Film Theory: The Empire's Biggest MISTAKE! (Star Wars)

[@ThePete7499]

I like this guy

[@agentwashington9911]

Yo its Leorge Gucas.

[@AdamTheCannon]

yes mhm gorg lucas

[@Agent_Pear]

wait a minuite...

[@Expev1a]

Yoooo Lucas George!

[@macncheezboi_designs]

WOW actual George Lucas (Hopefully)

[@unknownvariable9239]

This is exactly why Grand Admiral Thrawn developed the Tie Defender, it has shields, faster speeds, greater damage and hyperdrive. It was meant for mass production which would cripple the Rebels. Sadly, it was replaced with a space station that blew up, twice. Lesson: listen to the smartest Officer in the Empire

[@joshuaded1052]

Finally someone made a comment about Grand Admiral Thrawn tie fighter

[@captian00f88]

I was gonna comment that :(

[@reazon3955]

wait, he doesn't talk about it in this video? wtf man

[@winterssunshine]

100%

[@kingklp0442]

I was literally came in the comments to say this lol but to be honest thrawns tie still didn’t help the visibly but did on all you said above. I want a Star Wars what if just to see how his ties would have effected if he would have got the funding to make them over the Death Star

[@crackerswithchez]

The Empire followed what is called "The Tarkin Doctrine", which was essentially the idea that fear, is the best way to subject a galaxy. The Empire used star destroyers, ships that worked best against other capital ships. The main problem with this, is that the Empire was fighting a small, guerilla force who used small, capable ships to hit and run Imperial targets. The empire controlled over 12 million star systems, meanwhile, they had only 25,000 star destroyers to subject those systems. The Empire was stretched to the point of not being able to defend against an efficient rebel force.

[@ShyBiiteVT]

What was that one quote made by Thrawn about the Tarkin Doctrine? As wasteful as it is ego driven?

[@Gamerguy826]

It's kind of ironic that they called it "The Tarkin doctrine" considering that Moff Tarkin refused to fly a TIE Fighter because he deemed it suicidal. I love bringing that up with people who defend the Empire and watch them squirm. It was in the comics. Don't believe me? Look it up.

[@katomamundara8106]

@@ShyBiiteVT Honestly the issue is, without the Tarkin Doctrine, they wouldn't have the manpower to subdue planets if they acted out. If they shifted to more expensive ties, they'd be able to be overwhelmed with multi-planet conflicts and slowly lose territory in a different way. The Star Destroyers were absolute beasts of ships, the only issue was that they were planning for capital ships to fight back, not advanced fighters. The clone war era fighters were good, but not THAT good, remember, the Y-Wing in the originals was stripped down armor wise from a Clone Wars era unit, and generally useless without escorts, as an example. Using that as a basis, the Tarkin Doctrine was freaking genius. High speed high mobility units to outflank an opponent. What they didn't expect was units on the same if not superior mobility/speed performance to be mass produced (Lost control of production centers) with the firepower to back it up. The X-Wing would be like sending a modern plane vs top-of-the-line WW2 Era planes. It was not a fight they could win regardless how they built. Attempting a control a whole system without drawing a complete galaxy-wide revolt (aka not being able to control ALL the money) meant they needed to focus Capital Ships, which also meant spreading out their forces, which made them vulnerable to smaller higher power strike forces. What were they to do? Shift to fighters? Then every Star Destroyer lost is that much less power to maintain control of planets, and while they'd win more skirmishes, they'd still not win the war, just be able to handle themselves better as the resources were already strained thanks to the Death Star (the first was, love it or hate it, a great idea, but screwed over by a bad design choice (retconned as intentionally put in). Maybe had things gone on maybe a year with an active Death Star they could have afforded a full divertation into focus for Fighters, but that wasn't an option as the Death Star would solve so many problems (got a rogue force? Just destroy the planets they hide on until they have no supporters left out of pure terror of aiding them).

[@Jedi_Spartan]

Yeah, I once heard a fan refer to it as the Empire making ships "scarier than they are objectively tactically useful."

[@FightNightShmight]

Not true actually

[@voidvalkyrie]

Fun fact: Tie fighters can’t land on land without special equipment. They can technically land but the pilot can’t get down to the ground without getting hurt from the fall and forget about getting back into it without a latter. This makes them completely dependent on the Star Destroyer they came with or Imperial base. Also the lack of hyperdrive or hyperdrive ring would doom them if their Star Destroyer was destroyed in deep space or in an uninhabited star system. While it is possible to travel to another system without Hyperspace regular space is very dangerous with pirates and bizarre but dangerous creatures like Star Weirds wandering about.

[@eyesofthecervino3366]

Solid motivation to not let your Star Destroyer get blown up.

[@abraham2172]

Thats not quite right anymore. In star wars rebels, we see in fact Ezra Bridger being able to enter and leave a TIE fighters cockpit with no effort. That means, TIE fighters can land and pilots could leave their ship, even if they were not built for said purpose.

[@aidanwendel1276]

@@abraham2172 he can use the force

[@justinbombach9873]

They explain that in A New Hope. Remember when they saw a single TIE Fighter on their way to Alderaan and they were confused how it got their on its own without a hyperdrive or anything? (Of course they realize just a minute later that the moon is not what it seems)

[@crithitjace]

Don't forget the space whales!

[@Trueknightofblades]

Actually, the Empire's cost cutting goes even further than poorly constructed fighters. According to the books, Stormtrooper armor actually came equipped with a host of internal sensors and environmental controls, but the rank-and-file troopers were actively encouraged not to use them because of the increase in cost using those systems would cause.

[@AnjiMitoGGST]

@our hero But yer dad isnt

[@fiusionmaster3241]

@@AnjiMitoGGST R.I.P. That bot. Nice one m8.

[@om3gared66]

Then why would the empire include those systems in the first place if they were told not to use them? Doesn't make any sense

[@veronikahreskova2963]

AND they practically threw away a perfectly good army or clones that followed orders - only to replace them with stormtroopers so badly trained they couldn´t manage to hit a close proximity target the size of a bantha. Sure, a precaution to not have the rebellion-happy grandpas, but they still could´ve been used to train the new recruits. instead they were decomessioned in favor of sheep. All in all, in a hillarious twist, the Empire was the Empire´s downfall all along.

[@gonkdroid4prez539]

russia moment

[@RoboKingdom]

To be fair, Grand Admiral Thrawn did come up with a better designed TIE that was more maneuverable, had shields, and smaller wings. His TIEs were designed to be the better fighters, but got passed up for a giant sphere with an obvious flaw.

[@ArmageddonEvil]

Twice. lol

[@i1C4RU5]

*Looks at TIE Defender* "This is brilliant!" *Looks at projects Augur and Stardust* "But I like this..."

[@skittybug6937]

...how else do you propose the Death Star gets rid of waste? Frankly, one singular exhaust port going directly to the main reactor is not a flaw. That they kept it to 2m in diameter is quite frankly a miracle. It wasn't even on the X-Wing scanners, and the computers were _never_ going to work to destroy it. So a singular 2m hole with the proton torpedoes actively fighting against exhaust and can only be expected to be destroyed by a proficient user of a dead religion is a "flaw" in design.

[@loothhussainfazeel855]

Not to mention, the much much better TIE Interceptor was designed as a replacement for the regular TIE, still can't forgive the missing shields though.

[@TheScarletSlayer]

Head construction worker: sir I'm a bit concerned in regards to this massive hole about the size of a missile that leads directly to the main reactor core Palpatine: nah it'll be fine

[@kentslocum]

I'm not a Star Wars historian, but I never thought TIE fighters were intended to dogfight a well-equipped rebellion. While they indeed were partially responsible for the fall of the Empire, they were intended to serve as a peace-keeping patrol and display of force to inspire fear into subjugated populations and fight off small, poorly-equipped pirates. Thus, the frightening noise, the terrifying silhouette, and the mass production made sense. The real problem wasn't the TIE fighter--it was the Empire's assumption that the war was over.

[@newyou6210]

Why would they keep using the tie fighters as interceptors then. Surely the Empire that controls so many planets have enough resources to pump out effective interceptors.

[@kentslocum]

@@newyou6210 I'm not super well-versed in Star Wars lore, nor do I think that everything makes sense in the Star Wars universe--far from it! However, while TIE fighters were often used in situations beyond their capacity (such as war), I believe they were perfectly designed for their primary purpose--peacekeeping.

[@RealBigDeal22]

That's pretty much what i was thinking. Noises and fear is everything in war: people must not forget that. It's the fact that luke was involved that really changed everything imo. If the initial tactics that involves ''fear'' becomes obsolete, then everything else fails for sure.

[@lordsiomai]

now that you mention it, the ship's shape does make sense. it is indeed unique in a way that it creates an image for itself you know? and it makes sense that the empire would use it to project terror and power. but then it's also kind of stupid for them to assume that they'd have no more purpose for effective dogfighters since it's certain that after a war there's gonna be rebellions and stuff. i dunno

[@CouchSpud91]

You could say that their overconfidence was their weakness.

[@planetnydro]

I want to know how the Emperor convinced Vader, who had more than a little experience as a pilot, to use a TIE as his personal ship. "How do you think it would look if they all found out that the Emperor's right hand man refused to use a TIE? Why, they might lose faith the the Empire as a whole!" "...can I at least make some modifications?"

[@eyesofthecervino3366]

"Vader, don't be a baby. You literally have precognition and ESP."

[@eur0be4t3r]

Well, he atleast didn’t use a regular TIE

[@MikeTXBC]

How did the Emperor convince Vader? Easy. "Do what I say or you'll receive no more maintenance on your suit and cybernetic limbs."

[@jmurray1110]

The emperor threatened to lightning him to death

[@alfredforbessealy524]

@@MikeTXBC do what I say or next time you lose a limb the replacement will be pink

[@joshuagiehll3737]

The whole concept of the TIE was swarm fighting. It was never meant for 1v1 dogfights. That's why Destroyers carried 70 of them while, at best, xwings only fly at a dozen or so (if that) per fleet. The Empire had the numbers to literally just keep throwing bodies at a battle till they won by their numbers alone.

[@benito23453]

MatPat is a brain burner!(Правдивое видео🇷🇺):……. kzbin.info/www/bejne/m37Zi4OMasaWrdk

[@Salsa-manda]

Literally quantity over quality

[@flamingmoomba5608]

The Zap Branigan approach

[@TreeStumpProdutions]

A TIE fighter could beat all rebel fighters bar an A-wing in a 1v1 fair fight.

[@plantainsame2049]

Just so everything at the kitchen sink at the rebels and see if they die

[@kpp8349]

I’m pretty sure the empires entire design philosophy was to install fear in the people the storm troopers, the spacecraft the weapons. All flashy and noisy to scare the enemy while also being able to be mass produced as cheaply as possible. Even the Death Star, while a potentially devastating when used was more for the fear it would produce when it was known the empire could just come up and destroy your planet if you were a big enough nuisance

[@EEEEEEEE]

‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎E‎

[@Seaburg7545]

probably the most effective thing about the TIE fighters was the sound's physiological affect, that sound would be terrifying to anyone unexpecting/unfamiliar to it.

[@ktauber9692]

Exactly! People on the ground ran from that sound like people fear the A-10 sound.

[@carized8852]

Ju-87 anyone?

[@GGolden2500]

@@carized8852 Yup, I was about to mention the Stukas. If the TIE fighter was truly meant to suppress local rebellions instead of actual dogfighting then the siren installed on it *probably* served a similar role to the Ju-87's famous siren. But that still doesn't help at all when you are in space.

[@justinbombach9873]

@@GGolden2500 We're talking about Star Wars man... Of course you can't hear sounds like that in space but this is FICTION

[@rockingamingwiththesahit2145]

It was a strategy used in WW2.

[@tailkinker1972]

Moff Tarkin's death probably hurt the Rebellion; if he'd still been around, making even more mistakes, the Rebellion might have won earlier. Don't forget all the other ideas he had, like giant robot camels, replacing the Clones with Stormtroopers, and trying to terrify entire planets into subjugating themselves.

[@goroakechi6126]

To be fair, allowing the Death Star to exist at all would have destroyed the rebellion if anyone with half a brain was commanding it. Planets like Mon Calamari and Bespin would be destroyed and cripple the Rebel’s ability to gain resources and ships.

[@redjirachi1]

That's not to assume Palpatine wouldn't use him as the scapegoat for the PR disaster of destroying Alderaan.

[@Smart-vn9yg]

@@goroakechi6126 But then again, as said in a different theory, it would be better if the Death Star was left alone or simply dismantled rather then blown up...

[@Richtofen-gy9cj]

Had he not died on the Death Star, Sidious would've had him killed eventually since he held too much power in the empire

[@yukiTrooper2]

This was actually addressed in the TV show Star Wars rebels it was one of the core aspects of the show. In the show the rebel stop their production of higher tier star fighter ones that go faster, have more guns and has shields but due to the rebels destroying their prototypes and factory they only have the standard tie fighters. Edit: Another thing is that in Star Wars rebels it is brought up multiple times by Grand Admiral Thrawn is that he is competing with Vice-Admiral Tarkin’s project the death star for funding and due to the rebels blowing up the main factory of the Empires tie ships production which lead to him lose the funding for the Tie defender Program. And before you say I’m just trying to the rag on the video I’m not it’s a GOOD video with good points but I wish they had done research into the backstory of why they only had tie fighters because it helps explain why the Empire head such bad Tie fighters.

[@benito23453]

Ж

[@danielockelford3886]

You are right. MatPat is really late on this matter. The video is fine anyway.

[@ResidentKen]

ACKHUALLY…..

[@ralseithelonely]

Hello bots. And no. You are not welcome, and you will not be missed.

[@AssassinGTM]

@@ResidentKen I don't think that joke applies here. This isn't overly obsessive nerd knowledge it's stated in a show made for DisneyXD

[@netkat7486]

I disagree. The biggest reason the empire failed is they constantly overlooked R2. R2 is literally the hero of the franchise from episode 1-6.

[@jeremytoth7635]

R2 was pretty clutch in Clone Wars too

[@dik56]

@@jeremytoth7635 he was literally the main character of that era

[@StephenDelRosario777]

The most deadly droid in all of Starwars, with Master Chief levels of luck.

[@violetlavi2207]

Which is ironic since you’d think Vader, the second in command of the Empire, would tell his underlings not to underestimate droids, especially a blue astromech 😂

[@jout738]

R2 always been great droid in Anakin and Luke ship. He is great enough droid to make Anakin and Luke be abel to destroy a lot of enemy ships, without themselves getting kolled.

[@daye8734]

Kind of weird how the TIEs are designed to be more “productive” but neglected the need to have simple shielding. Palpatine was essentially asking to lose.

[@killnet5638]

MatPat is a brain burner!(Правдивое видео🇷🇺):……. kzbin.info/www/bejne/m37Zi4OMasaWrdk

[@killnet5638]

Ж

[@killnet5638]

Ш

[@shayminup7]

Once again this proves that Thrawn would have saved the empire if they had just listened to him, if they just gave thrawn more funding for the tie defender project as stated in the canon thrawn trilogy the empire would of been the most formidable force in the galaxy

[@rebelgaming1.5.14]

The TIE Avenger utilized Shields alongside a few other variants, like the Imperial Guard's TIE Interceptors, intentionally designed to take on vehicles like A and X-wings.

[@Tu_Padre.]

The First Order actually solves some of the problems of the TIE Fighters with giving them a gunner, and shields, the terrible visibility is there however, this goes for the TIE Defender as well, it might be a major improvement but you are still practically blind to surprise attacks, imagine if the starfighters in Star Wars could avoid being detected on radar. Every dogfight with the empire would end in seconds.

[@lightningboltt5437]

Well, at least the sequels got something right

[@zidanerizalalghifaryalghif3248]

Didn’t in a new hope scanners aren’t picking up any tie’s, im confused on how they avoided scans

[@dianapennepacker6854]

Technically the Empire had 100x numeric superiority and should be covering each other's asses. Thought the Tie fighter was significantly more agility and faster. Almost like an interceptor hence why it gave up everything from life support to shields (shields don't seem to work anyway in the films. Was shocked to learn the X Wing had some.) Still terrible design and worse writing. TIE pilots were all suppose to be great but seems like anyone can handle them. Only the tight grouping of their guns which are also suppose to he able to swivel but never do are the only design they got right. It doesn't have extra fire power or anything. I like the Mandalorian fighter craft although I don't like their gimmick of spinning wings. Read it somehow is easier to take out force sensitivitie pilots with it. I call BS personally.

[@simpleviewer1334]

​@zidanerizalalghifaryalghif3248 I think they detect the energy from a battery or engine but TIE's don't use a traditional battery or engine, onstead the wings are solar panels that power the TIE

[@delanovanraalte3646]

@@dianapennepacker6854its probably harder to hit spinning wings and they made the cockpit stay steady so its easier to aim

[@CognetoBurrito]

What makes this worse for the Empire is that TIE pilots weren't just your typical rank and file; they were some of the best trained and most skilled pilots in the entire galaxy, and they were sent out and treated like fodder. Utterly wasteful.

[@macshadow1150]

That's why so many pilots defect to the Rebellion

[@ScooterinAB]

You'd have to be the best to fly one of those.

[@adb4522]

Why does the empire don´t use AI to flight there TIEs, like the separatist in episode 1-3? Maybe AI wasn´t as popular during the 70´s SiFi or Lucas just liked the analog style of WW2 more.

[@DEATHSxNEMASIS]

but the only reason why they struggle against luke and the rest of the sqaudren is due to ether the force or being ex empire pilots, the ties have better tactics and faster more manoeuvrable ships, where as yes, the x wing is a better ship, but the training on most of the pilots was sub par at best, giving the empire a massive advantage over most of the rebel fighters, hence why in most scenes most of the rebels taken out in dog fights (yes i know plot armour and whatnot) are jsut regular people with the most basic of training in how to fly the ships

[@wildfire9280]

Looks like pilots got treated like Clones.

[@FilmFightFanatic]

If you go by the tradition established by the rebel star fighters being named after the English letters they're shaped similarly to, you could actually say that the TIE fighter is an "H-Wing".

[@dumaniamsanchez8935]

the rebels, at least in legends, called em eyeballs lol, and the tie interceptors were called squints

[@thebigsucc030]

I like this

[@Drowsyspace128]

Nah the h wing is a weird jumbo double cockpit y wing with massive engines

[@burna8753]

‘An H’?.. Haytch has a Haytch in its name. Not aytch. I know muricans and brits say aitch/aytch, but you’re wrong lol. It’s HAYTCH

[@ExplosiveFloofBall]

The H-Wing was a rebel recon fighter made from y-wing parts

[@makermelissa]

Note that space is a vacuum, so the TIE fighters themselves don’t actually make the sound. Apparently in one of the novels, this is explained as an audible radar type system the rebels have for sensing the proximity of enemy fighters.

[@fiusionmaster3241]

Hm, good to know. Thanks m8!

[@roaringthunder115]

Neat

[@stevenscott2136]

That actually makes a lot of sense. I like headphones for gaming for precisely that reason -- I can hear what direction the enemy noises are coming from.

[@zjjohnson3827]

@@stevenscott2136 also several games have a audible grenade proximity warning and when I hear that sound byte I immediately equate it to a grenade, same as hearing the noise immediately makes me think of a tie fighter

[@chrisgames5201]

Well, still doesn't explain how you hear explotions, shots and hit sounds in Space, no matter what they try to say in the novels

[@K_Disk]

Kinda *ties* in well with your video on just how expensive the Death Star was. It makes sense that they needed budget cuts due to the sheer amount of money it would've cost to make it a thing.

[@velocityraptor2890]

let alone whatever upkeep costs that behemoth of a space station needed to keep running

[@Alexzander1989]

Unless we're talking the TIE Phantom, the TIE series was never intended for stealth missions. The entire point of that iconic "screech" we hear from the TIE Fighter's engines is to inspire fear in the populace that they fly over. Like the moment you hear that sound coming over head, you scatter and duck for cover.

[@redhood3253]

Exactly, similar to the Jericho horns on a stuka

[@russellharrell2747]

THERE’S NO SOUNDS IN SPACE!!!!

[@knyte8706]

@@russellharrell2747 well people don’t just suffocate and freeze in space either, but that also happens in Star Wars. I’ve kinda just accepted that the space in Star Wars just has different physics and rules than space IRL.

[@Alexzander1989]

@@russellharrell2747 There is on planets and habitable moons, you silly 😉

[@EEEEEEEE]

‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎E‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎‎

[@NJPCofficial]

I understand your point on the X-Wings, B-Wings, A-Wings, Y-Wings, etc. However, all of the mentioned ships aren’t necessarily named by the Rebellion, they are named by the starship manufacturers who make and sell them. For example, the Incom Corporation manufactures and sells the “T-65B X-Wing Starfighter”. The Incom Corporation named the “T-65B X-Wing Starfighter” the “T-65B X-Wing Starfighter”, not the Rebels.

[@eps200]

It's not even that weird. It would be as of Lockhead called their jets Alpha, Beta and Phi

[@russellharrell2747]

The ‘X’-wing is officially designated as the ‘T’-65. That still includes the ‘high galactic’ alphabet. The Clone Wars era Republic used Greek alphabet designations for their fighters. Obviously starship manufacturers used non-common alphabets in the same style as earth manufacturers. It’s fine, it’s gonna be just fine.

[@jmurray1110]

@@russellharrell2747 did they let’s see Y- winger bomber ARC-170 (advanced reconnaissance 170) V-180 torrent The headhunters I don’t think they did T least with the made starfighters

[@mdm_topplelock]

And the B in B-wing is short for “blade” because the ship is shaped like a blade(kind of)

[@NJPCofficial]

@WestWind Ok, thanks for the clarification. Makes sense.

[@bheemabachus5179]

I feel like Lucas, intentionally or no, designed the Empire's ships like real-life predators and the Rebellion like real life herbivores. Herbivores have eyes on their side so they get vision basically everywhere around them to look for predators. This is especially true on horses, gazelles, okapis, stuff like that. Meanwhile, predators like lions, tigers, and bears oh m, tend to have eyes in their front so that they can focus really well on a single prey. This isn't an absolute rule (lots of predominantly herbivorous monkeys have eyes in their front) but it's still very typical. By having the Empire only have windows in the front, you get the sense they're predators and oppressively chasing after our heroes. By having the Rebellion have full vision, you get the sense they're the ones in danger, which creates dramatic tension. I'm not sure it excuses the absolute insane affront to realism, but it does make the movie more exciting if you don't notice these kinds of things.

[@Undertaker.98]

" 1,200,000 clone vs infinite or a lot of Strom stpomer..." "Yes clone are better in fighter however not lot to take care all the worlds and bases."

[@maple22moose44]

monkeys and other tree dwelling animals have eyes on the front for depth perception, the same reason as predators. monkeys need it to judge how far a branch is and lions need it to judge how far a zebra is, the eyes on the front are NOT to focus on a single animal

[@bheemabachus5179]

@@maple22moose44 Thank you for the additional information and clarification. It is super useful. "Focus on a single animal" was clumsy wording on my part. Monkeys are still an exception, even if it has a biological cause.

[@pantheking9467]

Is that “Lions, tigers, and bears oh m” from Epic Rap battles of History?

[@starcobra2575]

They are made to be mass produced and not be independent, and tarkin believed in massive ships with swarms of fighters, thus they couldnt be that expensive. Of course that ended up being a mistake but its not "affront to realism". They ended up expirimenting with better ships however they were either sabotaged by the rebellion, too expensive to mass produce or were produced too late in the war to make a difference.

[@cr33d_dat_boi30]

Tarkin was originally going to get the Xwings for the empire but he said that they were to expensive and hard to make, so the empire adopted the tie fighters instead, since cheaper

[@jmurray1110]

Technically the X wing us a modification of the original plans they are similar but I suspect it would have looked a bit more like the ARC 170

[@ashtray4344]

That is not true at all. The empire couldn't get the x-wing because the DY Didnt want them to have that ship

[@kacpermalina308]

it ends like getting crossbow to gun fight.

[@D-S-9]

Alternate take: The TIE fighter was designed to be an intimidating swarm craft, flying in close formation with hundred or thousands of other craft. 90% of their navigation was taken care of by a singular or group AI. The pilots, much like the ships, were cheap and disposable. Or their helmets had AR screens that projected the space outside the cockpit - that one pilot did look up after all.

[@stevenscott2136]

If you explain away all the obvious design flaws, you have to blame their poor performance on poor training, poor recruiting, and poor retention of the better pilots. This is not unusual in the real world, as big flashy projects for politically-connected contractors tend to be favored in the budget over boring basics like training. So you get fancy new equipment being used by poorly-trained rookies who are just going through the motions to avoid punishment. So the Empire is STILL shooting itself in the foot -- it's just a different foot.

[@Jkizzle]

The rest could make sense other than the helmets. If they were able to see outside using ar then that would have been the case in star wars squadrons

[@mrtoast3319]

Yea it probably was just a show of strength in numbers. Considering the ship was designed when the empire was at peace and didn't have any real enemies. Why build functioning expensive ships in a time of peace, when you can get a 4 for 1 kind of deal.

[@Cooltech06]

Actually, as explained in the Cross section books, the whole reason for the TIEs simplicity was for the pilot to be completely dependent on it superior starship, such as an ISD, frigate, or otherwise. This was to further influence the imperial ideal of relying on the actions of the superior

[@THEJPIndustry]

Ye maybe they where but they never actee that way, it where always only like 3 or 5 in a swarm and not a mass produced swarm amount

[@allnonethevoid1487]

The TiE Fighter was well designed... for Darth Vader. Speed, weight, and maneuverability were the only things Vader prioritized in the design bc he didn't need anything else. His iconic suit meant he didn't need more life support in the ship, that helmet already screwed up his field of vision so 360° windows would be useless, and he didn't install shields because he never planned to get hit. Then Moff Tarkin came along, made the TiE's cheaper, and never realized how badly designed they were for anyone who couldn't literally see into the future and psychically sense his enemies 🤣🤣

[@stevenscott2136]

I like that idea! Tarkin and Vader are playing chess and Tarkin says "You know, we need a new fighter. You're a pilot -- any ideas?" And Vader, self-absorbed jerk that he's always been, makes recommendations that only work for him. Tarkin builds it super-cheap, and there's the TIE.

[@josephjanisch5396]

This is amazing head cannon!!!!!!

[@battleax6364]

I like this explanation

[@Aspiringamoeba1997]

​@@stevenscott2136 Tarkin and Vader do actually engage in hunting games occasionally, actually, though the hunted is usually played by Vader.

[@GooTheMighty]

Vader was probably the only pilot who didn’t need sight at all to pilot as well as he did. Ever since he was child, he was piloting with the force as a supernatural radar/spider sense.

[@BravoOneCharlie]

The reason why Grand Admiral Thrawn in Canon was so badass was this, he knew the TIEs sucked and comissioned the TIE Defender, which solved many issues. But the empire's money went to Tarkin and the Death Star, so cheapo fighters were the way they went.

[@TraceguyRune]

Nah, the Tie Interceptor is much better, and neither fix the FOV

[@minicle426]

Tri-Fighters > Ties

[@basicallyarobloxian4533]

@@TraceguyRune All nice and dandy until the rebels start targeting those over the normal ties, which they actually did.

[@Eletrickzr]

***Rebels spoilers ahead*** Not only that, but the the main TIE Defender factory was destroyed, and with Thrawn gone aswell, no one bothered getting the economical support needed for the production. And another note, Tarkin was a bigger fan of the Defender then of the Death Star, and suppoerted Thrawn in the debate against Director Krennic, as they showed overwhelmingly great results in every combat test.

[@majorpwner241]

Thrawn isn't canon... he's literally the opposite of what that word implies.

[@Anonymous-ht5hn]

For the rebel pilots their sight lines are even BIGGER because the visor parts of the helmet are made of a CLEAR plastic alloy (Canonically)

[@madisonatteberry9720]

"they fly now!" The thing that pisses me off about that scene, was that Poe was a First Order Stormtrooper, jet pack troopers had been around since the clone wars, the Republic used them, the Empire in both new cannon and legends used them, so why was this a surprise to.....actually, all of them should have known that, especially C-3P0 as he was there for all three eras.

[@martinmiklas7478]

around Clone wars? it was much earlier, in a last Mandalorian war (before TCW) were confirmed jetpacks

[@ACE112ACE112]

You mean Finn?

[@nick012000]

C-3PO at least has the excuse that he had his memory wiped.

[@jamesbellefeuille2926]

Does anyone know the link to the clip where John Boyega says, "They've been flying since the Clone Wars" ?

[@stoked-6996]

@@martinmiklas7478 in clone wars season 7 ep 1 rex and a bunch of 501st troops use jetpacks to surprise the separatists

[@lordkiwiz1535]

I think, that "Only See Forward" design suits perfectly to Empire's "Just Focus on enemy and do not help your teammates" theme! Emperial Pilots are taught to be brutal and loyal to the empire even more than any friend of them!

[@killnet5638]

MatPat is a brain burner!(Правдивое видео🇷🇺):…… kzbin.info/www/bejne/m37Zi4OMasaWrdk

[@benito23453]

Ж

[@wisemankugelmemicus1701]

which is horrible from a military perspective

[@artemisfowl52]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/goGzfXahfs2rqpI&ab_channel=WIRED All the thinking that went into starfighter design in Star Wars was based on how they looked on screen. Diagetic explanations for underlying philosophy or military doctrine is working backwards from a team who made choices based on 'it looks cool.'

[@ethanceccarini6412]

I mean just look at the bad batch cross hair kills a team member to complete the mission

[@Lee-yl4ul]

This reminds me of one of my favorite backstories for an ace pilot in a Star Wars TTRPG, an ex-imperial who was a *retired* tie fighter pilot. As in, he was such a good (and lucky) pilot, that he managed to live long enough to retire. Also, as a running gag, pretty much nobody actually believed him about that.

[@steeredshark5542]

I mean, can you really blame them for not believing him? lol He was able to pilot a vehicle equivalent of FNaFs spring locks long enough to be able to retire lol

[@enzymerc6969]

7:50 I own a storm trooper helmet, and the vision through the eyeholes is infinitely worse than shown here. for starters, the eye holes are not really directly eye level, they are slightly above your eyes, not majorly, but it's visible to the wearer. second, the eye holes are just really small, and the eyes are pushed out in front of your face, not directly in front of your line of sight, so if you tilt your head down at all, it makes it almost impossible to see.

[@pkmntrainerred4247]

I guess now we know why Storm troopers miss so many shots. The empire is asinine I guess.

[@rerror3577]

Maybe you just have the wrong size helmet?

[@ApexHerbivore]

@@rerror3577 maybe he has a funny shaped head

[@eur0be4t3r]

*insert that one Rex scene from rebels here*

[@WeFightForKarl]

"I can't see a thing in this helmet"- Luke Skywalker

[@redjaypictures4528]

Funny enough, in lore the X wing was originally designed for the empire, but they weren’t granted a contract because X wings cost more to produce, so the rebels snapped up the unwanted star-fighters at a discount and proceeded to mop the floor with the empire’s first choice

[@archivist_13]

That's incredibly ironic

[@yi_hou3092]

@@archivist_13 like what was the empire gonna do? They literally had to recover their losses financially after the whole Galactic Civil War and Jedi Purge, trying to approve and mass produce an expensive vehicle during post war time isn't very economical so them choosing the TIE was kind of a no brainer

[@archivist_13]

@@yi_hou3092 at first I could see why they did that, but after a few years they really should have looked into more effective ships

[@Cooltech06]

Finally someone mentions this!!

[@Cooltech06]

Actually, as explained in the Cross section books, the whole reason for the TIEs simplicity was for the pilot to be completely dependent on it superior starship, such as an ISD, frigate, or otherwise. This was to further influence the imperial ideal of relying on the actions of the superior

[@Mr.Crow1984]

I love how everyone forgets the fact that the rebels destroyed the death star because of wizard powers. According what we see in the movie the tie fighters pretty much wiped the floor with the x-wings and y-wings. Some places say that the rebels lost up to 27 of the 30 ships they deployed, while the empire only lost between 8 to 10 (it seems a bit like imperial propaganda not gonna lie, but thats what wookiepidea and other palces say). Edit: from what it seems only three rebel pilots returned home two xwings (luke and wedge) and a y wing. 5 pilots if you count han and chewie.

[@marallenrondez2606]

I'd say even without the wizard powers, the empire was still pretty flawed in their designs. They only wiped the floor with the rebel fighters because they were lucky enough to target behind them, a major weakness in the X-wing, and Y-wing. Without wizard powers, Yavin 4 would be destroyed, and all rebellion leadership would be gone, but it would have also likely extended the war beyond what we see in the movies. Rebels still scattered but waiting for a time to strike instead.

[@tehdominator17]

@@marallenrondez2606 the problem is its not hard to position tie fighters behind the rebel ships when you outnumber the rebels 10000/1. why would the empire care if it loses 10 ships, they have hundreds and hundreds more to throw at them. sheer numbers would overwhelm the better equipped but vastly outnumbered rebels eventually, and if yavin was destroyed taking with it the entirety of rebel leadership, that would be the effective end for the rebellion. Sure, there'd be survivors and others unhappy with the empire scattered across the systems but they wouldn't have the organization or the moral to actually stand up to the empire, not to mention the death of luke and leia would mean the Jedi are completely and entirely wiped out, with no masters left to train anymore.

[@Vilest7Creeper]

@@tehdominator17 wouldn’t visibility in the cockpit be key to executing swarm tactic? With poor visibility, TIE fighters can easily crash into one another.

[@charlestonianbuilder344]

Its the biggest space station of the galaxy, it can fit a million ties and mop the floor with the sheer numbers they had

[@mickys8065]

@@Vilest7Creeper well thats what the scanners are for, they tell the tie pilots where everything is, we even see this in some of the cockpit shots in a new hope, it's only the enemy fighters that are having their scanners blocked. More visibility would be great, but as normal it's not as bad as matpat says

[@deadeye4047]

Credit to the Eyeballs, the screech kinda makes some sense because they were ment to be used in swarm tactics. Tarkin likely wanted a 20/1 ratio. Can you imagine the psychological repercussions of hearing 20 ships screaming all around you? That would be absolutely terrifying, especially when most Rebels joined due to the subjugation or death of loved ones!

[@Kaiser0hmega]

So kind of like the death whistles?

[@hyzmarie]

Yeah! I would run. 0.0

[@deadeye4047]

@beyond your imagination would you mind NOT spamming this.

[@thepsychicspoon5984]

Except one problem: Sound doesn't travel in space.

[@stevenbobbybills]

@@thepsychicspoon5984 apparently in lore, the Tie swooping noises were supposed to be their signature on the X-Wing's radar systems.

[@JusticeSoulTuna]

I think the design of the TIE fighters is an allegorical sign of the empire's hubris: narrow visioned, rule by might and quantity but not efficiency.

[@ShadowSaberBaroxio]

The lack of shielding was meant to be addressed by Grand Admiral Thrawn with his plan to produce Tie Defenders, but due to some interference from glory-seeking Imperials under his command (i.e. the only way Thrawn ever loses) the Tie Defender program was shut down, and the Empire instead decided to go with the money hole that was the goddamn Death Star. Even still, the singular prototype Tie Defender was extremely threatening to deal with.

[@benito23453]

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[@christopherfleetwood5252]

To be fair to the Death Star, Emperor Palpatine’s super weapon fetish was originally supposed to be for fighting the Vong, but they got Gisnep-ed and the Death Star didn’t.

[@wizrad2099]

I feel like one of the more recent movies revealed that the design flaws in the Death Star were deliberate, made by an engineer that didn't believe in the Empire's goals. Can't help but wonder if the person who designed the TIE fighters had a similar mentality.

[@gerieconomides2776]

I really want this to be the case because it would be such a cool little detail!

[@Gabiman66]

Nah cap, people would have noticed, its not like death star which was the first building like itself, millions of pilots have tested them

[@saron95662]

I mean that’s one of the main plot points in rogue one

[@TheOmegazerox]

@Painfulstinger I bet imperials believed they could be just as good as the jedi pilots. Canon or not thier are plenty of skilled tie pilots but moste woul be undertrained due to the quanity over quality and rushed into battle cause the empire doesn't care about pilots they care about the missn.

[@Marisa_arts]

To be fair, the Death Star "weakness" isn't an actual weakness since there are a large amount of vents around, but the one all the way on the top in the trench run wasn't as defended due to how Starships fight like WW 2 ships and aircraft. So defending a point like that at a distance would not be as necessary. Not only that but vents and radiators are needed to vent out to space from the massive heat build up that would otherwise cook those inside alive. So no, a vent is not a weakness, it is an essential feature for functionality. At least the original Trilogy. Besides that, the plans had been completed by the end of the Clone Wars (prequal trilogy). The retcon is just a retcon.

[@ianmarkham8824]

Here’s another similar theory to go along with this one: Upgrading the imperial navy lead to its downfall. So, once upon a time there was the Imperial class star destroyer. Then we learn there are, in fact, two classes, the imperial I and the imperial II. For the longest time, no one knew exactly what the difference was, but it was speculated that the Imperial II was 15-20% larger and more heavily armed. Then, people started noticing more concrete differences, such as the loss of the large X-shaped tractor beam targeting array atop the superstructure in favor of a smaller comms array when an Imperial I was upgraded to an Imperial II. Then there’s the weapons. The main armaments of a star destroyer are house in eight batteries, four on each side of the superstructure. The imperial I had dual heavy Turbolaser batteries. The imperial II? Octuple Barbette Turbolaser batteries. Yes, quadruple the primary firepower of an Imperial I. These were incredibly effective ship-to-ship weapons, and we see, in battlefront II, the batteries on the Star Destroyer Dauntless tear an MC80 cruiser to pieces once it’s clear of Fondor Station. These weapons made the Imperial II the undisputed dominant interstellar battleship, able to stand toe-to-toe with any capital ship the rebellion had in its navy. See the problem yet? The rebels didn’t use capital ships, not usually. They were a flexible Guerilla force that mainly used small, light starfighters for hit-and-run attacks. Ever tried to swat a fruit fly with a snow shovel? That’s about what it’s like to use these heavy Turbolasers against starfighters. You need point-defense weapons, and the ISD II had none. It relied on its complement of 48 TIEs to deal with fighter incursions, and based on this video, you can probably tell how that went. The ISD I? Remember those dual Turbolasers that they ripped out to make room for the overkill cannons. We see, again in Battlefront II, as Iden comes in to approach Admiral Versio’s destroyer Eviscerator, the dual Turbolasers open fire with something similar to a flak barrage that swats her down. It would appear these weapons can be used in a similar vain to WWII DP (dual purpose) cannons that could behave as both ship artillery and anti-aircraft flak guns. However, being the only point defense weapons Star Destroyers had, once they were removed in favor of the more powerful Octuple Barbette Turbolasers, the Imperial Star destroyer lost practically all ability to defend itself against starfighters, leaving their imposing fleets incredibly vulnerable to the superior rebel fighters. Ironically, in their quest for more firepower, the imperial navy lost the warship attribute it needed the most for the conflict at hand.

[@chiefkiep1147]

From what I remember, there was a point defense system on the ISD I, that had laser turrets to take out fighters, and that was replaced to have more turbo lasers and and the octuple barbettes. The main weapons and the secondary weapons were replaced to deal more damage to big ships rather than the fighters they would have to go against.

[@L337N1NJ4L1NK]

This was supposed to be solved by the frigate class ships but most battle groups lacked any frigate support.

[@ianmarkham8824]

@@L337N1NJ4L1NK HA! Frigates? What frigates? It almost seemed like the ISD was the only warship the empire produced en masse. Ever since Disney took over the canon, we’ve lost all mention of the Victory class, Gladiator class, Revenge class, or any other vessel that might help with this issue. Sure, there’s the Raider II class corvette, but we’ve only seen one of those (Corvus) which makes me think they were a lot rarer than they needed to be.

[@BelrokFafnirGaming]

If memory serves, the sound the TIEs used was meant as a fear tactic. I can't remember which page, but in the novel Lost Stars a Imperial pilot is tasked with flying his fighter over populated areas to show that the empire is strong and can easily strafe their farms. Just a little fun fact

[@pixelfirehd7097]

This actually gets me thinking about Grand Admiral Thrawn's Tie defender program from Star wars rebels. From what I understand, Thrawn wanted to make the Tie defenders as an alternative to the death star itself, saying that to put all of the power and resources into a single weapon was foolish. But maybe Thrawn also made the Tie defenders knowing that the normal Tie fighters were just poorly designed.

[@benito23453]

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[@deadeye4047]

Don't forget about Legends' Chiss TIE Fighters, also GAT's design.

[@TheMongral]

Fairly sure this is quite literally the case. In pretty much every media source where Tie Defenders make an appearance, including ones where Rebel pilots even get an opportunity to either fly them or see them perform, those self-same pilots, who would have directly been fighting against Defenders, comment that the rebels probably would have been absolutely screwed if they "had to fight these things and not standard Tie Fighters".

[@GBrimstone]

I mean it's true though... Big gamble putting all your resources... All your chips on one number

[@FallenAngelHiroko]

And this is why Thrawn Trilogy was my favorite in the books. He was a master manipulator in which he taught his appetence and First Mate Pelleon. But equally as brilliant. He's basically what Darth Vader should have been (movie wise).

[@Ilander86]

As an aside, in the old days, TIE Fighter noise was created by a sound system within the other ships. Basically just used the atmospheric wav file for TIEs, and played it when their engines were on sensors. But, that still implies that their emissions were too high, letting combatants get the best of them.

[@waspsting2168]

The empire didn't care about quality. They wanted quantity. That's why they didn't go with Thrawn's superior design, the Tie Defender. Defenders costed too much. About 4 Defenders were equal to a fleet of fighters in price.

[@ninnikins4768]

1 defender could some x wings with the right pilot.

[@Joe_biden_loves_minors_]

@@ninnikins4768 could what?

[@1nOnlyTeaAddict]

It looks much cooler too

[@higztv1166]

it still has all the flaws the tie fighter has

[@1.-ulysses334]

@@higztv1166 What? the tie defender is basically a flawless version of the tie fighter, it has shields, it's faster than an interceptor, it has more weapons, it has a hyperdrive, and all the pilots of a tie defender were the best pilots of the empire.

[@aleks2703]

Also say I wanna point out that you may have noticed well obviously in the episode seven that’s when Po and Finn steal a tie fighter well first order TIE fighter Finn climbs into the rear gunner seat Meaning of the first order tried to fix the problem with TIE fighters

[@designerwookiee]

The star Wars: Rebels series addresses this to some extent with the Tie Defenders (Tie/d) model starcraft which had shielding capabilities and, if they had been completed and put into mass production, would've been a major threat to the growing Rebellion. Fortunately for The Rebels, the course of events in the show see the Tie/d model permanently suspended. This goes to show, however, that somewhere within the depths of the Star Wars studios, they are aware of this general issue of the original series.

[@benito23453]

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[@tigerazoz2910]

bruh bots

[@Andromeda_Ada]

@@tigerazoz2910 i know, i've been reporting them for some minuits

[@umbraemilitos]

The Thrawn books go into more depth about the TIE defender and its purpose.

[@stigkenobi7525]

Rebels is a massive plot-hole, and breaks lore and continuity. If you use that show as a basis for anything, you have already screwed up.

[@itty_224]

I think there's something this video glosses over quite a bit: what tarkin's doctrine actually is. It was focused around the star destroyer, and the idea that a large intimidating vessel that could inspire fear in the people is more effective than actual military power projection. Because of this, the tie fighters design wasnt an intentional factor of the tarkin doctrine, but a biproduct. a last minute addition to fill out the minimum starfighter requirements of the imperial navy. in fact, ties were arguably seen as nothing but a compliment to larger vessels, just another weapon in a star destroyers arsenal of turbolasers and cannons.

[@jettlucashayes8508]

And then some dude throws a class a terminal detonator into the star destroyer

[@thereaction18]

Fear amplifies Palpatine's power in the dark side. He manipulated the entire galaxy to feed his narcissistic addiction.

[@thebaronlouis8619]

Tarkin didn't design the TIE Fighter or even like the design. When he flew a V-Wing into combat he even thought to himself "at least it's not a TIE Fighter." The design philosophy of the TIE Fighter was quantity over quality. They gave it good speed, maneuverability, and a decent laser so that through sheer force of numbers, a squadron of TIEs would generally be able to take down even the most capable pilot. The Empire can afford to replace a hundred TIE Fighters more easily than the Rebellion can replace the dozen or so Fighters, light freighters, and small cruisers they'd take with them. You can afford to throw away ships when your enemy literally can't afford to lose anyone on anything but the most important missions. None of your points were wrong, except for the one about merge, since TIE Fighters will almost always control the merge because of their speed and maneuverability, but all these flaws are accepted because it lets the Empire crank out TIE Fighters like the Soviet Union could crank out T34s.

[@VMan29397]

im pretty sure a tie fighter would be outmatched by 2 rebel pilots preforming a thatch weave

[@dracobengali]

@@VMan29397 That kinda proves Louis's point. The empire never planned it to be 1 Tie against 2 rebel pilots, they meant it to be somehting like 50 against 2. Throw 50 Ties against somewhere that should only have a couple rebel pilots and even if they lost the majority of the Ties, they still win (like a Zergling rush).

[@baronvonbrunn8596]

True, but it doesn´t excuse the poor visibility, smaller wings and more glass would make it much better and cut down the cost at the same time

[@TheOmegazerox]

@@dracobengali Yes it was quanity over quality. Mass production and saving money by having no shields or fighter based armor. Just like storm troopers. Tie fighters wer exspendable cause they always had more. That was why the empire failed. Trying to simpley overwelm a skilled enimy with numbers is a bad stratagy. Anough skill can overcome larger numbers.

[@thebaronlouis8619]

@@baronvonbrunn8596 hello fellow baron. The visibility doesn't matter as much because of scanners plus the fact that the TIE is so agile it can pretty much pull a 180 on a dime even in atmosphere. The wings are just an aesthetic choice by the designer out of universe. In universe, there's probably some logic behind it that just never gets mentioned, because the TIE Advanced, TIE Interceptor, TIE Defender, and TIE Silencer all have more practical wing designs.

[@jonnycarcano]

I'm honestly surprised that you haven't done a list of war crimes in the Star Wars universe. The Clone Wars particularly is full of them.

[@jackcabaniss9571]

Wow, if this is true, then Thrawn was WAAAY smarter than we realized. Thrawn must have realized the TIE fighters were a mistake which was why he was pushing for funding of his Defender project.

[@Aereto]

And Vader himself vouches for the design when a skilled pilot can bring out its potential as a force multiplier.

[@mikes7423]

Thrawn didn't commission the TIE Defender.....Admiral Zaarin did.

[@m10tankdestroyer94]

@@mikes7423 That's Legends now. Disney Canon dictates that Thrawn was the one who commisioned the TIE-Defender.

[@mikes7423]

@@m10tankdestroyer94 They would be mistaken. Nothing will change those facts.

[@m10tankdestroyer94]

@@mikes7423 Disney already did. It's just a matter of acceptance by the consumers.

[@FadedHistory4552]

Imagine if the imperials hadn’t turned down the a-wing. THAT would have secured an imperial victory.

[@alexanderlumsden7010]

for a while maybe but the rebels are good at exploiting weaknesses

[@Hobbamok]

Not really. The A-Wing has a completely different design principle and fleet approach, meaning that the Empire would have had to change a LOT about their entire fleet

[@jout738]

They used the t-wing, when it could be mass produced for cheap price, so they would send thousands of them to just scare of the rebels, while they actually were just terribel spaceships, do skilled rebel pilot could destroy dozens of these t-wings, while escaping himself from the battelfield, when the t-wings got so bad visibility, that they dont know where the rebel is, if its no longer infront of them and for their poor visibility t-wings get easily destroid by flying meteorities, so the rebel pilot does not then even need to use ammo to destroy the t-wing.

[@simpleviewer1334]

Probably because it was a direct predecessor to the Jedi star fighter and ETA 2 actis starfighter or the fighters that Kinobi and Anakin use in Episode 3, wouldn't be great for your reputation

[@loturzelrestaurant]

Media Zealot explains the bigger and more important Reasons why the Empire lost though.

[@Firewalk1989]

Two things: - As if it weren't horrid enough already, most TIE variants, including the standard one, had no hyperdrive. Meaning they relied on carriers to get around. If a TIE squadron were to lose their carriers in a battle, they were literally lost in space lest reinforcements show up. - I'm pretty sure TIEs were loud in intentionally. They are reminiscent of German Stuka bombers, which had extremely loud sirens blarring during an attack run. It's all about psychological warfare.

[@oscarchoy9469]

I would fully agree that the tie fighter was bad but what about the tie interceptor sure it has no shields and a hyperdrive but it is undoubtedly more maneuverable than the tie and it is still cheap

[@harutakami1313]

not only were they stranded, but they also needed another carrier *specifically designed* to carry TIEs. TIE fighters don't have landing gear stock, and rely on specialized hangars in their carriers for docking in a gravity well. After the fall of the empire at the end of the original trilogy, some TIEs were retrofitted with wings that folded up to allow for landing on their own, but the standard TIE you see in the movies can't land on its own. the wings aren't actually physically strong enough to support the weight of the fighter.

[@oscarchoy9469]

@@harutakami1313 I mean they did have it but why would u need carriers when ISDs are the carriers

[@RGC_animation]

If a fleet of TIE fighter was lost, well you can be sure no reinforcements is gonna come.

[@generaldurchbruchmuller]

Imagine they had an hyperdrive, they just could have hyperdrived through anything, instantly destroying it

[@TheOrangeViking]

I don't know why but I can't stop watching this video. It's just so entertaining.

[@salamanda550]

They may be impractical, but TiE's and most of their derivative starfighters are still aesthetically some of my favourite ships, ever.

[@benito23453]

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[@Gamerguy826]

They sound cool. They look cool. But other than that they are flying dumpster fires.

[@iampotatogaming1686]

The empire actually DID have a shielded Tie Fight Variant called the Tie Defender. It was designed by Grand Admiral Thrawn, and was both durable and shielded and as shown in Star Wars Rebels, was not easily destroyed. The problem, though, is that Thrawn made an enemy of Tarkin, and tarkin made sure that the Defender was never mass produced.

[@scyphi5745]

Which was really the Empire's OTHER big problem besides bad ship design (because let's be honest, it wasn't JUST the TIE fighters)--the constant in-fighting and attempts to sabotage each other among its upper ranks, a problem I'm only becoming more and more aware of as the franchise is expanded more and more. They were all so busy fighting among EACH OTHER that they weren't giving due attention to the REAL threat that was slowly chipping them away. Honestly, I've long wondered if the Empire was already doomed to fail even before the battle of Yavin happened because of things like this.

[@athroughzdude]

Actually in Rebels it's a big deal when they start making prototype TIEs with shields and hyperdrives, which were a legit enough threat to warrant direct sabotage.

[@benito23453]

MatPat is a brain burner!(Правдивое видео🇷🇺):……… kzbin.info/www/bejne/m37Zi4OMasaWrdk

[@turbotastic7493]

10:58 matpat: I’m playing by the movie’s rules Me: that’s the first time I’ve ever heard him say that

[@Ashtari]

If I remember correctly, TIE's also had another defect. You can't eject the pilot like you could in X-wings. Skilled pilots are the hardest thing to replace and the Empire was just throwing them away. In the Extended Universe (I know, not exactly canon) the Rebels often had an issue where they had more skilled pilots than they had ships to put them in. And let's face it, a longer a pilot survives, the better they become at surviving. In the long run, the Rebels would have fewer ships but due to their pilots, each ship would rack up more Imperial kills. And eventually the Empire would have no one to pilot TIE's except for fresh academy recruits, meaning more losses as inexperienced pilots have to face up against people with thousands of hours of dog fighting experience.

[@AdmiralBlackstar]

That's a common misconception. It might be optional equipment but there are many examples of TIE pilots ejecting.

[@26th_Primarch]

TIE fighters do have ejector seats and one was visibly used in the Hoth asteroid belt chase in the Empire Strikes Back. Unfortunately a TIE pilot's life support is directly tied to their flight suit and that has a very limited operation time.

[@Ashtari]

@@AdmiralBlackstar Yeah I wasn't sure if I remembered correctly. Most of my knowledge comes from the Extended Universe, so it's about 20 years or so out of date.

[@greytging]

Extended universe is the only real canon tbh

[@Ashtari]

@@greytging They certainly missed out on not making a movie about the Thrawn trilogy...such a good set of books. And there was the series about Rogue Squadron which was excellent as well.

[@biggiejeffrey]

What happened to the Empire was the same thing that happened to all empires: dominance lead to arrogance. They thought that the sheer volume of expendable clones would be better than better technology and fighting training. Palpatine became more concerned about having his throne on a death star, than protecting said throne's "exhaust pipe".

[@chuckled125]

Actually conscripts, not clones, but otherwise yeah

[@sumpogimpo0777]

@@chuckled125 only imperial army were conscripts every stormtrooper was a volunteer that wanted to be there

[@thalgrond]

I always figured that this design was, on some level, a compromise. The Empire was spending vast portions of its military budget on creating the stormtrooper corps, replacing the capital ships of the entire fleet, and constructing the Death Star. Enough money and industrial manpower to produce a high-quality starfighter corps just weren't available, so Seinar Fleet Systems presented basically the cheapest vessel they could come up with and Tarkin had to take it regardless of its flaws. The TIE feels to me like a stopgap measure that they never had the time to phase out. This is backed up by canon and legends material. Unless they were on vital missions, Star Destroyers rarely operated with full complements of fighters, since even with their reduced price and low complexity Seinar Fleet Systems wasn't pumping them out fast enough to keep the full fleet supplied. This makes sense, given that each ISD was intended to carry a full 8 squadrons of TIEs - 96 fighters all told. There must have been hundreds of ISDs in the galaxy, minimum, and that's not including planetary garrisons, station defense forces, and the TIE complements of lighter patrol ships like Gozanti cruisers and Victory SDs. They were cheap - everything about them screams cheapness, from the lack of life support systems and shielding to the massive solar panels powering their electrical drives. They use ion engines, which require very little fuel, thus reducing their operational costs and letting the Empire deploy more of them for the same price as a more traditionally fuelled vessel, but in the process they are forced to use massive panels to provide the energy-hungry engines with enough power. So it seems to me like the main mistake here was phasing out the Republic starfighter corps prematurely. I choose to explain that by saying that Republic starfighters were high maintenance. Keeping them repaired and fueled, on the Imperial Starfighter Corps' budget, would have severely limited the number of small craft they could deploy. At a certain point, they had to make a choice between having a single squadron of older, more capable fighters aboard each SD, or settling for four squadrons of cheap fighters. For small antipiracy operations, this choice makes sense - it lets you control more space more efficiently. When this project was put into effect, the Empire didn't yet know they would be facing a determined insurgency equipped with high-value starfighters with well-trained pilots. Later in the war, the Empire begins deploying TIE Interceptors and (occasionally) Defenders, which I see as a sign that they're finally able to free up some industrial capacity to make better fighters now that their Star Destroyer fleet is pretty much complete - and now that it's become clear how much of an advantage the Rebellion has in dogfights. The starfighter corps' budget was expanding by this stage of the war as resources were freed up elsewhere - or else the Empire's slaving programs were finally starting to expand their industrial capacity to the point where they could expand their focus and start throwing some manufacturing man-hours the starfighter corps' way.

[@lubenicmackavic2780]

oh look someone knows something. Yes that is infact what this is about. But in addition the TIE could still project power (which the Tarkin Doctrine dictates, power projection over the subjects). So the TIE fulfilled its role perfectly as desgined.

[@dafilmqueen556]

Wow, so in other words, they made these cheap stupid ships because they simply didn't have enough money to operate them successfully for war, but once they got the resources needed, and saw how powerful the rebels truly were, they improved their ships with greater results. Wow, power!!

[@broD473]

My man really wrote an essay

[@Morokiin]

As a person blind in one eye: visibility is way more important than people think. Being able to look without turning your head is something most take for granted.

[@lorrainestevens4295]

People always say that stormtroopers can't aim well, but the only reason that people think they can't is because we only see main characters. They hit the foot soldiers in movies fine, and easily take out rebel fighters, but they just are physically unable to hit the main characters because they aren't allowed to die.

[@certifiedpilot2525]

plot armour…

[@sokaize]

Yep, it is pure plot armor

[@bigjake360t]

That, and the fact that most of the mane characters are force sensitive. Witch gives them the passive ability to doge lasers.

[@carlosfer2201]

@@bigjake360t "mane characters"... then what about the bald ones?

[@bigjake360t]

@@carlosfer2201 They get thrown out of windows, or off of balconies.

[@aaronator4d633]

The tie fighter roaring isn’t really a downside, in WW2 most planes engines were extremely loud but most pilots wouldn’t be able to hear it due to the glass being air tight. But still a great video.

[@benito23453]

MatPat is a brain burner!(Правдивое видео🇷🇺):……… kzbin.info/www/bejne/m37Zi4OMasaWrdk

[@chrislecount4801]

Plus if the Empire’s goal was to spread fear, I would think the sound of the TIE Fighter would do the trick.

[@Kremit_the_Forg]

First of all: WW2 planes weren't airtight, far from it... They weren't even pressurized like modern jets. Sure they had a seal but not airtight. That's why you'd have to be connected to the life support system, with oxygen and heating. The bombers even had little bottles you'd need to hook too when you left your station. Secondly: They could hear everything. They had however hearing protection (and coms) inside their headpieces because sound travels through mediums... The soundwaves generated by the engine hit the air, the air hits the cockpit, the cockpit hits the air IN the cockpit and this air acts upon your eardrum.. sure you could make sounddampening glass like in modern windows but that stuff is heavy. You want to avoid anything heavy in aviation. Especially if you just can thicken the hearingprotection.

[@wolvreigns]

The tie fighter roaring isnt a downside because they are in spaxe and use such there is no medium for sound to travel through. Air tight doesnt make something silent.

[@ThunderEwokB]

What I've heard is that Tie Fighter were inspired by Jedi Starfighters due to how incredibly well they performed except they didn't take one thing under consideration... the force.

[@wulfengel]

The force, and a rear window that's bigger than your head, seriously you got a gloryhole for a rear window in a TIE fighter.

[@projektkobra2247]

You didnt hear it...you SAW it in Revenge of the Sith....they were obviously proto-TIE fighters.

[@davidfuller581]

And unlike these, the Eta-2s (the Jedi Interceptors) _had fully transparent canopies_ so that makes it even worse. They _knew_ it was a bad idea and did it anyway.

[@maximomartin2529]

I agree with you. I believe If Palpatine left the Republic with the same costumes, ships and fighters, and so on, the Republic into Empire would be more successful into winning the war against the Rebellion.

[@kacpermalina308]

yes just hire more pilots to fill that ships and you win.

[@maximomartin2529]

@@kacpermalina308 Exactly!

[@rubynall80]

So the Sith were actually the ones carrying the Empire to victory. They were just as poorly managed as the Rebels, only the Rebels had the excuse of lacking funds and resources. This is what happens when you let corporate have their way. Palpatine might've done something about it, if it weren't for his obsession with hunting down Jedi.

[@MrSailing101]

the design of the tie fighter was a cheaper adaptation of the Jedi starfighters from episode three in other words, they are vehicles that were built with force users in mind, and thus not intended to be piloted by normal people.

[@killnet5638]

MatPat is a brain burner!(Правдивое видео🇷🇺):……. kzbin.info/www/bejne/m37Zi4OMasaWrdk

[@andresacosta7885]

Wow, you’re getting a lot of bots. Also, I agree with you. They tried to copy something successful without questioning why it was successful

[@Me-wx1mt]

ok that's actually really cool. *FiNaLlY iT'S hE-* just kidding

[@Pure_Havoc]

its pretty difficult when they have the Rule of Two

[@redblade5556]

(designed to be used by force users) (is instead given to be used by normies)

[@samthemultimediaman]

The TIE Fighter would actually be a practical IRL spacecraft with its solar panels and twin ion engines, it couldnt enter atmosphere because antigravity devices arent real, but it would work fine in a vacuum.

[@normal8999]

Imagine if somehow, we can send it in an aircraft to space and launch it there, would it revolutionized space travel?

[@chiefkiep1147]

In canon and legends, the tie side wings, weren’t solar panels, they helped with movement more than anything.

[@normal8999]

@@chiefkiep1147 well that sucks, can we change it to solar panel?

[@bangerxshane]

@@normal8999 they don't even fly close to a star a lot of times, and if they do how much energy could it possibly extract justifying the cost?

[@normal8999]

@@bangerxshane idk, I'm no star Wars fans

[@Hades-1021]

Ironically it is mentioned that the rebels had additional time due to the guy manning the Death star's firing mechanism had PTSD from firing the killing blow on Alderaan and had delayed from pulling the trigger of the Death Star so either way Luke, Vader, and Han Solo probably would've seen Yavin 4 and maybe the Death Star too blown to pieces

[@polishscribe674]

11:20 historians talking about late WW2 german tanks projects be like:

[@Nolandeslongchamp]

Lol

[@Nolandeslongchamp]

Underrated comment

[@polishscribe674]

@@Nolandeslongchamp let's make it properly ratet then!

[@Useraccount85]

2:29 That's not a Tie fighter, that's a dog🤣

[@B1_1_9_7_5]

Lego Yoda death sound

[@declanhugors]

How about creating "wayfinders" that give the direct location to the most powerful secret army in the galaxy as well as the emperor himself? Imagine if they were that stupid.

[@barryallen871]

Lol, you are just food for bots.

[@TakeTheWorld21]

Rise of Skywalker sucked so hard to where Palpatine wasn’t even acting as intelligent or calculated as in the other movies since he just boldly announces to everyone that he’s back and lets the galaxy prepare and have time to fight back against him

[@dingledongus]

@@barryallen871 you are the only real person in this reply section bro 💀

[@coolnerdlll6053]

@@TakeTheWorld21 I knew someone was gonna complain about Disney in these comments. Just let it go. ROS was a mess, but I think it's mediocre enough to not be worth complaining about.

[@michaelm8852]

Nah, the worst idea ever was sending assassins with engraved maps on their knifes so anyone that can read Sith can find the mysterious triangles and use them to find the emperor.

[@B1_1_9_7_5]

Wait so if they weren't outfitted with basic life support systems then how were Poe Dameron and Finn able to fly them in force awakens

[@readermike8355]

Updated Tie Fighter. Those actually have life support and shields since First Order actually couldn't afford to lose pilots

[@B1_1_9_7_5]

@@readermike8355 ok and where exactly do you get your sources from

[@michaeldolstra]

Where do they fit the components for this and the 2nd person in the small spaceframe? That does not seem possible.

[@sanguineaurora8765]

First Order Tie's were equipped with hyperdrive, shielding and life-support. Called Tie/FO's Also they are a little bigger than the Imperial Tie's due to a rear gunner. First Order knew they couldn't match the New Republic in their numbers so they went quality over quantity. It's kinda like their roles are reversed from the Galactic Civil War where Rebels had better but fewer ships. Then, just a movie later, they aren't even bothered when thousands of their personnel die on collapsing Starkiller Base. And later, when the Mandator IV gets destroyed. Mind you, that Mandator IV had over 25.000 crew on board. most of whom were brainwashed children in their late teens or early 20's who never had any other choice in life... Imagine the size of the massacre and loss of life. If only Star Wars could consider the humanity of the bad guys once in a while.. Oh wait.. Yeah. Battle Droids at least had some personality.

[@B1_1_9_7_5]

@@sanguineaurora8765 ok some? How dare you battle droids had a lot of personality

[@GetZeducated]

I could tell u without watching they went for quantity not quality and didn’t train troops well after they traded clones for conscripts

[@EnchantingWings1]

Oh my goodness, you got showered with comment bots

[@lordsiomai]

Matpat is pretty much the only the dude on the planet the can make a video about why a fictional fighter spacecraft is a disaster from a aeronautical engineering perspective and successfully convince everyone in the process.

[@killnet5638]

MatPat is a brain burner!(Правдивое видео🇷🇺):…… kzbin.info/www/bejne/m37Zi4OMasaWrdk

[@killnet5638]

Ж

[@killnet5638]

Ш

[@madsvigan2898]

We just gonna ignore that space doesnt have air? So aeronautical engineering isnt needed. You move freely in XYZ planes.

[@vallahdsacretor4839]

@@madsvigan2898 Technically yes, but if you look at how all the ships are designed, they have primary rear thrusters. The lack of imposing gravity and air friction doesn't mean they'll fully utilize it to their full advantage. Besides, Star Wars is cinematography first and foremost, and large dog fights around massive ships is a lot more visually appealing and easier to produce. See the opening of Episode 3.

[@eomoran]

The mass production was actually a copy of how Americans beat the Germans. “The German tanks were worth four of the American tanks, but the Americans had five” While the TIE fighters ought to have been phased out by this stage, they had been in service for a long time and had been successful up until that point. It’s quite likely that the empire wouldn’t have been able to expand at the rate it was expanding if it had been trying to build more durable stuff. Especially when you take into account what happened in the Rebels series, where often tie fighters were getting destroyed by resistance on the ground by being blown up with crates of stuff, where the shields would have been disabled anyways.

[@errorcringyname4044]

In reality though Shermans wiped the floor with anything but a king tiger in a 1v1 while playing perfect infantry support

[@mr.thiemo1406]

@@errorcringyname4044 the ones with the 75mm would have a hard time even against a panzer 4 let alone a panther. the ones with the 76 would win most engagements

[@YoBoyNeptune]

A better analogy would be the Russian T34. The American M4s had to be well designed and easy to maintain because the front was so far from the place that manufacturered them. While the T34 was decent on paper but so many corners were cut to keep production numbers up

[@errorcringyname4044]

@@mr.thiemo1406 the panthers believe it or not had quite a hard time against any sherman with the shermans coming out on top 3.6 wins to 1

[@gaychampagnesocialist7213]

@@YoBoyNeptune The issue with the T34 is then you have to spend resources and manpower on a tank that doesn't work, when you could cut it in half and actually get work done. This is the same issue the Empire has, thinking they have an infinite amount of manpower and resources they can use for their war machine, but not realizing they really reeeaaaally don't.

[@dungeonchest5827]

Matpat actually neglected the largest design flaw the tie fighters have, which is a lack of landing gears. Tie fighters, if they somehow survive a hit in a low altitude fight, cannot eject or land. This is because, if you take the empires inspiration and all the other flaws of the ship, Tie fighters are suicide ships. Their goal is to either self destruct or distract the enemy long enough for the bigger better ships to ready cannons that can cause more damage and be more accurate. They also serve as a fear factor, their screech can be pretty terrifying when it catches you off guard.

[@devinnall2284]

Ironically, the Tie fighters loudness could've been a great advantage in a large scale battle. Imagine how loud it would have been to be surrounded by thousands of them which would have been extremely disorienting for anyone fighting them.

[@MohamedRamadan-qi4hl]

Dude...... There is no sound in space

[@devinnall2284]

@@MohamedRamadan-qi4hl In the Star Wars universe there is

[@UNGGodYT]

yes , the intent was to swarm the enemies, so a cloud coming toward it, so they would not know where they are if the sound was everywhere , just remember that the pilots of said tie fighters dont hear any sound , it is somehow only outside not inside .

[@stigkenobi7525]

No it wouldn't. Since the x-wing pilots wear helmets that block out all sound except for the coms. You could not be more wrong.

[@devinnall2284]

@@stigkenobi7525 Okay but, the Tie fighters were made only to fight rebels they also would have battled against all kinds of pirates and other enemies who might no be so organized or well equipped.

[@was3513]

Honestly knowing this just makes the Empire more impressive, they literally controlled the galaxy on a budget.

[@mr.boomguy]

Being a regular on Generation Tech, he has "exposed" these flaws and more, and talked about how the Tie Defender pretty much fixes every one of these flaws (maybe except the visibility part). I'd like a follow up video about the Tie Defender to see how effective it Really is, because I love that fighter.

[@ericradespiel7779]

I think the TIE fighters iconic sound comes from the Stuka B-1 gyro trumpets from 1939-45 they were use for there fear factor

[@jbradley8659]

You mean the Jericho Trumpets (the unpowered blades that resemble a 2 blade propeller, mounted on the fixed landing gear and make a frightening sound when diving)?

[@ericradespiel7779]

@@jbradley8659 yes

[@aidanrogers4438]

4:47 _The editor_ ‘This one’s for you, Eddie.’

[@danielnavarrete1006]

I miss him already he was a cool character

[@padraicmarkle4658]

Minor point about the tie fighter, they were never intended for stealth missions. They also possess no hyper drive, meaning they had to be transported by some other ship to every encounter, usually a Star Destroyer. The idea that they were for stealth is moot. They had the Tie Phantom for that. Also, the points are not unknown in the Tie fighter being a piece of junk is universally accepted in the lore. This is why in Episode 6, Return of the Jedi, you see the new design of the tie interceptor, and later in the legends you would see the Tie Defender which fixed all of the problems by adding shielding, life support, hyperdrive, and visibility lines.

[@benito23453]

MatPat is a brain burner!(Правдивое видео🇷🇺):……. kzbin.info/www/bejne/m37Zi4OMasaWrdk

[@sprinkleman8103]

The Tie Defender is also canon, as shown in the Star Wars Rebels series but the legends version was better

[@ibzdagamer]

its not about stealth missions doe, the sound is comically loud, so the rebels could avoid it easily and get he first hit, its always about the first hit in a dog fight, and tie defenders are cannon, legends aren't, and it got destroyed the factory for tie defenders and production costs where cut for the death star.

[@jettlucashayes8508]

@@ibzdagamer but they may be brought back or even upgraded with thrawn’s new army

[@wolvreigns]

@@ibzdagamer but sound can only travel through a medium. So in space means no sound.

[@hermaeusmora2945]

The TIE fighter sound may not be a design flaw. In WW2 the German Stuka's did dive bombing and it had a very distinctive sound that was used to terrify those below. Same with the German's "screaming mimi" artillery, distinctive sound meant to terrify.

[@byronlee8745]

Another flaw of the tie fighter is that they had no landing gear. They had to be launched from special hanger racks in the death star and the star destroyers.

[@JohnDlugosz]

Rationalizing the sound: The pilots are not hearing the sound produced by the enemy craft through a vacuum. Rather, the sound is produced by the sensor system as an effective way of telling the pilot about the position and movements of the surrounding craft. Presumably it is a full surround sound system to give directional cues.

[@halliegeary8701]

Well I suppose it greatly fits with the Empires characterization. They’re so arrogant that they didn’t believe anyone could best them that they started to cut too many corners, ultimately helping to lead to their demise.

[@tok14a]

The TIE was inherently flawed from the start. It was made to mostly sit there and instill fear in the people like the ISD. Loved the video! Keep it up. You should do a video on Top Gun: Maverick!

[@joelsubba3778]

Yeah, if the tide offender had gotten into production jump, I would’ve had a chance, but they could’ve changed the window cockpit a bit

[@harrypembridge4430]

Some very good points, from playing the game I had the same issue, however the tactic used when flying the tie fighter was simply to hunt, good maneuverability and speed means you make quick attacks with several others then move on, the empires tactics were to overpower in a cost effective way, although we see the rebels scanners not picking them up it doesn't say the Ties didn't have effective scanners

[@wulfengel]

I play Star Wars Squadrons in VR so when I sit in that cockpit, I'm very aware of all the flaws, the rear window thats so small it could be a gloryhole, no visibility to your sides or below. So I just have the mindset to always get behind the enemy, be so aggressive it's always me on the chase. No shields, can only look forward, so the tactic is scare the enemy off and blast them as they're running. The front window is actually not that bad, you can lean forward over the centre console and peek round the edge of the window, it's slightly bowed out so you can look so far left that you can see the wings. In desktop mode it's horrid because your sat far back in the cockpit and half your vision is the hull around the edge of the screen, in VR you can inch up close to the window and have a pretty decent view. I also like the frame on the cockpit, that hexagon/circle frame in the centre is like the outside of a reticule or scope, helps you hone in on targets when your behind them. From flying a TIE fighter in VR, it really does feel like it was designed to be used always on attack, never have to deal with attacks from behind, the front window is designed so you can always keep enemies your chasing in your sights. What I mean is on an X-wing, can you see directly below you? beneath the nose? you can look down a lot further in a TIE than ships with a canopied cockpit. Sure you can't look behind or have no shields, but here's this: The TIE fighter is designed and also 'designated' a "Space superiority fighter" it's designed to achieve air superiority and is mass produced. So simply put, who needs to look behind or have rear deflector shields, when the only thing behind is even more TIEs following up and flanking you. Who needs visibility to the left and right when there's on average a hundred TIEs deployed for every twenty to thirty Rebel snub fighters? You have allied TIE left, right, up, down and behind you, the enemy is in front so therefore that's where the only window is going. I agree with Matt though, as an individual ship this TIE is crap But it is used with swarm tactics, therefore TIEs should always be covered by other TIEs or their carriers who move in to provide fire support, Quasar's getting right close to the battle to use their lasers on X-wings like in Squadron's first mission. The X-wing is still my favourite though, you can look up in it, best of all you can look up and behind in it so you can see people diving down on you from behind.

[@VMan29397]

@@wulfengel its pretty easy to beat a tie fighter just do a thatch weave with a wingman kzbin.info/www/bejne/fqvUZGxqab2ib68

[@therealdeadend]

Ok but if TIEs constantly got destroyed and had to be replaced, wouldn't it get more expensive in the long run to replace them than to have ships that don't get destroyed in the first place?

[@H3ntaig33K]

Matt is reading a script written by his interns. Applying concepts of offensive dogfighting where the empire meant for TIEs to be scrambled in defense of rebel fighters nullifies his point about sightlines and winning "the merge". During the battle of Yavin IV 8 TIEs took down 19 of 22 X-wings and 8 of 8 Y-wings sent to attack the Death Star by the rebels.

[@jeremytoth7635]

@@H3ntaig33K Yeah. We gotta remember who is at the head of it all when we talk about the Empire worrying about losing ranks lol.

[@lancemagmer9701]

Depends on the cost of shield generator good enough to be worth having vs the price of the base tie fighter.

[@mickgenau8067]

@@lancemagmer9701 A standard tie fighter only costs 60.000 credits (the x-wing 150.000) and the empire needed as many of them as possible, because they had to secure the whole galaxy, which is pretty much impossible. The shields could also be a flaw, because they would reduce their speed and during the battle of coruscant the fast interceptors (v-wing) suffered a lot less casualties than the shielded ships of the republic (Arc-170).

[@lancemagmer9701]

@@mickgenau8067 Is that production price or market price? It's also possible to he empire didn't have to he production facilities to produce enough shielding units.

[@MrRadicalMoves]

As an engineer who is literally paid to take all this kind of stuff into account... Mat Pat would make a good engineer.

[@Mike_Dubo]

0:26 I thought the biggest reason, both literally and figuratively, was sinking massive resources into oversized planet weapons. That, or not having a stricter screening process for Imperial Officers.

[@doombuddha]

2:47 - Come on... I cannot unsee MatPat here

[@gfish13]

Great video. This combined with the Empire's over reliance on large, expensive Star Destroyers is why the Empire was defeated by the Rebel Alliance

[@Cybertooth09]

Also, The wings can get caught on things during dogfights, and they can be torn off and crash. Also, the Mellinuim Falcon’s lasers are probably much stronger and more explosively powerful than regular fighters, because it’s a heavily armored smuggler ship who will probably need to defend itself from multiple attackers (or multiple skypirates)

[@dafilmqueen556]

Yet another reason why their design is so useless and tactically disappointing. I just keep seeing more and more reasons why the empire failed, and it ain't because of the Jedi this time..

[@phyroukann3764]

They should make the tie fighter to look like a flying saucer, or a butterfly-like in form. That way the pilot can get on and off the starship without using sci-fi magic. The starship itself are also able to land normally as well.

[@nickjoffe8433]

3:49 OH MY GOD! Why haven't I noticed that the Separatist Emblem is literally the Tie Fighter wings!!! HOW HAVE I NEVER NOTICED THIS!!!

[@sosgrosil1085]

Thank you for making me relive a civil conversation with my late father. This is pretty much all I was able to level with him on

[@Dark-uq4uy]

I’d more say the backbone of the imperial navy was the star destroyer. The empire cared more about capital ships and force projection then practicality. The tie fighter was never meant to be good, just good enough on mass to defend a larger ship that can actually get the job done. Dog fighting was never a concern of the empire, broadsides and larger engagements were. But alas, this mindset and ideology never worked for the empire, as they never truly fought against a large scale army like in the clone wars. This is why people theorized that the emperor was preparing for the uzanvong because their tech was suited to fight a wholly different type of war! One between great army’s not against some rag tag rebel scum!

[@jmurray1110]

Also the death star being able to blow up any foothold the bong established as well as there living planet

[@swordsman111982]

In the new Thrawn books they specifically point out that a Tie fighter is not meant to ever be alone in a fight. It is part of the weapons package that is the Star Destroyer. Thrawn specifically develops the Tie Defender to be an independent superiority fighter.

[@Gold-Knight]

Anyone else think the separatists had a point?