Fate/Stay Night - Why Ufotable's UBW Is Better Than DEEN's - Analysis

[@GrimgoreIronhide]

There is an entire conversation in the Fate Route about how Saber absolutely refuses to turn her back on anyone she considers an enemy no matter how harmless they may seem, which is why she wont sheathe her sword or stop giving a death glare when Kirei comes to talk to Shirou. Its made very clear that this is a matter of principle for her. The idea that she would turn her back on GILGAMESH, one of the few beings in the world she actually fears makes about as much sense as Shirou seeing a homeless man getting mugged on the street, shrugging and continuing on his way while whistling.

[@fujineetomori]

The homeless man in question is Shinji

[@tiagobelo4965]

@@fujineetomori in that case I could personally understand I truly despise shinji

[@Yuushashi]

​@@tiagobelo4965 Who doesn't?

[@neoaustin164]

Another thing this video doesnt touch up on is the significants of Gil not moving the entire fight in the anime, he utterly refuses to take shiro seriously and symbolizes that by refusing to move. When shiro dissarms him its because he hesitated to use his trump card against someone he sees as being so far beneith him and when he jumped back it was also symbolic, showing how Shiro won both in strength and conviction. The king of heros was forced back by a fake. In the movie gilgamesh is way too active for not taking shiro seriously.

[@neoaustin164]

Oh hey, my first heart. Cool! Thanks op

[@LeonGun8]

ALso note how the moment Gilgamesh is forced to take a step back (and loses his arm) he looks at Shirou and proclaims that in this moment he is strong,meaning that for the first time during the whole fight he has acknowledged Shirou's power.

[@lpfan4491]

i actually really like the version of gil from the movie(also how he is swag enough to not even fire using gate sometimes out of pure disrespect and instead throws single swords),but him just charging into the melee is really dumb xD

[@Ren-xd4jr]

That one hesitation because of pride, took his life

[@desolatorstorm142]

It's worth noting those elements are Ufotable saving face for Gilgamesh(I'm positive that they either really like Gil, or hate both Shirou and Archer considering the consistent downplay Archer's abilities have in the adaptation). In the novel, there was no hesitation for Ea. He just resorted to it too late. Before he used Ea, he admits that Shirou is stronger than him within UBW, indicating he admitted defeat, and was resorting to the delete-reality weapon against the reality marble, only for the superior speed of UBW to let Shirou to chop off his arm. The grail attempted to absorb Gilgamesh right before Shirou's finishing blow landed (ironically meaning that the adaptation turned the plot device into plot armor for Shirou which is the reverse of what happened). Gilgamesh actually used Ea on Shirou, not the grail, but Archer used Rho Aius to prevent the damage from being lethal. Gilgamesh was shocked that he couldn't get through Rho Aius during the chant scene, rather than only casually attacking it

[@nekochibi2256]

Do we really need an analysis on why Ufotables UBW is better than DEEN?

[@alnotbiggaytho7124]

Neko Chibi no bc Deen is better

[@fanu3p900]

skankhunt 42 jahhahahahahhahhahhahahh

[@TREVORVADER]

truth of this earth, 42 nice joke

[@manuellara9644]

truth of this earth, 42 an amazing joke

[@Lexipumpkin783]

tbh ufotable is like the god of animating XD

[@Animexxkyubii]

I always thought that Archer was send by the Counterforce to stop humanity from being wiped out by Gilgamesh, not him having still a bit of power left.

[@BlueDrakma]

Huh. I never considered that.

[@Animexxkyubii]

It is just a possibility. But I always thought it made the most sense.

[@dildoballins8545]

Not really a possibility since if he was sent by the Counter Force he would slaughter everyone in the immediate vicinity, a much more probably explanation was Alaya powering him up enough so that he can survive (which happens from time to time)

[@sirbedivere5670]

No. Independent Action.

[@redthief4623]

The reason he survived was by dematerializing exactly when Gil's swords were supposed to strike him as such giving the illusion that he died.

[@RedHeadGlasses]

My only problem with UFOTABLE's UBW was when they made Illya's death less shocking w/o the brutal heart grab scene but I give them point in with the eye slashing scene.

[@kytsunee6324]

Totto Land so you didn’t like that Ufotable ruined your hype in something that you shouldn’t have been hyped for by giving you information about the characters that were being slaughtered? It was supposed to be sad and represent how Shirou felt powerless in front of Gilgamesh and to demonstrate the immense power Gilgamesh wields, using it for any mean he wants. Ilya was a character meant to be just a girl angry because of conditions she was unaware of. She was raised that way, and she accepted it because she was angry thinking what the einzbern told her was true. That kiritsugu left her, meanwhile he tried to save her till his last breath. All of this depth in the scene is supposed to be something to not like because you couldn’t enjoy a little girl getting murdered knowing her past? Nice, dude.

[@kytsunee6324]

Totto Land ah alright gotcha.

[@TheAngryAsianAnimations]

I think the biggest issue was time. They had to cram everything in UBW in one and a half hours so they end up simply going through a checklist of what needs to be done without going in depth of each event.

[@connormills1413]

Late response but that is entirely true. We cannot entirely blame DEEN for the quality of that fight. they were likely on a tight schedule and the VN's telling of events is (as far I can tell) is both paradoxically clearly explained and ludicrously gauge. That and there was a picture showing Shirou and gilgamesh clashing swords, so I guess they decided to base the whole fight on that.

[@CrnaStrela]

We do, however can blame DEEN for their take on UBW. They forcing themselves to make one, even though they have no ability nor resources to make a full take on UBW. You see HF by Ufotable, that's how you animate entire stories with movies, cut them to several pieces so you won't lose all necessary details and have time to work on characterizations. But no, let's just cram everything in one movie. DEEN has never redeemed themselves, they are good at picking what source materials that would become popular, but they are so bad at actually making the anime itself and just clinging on the fact that the source material is really good so it erased their mistakes.

[@t.productionst4262]

Because its a 1 hour movie they f*cked up the shirou vs archer fight scene, the animation I'd good but its not the point of the fight they only used magic, strength, and ability while the ufotable ver, was to fight with their ideals and that's the real deal of the show, can't believe some people prefer the deen one.

[@brandonhawker6597]

@@t.productionst4262 Basically, Ufotable captured more of the heart of the UBW Route. It's not about Shirou being incredibly powerful, because he's not. As a Mage, he's inferior in every aspect to Rin. Hell, even Sakura with some formal training would completely outstrip him, since she's also a member of the Tohsaka line. Rather, it's about Shirou reaffirming his ideals and beliefs, and moving onward with the knowledge that he knows he may fail, but even if he does, the effort to succeed is what's important, not the result. And this fight signified that very well in the Ufotable adaptation. Shirou is going up against an opponent he should normally stand no chance against, but because he is willing to bet everything, including his own life on this fight, and Gilgamesh is too stubborn and prideful to take Shirou seriously, Shirou wins. It basically shows that, in the end, Shirou's determination and sheer belief in his ideals allowed him, the arguably weakest mage in the series, not counting Shinji, to defeat the person who was, at the time, often considered the strongest of all Heroic Spirits.

[@totozhu4543]

That's pretty obvious. Heaven's feel was trilogy, and they still cut out several parts out of it, though the saber vs berserker fight was severely extended.

[@houndnobleman876]

In a nutshell, the movie is a shallow fan service "adaptation" while the flawed, albeit very watchable Ufotable adaptation feels like there was actual thought put into it.

[@bounce2132]

What do you mean by flawed?

[@houndnobleman876]

@@bounce2132 It had issues with pacing and felt a bit too long. I'd still say it's a fine show, but not as good as Zero or Heaven's Feel.

[@Gohan7230]

Ufo ubw is very mediocre

[@quochuyvo3774]

Fun fact: Deen is the company that made Konosuba

[@BlueDrakma]

WAIT WHAT oh it is that's a thing H O W

[@phantom117b4]

Deen got alot better at animation: p.s. they also did "is this a Zombie?" and it's squeal " is this a Zombie? of the dead"

[@snakesniper4513]

RsGames1999 hah. Fucking dumbass. You do know that FSN deem did was about average during its time right? Also they compensate for many aspects in ye was scenes diverse. Shirou forcing Gil in CQC falls in line with the whole "you're not a wielder" trope. Sword spam b sword spam was nice and beautiful full to see but the CQC made more overall sense due to that fact that shirou traced his weapon allowing him to call himself a weilder. Many people already called you out on the whole sky change so I'll leave that out. However UBW does not cost mana once activated hence it won't vanish unless destroyed (making the whole black hole scene much more sensible as the grail causes the RM to collapse rather than outside where all the heart would have to do is try and attach itself to the host. Caliburn is not random, in the VN archer was slashing at shirou with it during their fight.shirou is stronger than Gilgamesh because he knows how to use his muscles with the blade, physically gil is slightly stronger.i get deen has its flaws in a few aspects but most changes and inventions are praised and canonized by Nasu. (Take overedge and triple crane wings for example) you also neglected how deens voices were closer to the VN. Gil was hardly calm later in the fight. You're just one of those UFO fan girls that hop on the deen hate train senselessly. Seriously...why bother with this video despite the time gap and time each studio had for production?

[@snakesniper4513]

RsGames1999 also shirou got a weaker "Mind of eye" from his fight with archer, allowing him to know away the swords.

[@snakesniper4513]

RsGames1999 and the sword fling. Do you really believe he saw shirou as a opponent worthy of even a sword spam?

[@freibier]

It is "UFO table", they named the company after a "UFO" shaped table they had in their office.

[@Selenkate]

Yeah, but that takes longer to say

[@NHDOreBros]

@@DawnMir It would be Oo-Fo actually because at the start of the Kara no Kyoukai movies, it says in clear English, an Ufotable production. Meaning the U in Ufotable is a vowel sound.

[@pandajune1991]

I've watched both and totally agree. Deen's isn't horrible but the sequencing and choreography are just a bit smoother, also you had a point in that the fight feels more satisfying when watching Ufotable's because they're long-range fighters who require well thought out strategies to win over brute force.

[@onemoregodrejected9369]

2:55 Yeah Shirou is at least a fit kid, he is been doing his "super hero" training Midoriya Style but for years since he was adopted.

[@bandabanana4939]

Other way around

[@patrickrudolph1258]

Unlimited Budget Works.

[@tranz2deep]

That would be the Coin Operated Lion in a certain parody series...

[@betterdevils8734]

@@tranz2deep UNIT LION

[@Gohan7230]

Unlimited artificial mediocre works

[@draknusdesderdus7506]

I would love more of these scene breakdowns. So much can be lost in the action of the moment when watching and it's really interesting. Also the comparison here was rather interesting since I never watched Deen's version.

[@KatanaShojo159]

Love your analysis. I've watched both versions TV and movie versions and this makes so much sense! You do anime analysis very well. Keep it up!

[@ssjokg4952]

Nice vid, although I I went in hoping it would be about the full series. A couple of things. Shirou's UBW: Actually it has to be that "dark" but lets see what ufo did. When he was fighting Archer,a cloudy but really blue sky took over Archer's UBW but when he was fighting Gil the sky wasnt so blue anymore. That was a greta move in that while Shirou was still a "dreamer" while fighting Archer he finally accepts all the downfalls, all the hypocrisy and all the pain he will encounter. It is the pain of a "hero" he must shoulder. The best party is that ufo did their own thing and still manage dto do more while Deen just copied the CGs from he VN and failed. Shirou's powerlevel and vs Gil: Actually, Shirou did power up because of his link to Archer.By drawing experience from him during their battle he now is able to deploy UBW, parry so many attacks from GoB and fight Gil. Gil while not the level of Saber,Berserker,Lancer or ofc Assassin, does have some skill. Those aside I would love to see more vids like be it an analysis of the tv seires or just a deen vs Ufo comparison. Many viewers even VN readers choose to ignore how much Ufo tried for this just because Shirou doesnt repeat his monologues in every goddamn scene.The same people that want more "show dont tell" are mad that it had more show.

[@dildoballins8545]

Gil having skill becomes meaningless since Shirou does also copy the skills of the Traced weapon's wielder

[@anxiousearth680]

Gil's also in a human body in this war, which prevented him from vanishing but could lower his cqc abilities.

[@tranz2deep]

I honestly think Shirou used insolence to throw Gilgamesh off his game. Had he been truly honest in his critique he would have called Gil out on being nothing more than a mythic derivation of Gilgamesh of Uruk because, in simple terms, he *was* one. Gilgamesh was the previous war's Archer. In another class he'd probably have had a favored weapon and, yes, mastered it.

[@TheAustin007powers]

Excellent video, one of my favorite series.

[@spiritwaker9595]

There are some really great points brought up in this and of course everyone will have their opinions towards it and debates. Personally, I much prefer Ufotable's UBW over DEEN's both for the visual style and overall feel. There are other aspects between the two that are worth debate (I personally prefer DEEN's take on the Mana Transfer scene for Shirou and Rin because of how detailed they went in it while also alluding more to what a Mana Transfer actually is, while the fight between Illya and Gil is taken differently as well) But more to the point at hand, I prefer Ufotable for its take on the battle with Gilgamesh. Yes they added elements that weren't in the VN but they were ones which enhanced the overly flavor of the story and experience. The way the battle went made more logical sense and just felt, for lack of a better term, way more badass and epic in comparison to DEEN. It still stands as both my favourite adaptation of FSN and one of my favourite anime which holds my favourite fight scenes (the final episode with Rin and Luvia still stands as my personal favourite) However, we also do have to take into consideration as a whole that Ufotable did a 26 (Including ep 0) episode series, each averaging approx 20-23min a piece, whereas DEEN did a near 2 hour movie, so there naturally exists a limitation in how much can be explained in such little time. Overall, this was a really good and interesting analysis. Keep it up and never lose your flames, mate

[@tranz2deep]

Solid writing while respecting and incorporating the imagery of the visual novel in the anime.

[@mechajay3358]

Amazing video, you should do more like this.👍

[@arrow_of_longing]

Why a juicy steak is better than dog shit - Analysis

[@rzplaygames5994]

About Gilgamesh throwing sword by himself... I think it's a nice way to show his accurancy as a Heroic Spirit of Archer class. Dunno if it was actual reason for including it, though.

[@blackfyre7900]

"or even Archer" he says. Gilgamesh's strength stat: B Archer's strength stat: D ...yeah, no. I am fairly confident that the reasoning behind Gil's shortcomings in the sword fight were due to his his anger and lack of a clear mind. Gilgamesh was reputed as an above-average swordsman and normal archer, and he is only truly subpar when compared to Saber.

[@BlueDrakma]

Well, that being said, the anime never outright says this information, and neither does the movie. Fate/Zero never does either. I understand that the VN has a lot more lore than the anime adaptations, but I'm only taking into account how these adaptations work in comparison to one another. Given his style and history in the shows, Gil's strength stat, especially in comparison to Archer and Shirou's, makes no sense in the context of this scene. Therefor I didn't mention it.

[@blackfyre7900]

I suppose that is true. Apologies for coming to you with this somewhat fanboyish argument. I am simply a large fan of Gilgamesh, and I am not a fan of how the anime inaccurately displays historical context. I simply find it to be a strange idea that the Gilgamesh went through his entire life's journey by shooting swords at people. Thank you for replying though. Still, it is never outright said that Archer is stronger than Gilgamesh is. It isn't even shown clearly either. Shirou pushed Gilgamesh back, yes, but Shirou had also pushed Archer back, and their fighting styles are entirely different. Still, great video.

[@BlueDrakma]

No problem! Thanks for not biting my head off. I know Gil in the show really isn't anything like Gil in the legend in terms of fighting style. Honestly, I find it strange they made him an archer. I suppose it kinda makes sense if he owned all the world's treasures, but it really is a stretch to say he can also fire them off like bazookas. Really raises the question of whether or not a few of those projectiles were accidentally just rapid-fire goblets and wine.

[@blackfyre7900]

Haha! I wouldn't doubt it, Gilgamesh does have it in him to fire such things in his arrogance. But, apologies for continuing the argument, but if we're looking at anime context then in the original DEEN anime, Gilgamesh was shown **beating** Saber in a sword fight. He's definitely not the superior swordsman, by any means, but he was still skilled enough to fend off her attacks.

[@BlueDrakma]

I don't mind! This video pretty much exists to bring out conversation. If we do look at Deen, that is very true, but we need to keep in mind that Gilgamesh has planet-busting Ea (counting the reality marble) whilst Artoria had skyscraper-busting Excalibur (if you count Cthulu Caster as about that difficult to kill). Even with Avalon's passive buffs, that's literally a world of difference.

[@BlaxeFrost-X]

i read the VN and the ufotable version feels similar, just some updates, i like that version, not deen

[@glich6035]

and the moral of the story is if it wasn't young Gilgamesh shirou would be uterlly screwed because at that point Gilgamesh had grown to truly treasure his possessions and actually start to master his armory and wasn't a completely arrogant prick still arrogant and a bit of a ass but a far wiser and softer one

[@MarcelloF133]

oh boy. Gilgamesh does in fact have more might than Archer. Archer's stats are low tier and has rank D strength while Gilgamesh's strength is Rank B. what Archer has is better fighting skill since he is a sword and probably fucked a sword too. But UBW is a perfect counter to Gate of Babylon even though Gil could easily destroy it with Ea. The real problem is Gil's pride.

[@BlueDrakma]

Senpai Stats aside Gil’s showings are kinda pathetic, to be honest. His feats of raw strength are minimal to nonexistent. Archer has to be stronger than Shirou and Shirou straight-up beat Gil. Even discounting Shirou’s link to Archer, Gil had used swords for wayyyy longer than Shirou. It’s not like je chucked steel around with gold puddles in life. Honestly stats don’t make a lot of sense in-lore sometimes.

[@LeonGun8]

We can't depend on stats because stats barely make sense in the VN's context. Archer killed Berserker seven times in Fate without even using Unlimited Blade Works !!! Just let that sink in. The only true edge Gilgamesh has over Archer is his more unique items in his armory, like his Armor, some super weapons which he could use to literally nuke the town, and Ea. Basically, Gilgamesh would have to take the hit on his pride and use his big shot tools against someone he considers a "phony".

[@brucewayne8550]

Stats don't mean all that much in Fate Assassin Kojiro has piss poor stats yet he's able to stalemate and even almost beat Saber who is his superior in terms of stats. He even fights of Berserker off-screen with pure skill. Lancer admits to not wanting to fight Kojiro in close combat and even Gil doesn't enter into close combat with Assassin and instead kills him off-screen with GoB.

[@lordtouchme77]

but archer have more battle experienced compared to gil, i mean he is counter guardian ffs. he would fight for eternity and his armory would keep increasing, stats doesn't mean anything to someone who is fighting for almost his entire life + his job as a guardian. i mean you just need to used common sense that younger amateur human emiya could beat gil with ubw alone and you want me to believed that the more skilled and stronger version of shirou who is also a servant and CG can't beat gil with ubw? i call that BS.

[@Ryad.jpg.]

dude your content is really good you deserve more subs

[@renni9813]

What a brave statement

[@JRZTT]

I love Ufo version but for OST, I preferred DEEN.

[@boltmix7359]

Well-Intentioned Anti-Villain How so? Last stardust and the opening of second season of ubw are masterpices,even the EMIYA remix used in the Shiro vs Gilgamesh fight was better then the original.

[@JayWalkZ]

Bolt Mix emiya remix isn't better than the original, but music is all based on personal taste I would say.

[@jaredjeremy2170]

Agree , DEEN OST actually better

[@geniei91]

Personally, I just like both Kenji Kawai and Hideyuki Fukasawa. still prefer the latter's EMIYA tho xddd

[@lpfan4491]

both versions had good music

[@fuin4597]

i like both. They're entertaining in their own ways

[@giosmack49]

in the deen version though gilgamesh went to rush first after he realizes his mistake and trys to jump back but shirou keeps pushing and countering babylon

[@JoshtheOverlander]

Rest in pepperonis, Giggles. You shall not be missed...

[@wedmikey]

meh i think both were good in their own way.

[@myolgiden]

Exactly. One is better on character desings, one is better on background and visuals.

[@41N53L]

Mustafa Yolgiden not to mentioned the deens one is good at building up suspense

[@holdenm.c5495]

To me, i like both final battle. Its really enjoying to watch.

[@RandyAlterReviews]

one thing I want to point out is DEEN's choreography for the fight scenes wasn't bad, the only thing in difference is Ufotable's High quality Visual Effects. But in terms of Fight scene choreography I think DEEN did better

[@manuellara9644]

Randy Alter Reviews how so?

[@DoomRanger]

Well, DEEN's fight scenes were honestly more accurate than Ufotable but Ufotable just has much better graphics, you can't blame DEEN though, at that time, the graphics DEEN used were considered excellent. Now, the Fate route graphics is considered lousy Any who, DEEN's graphics atm is very good too, they made Konosuba

[@leoprotettore5862]

DEEN's choreography fighting is somehow... bad. REALLY BAD. The non-stopping swing back and forth with the Excalibur(?) makes no sense since it consumes lots of energy and also that's not how you're supposed to fight with long swords. And then, the Gil charge is also shiitty, cuz nobody ever damn fck charges into someone if you have range advantage. Basic tactics, spend ALL your projectiles till you run out in order to, if not destroyed, weaken your enemies, and THEN you charge into them.

[@Alik_Odess]

Randy Alter Reviews Dude Strategy 101. If you have long range weapons use those first to keep your opponent away from you so he won't have the chance to hurt you while you can hurt him... What DEEN did was basically equal to a guy with a gun to try and hit his opponent with the handle instead of just shooting him....

[@VuDuyVo]

Deen's Version: *sees Lancer and Archer fighting like normal people* Yea, I can seen how Shirou might have held his own against Servants. Ufotable Version: *sees Archer's flashstep* Did I put on DBZ? *sees Saber's Sideways tornado strike* Okay stop. It's not like Ufotable doesn't know how to make fight scenes that fit the universe. Fate Zero's fight scenes were amazing. What the happened? *sees Shirou's Superman Jump* Oh for the love of...

[@jaredjosephsongheng372]

Ufotable has used their Noble Phantasm "Unlimited Budget Works" which is also known as "Unlimited Tax Evasions"

[@Abrhm77]

My problem is i accidentally watched deens fate stay night instead of Unlimited blade what should i do is the 2 of the series same?

[@BlueDrakma]

So Deen starts very similar to how UBW goes, but ends totally different. By the halfway point they're basically two entirely different series.

[@nisemonoyarou]

I like the part where you called Gil a servant lower case heavily implied

[@konjiki8203]

I will criticize one thing. The part about Caliburn, in the VN it was there, so it wasn’t Deen’s fault, you even see the CG of Shirou wielding it against Gilgamesh. And it wasn’t impossible for Shirou to wield it, as he has seen memories of Saber (slightly) and Archer, who has also most likely projected Caliburn. Other than that, and a minor detail about the appearance on the UBW, you mostly made valid criticisms.

[@thebaker9005]

I still believe that the visual novel beats both adaptations by a landslide and I would recommend to everyone that they read the visual novel first. I honestly do not like reading at all and struggle with it, but the visual novel was worth every minute of it.

[@DakinRinone]

Ufotable has literally some of the best animation work in the damn industry. I'm not riding on studio Deen cause they do good work as well with their other works. But comparing both of these side by side, there is no comparison.

[@wilfordpadio3900]

yeah comparing a movie that has a time limitation to a 26-episode one where you can flesh out a story is good

[@MiaMizauki]

I feel like this video should be called why Ufotable's version is better than the VN. Many of the things you talked about weren't in the original story. The grail attacking Gilgamesh and him using EA, the visual representation of how UBW countered GoB during the fight, the "hopeful" UBW. In this industry where creative changes are met with harsh criticism, I can't really blame DEEN not wanting to add their own input and context. Especially when I hear all of the shit they get from the 2006 version where they added the Caster Arc to give proper closure to Sakura and Assaassin.

[@dancewithme8790]

This.

[@niasandra6774]

@Silverlock watch?v=hpLixH4479c Before Unlimited Blade Words Summoned. "There's no way for me to defend myself if he release all of the Noble Phantasms behind him. But he release them one by one as if to test how much I can take." "I repel the oncoming swords...I throw away the destroyed sword and prepare for the next attack." After Unlimited Blade Words Summoned. "A curved sword appears behind him...but I pull out the curved sword by my feet faster than him. I swing it straight at him." "The instant I see his Noble Phantasm, I real the exact same one and swing with all of my might." Shirou's ability to telepathically fire his weapons is one of three things Ufotable copied from Deen. He does not have that ability with or without Unlimited Blade Works.

[@MiaMizauki]

+Nia Sandra Hah, he deleted his reply.

[@yoursonisold8743]

But are you disregarding how inaccurate the DEEN anime was to the VN as well? To me the three versions are all their own beasts. It's fine to like one over the other, that's just opinions, but you cannot claim that DEEN's version was accurate to the VN without lying. The Caster/Sakura plot they added felt pointless and was handled terribly. Sometimes it's better not to give closure than bad closure.

[@Vulken2000]

MiaMizauki THANK YOU! Finally somebody said it. Honestly, Ufotable fans are just absolutely crazy to think no one would remember the shit they gave to Deen for doing the exact same thing Ufotable did except several years later with a shot ton more cgi than that single dragon scene. It irritated me to no end whenever someone claimed "they combined the three routes," when talking about the Caster Arc causing me to wonder if they'd even read the VN. Hey Ufotable fans. That shit that was added in UBW with Caster and her Master was really dumb. Way to make your villian look less evil by putting her next to a bigger asshole. The whole thing with the high tech lab was really out of place compared to the rest of the setting as well. And way to show Archer just to skip how Caster could have gotten away. Not only was it bad, but unlike what Deen did for Caster, it was unnecessary. You could have skipped that whole side story and the story would not have been effected. Not take out Carter's Arc in 2006 and see what happens. Suddenly we get one Servant killed off right away literally seconds before we learn of an "eight servant," with no build up, while the whole Assassin vs Saber rivalry was left hanging. Great work wasting that giant budget Ufotable.

[@bramderacourt9499]

Sorry to contradict, but while your assesment of Gilgamesh being better at long range is absolutely correct, Gil actually does have a degree of melee skill and his physical strength and endurance stats are way higher than Archer or even Lancer, both clocking in at B while archer only has a D. It indeed makes no sense that he immediately goes for the melee but to say he is useless at it is rather reductive.

[@princekyros]

Just one nitpick. It's magical energy (or prana for like one or two mostly canon translations) not mana. Mana is the Od of the planet.

[@tprh388]

I think you should also do an analysis for Shirou vs Archer fight.

[@r.k845]

Honestly while both are bad the Deen version is superior in many ways for that fight.

[@Huyrrou]

This is... the power of table

[@error404willtolivenotfound3]

Studio Deen still animated UBW better than 7 Deadly Sins s3

[@KahavaveCAPIPI]

This is the least controversial statement in the history of statements.

[@DeepbloodFang]

As much as people like to gloat on how fantastic Ufotables adaption is and bash on the DEEN adaption, back when the DEEN version was released, I was just incredibly happy to even get a Fate adaption and see my favourite characters moving and breathing. In fact, for many, DEEN's adaption was the entry gate to the Nasuverse, so for that I will forever be grateful for the DEEN adaption, even if quality-wise Ufotable's is better.

[@BlueDrakma]

See, I do like the DEEN version, I just think it's important to acknowledge what specific things made X better than Y and so on. I do personally think it'd be a shame for somebody to see the movie, dislike it, and then assume it gets no better from there. I know people who've done that.

[@dreamchaser3012]

Im really not a fan of how UBW goes out of its way to express how limited Gilgamesh is at close range. Thats the exact oposite of how he's depicted in the Epic of Gilgamesh, where he just kills everything with his bare hands. Im fond of the idea that Gil refuses to actually fight hand to hand not because he cant do it, but because he would have to put in the effort and he thinks Shirou is not worth it. And the new writers seen to feel the same way. Since we see him absolutelly going to town close up and personal against Enkidu (who can stand his ground against Quetzalcoatl) and using his NP's powers individually in Strange Fake. But god that last fight in UBW is a beauty

[@r.k845]

Yeah and gilgamesh in the myth doesn't have gait of Babylon and would lose to Hercules. Your point?

[@jimmyp9105]

To answer your qeustion why he throws the sword and others like close combat. It simple: boredom. If you don't switch it up, you get bord and there for unfocused.... This isn't the best of examples but take me cuting grass, going back and forth, back and forth, or circle is tedious and boring, so after awhile i start doing random cuting.

[@syntinel9481]

Basically it's better because it looks better and makes more sense. Also, it looks better.

[@jayfugazi9751]

shirous theme in the ufotable version was so fuckign hype

[@romanempire8705]

I've just watched Fate/Stay Night Unlimited Blade Works and I thought the Deux Ex Machina was hard in Emiya, but the one in the movie is way worst... Though the Fate/Zero, Fate/Apocrypha, and Fate/Stay Night Unlimited Blade Works, which are all the Fate series I've watched, are just full of Deux Ex Machina and plot armor for the Main character... Not so much in the Fate/Zero though, other than that I enjoyed the series.

[@jaydenlobbe7911]

So the thing about Shirou having plot armour could be said for literally any character in any work of Fiction I think OtakuDaiKun said it how it really is: Plot Armour is just Plot, it just comes down to whether or not you accept the logic behind why certain characters are capable of certain things Also your comment is only talking about the Anime, not the VN In the VN you can very easily get Shirou killed in some of the most painful ways imaginable, an example of such would be Berserker breaking his legs so that they bend in the opposite direction at the Knees You can't really say that Shirou has Plot Armour because their are very clear parameters at work in situations where he could possibly be killed. If Shirou doesn't follow Saber and Rin during Sabers fight against Berserker in UBW he gets killed by a Lancer in hiding. If Shirou tries to save Saber during the fight where we learn that Kuzuki is Casters Master he gets killed after seeing Kuzuki practically blow up Rins head in a single punch. In the situations where Shirou gets killed it always comes down to choices that the player can make, the UBW Anime is only telling us how the story happens when the player makes the *Right* choices.

[@ShirouBrando]

I know this is 4 years old but shirou has negative plot armor he has soooo many bad ends if you make wrong decisions

[@romanempire8705]

@@ShirouBrando what is the anime called? I wanna see it, it's just frustrating that a guy who just recently started fighting strong opponents beats one of the top strongest fighters in the series.

[@romanempire8705]

@@jaydenlobbe7911 plot and plot armor are different, one is the character driving the story and the other is the story driving the character regardless of how little sense it makes. If they make an anime with Shirou being killed and he should've been if he's the one fighting, then please share.

[@ShirouBrando]

@@romanempire8705 its the vn you make the choices for shirou and if you make a wrong choice you hit a bad end for example if shirou decides not to fight in the war He gets encountered by illiya and beserker without a servant gets his legs broken and gets his entire torso caved in then illiya cast a spell on him to not let him die so he can keep feeling the pain rips his head off and takes him back home to do experiments on him and thats just the first bad end

[@zerociel27]

Animation budget ofcourse its newer so it's better, but the Studio Deen's version have better sound track ost, ending theme and opening are also better for me,

[@BlueDrakma]

UFOtable had a perfectly average budget, they just do good work. Deen had a film budget and made the movie at the same time that UFOtable produced Fate/Zero. The mistakes in its production and advantages in UFO’s were entirely based from the teams and passion involved.

[@zerociel27]

Don't get me wrong, i loved the ufo table version much better, but for me the music from the past really catches the emotion of the scenery, btw loved this video content

[@GiyuTomiokaTheOneAndOnly]

I still think we need a remake on fate route cause the story seems good

[@higodelaluna]

I'd prefer that the title stated only the final battle is analysed, because it looks like you judge two entire works based on it. Even if you would be right anyway.

[@gamervevo-s8v]

Because Unlimited Budget Works

[@LordEmperorBoss]

Gilgamesh in any incarnation just does as he pleases. And supposedly Archer in UBW is the Stay Night Shirou. Which is why it’s slightly different. Other than that, I think this was on point.

[@lucasmillerthelewderofloli9327]

Not really, Archer from UBW went through similar events that happened in Fate route, except he never really hooked up with Saber and the last person he was close with ( Illya ) died a year after the grail war, since then he was wandering and fighting in wars only to be killed by people he was fighting for.

[@thegamerfe8751]

@@lucasmillerthelewderofloli9327 No, that's the Fate Route/Stay Night anime Archer. The Archer in UBW is indeed Shirou from the Fate route and again, the Archer from Heaven's Feels is the Shirou from UBW. Heck, even the change in personality and ideals hint at this if you watched/played in chronological order.

[@ShirouBrando]

@@thegamerfe8751 no no he is not archer is from a similar route to the fate route but he didn't save saber Nasu has straight up confirmed that all 3 shirous from the routes we see have a 0% chance of becoming archer so he cant be the ubw shirou

[@junior_3676]

Next on BlueDrakmaVA: Why water is wet

[@sheemolevarghese9480]

I am little lucky my name is Emiya

[@kiritsuguemiya8274]

WTH DID THEY DO, I DON'T THROW SWORDS

[@DarthAlphaTheGreat]

Does my armour get in my way you ask? You fool! My armour is a master piece! But yes, it does. That’s why I am here as Archer. -Gilgamesh :P

[@Fedorchik1536]

I love how Gil hesitates to use Ea against Shirou in ufotable (because who the hell he thinks he is, he is not worthy to even gaze it) and it is what finally makes him lose. To arrogant to admit that he's been matched. Not sure if DEEN version as that.

[@Washekk2712]

Rip seven deadly sins

[@renni9813]

Im pretty sure archer was able to come back, not because he had a little energy left, but because the world was facing a catastrophe. His job when hes not functioning as a heroic spirit is to protect the world when it faces threats

[@Sambit_Kumar_Barik]

Can u tell me which series is the one which is at the left at first 16sec of this vid..?

[@Makiosaa]

Caster Gil would have beaten Shirou not because he's stronger than Archer Gil, its because he's not as much of an arrogant prick, and would've taken the more cautious route and hit Shirou with his strongest attack, especially when he pulls out UBW, while not as useful against Caster Gil, he should still be able to take out the staffs.

[@Brimst0ne6800]

Say what you want about DEEN’s Fate/Stay Night, but you can not deny that the DEEN’s music department was and still is better.

[@renowinter8022]

They steal from the VN

[@Brimst0ne6800]

Terence Tebing I’m talking about the OST, Kenji Kawaii did such a good job working on it, you MUST listen to it.

[@whiteraven562]

Why is Ufotable's UBW better than Deen's? Because they didn't try and cram an entire visual novel route into an hour and a half movie.

[@DPSS927]

I will say one thing. While Ufotable's battle was more satisfying, DEEN's interpretation was more canonical in a lot of ways. In the VN, Archer didn't use UBW during his 1v1 with Shirou, he didn't have enough prana. The grail didn't try to consume Gilgamesh mid-fight like that and he only used EA to show off and it's implied that Archer used Rho Aias to barely save Shirou (I don't believe this happen in the DEEN version, so point Ufotable on that one). Speaking of which, the grail never sprouts arms and develops some montrousus humanoid giant body. Finally, and this is the part that really bugs me, Shirou's Reality Marble doesn't go down due to lack of prana. The blast from Saber's Excalibur weakens UBW and immeadiatly afterwords the hole in the grail appears over Gilgamesh's severed arm and literally drains Shirou's RM while trying to absorve Gil. There was no Deus Ex Machina which ends up saving Shirou after he runs out of prana. If anything, if it hadn't been for outside interference he would have managed to kill Gilgamesh just fine. So when it comes to the ending at least, I might just say that I prefer DEEN's version.

[@charlestonho6733]

Ufotable are best as DEEN fight does not make sense.

[@MrYoyoshi9]

@@charlestonho6733 while UFO is the best of the two, neither makes sense tbh, its a fight where circumstances matter a lot, and both of them ignored the circumstances, Deen because the obvious cast ubw and proceed to use a single sword as a baseball bate while Gil also forgets about GoB, while UFO ignores that it was a simultaneous swordspam where Shirou gets Gil in close combat and its over in like 10 seconds and makes Shirou jump around and letting Gil retreat once Shirou gets him, while the idea was cornering him and not giving him time to adjust, because Shirou can counter his swords but Gil has a lot of weird things that Shirou can't just copy and throw at him, and he is fully aware that he can't even project Ea, in UFO version Gil has plenty of time to do something but he just stands there,so it seems he lost because stupidity ,and then the grail saves Shirou from him, instead of absorbing Gil before Shirou killed him, very possibly to not make him look bad for almost getting killed by a faker when that was the point

[@charlestonho6733]

@@MrYoyoshi9 Have you forgotten that Gil ONLY use Ea on opponent HE consider equal due to his aarogance. He consider Shirou lower than Mongrel.

[@MrYoyoshi9]

@@charlestonho6733 In the novel, before this fight Gilgamesh already used Ea on Shirou, it was like the weakest Ea he could do however, but he showed it to Shirou when he realized he could copy his weapons, just to make a point and showing him he didn't had any chance against him, and there Shirou realized he could not even analize it, after he deploys ubw he takes Ea into account since the start because he knows he can't counter it, and he thinks is Gil trump card so he is going to use it if he is losing, so when Gil finally decides to use it Shirou is already waiting for it and chops his arm before he can touch it; this Is all from Shirou perspective he didn't knew Gil rarely if ever uses Ea,but he was not wrong in his assumption, in the novel Gilgamesh was more carefree about using Ea, he found Shirou enough of a bother to show him what a real weapon is, but only used the full power with Saber

[@charlestonho6733]

@@MrYoyoshi9 Deen does not highlight why UBW is anti gate of babylon

[@azizsaidy1135]

Do you plan on other Fate analysis videos?

[@BlueDrakma]

For now, I'm going to focus on branching out to other anime. But, when Heaven's Feel hits, definitely expect stuff about that.

[@azizsaidy1135]

RsGames1999 Alright then, nice analysis!

[@ThatWhiteHand]

To be honest, I sincerely feel that we would still be seeing DEEN fate adaptations if they didn't absolutely blow it with this movie.

[@orderofshadow]

I prefer the babylonia gil. He has more humane side than his ubw counterpart.

[@slyonemonsema2633]

It has the same saying of game logic never question it. It’s called anime logic and this is how they cut corners/save money and don’t make the movie so long on small nit picking things. It’s best to take it for what it is an move on that’s what I’ve come to realise after 25 years of watching anime an playing games.

[@Orochi97Jr]

Ufotable saved FATE. Change my mind.

[@sillysalad0]

yeah it saved it by completely butchering all the characters and the entirety of most of heavens feel

[@kimchirice3664]

But u can't say that DEEN's adaptation was bad at the time since it was really one of the only representations of fate in the anime industry no?

[@DaBroSquad]

The grail eating up Gilgamesh in the middle of the fight is from the vn

[@destroyercreater98]

Honestly Shirou using UBW in deen’s would’ve made more sense if it was at least implied or even said that while in UBW. It’s easier for him to trace and make stuff like Caliburn instead of outside it which would’ve been REALLY slim. Also cap on Gilgamesh not being as strong as EMIYA. He has B class strength, so he can sure as hell deck him across a field. Just doesn’t wanna dirty his fist with his blood.

[@r.k845]

Shirou gains the strength and skills of the users of the weapons. Gil isn't doing anything.

[@bholanathhembram7366]

Funny thing, I remember watching both the versions but I actually don't remember anything.

[@Jediahgames]

Not really a problem of wich studio is better, just wich one followed the novel more closely

[@UgandanPrinc3]

I wish you had mentioned Gilgamesh's hesitation to draw Ea too

[@BlueDrakma]

If I were breaking down the scene on the whole and not just comparing these two versions, I definitely would have. Next video is about Kirei and Kiritsugu, but after that I may do one about Gilgamesh and his relationships with other characters.

[@UgandanPrinc3]

RsGames1999 looking forward to it!

[@illumination_0109]

Well ever since UBW have no one noticed animation started to get better at a much quicker pace Ufotable should be credited for that without Ufotable the anime industry mightve remained complacent and refuse to up it animation game

[@ME_YA4P]

VN is still best. Like the aspect of UBW > GoB speedwise was not explained at at all, Gilgamesh not being able to just pull out something esoteric like Vimana is explainable since Shirou immediately closes in and the pressure Gil is under is explained better once you realize that with every exchange one of Gil's swords is permanently destroyed. Also, ufo's cop out with GIl at the end was eye-roll worthy, defying all previous convention on how RM work.

[@flamekirito151]

My friend you have NO idea how strong gilgamesh is. He IS stronger then any other servent,even in their own class. Only a few like solomon and merlin out-class him.

[@BlueDrakma]

im talkin arm-wrestle, my guy

[@somerandomdudeiguess6713]

The only thing that Deen made better is the shirou vs Gilgamesh fight

[@OgreDLink]

Nothing beats FF's Gilgamesh though.

[@aldonares3297]

Best thin about deen´s ver is the glorious german dub

[@RyoukenTheRyo]

Giggles the archer XD

[@yurineri2227]

So true

[@manyeown]

honestly though at least deen didnt kill precious illya 😔

[@aipserga5657]

um think of it this way in the ufotable version before ripping out illyas heart gilgamesh gives her some time to find comfort knowing that heracles is there but in the deen movie adaptation its just gil haphazardly ripping out her heart, im not saying ufotable justifies gils actions just saying that atleast in the ufotable ver gil let illya have some closure while deen didn’t

[@yarigold]

The thing is in the novel: - Shirou's UBW didn't suddenly dissapeared when he was out of mana, it was slowly starting to fade away from the horizon. - What blown away UBW completely was the aftershock of Excaliber - Shirou knows he was running out of mana and wasn't suprised by Excaliber aftershock blasting away his already dissapearing UBW. Instead he was fully determined to finish the fight with only kanshou and bakuya in his hand only to have the final blow to be cut of by the tainted grail trying to use Gilgamesh as a core. Altough the fight was alot better in the UBW anime than the Deen movie it still changed the ending, which was better in the novel.

[@BlueDrakma]

yarigold In what way was the ending different? I only ever read Heaven’s Feel, so the Fate and UBW routes in VN form are kinda unknown to me outside of the anime versions.

[@yarigold]

I just pointed out what was different in the VN. You see the thing is Saber firing her noble phantasm happened at the exact same time as Shirou was about to give Gilgamesh the final blow. (I believe the fight in the reality marble was told as a interlude or something) What's is very noticeable different was how thoughtfull Shirou was during this fight and even anticipated himself running out of mana (and even the backlash of Excaliber wiping away what was left of his reality marble), switching to kanshou and bakuya while being confident in capable of finishing Gilgamesh off not giving up his momentum and trying to give Gilgamesh the final blow. However at that moment the black taint came out from inside Gilgamesh body and the rest is pretty much the same.

[@Felicapo29]

The fight as a whole is different in every route…. you cant compare them

[@memyselfandi7634]

It's the same route tho...

[@chaosglitch3109]

Does it honestly need any Analysis?

[@hisoka6272]

"Gilgamesh is very clearly an archer class servant" 🤔🤔🤔

[@lucasmillerthelewderofloli9327]

Of course he is! Just look how many swords he has! It's obvious Archer class servants use swords! :P

[@badbeardbill9956]

@@lucasmillerthelewderofloli9327 I mean, Archer in F/SN UBW used a spiral sword as a freaking arrow...

[@Jason-si7ic]

I mean Unlimited Budget Works

[@ShadowShinobi2012]

I hope I don't sound like I'm stupid or don't know what I'm talking about, but to me, I think the movie does this fight much better, not just visually, but to me, it displays the arrogance of Gilgamesh much more. As stated, Gilgamesh is an Archer class Heroic Spirit. It is definitely within character for Gilgamesh to stay at ranged, but when you think about it, it makes more sense to not take Shirou seriously and combat him at close range, believing yourself so superior that fighting outside of your element against a lowly peasant is more than he deserved. Not only that, we are talking about the King of Heroes versus a High School kid...I mean, if I was a master Sniper and I'm challenged by a kid with next to no combat experience and I'm a cocky prick, then I'm going in with fisticuffs to prove how trash my opponent is. That's what I got from the movie, the anime definitely kept Gilgamesh in character and was more honest to who he'd actually fight, but doesn't scream to same level of arrogance to me. Plus, Gilgamesh's anger towards Shirou is justifiable because again, he's a King and Shirou is the equivalent to a peasant challenging him...that's a major insult. Again, I agree that Shirou barely surviving the flurry of swords in the anime is more realistic and better thought out. I also believe that the way he cut off Gilgamesh's arm was better animated in the anime, but I have a soft spot for the Movie version. The Holy Grail situation should've been explained MUCH better in the movie. I already agree that Gilgamesh should've used his Noble Phantasm to you know...FIRE THE SWORDS at Tousaka, but I still say this is part of his arrogance. It's almost like he's toying with him throwing the swords at him and Shirou is just blocking them, but it's not so much that he's blocking them because of his skill, but more because Gilgamesh is allowing him to and underestimating him the whole time. Him getting his arm cut off in both shows how foolish he was being and deserved the loss that he got...the seal disappearing in the movie is extra extra EXTRA dumb. Also, I have to say that Shirou's Unlimited Blade Works chant in the movie is much more epic and awesome than the TV show. While yes it would make more sense to say it in Japanese, it was said in a broken English style in basically every anime adaptation and sounds awesome. Now, I WILL say, that the anime's version of the chant is much better content wise. Also, the anime does a much better job explaining why he decided to use the reality marble, rather than just "Oh yeah, I can do a thing". Sorry if I'm all over the place but you made some amazingly good points, but I also disagree that Ufotable is hands down better than DEEN's but I can even admit that it's probably my personal bias.

[@imthrillz5255]

Honestly i dont think anyone is asking or wondering why Ufotable’s adaptation is better than Deen’s. Honestly the only thing from Deen that i liked was the Fate Route’s osts and ending

[@thetidelines-h5i]

One thing I still don't get is why Alaya or Gaia didn't intervene if the Grail threatened the world or humanity, I mean yeah EMIYA was there and he is a Counter Guardian but he was summoned there and not directly sent there by Alaya. w h a t i s t h i s ?

[@lordtouchme77]

they would sent an agent of counter force after the accident happen, after that they would considered it as a threat and send CG/powerfull creatured to eliminated the threat. thats why you always see burning building during archer's flashback of his job as CG.

[@hedgehoghibari]

only thing i like better about deen version is the music. ufotable soundtrack doesn;t even come close

[@ozysalt4831]

I prefer Deen the only thing that Ufotable did is good animation but thats all . The old faces are more lively for me and the music are masterpiece.