Game and Watch mains are the type of blokes to miraculously float towards the aroma of a freshly baked pie.
@BigJay_2 жыл бұрын
Game and watch mains are the type of mfs to go "wiwiwiwi" when sleeping and have a big bubble on their nose
@grayanddevpdx2 жыл бұрын
Game and Watch mains are the kind of people who stalk you while playing on their Game and Watch device. (I know because I am one.)
@loganharris78012 жыл бұрын
Game and Watch mains are the type to fall to the ground at inhumanly fast speeds with their feet lifted up in the air whenever a minor inconvenience occurres.
@theBCEproductions2 жыл бұрын
Game and Watch mains are the type of people that commit war crimes in Krakow in 1945 and get away with it because no one was going to say anything about a few missing Poles.
@kodahyphenlee2 жыл бұрын
Game and Watch mains are the type of blokes to not fall until they inevitably look down
@PatJamma2 жыл бұрын
The best description of G&W I've ever heard was "an offensively high tier character stuck with bottom tier defenses".
@Neogears13122 жыл бұрын
That’s my exact description of Videl.
@leithaziz27162 жыл бұрын
Goldlewis in a nutshell. Allthough it's not as bad as before.
@HellecticMojo2 жыл бұрын
@@Neogears1312 isn't she pitifully low in damage?
@iluvchess147362 жыл бұрын
"The glass to cannon ratio is kinda fucky"
@lowkeyajax2 жыл бұрын
@@HellecticMojo no
@landronsc2 жыл бұрын
"Even if you hold R to shield, you're gonna be holding an L" and "The glass-to-canon ratio is a bit fucky" are 2 of my favorite quotes now
@iluvchess147362 жыл бұрын
I never realized the joke with the first one until you wrote it out Now it's not funny anymore because I explained the joke to myself Great line tho
@peighnesshonourchign91642 жыл бұрын
*cannon
@Sean_Bird2 жыл бұрын
Ah yes, Melee Game & Watch. I guess being a buggy disaster fits his role in Subspace at least. Even still, I'd say he's one of Smash's defining weird characters, and I'm glad the Smash team actually managed to complete him in later games.
@BigYellowSilly2 жыл бұрын
For me it's weird, Melee G&W is defo the least complete, but he's easily the most fun imo. Stuff like his old N-air and D-air alongside his kill moves that lost a lot of kill power in later games make this my favourite iteration of the character, despite his issues
@Pokehero2 жыл бұрын
@@BigYellowSilly Man if Brawl G&W had Melee nair....... character would be mad fun
@RiahGreen2 жыл бұрын
@@Pokehero Play P+! You'll have a blast.
@whomdunit24572 жыл бұрын
@@BigYellowSilly So, with Melee as your favorite iteration, what would you say is your least favorite and why?
@BigYellowSilly2 жыл бұрын
@@whomdunit2457 Smash 4 G&W was really boring imo, character just felt really ok across the board
@Neogears13122 жыл бұрын
Fun fact about the bowser glitch btw; it’s because the damage as well as the animation is based on weight. The heavier you are the more damage it does. But at the specific weight values of puff and GnW makes bowsers grab miss the frame where it’s supposed to hit because they skip it perfectly enough for the game to not correct it like it does with pichu.
@BigYellowSilly2 жыл бұрын
Always wondered how Pichu got away with that, ty for the info
@bigbangbot-SuperSqank2 жыл бұрын
The damage isn't based on weight, the actual speed of the throw is. How the throw works is that it has a hitbox and it has a throw. All of the damage comes from the hitbox, which is only active for one frame. Puff and GNW just so happen to have a weight value which skips the one frame where the hitbox is active, so the throw has no damage. PAL Melee fixed this by making the throw the same speed against the entire cast, so the only "fix" Game & Watch got was a change made to Bowser, not him. Even though the throw does damage to Game & Watch in PAL, the throw is actually considerably slower, so it isn't a pure hinderance to GNW.
@Neogears13122 жыл бұрын
@@bigbangbot-SuperSqank yeah I knew I was a bit off but I was tired and just wanted to ball park the idea off memory so it was it least roughly known why.
@RiahGreen2 жыл бұрын
So many characters in melee would be more viable if their weaknesses weren't down to "Oh, sorry! The moveset you ordered doesn't actually work. We'll have to reorder but they won't come in until the next installment."
@MegaStunfiskandHat2 жыл бұрын
And then the next installment gutted neutral, punish and even general movement to the point where it doesn't feel like the same series :(
@ugh_lily2 жыл бұрын
just play p+ :)
@ugh_lily2 жыл бұрын
@@bN_isheeere no :)
@ugh_lily2 жыл бұрын
@@bN_isheeere because it’s bad
@ugh_lily2 жыл бұрын
@@bN_isheeere it’s funny that you respond to play ultimate when that’s the game that gutted neutral punish and movement
@Justpassingby2042 жыл бұрын
“Even if you hold R to shield, you’re gonna be holding an L” Bars
@MrMisfortune2 жыл бұрын
I feel like you could explain why G&W is bad to 100 different mains of him and 95 of them would respond with "haha funny 9 lol." And I respect it, it's a good reason to play a character
@BigYellowSilly2 жыл бұрын
Oh yeah like there's no way around the fact this character is dummy fun
@Lafenlafen12 жыл бұрын
Good luck finding 100 GnW mains LMAO
@MrMisfortune2 жыл бұрын
@@Lafenlafen1 given that Melee is extremely popular even today, 100 G&W mains probably exist, tracking them down would be the issue.
@KingOfDarknessAndEvil2 жыл бұрын
@@MrMisfortune With the popularity of Melee and Ultimate combined I doubt you could find 100 G&W mains
@deafnyan85062 жыл бұрын
G&w main here
@glockinmytoyota2 жыл бұрын
as the best active melee G&W player in the world, this is a great video! i really like how you focus on the strengths of his offense and the weakness of his defense. but, there are some minor nitpicks and notes that might serve as good accompaniments to your detailed analysis! - regarding his defense, perhaps the most understated element that makes G&W so bad on defense is his combo weight. dying at 70% is one thing, there are a lot of characters that die at early %. but, they dont get combo'd like G&W does. fox up-throw -> up-air true combos G&W well into the ~115% range, and it kills him at 70%. it's not like with Jigglypuff, where once you're past 85%, up-throw up-air is pretty much off the board. this is true of many, many, many kill setups in melee. G&W dies to them early, but they still combo him well into late%. it's unfortunate. - regarding throws, while you're correct that up- and down-throw are definitely the 2 best, his f-throw and b-throw are useful for far more than just positioning. these grabs are amazing DI mix-ups, as if your opponent DIs in, spacies catch huge combos started by either up-tilt or down-smash (depending on %), and non-spacies take a free N-air. and if they DI out, no matter the character, they're offstage - which is where G&W shines most. all of his throws are extraordinarily useful in different scenarios. - regarding his smash attacks, up-smash and down-smash are pretty much flipped from how you outline them here. up-smash ends up being pretty much useless, as any anti-air qualities it has are far outshine by up-tilt, and its impressive shield-stun is relatively meaningless 99% of the time. down-smash however, serves as one of his most potent combo moves at low%, extending perfectly off of his ground game and serving as a legitimately amazing DI mix-up combo tool. - regarding his up-tilt, this move is honestly just really understated. against spacies, it is easily his 3rd best move (behind only f-air and d-tilt). it is one of the strongest anti-air tools in the game, and the follow-up tree that it creates is legitimately insane. at low% you either get grabs or more up-tilts into f-air/n-air. at mid% you get a free n-air to send offstage, and at high %, you get N-air to kill. against non-spacies it is significantly worse, but it is also a great tool vs. Peach and Jigglypuff, as G&W can struggle when directly below many characters due to his awful shield. up-tilt mitigates this weakness significantly, giving him an amazing anti-air vs Peach/Puff that kills Peach at around ~125% and Puff at around ~110%. overall, this video was really awesome and i love the detail you went into to shine some light on melee G&W. i don't want this comment to sound like a nitpicky hater because that's really not what i'm aiming to do. i just feel like i'd be remiss if i didn't throw some of my extensive G&W knowledge into the fold as well. if you dont believe any of what im saying, feel free to watch some of my sets and see how some of these things hold true in high level play!
@BigYellowSilly2 жыл бұрын
Glad you enjoyed and thanks a ton for the insight! I really appreciate the feedback from a great player and don't worry about feeling nitpicky or anything, I really do appreciate this stuff and the more people that can see it the better 👌
@evanzigmond12132 жыл бұрын
let’s go new hampshire 😍
@SmokePudding2 жыл бұрын
Where can I find your sets?
@JT-vm5sb2 жыл бұрын
@@SmokePudding just look up glock in my toyota melee
@SmokePudding2 жыл бұрын
@@JT-vm5sb 👍
@WarioLandIV2 жыл бұрын
You speak so clearly, the auto subs are almost one to one with what you're saying. As a person with an audio processing disorder, it's really appreciated!
@BigYellowSilly2 жыл бұрын
That's really good to hear! I feel like I used to speak way too fast in some of my older vids, so I'm glad there's an improvement
@OG_DouG2 жыл бұрын
tbh, i feel G&W could've been stronger if the devs had more time to design him. and maybe Ganondorf would've had his own moveset instead of being a Captain Falcon semiclone
@BigYellowSilly2 жыл бұрын
In an ideal world Melee got one more month of development and some intern was like "ayo that shield trash"
@MrMisfortune2 жыл бұрын
Gannon being a Captain Falcon semiclone for 20 years is the biggest tragedy of the Smash series.
@mlalbaitero2 жыл бұрын
He's pretty different
@bageltoo2 жыл бұрын
I hate how smash characters never change past their initial appearance. Sonic still has 2 spindashes and Ganon is still a falcon clone
@Ganmorg2 жыл бұрын
@@bageltoo Samus also has this problem really bad, I really don’t like both versions of her in Smash
@delor422 жыл бұрын
"If you're holding R to shield, you'll still be holding an L" Absolute genius line my good sir
@arJunebugSmash2 жыл бұрын
this is a detailed moveset analysis, well-done! i love how G&W could totally be a good character if most of his moves just... worked LOL. i'd reckon he'd be at least a mid tier with functioning aerials + shield buff. it's very hard to make a small disjoint character bad in smash, but somehow Melee managed to do it.
@BigYellowSilly2 жыл бұрын
Thank you! I do wonder a lot how a G&W with just those issues fixed would fit into Melee, I kinda hope that's how he turns out in Beyond Melee and isn't completely new
@graxjpg10 ай бұрын
in casual gameplay i think hes one of the best characters right now because of his lack of utilization. i just play with friends, granted we all know how to DI and wavedash etc and G&W has served me well
@yottabyte61462 жыл бұрын
"So even if you hold R to shield, you're gonna be holding an L." Greatest line I've ever heard
@ems67062 жыл бұрын
I think Fighting Game Garbage could feature very poorly designed top tiers. Ice Climbers in Brawl are top two... because they have confirmable ToD chain grab on a lot of characters. Like they just 9-1 a lot of characters and I will swear to this day Meta Knight was the lesser of two evils in the top two and they did more to chase people out of Brawl than MK did. Like MK was incredibly op.... but he actually played a game of smash, the mirror was a really cool matchup that was very fun to watch, and he took skill to use optimally. IC chain grabs might be hard to learn, but I'd argue four free stocks for practicing chain grab set ups is an inordinate amount of payoff for the work. What a dumpster character who I'm glsd has faded into obscurity they deserved it.
@NeoGraena2 жыл бұрын
Wobbling my man
@k-leb46712 жыл бұрын
And now they kinda suck in Ultimate. Shame. There's still some wicked stuff they can do by desyncing the two climbers' moves, but once again it's an inordinate amount of payoff (just in the opposite favour this time).
@elmaionesosexo2 жыл бұрын
@@k-leb4671 the thing with them is that, desync is amazing if you learn to do it, but they don't have anything else to do
@Rukir2 жыл бұрын
About the beginning of the video: According to Smash Ultimate's roster numbers, game and watch WAS the last character ever added to melee (ganondorf was 4th last, then mewtwo, then roy, then g&w). According to the debug menu's character order, he was 2nd last, then ganondorf. In either case, it was close to the very end, and the last non clone character.
@SSM24_2 жыл бұрын
Honestly Ultimate's fighter numbers are kinda arbitrary in a lot of ways, and either way certainly not representative of implementation order during development specifically. According to the wiki, for the case of Melee's unlockable characters their fighter numbers are just based on when you unlock the characters in Melee, and G&W is the last character you unlock in Melee.
@cola53752 жыл бұрын
Fighter numbers are based on when the fighters were annouched for the game more so than when they were put in. This includes both commercials and the order characters were unlocked. In melee G&W is the secret final character and not that many new comers were annouced before launch.
@lpfan44912 жыл бұрын
Ganondorf was the last character put in? No wonder they couldn't do better than a clone.(Though maybe it was a good thing since he is the most legendary clonecharacter of all time. Sure, he sucks in every game, but it is always fun to play him because actually winning with him is so incredibly satisfying.)
@theobserver4214 Жыл бұрын
@@lpfan4491 He’s aight in Melee, still worse than Falcon but Ganondorf has his own worthwhile advantages in that game. A midtier character
@ReitheOffbeatOtaku2 жыл бұрын
It's so funny to compare G&W's Melee down-smash, where you either explode or take 2 percent with no in-between, to the Ultimate version, where you usually get buried in the ground, but sometimes the game is nice enough to semi-spike you instead. That being said, though, it's interesting to see an overview like this as an Ultimate player, since even though G&W is a lot higher on the Ult tier list than the Melee one, he might've been even more ridiculous if he had some of his moves that got replaced over time like his old nair and fair.
@DinkyWaffle2 жыл бұрын
I am so thankful he has bomb (which despite the jank, it's still a fantastic move and allows him to get free grabs at any percent) instead of card because he would legitimately be a top-tier contender instead of this weird counterpick I beat Pikachu but lose to Ike type beat
@ReitheOffbeatOtaku2 жыл бұрын
@@DinkyWaffle Yeah, the bomb is a pretty strong move, (to the point that it's more of a trade-off than an outright nerf) but Ultimate G&W with that disjointed fair would've been a menace. It was also a nice change just for the sake of move variety; the only other projectile aerials I can think of in Smash are Mega Man's pellets (which are pretty mediocre) and Mii Gunner's fair, (which is more straightforward, and not especially versatile since it forces them backwards) so it was nice to see them experiment with that concept a little more.
@DinkyWaffle2 жыл бұрын
@@ReitheOffbeatOtaku I think the other projectile aerials are actually pretty good, gunner fair is alright as a poke and pellets are pretty good in general
@ReitheOffbeatOtaku2 жыл бұрын
@@DinkyWaffle Yeah, to be fair, I'm not a Mega Main, so there are probably a lot of uses for pellets I don't know about, lol. As for Gunner fair, I agree it's a good move, I just meant that you can't really combo with it or anything crazy like that when I said it's not versatile.
@RosalinaSama2 жыл бұрын
@@ReitheOffbeatOtaku villager also has them and theyre really damn good
@Altilt2 жыл бұрын
This is honestly an amazingly thorough analysis, this character has so many easy to miss positives and negatives that usually I don't see them all in one place. The only thing I could even think of that wasn't mentioned is his defense being made even worse by his janky tech roll animations, which are relatively easy to react to and punish compared to most characters. Every other interesting factoid of the character is covered, from the 0-frame-lag uptilt and incredible disjoint/duration of some of his moves, to the janky chaingrabs, terrible hitbox on 9, and weird issue with aerial Bucket. Really a solid, complete look at the character.
@nickvitale2 жыл бұрын
22:53 “Even when you hold R to shield, you’re gonna be holding an L.” 💀💀💀
@theboi55842 жыл бұрын
Melee Mr. Game & Watch is one of the most fascinating characters in the entire franchise. A lot of his moves and properties are just odd, like the pummel slide and kamikaze down-b. But even with all his weird issues and quirks, he’s genuinely fun to play, it’s kinda fun to destroy your friends as the buggy 2-D man.
@graxjpg10 ай бұрын
what are those techniques you mentioned? hes my favorite character, but i mostly play 64.
@InsomniaDaydreamer2 жыл бұрын
Mr Game and Watch is genuinely so decent that it's kinda funny
@BigYellowSilly2 жыл бұрын
He is quite literally doing he best
@lvl5Vaporeon2 жыл бұрын
Imagine trying to l-cancel as G&W when you realize some Numbnuts decided to give him a nonstandard landing state and you just thought you couldn't do it. Totally wasn't me wasting my time in training mode guys...
@graxjpg2 ай бұрын
its not the landing state, its that the non-L-cancelable airs are codes as special moves
@jfm58642 жыл бұрын
People tend to focus on the L cancel thing with G&W when really if you were given one thing to change about him to improve him the most, it would be pretty low on the list. Dying at 80 because you get shield poked by a falling Fox uair or something is way more detrimental to the character than being unable to L cancel 2 aerials that aren't really even that good and 1 aerial that is a kill/edgeguard tool who's endlag doesn't really matter anyway.
@myboy_2 жыл бұрын
If game and watch could L cancel, shield, and dodge I would main him. He is so fun to play
@Noname-cs8wu2 жыл бұрын
Try him on p+ he feels do good
@SonicTheCutehog2 жыл бұрын
Mr. Game & Watch was the last unique character added to Melee. The six clone characters were added after him.
@crack4184 Жыл бұрын
G&W is a clone of Mario with some attacks changed.
@graxjpg2 ай бұрын
no only one other character was added after him, except ganondorf. the general consensus though, is that GnW was programmed after ganon because of the fact that he wasnt finished.
@graxjpg2 ай бұрын
@@crack4184some? you mean all? he has some similar attributes but all unique moves
@thetruejerrycan2 жыл бұрын
I remember in another video you described him as "pretending to have a shield" and honestly I'm still dying at that description. Very well-made analysis on G&W! I knew his defense was bad but I never knew that some of his moves were so jank in both bad and good ways
@paddythelegend16712 жыл бұрын
How to make G&W viable -Make him be able to L-Cancel all of his aerials -Fix his shield and dodges G&W is now viable
@smoceany9478 Жыл бұрын
nah tbh those dont make him that much worse, the real problem is being comboed to oblivion and dying at 70
@vivelespatat267011 ай бұрын
@@smoceany9478He'd be Ganondorf tier at least, or DK. Not amazing characters but they can actually do shit without being held back by having a core ability available to every characters made non functionnal.
@smoceany947811 ай бұрын
@@vivelespatat2670 it would make him a bit better, the shield would help the most, l cancels dont really change too much, and spotdodge, how many times do you spotdodge, unless your borp almost never. but really the big problem is his weight
@draga_9 ай бұрын
so project m/+ then
@KrakheadsVideoHole2 жыл бұрын
IIRC people guessed that he was added very late in development because in melee's debug menu, the character's ID numbers are sorted by when they were added into the game and him and Ganon are the last two
@BigYellowSilly2 жыл бұрын
That's what I was thinking, I checked in the Debug menu and he wasn't second last, and in M-ex he's third last, but I know for a fact I've heard that before
@lieutenantpepper34212 жыл бұрын
Who was the first? Curious.
@BigYellowSilly2 жыл бұрын
@@lieutenantpepper3421 Mario, Fox and Falcon are the first three listed in Mextool, while G&W, Ganon and Roy are last
@lieutenantpepper34212 жыл бұрын
@@BigYellowSilly Huh. I assumed it'd be Kirby or something, but those make sense.
@aetherius62212 жыл бұрын
@@BigYellowSilly in an AsumSaus video he points out that Roy doesn't have a black and red nameplate like everyone else on the character selection screen, but a pure black one. Roy is definitely the last added, I know that for almost a fact because he was added at the announcement of fire emblem 6, which hadn't even been released yet, making Roy the only original smash character, who guest-starred in FE lmao
@BolognaBoyTK2 жыл бұрын
G&W is a reason I still have a big soft spot for Melee despite not playing it in 5+ years, I love how even though he's technically low tier he's just so fun to play and he can pull off some amazing stuff.
@bastionunitb73882 жыл бұрын
Game and watch is a character that we've just gotten used to seeing, so much that sometimes we forget having a silhouette that is an amalgamation of old LCD games as a playible character is very strange
@The5lacker2 жыл бұрын
As far as G&W's base stats goes, given Mario is the "Default" to which all other characters are compared against, as far as development goes, I imagine EVERY character started out with Mario's stats, which were adjusted as development went on. G&W just... wasn't, because we had to WRAP THIS SHIT UP.
@Eiji4752 жыл бұрын
I think G&W would actually be a decent mid tier if his bugs were fixed. I don't think Melee mods should do a whole rebalance and nerf the top tiers and such but they should mod G&W and a couple other low tiers just to fix them slightly.
@BigYellowSilly2 жыл бұрын
I've always thought a nice balance mod would be to buff everyone below Mario to around as strong as him, that way Melee's core meta is mostly untouched but some characters are more fun
@Eiji4752 жыл бұрын
@@BigYellowSilly ya something like that would be nice. I love watching low tiers but you can tell they are extremely held back by just being coded bad half the time aka G&W, Roy, Mewtwo, Zelda etc. However Link stanky leg stays haha
@bageltoo2 жыл бұрын
Exactly Low Tiers are fine especially in a game this old. But no character’s weakness should be “this move is coded incorrectly”
@theovermind60412 жыл бұрын
@@BigYellowSilly I think everyone below SAMUS should be buffed to be good as her. Also fix the damn cyclone glitch with Luigi.
@freddiesimmons13942 жыл бұрын
@@BigYellowSilly why would we want to avoid touching the meta?
@cyph1572 жыл бұрын
And now in ultimate, he is rly fricking good.
@elmaionesosexo2 жыл бұрын
and fun which is more important
@Rarest262 жыл бұрын
Ah, Melee G&W, probably the most representative character of the whole game: a fucking broken disaster that can be kinda fun. Even if it’s as broken as RBY which, considering you love both, I’m assuming it’s a good thing in this channel.
@josephhanicak79222 жыл бұрын
Fighting game garbage shouldn't be just for low tiers. It should also be great characters with trash design as well imo
@Neogears13122 жыл бұрын
I’d edit that to say “just for”
@josephhanicak79222 жыл бұрын
@@Neogears1312 could have sworn that I did. I made the comment very fast lol
@rac1equalsbestgame8532 жыл бұрын
_Brawl Meta Knight_
@josephhanicak79222 жыл бұрын
@@rac1equalsbestgame853 yes and no. Was a ton of fun to play, but insanely overpowered. The main problem with meta knight isn't necessarily in his moves themselves. They killed too early, and we're way too safe. Meta Knight could have been an amazingly designed character if values were adjusted. Bayo was a way worse character design wise imo. Like her problem was design wise. Her witch time was just stupid in concept, bat within was also dumb, and her combos were stupid. Not just the touch of death one either, she had so many.
@rac1equalsbestgame8532 жыл бұрын
@@josephhanicak7922 Whatever, BOTH deserve a trip to fighting game garbage.
@SSB_Seal2 жыл бұрын
Game & Watch is my favorite low tier in Melee (and also the most viable one imo), so I really enjoyed hearing you talk about him!
@cirlu_bd2 жыл бұрын
"the Glass-to-Canon ratio is a little bit fucky" is the best way to describe G&W, thank you so much for finding these words I love them so much !!
@SP_Sour2 жыл бұрын
Very glad you covered him, I was hoping you would someday but wasn't sure. Welcome to Melee, the world's most popular unfinished beta... I main G&W and boy is it a struggle. Not covered in the video is how being a low or mid tier in that game feels really extra sucky given just how dominant and powerful the top tiers are.
@hannahbriarly41922 жыл бұрын
Also absorbing powerful projectiles such as pk flash and then using the bucket on an opponents shield will almost instantly kill you as game and watch is pushed away from the opponent at incredible speed. He also will kill/shield break anyone who dares stand between him and the blast zone
@k-leb46712 жыл бұрын
Wow really? Man that move really is stupid in this game
@hadesKIU2 жыл бұрын
This is an amazing Christmas gift (no matter how late it is.) Other than this series being fun to watch and you being a great KZbinr, some of the lines like "Holding R to take an L" and "Glass to canon ratio" are absolute gold.
@firstnamelastnamesb2 жыл бұрын
The thing about Mr. Game & Watch being the second-to-last character added to Melee is definitely untrue. All of the clones were added long after the unique characters were decided. Sakurai has stated that the roster is decided at the very start of development, and that clones are added near the end. This is further supported by the Debug Menu, which lists the non-clones in mostly alphabetical order (just with Zelda and Sheik put next to eachother), while the clones are tacked on at the end, with Ganondorf (who we know was the final addition) at the very end of the playable roster list. If the clones are listed in the order they were added, then the order goes Falco -> Young Link -> Dr. Mario -> Roy -> Pichu -> Ganondorf, meaning Pichu was the second-to-last addition. I think a more likely case for why Mr. Game & Watch is seemingly unfinished is because he might've been on the chopping block but was able to be completed in time for inclusion. This sort of thing has actually happened numerous times throughout the series. Some examples include Lucario, Wolf, Toon Link, and Jigglypuff in Brawl, and Bowser Jr in Smash 4. In direct contrast, it seems like Piranha Plant in Ultimate was an example of a character that didn't get lucky like the aforementioned ones and had to be pushed to DLC off of the main roster.
@richieosborn26392 жыл бұрын
The first Key fighter, before Sora came into the roster at long freaking last.
@GanjamanNL2 жыл бұрын
KZbin Gold: Big Yellow (FGC)
@BigYellowSilly2 жыл бұрын
(:
@cise38952 жыл бұрын
One thing about G&W throws that I noticed is that his hands are a pretty obvious tell as to which way he’s throwing. It’s completely impractical, since the motion’s only visible like 2 frames before you’re launched, but it’s kinda neat.
@simongotborg38662 жыл бұрын
Cool video, just wanted to point out an error. It's a common missconception that grabs come out on frame 6 (because for some reason the frame counter starts at zero on grabs instead of 1 like with other moves) but G&W, like other characters, actually has a frame 7 grab.
@BigYellowSilly2 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the info, I should've copped that but the site I was double checking frame data on said 6
@simongotborg38662 жыл бұрын
@@BigYellowSilly Yeah, a lot of sources gets is wrong so it's an easy mistake. Thanks for the reply, makes me glad to know I'm not just wasting time writing comments like that. Great video anyway, have a nice day ^_^
@Harmless_Music2 жыл бұрын
oh man. I remember there was a time in my life where I mained him in melee for a long time. I actually did okay in my local at the time, but he’s got some hilariously stupid stuff that definitely hurts (and helps) viability I’m super glad you acknowledged his jab! It’s so good, single jab gives you either dtilt shield poke/pressure to beat oos or grab if they hold shield. Up tilt is also a phenomenal anti-air because no end lag and great range too. Also, f-tilt is a good tool to cover ledge vs spacie side b (and guarantee edgeguards on yoshis vs all cast iirc). F-smash still better in neutral tho lol Really happy you made this one! edit: okay I had to talk about this because it wasn’t mentioned, and it was my favorite thing to take stocks with: G&W fthrow and backthrow are kill throws at mid %’s. If your opponent DI’s into either throw, you get a free nair, which usually kills past center stage (especially on Yoshi’s).
@serix21962 жыл бұрын
He was so fun to play in Melee and it made him my favorite character as a kid. He's just lame as hell in the future games.
@HaVaJawbreaker2 жыл бұрын
I know the topic isn’t on BM, but I really hope they just fix his shield and L canceling and nothing else because that’s sorta all he needs to be at least good
@BigYellowSilly2 жыл бұрын
I trust them to do some cool stuff but if they give him his Ultimate aerials I'll cry
@nimbus77272 жыл бұрын
I’ve wanted to main G&W in Melee for the longest time. Really interesting character due to his jank nature and weird properties. His combos also seem fun.
@user-ww7vq3gs6p2 жыл бұрын
i love these videos, are there plans to make a fg gold or fg garbage on hftf? that game is full of war crime and disfunctional characters
@jebbanana23092 жыл бұрын
i wouldnt call any of the characters dysfunctional but pet shop sure is a war crime
@wolfgangervin25822 жыл бұрын
@@jebbanana2309 Hftf is the only game I can think of with two non-boss characters banned from play.
@jebbanana23092 жыл бұрын
@@wolfgangervin2582 that still doesnt mean the game is full of dysfunctional characters. just two insanely op ones
@wolfgangervin25822 жыл бұрын
@@jebbanana2309 yup
@starbreaker67402 жыл бұрын
@@wolfgangervin2582 who else is banned other than petshop?
@JC-hi8fk13 күн бұрын
As a kid I was sure he was the best character because he was the last you unlocked.
@ems67062 жыл бұрын
Melee is 100 percent one of the more interesting Nintendo games in terms of wanting more info about it's development. I would pay good money for a book that goes into the nitty gritty of it's development cycle. it sounds chaotic and stressful for the amount of time they had to make it. like the problem with a book trying to figure all the details out about it is I wouldn't be shocked if the people who worked on it have generally truama blocked that period from their minds cause the conditions sound generally inhumane and bordering if not overtly exploitative. maybe Nintendo also has some investment in not letting all the brutal crunch details getting out. I know Sakurai has some lingering health problems from his work schedule and I hope gets time off more now to rest.
@MrPomegranX2 жыл бұрын
I always questioned how he has the parachute for his neutral air but not his up-b
@large_hadron_colander83012 жыл бұрын
8:26 it's unsettling seeing G&W face directly at you, w/ hammers out too...
@Point5_2 жыл бұрын
hey that's my main. One thing, I don't know if it's a true combo or not but you can combo out of b-throw and f-throw into n-air with bad DI. Not if they DI but how will they know which throw is it ?
@BigYellowSilly2 жыл бұрын
Even if it's not true that's a pretty cool DI mixup tbh
@jman20502 жыл бұрын
Kinda interested to see a similar Fighting Game Garbage video on Melee Pichu, since he’s a joke character who was made bad on purpose but who isn’t actually as bad as you’d think.
@sagacious032 жыл бұрын
Great analysis video! Thanks for uploading!
@strikerhutassa2 жыл бұрын
I instinctually said "oh fuck yeah" when I saw this in my feed.
@anothenblue26302 жыл бұрын
G&W is one of the few characters that are bad by mistake rather than terrible design. He'd be in a far better position if only he could actually block and L-cancel (more so the former). Wouldn't make him top tier, but he'd be perfectly serviceable. That's the kind of low tier where I can at least get what the devs are going for. Meanwhile, you have nonsense like Kirby having low range and low mobility (like why is that even a thing, how is he supposed to do anything?) and Little Mac being a stupidly polarizing, but still low tier character that's neither fun to play as nor fight because he's too good in his own field, but also too terrible anywhere else (which just happens to include literally 2-3rds of the combat in Smash, i.e. aerial combat and platforms) to actually fight his opponent in anything resembling a fight. I'd also throw in basically every super heavyweight until like 4's Bowser, who doesn't even really stick to that archetype anymore because he is too fast for that now. They really need to just give extra hitstun for big guys so that they can have combos rather than get one lucky hit in, then have to win neutral again when that's already pretty hard to do. It's one of the main differences between beefy guys in other fighting games and Smash.
@notawizzrd8862 жыл бұрын
been hyped for a new FGG, thanks Yellow
@naquan592 жыл бұрын
21:55 So that's why Hungrybox rolls so much more then any other smash player and yet somehow get's away with it.
@RosiYYAP2 жыл бұрын
Yissss another Melee FGG G&W is so weird lmao. My friend from uni mains him and made him work at our weeklies, but it's such a struggle to get over his weaknesses. On the flipside tho, that same friend mained G&W in PM (back in 3.6, no less), and good god did the PMBR turn the character into a glass cannon but without the glass lmao. P+ has since toned him down, but the G&W of 3.02 thru 3.6 was a fucking monster lmao
@cobb7972 жыл бұрын
I’m amazed how he went from being complete shit to being god in ultimate
@ink34872 жыл бұрын
He's only god in ultimate because he's one of the 2 characters with a positive MU against pikachu
@kingdedede55702 жыл бұрын
@@ink3487 but ness isn't god so what's your point
@cobb7972 жыл бұрын
@@kingdedede5570 cause ness cannot defeat mr game and watch
@callinater6133 Жыл бұрын
@@ink3487 uh, no. He beats most of the top tiers lmao
@c4rt00nk1d2 жыл бұрын
Man, imagine how crazy GnW would be if just his "special" aerials and shield was normal... L cancelling that nair would be a war crime Maybe a Melee but Dev oversights are fixed mod would be cool.
@omlett64822 жыл бұрын
Melee G&W DAir walked so Smash 4 Cloud DAir could run
@JAnne_Bonne2 жыл бұрын
I… I still don’t get how they managed to not check his shield. Like… HUH!?
@BigYellowSilly2 жыл бұрын
I genuinely think it was intentional at this point tbh, like they made it this bad on purpose so his Light Shield was the size of a reg one
@mattguy17732 жыл бұрын
Thank god mr game and watch is a finished character now
@klewis13732 жыл бұрын
“Even if you’re holding R, you’re gonna be holding an L” Hilarious I had to drop a like on the video at that moment
@tinyclover38492 жыл бұрын
imagine a universe where game & watch's nair was L-cancellable
@OTHERMRBABCOCK2 жыл бұрын
Wanna see a character with just as good offense but the easily worst defense similar to this character? Try Alpha-152 in any of the Dead or Alive 5 series. Fast pokes, some powerful and quick throws, does excellent strike damage, and is fast in general as MOST of her stats are Kasumi’s. The issues? These are HUGE: Cannot actually counter hold attacks. She just teleports behind her opponent. Her parry does a very weak hit that isn’t comboable into anything. This character has no regular wake-up kick, which in a game based on pressure and momentum is a big weakness. Her H+K getup attack is okay but easy to catch onto. She is the lightest character in the game and gets juggled for more damage than any other character in the game. In every character’s combo challenge, every character gets a specific combo to do that only works on her. Juggles are the core element of doing damage in DOA, so this combined with a gimmick wake up kick is a fatal blow. She’d make a great character for fighting game garbage
@CrossoverFan4life2 жыл бұрын
Fast forward to Ultimate and he's an incredible character, 2nd only to Pikachu among lightweights
@k-leb46712 жыл бұрын
It's funny how just having a jank shield and spot dodge is enough to bury him into low tier. If both of those were fixed, perhaps he could be high tier.
@birdvibes5102 жыл бұрын
Man, I never knew some of these things like Forward Smash avoiding grabs, I wonder if him being finished in Melee would’ve changed his place in the tier list
@freshbroceries46012 жыл бұрын
Now you gotta do a fighting game gold on PM game and watch to show how just a few changes to an otherwise middling character can turn them into a monster.
@sarasaland47092 жыл бұрын
I am also 100% of the camp that G&W should’ve kept his Melee N-Air.
@tsyumamatsuthehavenofguard322 жыл бұрын
Man I wish I can say game and watch was fixed in the modern day, but considering that the damn bucket glitch still exists even after all the patches, they really didn't
@PeppySweetheart2 жыл бұрын
Oh boy, a new Big Yellow video! 😃
@ugh_lily2 жыл бұрын
great vid! love gnw and hes one of my favorite characters in p+
@HollyBunnySilly2 жыл бұрын
Game and Watch was one of my mains back in brawl when I first started with the series. I always chose the cool looking characters, or the ones I recognized, and I've stuck with G&W to this day. I never got to play OG Melee considering I didn't exist yet, but he still looks like he has all the traits I loved him for in Brawl. (and also he goes bip bop bep beep beep boop and he is like I am Mr gay man watch and he get 9 and crowd go OOOOOOOO)
@philipkelly73692 жыл бұрын
I'm sorry, I thought this series was called Fighting Game garbage? What is this casual party game doing here?
@BigYellowSilly2 жыл бұрын
Next Fighting Game Garbage is on Mario Party 6 take it or leave it
@equinox38612 жыл бұрын
@@BigYellowSilly Wtf? Mario Party 6 is one of the best ones.
@gamenwatch62692 жыл бұрын
I've been a game and watch main from Melee to Ultimate... the way our reputation is based on what game we play... though...
@terribleawful2 жыл бұрын
is that what sausages look like over in the queen's land
@kaiserbts80072 жыл бұрын
What I think of when I see these stat comparisons is that maybe game and watch is a reference to him existing before Mario
@salamistick15252 жыл бұрын
I think that it is important to note that even though down smash is a pretty horrible move if you get the weak hit the strong hit is pretty good being used for combos at low percents and having decent knock back that being said it is hard to use and I can see why you said it was bad and I would also like to shine some light on his forward and back throws being that if the opponent holds in it is a free fair (unless that are super floaty then it’s a nair) and if they hold out they are stuck having to recover which g&w has a very good edge guard game. G&W’s jigglypuff matchup is not even that bad either I think you could argue it’s almost even because if you poke jigglypuff with tons of fairs and nairs she will die very quickly.
@BigYellowSilly2 жыл бұрын
If I remember right I heard that G&W/Puff is around even but if Puff gets a lead it's very hard for G&W to even it out, ty for the insight tho I had always heard D-Smash was just awful so it's cool seeing how it can be used
@jabarithegoldenlucario88412 жыл бұрын
To sum it up, Game and Watch in Melee is exactly like his inclusion in the game. Really damn weird.
@eggmug5622 жыл бұрын
Lemme tell ya somethin bout ultimate game n watch tho: there is nothing more satisfying than taking a stock, and then immediately taking another at 0 with a 9. Fuckin beautiful
@WilfredCthulu2 жыл бұрын
Oh no lol. Thought he was so cool and mysterious now here is with garbage's return. Ahem, beeg yellow, are you at all invested in the Akaneia Build? I actually thought it was already dead with Beyond Melee being the successor but no they just had a huge update. I actually think I might like it better than Beyond because it feels more like the Smash Remix (another mod I cannot recommend enough love that shit) of Melee. They already added two characters that don't even seem planned for Beyond so I think you'll enjoy. I would like you doing videos on it too of course.
@rjante22362 жыл бұрын
I see you everywhere lol
@BigYellowSilly2 жыл бұрын
I saw the update but haven't tried it yet, looks amazing tho I have all the respect in the world for them
@WilfredCthulu2 жыл бұрын
@@BigYellowSilly Ah yes. You might also love Project M Ex Remix which also seems to be getting an update soon. Golden Age of Smash mods?
@Bacchus3252 жыл бұрын
You should try and do Smash 4 Vanilla Diddy Kong not as broken as Brawl Meta Knight but still caused a lot of controversy. In that same vein you could do Smash 4 Bayonetta.
@RogueGetsWashed2 жыл бұрын
As a person who mains G&W in melee, it doesn't matter if you main a low tier character, what you do with that character is what counts. Take advantage of their quirks.
@LordRobbyshin2 жыл бұрын
17:49 Man, I love fighting games.
@demonicgamerazazel98662 жыл бұрын
Babe wake up, new Big Yellow video
@reilly50052 жыл бұрын
G&W is 1 of 2 melee low tiers that I will only play in melee. the other is pichu
@ChillavaKirby2 жыл бұрын
"I really like this move I wish they didn't change it to the fucking fish bowl in the later games." Trust me, no you don't.
@BigYellowSilly2 жыл бұрын
I know the fishbowl is really good it's just snore tbh
@ChillavaKirby2 жыл бұрын
@@BigYellowSilly That’s not what I meant exactly. I mean modern gnw is kinda balanced around having crazy frame data and being difficult to land safe hits on, along with some pretty above average damage output, but he struggles to actually secure the kill sometimes. If he had the power to basically turn himself into an active c4 explosion at will, all hell would break loose.
@majordorkus90792 жыл бұрын
I love GnW hes been my main for 10 yrs nice vid yellow
@khaztv2 жыл бұрын
Throw animations are useful for mixups at the ledge against fastfallers. If they di in against up throw and you forward the punish is very easy
@Mecceldorf2 жыл бұрын
Game & Watch doesn’t seem bad. That is until you try doing anything you would do with every other character.
@ScatLuigi2 жыл бұрын
if g&w were a finished character he'd be pretty fucking good but if melee were a finished game it'd be pretty fucking bad sacrifices need to be made somewhere i guess
@moss79102 жыл бұрын
I’ve always found melee's low tiers to be charming
@BigYellowSilly2 жыл бұрын
I agree I'm not really sure what it is but I think they're neat
@Parpeing2 жыл бұрын
@@BigYellowSilly its the engine imo fighting with the same movement tools and tricks than most of the cast makes it feel like... a scooter kid at a skatepark you cant do shit nearly as cool as the skateboarders but damn can you shmoove
@ieatatsonic2 жыл бұрын
I main game and watch because he's funny, but also I play Rivals of Aether so no shield isn't a huge behavioral shift for me. Nair is an incredible kill move and his edge guard options aren't bad. Once you get used to edge-cancel spacing his options open up a bit more. Edge cancel bair or upair just kinda locks people on platforms. He can grab ledge from farther than it looks, though his recovery still isn't fantastic.
@MeesterTweester2 жыл бұрын
His fair is actually a cake box, not a credit card