Judo vs Karate From 1991 Pre-UFC Era - What Happens if you Punch a JUDO guy?!

[@FightCommentary]

If anyone can find more vintage footage like this, please show me! Always down to look at and react to old stuff.

[@GGn00bschell]

Hi, not sure if you have done it before but you can look at kyokushin vs yiquan (or 太極拳 as it was known in Japan) kzbin.info/www/bejne/Y6ukp6KAdpeLaZY The guy at the start is Shokei Matsui, one of the directors of the many Kyokushin organisations now.

[@vascosyogaundkampfkunst8042]

Do you remember that I have sent you some old footage of an awsome tournament between Muay Thai, Taekyon and Capoeira or shall I send it to you again?

[@DemuDesu]

@@GGn00bschell FYI, that's eventually kyokushin vs taiki-ken (太気拳 ) which is based on yiquan like you said. Whoever uploaded the video got the name wrong.

[@GGn00bschell]

@@DemuDesu thanks for the correction

[@glenw-xm5zf]

Good clip

[@johngault7329]

I was training isshinryu karate at this time. My sensei would constantly stress that the most important thing when we kicked, or punched, was how fast we could get it back. Not the power of the strike, nor the speed of the strike, but the speed of the retracting of the strike. On the chance that we were up against a judo practitioner, we couldn't take the chance of it being intercepted. No joke. If he didn't hear our gi pop while striking, he would lecture us on the danger of not getting the hand/ foot back quick enough. Every time. We also trained in basic throws, holds, and locks every class.. We were taught that the best way to fight a judo guy was to keep our distance and wait. They are no danger at 4'..

[@FightCommentary]

Super interesting! I’ll have to check out your style.

[@kiltrofilms]

bro, my first martial art was traditional goju ryu from an old timer (who also did kyokushin matches and american kickboxing) and i remember the exact same teachings about snaping the leg back to the point where he would give you shit if he didnt hear the crack on the cloth.

[@MMANEWSMALAYALAM]

I also trained in Isshinryu , but our sensei didn't taught the style's application as sophisticated and detailed as yours .

[@adamclark1972uk]

That's right, keep at least 4 feet away from a judoka, and if they come closer, you move away, and keep moving away as fast as possible. Wear running shoes if necessary.

[@CEOdosPutos]

My sensei used to say go at 100 but get back at 1000

[@prodango5272]

I'm very certain this was a friendly "exhibition" of sorts. I remember something about judo and karate being tested against each other to decide which style would be implemented into Japan's police force. Judo ended up winning, and I wonder if this was some homage to that.

[@FightCommentary]

So judo is trained by most if not all of Japanese police force?

[@kaizenproductions00]

​@@FightCommentary From what I know, Japanese police learn Judo and/or Kendo at the police academy.

[@Batucadax]

How dare they leave aikido out of this!

[@AljosaPLampe]

It was a fight between judo and traditional jujutsu but yeah judo won

[@dvdp4513]

Right. That’s why in MMA they try to end the fight on the ground asap. Imo.

[@TenchiBushi]

I think this is in a high school or community gym. Many school and community judo rooms here in Japan look like this. This was a fun match. I already spotted the judo guy since the judo kanji is on his dogi. I think the karate guy may be Kyokushinkai or one of the off-shoots like Seido or Ashihara. Before I moved on to Kali, I studied Okinawan Karate. We had a few throws, locks and takedowns. It wasn't as sophisticated as in the grappling arts but it was taught part of a fight ender (that was the concept).

[@jestfullgremblim8002]

That last part is funny, because Karate was originally a Weapon and Grappling style. It's striking was very limited and just like Taichi, it was always in the context of grappling

[@alexandermilenov818]

Judging by the gloves, this is a Kudo guy. There's a good amount of grappling in it especially after the yellow belt. In competition you get (I think) 2 takedowns with 30 seconds of groundwork per round, but outaide of competition, you train throwing and groundwork a pretty fair amount. Has to do with it's origin of Kyokushin and Judo (it's added muai Thai and bjj techniques since then). It's pretty open to what works (even the name translates to sth like open road).

[@eugenebach5421]

​@@jestfullgremblim8002 I've always thought the fist of a karate should be treated like a rondell dagger or a tanto in a fight. Take them down and crush face.

[@jestfullgremblim8002]

@@eugenebach5421 yeah, it usually represents weapons in the forms, if not that, then grappling haha.

[@alexandermilenov818]

@@johnreidy2804 yes, that was proven without a smudge of doubt by the last UFC welterweight championship fight. But if your point is on the balance of probabilities, then yes, i can agree to that.

[@shevetlevi2821]

This is a valuable video in its pre-UFC perspective. In the mid 1970s I was a new shodan in Uechi ryu, an Okinawan karate style. My sensei was a Korean War USMC veteran and very knowledgeable in many martial arts. He was a sandan in Uechi ryu and a shodan in judo. One night he passed a comment that a good judoka or wrestler will beat a karateka most of the time. Although I deeply respected my sensei I thought how could this be? As karateka we're at an advantage because they can't do anything until they grab us. I thought of my strikes as magic death rays that would just drop them as soon as they moved in to grab. Fast forward to the early UFCs and the Gracie family, as well as other grapplers in the early matches served us strikers a heaping slice of humble pie. It revealed a big hole in my education and bothered me enough that some years later I trained in BJJ for 3 years and rounded out my training. I didn't start a serious study of karate until I was 16 but I started judo when I was 11. Unfortunately I just couldn't stand being slammed to the mat so I was on and off for about a year but I wish I had stayed with it alongside of my karate training. When I started BJJ almost 50 years later I still didn't like being thrown but I had the mental maturity and mental fortitude to just deal with it.

[@tsoliot5913]

I love their haircuts

[@adamkane7513]

In 1991 I had a full head of hair! Yes, the memories...

[@Slop_Dogg]

Definitely that 90’s cut I saw a lot when I vacationed in Tokyo lol

[@israelcanada8969]

Hahahaha 😂

[@des6853]

Wait so that second throw/trip... that was karate dude who got Judo's back. You can tell cuz he didn't really handle the dominant position as gracefully.

[@rwdchannel2901]

Before Karate became a sport by introducing the belt system there were lots of moves that aren't currently taught because they will cause disqualification from the sport karate. Karate had a lot of grappling in it before it became sport karate.

[@richardgodivala4680]

Sadly, something similar has happened in Judo - many techniques that are not (no longer) allowed in competition, so they're not taught much. Judo has strikes, spine locks, wrist locks, leg logs - but few judoka know them.

[@vincedgarvlogs]

The Karate grappling aspects sucks though, that ankle lock is so wrong.

[@richardgodivala4680]

@@vincedgarvlogs It clearly wasn't working well. Unsurprising, if they're hardly taught, and never practiced.

[@vincedgarvlogs]

@@rwdchannel2901 still inferior compared to white belt BJJ

[@eamonob84]

@@vincedgarvlogsthis video is not old enough for them to be using the grappling that was practiced in Okinawa. I don’t know where he learned that ankle lock he tried.

[@alexfresel6198]

Very good clip I was training judo in Japan right at this time before that it was Kendo. I didn't keep up with the judo because they were super crazy into it and my reason for being in Japan was to study the Japanese labor movement. Very interesting to see the two styles matched up for real.

[@DiegoBombardiere]

I am 90% sure the Karate guy trains Daidojuku also known as Kudo, which is a full contact karate style that also has ground fighting, although much more limited than BJJ or other more popular modern styles. I'm sure the gloves he is wearing are Kudo gloves, plus that sluplex he did is very common in Kudo as well

[@DiegoBombardiere]

Straight ankle locks are common in Kudo too

[@UnknownFeng]

I was thinking this was Kudo as well by his sleeve length.

[@jestfullgremblim8002]

Exactly

[@markdaniels4178]

Lol! There was no kudo back in 1990 nor there was bjj in Japan in that era

[@UnknownFeng]

@@markdaniels4178 Daidojuku started in 81. In regards to Bjj it was already in Japan during the 90s especially after the first UFC.

[@teikarate]

You have to remember that so many karate guys, trained judo first back in the 80s

[@scottage_teaches_jujutsu]

There were at least 2 uchi mata (inner thigh throws) the “kimura” is named after a guy but the moves name is ude garami (winding shoulder hold or bent arm lock depending on the translation, the first submission I think was either a strangle or a cross face from an ushiro kesa gatame (reverse scarf) but there was a regular kesa gatame later on, the karate guy did more of an ura Nage throw (belly to side suplex) and the sweep the judo guy got was a kosoto gari (reverse outer reaping throw) with a possible tai otoshi (body drop throw) but I’m not %100 sure because I’m watching this on a small screen. Rad video I hope to see more

[@The_Ballo]

This was really cool! Hopefully you can find more vids like this

[@FightCommentary]

I hope so too!

[@timsmith5335]

In traditional Okinawan karate we have many throws and locks. Many people think we only have punches and a few kicks. We train takedowns, throws grapples and locks as well.

[@jno8039]

True. But even in shotokan

[@-westman3619]

I haven't watched in a while, glad to be back!

[@FightCommentary]

Thanks for coming back and please turn on the bell button if you can!

[@JohnJohnson-pq4qz]

Its the karate guy who then gets the back of the judo guy and throws him with a Ura nage (back throw) pretty much a supplex which he does pretty well.

[@Budoexplained]

1:00 Uchi mata to waki gatame 1:48 Ura Nage 2:13 Uchi mata to Kesa gatame 3:08 de ashi barai or ko soto gari (little hard to see) to juji gatame attempt 4:53 Ashi dori Ouchi gari

[@FightCommentary]

I see you added a profile picture! Is it a Japanese castle?

[@Budoexplained]

@@FightCommentary Yup, I like in Kyushu Japan so there is a good number of them around me. This is Kokura castle. I also change my handle, going to start uploading some MA stuff so trying to be a bit more official lol.

[@Batucadax]

How come they don't scream them out like Ryu in street fighter, isn't that how it should work?

[@jonharker9028]

@@Batucadax I think the kiai is only used in knockdown karate when you’ve scored the knockdown point, and this looks like a friendly mixed-rules exhibition more than a proper competition besides. It’s hard to see the kanji on the karateka’s gi, though, so picking out which style he does is hard.

[@jestfullgremblim8002]

@@jonharker9028 they were making a joke about the fighters not shouting their technique's names

[@maexpert11]

From my experience with karate it's been a long time since I've been just a karate guy lol but I'm pretty sure there are a lot of grappling techniques in the katas unfortunately there are a lot of people especially here in the United States that doesn't teach it the way it should be taught but once I started doing Jiu Jitsu and IDS I've been noticing it more and more

[@markdaniels4178]

Very well said

[@jno8039]

I agreed

[@codenameidk206]

Kimura lock originated from Judo. The name came from a Judoka named Masahiko Kimura, inventor of that lock. Btw that move at the end by Judoka was Osoto gari (maybe) not Kouchi gari. Osoto gari is an outer leg reap, meanwhile Kouchi and Ouchi garis are inner leg reaps.

[@jestfullgremblim8002]

That first part is very wrong tho. Masahiko Kimura only did as much as popularizing the technique. Kimura isn't even it's real name, that's how BJJ people started calling it long ago, it's actual Judo name is "Gyaku Ude Garami" as opposed to the "Ude Garami" which is called "The Americana Armlock" by BJJ practitioners. And the Ude Garami wasn't even invented in Judo. It is included in many Kung Fu styles that are older than Judo, it was also taught is Kito Ryu Jujutsu (one of the Styles that the foundator of Judo studied) and it even used to be in Sumo.

[@codenameidk206]

@@jestfullgremblim8002 Yeah I think discussing the origin of the technique is not that simple.

[@HelloBrother22]

it's an o-uchi-gari, not an o-soto-gari

[@jestfullgremblim8002]

@@codenameidk206 i mean, at least we definitely know that it wasn't invented by Masahiko Kimura or by any Judoka hahaha

[@jestfullgremblim8002]

@@HelloBrother22 yeah, the third takedown was a O Uchi Gari that looked like some kind of Uchi Mata because the Karateka spun into it

[@jamestk656]

As a jiu jitsu guy, I've never seen that throw transition into a belly down arm bar(?) in that first match since I'm more conditioned to take the back. That was really interesting.

[@nickfry7839]

im a jiujitsu guy too. i havent come across it in jiu jitsu yet, but i know it well from pro wrestling funny enough! its called the fujiwara armbar. i always called it the fuji armbar for short.

[@jamestk656]

@@nickfry7839 Is it an arm bar for sure or is it a shoulder lock? Can't tell from the angle if he's just pulling the arm up and if so, I think my shoulder would give out before my elbow would.

[@nickfry7839]

@@jamestk656 i think it is more of a shoulder lock. i dont know why fujiwara called it an armbar, maybe because the arm is the lever.

[@sylver76]

​@@nickfry7839 No, it is an armbar. It's called "Waki Gatame'. You use the armpit (waki) to apply pressure to the elbow. Like for all straight armbars, having a good control of the shoulder is what makes it possible to apply pressure on the elbow. That technique's been around forever, but it's fallen out of use because it's dangerous to do it standing - no control, you can either break the arm or you have nothing. On the ground however it works pretty well, especially because people have forgotten it exists and are more worried about avoiding the back take.

[@danielkeizer4174]

It's s forbidden technique in judo. It was banned somewhere in the 90's because in competition some guy almost tore another guys arm off. He broke his arm in two places with compound fractures. Ending that opponents career. So it's no longer allowed. Same goes for a bunch of older techniques that they either don't teach anymore or at least aren't used in competition because of injury risks. I'm too old and not involved anymore so I honestly don't know. That being said they were taught in the older styles from the 70's and 80's. Scissors, fireman's throws, standing armbar throws, reversed shoulder throws. Stuff japanese jiujitsu had in it got cut in modern jujitsu and definitely aren't in Brazilian jujitsu wich came from classical kodokan judo and never had any roots in jiujitsu.

[@leonardonais]

This material Is pure Gold, thanks for bring this to us

[@FightCommentary]

Glad you enjoyed it!

[@redpilljujitsu9068]

He went for a waki getami (belly down armlock) its usually done standing but is great to do it in newaza as escapes are really hard once locked in.

[@Tko_Tek]

Good video

[@taekwondobro]

I always love to see these gems

[@EliahuDiversosAulas]

It was very good fights. And they were hard to both. I liked it so much. It showed if the fighter gets in your "field" he wins, how it happenned in the video. Proving, there isn´t martial art better than other, but the moment and your area, one is more effective or less. One more suscribed. Congrats!!

[@FightCommentary]

Thanks! Or should i say, “Obrigado.”

[@celestialode]

kickass video man!

[@kylieminou7775]

Love the good natured attitude while trying to kill each other. Those two look like they are friends from outside the dojo

[@josephnatali8802]

The kyoku is strong with this one: standing in front of opponent without keeping distance, without going in and out, without keeping his hands up. Not shotokan, which would be much more difficult to touch or grab for a judoka (though when a grab happens, the result would be just as bad for the karateka). Still, one punch, one kick, enough to end the fight. But same with the judoka, one throw and one sub. Interesting to be aware of our weaknesses.

[@victornice858]

Terrific video! Educational baby!

[@steveevans4299]

The Armlock he got the first submission with was the ArmPit Lock - Waki Gatame

[@djs7734]

Great video and great commentary, it's like listening to Joey Styles!

[@FightCommentary]

Glad you enjoyed!

[@ArizonaTengu]

Goju Ryu student, my master taught that grapplers are afraid of getting hit. It’s been my experience that is the case for sure. Clock them one good time and they start to doubt themselves. Also, the blocks are also for escaping holds on the arms. The execution of the blocks assumes somebody is grabbing your arms from an extended position. Probably a lost lesson for most in the world honestly.

[@ularlularular]

i think the karate guy knew some pro wrestling moves that is why he could do some basic grab and that ankle lock. pro wrestling is huge in japan even back then in the 90s (even after before that).

[@CaPnBaLlBaG]

When karate guy jumped on that straight angle I straight up yelled lmao. That was awesome. All he had to do was go belly down and he taps the Judo guy. Seriosuly cool fight.

[@Budoexplained]

:30 平成ーへいせいーHeisei. It means becoming peace or turning into peace, Japanese get new era names generally when new emperor takes the throne.

[@Akkuzi]

what an awesome video

[@AljosaPLampe]

The armlock is called waki gatame which translates to armpit hold.

[@FightCommentary]

Cool! Thanks!

As far as I know sankaku garami is an armlock with the leg triangle being in place, while sankaku jime is the choke by itself. Gatame and Garami are often used in ne waza to describe kansetsu waza (join lock techniques).

[@FightCommentary]

Very cool. Love these terms! Keep them coming!

[@haroldborders3749]

AWESOMEEEEEEEE. I WAS STATIONED IN ASIA FOR OVER 8 YEARS. I LOVED IT THERE.

[@FightCommentary]

Tell us more!

[@AGuy-s5v]

That ko-uchi gari at 4:53 was dirty, lol. He just sent it, no effs given, lol.

[@shadedrob137]

Pretty sure that was o-uchi gari.

[@AGuy-s5v]

@@shadedrob137 It looked like it was an inner reap.. I'll need to watch it again, you may be right.

[@shadedrob137]

@@AGuy-s5v O-uchi (large/major inner) and ko-uchi (small/minor inner) are both inner reaps. The direction of the reap is the main difference.

[@AGuy-s5v]

@@shadedrob137 Right, ko-uchi is more in the direction that osoto gari would be from an orthodox (right foot forward) stance. That's all I'm trying to figure out, if it was o-uchi or not. I appreciate the clarification.

[@Katcom111]

Wow and this is the year SHOOTO existed.

[@shadowfighter6445]

I've seen this video before, I think the karate guy does kyokushin. Overall this fight was awesome 😎.

[@marc-albertjaquat6364]

Nice footage, very interesting as the judoka has now clue at blocking. That O Uchi at 4:53 must have knock some air out of karate guy. Now, we are train not to grab/touch the leg as it's shido (penalty).

[@johngr1747]

The upside down Armbar is called "Waki Gatame" And the Suplex is "Ura Nage" (I'm not a Judoka, I just know these lol)

[@jestfullgremblim8002]

Well done

[@johnl2648]

My eskrima grandmaster who has karate background and kung fu background in the 70s and 80s does execute leg scissors to reap to heel hook

[@luisbonnet3957]

By the way, Karate does have a few throws in the arsenal. They may not focus on these takedowns but they have a few but not all instructors emphasize it. They have locks, takedowns, and strikes.

[@Eri587]

What an interesting video. As far as i know only Wado Ryu Karate has grappling elements because the founder trained at Karate Shotokan and Daito Ryu Jiujitsu but even then that style has a aikido like approach to grappling with the japanese jujutsu style throws and some locks but what the karate guy did looked just like bjj or mma. Shooto was the mma organization at japan before pride, catch wrestling was huge in japan during the 80's so is possible that his karate instructor was the type to cross train and knew some grappling but if he trained for it he would have done a better job at defending so he probably had that one move and that's it. Edit: I just remembered about Shidokan Karate wich is a mix of kyokushin muay thai and judo but again if he trained that style he would have done a better job at defending what the judo guy was doing.

[@irvinjaycarranza6828]

It seems like the Karate guy is trained in Kudo karate. Good content btw.

[@_BillyMandalay]

very nice sportsmanship with these athletes

[@scottage_teaches_jujutsu]

When the judoka bridges up what he’s doing is stomping his heel to the ground to make the karatekas Achilles lock weaker then used better angling to finish his own

[@FightCommentary]

That’s super interesting! Thanks for the detail!

[@AlohaNationKode]

My school did teach a few Standing Joint locks, throws and sweeps.

[@potterspride1]

So the arm lock the Judo guy was doing is call Waki Gatame.

[@DemuDesu]

I'm 99% sure that karate guy is from Daido-juku, which means he has some knowledge of judo/jitsu. He wears that fist wrap thing to protect the knuckle from the hard plastic head-gear thing they usually wear. Other full contact schools fights with bear knuckles. Also other people pointed out, it's a most likely a demonstration, not a fight.

[@FightCommentary]

Very cool! I’ll have to check out Daido-Juku!

[@renato7184]

I doubt it. Daido Juku guys are much better at grappling.

[@yamiyomizuki]

there is a style of karate that also incorporates elements of Japanese jujutsu, I can't remember the name, that's probably what the karate guy in this video trained given that he knows the straight ankle lock. edit the style I'm thinking of is wado ryuu, I looked it up.

[@jdaimaoh765]

I practice Wado Ryu. It have only sweeps as throws, not techniques on the ground or joint locks

[@marcoleonettincrsr]

The name of the first armbar was ude hishige waki gatame The last throw of the first half is called osotogake with ude hishige juji gatame as the armbar

[@bryanhurley6303]

FYI, I believe both of the arm bars, the first and the last one after the big harai-goshi, were ude-hishigi-ude-gatame (arm pulling arm lock). The arm locks you mentioned in both cases could not have been correct. First, nothing with ashi-gatame, ashi-garami or anything else with ashi was done for submission, until the heel-hook. Ashi is foot, and both the arm bars I'm talking about were straight-arm-locks done using the tori's hands. You called out the juji-gatame attempt correctly. For background, the kimura and the americana are all BJJ names for variations of ude-garami, which stays ude-garami whether it's upwards or downwards, in judo terms. BJJ named it a Kimura after Kimura sensei destroyed Hélio Gracie's arm in their fight. The omoplata doesn't exist in judo in the form that BJJ does it, though ashi-garami is close. As far as Sankaku... it IS fun to say. it simply means triangle and there are several sankaku techniques in judo both with legs, and arms, just as in BJJ. What's different about judo sankaku jime, with regard to BJJ, is that more often than not, a judo sankaku is applied from behind the target's head, as opposed to from the target's guard. This is because it is an effective way to break down the turtle-position, which happens in judo more than BJJ, because the ruleset in BLL discourages letting someone take your back in any way. Judo rules make the turtle a viable defensive position as well as having a variety of offensive and counter opportunities from it.

[@DAVID-io9nj]

There is lots of evidence that most styles are similar if practiced "old school". Fighting for real doesn't work if you limit your techniques.

[@PhilipAJones]

The combatants are so expressive like they're cocky anime characters.

[@frankszulakiewicz5826]

Karate guy is not allowed to go full power because of rules.

[@turntablesrockmyworld9315]

the face down straight arm lock is a white belt arm lock called waki-gatame,

[@EngineerMK2004]

You can also tell the Judo guy is Judo, because the Kanji on his gi says Judo. The first throw was uchimata. He then did ude-hishige-gatame. If you need Judo comentary, I'm available. In Judo, KIMORA is ude-gurami.

[@fhtswstudios4260]

The sweep at the end is O Uchi gari "great inside sweep". In Ko Uchi gari, "small inside sweep" ,you use the inside of the foot to sweep your opponent.

[@FightCommentary]

Oh! That’s a good clarification! What are the characters for O and Ko?

[@fhtswstudios4260]

@@FightCommentary You're welcome! The character for ko in kanji is the same as xiao (little) in mandarin (sorry if I'm writing it wrong). While the character for O is the same as dà(big) .

[@bigheadrhino]

Awesome

[@tokyorobotto]

I checked the oringinal video. These are just students at a school festival having a friendly match. According to the original video description, the rules weren't properly decided. You can tell the ref (also a student -- the original video starts with him kicking a rolled up futon) is sort of making it up as he goes along, telling the karate guy that head kicks are not allowed (3:34 in original video) despite them being ok prior (lol). I'm not a judo guy (I do BJJ in Tokyo), but I guess you could call that last takedown o-uchi gari (大内刈)?

[@FightCommentary]

That makes sense! That ref seemed like he was just making it up 😝😝😝

[@fhtswstudios4260]

The first throw is called Harai goshi, it's almost like Uchi Mata except in Uchi Mata you put your leg against the inner thigh of your opponent instead of against the leg.

[@tacticaltemplar875]

This is clearly a playful exhibition match, but still cool. If face punches, knees, and elbows were allowed, I'd say it'd go to the karateka, but it would also increase the danger too much, so I understand why they didn't do it.

[@thecollector6746]

Except for the fact that there have been Karate vs Judo matches since the late 19th century and the Judoka without fail beat the breaks off the Karateka...friendly exhibitions or not. It's almost as if you don't actually know what you are talking about.

[@tacticaltemplar875]

@The Collector Doesn't address my point that this is obviously an exhibition match and they're not using face punches, knees, or elbows, now does it? I'm not trying to take anything away from Judo- I think it's a fantastic martial art. I just don't see the point of having matches where you take away most of one fighter's weapons. I have the same view when Muay Thai guys fight Kyokushin guys under Kyokushin rules- half of what one fighter does is now off limits while the other guy is fighting under rules he's used to.

[@thecollector6746]

@@tacticaltemplar875 You don't know WTF you are talking about. Stop.

[@tacticaltemplar875]

@The Collector Clearly you don't know wtf you're talking about or you'd have disagreed about something specific that I said. Low IQ moment on your part.

[@mr.bigstuff4755]

This is fun😂

[@fhtswstudios4260]

The armbar in the beginning is Wagi gatame "armpit armbar" in english.

[@Redsensei10p]

That first arm bar is the Waki Gatame. Means armpit arm-entanglement

[@FightCommentary]

Thank you! Is that a common beginner judo and Japanese Jiu Jitsu technique? I’ve seen a very vintage JJJ video that had it too!

[@Redsensei10p]

@@FightCommentary honestly I learned that from Erik Paulson, the founder of Combat Submission Wrestling. He claimed it to be from judo and catch wrestling I believe.

[@FightCommentary]

Have you sent us footage on IG before btw? I’m trying to put names to IG handles.

[@FoxholeFightClub]

nice.

[@badtothebone7613]

Your commentaries are more insightful than the late Don. F. Draeger. You should write a book. Hear my words.

[@FightCommentary]

Thank you so much! Consider becoming a channel member! That will help out the channel a lot!

[@franciscogonzalezramirez5033]

I train shoto-kan karate and yeap, we do practice joint locks and some throws and sweeps, and very little judo-like ground control techniques.

[@Braxtonkai]

Love these old style vs style vids

[@evanburgess8428]

This is just a humurous work

[@bw5020]

I did Tang Soo Do. Don't think I've ever been taught submissions that made me feel good about them

[@donaldduke2233]

What many people are unaware of is the fact that Gichen Funikoshi was a great admirer of Jigoro Kano and when he FIRST brought Karate to Japan from Okinawa Funikoshi Shihan taught it at The Kodokan Judo Institute. What everybody should be aware of is the fact that both Judo and Karate are assimilations of the various Martial Arts studied by their founders and that assimilation continued during the time that Karate was being taught at the Kodokan. It is only reasonable to assume that some techniques from each art bled over into the other. The Atemi Waza, or "striking techniques" of Judo are basically Shotokan Karate minus the Karate Katas. Kodokan Judo and Shotokan Karate are not adversaries, but more like brothers. By the way, SHOTO was the nom de plume of Gichen Funikoshi, who was also a famous author and poet.

[@thecollector6746]

1. Karate was never taught at the Kodokan. 2. Judo has absolutely no cross polinization from Karate worth mentioning. 3. All of Judo's atemi-waza comes from Kito and Fusen Ryu. Neither of which are Karate Ryu-ha

[@FightCommentary]

I'll have to check out Kito and Fusen Ryu. Thanks for these search terms!

[@saddiqstevens7200]

Hey Brother. Your videos are awesome. Can you do a video on a good boxer vs grappler and high level TKD vs Grappler?

[@FightCommentary]

I’ll look for some. Any you can recommend?

[@saddiqstevens7200]

@@FightCommentary I've been trying to find some. No luck. Probably not looking in the right place.

[@FightCommentary]

I might have found more TKD vs grappler videos 😎🤓

[@saddiqstevens7200]

@@FightCommentary nice. Looking forward to seeing them. Thanks bro. That one you did with the savate guy vs boxer was very interesting. I didn't know savate had hands like that.

[@JohnJohnson-pq4qz]

the first arm lock was a ground version of waki-gatame (arm pit lock).

[@thattrickytrickster612]

Traditional Okinawan karate has a lot of take downs, clinch work and even groundwork but the practices have been phased out over time in favor of the strikes. Many of the Kata in a lot of styles actually prioritize takedown and locks rather than just strikes because it was more focused on actual self defense and sparring. When the Japanese popularized it, they focused on the striking and the perfection of Kata as a performance. However, I still think a skilled Judoka or any decent BJJ practicitoner can win over even a good karateka purely because the throws, locks and groundwork of Judo and BJJ are hyperfocused for competition against other grapplers with similar or greater skill.

[@VicSage1836]

I train in Shito Ryu karate. We practice joint manipulations/ankle locks. Including that exact one in class two weeks ago. My sensei is also a black belt in Aikido, so I don't know if the joint manipulations come directly from karate, or if he's incorporating into our class because he finds them useful.

[@jestfullgremblim8002]

0:59 that wasn't an Ude Garami or Gatame. It was a modified Waki Gatame and then he went for the regular Waki Gatame.

[@ulhasanzk2249]

this has been going on for centuries testing what style is the best going from dojo to dojo

[@vidarrodinsson2237]

If you think about it, judoka was worse in many physical parameters. He was weaker, smaller, he couldn't keep the pace. But still could won many rounds. And surprisingly Karate guy knows at least some grappling, and what got most of the wins was grappling, even from karate guys. Grappling supremacy, guys.

[@cahallo5964]

3:50 no there aren't, locks in karate are 99% pins or part of a takedown, you are not pinning people with an ankle lock, he probably learnt that from watching pro wrestling lol.

[@Raadestdude]

That was cool. Udegarami is Kimura in Bjj

[@tommytaylor2799]

The armlock, in the beginning, looked like a Waki Gatame, in which the armpit is used.

[@jackolman]

Art vs art is old as the hills

[@sensei9295]

If you observe, the Judo guy had no padding from the karate guys strikes while the throws damage was mitigated by the mat. Which would have caused more damage and been more likely to end a fight on the street, the strikes or the throws?

[@FightCommentary]

That’s a good point!

[@Heroroar]

There is pretty much no ground grappling in karate but apparently a lot of early karateka cross trained in judo so maybe that’s where it came from?

[@jestfullgremblim8002]

No. It depends on your Karate Style. For example, many Wado Ryu schools train ground grappling

[@CharlesBetancourt-iq9oe]

The pre 1922 karate( okinawan kenpo) had grappling and floor fighting.Everybody should see the video" why boxing destroyed karate"- by Jesse Empkanp, to get a further underdtanding of what I mean..

[@gretashapiro4118]

This is as real as the Japanese professional wrestling

[@Skaxarrat]

The Karate guy learnt too late that if a Judo guy is grappling you, you don't fight them, you punch them in the face.

[@thelasthokage4347]

Now do it when Mike Tyson punches a Judo guy

[@The_true_Joe_mama]

jack dempsey was a judo black belt. I think jack could take a couple of tyson strikes

[@thelasthokage4347]

@@The_true_Joe_mama Doubtful, Mike had about 30 lbs on Jack in their respective primes.

[@The_true_Joe_mama]

@@thelasthokage4347 It could be any punch. He could definitely take a jab and counter punch from the range.

[@ghazanfaryaq6776]

What would it take for a Karate fighter to understand that Karate is not designed for competition. The Karate I was taught placed huge emphasis on attacking the vital areas of the body - fight dirty or else don't fight at all.

[@Ronnock]

C'mon, man! The Karate guy had the judo guy's back in the 2nd round, then the judo guy came at him for the uchimata ippon!

[@rotisseriebear5394]

Somehow, I suspect they traveled as a team and entertained students in different schools. They look like they are too relaxed, and holding back.

[@adriafro7321]

5:40 its definetely Uchi-mata!

[@AngryGrape1337]

And this, kids, is why Kudo was invented.

[@MrMeltdown]

Some cool things to note from both sides learning how to defend from another style is probably more important than training how to attack in that other style. The judo guy was out of position/dropped guard a few times and the results: Painfull looking leg shots: kzbin.info/www/bejne/r5PEg2yXfquigMk & kzbin.info/www/bejne/r5PEg2yXfquigMk and Devstating clout to the head: kzbin.info/www/bejne/r5PEg2yXfquigMk If a follow up to either in these rules was allowed it could have been game over. Likewise the throws looked pretty devastating if they weren't on a padded mat.

[@jasonrandall5148]

Can't believe you didn't know Wudo Ryu had leg locks and judo Jujitsu throws in it.

[@FightCommentary]

Show me! Always looking to learn more and feature awesome footage!