Floyd Shivambu vs Orania Movement - Land Review Committee

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Parliament of South Africa - “To represent the people, and to ensure government by the people in fulfilling our constitutional functions of passing laws and overseeing executive action”. EFF Floyd Shivambu grills Professor Boshoff of the Orania Movement during CONSTITUTIONAL REVIEW COMMITTEE Presentation in Parliament. *****
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[@amennkosi2332]

Iam black and I'm proud of Orania .. It came from nothing and they built it from the ground up. Those same people left us black people with everything and look at what we do ! If we don't burn it we loot . let's just put the differences aside black people have been in power for more than 20 years.. All we do is tender and B.E.E

[@SimphiweRadebe135]

You're not black

[@petramyburgh5606]

My friend I have just responded to a comment to that politician causing separation in our country. What is wrong with them? You want to live with your family in peace and when we walk in the street we say hallo to one another with a smile on our faces! You have your life I have mine! I listen to rock music !!!

[@wisdomunderstanding676]

We know when commenters say "I am Black." iit almost always means they are NOT. You agents need to learn new tactics. clown

[@stealthreader1964]

Wena, you're suffering from self hatred, you are a result of what Hendrik verwoerd wanted black people to think of themselves.

[@williamf739]

I see your point and raise you the idea that we as a continent suffer from 3 fundamental ideals and that is strong leadership ,ease of corruption and lack of vision ,with that said I think to recognize Orianna and their ideals in the post 94 South Africa would be excepting the idea that there is a safe haven for the mentality to segregate a people for their own purposes. If these people want to be apart then let them find a continent of their own so they can but if you exist as part of a nation and expect that nation to cater for you and you wants but you refuse to acknowledge its needs you in 1 word are "nuts"

[@davemarx7856]

Is no one bothered by how chubby the EFF members are? All their starving brothers and sisters but they're looking all tubby in Parliament.

[@linusgerhard6743]

Ask your mother 😂😂😂 she's also fat😊

[@edwill1595]

The intelligence between the two are just light years apart!

[@cory8606]

so much hate from the EFF. Look at all the previous homelands, in some of the most fertile areas and it's a shambles. Orania is in a arid semi-desert and it thrives.

[@mzwakhethenjwayo3618]

Where does it get its water n electricity?

[@jimbobjones1858]

They pay Eskom and Dept. of Water And Sanitation for it like everyone else. What is your point?

[@mzwakhethenjwayo3618]

@@jimbobjones1858 if they were that independent n want so called cessation then why don't they generate their own electricity n hands off the water in the orange river as this belongs to South Africa...do they have their own constitution?if so then we need to ask this what is a Nation compose of?if I decide to buy land n then still depend on the resources of the country where I am based that does not mean I have built my own country but instead it means I have excluded myself n other people from coming to my place n the criteria could be race as is orania since its based on exclusive racial segregation,thus promoting racial hatred

[@jimbobjones1858]

+Thenjwayo Mzwakhe They do draw water from the Gariep River (used to be called the Orange) but anyone who does, require a water use licence and pay government whether a service is provided or not. I believe they already rely to a great extent on solar electricity generation but are still grid-tied and pay Eskom for that privilege. They pay taxes to SARS like everyone else but insist on doing everything themselves, not to exploit "cheap labour" and are not reliant on government for grants and handouts. I believe they have a constitution of their own, subject to the SA Constitution which grants them a right to self-determination. (see: Section 235) Personally I was always very skeptical of Orania, but if you listen to Prof. Boshoff in a number on-line interviews, you might realise that they rather promote racial harmony than hatred. Why hassle them - they are not bothering anyone!

[@frankanonymous3766]

Intelligent black people should build their own Oriana. Other races are welcome.

[@yusufakals]

To the eff lady, why must he give land that they acquired legally, they acquired a barren piece of land which was a delapated city, it was nothing and they built a successful prosperous mini town , to people who haven’t built it, it was built by their own community, their own labor, why should they give that up.

[@quartusbuys6831]

Because of ENTITLEMENT!

[@prophetofanu8933]

That land belongs to the indigenous people...the Dutch colonised it... it doesn't belong to them.

[@blissr6277]

It is colonized= legal does not exist at that point u can kill, steal, opresss do whatever once u colonize ppl don’t matter if their not ur ppl

[@Bolognabeef]

@@prophetofanu8933 the land belongs to who bought it, furthermore the Zulus and other Bantus aren't indigenous peoples of SA

[@prophetofanu8933]

@@Bolognabeef bought it from whom?

[@whitehawk68]

Yes I agree, the Afrikaaners converted a barren strip of land through sheer determination , hard work and sweat to what it is today, now the blacks want it. Absolute SHAME on you!!!!! get your own land ! The anc is sitting on hundreds of thousands of acres!!!!!!!!!

[@sibusisosiso9727]

We don't want orania we want afrikan land u can take ur orania to Europe

[@keananlambrechts111]

Not one reasonable response, don't know what I was expecting... Stock car and Land are two very different objects.

[@hehe8012]

y'all colonized and stole that land. give it back to its rightful owners

[@mmatlouellah7904]

On who’s strip of land??

[@deoncockrell4327]

Why didn't any black people do what the people of Orania did? Why? Orania didn't steal any land, they bought a piece of land that nobody cared about and turned it into a community with a GDP of over a R1bn now all of a sudden everybody is interested, now all of a sudden it was "stolen"... Rather just be honest about your true motivations and here's a hard pill to swallow, dignity can't be taken, bought or "expropriated" it is earned by hard work, honesty and refusing to take shortcuts. Orania is not a physical thing, it's something that is carried in the hearts and minds of people who fear God, respect each other and are committed to being the best they can be. Good luck stealing that.

[@zavier1304]

Why do black only communities not thrive like Orania? The people in Orania don't even make use of black labour.

[@morrisgordon9618]

@@shootayibyukhrabaytak674 So why do these White people choose to live in SA.Why dont you just say to these white people to leave SA for Europe.

[@shootayibyukhrabaytak674]

@@morrisgordon9618 Because white people have as much right to live there as blacks do - 400 years whites have lived in SA......the Bantus weren't even there then.....this is an ignorant and racist remark and doesn't deal with anything I have said.......blacks can't look at themselves and learn from their mistakes, so they are condemned to repeat them

[@morrisgordon9618]

@@elaineduplooy5584Are you saying Afrikaners are better than the white Europeans and Australians ??.Because you control the Black SA community

[@elaineduplooy5584]

Morris Gordon. No, I didn't mean that at all, that was just a very good example of what the Boers went through to survive, in fact, whether you're European or any other white nation, you are a target because of what's currently happening in SA and around the world. I really am concerned for all good people of every race, who want to have this country work, but unfortunately I don't see that happening soon. And yes, the Boers made a covenant with God, that if God would protect them against the enemy, they would remember that day, 6 December, honouring and thank God into the generations to come. And as you would know, a covenant is binding. The current government changed that holiday from "Gelofte dag" to youth day, but if God made a covenant with man, it is binding, no matter what. God is not a man that He can lie. But we are all equal in Gods eyes, it's just our sins that separate us from God, but we have a choice and that's JESUS!!!! I'm not white nor black, but my identity is in Christ!!!!!!

[@morrisgordon9618]

@@elaineduplooy5584 I dont believe , you believe in a higher power or "God".I think, you believe in the White race more than in God.The oath was not with God but with the white race.Because you put whiteness over everything.Thats more important to you than food,family and country.Whiteness will also be your true "God".

[@thekgi1349]

This leader of Orania movement spoke like a well rounded, intelligent and decent South African white man. I did not expect that coming from a white community leader in Orania.

[@zavier1304]

Yeah because white leaders are never factual and well spoken?

[@jimbobjones1858]

I think we all had preconceived notions about Orania, but I've been seeing more about them on-line recently which really impresses me.

[@yusufakals]

You should watch his other interviews on KZbin, he is a very well spoken man, has a good vision for his community, I think other communities in SA should learn from them for prosperity.

[@thekgi1349]

@Boerboel 1652 You correct.

[@kingmufasa8929]

Lethekga, Ignatius Kgomo the sad truth is, Orania is working! they have NO CRIME!

[@nutronhammernutronhammer]

This isn't about equality or justice, it's plain jealousy on the part of what appears to be a major chunk of Blacks living in SA.

[@sheffglg7628]

In your country no one says this is blacks town but if they say this is a whites place we should agree and shut up hell no sir these guys are racists

[@julyhlophe3497]

Idont think so

[@truthteller9005]

This Orania guy actually sounds reasonable

[@deoncockrell4327]

He is a reasonable man, they fairly bought an unused piece of land and took its value from R0.5m to R1bn in a few years, they work hard, on their own and they are making a point of showing that they have not exploited anyone to achieve prosperity.

[@eenheidiskrag7123]

Very much so, Deon ! They´re thriving in the semi-arid Karoo...

[@moosesnWoop]

Very much so, great to see this kind of discourse.

[@777QuikSilver]

@@faa9261 No he is just giving facts.

[@yonelandibongo3760]

Sounds reasonable to you, but he offered no solution. He couldn't answer a simple question of how would he prefer the ownership demographics to look like over what period? His reluctance to answer a very simple question speaks to how they do not want to correct their wrongs. He keeps referring to how land should be viewed as living space and not as a commodity, meaning that he wants blacks to be squashed in other pieces of useless land. This is a blatant resistance...

[@mrhyde7431]

The eff lady is not relevant at all, she should be given some money and sent back to grade 1

[@trouserminnow1]

What?? Why can't those people do it for themselves? Are they incompetent?

[@chinesespeakwelsh]

yes

[@phikomazule2974]

Why could the Afrikaner and English stay in Europe, where they incompetent?

[@trouserminnow1]

@@phikomazule2974 why are they incompetent in Europe?

[@optimistic5778]

@@phikomazule2974 The exact opposite. They explored accros Earth with the boats they built.

[@shootayibyukhrabaytak674]

Ignorant and used to living on handouts and stealing

[@stephenhenning3576]

Why distribute land that is paid for by private owners, when the government owns more than 60% of unused land?

[@cryptoprepper1463]

because they are very racist

[@kobie451]

What poor black man that stays around a city will want to go sit on a piece of land no matter how big that is, hundreds of kilometers away. there just is not that much land around the cities.

[@bezilelanga847]

He can use it as security at a bank.... Get his jobless graduate children to open a business and make money.

[@kobie451]

That is possible i agree if there is a peaceful solution. But if land that is bonded is taken and not payed for or there is Zimbabwe style land grabs. The banks will be bankrupt, the economy bankrupt, and the land will be nearly worthless. The way i understand it is that land will belong to the state. Then every future corrupt government might decide your land now belongs to someone else. No investor or banker will bond such land. The other problem is rates and taxes raised on all land. The poor person getting whatever land wont be able to pay rates. This means more job losses in the municipalities because they have reduced income. And the final point is that even if u have land u cant get a loan if u dont earn a salary. So your only hope is to sell that land to someone who can afford it, which leaves u without land and a ruined economy and no grants.

[@kobie451]

African bank--Failed, SABC- failed, Eskom- failed, Prasa- failed, SAA-failed, Municipalities-failed, Farms bought by government and given to black people- 80% failed. Zimbabwe tried the land isue- failed, now they asking for white farmers back. White farmers from Zimbabwe in other African countries are all prospering and making good for those respective countries. What will change suddenly? Yes there are white Supremacists as are there black supremacists. Does all African Americans have to give their bought and earned land back? Not one white South African alive today had any land given to them. Those who have, had to work fork for it. And u cant feed they masses or give them anything for free without someone having to work for it first. The old saying goes - Easy come easy goes. If u keep getting things for free u will expect to get it free all the time. We used to build our own trains, which sourced many more jobs to black people. Today we cant even buy our own trains at 20 times the cost we could make them without messing it up, but then again all the white knowledge was removed from those institutions. Instead of being racist yourself, if people worked together many could have jobs. I would trade having a job for land any day.

[@kobie451]

U are obviously not from Africa. Do u even know what saved Zimbabwe from utter starvation? Do U? Let me tell u what did. They were able to come to South Africa to find jobs in their millions and send that money home. I know i employ 3 Zimbabwean ( and 14 South Africans) men and one of their wives, they escaped starvation to seek refugee status here. Two of them worked on a farm all their lives and one has done accountancy, he begged me for labour work. He has over the last 11 years become one of my best trusted employees. I regard him more as a friend as an employee. As this economy is now faltering i have had to let go of 1 of these guys. And the sad thing is if the whites are gone these immigrants will be the next to be murdered because they are taking jobs of South Africans. I have as of now helped him to build a house in Zimbabwe with 2 rental units. I want him to go back to Zimbabwe, because when South Africa fails there wont be any place for South Africans to run to to find jobs. So yes u have no idea of the reality of there being no jobs and most of all no grants, for the next 30 years. I am also considering partly moving my manufacturing business out of South Africa to Zimbabwe or Botswana, where they already mostly got over racism towards white people. I say again all this is not about race it is about politicians race baiting people so that they can have a free lunch forever.

[@kobie451]

Ok after this post i understand u are not from Africa. And i will gladly give u the cell number of my Zimbabwean workers. Whom one, incidentally i have helped build 2 rental units for his retirement. So if u dont know what the fcu k u talking about i am not wasting any more intellect on an African American who would not be willing to return to Africa. I can move my business to ZIm any day, and u know what they will gladly take my white arse back there because it will mean 10 families with food and education. As for u if u paid for an education u should ask for your school fees back

[@optimistic5778]

Only 30% of south Africa's land is inhabitable without boreholes.

[@bigboy4333]

I'm so confused, how does Orania affect our lives? Had Orania not existed, would you day to day life be any different? As a non conforming black South African, I refuse to blame 200k individuals who chose to separate themselves for reasons known to them, for the incompetence of our very own black Government. The ANC that we keep voting for since 1994 has untold amount of land being shared amongst themselves and their buddies, black and white, and Orania is just a scapegoat.

[@nhlakaniphoradebe1732]

I am of a view that, u guys are depending to the white supremecy to self surrender to equity which isn't possible to every corner of black peoples suffuring in this country u'll find white supremecy pouring vinegar to a wound. Look man they're moving there for the feel a mixure between them n us is an insult. What do you call that, they're training military scenarios in front of everyone who do you think they're preparing themselves against. I mean very rarely u'll find us hating them but we have every reason to that, it's a shame it's us who you'll find beginning to be recognized. Its very important that you come to yourself n look at yourself, respect urself first don't allow to be treated as a subhuman at a country of ur own birth and origin

[@LithaTshangatshanga]

Uthengiwe

[@astraeashaw4768]

Those two in their red everalls - so childishly arrogant and undignified. There is no hope for that country.

[@shootayibyukhrabaytak674]

And pretending they are intelligent and orderly, calling themselves "honorable Malema" "honorable Shivambu".........lol.........they beg for ridicule

[@ike3263]

This is 100% eff racism. The orania people live in the middle of nowhere and built somewhere and you cant?! Lmfao!

[@sheffglg7628]

So saying this is a town for white folks is not racist fuck outta here

[@JM-rs1ci]

South Africa is a large country, and Orania is a small location. Why does the EFF want to take that land from them?

[@beetlebayley5237]

J M It;s NOT the EFF that wants the land (they are just useful "intellectuals")... It's the Rothschilds! Read the book World Order by Eustace Mullins and be amazed!

[@hillbillysceptic1982]

It proves that apartheid was a better system for society including for the Hamites

[@sheffglg7628]

We dont want to take the land we want to live there

[@margelatutrandafirulgalben3156]

Why?​@@sheffglg7628

[@linusgerhard6743]

​@@beetlebayley5237😢

[@fashiondistricttv5128]

Orania is making much sense.

[@tarakbenslimane2228]

Sens of apartaid bastards regime.

[@aaienaislamova8495]

😆😆😆😆😆😆

[@mariuspieters2530]

Most people don't even no history and where they come from and as for land lol take as much as you like you people don't know how to work land and work as a team looking at the last 20 years excuses after excuses blame the whites but no focus on building maintenance. Example. I live in Durban the road from dbn to Richard's Bay for the last 4 years is dug up but not completed done to a lane in some parts its a toll road... A joke inner city of Durban a mess we can't even come out of our house at night... Land can't help the blacks in a 100 years only education and just general changes stop making children you can't support and children by several women and moving on.. I have a buddy at work black guy we earn the same but live so different I have a lot and save for progress be it home etc he is always broke no money pays titbits to children from 2 women in debt it at the clothing stores and complains about salaries I laugh no amount of money can save him so in this is a message blks have to lean to work hard on choices. And in good choice comes a good lifestyle.. Government has to deep pockets to help the blacks in south Africa land is a distraction eff a bunch of champagne 🥂 socialist full with hate

[@mzwakhethenjwayo3618]

Yet u still call him your buddy...loool

[@thekgi1349]

who are you to tell us whats good for us?Has white people ever prescribed anything good for African people? We demand our land now and we will get it by fire or by force.

[@mariuspieters2530]

@@thekgi1349 that is the problem.. Fire or force.. Nothing about hard work in that I come from a poor back round single mum looking after 2 boys the here sister and her 2 boy after she divorced grandma and grandpa on one salary so not easy for her we now live well work hard save and build home.. You don't see that because you have hate and won't move pass colour and I have not been given anything work for it some days i have no idea how iam going to pay my way so I go to my boss and ask him if I can work more less time with my family but you still think iam the problem.. The black guy at work always borrow money from the boss and won't save no one wants to work on Saturday the still drink 🍻 taverns are never empty Monday no money and I get the blame for there bad choices because iam not black and have a good life its sad when people have hate...one more thing I do a small thing everyday I give a meal to someone every day.. Not one black person at work even helped me not even a rand I get help from my friends and family to do this.... So judge or build a nation.. Look beyond hate

[@thekgi1349]

@@mariuspieters2530 It's good that you work hard.I work hard too and I am black and do not drink alcohol nor do I smoke -not that those two things have anything to do with colour . I wish you prosperity in your life and many good things. I have zero hate for white people God knows I am telling the truth. What I hate is racism and injustice .Many white South Africans are racist people that is why they is very little sympathy for them - especially from me. They are racist and this is not something I have been taught ,told or read in a book.I am telling you something I saw with my own eyes and heard with my own ears many times. However,they is hope - I just hope this will be a good solution to the land issue that will please most people and that South Africa will succeed and be a country for all and not just white people .God bless South Africa.

[@mariuspieters2530]

@@thekgi1349 thanks for the reply iam sure that blks have had a bad deal and it would take a long time to get rid of the ill feelings both ways but if we try we can change just look at the world and people through children's eyes there is no colour no hate just joy love people can make things so complicated we are idiots that way... You enjoy your day and all good to you. Be blessed in what you do

[@LeonDieBoer]

The EFF's arrogant young "politicians (who doesn't even know what a government bond is) asks completely non-relevant questions and when the quality answer backed by facts and data comes, then they play with their cellpones. Pathetic... I feel sorry for black South Africans i the EFF comes to power... Zimbabwe will have nothing on SA when it falls completely.

[@dewetmaartens359]

Mandela actually visited Orania and gave them his blessing. This is not made up you can easily verify what I have said with a simple search.

[@royrussel8722]

By he doesn't own southafrica

[@dewetmaartens359]

@@royrussel8722 and never will.

[@sanelemsomi3735]

I'm not Surprised he is a sellout anyway

[@kacperkozicki8965]

well, i'm from poland and i'm really proud of oranians. if i ever wanted to live in sa i would chose orania, because i think they do a great job and in such a country like sa where u can get killed in the middle of a street because you are white, orania is a great and safe location for whites

[@sheffglg7628]

They grandfathers did that to our mothers why shouldn't we

[@judahramashia8713]

This is the most constructive discussion on this matter I heard since the start. The rest were just “you stole our land and no we didn’t”

[@io_inc]

Why can't you build Orania in Europe?

[@wonjubhoy]

Political correctness.

[@jimmyferreira13]

So why can we see the black first land first presentation and then the eff dissing the Orania presentation on youbtube . But we can not see the Orania presentation. People need to see all sides. Not just the eff and black first land first. BS

[@jimbobjones1858]

Search "Constitutional Review Committee".Each day's session is over 6 hours long, so you'll have to scroll through the timeline as well.

[@ChocolateOdyssey]

Land is a right from G-d to all human beings. First, government needs to give up state owned land.

[@yusufakals]

At 3:51 looks like he is sleeping or on his phone, clearly he is not interested in what the gentleman has to say, sheer arrogance by the eff

[@ArmaPlays-sk3ph]

I am getting realy sick of this racist stuff, south-Africa is doomed

[@raymonddunne627]

Well done to the people of Orania for doing such great job, I would love to be patriotic to the land I live in unfortunately it's really difficult in South Africa but I'm sure if I lived in Orania I could be. Would you accept English speaking Irish people? I can't really speak Afrikaans :/

[@aaienaislamova8495]

Shut up

[@raymonddunne627]

@@aaienaislamova8495 you better keep hiding your face behind that mask >

[@michaelthompson679]

You would have to learn afrikaans

[@paullombard00]

They would accept you, but it won't be easy. You'll first have to learn Afrikaans, then learn the culture and history and finally you'll have to convince them that you consider yourself a Afrikaner. I met a German man who went through that process and lived in Orania. You'd have to be very motivated.

[@MONSTERKILL2013]

@@paullombard00 that's interesting

[@wallyknowll9894]

Shivambu should go and start a small business. A barber shop would be a good start.

[@wallyknowll9894]

@Mikey Pie These black racists want to live by taking white people money and spending it out.

[@chabalichabali6173]

Wally Knowll why dont you do that

[@wallyknowll9894]

@@chabalichabali6173 do you want white people to give you free money.

[@willactually7509]

Where does the Oros Man Shivambu get his statistics from? Whites 5% of the population owning 80% of the land...?

[@eenheidiskrag7123]

BOERS/AFRIKANERS should better elect a "Cabinet of Crisis" to start immediate negotiations with the Black Majority... aimed at getting their complete INDEPENDENCE from South Africa ! Such an elected Board of Citizens would necessarily be invested in the full representative powers to accomplish with the Boer/Afrikaner dream of having their own "promised land"... Independence has to be achieved in our lifetime!!! There´s no other way out from this evil crisis !...

[@eenheidiskrag7123]

Indeed, Letitia ! Raising awareness is essential... but we have to go to the NEXT step! Afrikaners have now thousands of effective friends abroad - mainly in Europe, the USA and Australia - and people can be mobilized to peacefully protest against the ANC Apartheid policies. It´s time to break the deafening silence of the national governments...

[@stephancoronatus8746]

But didn't you know Mathkab78? That you are actually now as we speak, living on stolen land, that your ancestors took from my great, great great.....10000 times great grand father, way back in the year, 9 630 BC? He was the origional white land owner in those ancient times in Africa , no one came before him. So I want it back, thank you. You can leave the keys on the kitchen table, don't worry about the milk, thank you very much.Your house is unfortunately now my house. Sorry to say, this is now the new laws of Africa, and I am lovin it! Can you tell the neighbors to also get the fuck off, or go and jump in a river (if they can't swim)? Appreciated and wish you all of the best!

[@eenheidiskrag7123]

Mathkab78: Thanks for your comment ! One can easily see bad things... but also GOOD things through the long period of Colonization of Africa ! I ask you to be impartial, and think just a little bit "out-of-the-box" ! What our eyes can see all around is essentially the outcome of the White People´s hard work... Not only, but essentially !!! Anyway, I think that we someday have to stop looking permanently to the Past - which one cannot fix from the wrongdoings on both sides - and start making things free of failed and useless ideologies, which can only offer us a blatant Culture of Hate and Prejudice, rising unemployment, endemic corruption, poverty, rampant economic decay... and plenty of CRIME !!! I´m very, very concerned about the extent of the ongoing brainwashing being perpetrated on the Southern African Peoples (RSA, Zimbabwe, Namibia, Angola...) who have been victims of unscrupulous populist leaders who don´t really care about the Peoples they should protect. I hope this evil situation can be fixed on the next elections !...

[@eenheidiskrag7123]

Patrick Kazan: Thanks for your comment ! I guess you are a young man, so maybe you don´t still have enough life experience to fully understand what´s going on... on the TOP of your own political and social reality ! Don´t mind, it´s not your fault ! Really... When you live in a Country where pupils are taught absolute "non-senses" at school... when senior political leaders dare to voice racial hatred speeches at daylight, with no criminal consequences at all... when SA Police don´t do what Police Services around the World usually do with visible results... it can´t really be your fault ! Anyway, maybe you can understand that it´s not up to you to decide the Future of the Minorities currently living in South Africa ! They are entitled to get FREE ! Do you remember your forefathers´ struggle ? It was about oppression, wasn´t it ? Well, now it´s the reversed story unfolding... And, as you should know, Afrikaners are now being targeted just because they are White ! And people don´t deserve that fate... Thus, NO !... it´s not about "White Supremacy" ! It´s just about FREEDOM !!!

[@eenheidiskrag7123]

Patrick Kazan: You talk about Europeans X Sub-Saharan Africans ! That´s OK for me ! Anyway, did you know that Europe’s BLACK population has grown dramatically over the last decade ?... There were nearly one MILLION asylum-seekers from Sub-Saharan Africa who fled into EUROPE between 2010 & 2017, according to a study from Pew Research Center, based on EuroStat Data (Review on QuartzCom/2018). And did you know that more than half of migrants who sought asylum in Europe in 2017 were born in Nigeria, SOUTH AFRICA, Somalia, Senegal, Ghana, Angola, Kenya, the Democratic Republic of Congo, and Cameroon ? Did you know that ? What do you think Europe should be doing with these asylum-seekers ? Thanks for your eventual response...

[@lemontree397]

"Our people are staying like pilchards in a tin" 😂 Say what you want, but the EFF has a sense of humor

[@janruudschutrups9382]

I hope there still is a future of coexistence for black, white and coloured peoples in South Africa. If the EFF however get's the reigns of power and start demanding farmlands without any form of compensation, I would advise the farmers to comply. Literally, only give them the land. Take all machines, valuables and other capital out of the country, destroy what you can't take with you and leave the EFF to rebuild the country from scratch.

[@williamkep7697]

Shivambu. What's stopping you from starting your own town in your own land??

[@eddiesolomon4836]

Because eff has no plan at all

[@ezekielamuaalua4564]

Orania will prosper. No crime. No corruption. No theft. Leave the people alone.

[@Kate-it7cn]

I promise you, rather than learn from them ( and they are generous with their blue print) they will destroy them! It’s what “ they do”, period. Not one example to show us otherwise.

[@antie4ie]

We all are human but those EFF is nonhuman for sure. I don't know what they even belong to..

[@peace6325]

Afrikaners on average don't have more than two or three children for a long time now... contributing to their 'wealth'. So there is a reason why they make out only 5% (according to video?) of the nation. Responsible family planning. So responsible family planning = less right to land?? Very logical EFF.

[@MrMariuspretorius]

In the first place I think people are missing a big point, they talk about it the whole time, HOW DID WE BECOME THE MINORITY? We dont make children that we know we cant afford, I stay in a house and only have one child, then I see black people staying in a shack with 6 children, So this is why we have land and are the minority, and black people know that they where told by the ANC to make as much children as possible years ago, so that if they come to power they will be the majority, so I must only buy clothes and pay school-fees for 1, as where that guy staying in the shack must pay for 6, so that is now my problem because I am white and own property because I can plan for my future

[@bonganiradebe9293]

Marius Pretorius no idiot you can't even make children you are not only a minority you are dying faster than you are giving birth

[@thabangmahlangu1484]

I like to hear your argument but your reasoning is flawed. Your assertions are not validate by anything (Not science and not research, just a passionate opinion). The same opinion I have which is: You are a minority because you came in a small boat from a far away place. Your minority is a result of you not being indigenous people of South Africa. You found us in our majority and no matter how many babies you make, you can't keep up with us. Do you see how much BS my point is? Same as yours, you are talking BS.

[@kobie451]

Why do u need science research to tell u that to put one child through school costs less than to do the same for 6

[@deoncockrell4327]

I don't see you policing the rest of KZbin comment sections for "irresponsible commentary", walk out your door and ask any white couple why they only have one or two children... they will tell you. PS: Talking about science, you can Google the historic sensus and population data of South Africa, I'd actually like to hear your opinion on it.

[@deoncockrell4327]

"I respond to what is of personal interest to me." Typos....? They say that small things amuse small minds, carry on brother, carry on.

[@lss922]

ORANIA FOREVER, GO AFRIKANER!

[@hakapeszimaki8369]

Nobody stops anybody to build a comunity that functioning.

[@sanelemsomi3735]

is it okay to discriminate. what if we give them Orania we don't want to see them outside it or inside South Africa is that okay. they are free to roam around our cities but we not in Orania

[@jasonbeale6875]

Floyd my friend. I’m not a massive friend of the Orania movement but if they want a tiny bit of land which is safe and secure, then let them have it

[@keletsoify]

How do you consider a self determination within the boundaries of SA now still a tiny town which could grow if not monitored. The amount of land they currently occupy will at some point in time not be enough for them and then they will start taking more of land not allocated to them and then what? Israel started they same way as the nation grew so was the need for more land hence the violence after the effects and has to be observe carefully not to happen here.

[@user-sd6zb6op1j]

That is not how Israel expanded. You are complete wrong. Israel expanded after it's neighbours declared war on it.

[@keletsoify]

@@user-sd6zb6op1j Two wrongs doesn't and will never correct anything but rather creates the more desperate situations that neither side would be happy with. You cannot tell me that because Israel with the help of the US in taking the large part that was occupied by the Palestinians is at peace with the outcome.

[@keletsoify]

Let me just add that I'm all for peaceful coexistence but no peace can come out of me taking your place and I think you will just let it go just like that. I will be so credulous to say the least.

[@user-sd6zb6op1j]

@@keletsoify Israel received barely any help from the US during the 1967 and 1973 wars. In fact in the 1973 war, most the of the support provided by the US arrived after the end of the war, the Soviets on the other hand provided the arabs with 60.000 tons of equipment and a few thousand mercenaries. Israel conquered the land fair and square.

[@user-sd6zb6op1j]

@@keletsoify the land belongs to the boers, they have lived there for 400 years (300 years in the specific area), longer than most African tribes which currently reside nearby. They bought the land and developed it on their own, despite being underestimated by basically everyone. They own this land to no one, if they hadn't developed it. It would have as empty and inhospitable as any other chunk of the massive south African desert

[@robertpothier]

This is ridiculous. How can you ask a question then ignore the response while tapping on your phone! 2ndly: Is there not enough land?! Why is it about taking land that is worked? -Orania is beautiful because the people there made it like that..."surrounding areas around orania" - draw a circle please, then draw another circle AROUND that...exactly. I have many black friends and I hate to get into this but you cannot point at what others have when you have not built that infrastructure into your own domain.

[@user-fx2nk9cb8f]

Orania has Technical School in the land of South African Country while our children not allowed to have. Please can our children have Technical Schools also in the land of South Africa Please. I think that will be best for our children's too. Our children also have a right to have best education. If children of Orania can have Technical schools Children of South Africa must have Technical Schools too.

[@diamant1579]

black's never had land in south africa you stole it or murder to get it.

[@ericcastle7296]

Idiot thinking as usual

[@the5-starreview871]

Power does not cede amything to a lesser entity! Power does not back up in the face idol threats or long talks. The ANC and Mandela kept South Africans in the lesser position. Stay the course...but get that land...by any means necessary.

[@dumisanid8733]

They used to be Europeans all along.. With Europeans Only signages. Now that we say let's all share the land. Then they say they too are Africans??

[@MrZeev76]

After living there for over 400 years, they should be called Africans. To be African is not to be a certain race. The Bantu look nothing like the Khoisan people. The Egyptians or Moroccans certainly don´t look like the Bantu, neither do the Ethiopians and Somalians. Africa has many races.

[@user-fx2nk9cb8f]

We dont want Land of Orania. We want Technical Schools back for our children.

[@garethkeemore31]

This is Isreal and Palestine in SA. Same Same but different

[@melpowell9362]

I think I can give an outsider's perspective of the problem. As an American, I can tell you that a lot of politicians make a career out of unnecessary bickering on a subject instead of presenting a viable solution. There seems to be more emphasis on giving history lessons and attempting to get someone to admit to alleged ancestral wrongdoings. There was no "Constitution" when the majority of lands were occupied and it was not developed to the point that it is now. Take it from someone who knows agriculture. If South Africa does remove whites from the lands they have been tending and give it to others who may not have the knowledge of how to get the land to produce, there will be more significant problems on the way. The very survival of the nation may be at risk. If expropriation occurs without compensation, the current residents must be afforded the opportunity to remove their equipment and other possessions from the property prior to occupation by any other party or parties. There is obviously a lot of mistrust on both sides but there must be positive communication and dedication to making South Africa stronger as a nation, both domestically and internationally. I wish them the best.

[@TroubleMedia1]

6:14 - 8:01...anyone understand what shes trying to say?lol

[@TBOTSS]

"Can you give me a banana?"

[@japievanschalkwyk6782]

Blubber... And more blubber, never anything constructive, EVER

[@Mauritzb88]

Shivambu is the best illustration of a Racist!

[@chabalichabali6173]

Mauritz Botha u not backing up ur claim.why say dat

[@PeterJohnJnb]

1500 people can cause this much stress for these people. Eish, let them be - who cares???? They're just living out their lives man. Those of us who want to live inclusively, let us do it, those that don't, don't. Isn't that a democracy?

[@pangpang106]

Hoogmoed voor die val en trots voor die verbreek.ANC you next God almighty doesnt sleep he is the most just and this land is the khoi sans land not blacks

[@bonganizulu2683]

Land will be taken, it's just a matter of time. We can chit chat and talk but at the end of the day, land will be taken

[@calebtimes453]

It does seem that way all well

[@ginomanshit2365]

starvation will ensue and your social systems will collapse due to the tiny minority of whites paying the majority in tax go ahead have fun,as long as you stay in your self created shithole instead of flooding into white lands when times get tough

[@andrejacobs7514]

Yes, land will be taken, people will starve and will turn on each other and will steal and murder each other because that is the nature of Africans. They can’t do anything by themselves without someone telling them how to do it, like children. Just look at how they have turned once internationally recognized 1st world cities into slums.

[@kingmufasa8929]

Ryan Zulu war is coming!

[@bonganizulu2683]

@@elaineduplooy5584 you can say all names and terms you can think of, but as I said land will be taken broe, whether you like it or not, it's coming.

[@laurenjamieson8411]

Stop with this "the land was stolen" crap. IT WAS NEVER STOLEN!!!!

[@evansmashilo4548]

fotsek lank was stolen wena maarn

[@E-D-E2704]

+Evans Mashilo ja ja ja....who rattled your cage ?

[@uluntundamase7078]

What was it then?

[@NiekKuijpers]

Much respect to Orania

[@nozinikane6376]

To explain the whole day wont help...give us back what belongs to us period

[@BronxWavy]

3:37 "post colonial discourse" means threatening war

[@tsepondlovu1981]

Europe people. Europe!!! No place like home you know :)

[@maclectic]

To make prosperity out of the dry land does not look good

[@lameekgod5341]

Great answer

[@ronagov3020]

When I look at all the You Tube videos and comments on social media the fire has started. Now we have we have to see how big it gets and how fast the fire grows. Make no Mistake Zimbabwe and Botswana won't be supporting us

[@clt9914]

As reform is thought, redistribution equitably. Will there be a compensation to blacks, natives for the years they were denied of this economic Capital?

[@redmatters9318]

A yway you spin it , Orania is preserving apartheid. It must open its doors to all people. These rascists must be brought to book. G'day from Australia 🇦🇺.

[@bendebeer5791]

moet nie die swartes te woord staan in orania nie en as julle dit doen praat afrikaans moenie sy taal praat nie. hulle is vermakerig teenoor julle

[@travv88]

That woman is a truly disgusting person.

[@D.N..]

Unfortunate but Orania will be seized by the ANC , EFF . It was a noble effort but the Afrikaner will never be allowed a homeland

[@mohamedfarah2112]

good points. As an African, we can all live in peace.

[@constanciagideon9228]

I followed these orania videos. I understand this. These group of people are claiming to be like the ovahimba community in my country of origin Namibia. Let me explain how I understand things as a christian. According to the bible, what is bad will never ever last. But what is good, will stand, because God will protect it himself.

[@bell191991]

Simply handing over land to people will not make them prosperous. Even if it is good quality, fertile land. Country after country has done so called 'Land Reform' to be more 'fair'. Many of them ended up causing a food shortages, because the new owners could not reliably produce surplus food and make it a functioning business. Those food shortages will affect the poor and dispossessed the most. Abstract ideas of 'justice' matter less than the actual physical outcomes.

[@ronagov3020]

Shivumbu you made a good mathematical question about the 5% owned by whites. Are we getting factual figures then let's present to the nation as statistically and simple as possible

[@MyAbzo]

lol...If I were a betting man I would take my chances on Orania being one of the first pieces of land on the 'List of properties to be reshuffled'... By the way, anyone know who is behind the building fires?

[@niciv.n.8747]

Abongile Ndudula ....normally Satan is behind fires....and one day will be in tbe pit of fire.God is Almighty...and will have all His children in heaven one day....FOREVER.

[@dewetmaartens359]

Kom probeer ou ballas, jy en julle gan kak

[@MyAbzo]

lmao...ag shame, is jy seker ou kerel? I wouldn't be so cocky if I were you, maar ons sal moet sien :)

[@dumisanid8733]

True

[@beetlebayley5237]

Abongile Ndudula Hou nou op met jou ekskrementele "argumente" en wys wat in jou steek. Julle bekke is vreeslik glad, maar julle kan NIKS opbou nie. Dit help nie jy het 'n graad, maar geen rugraat nie. Kom nou, tattatjie. Dis nou al 30/ DERTIG jaar wat julle "in beheer" is, maar nie hond haaraf kan maak met oor die 4000 plase in die ANC se besit nie. Trek jou vinger uit jou "squamocolumnar junction" , lek hom skoon en spring aan die werk en wys ons hoe jy kommersieel boer man. Die woord is inisiatief. Mense wat die het maak altyd 'n sukses. Ek het saam met iemand in besigheid gegaan so 15 jaar terug. (Sal nie se wat sy velkleur was nie) weens swak besigheidsbesluite het hy als deur sy rektale kloof getrek. Ek het ALS verloor. Huis, Kar, geld, ALS. Moes weer begin met NIKS. Ek moes loop tot by mense om te werk. In twee jaar het ek (met die talente wat die Here my gegee het) weer 'n florerende, winsgewende besigheid opgebou. NIE EEN VAN JULLE SLIMKOPPE IN BEHEER KON DIT NOG REGKRY MET ALLES WAT JULLE BESIT EN BEHEER VANAF 1994 NIE. Ek werk BAIE tussen julle huise. Dit is net 'n absolute wonderwerk dat ek nog nie vrek is aan een of ander siekte waarvan die mediese wereld nog nooit gehoor het nie. Tot en met julle iets vermag het met dit wat in julle beheer is nie wil ek nie 'n woord verder van julle hoor nie. Ja ek weet ek praat "genadeloos", maar dis hoe die lewe is. Kry vir jou! Zuma het gebak! (en gebrou)...

[@keoagilemotshologane7387]

it happening guys Land Without Expropriation with Compensation Whether you people Like it or Not!

[@milmarQ]

God said, if your enemy says he is hungry, give him something to eat. If your enemy says he is thirsty, give him something to drink. However, coveting God-given, worked and paid for land, is not negotiable. God says, "Thou shalt not steal". This lets me think of a certain King Ahab and his wife Jezebel. They killed the landowner, Naboth, to steal his vineyard. Naboth went home, to be with the Lord. Ahab and Jezebel on the other, had a nasty fate...firstly, the King was killed by an unaimed arrow, his heirs would be destroyed and dogs would devour Jezebel on the street....not to mention the eternal torment in hell for the pair. You need Jesus my friend. This time here on earth is short, eternity is forever....is losing your soul worth a few square meters????? P.S a wise man (God) once said, if you don't work, you don't eat. Love you my brother

[@patrickneumann2022]

worry about the rest of the country before orania, there much more to fix, starting with crime and corrupton

[@manuelfoletti7882]

W Orania m, support from italy

[@28stretch]

Repercussions? What repercussions were there for them after regine change? 🤔 I'll wait..

[@cliffjansevanrensburg4985]

Ons soek als mahala basie

[@ceceliakuruwe-kep5167]

This Shivambu needs to go and build his own town for his blacks!

[@peterbillas9131]

Im black but if you give black orania it will look like sheee in 1 year we need to educate our people most of rdp house don't have garden the the shower are wardrobe for old clothes we need educational we can't take care of little he have and they know

[@666oracle]

When you speak equality and fairness, then the numbers you call simple mathematics should matter. How do you split the land equally?

[@keananlambrechts111]

You cant... If you divide all the land in SA excluding national parks and mountains you will each get a plot the size of a wendy house

[@666oracle]

That's a lie. I think anyone who has flown in a plane can easily debunk that fear mongering.

[@marabunya]

The Mokwele lady is always too emotional and falls prone to asking useless questions. Shivambu on the other hand is extremely calculating in his engagements. I think what makes him such a formidable opponent to debate against is his vast knowledge of the history of South African politics.

[@ThePainterr]

Myth buster- Republican Boers were not Afrikaners. Only 1/5 of Republican Boers were of Dutch decent.

[@sandiledlamini5929]

Mhm

[@E-D-E2704]

er... tank you very much for er..your er....reply Mr. ..er..Mr buzz off...er !

[@brotherG13]

😁😁Nothing worse than someone who thinks that he is smart.

[@debramorgan3824]

Your in Africa. We cant do that here.

[@randominput58]

why he bring Apartheid up, is that a threat ?

[@hansolavrkkennordland9534]

Is there one pise of land that is not populated that the africaner can get to live in.?

[@jeffdaddyjeffrey8012]

I didn't hear this guy what he was saying what is that isolated change

[@Alexlittle9]

4:39 thru 5:02 hell nah

[@alexandergreat2511]

Those EFFers look like bugs

[@alexandergreat2511]

Mikey Pie correction sir !

[@philippotgieter1526]

Build your own up then Rather than taking something someone else build up

[@dezeekat]

shivambu is uncle Fester

[@greatgd3966]

Eff are chubby they eating well at the expense of the poor whose money they stole from vbs

[@stuartschoultz663]

What about indians... mixed races?

[@tallblondealien5481]

Stuart Schoultz The Eff hate mixed race,Indian and anyone else.They like the Chinese at the moment but that will change!!!Bunch of angry youth at a guess abandoned from their fathers.Many many children with no fathers.I think that is a the most major problem,no family structure as a lot of the world,but especially Africa men making babies too many babies and leaving. Orania is probably successful because two parents and not loads of children.