FFXIV Healer Strike! HUGE CONTROVERSY! [Dawntrail Media Tour]

Final Fantasy XIV Healers are going on strike! There is a huge social media movement of healers in FFXIV raising a significant amount of concerns over the Dawntrail changes and perhaps lack of changes and
If you enjoyed the video, don't forget to hit LIKE and leave a COMMENT down below. SUBSCRIBE for FFXIV gaming videos!
► Checkout Evyx.gg (My ad free website!) for more FFXIV content and guides!
evyx.gg
► Join the Evyx Gaming Discord:
/ discord
► Follow me on Twitter:
/ coleevyx​​
#ffxiv #ff14 #FFXIV #FF14 #FinalFantasyXIV #finalfantasy14 #finalfantasyxiv
#FFXIV #FF14 #FinalFantasyXIV
Timestamps:
0:00 FFXIV Healer Strike
0:11 Dawntrail Media Tour No healer Dungeon Clear
0:44 Dawntrail is meant to be more difficult content
1:29 I LOVE FFXIV AND I LOVE THE DEVELOPERS OF FFXIV
2:03 Dungeons without Healers
3:38 Lets be real about the main story questline
4:30 Hypocrisy in the request
6:30 Ultimate Raids Without A Healer
8:05 You cannot give players feedback
8:58 It would be easier with a healer
10:57 DPS and efficiency is vital
12:34 Damage is king
14:32 Healer damage kits need to be improved
17:24 This is very important
19:35 Normal moments shouldn't be boring
Now let's talk about the healer damage kits going into Dawntrail
:
the healer DPS kits definitely aren't balanced right now

[@ColeEvyx]

To be quite clear: I love healing in this game and it's my main role and I plan to take SCH/SGE/WHM/AST all up to 100 in Dawntrail and play them extensively. I do however just wish there was a bit more DPS kit for Scholar. Eg: Miasma 2 and multidotting. I am definitely not quitting healer. Just wish we had a bit more of a zesty/spicy normal outside of those funky awesome moments!

[@HotaruGlaive]

I think tone is a big thing with feedback. You'd have to show me the specific example of people giving feedback and someone popping off. I moved servers a couple times and finally paid to move back to Jenova because the people gave helpful advice in a nice way. When leveling they would sometimes ask if I had a certain ability and sometimes I wouldn't have completed the job quest for it (sorry, but I'm not jumping out of 30 min duty queue to run a job quest). I would tell them I had not and their response was just to tell me I should do it right after because of how good the ability was. Most "advice" I see in duties is "Healer use X". It's very impersonal while my example was more of a conversation which was nice. Also, one of the most toxic DC's for people giving advice was ironically Crystal. I guess they were RP-ing assholes? LOL I give advice and have never had anyone be offended.

[@PunkFiddler]

To me, it's not about the no healer runs but more of having the barest of bare fillers and close to 0 opportunity cost in our spells which isn't rewarding. It's so boring to spam 1 button and be other people's comfort person. I want to have fun. I am paying my sub to have fun. Shadowflare gcd, miasma 2.. even emergency and deployment tactics affecting biolysis.. it will greatly amplify my enjoyment with SCH

[@goodsherbear]

I'm an AST main, and I'm just tired at this point. I know the RNG was controversial, but I loved it because it gave me something to focus on during those slow times. Now its gone. I don't even need something zesty! Even a nice 1-2-3 combo like a tank has would be nice.

[@whitemageserenia]

I'm a healer main myself, and I'm inclined to disagree with "more dps buttons" being a "good direction to go" now granted, I know what you're saying and I do get it and understand, but we're also talking based on current experiences, it's entirely possible that expert roulette might "require" more GCD heals and maybe that's why we got more instant cast buttons (like Glare IV after Presence of Mind). Something to weave in between heals or something. As you said we don't really know what "endgame" Dawntrail is going to look like, I just wish as a healer I could feel more like... ya know... a HEALER. It's for that reason that I stopped caring so much about Savage raiding, and why I've never had >any< interest in Ultimates because I honestly don't care enough, or want, to optimize my damage above all else. Yeah, I DPS as much as I can, but I'm not going to QQ just because I had to cast a random Medica II or Cure II, or Cure III or w/e. Or even Eukrasian Diagnosis/Prognosis, or aspected Helios. Truthfully, I tend to have a bad habit of overhealing anyway but that's neither here nor there, that's a me thing. In short, I want to DPS >LESS< and Heal >MORE< as a healer. because show me where tanks want to tank less, show me where DPS want to DPS less.. you won't. So Why, as a healer, should I want to HEAL less? even from a design standpoint that makes no sense. Why is healer designed so poorly in XIV? Why is it designed for us to NOT WANT TO DO OUR JOB in favor of dpsdpsdpsdpsdpsdps? at that point, just get rid of healers in general and give every single job self-sustaining options. And/or make more RDM-esque jobs who can support heal. Know what I mean? So, I both agree and disagree with your stance on this topic, just figured I'd share my two cents as another healer main. Anyway have a nice day.

[@Keromimi]

What's so weird is look at Scholar in just 2.0. Bio II, Miasma, Bio, Energy Drain, Shadowflare (!), Aero, Ruin I & II, and Bane (!). Technically Cleric Stance though I imagine most people don't miss it beyond the rulebreaking aspect of it such as it giving old % based Lustrate a purpose and made Fairy feel like a cheater. It just feels insane that 50 levels later we have less than what we started with as far as attacks go.

[@Mabujold]

I've been saying for a while that if they want 90% of the healer's kit to be healing, then content needs to make you want to press those buttons. I love the "healers need to dps" mentality but when you only give 1-2 dps buttons to healers, it gets boring fast in anything but the very top 1% of content. The way I see it is they need to either make the dps part of healer more interesting and/or make healing more important in content. I'm not saying to make everything a challenge but we should have a middle ground somewhere.

[@astiagogo]

I totally agree that is insufficient for the purpose of fun and the healing skills are a case of "why do i even have this skill?" a lot of the time, but all the same (old same old...) DPS on a DPS jobs gets boring fast. Imagine the game with no mechanics making you run about to avoid shit: Now you have realised that FFXIV has the worlds most tiresome and samey combat ever. Oh but when they go to bed in the inn room...err...said someone to me once...

[@ovted129]

also the need to heal is so limited so the most of our kit is supposed to never be used. premade Healerless groups are common for roulettes and farming

[@elvangulley3210]

Can you cry babies go play wow and leave this game alone I'm so tired of you people

[@gilduinstevens7971]

i fully agree with this, both tanks and healers have way to many options compared to the old days of Strom Blood, now we have way more options for healing or mitigation. This results in content where a good amount of the time only 1 healers is actually doing anything even even in 4mans, a healer not even needed in the first place. Adding more dmg will only make healing more toxic than it needs to be. But making both healers and tanks use the all the buttons they have is the only way I see where u can make healing "fun" making u optimize not for dmg but for a risk of losing out of utility. Even to the point where using a gcd heal shouldn't be seen as negative.

[@kou7191]

There's this sort of double standard that the devs think of the healing role as too intimidating and thus they HAVE to be/stay accesible (ie, even a literal griefer can get the job done) but the same logic doesn't apply to either dps or even tanks.

[@Naexus01]

Been healing for years, 100% the damage kit is boring, but I'd argue the reason why healing is boring is because the content is not interesting to cast heals in. Queue up for a normal raid full of first timers where people are getting hit left right and centre and there's actually enjoyment to be had pressing gcd heals. The problems start when you get to savage where the incoming damage is predictable.

[@Mabujold]

yeah to me the only time that healing is interesting is like week 1 of content being dropped because people are not already overgeared and you might actually get to cast some GCD heals.

[@nefesha3972]

Yah its a big issue with how this games fights are very puzzle like. The randomness is almost completely removed. Damage taken is too low and defensive CD are too strong and to short of a CD. You always have something preparred to trivialize the mechanics damage while always having available CD's to top people off with no worry or risk before the next hit. Healing in low level dungeons with a sprout tank can be more stressful than savage becuase you lack options and have to pray they know what a defensive cd while chain pulling.

[@liquidsnake23]

It would be interesting to have an AOE that does a small amount of healing from the percentage from a dmg cast example blood sword in some games or brigette in OW. That way at least in a bigger party or raid (or in an easy pull) these other off healers can push out damage while giving a small heal to their respective parties.

[@nefesha3972]

@@liquidsnake23 I was hoping when they announced a new healer for Endwalker it could be a dps healer. Something like you build up stacks on a boss you explode into heals. Though I think what they did was better making it so their are two types of healers. I think they should do the same and make a tank better suited to self healing and main tanking and then having another better as a off tank and utility.

[@recaplrg3552]

Fully agree, in most other MMO's I played, a healer had no time to dps, it was just healing all the time without pause. Which tbh with almost no damage spells in final fantasy, that actually would be fun as healer. But most of the time a healer is doing damage. Its just boring with the damage kit that healers have. I would advocate for more damage income in general so that healers have more healing to do and less time to dps.

[@neon9152]

Where are these people that get upset in dungeons? Is it a different DC thing? Where I am most people just \o at the beginning and "GG" at the end.

[@SubduedRadical]

Same. I've even explained mechanics to newbies and rotations to some DPS Jobs (while I only main Tanks and Healers, I explained old SMN in SB or so to someone in a dungeon while also giving tips to the BRD and SCH while I was Tanking. No complaints, complements all around, got all 3 comms). I think a lot of people are being more...antagonistic...in their "advice" than they are letting on. that or they're saying things in a way where text doesn't convey well (like sarcasm).

[@phase269]

Lucky one, for me my friend got kicked by some Party's for wall to wall pulls, while I the healer are okay with it but the dps are not. I wish to find the so called nice and wholesome Community everyone is talking about. The weirdest party member I ever got was like "Ugh another Party that is not talking in chat." he leaves, like sorry for not reply immediately to an hi while the others play on Console where I can only guess if chatting is a pain, at least some console player told me it is. 🤔

[@Sniperbear13]

i think most people really just choose to silently leave if they are getting upset. a lot of the time people feel its not worth trying to tell people things. that said, i have had times way back when(when the Free Trial was only up to level 35), people getting upset at low DPS from some people in the party. they are rare though.

[@tcerathi]

it's people on the official forums being stupid, as per usual

[@user-mu1os7me8s]

I feel like this is mainly with more hardcore content in the game. Normal dungeons and raids have a lot more casual players like this.

[@Mabujold]

I guess one way to summ up how I feel as a healer main is that I would prefer if my gameplay was about trying to weave in as much damage as I can between my heal rather than trying to find ways to cast as few heals as possible....as a healer.

[@this_epic_name]

Exactly. Current approach to prog is to just dps and figure out where heals are required as you learn the fight. Would be great if that paradigm could be flipped on its head.

[@JeremyS.-ug3sp]

This. Whats the point of playing a healer if your doing everything in your power NOT to heal.....Its weird.

[@SubduedRadical]

I feel like that mentality is what has caused the present situation, though. It started with "Can I get in an extra damage GCD here?" "Can I afford the MP for a damage spell?" "Can I afford to go into Cleric now?" and that muted over a long time, like evolution from the first life forms over eons, into what we have now on the other end of that spectrum, "Can I use an oGCD here or rely on a party auto health regen tick here to get in ONE more damage spell?" "Can I forego AF heals so I can dump more Aetherflow into Energy Drain?"

[@this_epic_name]

@@SubduedRadical Thumbs up. "Can I forego AF heals so I can dump more Aetherflow into Energy Drain?" IMHO, the answer to that in savage raids should, by design, almost always be "no." :) But my current thinking keeps coming back to gear. If we all raided with minimum ilvl gear, the healing is a lot harder, right? (I've never really raided with minimum ilvl except for week 1, and my group is like a week 30 clear party). So for the bulk of players that don't clear week 1, could they somehow make gear ease the dps checks for bosses, but keep the healing requirements up?

[@gboyricky]

I’ve played some old mmos before I started 14 ten years ago and had found it odd that the more the game progress the less I had to heal but do more damage. I had been use to mmos where the damage was always constant and I couldn’t even dps because I had to stay healing.

[@vineveer4358]

Healer's only interesting when your party is bad at the game. (That includes learning the game to put it more nicely.) It would be nice to have a small dps kit rather than JUST 2 damage buttons.

[@ahrims7]

Yup exactly, when the party starts to be more steady- especially in endgame content; Healer is the only role that gets more boring as progging goes on.

[@zeehero7280]

As someone who plays healer in dungeons a LOT, I'd rather the dungeon go smoothly and not have to heal a ton than people being so bad. I don't mind when I get to heal for sprouts, always nice, but aside from that, no I dont prefer the team to be bad lol.

[@thechugg4372]

Honestly when I started this game I never understood why every class has some form of self heal, it really makes healer less useful and when everyone has a magical heal button it removes a lot of class identity...

[@DKarkarov]

Because the game is designed for all story content to be solod, other than maybe some trials? I bet they fixed that by now though. To facilitate this every class has some sort of self healing "just in case".

[@Sagasaurus]

Honestly, I'm in the minority. I want the healers to lean even deeper into the healer/support theme. Give me more ways to buff my party. Imagine a field where when you stand it everyone gets a damage buff (also keeps them near for aoe heals). Imagine instead of just an emergency shield, it comes equipped with a trait where when the shield break it does damage to the boss. Imagine a link buff where you link to a dps and if they're overhealed they get a damage increased based on the percentage of overheal. So on.

[@SubduedRadical]

I've said before there should be a GCD no-CD limited buffer healer for downtime. Like not saying this, but say WHM had Bravery (physical) and Faith (magical). GCDs, 2 second cast, low MP cost, boost target's physical/magical damage by 3%, 10 second duration. Then the downtime could be rolling those buffs across your party members instead of spamming one damage nuke. Or Chemist as a healing Job with a simple "rifle shot" basic attack, but "Vitality/Strength/Dexterity/Intellect/Mind Tincture" GCDs they could cast on party members in downtime to buff their damage. That'd be fun. I don't like damage rotations and I used to like "rolling HoTs" on people as a Resto Druid in WoW, so "rolling buffs" would be fun to me.

[@Sluppie]

Honestly I like this idea. What if in addition to my main DPS skill I also have a move puts a vulnerability debuff on the target? That might actually be fun.

[@ArchieGamez]

I like this idea too

[@this_epic_name]

@@SubduedRadical This, coupled with a fight design that variably had different members of the party (not tanks) taking big D damage at different points in the fight, would be fun indeed.

[@WVER-gc2fs]

This. We all want more job/role identity, and just thoughtlessly slapping on more DPS options is just gonna make that even worse (hello "Green DPS meme"). Let's get the enemy-counterpart version of mitigating damage. Let's make them more vulnerable! Let's inflict limited status effects! Let's give our DPS more oomf! And let's do more support! Damage is primarily the function of DPS. Let us beef that up! Let us beef up party damage and crit rates! Let us regen party mana! Let us lengthen DoTs a bit! Give us utility skills we can be strategic with!

[@nihalzeor8085]

Stormblood SCH: Bio, Miasma, Miasma2, Shadowflare, 4 differents "dots", and Bane to spread the first two of those Largesse critloquium was crazy, because there wasn't a difference between galvanize and catalize, also you could throw in an eye for an eye there I don't dislike the game, but SCH was a lot more engaging back then

[@hazardyoutube1121]

I stop being a sch main because of these changes I only sch in content now after I cleared it before or it's needed for un real party

[@LittleHobbit13]

I don't want a bunch of DoTs back for SCH. If we get more DPS, I want actual DPS, not "check in every 30s" DPS.

[@nihalzeor8085]

@@LittleHobbit13 it's still way more engaging than spamming broil nonstop that we had for the past 2 (3 probably) expansions :D Also, they had different durations, so it was more engaging than "click two buttons every 30 secs)

[@loomingdeath1758]

@@LittleHobbit13 if u want dps on healer go play Red Mage XD

[@anyakosta364]

I agree I started doing story in Stormblood on sch and it took me forever to fight 1 single mob all of the sudden everything has changed soo drastically....people won't understand unless they have played sch prior Stormblood 😢 Ast have changed also....sooo Omg....well ok I maybe old and don't wanna change my habits 😅 Yet I feel the healers are being changed not due to a fact to make them feel better...but due to a fact to adjust parties better to accommodate other players in parties and not the healers players We need to change it !!!

[@FlameHazeVT]

Got to love the "You don't pay my sub" argument. Neither do they pay the other people's sub to "allow" them to waste the other party member's time by not accepting feedback. That is if the feedback is warranted, like them doing a completely random mumbo jumbo rotation.

[@Chonicle2]

There's 2 sides to this coin, yes giving feed back is fine but from the experiences i see were people get feed back the person giving said feedback is acting like a Holier then thou asshat who thinks hes superior in every way, Most people dont mind help, but they dont want to be belittled and told exactly how to play,

[@clintmatthews3500]

Am I the only one not even paying attention to other people’s rotations? If stuff feels like it’s dying in a reasonable amount of time I really don’t care how.

[@Dogan_TM]

@@clintmatthews3500 Considering the entire point is the boss _isn't_ dying in a 'reasonable amount of time' because people don't learn how to play their job, I don't know why you would even comment that.

[@Izakix17]

Me a DRK main in the same dungeon: “please… H man…”

[@shizachan8421]

Tbh, as long as I live, I'd rather have the healer push dps, as this means I don'T have to use all of my mitigation for one single trash group and can actually spread them through the dungeon comfortably. A healer who does only heal makes tanking just so much harder.

[@BAMFZone95]

As a warrior main, healers aren't needed :) I also feel like I'm trolling if I play a darknight in a dungeon roulette. I don't know why they're made out of rice cakes.

[@OneTomato]

@@BAMFZone95well of course you gonna says healers are not needed when you are a warrior main, the class that have the most self healing

[@BAMFZone95]

@OneTomato of course! I did a no healer run like a year ago with 3 friends. But i come from WoW. I really do prefer healers fitting their role as a healer. I want them to need to heal and have engaging gameplay while doing it. Other than white mage. White mage should be the introduction/easy healer. But healers deciding to strike wouldn't affect me as a tank. Don't need em but I appreciate them. If I played dark knight, I'd feel back for any healer in my group. The other tanks are better for healers since they dont feel like they die immediately. And that's why I don't play as a dark knight. I like to make everyone else's job easier.

[@laurenlunamar4729]

Fun fact I was in a party of all heals and we cleared an ex it was very exciting

[@SubduedRadical]

I don't doubt this, but which one? I know Rubicante Ex was cleared with no tank, just 7 dps and a healer. A no tank/no DPS all healer clear would be cool to see. :D

[@laurenlunamar4729]

@@SubduedRadical um I believe ex MM from bozia I haven't attempted any SHB or EW content with all heals but might be something to try with ex hydelen

[@Zadamanim]

@@laurenlunamar4729 Dunno who MM from bozia is, but the Bozjan Southern Front is SHB content, and there's no extremes in there.

[@deelanmj]

@@Zadamanim MM is Memoria Miseria (the Varis trial). Can be unlocked by talking to the Wandering Dramaturge in Gangos.

[@Zadamanim]

@@deelanmj Oh I didn't realize you unlocked that in Gangos, interesting.

[@dillchillin]

don't worry if yall want to be useful in a dungeon run with a dark knight

[@whitemoonwolf13]

currently lvling drk. it is pain.

[@phase269]

The reason my tank friend played Drk xD

[@lootmaster1337]

yeh the only of my 4 tanks where i feel the need to wait on the healer to press some buttons. (although you can overgear a lot) Warrior it feels like 0 difference if the healer is there or not , gnb and paladin you just time your cd's correctly and its fine too.

[@JathraDH]

Or just pug dungeons on Crystal. You will have plenty to do. GNB is far worse than DRK BTW in terms of 0 skill play.

[@sligen]

Drk and GNB take big damage for most dungeons if they dont know how to manage mitigation. They struggle with big pulls and require massive healing.

[@abandonshipify]

Someone should know how to play by level 90, tens to hundreds of hours into the game. If they get stuck, to the point that trusts can't get them through, I... Don't know what to say at that point

[@recaplrg3552]

Completely agree, also without incentive to learn people won't learn. So if the dungeons stay easy af. And the normal fights are catered to the lowest tier player. There is no incentive to improve. Without that people will stay bad at the game. I don't know why anyone would want that.

[@SubduedRadical]

@@recaplrg3552 The alternative is you give them "incentive" and they don't learn. They quit, or worse, they keep playing just so terribly dungeons are now unclearable. Some people have posted their horror stories of leaving dungeons because they had such bad players the run was literally impossible to clear with them.

[@recaplrg3552]

@SubduedRadical I play the game since HW release with over 15k hours on the clock, and I never encountered such issues. I believe there are such people, but if they leave the game, you would not notice it on the player count, that I am sure of.

[@SubduedRadical]

@@recaplrg3552 The same is true of the people that want stuff to be harder, though.

[@Jcadd89]

​@@SubduedRadicalwhat's the percentage for that tho. I have played off and on for every expansion since arr release and I have never once not been able to clear story content due to a single person being bad. Iv has to work at it we had to learn together and actually communicate and have patience but it was never impossible.

[@MVimah]

It's the principle of the matter. Current tier content without a healer? And yoshi p telling healer mains to do ultimates? It's a slap in the face

[@FemboyDestroyer8008]

Honestly, it's amazing how in SE's desperation to make a role that caters to everyone, it ends up catering to no one. Healers that miss their old DPS rotations are mad, healers that would rather have more reasons to heal, the ones that would like a combination of both are mad, this design philosophy appeals to no one. Stormblood really was the best of both worlds, what with people no longer being punished by switching to cleric stance at an inopportune moment, dps rotations not consisting of monkey mashing your standard nuke and applying a dot every 30 seconds, and tanks/dps not being able to shit out copious amounts of heals/mitigation at a moment's notice. All of these changes since Shadowbringers just reeks of making things accessible for the sake of accessibility, regardless of how much it dumbs the game down and strips away any iota of fun that can be had.

[@SubduedRadical]

Eh, not really. A lot of people are happy or content with the present situation. There are a lot of types of healer player out there. I contend the best solution is to make the healer Jobs play differently, some more DPS focused (SGE?), some more healing focused (WHM?), some more buff focused (AST?), then let the players land where they may. And introduce optional (Hard) dungeons and roulettes again, some midcore content to bridge the gap between normal stuff and Extreme stuff. I played WHM in SB and ShB. SB WHM sucked. I'm so much happier with ShB/EW WHM, and we didn't lose any damage abilities, we traded Aero 3 for Misery.

[@erwark]

I think more interesting DPS rotations or harder healing would be fine. The issue is we have a big healing kit with nothing to use it on, so we fall back on the dull DPS mashing. Fixing *either* would be a huge improvement.

[@phase269]

@@SubduedRadical But SB Astro was better then ShB/EW Astro, but maybe Dawntrail Astro will be better then SB we will see, but yes Whm is better since ShB.

[@kou7191]

Let's be honest, the only people happy with the current healer designs are those that want to do only the absolute minimum effort and still get rewarded. Casual =/= lazy.

[@shizachan8421]

@@kou7191 Yeah. Healers right now are the easiest role in the entire game.

[@stumpernek]

Phlegma balls

[@redgeoblaze3752]

Pneuma nuts

[@AjaniGoldmaneFFXIV]

I just want to have dots man. I am a dot goblin.

[@JeremyS.-ug3sp]

I miss the way the old summoner and scholar worked. The dots were super fun.

[@SubduedRadical]

/pats SGE on the roof...of the head This baby can fit TWO DoTs!

[@elgatochurro]

You only need one dot :v

[@elgatochurro]

​@@JeremyS.-ug3spold scholar mains not complaining about having 6 dots for the 600,000th time challenge: IMPOSSIBLE

[@SubduedRadical]

@@elgatochurro The best part is...they never had 6 DoTs. Some people still talk about cross-classing Thunder 1, even though they could only do that in 2.0. It was literally removed in the first patch of the game, 2.1, yet people still try to act like it was a thing for most of the game. It's...so weird. Personally, I hate DoTs. I'm happy SGE is getting more DoTs for the people that like DoTs. They can play SGE while I'll play other stuff like WHM.

[@corbenikgaming7688]

Now I play every class pretty regularly so when I say this it's coming from a place of comparing them to how I play the role when I'm not and others I play with agree with my opinion on this but it doesn't help anything when 50%-60% of healers you get paired up with even at high levels suck at healing especially if the healer is playing Sage because the majority of them don't understand just how active of a healing class Sage really is. It's a healing class where you have to pre-heal and cast barriers, and keep them up and going because it's a barrier healer and it doesn't straight heal nearly as much as say WHM does.

[@razorxseraphim149]

Recently had a run in Holminster Switch where as a Red Mage, I had to Vercure and Verraise. We wiped twice on trash pulls because the healer(an Astro) wasn't actually healing at all. After the second wipe they stated "I can start healing". We didn't have a third wipe because I switched from focusing on DPSing to also healing. It's rare but sometimes, when you have a trash healer, you have to have a Red Mage step up and try to get the clear by healing.

[@pmmcgovern]

The most fun I've had healing recently was doing wall to wall pulls in a leveling roulette tam tara because I actually had to gcd heal due to lack of toolkit

[@SubduedRadical]

I've said for a while the quickest way to make healing more involved again is to gut or remove oGCDs. People get mad because they're used to weaving oGCDs between damage spells, but if you really are bored healing and want to have to engage with your healing kit more instead of your nuke spell...that's the fastest way to get there. Bonus points: It doesn't affect the casuals in their content since Jonny Casual Healer already heals with Cure and Medica spells.

[@Sluppie]

This. The mega pulls in dungeons almost always require at least some healing to get through them and honestly I kind of enjoy that.

[@Dogan_TM]

And by that you mean pressing one button.... focused on the tank. What a world of difference.

[@SubduedRadical]

@@Dogan_TM I mean, if you hate "nukespam" something that isn't nukespam, by definition, isn't nukespam.

[@pmmcgovern]

@@Dogan_TM I didn't say it was peak healer gameplay lol

[@KerimBZ]

A lot of points I agree with you, but I don't understand how you can talk about being warrior to have control over your own health pool and not face diving because a healer did not pay attention during a big pull, and then complain later on in the video that a paladin might be using clemency because they do not trust your healing.. The amount of times I saved the group from wiping during the mist dragon in the burn is insane... so yeah I'll keep using that when I deem fit...

[@mp9228]

I think another big problem is that failed mechanics either outright kill dps or it drops them in 2, 3 if they’re lucky. given how rapid some mechanics are, this doesn’t really give healers a fair chance to save their party members. on the other hand if you do all the mechanics correctly, you practically take zero damage outside of very predictable raid wides. as a tank I don’t know whether to use my party healing because it makes me look like I know what I’m doing as a tank or it makes my healers job that much more insufferable. I don’t think the proper response is to increase their dps kit because there is already a subset of players that don’t want to heal even when it is needed

[@Gekkoukitsune9]

So you wanna make the game easier lmfao 🤣 dude dps dying is on them learn to dodge. Second no thry dont need more dps they need understand what they are playing . They had dots and ect back then and cried and it was all removed so oh well suffer

[@mp9228]

@@Gekkoukitsune9 I never said anything like that. I’m saying that fixing healer requires a bigger redesign than simply giving a few abilities to some classes and taking them from others. turning them into a glorified dps doesn’t really fix anything other than make them slightly less boring in the content where those abilities are available. a 1-2 button rotation that becomes a 3-4 button rotation is still going to be boring if that’s what you are doing 95% of the time.

[@redgeoblaze3752]

@@mp9228 I'm inclined to agree with you for the most part. But to change the fundamental design philosophy for raids would essentially waste an expansion's raids trying to "get it right" at great risk of alienating new and old fans alike. P5S had a lot more healing required, and when my team wasn't optimal (almost like we're learning the fight) I would regularly just run out of mana, and we'd wipe because of that. Another issue is that all old fights in the game are going to stay the way they are now. If you fundamentally overhaul healers' damage kit, that makes older fights more fun by proxy.

[@Gekkoukitsune9]

@mp9228 and I'm saying no you wanna turn a healer into something that isn't a healer smh you had all that extra stuff and doing what you guys are doing now is how you lost it so again I hope it never changes and it stays like that smh I'm tired of yall banding together to morph a role

[@Gekkoukitsune9]

Also like I said it doesn't sound like you guys wanna healer maybe play anew role 🤔

[@Orih9]

As someone following along with the #FFXIVHealerStrike, the promise of 8.0 bringing a fresh take on job identity sounds like it could be a dream come true, but 8.0 is yet another 2.5 years away, and that, to me, really hit me in the gut, because I've already been waiting through Shadowbringers and Endwalker to see healers improve. I don't really want to wait that long, and I think there is more that could be done now for Dawntrail to make healing feel more fulfilling while we enjoy the story and new content, and hopefully wait for 8.0. Increasing the frequency of how often our other attacks can be used, for example, could go a long way to making our downtime a little more dynamic for 7.0. Thank you, @ColeEvyx for reporting on this!

[@leighg9o]

3 years. Games gunna take longer to do stuff with new graphics. Please look forward to delays lol

[@gmerc1333]

at this point anything they do would be too little too late

[@redgeoblaze3752]

Yeah, honestly that does give me hope. So long as they can actually pull through with it. As it stands, I might just take Dawntrail as they're presenting it and treat it like the beach episode filler arc. I'll get my favs to max, get some savage gear, and if I can't think of some other goal to do, I'll just log out and wait for a while. I still really enjoy the game of course, but since I started in Endwalker, I feel like I'm in a constant mad dash to get everything I want completed. It'll be nice to just experience an expansion as it's meant to be, and finally get to clearing out my backlog of games.

[@RichardRollington]

If you had a healer with ~8 core damage gcds (including aoe buttons) in a simple rotation and the rest of their kit are different ogcd heal tools with stacks, even if they did only 5% more dps than any of the other healers, it would be the most popular healer among raiders and casuals alike. Pressing 1 button on loop is not engaging gameplay when things are going right and for most content we already have more than enough tools, on top of gcd heals when we run out. Even if 8.0 adding a bunch of core damage gcds (not on a 40s cooldown or something) and have the capstone still be a new healing ability, I still don't think it would be enough.

[@Castersvarog]

It could be 1% more and it would still be the most popular by a huge margin

[@SubduedRadical]

Raiders not in prog, probably. Casuals, probably not. But I do think - and have advocated for this "4 Healers Model" - for several years now. Make a healer Job more DPS (use SGE with Kardia for heals, easy answer!), and it looks like they're tip-toe-ing in that direction.

[@ruta1133]

The assumption that casual or low skill healers would rather be dead on the floor watching the group clear a boss without them than having any pressure on them is, at best, ignorant and at worst demeaning and rude. They could have used the criteron solution here and just given everyone a single-use rez and change rez immunity to not wear off with actions. This would allow devs to have damage pack more of a punch, and allow healers a chance to recover despite skill level. Being rez'd to try again is a simple luxury guaranteed to all other roles except healers. I could say so much more but I'll just leave it at this: having trust issues doesn't give you a right to dunk on healers. Open your eyes. Everyone contributes to a wipe.

[@Kaimariification]

If it wasn't for the fact that they can't be used during a battle, then the Phoenix down drop would fit the object you seek. You can only have one in your inventory at a time (so you can store up to at least two if you put on in the Chocobo bag) and it would allow a player to be rezzed by someone who isn't a healer class. Players gain them from two different quests along with access to more from running PoTD.

[@Sonicboom1ish]

I think healers having access to such a large amount of super strong oGCD heals in conjunction with how infrequently damage tends to happen in most forms of content is where a lot of these issues stem from. their philosophy of dps spells being easily accessible for healers only makes sense imo when healing isn't easily accessible at the same time

[@thebrave9971]

There's not much they can do about adds in dungeons, mostly because the tanks are so imbalanced defensive wise that Dark Knights actually need a healer, while warrior never needs a healer with adds, what they can do is boost the damage of bosses, as the mit of all the tanks is somewhat equivalent in a boss situation compared to fighting 18 mobs at once (looking at you Bloodwhetting)

[@lagtastic7511]

They could easily cause the mobs to do more aoe attacks, or randomly apply debuffs that need to be dealt with. That way the tanks aren't the only source of required healing. Which is the biggest issue in 14 dungeons at max level. The worst part is they use to do this

[@MasterNix]

I remember when I got kicked from dungeon, when I was trying to teach Red Mage that was randomly casting everything (priority on long casts) and they said to me "we dont need your speedrun tactics"

[@MymmikCosplay]

Sad when you try to give someone real advice and they just plug their ears Especially considering the whole point of rdm kit is to implement to quick casting shortcuts to fill your meter for your burst. It purposefully punishes you a bit for skipping the cast shortening spells. It’s not a speed run tactic when it’s the core of the kit lol so silly

[@MasterNix]

@@MymmikCosplay aye. There are some people that believe its easier to stack one element completely and then more to the next one, even though there is penalty for doing that...

[@kennethlandis6291]

I think the primary concern with healing balancing is that the better your group is, the less healing you have to do, which makes "healing" feel less valuable. It's true in all MMO's, it's just more prevalent in this one because it's designed so casually so even most mistakes aren't harshly punished outside of the hardest content...so the healer rarely should struggle to top people off if they aren't intentionally standing in fire.

[@kennethlandis6291]

The flip side of this is the immediate one shot for not doing the mechanic...it's rarely just big damage...either it's trivial or the person dies and you don't heal that lol.

[@this_epic_name]

@@kennethlandis6291 Yes, and I really hate that aspect of the upper-tier raids: all 8 people do it exactly right or it's a wipe. Period. It's either that or there isn't enough damage to necessitate GCD healing (at least when you're geared up, which might actually be the cause of the design "problem" we're all discussing. How do you make it so GCD healing is necessary when you're not overgeared, but also keep it necessary when you *are* overgeared? I'm thinking that, in savage raids at least, my main issue is that my group isn't clearing fights before we're all geared to the teeth, and gearing up might be the very thing that makes GCD healing unnecessary.)

[@lolalolalola1231412]

Where I noticed it was wrong, was whenever I HAD to cast a gcd heal over a dps spell and felt bad in raid.

[@BeastFenris]

I hate to be that person but, a healer strike is literally pointless with the existance of the Trust System....Not that some of these things AREN'T concerns but, maybe think of some other way to "stick it to the man" that DOESN'T have a work around for it? And that DOESN'T involve DDoS attacks?

[@jmjannise]

Healer strike locks down trials.

[@alexthebasilisk]

@@jmjannise until peeps beat trials w/o healers lol

[@thomascranor2668]

​@alexthebasilisk That's kind of the point. SE will be in a bit of a bind if that starts happening. Everyone will be able to see just how broken the system is and the team will have to address it.

[@Crystan]

@@jmjannise 90% of players use the duty finder to queue for trials. They don't bother forming groups. I'd argue a healthy portion of those are still going to be healers. These 'strikes' are only good on paper. There's too many casual players who just don't care and will queue up on WHM/SCH/SGE/AST anyway.

[@jmjannise]

@@Crystan I understand what you're saying, but if Zodiark is any indication enough players could stall out and get SE attention. I did Zodiark day 2 of early release and 2 of my group had to change to healer because people just filling roles were struggling. Not saying its perfect, but showing SE it's a problem makes the game better.

[@klabence]

Regarding it needs to be easy for story players, they could easily make the story content be the duty support dungeon, and you unlock the 'hard' version of the dungeon after that.

[@lukahcasshe6197]

Or just overtune Trusts so if you can't clear it with people and just want to do the story, you can get an easy ride with NPC support.

[@talancorwell]

If tanks and healers were balanced equally, then it would be possible to do content with 0-1 tank as well. The fact that no one does shows that tanks can do healers' job, but not vice versa. That's not balance.

[@SubduedRadical]

It is. On content there have been 1 tank and 0 tank clears of things. Rubicante Ex was cleared with no tanks (7dps/1healer) on content/patch. HydEx was routinely cleared with 1 tank on content/on patch. Just as no 1HP Doom mechanics make Healers required, Tankbusters/swaps make Tanks required. Without them, people could clear without tanks all the time. HydEx has no tank swap, so it wass cleared solo tank on patch. Rubicante might have had a buster, but his autos were so weak (and he stopped them for long periods when preping/casting mechanics) that the DPS "tank" could just be raised and #2 agro take over. And due to the higher damage, they cleared before the big damage combo at the end.

[@userbunny14]

I've done lots of things with no tank. I'm a regular reaper/mch tank. Not intentionally... the tank dies and I'm next on the list... and the tank even after res somehow doesn't get aggro back even with stance on and wont provoke. :D WOO! Fun. Even did a couple dungeon with 3dps and a healer in EW.

[@talancorwell]

@@SubduedRadical Fair point. I'd argue though that those aren't equivalent to savage/ultimate, so it's still not quite equally balanced

[@alexthebasilisk]

@@userbunny14 accidentally did an MSQ roulette with 4 DPS, that was fun! :) For the record, we made the BLM tank.

[@oonue]

Can I use Esuna again?

[@marchabel8880]

And another thing…back in the day Whm, Sch, and Ast had their own unique versions of esuna. Idr the name of Ast’s, but Sch had leeches and Whm had esuna. This feature was removed because “we dont want to confuse people with it”. Okay then please explain to me the reasoning this is okay for ranged phys and their party mit…

[@N620AA]

Honestly, I've been doing catch-up for Dawntrail, I quit after I finished .0 Endwalker... and when you do some of the normal mode 8-mans required for MSQ, you kind of realize... this "healing is too easy" take has to come from someone so used to running with competent people that they no longer remember how this content feels when you have people actually making mistakes and requiring aggressive healing. Try doing Zeromus NM with with a bunch of first-timers learning the mechanics. It's vuln stack galore, combat rezzing all over... It's -rough-. Then you have statics and high-end stuff, where damage is too predictable, healing is tactical at best... I think the root cause of the problem is that entirely too much damage is avoidable, but horrible if it isn't avoided. No in-between. That is what needs to be fixed IMO, and if it was done right, it'd probably imply nerfing MSQ 8-mans, and greatly shifting the design philosophy on endgame content.

[@jaquanepatterson2537]

Can’t they just make a different roulette that scales current expac leveling and endgame dungeons to be harder so there’s more variety and difficulty without hurting current standings?

[@insentia8424]

0:44 onwards: Also, changing fight design philosophy + job changes at the same time would mean you are changing two variables at the same time: Pinpointing which wasn't tuned properly becomes a nightmare for the balancing team at that point.

[@WarGiver]

Before I start I want to open with this: People have enough Healing anxiety as it stands and it turns people away from the role; a role that often has instant queues or at most less then 5 minutes most of the time. Often times DPS needs to wait for 10 to 30 minutes for the very same queues. Making the role have more damage buttons will make this worse not better, this will turn people away from playing healer. Giving the Healers an AOE DoT and/or single target DoT should be the limit of added buttons. Yes healers are expected to DPS too, but that is completely irrelevant if you need to spend 30 minutes in Duty/Party finder before you get even one healer to run everything because so many people fear the role. This gets worse when elitist players push people away from learning healing by being toxic when they try and the healer's damage output is too low. --- Alright I waited a few days for me to think on what you are saying, but the issue is that there are in essence three tiers of play, "Leveling/Learning" / "Expert/Extremes" / "Savage/Ultimates" If you modify healers to tune them to be more interesting and have more output at one end, such as Extremes, then you will add a barrier of entry for learning, and it WILL be a barrier, even if a small one, there are not enough healers at this moment as it is. I do get what you are saying but while making healing interesting is a good goal, a great goal. The problem is not the existing healers (and players), especially extreme level ones, the problem is with leveling/learning. I tested this, and let me tell you, I have encountered EXTREMELY toxic players doing leveling roulette for a healer who is new and still learning doing ARR/HW content just not knowing what their AOE button is, and just to remind people, it does not appear until Level 46. Imagine if people have more reasons to be toxic about then a healer doing the wrong one of two attacks. On the "Ultimate" end if a healer needs to interrupt their DPS to do heals or raises it could affect the entire party with more damage loss. Think of it in this context, if a Healer is about 1/3 the damage of a DPS and we have a DPS who is dead with now two stacks of weakness, meaning they do half the damage they normally do, would it be worth it to stop the healer mid combo to raise them? This gets worse on if the new actions add more potential DPS. As it stands healers do about 1/3 the damage of a DPS and a tank about 2/3. (this was mentioned a few years back in a PLL I watched but cannot recall which one) this is the general target, exact numbers are irrelevant since specific DPS jobs do range quite a bit. Given most content is tuned around this then the Healer's output would need to stick to the 1/3 range or one of two alternatives, Tanks output less damage, or dungeons get harder. If a healer's DPS is to remain at its current output then to offset it existing options would need to be nerfed, if healers were doing damage more on par with tanks then fights would need to be tuned slightly up or DPS themselves slightly down. Alternatively the new options would need to be relatively pointless. If too many people are needing extra healing for whatever reason or being raised, we don't want the over all damage to be lost to be worse then it already is. Let me tell you a story, When EW dropped I grabbed Sage, I was sorting my hot bar and queued into a leveling roulette (I wanted a test I felt I could handle, something low difficulty and a place that would be safe), because of the moment I was pulled in my AOE damage button was not on the bar (It was on my mouse being moved). It would have taken a few seconds to correct this but I was vote kicked mid first trash pack because I was healing and single target DPSing rather then AOE damaging. As I also run as SMN a lot I have seen people try this more then a few times at the start of EW for others. I will grant this disappeared six months later but it solidified my stance that adding more damage tools will just make things far more toxic. The fact is that As healers we are the team babysitters, if everyone is doing all their damage reductions, and personal sustain our need should be minimal in most normal content. (Wall to wall pulling aside.) However, let us be honest, most people forget to use Addle and Feint, much less time it right rather then just use it on CD. Healers currently sit in the position that we need to make up for worst case for both Tanks and DPS not getting things correct. The fact that TOP was cleared with no healer is impressive, don't get me wrong, and while I do feel that there should be things to make such harder we really do not want fewer healers then we have.

[@BM03]

I gotta admire the irony of healers constantly asking for more ways to do DPS. And this proves it, apparently? Not to make healing relevant, but to effectively be a party of a tank and three DPS... But one of them has a faster queue? Guys, getting a better DPS rotation on HEALER is not the solution. Making HEALING engaging should be.

[@Gegarace]

The legit arguement on TOP clear without healers would be, if there's no DPS would we clear it or if there's no Tanks would we clear it, is it possible tho? So this turn healers into "optional" while Tanks and DPS still manditory. Yes, you are correct if square enix pick this route, Healers do need more DPS kits.

[@Orih9]

That argument is a bit misleading. The concern isn't really, "Top was cleared without healers, therefore it's optimal and healers have no value in hard content." Earlier during EW, Yoshi P responded to a question about the lack of DPS variety and the lack of healing necessity for healers, and Yoshi P suggested that if healers want to feel more engaged they should play ultimate. But if ultimate's healing requirements can be met, even sub-optimally by a Paladin and Red Mage casting Clemency/Vercure, how exactly is that content meant to better engage healers who can otherwise heal circles around Paladin and Red Mage? Other than the mechanics themselves, Ultimate doesn't really push healing specifically to the test, not in a way that offsets the main concern being how much time healers spend spamming their Broil/Glare/etc. That's what that comment is really about.

[@eolendes6432]

You can't clear content without dps. There is a strict system in place to ensure fights are cleared within a time limit: Enrage timers. Healers have been designed to have a lower cap on their DPS. They will never output as much DPS as a proper DPS (Which is normal ofc) but as it turns out the healing capacity of healers is not necessary in most fights.

[@OriginalRockCandy]

I don't think more dps buttons would help personally. Reason being that no matter how many dps skills a healer has, it still wouldn't solve the problem of content being beatable without healers. Content where healing is required is what would help healers feel more important. So increasing the reason to press those healing buttons is probably for the best imo

[@AzureMerlin]

You can't clear TOP without DPS or Tanks no, because the damage tanks have to deal with like TBs would instantly wipe healers or DPS. And without DPS, you will 100% hit the enrage timer and get wiped before getting even close.

[@Orih9]

@@OriginalRockCandy It isn't just about tank and DPS sustain getting stronger every expansion. Healers being stuck spamming Broil or Malefic or whichever spell is also an issue. And it's not necessarily about quantity. For example, if instead of being locked away behind a 2 minute cooldown, Baneful Impaction was a DOT you could cast at any time with a much shorter duration, like 12 or 15 seconds, that one singular attack would be considerably more well-received, because it would actually feel like a new part of your gameplay.

[@coffeebundeluxe163]

I think a good summary of my opinion about the omega protocol is that yes healers ARE needed. Challenge Runs like 'no healer omega protocol' should not be considered when you raise the question because that's an insanely optimized challenge run, not average gameplay. While it is POSSIBLE it should by no means be considered as a standard.

[@misterbxiv]

For the top clear you’re forgetting the extra tank mit and heals, that basically make up for healer ogcd’s

[@haroldestrada7649]

Honestly the "we have to make sure that people who are only interested in RP or whatever" never really made any sense to me. If people get madge about this opinion, feel free to call me a gatekeeper but I honestly think that if someone's doing lvl 91-100 content they should be fully aware of how to play their class. Not hardcore gold parse level god gamers, but the ability to properly do their class's main rotation, understand what common markers are and what they indicate, and whatnot. If someone refuses to learn how to play the game, that should be a roadblock for them. "Oh, but what if they story and job level skipped": then they shouldn't've done that, or at the very least they should have sat there and hit a dummy for a while to get their rotation down and watched any one of the billion combat basics guides to figure out what the markers do. "But what if they're only interested in RP or non combat stuff?": Then why are they in this combat duty? "But what if they're just here for the story?": The story involves combat, if they're interested in a story about involving combat from a character they control they'd better be ready to lean how that combat works. "But they have to go into those duties to get glamours": Glamours are earned via PVE combat or PVP content in some rare cases, if they're not interested in learning how to obtain their glamours, they don't get them. Base point is that this is a PVE combat MMO at it's very core (with some other non combat or pvp side content). If people don't want to play the game....... then they shouldn't play the game. There's a reason you can't prog MSQ as culinarian. Try justifying to your lvl 99 dungeon party that you don't have a job stone because you roleplay as arcanist I dare you. A base level of competence should be able to be expected this late into the game (sastasha, arr dungeons, whatever, that's the noob zone, they can do whatever), and IMO SE catering to the lowest common denominator makes anyone looking to do higher end stuff cringe any time they queue in for expert. Add onto that TOP being cleared without healers, people doing two hour runs of time loop dsr, no healer savages..... yeah, is it realistic that anyone will be able to just pick it up and do that? no. However it's not indicative of good things for the health of the game as a whole that those things are even possible in the first place.

[@Vokcas]

On the flip side, I have ran combat dungeons where Raiders have no idea how to use a class, healers have no idea what they kit does beside from Glare or Holy and tanks who don't know what a cooldown is. If anything these type of players I encounter more then Rper's. I have never encountered a RPer who didn't have a job stone after Sunken City, heck the argument of the job stone is irrelevant due to most likely the RPer is running a vfx mod.

[@Dino-te5rt]

honestly, i agree. they need to not appeal to the lowest common denominator. all it does is bring everyone enjoyment down with the game down as they need to baby proof the game for them(to the healer's dismay). it also wastes people time in pve combat like dungeons, trials, etc as they make them take more time and people in working class might not have that much time to waste in content. overall one of the things they could do is add enrage back into normal content. this will at least make a standard skill level for the player base. to anyone saying this is gatekeeping and toxic, it more toxic to go into team based game not knowing how to play game at a basic level expecting to get carry through.

[@haroldestrada7649]

@@Vokcas conjurer in puppet's bunker on three separate occasions, arcanist in ktisis, thaumaturge in the vault, and that's just what comes to mind right now. It happens..... frequently. As for those combat dungeons. Assuming that your report is accurate, was the party able to clear in a timely manner in that state? If so, I view that as a problem, if someone doesn't know how to use their class the dungeons should be a roadblock that requires learning to overcome. I never claimed that Raiders were gods >.>

[@lifeiaskedfor]

i mean, you should know how to do your basic rotation...in content where is matters, dungeons don't matter. If you're as passionate as this then where were during Abyssos? healers where no where to be seen the minute healing actually got hard, the min you actually had to care about mit and actually heal instead of sitting there pressing glared 24 fucking times over the course of 2 mins. No i don't think dungeon content needs to be harder when people can barely learn how to heal in the first place, the fact that healers are always chatting each other in normal and savage content, quite frankly idc if the healer check is harder when the healers don't even wanna do their job in the first place and the minute it easy they all change to being a tank cause "oh heal is so scawy" like please don't argue for something you know nothing about. You're argument about top rings prety shallow when you realize that the "no healer" run requires alot and i do mean ALOT of specifics to even work, it required alot of healing from no non healer classes and squeeze out even small amount of healing from every job in there. TOP can be completed with no healers but it's not something just anyone can do it requires alot of work and planning, you window gazers need to stop dooming about TOP like it's something people in PF is commonly doing it and praise the feat that it took to even pull off such a challenge.

[@kataku8609]

You know what is funny, Nier Automata has a good story. You can watch it on KZbin through a lets player OR learn the combat and go through it yourself. More funnier than that, in all other games with a story that have a combat, you have to go through the hard combat to get the story. Even DARK SOULS has a story! AND PEOPLE PLAY THROUGH THE COMBAT TO GET THAT STORY!!!!

[@Salence]

Clearing TOP without a healer is like doing an Ultimate, while also doing an Ultimate. It's Ultimate squared

[@HippeusOmega]

Oh i know from perspnal xp trying to give feedback to healers struggling as i main it. Had my head bit off by the tank when i was giving the healer some advice on cleansing doom with esuna. Now i dont even say anything or ill just leave the duty if it looks like were not going to clear it.

[@Dogan_TM]

"Blocking" players who refuse to learn how to play the game is _entirely_ reasonable to me. I have no idea why that SHOULDN'T be okay. What game has anyone EVER played that has allowed them to coast through the entire way without learning a single thing throughout their entire time of playing it-especially one that has them cooperating with others? How is FFXIV the sole exception to this? Why would FFXIV the sole exception to this? Since WHEN did FFXIV become the sole exception to this...?

[@TheFrantic5]

One of my guildies said in response "If you're bored while healing, you need to pug more."

[@shawnscouten5184]

If a job is only interesting when people are actively messing up, it’s not a good job.

[@Jinxyoutoheaven]

@@shawnscouten5184as a healer you are correct.

[@eolendes6432]

"Oh no this guy is consistently messing up better throw shields on him." He does't get hit and the shields go away. Or he dies to 1 shot mechanics. Or he still survives everything without the shield.

[@RaddyC]

Healing should be fun in all content, not just doing savage prog with shitters

[@RED_Theory038]

Then what is the solution if you people refuse to run pugs? Because that's almost all my PvE gameplay and I'm not seeing this lack of need for healers and frankly it sounds kind of out of touch to me.

[@cutejustice]

If the dungeons in DT are the same casual mess right now where you can take 1 WAR 3 DPS then there’s virtually no need for healers. The dps can rez, the warriors can heal, what are healers for? Either they give healers some ability to eat a tank buster and a fleshed out dps rotation, or the obvious option: have the trash mobs hit harder in dungeons and make trials a bit more heal heavy. 🙄

[@AdamKafei]

I really think healerless TOP should have set off every balance alarm at the studio. Even in random groups, when I get a WAR tank I just don't bother healing, if I have to think about healing them then something is very wrong. THAT is very wrong - or it should be at least - and that the other tanks seem to be going the same way? That's sad. I have joked about them making an April Fools day patch where everything that isn't WAR is just removed because it's that stupid and it simultaneously drives me up the wall and makes me wonder why healers exist, hell, why DO healers exist right now? What do we do in 90% of duties? I see a lot of "Give healers more dps buttons" but that doesn't fix the problem, it puts a plaster on it. If people wanna play dps they should play dps, not turn healers into dps. The only way this problem gets fixed is to make healers HEALERS, they have to create conditions where healing is needed. Am I gonna join this strike? Probably not, but I also don't know if I can bring myself to keep playing my prefered classes if the devs are just gonna make them increasingly pointless.

[@meteorwalkergg]

@8:08 1) you CAN give SOLICITED feedback. you (rightfully) CAN'T give UNSOLICITED feedback, correct. 2) You "can't" give people unsolicited advice irl, either. What's your point? Why would it be considered any less rude & arrogant in-game than irl? You're both strangers who don't know each other like that. Carry yourself with a basic vibe of general respect & build rapport, first People who actually want advice will seek it out. "Don't give unsolicited critique" is a really easy rule to follow, whether you agree with the rule or not People WILL ask for help & advice & even critique... when you actually let them cook, first

[@noahwagoner7650]

You absolutely can block players with difficulty after six expansions. If you are in dawntrail you have played over 400 hours. its okay to promote skill not settle to the lowest common denominator. In stormblood we got stuck on Shinryu for 9 wipes and almost disbanded. its the most memorable experience in the game thus far for me so lets not kid ourselves.

[@SubduedRadical]

"Let's have people follow our game loyally for 10 years. Now we're going to block them out of content so they quit!" Said no successfully gaming company ever.

[@elgatochurro]

Game doesn't really teach you gcd and ogcd though, among other things

[@noahwagoner7650]

@SubduedRadical how is a difficult dungeon or fight that would require you spending time to gear up for to complete or progress through "blocking" its called difficulty

[@noahwagoner7650]

@@SubduedRadical this is a bad take im afraid.

[@rickmel09]

@@noahwagoner7650 ask the wildstar devs if that worked out for them :)

[@mahrze]

Been playing this game since 2.1 when the PS4 beta came out. One thing that convinced me of healing was a SCH in Dzemael Darkhold as I was leveling a DPS, this SCH was micromanaging his damage while keeping everyone alive. Was so impressive I decided to learn how to play SCH and it felt glorious to mimic a fraction of what he was doing. I ranted at a friend when they gutted healers in Shadowbringers and was very upset about how they butchered SCH, only to see some of the old SCH stuff given a new coat of paint and call it SGE. I get some new players don't know some of these things. I also feel the devs are basically putting on their heads a "sprout leaf" when making these changes after making jobs and adjustments that contradict their prev stances. Like stuff that reduces CD timers only to now add one again. Their tank approach is a bit contradictory too, because they put all the responsibility of aggro on tanks but if you dir in a W2W, you have no way of recovering. Their dashes are all over the place and may as well made the (now) 40% mit just be a generic skill like rampart and tack on the unique buff. There's a lot of things they really need to comb over and check to make things more cohesive and healers being put on the back burner is just a big smh moment. I'd rather them stop the new jobs and just really clean up the kits properly before adding more recycled archetypes. Sorry for the rant, just feels dumb to see them gut one role, mishandling another and then wonder "why are people angry?"

[@SubduedRadical]

Keep in mind, they didn't gut healers in ShB. They gutted SCH. AST lost a lot of card effects, but its damage kit was mostly the same. WHM traded Aero 3 for Lilies and Misery and NOT SUCKING (SB WHM was the worst iteration of WHM in the entire game). SCH was a downgrade, AST was as well in a different way, but WHM going from SB to ShB (and to post-6.1 EW) was an upgrade.

[@zaphyy]

I'm a healer main but won't be healing in DT unless my friends want me to run something or if I get an itch to get in PF again. It's just not fun anymore. I was slightly hopeful for some good changes during the Media Tour but nothing is going to make me want to main healer any more. It's a shame because I love the lore and aesthetic of Sage as someone who is in the field of medicine but the gameplay unfortunately has gotten stale quickly.

[@DizzyQuanto]

I feel like healers have so much potential to be a solid sub-dps, and could even possibly replace DPS or at least feel as fun as DPS if they were given the opportunity to have better rotations.

[@DerioTheArtist]

The leveling dungeons require trusts to be there so the mechanics and damage can’t be high. Since all dungeons are now linked to the MSQ all experts going forward won’t require a healer

[@LightDefender1]

I can see a middle ground here. Have the base dungeon be for trusts and a harder version for players. Make a dungeon hard variant and have it be hard and throw healer checks everywhere, really make those fuckers sweat.

[@SubduedRadical]

@@LightDefender1 Honestly, they should just add (Hard) dungeons again and make them a separate roulette. Two dungeons per patch!

[@TheAuron32]

@@SubduedRadical yes, i really miss that, going back later to see whats changed was a cool thing, added a bit of local lore and what not.

[@Dogan_TM]

@@LightDefender1 y'see, that'd require effort.

[@AustinParkerKillulotz14]

As a healer main myself. (Whm here) i find it unbearably annoying when is see Warrior a Tank of anykind soloing instances of any level i dont care what it is. Let put up a couple examples of what i see. Team dies except the tank: there is 10-15% or more of the bosses HP left that tank SHOULD NEVER be able to sustain for that long or have the damage needed to complete the fight. Team dies except Tank: and there is lest than 10% of the bosses HP and the Tank is a giga chad that evades all the attacks or does the mechanics right. MAYBE then and only then would i say ok fair enough to held your own lets move on. There arnt enough DPS checks in these fights and if there are they are way to low. The mechanics for average content do not push anyone to develop braincells. Being a healer main almost exclusive make my brain go soft from the simplicity i fall asleep i nod off. People die and it doesn't matter i die it doesn't matter. Tanks have been given mainly Warrior if im speaking from the heart here. but tanks broadly speaking have been given to much mitigation and self healing. Whats tanky look like? In my 30 years of gaming experience tanking typically is shown off with lots and lots of HP. the pool gets bigger butt the durability of that pool is largely the same as anyone else outside a few skills and armor builds the expectation to that pool is the intervention of a support/healer. A tank takes the hits and keep the bosses attention. The healer makes sure he can keep doing that. While DPS does damage and does mechanics to avoid getting smushed into the dirt. How hard is that to understand. I would even test to say going as far as making Tanks CDs to have diminishing returns you cant stack 8 CD with out the last 6 being basically useless. Now im not tank specialist i dont know the math on tank skills and how they actually work but this is broken and should never be the case. someone needs to make healers matter again or at least so they cant be ignored outright.

[@ReaverBharash]

I’d like to see the self healing on a DRK. Soul Eater doesn’t cut it and the self healing from Living Dead doesn’t count. That aside, WAR is undoubtedly the strongest tank, period. Just because you see people clearing content either fully solo, or finishing something off when everyone else is dead doesn’t mean that applies to every tank either. I’ve seen some rather questionable tanks struggle to use their kits at all. But hell, the easiest thing they could do about tank invulns is make the tank busters eat through the invulns, so we would have to find a different use for them. Tank busters are just invuln one then blow CD load on the other. They could even give us more tank busters to spread the CDs out more so we have to use less at one time.

[@CanisMythson]

This is why I swapped to maining DRK. I don't have the tools to do those things, so I end up wiping with the party and everyone gets to play.

[@phase269]

As a main healer I love to play all 4 of them and love to do damage, but it would be nice if I had to heal more then what is right now. I don't need to heal 100% if the time but right now I maybe heal like 1-5% depends on how confident is the party in dodging. I play Astro as my main, like all healers I now overhealing is not a wanted thing, so I try to let my group drop but everytime I got an pld or rdm even an smn they will use their healing by 90% health, that is when I ask myself why do others then Healer got healing? Like when my job is not to heal because they can do it, then why do I don't get more damage spells and potency. If the Tank is a War I feel like a wasted spot, like every dps would be better then my green class because the damage will be higher, yes a healer will do good damage too but compared to the red ones with a Warrior 3 dps will do more then every healer(if you now your job well). I know Warrior only can heal himself with 56 or so but I wish at this point to just switch my role inside the dungeon. I like Warrior but I really don't know if a non healer class should be able to survive Solo. Everytime I got an Drk or Gunny I am the happiest person. I love ffxiv and their system but imo the Term of healer, at least in normal content, is losing its purpose maybe I am wrong but it feels for me like that. Tbh I rarely use spells like Macrocosmos because there is no healing needed and the Potency is so low for the cd of 180 like come on yes the Astro is a support class but 250 potency Fall Malefic is dealing the same damage at least I weave it. But those are just my thoughts, everyone as they wish 😁

[@melaniebiberger2191]

Healer strike 🤦want more challenge as healer and then they probably cant even do limit cut

[@igorbosso4541]

Healing in FFXIV is straight up boring nowadays. The "Healers must do damage" concept sounds cool at first, but then you realize that it comes down to spamming a single button 80% of the fight while keeping a DoT up and using OGCD healing for the most part. I don't like to compare, but healing in WoW is so much more interesting. You have healing-specific mechanics, mana management, and above all, you have to heal. This is your primary focus, your priority. After that, you can think of pulling some damage here and there, things do damage, all th time. I don't play a single job/role in FFXIV; I always go for something new each patch. After Shadowbringers, I don't feel like healing anymore. I would play anything but healer. The role is in a really bad state right now, at least in my opinion.

[@eolendes6432]

Healers heal in wow and yet their damage kits are much more interesting. Of course people loathe having to deal damage with healers in FFXIV, nukespamming is horrid and that's why healers want to recover their damage kits fron earlier expansions.

[@The_Yukki]

@@eolendes6432 I wouldn't call 1 extra button much more interesting. Druid either keeps 2 dots and casts one of 2 spells, or keeps 2 dots and uses 1 melee ability. Monk keeps 1 ability on cd then spams another while that one's on cd, etc.

[@Zoeila]

@@eolendes6432 no i want to recover a time when gcd healing wasnt viewed strickly as a dps loss because ogcd's are way too damn powerful.

[@antarath517]

@@The_Yukki I come from the fistweaving/kitty/disc end of healing. It's WAY more engaging and fun for me to both dps and heal as them than as any healer in ffxiv. ffxiv very rarely makes you decide whether to heal or dps, and it doesn't have engaging finishers to transition from dps back to healing. That's part of the issue with ffxiv job design. They're too focused on making each job for "everyone", rather than filling niches. I want a white mage in my game that just tosses heals and rolls their head on their keyboard. I also want a crazy oddball healer that weaves an intense DoT rotation while healing. Issue is, all the healers are REALLY similar to white mage in that sense. 30 second dot, long cd burst, one button spam. Their healing tools are somewhat different, but I'd desire more variety there too. Again, I must emphasize, the current healer design has a place in this game. Problem is, we don't get to choose if that's for us, it's all there is.

[@eolendes6432]

@@The_Yukki Cant druid dps with cat form? Wasnt that the optimal choice at some point? At least you get choices

[@SubduedRadical]

Oh, and that TOP zero healer argument IS STUPID. 75 Vercures, 75 Clemencies, TWENTY-FIVE Physics from their SUMMONER (it's in the log!), and tons of other oGCD heals, by extremely high end players. People want the game to be less rigid and allow skill expression: THERE IT IS. There are three groups of healers in this game. Contrast the OF post with the crossposts of it to r/ffxivdiscussion and r/ffxiv. 1) OF is hyper negative and trying to organize the strike...getting about 200-300 people to agree with it. 2) Discussion largely agrees with OF's points, but finds their approach questionable, and some question what OF actually wants. 3) Mainsub is full of people saying they like healers in the game right now, think the OF people are utterly insane and full of themselves, and largely oppose the strike as stupidity. Something people need to realize is there are different types of people playing healers. Some want more damage, some want more to heal, some like things the way they are. Some people want MSQ to be hard level, some people disagree and think there should be more midcore bridge between easy and harder content, but that MSQ should stay as it is. You also get into gearing, rotations, mitigations, the different Tanks (WAR heals...a LOT...vs DRK doing not so much). Some think we need total reworks of oGCDs, GCDs, that Tank/DPSers need to have costs to using their healing tools, that they shouldn't have ANY healing tools, and so on. . The simplest compromise is probably make some healers more DPS focused (like SGE is getting), keep some straightforward (like WHM), make some encounters hard (I would LOVE more -OPTIONAL- Hard mode dungeons like we used to get), while keeping MSQ easy. Most people are NOT running 1T/3DPS, even if it's supposedly better, and that isn't changing. Most people are going to run the standard DF because that's what they enjoy and it's easy. It'd be fine if there were other roulette options and stuff, but does anyone REALLY want their MSQ 4 man roulette or 24 man roulettes to take 1-2 hours or even be unclearable with the party they get paired with? Some people act like they want that, but let's be real...that would be miserable for everyone.

[@silverstrider2046]

On the topic of progressing thru the MSQ, we have had several MSQ dungeons throughout the years that have been difficult. In ARR, Brayflox Longstop as a SCH was difficult because you not only didn't have access to Leeches, SCH's Esuna equivalent skill, but it was still 100% clearable as a SCH despite that. In HW, the Vault was also difficult because the last boss had a slew of mechanics that actually were challenging to deal with at the time. In SB, Bardam's Mantle had very hard hitting mobs that could easily chunk away at a Tank's Health In ShB, Holmester Switch and Mt. Golg had particularly nasty 1st room pulls. In EW, Tower of Zot is probably one the harder dungeons of the entire expansion. This isn't even including Trials where the Steps of Faith of ARR, The Final Steps of Faith in HW, The Royal Menagerie in SB, The Dancing Plague of ShB and the Dark Inside in EW could all potentially bottleneck players. While we have had several of these dungeons and trials nerfed (if not flat out removed in the case of ARR Steps of Faith), the fact was that they had existed throughout the game's lifespan. Expecting players to get better as they level is the basis of any RPG, MMO or otherwise, so I don't agree with the fact that the MSQ shouldn't be expected to be difficult when history has suggested some level of competency be there. On the topic of Dungeons, it's not so much that a WAR and even PLD can carry a group of 3 DPS thru them without issue that is the problem. The problem lies with how much group mitigation/healing SE continues to add into the game that's outside the healers control. Things like Arcane Crest, MNK's new Earth's Reply, etc all undermine the need of a healer and as more of those skills get added to the game, it becomes harder and harder to justify having 20+ healing abilities when the healer themselves can semi-afk in a Dungeon and just press their filler spells for the majority of it, never interacting with more than maybe 4 healing skills, if even that, my own personal best being 3 skills as a SGE. On the topic of Savage/Ultimates, fringe cases such as the TOP no healer clear are just that, fringe cases. However, there has been a steadily increasing trend of these fringe cases popping up, time and time again. Solo healing Savage and Ultimate Content is a feat to be sure but when you have this kind of thing happening on patch that ilvl power creep can't be blamed for it, it really calls to question all the design choices that have been happening in the game. Not to mention that, even in standard 2 healer comps, the overwhelming majority of your time is still pressing your 1 filler button that more than doubles your entire healing toolkit usage combined. 246 casts of Broil vs a combined total 110 healing abilities in DSR should not be a thing in one of the hardest Ultimates but there are countless logs with similar numbers across every Savage and Ultimate fight in the game. After playing as a Healer since 2014, I'm tired of it. I miss my DPS skills like Aero 3 and Misama 2 that got removed. I miss my support skills like Virus and Disable that were given to DPS roles and even got buffed on said roles. I tolerated the lobotomy Healers got in ShB because I was under the impression that it was to create a new basis for healers but here we are now, going into a new expansion and I'm still only hitting the same filler crap as I've been doing for the past 5 years with very little to show for it. Our toolkits are as disjointed as ever with little to no thought behind any of our skills required as the overwhelming majority of them are just fire and forget and DT isn't correcting any of it so, I'm just done with it all.

[@cyphi474]

Devs should never compromise their vision when it comes to difficulty. New players might be blood of any mmorpg, but old players are bones that holds it together. Objectivelly, ShB and EW dungeons ARE much harder than ARR, HW or even SB dungeons. There is much higher chance if you fail, you'll die. But you still have to fail horribly, because there is more tools that can help you. Dash tools to get you out of tight spot and variety of mitigations. On other hand, Cape Westwind(now solo duty) can give somewhat hard times even to experienced player. Its actually hardest duty up to Stormblood, even beating some early there. All ARR and past ARR content, plus HW content, should be rewoked to match it. But point is, there is some learning curve to follow for the completelly new players to the genre. It should be steeper with less difficulty spikes. But its easy to say from perspective of someone who plays this game for long time, it would be probably different from new player perspective.

[@Arnveld]

The easiest way to fix it, NOW, before DT comes, is Bump up damage numbers to not 11 but 25. Tanks need to feel the heat, and Healers need to heal. If basic bread, the dungeons, won't offer any challange at all. We're for snooz fest for Xpac and another 2 years of copium that the Next one will surely fix healing problem.

[@Vokcas]

This is what I want to happen, Healers only healing should come from primarly using instant heal cooldowns, Tanks shouldn't be able to chain pull and tank without needing a healing present; this is a mmo with a synergy; what point of having a synergy if your not going to utilize these roles. Healers are DPS, 10% of the game requires a Off Tank, it brings the question, what the point in playing a tank or a healer.

[@this_epic_name]

@@Vokcas Effectively, the only point to playing a tank or healer is because (we thought, at least) that certain mechanics are built just for them: tankbusters and raidwides. The tanks in my party as just as sick of the current paradigm for tanks as we healers are with the healing paradigm. Tankbusters conveniently timed to the mit CD times and big raidwide damage conveniently timed to the big heal CD timers. Rarely if ever is there a need to mit or shield/heal outside of those timed (and predictable -- same time every time) mechanics.

[@SubduedRadical]

No, keep MSQ easy, but start adding a (Hard) mode second dungeon in each patch again - with its own roulette.

[@ovted129]

As a healer I was really upset to see them buff second wind cause I already noticed healerless groups and this would make it even more so I felt.

[@zeehero7280]

I mean, healers were always needed for progging high end content. the fact some crazies managed with 1 healer for some does not change that fact. I would not mind if bosses in dungeons did more damage though. one issue with dungeons is the bosses are easier than the trash. I assume SE means they are increasing the damage and difficulty/punishment of boss mechanics. Casual content is the only content that can be said is ever "too easy" and thus thats where the changes should be.

[@eeoou]

Im confused here. Isn't the new expansion is not out yet? How could they pkay and make strike on this new system?

[@karalynn2193]

Yeah, I definitely think they need to bump up the difficult of dungeons overall and they can instead ease the difficulty when players run with npcs....

[@Klefth]

Bring back Miasma II, Shadowflare, and Bane, bring back WHM's Cleric Stance, and bring back the actual AST card system instead of these 1-min oGCDs, and that in itself would fix a lot of the monotony of playing healers once shit's been figured out. That's the most egregious and annoying part of all of these issues: the solutions _used_ to be part of the game, but in trying to streamline everything to "reduce stress" they took all the fun away.

[@camposforce93]

I am a main healer and my thoughts about this issue are as follows: If the content will be easier and healing will not be that required, I understand it so the game would more welcoming, but I would not deny that healing is boring in the sense that if the dungeon is too easy to heal then our dps kit is just couple of buttons. We need more dps options as healers even bring the dps stance back. I know that on high end content we do need to heal more but having couple of more dps options won’t hurt at all and would make the haling experience more fun. Now regarding omega protocol, I don’t see that as big thing. Yes, they cleared it without healer, but they were a static and that achievement requires a lot of communication and planning. try to do that on a normal static or heck even try to do that on pf that would be almost impossible. Yes, it is interesting seeing that no healer was required for that, but they were expert and try hard player less than 10% of the community is like that. Like yeah good for them that got that cleared but the rest of the player would not attempt or do that, so we (healers) are required for that content. In summary I think having more dps options would be a good way to solve this "healing is not required “issue.

[@OldRecordMedia]

The problem is that post-ShB healers are objectively 2-button classes unless they're running endgame content. It's worse for solo healers or healers who are wanting to do MSQs without basically being glare/broil/etc bots. Prior to ShB, healers had a DPS kit in addition to their healing kit which gave them far more contribution during fights at all levels of play. A major reason Scholar was the strongest healer doing Stormblood not due to its ability to mitigate the most damage but also because its kit allow scholars to passively apply pressure since most of its damage revolved around refreshing the 3-4 dots they had available. The fact they could easily spread those dots across entire groups of enemies also made them work very well in normal dungeon content as well as endgame content. The other healers had similar abilities as well but excelled in other ways (WHM was objectively the strongest raw healer while AST provided the most utility). As a former healer main, playing the class nowadays is mindnumbing and boring. As you stated, there is literally no risk. The tank can wall-to-wall pull and all it means is me getting to actually use my OGCDs every now and then. That's assuming the tank is undergeared or not using their mitigation tools because if they don't suffer from these problems, I may as well cast cure/physic/benedic a couple of times before going back to spamming my singular AOE spell. Seeing that most of the changes to healers thus far is adding to their healing kit more than anything else just drives the knife of mediocrity in deeper.

[@wolfknighthunter]

wasn't this media tour though? We already saw a picture of Alphinaud as a DPS on SGE. This isn't even the final build of the game that will be released on the 28th. This was a build for Media Tour. Played by people who know there jobs and have lot of followers. in a level 91 dungeon. its a leveling dungeon. WARs have always been a blood tank since ARR with most healing. Bloodbath was originally our trait til it was taken and given to DPS. Please remember this was all testing stuff to give us a idea of how things will work and see the new content through the eyes of people many of us watch and can explain depending on your play style.

[@Double0Anims]

That's nothing to think about on Alphinaud. Haurchefant is a sword and board knight made to be a tank, but can be a dps if the player does the vault as a tank. The NPCS fill whatever role the story needs them to.

[@wolfknighthunter]

Up until the addition of trust in content before SHB that isn't how it has worked during first MSQ playthrough and decided to use trust instead of duty finder for first clear. Y'shtola only went back to healer in one dungeon in trust for story in EW because she was healer before. It's always made sense. Even talks about it in the MSQ. But that isn't even the point I was making. The point is this isn't even the final version of Dawntrail. This is a build for Media Tour. So the fact people calling for tank and DPS nerfs on a not fully released build because healers are upset at what they saw a creator do while testing really need to chill out. Let's get the official release and see.

[@SubduedRadical]

@@wolfknighthunter what makes it even worse is all the people at the media tour are content creators, many of the Ultimate raiders. They are better at this game than 99% of the playerbase. I looked up Xeno's character and he's an orange (and even has a 100) parsing Savage raider! CLEARLY their experience running stuff does not and will not match the average player and DF run.

[@wolfknighthunter]

I agree with you completely! I get very aggravated by this, and have been saying it's not a very diverse group to represent the community that they invite with the exception of Jessi from what I could tell. I haven't finished a tier in a while and I am never at that level of play. Which is why I taking what we seeing with a grain of salt. Looking at explinations of new abilities so I have a little idea. Because I'll be honest I won't truly understand til I get to play and see. They got to play as level 100 with all new gear and jobs and only had few things they could access. We know we going into first dungeon with same gear we have now. Same builds we have now for most jobs if your sticking to your normal job.

[@PureRandumosity]

Was a healer main for 7 years, i stopped maining healer recently because its just gotten boring. I want to use my massive healing kit but after prog or in a good group of players I have to use the dps kit mostly...and the dps kit is boring. The most fun I have in the game being a healer is in completely new groups to the content, like the first week of an alliance raid. Oh my god did I have fun first week of the Nier alliance raid. Or any of the stormblood ones. I only have fun now in groups where there is at least SOMEONE I can save with a rescue or a big shield and just make them my goal to keep alive. I hope they start designing content where you need the healers healing kit

[@Damien_Bathory]

The devs focus more on adding DPS over Healer roles or Tank roles, what can be expected?

[@PataHikari]

Frankly a big issue with people talking about difficulty in the MSQ dungeons is that Dawntrail is the 5th expansion in the game. To play a Dawntrail leveling dungeon they need to have done 90 levels of dungeons beforehand. Expecting some baseline level of competence after so much playing is not a tall order.

[@cordrac]

"You cannot give people feedback in this game" once I asked the tank in the (former) Aery to use reprisal and such in wall pulls, and the dps started keysmashing at me for not touching a single Esuna (they had an incurable debuff from failing a boss mechanic) I understand you, fellow healer main.

[@Sluppie]

Honestly, while I'm sure this is true, the last 3 or so times I've gotten any direct feedback in this game it has turned out to be flat wrong. With the exception of like... someone explaining boss mechanics to the party, I haven't gotten one ounce of actually useful advice. While doing Brayfox Longstop back in like... HW or SB, I was trying to clear it as Gladiator because I hadn't gotten my Job crystal yet and my gear wasn't above the level cap. The feedback I got basically consisted of someone reading my tooltips for me, in order to tell me to do the things that I was already doing the whole time. Once I got my job crystal and better gear, I received no further feedback. While doing e4 normal, which is to say the Titan fight where everyone dies on once or twice, I got flamed by a tank for 'not knowing the fight'. The only reason why I was failing mechanics is because I kept having to rez the other healer who kept dying over and over, and that was distracting. I don't think I ever died in that fight, but nearly everyone else did and know this for a fact because my WHM ass had to rez them myself. The only reason why I had vuln stacks and no one else did was because you drop vuln stacks when you die. One time I got flamed during the first Crystal Tower raid because I was the tank of party C, and the tank from party B wasn't doing their job during that one fight where only one party can damage the boss at a time. Literally nothing I could do about it because that boss usually dies before C's turn comes up, and yet I was the one who got flamed. Literally all I said was, "I can't help you with that. It's literally B Tank's problem." In no situation have I ever been given direct how-to-play-my-job advice that was actually useful, and I've leveled every job in the game (except blue mage) to 90. The only advice that has ever been useful has been about explaining the boss mechanics, and unless it's fresh content I really don't need you for that. I go to youtube for that info. I guess that's really what it comes down to: If I wanted to know, I would go look it up myself. I can read the tooltips all on my own. I can figure out (or look up) how the boss works. Advice from randoms has historically been questionable at best and I honestly can't think of a single time it's actually been good. The one time someone had an opportunity to give me good advice, they couldn't because it involved talking about damage meters, which are against the rules, and I'm pretty sure that the actual problem there was that I was using Piety Materia instead of Crit Materia.

[@Dogan_TM]

@@Sluppie The only ones who are willing to give 'advice' are the idiots who don't value their account. *Anyone* who can read has read at the ToS and saw how much of a gamble it is to even _talk_ to someone in the game in any form of a confrontational manner, so they just shut up and let people suck to avoid losing potentially thousands of dollars in sub money and whatever Mog Station items they got. When I see a Black Mage spamming Fire III? I don't say shit. When I see a Warrior using no cooldowns? I don't say shit. A healer spamming GCD Heal II? I don't say shit. A tank not use AoE skills? No mitigate skills? A Samurai spamming random shit? A Ninja using Doton in single target? Bard spamming single stack Pitch Perfects? No Dancer partner? No Technical Step? Literally anything you could think of, I don't say shit. Not in early level dungeons, not in late level dungeons. I'm not gambling for leeches that don't value peoples' time. The *only* thing I will ever do is write "Tank stance " and leave if they never turn it on.

[@Theheadless1858]

This is BS. What if the tippy top of players don’t need a healer? Most healers complaining about this don’t have 1/4 of that skill. And when Abyssos savage pushed healers you all dipped and left anyway and no one wanted to heal. A ton of casual healers will DPS as you die to tick damage over a full dot duration and not use their heals even when they are needed then complain the healer kit leans too much into healing.

[@ulibarriL]

Dude, a bunch of players bounced out of abyssos savage. They weren't just healers. The devs effed up and over tuned it. Healers just took the blame because, you know... eff you healers.

[@lagtastic7511]

The issue is maintenance. This game has none for healing in current expansions. Its always all or nothing, mechanic goes out, blast heal, continue dps, repeat Talking things like random damage that's unavoidable Debuffs to be removed Debuff to be managed And this can be so low stress its not even funny. Example, boss puts out a debuff that takes away 1% health per second for the encounter. On papers its nothing, its a full 100 seconds to kill someone But you add in a small amount of unavoidable random attacks that can't hit the same person twice in a row. And a nice spicy big aoe with a lengthy cast time and plenty of visual queues maybe lets say every 100 seconds. You can set this damage to whatever you want, but now you have a threshold for I need to keep people up past a certain point. A skilled healer will weave their damage and healing. A non skilled healer will focus solely on healing. And then top everyone off before the big aoe, and the dps/tank help out where needed. The big thing though is you don't take away the tank/dps sustain. They should be able to help cover for mistakes. But in the instance of the above encounter, they would not be able to outheal the steady maintenance healing. They should have some agency in their own survivability. Everyone is contributing, but the healer FEELS required. I can't tell you the number of times I have seen a new healer flat out die early in a boss they havent done during an expert. And they almost always say "Guess I'm not needed". Horrid Design, and should not be happening period.

[@ChilleUK]

I still enjoy healing but would be cool to get DPS rotation.

[@chriskarpetas]

Please don't pay attention to people in the Official Forums, most of them in that god-forsaken place are deranged.

[@lukahcasshe6197]

Good job invalidating an opinion based on logical fallacies.

[@userbunny14]

Hearing people complain about savage raiders clearing the FIRST DUNGEON on MEDIA TOUR, with a WARRIOR, and a RED MAGE, saying healers are dead, time to strike, pisses me off more then anything. Yes healers could use some help, but for 98% of parties, a healer is needed. At least if you want to finish it in a reasonable time. Sure you could finish it without, but it's gunna take 40 minutes (or longer) vs 25. The number of times I've been in a dungeon where the tank doesn't even know what PERSONAL mit is, let alone how to use it to help their DPS...? Countless. The number of times even WITH a healer, I end up tanking SOMETHING as a DPS... it happens in 75% of dungeons I run outside of my personal friend group. And YEAH! The FEEDBACK comment! You can't give feedback! Even politely! The average playerbase isn't going to be able to clear even a normal dungeon without a healer. Healer role is not dead.

[@lukahcasshe6197]

As a healer main, I can guarantee that I have had a vast majority of runs in both normal and extreme difficulty content where I don't need to heal anything whatsoever, and a few savage where healing has been minimal. And when that happens all we have to press is one button. Forever. As for feedback, constructive criticism and polite feedback has been regular and frequent since Shadowbringers came out. Not only has it been ignored, but when Yoshi P was forced to answer a question regarding it, only gave the tonedeaf response of "Go play Ultimate". Content that was cleared without healers even being a necessity. Is it easier with one? Yes. But no other role has to fight to even be able to do their job at all. You don't see healers tanking busters for the tanks or doing leading DPS during burst windows. You don't see DPS classes forced to press the same button forever. We tried. That's why we're striking now. The other options are all exhausted, and so are we.

[@cjgparas3]

How about Slash / Bust style for a role from samurai showdown. A role may have 2 forms. You can choose one of 2. With 2 different play styles from one role for variety and taste. Classic DOT summoner vs eikon summoner

[@QuixSilver1234]

Regarding dungeons, I think the perfect difficulty is where you are able to pull single packs without a healer, but are not be able to pull wall to wall. This allows parties with an underperforming or afk healer to still clear the dungeon in a reasonable amount of time, while also making the presence of a healer integral to the content. There are plenty of lower level dungeons in the game that fit this criteria, so I don't think it's unreasonable to expect even hyper-casual players to be able to handle the same level of difficulty at lvl 90+, that they had to clear to get to lvl 90 in the first place. A couple of month ago I had a healer DC at the very beginning of the lvl 90 dungeon. I wasn't paying attention and just wall to wall pulled like normal. I didn't even notice that there was no healer until most of the mobs were already dead. The only thing that tipped me off was that my health had dropped to 1/3, which is lower than most healers allow it to drop to. I used the exact same mit package that I always use for the first pull, but it simply didn't matter that we didn't have a healer. We then continued clearing the rest of the dungeon up the last boss (w2w pulls all the way), before a healer was backfilled. I don't particularly look for difficulty from normal dungeons, but I also find their current state in EW (where we can have a completely missing job roll without any real repercussions whatsoever) very, very silly.

[@SubduedRadical]

This is probably a decent point to aim for, but I'm afraid people would all complain if the tank isn't double pulling all the time. That's the entire reason the put the walls in, because people were demanding more and berating tanks or healers that didn't feel comfortable with it.

[@Aitherea]

I think a lot of your points are spot on, but I'm still confused why everyone turns to DPS as the solution. Why are we not arguing for more healing? Why are we not demanding it? We know the devs hear us, at the very least. It is really sad to see healers expecting or even asking to become DPS. We should be fighting to *heal*. I begin to worry I'm in the minority and the devs, who do watch and listen, are going to essentially turn healers into green DPS. FFXIV is the first MMO i played where the healer hardly heals and isnt super necessary. It just baffles me that the solution isn't to demand that healers become healers; instead we keep pushing that they become DPS and it's so painful to watch.

[@collenjets123]

Its because DPS actually have very interesting and fun to use kits duirng gameplay, and healers have nothing. Even tanks have half of what a melee DPS gets access to in terms of rotation etc.

[@slainmaster1997]

It's largely in part because outside of Ultimates, healing is hardly more than spending 1-3 GCDs worth of time using off-globals between each instance of meaningful damage thanks to the sheer power of the healing kits every healer has currently. The amount of time between mechanics where you legitimately have to heal compared to how much time you actually spend healing (if you're planning your healing correctly) is ridiculous by comparisson, and what else are you doing when heals aren't necessary during that time? DPS spells. Which as it stands is little more than mash one button and pressing another every 30 seconds ad nauseum.

[@shadowbringer97]

I feel the same way. Why are we not forced to use our entire kit, when every other DPS and Tank does. I completely get where the ask for more DPS comes from, since no changes are going to be made to utilize the entire healing kit, only makes sense to provide more DPS moves to offset the lack of healing. Ultimately, the underlying issue worsens because of this and still you're not really using your entire kit.

[@eolendes6432]

Healers are actually arguing for more healing too. But then we get told "More healing means sprouts getting stressed." So we go, okay, more interesting dps buttons. But then "Healer should heal" crowd show up.

[@shadowbringer97]

@@eolendes6432 "More healing means sprouts getting stressed." - The same could be said for DPS and tanks as well, is it not? I get that with Healers it would be more prominent because there's a lot more responsiblity on it. I read some other comment here as well that I would agree with and wonder why the devs didn't attempt something like this or at least consider it, if sprouts were getting stressed or the content had to be do-able easily. The thing to consider, they should have increased the need for healing on subsequent expansions. Natural progression with minimal changes shouldn't have an negative impact and players would be capable of learning naturally. They do this already for other parts and should have placed a greater significance on healers.

[@ErraticFaith]

As I have tried to communicate briefly on the western Reddit, Japanese players and servers are not oblivious to the critique and understand the perspectives shared as many players have communicated it on servers and otherwise. We're all aware of how the game has changed over the years and there are plenty of disagreements over the handling of challenge vs accessibility. I have long found it insulting, that some claim the Japanese community have a universal voice. We certainly do not. Many simply cannot communicate as such in English. The team have become weighed down in world events and changing feedback. Much in the same way. The healers need some attention. This you can tell without hyperbole, just by noting that in the thousands of MMORPGs that have dealt with healing - none have been reduced to such. Having a challenging ultimate is nice but not at the cost of a totally dead experience outside of it. It's simply not respectful to those who enjoy the class / job role, in whatever capacity. It renders the healer experience almost void. Which isn't what any of them were promised and that they don't accept it, is fair enough. It's also difficult to accept that some are so selfish, that they would rather drive that community of healers from game - than listen to their voices and treat them as equally valid members of the community. After all, they expect to be heard themselves. To that end, if you truly care about the game as a collective whole - and it's longevity - support the Healers in their attempt to be 'heard'. It's not much to ask and the company can easily address it with an acknowledgment that would do much for the good will and faith of the player base internationally. Nobody in good faith can call the healer experience at present rewarding in most circumstances and I do think a compromise can be found between accessible and braindead. Pounding a single button or two ad nauseum whilst watching netflix or whatever you all do - isn't a game. It's not even 'stress free'. It's insulting. Some feedback for them, is the very least they deserve.

[@Zadamanim]

No idea why this video has so many dislikes, everyone in the comments seems to agree with you lol. Healers are probably the least interesting to play. It feels like half their kit is superfluous... Like with whm, I get that cure 1, cure 2, cure 3, medica 1, medica 2 and medica 3 (in dawntrail), all have slightly different uses, but I feel like you could simplify it to just being cure 3, medica 3, and free up those buttons for damage spells. I would also give those two Enhanced Glare, which doubles the potency of your next glare, so they aren't dps losses unless you use them twice in a row, and it would give you something to hit during downtime.

[@AngelScolarus]

You did well in pointing out the crucial flaw of a healing role lies in not HOW jobs heal with their kit, but what to do when healing is not necessary while still providing an engaging gameplay experience. To their credit, the devs have built some methods if we look to SGE and AST as case studies. On SGE, the main emphasis is to keep kardia ticks through consistent actions while your tank is constantly keeping chipped away either by heavy boss auto-attacks or multiple smaller autos from a mob pull. Clipping your GCDs or halting your attacks entirely means one less CPR compression on your tank keeping their health stable for the next tankbuster or before mandating a CD to be popped in a mob. For AST, the principle is not contributing DPS, but increasing the overall party DPS contribution using their iconic card system and divination during bust windows. Their engaging card system requires carefully pay attention to what cards are randomly drew, recognize if they were Range or Melee type, and judge if its worth redrawing for a different seal (purely for the lawls). The seal system was at least an attempt of adding complexity to the system, but failed to payoff in the end for all the effort lining up 3 seals. For 12 seconds, Fell Malefic with the lowest healer offensive spell potency went from a damaging pin prick, to giving the boss a slightly irritable hangnail. Looking ahead to Dawntrail, I still find SGE to be in the better position of engaging gameplay over AST despite their redesigned card system. With only 1 card contributing to the teams DPS, the remaining 2 cards for healing/mitigation may just sit in your hand unused when no one is taking damage until the next draw 30 seconds later. One workaround I wish they could bring back from StB AST was "burning" a card to power up the next one you play or turn it into an AoE, adding a level of strategy in the card system while still serving a use for all 3 cards drawn.

[@Gartzak]

i mean IF (and a big if) your party can mess together you can clear without a healer, most of the time i dont see many party that can mess well together

[@kataku8609]

Healers should be fun in ALL CONTENT, not just the Ultimates. No other role is as boring in normal content as healer. Tanks don't just mitigate, they also shield, heal and DPS in all content. DPS shield, heal and DPS in all content. I have been asked so many times when doing maps to change from a Healer to DPS. Or asked by my Tank in a dungeon to not bother with healing and just DPS, because they "got it!" As for your: what is more optimal 75 clemencies or a healer. We are not talking about optimisation, it is more optimal to go 1 tank 3DPS in dungeons. But TOP was cleared with no healer, that is how important the role is. No tank? you die from tankbusters. No DPS? You die to enrage. No healer? The Paladin has to Clemency a few times. Healers are boring to play. We want more engagement when no healing is needed. You can definitely get the sweet point of a dungeon being casual enough for the MSQ, but if you want to optimise, your kit should allow for it. It was possible in ARR, HW and SB, it can be possible now. The devs will not increase the damage in this game, it is obvious. What they could do is add interactivity to the Healer kits. SCH: Pet management and DoTs SGE: Melee healer with a complex DPS rotation that procs Kardia AST: Versatility changing between Diaurnal (pure strong heals) and Nocturnal (strong shields) while distributing cards with different effects (RNG or not) WHM: This could stay the same for the people who just want easy heals and holy spam (it also works as a beginner healer since it is the only one starting at level 1) #FFXIVHEALERSTRIKE

[@SubduedRadical]

Not everyone feels the same thing is fun.

[@waferdaze8017]

You see, what I enjoy about FF14's healing is that there ARE ways to get around it, unfortunately most of those require a specific approach to gameplay. Personally, I think of DnD's design philosophy being that having a dedicated healer role can become a bit too centralizing. Creating content that makes a dedicated healer important means enemies have to pump out ridiculous damage that most other jobs wouldn't be able to do anything about. Healer is the biggest point of contention in the holy trinity because it most of the time enforces the holy trinity. FF14 you could theoretically evade getting stuck in "A dedicated healer is NECESSARY at all times." I much prefer the idea of a "support role" than a "healer role" and FF14 seems to be leaning into that just a bit more. I agree, more DPS/utility buttons would do wonders for it in it's current state. And it translates well into high end content too because where that healing DOES become more necessary, it just makes everyone else's job easier to optimize. To a point where as people get better at content, you step away from strictly healing to throwing in attacks and still having a vital role. The responsibility is just so much more evenly spread with most jobs having their own mitigation or recovery options. So the NEED for a healer lowering to a recommended role is great.

[@this_epic_name]

This is the perspective FFXIV is built to please.

[@SubduedRadical]

Not everyone likes DPSing. A lot of people like Healing, Tanking, and even Support (buffing/debuffing). Only around 30% of people like true DPSing. I know it's not the perfect source, but Panthon did a poll a while back and the rough ratios were 20% wanted to Tank, 25% wanted to heal, 25% wanted to DPS (pure DPSers), and 30% wanted to be Control (support/buffers/debuffers like Guild War Mesmers or Everquest Enchanters - not dealing damage but providing support to their party). Given that was a game for people who liked Everquest, I suspect the broader MMO community it's closer to 15/20/35/30 or something, but the point is, most people don't want to be a DPS, either. They want to do something else. BUT, some people DO want that. A round a third or more people WANT to be a pure DPS, no support, no buffs, no nothing. Just them, their rotation, the boss mechanics, and proving their worth by big damage. So turning everyone into "Support DPS" wouldn't please really anyone. The Tanks and Healers would obviously be mad, the pure DPSers would be mad, and the Supporters wouldn't like that they're doing damage spells so much instead of buff/debuff/crowd control.

[@waferdaze8017]

@@SubduedRadical And THAT I understand. It's one of those "if it ain't broke don't fix it" things. I like having a variety of options given to me on a personal level, but that defeats the point of MMO design. Healers HAVE to be designed for in SOME capacity. Every role has to be IMPORTANT. As I said, to by-pass healers as content gets harder, you have to play in more specific ways that not everyone is gonna like. It's neat that it can be done, but Healers serve to just make everyone else able to optimize as a good safety net. Which is obviously a big draw for most people who main healers. Me? I like to min-max where I can, but MMOs are NOT meant to be designed that way. MMOs are about a far wider community, so the "holy trinity" serves as a boundary for players to play within such that they will always be contributing in a meaningful way.

[@lukahcasshe6197]

Bro really just said "My favorite part about healing in FF14 is not having to heal"

[@waferdaze8017]

Tends to be the case that a smooth win is pleasant.

[@odstzero22]

I wished healer dots worked like other mmos where when you apply a dot to an enemy it gets applies to all enemies nearby. Plus having a ogcd or gcd for healers that procs from the dots would be cool.

[@Castersvarog]

There was stuff like that before, Bane was an ability that would spread DoTs around on SCH and old SMN. And there was AoE dots like Miasma 2 and Aero 3.

[@SubduedRadical]

@@Castersvarog Aero 3 was replaced with Misery and was more annoying than interesting. I've played WHM for years and I hate DoTs. I'd rather have things like Lilies/Misery any day of the week.

[@Dae-Dae97]

Yoshi p has in on record that they'll add dps each expansion and they rotate between the 7 roles as the second job (7 because they count melee as 3)

[@zachcarter2086]

So not a healer main or anything, but I'm kinda feeling like just adding more DPS alone isn't the right move for the game on the whole. I think focusing on expanding the DPS side of healers too much further pushes them to a state where they're just glorified DPS jobs. I honestly feel like (and as a tank main I understand it might suck at first) we should be pulling out some of the tanks' self-healing potential. We should be making more of a need for healing in the game to justify having the third role. Don't get me wrong, Healers need more exciting DPS options, I just mean that I don't think it's the primary problem with healing in FF right now. And while it technically makes everything a bit harder, I think that's better overall than healers not having a real purpose. Personally, like I said, I would pull some of the tanks' healing out of their kits to spur a bigger focus on healing, and then as for DPS my thought is, since they have the healer split for Regen vs Shield, you could make another split for, say, Burst vs DoT/Sustain. I'd make SCH and AST the DoT jobs and have WHM and SGE be Burst. This way they're on corners with each other and each job has its flair. Again, not a healer main so if I'm wrong or missing something I would invite healers to expand my understanding.

[@Neidhardt150]

literally only about 5% of the overall player base have been in and cleared multiple ultimates. anyone saying you don't need healers for top are just lurkers who will never even attempt the content anyway. A LOT of people talk out of their ass on what needs to be fixed or standard that make no sense at all.

[@aidanmillow566]

Where does that 5% come from? I have trouble believing it's so high.

[@TinySamaa]

SO TRUE!! CANT SAY NUTHING TO PEOPLE!! I was in the Osma alliance raid and I was telling the raid Left and Back and how to tell which is Left and which is RIght. Someone started to come after me in alliance chat and thankfully, I did not need to defend myself because a nice handful of players there were not snowflakes. That being said, I just make sure to block the atrocious players when I get out so I don't have to deal with them.

[@fidoisherechaos535]

Honestly if they gave more meaning to our kits as healers or made it rewarding to use our skills i feel like we would be more engaged depending on content. Like even if we have 1-2 spam buttons for Single or AOE but why can't it be a 111 combo with giving us Gauge or maybe make a highlight heal or 2 at the end of the combo's to cut MP costs or give additional Healing. Same thing with healing like Cure on WHM we need to get rid of Free cure just make it a combo heal give it a combo with less MP cost. Or like Medica into Medica 2. Like we don't need overly complicated kits cause that defeats the purpose of what Shadowbringers brought after Stormblood. We need more involvement with what we have already without changing the gameplay too much just make it more satisfying and reward us for what we are already doing so we are not bored for 10-30s while we wait for mechanics. There is so much that could be done without reworking healing from the ground up or making it too hard.

[@one_eyeddd473]

Lol poor dude knows he just walking on eggshells by being honest about something he loves..shame its that way. Give the healers sum deeps man i feel you lol ❤

[@siyrean]

As a healer I wanna heal not dps. If healers are expected to make it through bartem mettle, holmister switch, barbarichia and golbez, then they don’t need any more Aetherfont’s

[@Ilandria.]

I just want the old SCH (2 different faeries, manual healing, lots of DoTs and cool DPS stuff), AST (the really cool original card system, noct/diurnal sect, and all of their buff manipulation time magic), and Cleric Stance back.

[@Ilandria.]

I should also mention while I really enjoy filling my rotation with DPS stuff, healers (imo) should be primarily healing. If healers are primarily focusing on optimizing DPS that feels crappy because the reason I play a healer is because I want to play a healer. If I'm not having to fill with hard casts of healing spells at least often, then there's a design failure somewhere. I get people want to have their own agency over being alive or whatever, but this is an MMO, not a MSO (massively singleplayer game).