a binary Alphabet rating system. That way the stats can be shown as completely accurate and each machine can be different with slight tweaks not visible in the rating system

[@selarom2018]

Absolutely, I was disappointed to see that i can't view the radar chart for stats in the normal select screen when i bought new ships

[@RNGsquirrel]

Thank you so much for this video, i recently beat fzerox on master, and just got this game. I already learned that a lot of the stats are lies, and was looking for exactly this

[@Link-Zero]

Hey there, I hope this video doesn't feel too rushed comapred to some of my others. I explained why in my latest community post but I just wanted to remind you of it again. It is an interesting topic and I may have an idea that will follow up on this video sometime in the future. I'll see 'ya next month. o/ btw: Bonus points for the one who guesses correctly which machines performance diagram I used in the thumbnail. Hint: It is a non-custom machine :)

[@custom-r]

Here's my guess: Super Piranha

[@GhostRoasterDrankAllTheMilk]

This feels like the ultimate guide to how the F-Zero machines should be played. This video is great and you definitely earned my sub

[@csGX64]

After watching this video i tried using some machines ive never used before and i noticed the wild goose and mighty hurricane can snake for some reason

[@MtnSmithy]

I remember at one point concluding that a machine's weight had more of an effect on how it plays than any of the stat grades. Kinda wonder why Sega used the same grading system from F-Zero X if they weren't even going to really stick with it.

[@hiramjew1523]

I'm glad I'm not the only one who thought a lot of these stats were whacked. I remembered picking Black Bull for the first time and thought it's the most slippery machine ever while the Magic Seagull was one of the grippier machines despite the E rating. I naturally assumed heavier machines just slipped more compared to lighter ones lol.

[@Krelet]

The fact that there's no speed stat 💀

[@reeidly]

Its funny, when I first played this I picked up Little Wyvern first and I got so used to how it handles that I can barely play anything else lol

[@177Willy]

Danke für die realistische Einschätzung der Maschine. Ich hab bei den meisten Maschine das selbe Gefühl wie du.

[@CysmaWinheim]

I've often wondered this myself. Maximum Velocity was the most up-front about each machine's specs, and the new F-Zero 99 to some extent, but the rest were pretty cryptic. My guess was that it all had to do with the machine's weight: heavier machines would theoretically have better top speed, grip, and durability, while lighter machines would be better at accelerating, handling, and boosting. I really hope they add more machines to F-Zero 99 at some point. Partly because I want to see what they'd look like in the SNES game's pixel art style, but also because I'm curious to see what their stats would be. And if they went through the whole franchise, they could add one new machine each week for a whole year without running out!

[@HighLanderPonyYT]

I'd rather they released a sequel to GX.

[@CysmaWinheim]

@@HighLanderPonyYT Absolutely, I'd ideally love a brand new 3D F-Zero that iterates upon GX's driving, but I'm working with what we've got for now.

[@Teleport-w5y]

The big fang back when I played made me realize the stats weren't accurate lol. This thing is sliding so much it's unbelievable ! I should pick this game up again sometime...

[@mechaspyder179]

Most of these I would have to agree with, except for the Sonic Phantom, Iron Tiger, and a couple others. Other than that, great video!

[@VestedUTuber]

I... don't entirely agree with your assessment of the Fat Shark's grip. I think that the Fat Shark's E grip stat is a bit underrated, it's really more of a just barely D grip. I think that's to do with the weight. IDK, it just feels very planted to a certain threshold, and even when it eventually lets go it does so in a predictable manner. Don't get me wrong, it's still definitely not easy to drive, it's just that it feels grippier than advertised. IDK, maybe it's just because of its poor turn rate that it just doesn't turn tight enough at normal speeds to lose grip.

[@elquiltro92]

I can disagree with the Wild Goose. It has a D grip for sure, but boosting is amazing, not to mention it really helps it getting near top speed.

[@johanericsson7309]

White Cat works rly well for me playing casually, feels very intuitive to control, whereas Hyper Speeder feels kinda stiff (but is obviously much better thanks to its speed), for the lack of a better word

[@empresscarrie6230]

silver rat having dad and realizing that's gorohs kid was my moment of realization that they don't mean much

[@GlowingOrangeOoze]

I think I like that the stats aren't very accurate. They give you a ballpark idea of what to expect when you pick the machine, but you still have to experiment and come to your own conclusions.

[@WtFHaXFtW]

Twin Noritta has some quirky boost behavior which probably would move it to top side of A tier

[@HighLanderPonyYT]

I think it's bc the letter ranks are just a part of it. They must be evaluated with the weight in mind.

[@THE_PROT01]

They make sense you just don't understand

[@custom-r]

This is definitely something that the games share. Most vehicles with similar stat lines tend to feel very different. Aside from GX, GP Legend is a great example. Take Mad Wolf and Deep Claw for example. Same stats, but one of them feels much stronger than the other. This can also apply to Death Anchor and Twin Norita. But a huge part of that is how the game is designed. You'd get much different results on the 2D plane than on 3D and that's without bringing up Climax. Still though, the lettered stats only tell one part of the story. If you built custom machines with similar stat lines to Blue Falcon or Blood Hawk (depending on how they're used) 9 times out of 10, they'll leave the former in the dust. The visual stats are one thing, but the hidden natural stats play a massive role. You really can't trust GX completely without trial and error (and this is just regular GX at that) You might find these spreadsheets and tier lists by AKC12 interesting: docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1m2sCmuiBmXUHwLV3ZUupeKVGXm0wGhOdEkPX6YaSuHM/edit#gid=0 tiermaker.com/list/video-games/f-zero-machine-tier-list-112524/1577891 tiermaker.com/list/video-games/f-zero-machine-tier-list-112524/1577898

[@Kalancodragon]

I think it would've been worth having a list at the end of what you felt the actual stats were, and maybe also doing a comparison where you showed the listed stats, and your opinion-stats with the vehicle weight: I feel like weight may have an effect on stats where two vehicles can be made to feel different due to weight differences, and some statlines might play nicely with high/low weight than others.

[@saturnexplorers]

Reminds me of that one time I picked Spark Moon because it looked cool and had similar stats to the Blue Falcon. Really didn't expect it to just keep sliding out of control.

[@Ghorda9]

it's really good for drift and slide turns, just don't bother with quick turning.

[@oscarbravo8585]

Custom machine: Energy Horse is a cheat code ...CBB

[@mallow2902]

I feel like the grip stat doesn't really matter that much. The best machines in the game seem to be the ones that gain lots of speed while sliding like Fat Shark and Black Bull. As a Sonic Phantom main, I definitely agree that it can feel way grippier than advertised, but what's actually important is that it can slide when prompted and gains pretty great speed when doing so.

[@ryanthibodeaux6672]

I’d dare say that Schneider and Fat Shark are the easiest machines to learn, black bull is a very close 3rd. All three of them are top tier

[@LuwiigiMaster]

If Nintendo ever makes another F-Zero game, I am of the opinion that body is the only metric that can be objectively good or bad, while boost and grip ratings instead denote 'types'. Example, an A boost type is a long, powerful boost that consumes a lot of energy and can be fired slowly, while an E boost type is a short, weak boost that consumes little energy and can be fired quickly. A type grip is a vehicle that will rarely loose traction while E type grip is a vehicle that can slide easily, obviously a heavy vehicle with E grip would help you control it better than a similar vehicle with A grip.

[@wouterW24]

To a degree the poor statistics turned me off from experimenting as much as I ought have as a teen. Even the written overviews of the time have flaws I’m glad machine overviews are still being uploaded recently. At one point I will be able to hook up my cube again or nintendo will move to emulate this game(hopefully decently) and just go outside the mold more. And more then that just all machines are there own little story regarding odd performance and handling quirks.

[@jayfox4291]

I'm no expert, but i think leaving weight out is part of the reason the stats r wild. I'm not 100% sure of the stats i'll be talking about cus my gamecube isn't set up. but i made a custom machine with an A or B in grip, & very light weight, like 700-800. The result of that was an EXTREMLY twitchy, hard to control machine that slides without effort. I hated it. I made a different 1 with like C or D grip, but alot (in my opinion) more weight but not STUPID heavy, like 1,500-1,700. What i got was a machine that virtually never slides, & just feels a million times better to control. So i think weight is a very important stat. If mass & velocity are considered to... Perhaps they affect boost. Example i'm making up. Say a machine is REALLY light, maybe it gains the speed easy, but loses it easy cus it has no real mass. Making the boost feel shorter & weaker? But a heavier 1 keeps it's momentum better? Again, i'm kinda grasping at straws here. Guessing based on some just random bits of my own gameplay & a couple hunches i have with no research. But it may help explain why stats are odd.

[@foxboi6309]

Deepclaw is such a great machine for me, despite having a "C" grip, it takes a lot of speed for it to actually lose grip, looks more like a B honestly

[@marcellosilva9286]

Even though it's probably been over a decade since I've played F-Zero GX, I still remember how amazing the Sonic Phantom's boost was, I felt so vindicated watching this video, but I was sad that the Little Wyvern's stats aren't as good as advertised and that I was lied to, but it does explain why I thought the SP was performing better for me. However, I still don't know how you did those turns with the Sonic Phantom without losing speed, I always just let go of the gas and use L and R to help the machine turn, but you didn't do that here, I have no idea how these advanced turning techniques work, I'm not a pro.

[@Anthonyvideogame]

White Cat main here, I feel like it gets better boost than the C grade lets on.

[@CoolLogoDude]

I was trying to beat an expert cup with the super piraña because I really don't know what Im doing just kinda winging it. This video is going to help me to complete this game thank you. Also, is it a better idea to beat the Grand Prix or beat the Story first? I haven't touched the story yet. I wanted to get good.

[@Spectacular66]

I was pretty sharp with the Wild Goose, beat all the cups with that machine, haha but yeah the booster is strangely weak for being a B rating

[@colbyboucher6391]

F-Zero GX, the most completely broken best game ever.

[@NoNameNoWhere]

The ranks for the machines are pretty useless, especially grip. Dark Shneider, despite having a D grip, controls better than any other vehicle in my opinion. It really is best to ignore the ranks and simply experiment. One thing that I love about F Zero is how different most of the vehicles feel from one another. They aren't uniform designs, so it makes sense that they feel somewhat unique. I also love how varied people's preferences are. What feels good to me will often feel horrible to others. Some vehicles are notoriously bad, but all of them are viable for general play, even on Master difficulty. Even the White Cat... though just barely.

[@UltimatViolet]

While the Wild Goose is definitely one of the weaker machines, I think the boost, while VERY short, isn't that terrible since it takes up so little energy and can therefore be spammed more than most, which goes well with its extremely durable body.

[@DrakodanSRL]

Shorter boost duration is inherently worse since it requires more frequent MT to make efficient use of the increased speed. All it results in is lower overall uptime on boost state, and more opportunities to mess up your MT rhythm and lose a ton of speed.