Games That Aren't as Bad as You Might Think - Game Sack

Episode 150 - You may have heard some bad stuff about certain games or look at them and think that they probably won't deliver much fun. We're here to tell you otherwise. You are required to change all of your opinions after watching this episode. Or not.
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[@foxman1109]

To move quicker in Hook, hold down the attack button. Same thing when you fly.

[@GameXplain]

Pro Tip: You can turn off the Fruit border in Yoshi's Story with L. Bonus Pro Tip: Play Yoshi's Island instead

[@luigifan001]

Prick.

[@SodaPopBarbecue]

+GameXplain That's pretty rude language from a rather large game channel. No symbols means you're not joking, so you or whichever of your staff posted this meant this. If you're going to be dicks to other gaming channels, people might unsub from your channel.

[@gamefoun]

+The Name's Recoome what are you talkjng about?

[@wboeren1]

lol, good tips thnx.

[@GameXplain]

+Punished Roy +The Name's Recoome Yikes, I was really surprised to see both of your responses (particularly as my comment wasn't directed at anyone in particular). I assure you I was using ProTip in the manor of how the almighty Urban Dictionary defines it: "Obvious advice sarcastically presented as sage wisdom" Sorry if that wasn't clear (I'm guessing you guys weren't big GamePro readers! ). I've actually quite enjoyed every video I've seen of Game Sack and wouldn't comment at all if I felt otherwise

[@JackOfHarts96]

I thought Altered Beast was considered to be good by most people...

[@rars0n]

Oh man, Hook on SNES is a surprisingly good game. I remember getting it for Christmas and thinking "darn, why did they buy this instead of something better?" only to put the cart in and and quickly realize it was a very good game. The gameplay really made the game work. It's definitely worth playing even today.

[@LaydiNite]

I had fun with Altered Beast as well. I didn't realize it had such a bad reputation.

[@matthewlane518]

I like the genesis "Welcome to your doom" better than arcade, sounds more evil

[@Nickzstuff]

Hook is still one of my fav hidden gems. I was playing through it late last year when I found out for the first time there was a way to run by holding either the attack or jump button down. When I saw it made you fly faster to it blew my dam mind.

[@DoomPlague]

I did the same thing. Got through almost the whole game thinking you couldn't run and couldn't get through the last part. The game is way better once you realize that you can run. Did these guys ever correct this oversight?

[@Nickzstuff]

@@DoomPlague completely agreed. I still thought of hook as a hidden gem prior to the run feature. After its one of my fav underrated classics haha

[@jpaulobiem]

Dave is absolutely wrong about Hook. It has a run mechanic, you just have to hold the SNES 'Y' button. It allow you, inclusive, to fly faster and pass that difficult spiky part in Hook's ship. That game was a gen. Try it again Dave!

[@davidaitken8503]

Why are people on KZbin always so damn clueless about the games they play. AVN didn't know you could run in Dennis the Menace. If you think you might be doing something wrong in a game you're unfamiliar with just watch a speed run or long play video of it.

[@jcaseyjones2829]

Oh, I don't know, maybe because they played the game a decade before the internet, dipshit. Seriously, it took this long for someone to say this?

[@jbfarley]

@@davidaitken8503 🤡

[@alexandreandrade5365]

"Games That Aren't as Bad as You Might Think" Altered Beast as first game... WHAT THE FUCK???!!!

[@fourlokouva]

Please forgive my negative rant 5 years later…I do remember thinking the beast morph concept and voice clips were neat, just poorly executed. Sorry Joe

[@Spartan77]

Your Altered Beast cartridge label darkened like that because the manufacturer used cheap quality glue. The same thing happens to Activision carts on the 2600. Thank you for all your wonderful videos.

[@MyPhobo]

I didn't even know people hated Altered Beast. I always thought it was great, most of my friends did too. It was awesome back in the day.

[@Rountree1985]

Deca it’s revisionist history. Most people liked it back in the day, now people say it sucks for some reason.

[@rodmunch69]

I bought the Genesis at launch and while I didn't hate Altered Beast, I never thought it was a good game - other than the graphics, which looks stunning at the time. But in general everything I ever heard about Altered Beast was that it was a good looking game that wasn't very good - and that was what people, my friends, what I read in magazines, all said. Not a bad pack in game, but not a system mover, and if you're going to pack in something, it should make you want to buy the system to play it. Sega did eventually figure this out with Sonic.

[@RoomerJ]

@@Rountree1985 By "revisionist history" do you mean people changing theory minds? Lmao.

[@Ms_Drake]

Me either.

[@kerorogunsou78]

i think you might be playing Hook wrong, because i very clearly remember running and flying fast.

[@rednight2476]

Not that it's a good game by any stretch of the imagination, but E.T. is not nearly as bad as people like to claim it is, nor is it anywhere near the worst Atari VCS game.

[@frataltay4543]

rednight I agree with you... People always said E.T. is worst game ever made but real worst game ever made is... ACTION 52!

[@apispraetorium3275]

This is the first I'm hearing of anybody hating Altered Beast. This was always a classic among my circle of peeps.

[@dimmakchampion3808]

same

[@daywalker3735]

dude for real I LOVED that game as a kid!

[@briantaylor1918]

William Hall just seeing the cabinet blew me away! there was usually a crowd in front, but i still got chills just seeing the side of the machine when walking by ... 😺 then that dip switch mode on the Genesis increased the replay value bigtime by trying different beasts for different levels 😸

[@jeffm5056]

Altered Beast is awesome. I don't care what anyone says. That was one of the first home games that was really close to the arcade version.

[@crackcorn0404]

Some games that are better than people give credit for: Simon's Quest (NES) Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (NES) Zelda II (NES) Columns (Genesis)

[@robsmors]

Not only can you turn the square of fruits off in Yoshis Story but you can also center them more or move em more towards the edges. Gotta play around with the controller Dave....!

[@ChaossX77]

The fruit border in Yoshi's Story can be removed or repositioned with the c stick.

[@BENNYintheTECH]

thank God a new ep :) i was just thinkin yesterday how i could use a dose of sack. don't ever change your format. it's perfect. there's not many half hour shows i actually watch all the way through on youtube, with you guys its just natural and i always want more.

[@TheTrout9000]

I rented that Hook game constantly back in the day. I think I just really liked the ability to fly around in it, and the music was just like the movie!

[@CGQuarterly]

Great to see Altered Beast getting some respect from a mainstream KZbin creator! Same goes for China Warrior. Milon's Secret Castle has never clicked with me, but as Dave alluded to, I think it's because I don't understand how to play the game. Yoshi's Story is a cool game; I didn't realize that it was considered "bad" by some. Glad you guys are feeling better. Welcome back!

[@deftones8717]

Thank you Joe 🙏 it’s nice to see someone stick up for Altered Beast for a change. I never quite understood why Altered Beast gets so much hate. Game devs were working with a new system/new software I suppose, but I think the game is fine. Nothing spectacular or noteworthy really, but I don’t think it warrants the hate it receives. Also, like you Joe, my opinion may be a bit biased and might be skewed through my nostalgia goggles, as it was the first game I had for the Genesis as well. Admittedly, the game is quite primitive and there isn’t a whole lot to it, but it still plays pretty well. The whole vibe of the setting, the characters, and especially the music, gives off a sense of foreboding. I don’t ever hear anyone praise the music, so I guess I’m in the minority with my appreciation for it. I LOVE the first song. It’s amazing how much of an impact music can have on a game. But anyway, I know I’m 6 years late to this video but I’ve seen all of the newer gamesack videos :( so now I’m binging on the older ones. This channel is by far the best gaming channel! We all miss Dave, of course, but I am so glad that Joe stuck around for us! I totally understand and respect Dave’s decision to part ways so he can focus more on his family and his responsibilities, but I bet he misses you Joe! Poor guy, being an adult sucks lol. Who wants to sacrifice their fun video game channel with their buddy, for their job at UPS 💔 lol I’m sure it pains Dave deep down, but I hope he and his family are doing well! Miss you man! And Joe, I love YOU! thanks for remaining faithful and not cheating on us like Dave 😆 jk Great video by the way! 🖤

[@geshp]

Good episode; really refreshing to watch something that reviews middle of the road titles. Many vids focus just on the best or the worst but the majority of titles fall into this category so it is great to see it featured like this, Keep up the good work!

[@PaladinDusty]

I never understood the Altered Beat hate. That game sold me my Genesis.

[@sega_kid4288]

I'm sure someone has said this but you can run in Hook just hold down the jump button. It's a good have, it may be nostalgia, but I enjoy it.

[@Nandru85]

Holy mindbliwing, Batman! I've beaten this game several times and never found out I'm reading thus at 1 a.m. and of course I need to try it right now..!

[@BananaPhoneBanana]

On Yoshi's Story you can use the D Pad to change the size of the fruit frame and completely hide it.

[@jacobzagranis]

Wait, people don't like Altered Beast? Sure it can be hard, but I always used to have fun with it, the Genesis version at least.

[@GAMONSKI4EVER]

The sack is back! Sorry to hear you guys were both sick last week. Great video, respect the sack!

[@EdgarTarly]

L removes the fruit border in Yoshi's Story. I grew up with the game as a kid and my Parents were one of those people where "you can't get a new game until you beat the one you have" kind of people. I really got into Yoshi's Story, I even found the Black and White Yoshi's which were 'secret' ones.

[@MarkieMX]

HOOK in SNES is such an underappreciated gem Great music, good levels, and there is a run button you guys!!!!!!!!!!!!! (Was that enough exclamation marks to make my point?)

[@virustwin]

Great episode. would like to see more in this series. also, really glad you guys are feeling better again!

[@m3talman]

I just discovered your show and I have to say, I like how positive you guys are. I mean, you call a spade a spade when something about a game sucks, but the fact that you even have a video about games that aren't as bad as you would think or that their rep would have you believe speaks to the positive qualities of your show. Nice to see something other than "the 10 worst games evar!1" for once. 10/10 will watch more.

[@ryanamberger]

Would love to see a "children's games that don't suck" episode. Great video though guys. Glad your both feeling better. 😎👍

[@ryanamberger]

SHITEN MYOUUUUUUUUU!!!!!

[@protocetid]

+Ryan Amberger Your avatar gave me cancer.

[@MrDmoney156]

+Yes Imsure Exactly! lol and the Famicom\Super Famicom are for grown folks only. And got these little kids around thinking the Super Nintendo was edgy, hardcore and shit! 😆

[@NewAgeRed]

Don't you know? all games are for children. ;)

[@MrThankman360]

These guys have a fantastic T-shirt collection!

[@ActuallySanFrancisco]

oh how i would love to see more on this topic. so many 'popular' opinions on youtube for so many games are just completely ridiculous and a pure result of groupthink. nice episode as always!

[@badbirdkc]

I feel like the hate for Altered Beast is oddly retroactive. I don't remember people hating on it when it was new. I was blown away by it myself.

[@Cronnu]

About Hook, I don't know if someone have already said but you can run by holding the attack button (Y). I really like this game.

[@seanmyster6]

+Marcelo Nonato Yeah, how do so many people miss that? They must think that "attack = run" is exclusive to the Mario series.

[@jamergamer0076]

why don't people realize in yoshis story you just push the L button to hide or reveal the fruit readout

[@FabricioKMS]

Everytime the yoshis sing, my heart melts a little

[@weedjuul6519]

Damn I had no idea Yoshi’s Story had a bad reputation. And I kinda liked the way you move onto another world after one level. It gave you incentive to play through the story a few times. Also the hidden black and white Yoshis you can find that join your team and basically act as extra lives

[@AlucardsQuest]

I think Goemon047's review of Yoshi Story explains why most people passed it over, as well as why one might give it a second chance.

[@beebeejoo]

Who ever had the impression that altered beast was a bad game?

[@edwardmarshall2035]

No one I knew. Pretty sure it's a classic to everyone who played it, and is a great example of an arcade port done right, but I only ever played the Genesis version.

[@KayFabeMedia]

I've heard this for a while, but I always used to think it was good.

[@Trevelyan2]

awerawexd awerawer kids that watch knobs read off of Wikipedia on games they found on ROMs on their emulators, edit shit together and collect views.

[@bahamut245]

Hook does have a run button hold on the attack button and he'll run he can even fly faster when he's got pixie dust by holding same button

[@kodybuffettwilson]

Thank you for being one of the only videos I've ever seen that uses the prefix "were" correctly!

[@iHazGamezz]

I'm a little late and I didn't see anyone mention it while glancing through comments, but in "HOOK" you CAN run and fly faster! Just attack once and hold down the button and you'll pick up the pace!

[@MikeydCT]

I like Millon secret castle, glad it was in this episode.

[@Antnj81]

I've never heard of anyone hating alterbeast

[@croutonofdoom1]

Nice to have you guys back

[@foxyman9449]

In Hook, if you hold down the weapon button, you can dash and even fly faster. It makes the game a lot more fun, in my opinion and I still enjoy it to this day. I'd go back and give it a try, if you could :)

[@SoulSecureOfficial]

Yoshi Story is an awesome game and you can turn the fruit display off, you know. I can't understand how you wouldn't figure that out, but whatever. I played the crap out of it and the only reason I don't have it anymore is because it my copy went missing mysteriously a few years after I got it.

[@CarbonKnights]

I love Altered Beast! I play the arcade version of it a lot when I have a half hour to kill on Sonic's Ultimate Collection on 360, it isn't as good with that wonky-ass d-pad on those controllers, but I still love it every time. It reminds me of playing it on the machine at the gas station back in the day when I needed to get rid of my allowance.

[@geebsterswats]

I've been watching gamesack for at least t years. Don't know how I missed this episode, but holy crap. Shadow Blasters... I have had this memory for almost 30 years of the boss fight with the gigantic sprites, floating in space. I only played this game once when I was 8 or 9 as a weekend rental. I couldn't remember anything else about the game other than the boss fight. I've tried googling to figure out what game this is many times over the past 15 years! I'm definitely going to pick this one up and finally satisfy my nostalgia. Thanks Joe!

[@tr3vk4m]

I had the same thing about the SNES Taz game, which I recommend you do not pick up.

[@Drancks]

Glad to see you guys feeling better! Also dope episode, yo!

[@ScarisGargoyle121]

Altered beast was my first mega drive game too

[@manghariz2211]

We need part 2

[@thomaspleacher2735]

"These are based on the four elements like fire, wind, lightning, and... whirlie blades."

[@ModelJames13]

Beatdown: Fists of Vengeance. It's a 3-D beat em up made by Capcom and directed by our friend Kenji Inafune. It seems to be hated by nearly everyone who remembers it. But I'll tell you back in the day I rented it and loved it so much that when it was due back I returned it and headed straight over to Best Buy and bought myself a copy. I've played through it at least 10 times.

[@thefrankiepalmeri]

For the next "not as bad as you think" - Mischief Makers.

[@gozinta82]

+thefrankiepalmeri Friend and I rented that one when it first came out. Beat it the first day cuz we played it non-stop. Very awesome and original game thats underrated.

[@thefrankiepalmeri]

+gozinta82 Yeah , really a hidden gem.

[@gozinta82]

thefrankiepalmeri Also was one of the first cheaper games I had to pick up on the system more recently. One of two games released on the N64 I believe :)

[@evilubuntu9001]

I missed my weekly sack last week, I was starving for some sack and I am so happy that this sack was so nourishing and satisfied my craving for sack.

[@cameronmcdonley9795]

what the fuck?

[@evilubuntu9001]

Cameron Mcdonley I love Joe and Dave's sack.

[@cameronmcdonley9795]

Either you're a chick or you're homosexual I can infer that but no matter what your sexuality is, leave your Joe and Dave fantasies to yourself.

[@evilubuntu9001]

Cameron Mcdonley You are going to tell me you didn't come here looking for some sack?

[@cameronmcdonley9795]

Fuck off with that shit. Go fuck yourself.

[@schalkespringer]

That darkening has a nickname "actiplaque" since Activision labels are notorious for it. It has to do with the glue aging. If the lamination on the label is worn or not as thick(like less shiney when new) it usually will darken the worst. Hope that explains a little!

[@EdmondDantes224]

I'm surprised you got as far as you did in Hook without figuring out how to run. Yes there is a run button... or rather, you run the same way you do in Super Mario Bros: the attack button, when held down, is also the run button. I'm honestly kinda surprised you didn't accidentally luck into that, as that's how I figured it out.

[@scottcowan7343]

I'm sure he'd enjoy the game a bit more if he knew this.

[@EdmondDantes224]

Yeah, knowing how to play a game is usually conducive to enjoying it. I'm beginning to not trust Gamesack's opinion as this isn't the first time they've been seriously ignorant on something. Then again I watch them more just to see a boatload of different games than for their reviews anyway (they also dissed the Animaniacs SNES game for its "difficulty" but its actually pretty easy)

[@bondedomao]

They don't really seem to know google at all. But I still enjoy them.

[@markg5480]

Milon's is a great game. It's like a mix of The New Zealand Story, Metroid, and Simon's Quest. It is hampered by frustrating controls and sloppy hit detection, though. It's also great proof that nobody reads manuals, as it clearly states that you're meant to use your bubbles to break blocks to find items. Angry Video Game Nerd single handedly made this game out to be something mind bendingly impossible and ultra confusing, when in fact all you need to do is fire bubbles at everything and rub up against every wall. It's exactly the same as what you do on Metroid, but Metroid is a huge sprawling planet whereas Milon is a handful of little rooms.

[@MrJechgo]

In Hook, there's a "run" button when you fly, but it is not something that you'll know from the start :P

[@mikkolovesgaming1723]

+MrJechgo Oh wow, that's pretty obscure, a dash for ONLY flying.

[@MattyPBee]

You can run too, if you hold the button down it kicks in after a second or two

[@kernelpickle]

That Hook game would’ve been even better if it was just called “Rufio” because then you wouldn’t be a slow, middle aged man in tights-and if I recall Rufio had a cool sword.

[@Shredinsocal]

That was one of the least awkward intros in a long time...good job, guys!

[@darkleoz]

yes you can run in Hook just hold the attack button its in the manual

[@GameSack]

I must chastise Dave for buying a cart-only copy.

[@thoyo]

+Game Sack haha I had a feeling that was the issue :)

[@mitu123Copper]

Glad to see Yoshi's Story on here, I actually liked it.

[@dsgitlin]

A couple of things on Yoshi's Story (from memory having last played the game in...1998 or so?) - I remember the disappointment that it was more a kid's game than a sequel to Yoshi's Island. A lot of people were hoping for the latter than the former. That it was so easy was a bit of a letdown. - If you take it for what it is - a cute, happy game with fun mechanics - it's a lot better. - I think you can hit L or R or Z or something to hide the fruits - There's a bonus for collecting all of the light green melons instead of the other fruits. That's what I used to do for an added challenge.

[@PhilShary]

24:25 This is such a cathartic moment, guys! Thank you so much for that - in the era of console wars, paid reviews and cliche game journalism, we truly forget that it's okay to get enjoyment from what you really like playing! I am sometimes surprised when I realise that many games I played and loved 20 years ago are considered crap and, honestly, from an experienced player's point of view, really are crap. But I don't care!

[@storm6949]

I keep reading 'Game Sack' as 'Games Suck' lol

[@brothercannon]

The All-Turd Beast!

[@JustPeeSee]

What about an episode discussing games that are dismissed due to how similar they are to popular games: Ex. 8-Eyes (Castlevania), Ranger X (Blaster Master...sort of), Gunstar Heroes (Contra), Kid Chameleon (Super Mario Bros. 3), etc. I love your videos, guys.

[@iCach0]

Good to see you guys back in good health. I really loved the concept behind this video, please do more of these if you find good candidates.

[@cardsharpHS]

I'm currently playing Daikatana *and* Duke Nukem Forever, so I had to click a video with this title...

[@akhandtripathipyz9888]

Altered beast is good just hope it had an ending to make me feel like i accomplished something

[@conspiraciesarejustgreatst2059]

The awful singing at the end of Yoshi's story was my favorite end game moment ever. It was absolutely hilarious and makes me chuckle now whenever I hear it. Yes, that's like 20 years later....so it's definitely a great addition

[@solidsnake0427]

You can move really fast in Hook by holding the attack button like in a MARIO game. Also while flying.

[@brickman409]

Wherebear? There bear.

[@sakuyaizayoilamaid8373]

Altered beast is the most underrated genesis game. Its not that great but its not how bad people say it is, its a decent game

[@02337755]

Great episode on differences in gaming opinions, funny ending. Glad your back!

[@Reckez]

GameSack! Important content recomendation incoming: Please make an episode about your favorite VG Music, that you listening to on your MP3 player.

[@jp77757]

I never knew people considered altered beast bad, for myself i still love it.

[@someguy3186]

RPG Rider Loved that game in the arcades

[@JustinEvitable80]

People thought Altered Beast was bad?

[@exiled5160]

People thought Altered Beast was good?

[@domdellamorte]

My favorite episode of the show yet. I agreed with many of your picks and learned about some intriguing games I’ve never heard of! Love the show.

[@codekhalil6437]

Ahh such nostalgia with the snes version of Hook. I remember seeing previews of it in EGM. The colours jumped right off the page. It had great a snow level (a must for any platformer.) And it was as platformy as it gets. Just one of those good games you can pop in and turn your brain off

[@TheZombehdude]

you can totally hide the fruit on the side of Yoshi's Story. I thought it was a shoulder or a c button. You guys should be more thorough

[@Swordslinger-hb1ns]

Another game that gets a bad rap is the western rpg Elex. Very underrated gem despite mixed and mediocre reviews.

[@mamailo2011]

Great video guys. Keep up the great work. One idea for another "Enemies That Aren't as easy to beat as You Think at first sight"

[@kutulukutu]

I think it's the adhesive that starts bleeding through the label? My Altered Beast and GREEN DOWG are in the same shape. Streets of Rage, as well. I'll eventually replace the labels, because screw people these are my games. Not sure if I'm right about the adhesive bit, but I'm totally right about screw people. And I think they redid the voices from Altered Beast because Neff sounded like the snarky guy at a... specialty bar...

[@KrazeeNavelRocks]

One game that I had a lot of fun with but got a bad rap is Way of the Warrior on 3do. The controls were different but not bad once you got used to them, and the graphics and secrets were insane for the time. Plus I really like White Zombie so I thought the soundtrack rocked, remember this was before almost any games had “real” music.

[@RappingNinja]

In "Hook," you hold down the "Y" button to fly faster and to RUN. That's how you get through the spiked corridors AND how you make Peter look badass. Also, the music is EXCELLENT. Easy one of the selling points for me as a kid - aside from the GamePro review of the SNES cart, which gave the game PERFECT SCORES IN EVERYTHING (seriously), was the amazing work on the soundtrack.

[@Aannon]

You can TOTALLY run in Hook. Walking would take forever!

[@323GONZALEZ]

You could run on the game hook. By holding the attack button and moving forward makes you run :P . i know this cause i have the manual of this game.

[@BrightSpark]

I have never heared a whole lot of bad things about Yoshi's Story before. Maybe Europe just liked it a lot more than America for some reason? Anyway, one game that I think is not as bad as others think is *Banjo-Kazooie: Nuts and Bolts*. Yes, it's not the Banjo-Threeie we are still waiting for (but probably will get in the form of Yooka-Laylee), but it's a perfectly fine game in it's own right. Just forget about the marketing leading up to it or pretend that it's Lego Racers 3 or something, and you will have a lot of fun in a vehicular platformer with your favorite characters from the BK franchise.

[@SilentEagle3]

I'm unlike most in that I don't let a brand name make me expect and hate something. If a Nintendo IP turned into some kind of RTS or TBS, I might be confused (unless, you know, it was one in the first place), but if it's a good game, I don't give a darn if it's the next Pokémon game.

[@UnbornDecay]

I had no idea what B&K was before Nuts And Bolts, so, with an unbiased opinion (and as a child), picked it up, played it, loved it, broke it, cried for it. Stupid Xbox 360 laser!

[@yamigekusu]

I actually want that game. Now that I have a 360 again, I have a chance

[@BrightSpark]

YamiGekusu You could also pick up the Rare Replay collection if you have an XBone.

[@yamigekusu]

I just got a 360 three days ago

[@randypeppercorn1865]

"What did you think?" Dave, I've played Hook and it's AAAAAASS! 😀

[@SolukPlay]

You can run in Hook. Great game! Just hold the Y button down while pushing a direction and after a few moments Pan will burst run. Much easier to jump bigger pits later on. Love the show!

[@chrisvanderhoef9885]

I think the it's the glue they used that caused the label to go bad.

[@captaindishman9126]

Someone else in the world has played China Warrior? Amazing!

[@diegordi1394]

I like those Yoshis singing.

[@stereo123]

Oh, come on, Dave. You can hold some button and Peter Pan flies faster, that's how you get past that long spikey parts.

[@pjomayo]

There were far more than 5 ports of Altered Beast..C64,Amstrad CPC,ZX Spectrum Amiga,Atari ST...