Gen 3 Timing Tuning How To Guide, Histogram Setup, HP Tuners Tutorial

[@chriskubond6314]

If it wasn't for this guy, I'd be paying someone to tune my truck. Thank you thank you thank you!!

[@kinghatedtv9411]

Been watching GRG for like 6 months now. Was burning it all into my brain. Then realized you have a Gen 3 Tuning specific (which i will be tuning -eventually-) Just got my HPTuners and will be doing my added bung for the wideband in a couple weeks, then swapping springs and adding a cam to my 01 Burban... But now i feel like im more knowledgeable of the Gen4/5 platform cuz ive burnt it into my head for months LOL. So now im binge watching the Gen 3 stuff. Your vids are awesome Kyle!

[@ihorsepoweri2788]

I’ve watched these videos repeatedly and I’m slowly catching on these videos are very helpful

[@chadewhitaker]

The videos are awesome! I did a complete engine build on my 03 Sierra and installed a BTR stage 4 cam and a few other things then bought an HP tuner and with your GEN 3 videos it runs great!

[@RP-dv3pw]

Very informative. I need to slow the vids down by x.4

[@theproofgiver007]

Like the simple gen 3 videos!! Good start for a newbee like me

[@hexxj.6218]

Hey man thanks for the great information! Subscribed and thumbs up! Timing tuning seemed so hard but I got so much clarification on your video.

[@cyclesteves]

Thanks for the videos, just started playing my new MVPI 2 pro with pro link, this has helped me on my 2005 Silverado 1500 SS, thanks for all the videos.

[@johndahl8530]

my gen 3 is in the learning stages. I really enjoyed this one today

[@BadRobotXIII]

Love the content, great information. Just want to add, it is safer to leave the low octane table lower than the high octane. The ECM uses these during knock detection. The ECM interpolates between the two based on the knock learn factor. Also in the event of MAF failure it reverts the the low octane table. Not trying to call you out, just wanted to share a bit of information I've learned on my road to tuning. Love the videos, great information, keep it up. ABT dude!

[@GoatRopeGarage]

Yeah, I always tell people to leave the low octane offset, not sure what people want to make it match the high octane table.

[@clapfishSS]

If the MAF failure causes it to pull from the low octane table, should the tables match for a SD tune? My car has the MAF deleted and is in full SD so should mine match?

[@newmexicosportsacademynmsa1459]

do you have any videos on hemis?

[@justingruenberg3154]

Your content is great! I’m working in efi live and all your info transfers over!

[@RAWRMotorsports]

You should do a video on what you would do to a bone stock tune on a bone stock engine and or freed up engine . Ie intake /exhaust .. ✌👍😎🔥💥 Great videos man keep it up 💥🔥

[@georgiaboy1579]

Great video. Thanks for the knowledge. You make tunning so much easier

[@jamessanders3134]

What is the formula showing each timing parameter = total timing? I ask because on my LS6 logs there seems to be something going on that does not reconcile total timing. And I am logging all timing tables from what I can see.

[@exploringgodscountry]

I am also trying to log TCC as I think my TCC maybe causing some knock. Then the IAT, ECT, and commanded fuel... I think are already in list. I can see what those other tables are adding or subtracting then too and compare spark advance in log to main spark tables.

[@kickingrumption302]

Thank you for providing such informative videos. One question, curious as to why you are viewing average data vs. max data in the histogram?

[@dalehally9871]

Legend great work thank you

[@Marc_Wolfe]

Looks like MBT (max torque) table, might just be for traction/torque control or something, MBT minus torque drop requested, vs the high and low octane tables, then it uses whatever is lower?

[@MrRoyalfelix]

Great info thanks keep it rolling, super easy to understand things ur explaining 👍

[@rogeliogonzalez8655]

Awesome video and easy to understand. Thanks!!!

[@6.0burnsey]

Your videos are so helpful! Did a cam swap on my silverado and learning how to tune it myself. One quick question. When doing timing tuning on the third gen platform, should revert all of the changes done to force the truck into maf or speed density mode? Like reenable the o2’s and maf sensor.

[@kolemieux]

Exceptional ! Thanks so much

[@timhickey9687]

Hey mate, great content.

[@4BillC]

I get knock on the stock tune! I want to add a couple psi of boost but idk if she'll hold. Either way it will be fun!

[@wademunyard9026]

I like to try and keep intake and coolant temps as stable and consistent as possible when first dialling in fuel or timing. Than you can go in and make changes later, if need be to your other offset tables

[@wyattsmith8961]

At lower loads, timing can get way too advanced without knocking. Tuning for knock in this way could cause some of that catastrophic damage you mentioned. You can probably get away with it on the torque curve above peak torque, but not everywhere.

[@GoatRopeGarage]

Always use the MBT table as a guide

[@Ls_kang369]

in mt gen 3 timing i seem to have somthing that is adding timing to what i have comanded

[@GoatRopeGarage]

Good chance, there are multiple other tables that can add and subtract timing from the base table. Look at the ones on your spark advance area and see which can add timing and what conditions they require in order to do so. It's more common to have things pull timing

[@evcass69]

For fueling, it's highly desired to have smooth VE & MAF graphs. How important is it for the advance maps to be smooth? Mine are very bumpy from multiple tuners being in my '98 tune over the past 20 years and multiple engines without resetting the graph back to stock. But now I have a 12:1 418 vs a 10:1 346, is it safe to set the Hi & Lo octane advance maps back to OEM and start over given the displacement increase?

[@GoatRopeGarage]

Yeah, you have a little more room for transitions but I personally like to keep it smooth as possible as just like the other tables you can run into driveability issues

[@joshuas.4967]

Do you modify tunes? I have killer false knock on my truck, seems like you could definitely help.

[@joshuanetto9431]

Asking for a little help please. 2000 Silverado 5.3 complete Rebuild stge 2 btr cam ported 862 heads true duals to separate Flowmasters i kept bank 1 and 2 o2 sensors. Im trying to get my scanner set up to read everything i will need to do the proper tuning steps but i cant find CYLINDER AIR MASS in my tune file on the editor. Ive tried to follow your setup videos step by step but it seems my pcm is different for some reason. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

[@antonylopez5742]

Found it. Thanks man

[@clintchipley21]

So if you want a way to find mbt timing without a dyno in each given timing cell log maf airflow will peak at mbt timing.. the more airflow that is being vacuumed into the engine the more tq your making on a naturally aspirated car any way just the way I do it when I do not have access to a dyno

[@matthewbrown1760]

I have an 02’ Silverado that was Mustang Dyno Tuned but the original ECU was replaced with the Holley Terminator X-Max. It looks like most of your tutorials are with HP tunors. Do you have anything for the Gen 3 and the Terminator system? Thx

[@marktravis7697]

Do you have any videos on the 6014ls?

[@daviddahl1759]

Hi all, I have been wondering. I have a Gen3 and T56. The PCM is from a Tahoe (Po1) should I get a PCM that was for a standard transmission or is the Tahoe the same? Thanks for all the great vids....

[@pcmcobra]

another great video. thanks!

[@chrismartens6296]

I am looking to do a lean cruise tune. Have you talked about this before? Could you point me in the right direction? I have a 1998 ls1.

[@killerdoxen]

I’m planning an S10 LS swap in the future and found you by your Gen IV videos. Would be an LS3 running on a Gen III PCM to maintain the datalink the older trucks use. Plus integrated transmission control. Couple quick questions. You mention bad tunings causing catastrophic damage. What, in general, are the places where you can do this damage? I know knock from bad timing and running too lean hurts an engine, but is there anything else? And is there really a specific order to your tuning? Eg, first timing, then MAF, and then speed density and whatnot.

[@GoatRopeGarage]

Basically bad fueling and spark. I usually do MAF, SD then spark though the order might have to be changed on setup like that.

[@sbc350]

Good videos! I have a 5.3 lm7 with twin turbos, how much would you recommend to use timing advance while having 0.5bar boost?

[@frenzziee]

Any idea as to why my hits on the histogram are decimals? It would show as .314 or .268 but never a whole number. Certain I have parameters and other options identical to yours.

[@scottzito4797]

Why are we seeing as much 50° of timing at some of the lower cylinder airmass numbers?

[@GoatRopeGarage]

Off throttle area, it cuts fuel and advances timing. It’s trying to light off anything left over to reduce emissions but is effectively firing on dead cylinders. If you turn dfco off and lower the timing down there it will cause you to light it off with the exhaust valves open.

[@DM-qp7do]

So I need help, I have a 05 GMC 5.3 and a diabloi3 tuner, how much timing should I add for wide open throttle. I've tried playing around with it but the diablo geeks out if I use it too often. Thanks

[@adriancervantes19]

On the spark advance histogram what do the shades of blue indicate I'm a litttle lost on that. Some areas are light blue and some are a darker blue any help would appreciate thanks! Btw using the graphs you have on your website 🤙

[@GoatRopeGarage]

Just going to be an indication of spark level, just makes it easier to glance at and see where the most spark is commended

[@onequickhd]

what parameters would you change for gen 4 tahoe 5.3

[@kwebb2525]

Can you please explain the computer decisions on which table it picks to be in Low or high octane and why? Which one is default?

[@GoatRopeGarage]

High octane is default, the computer can switch to the low octane table if it detects knock, it can be a bit more complicated than that based on platform, but as long as you're not experiencing knock you should always be in the high octane table

[@rockabichebel]

Hello if i have MAF deleted on my gen3 2002 what tuning i should do for my 4l60e plz ?

[@macdaddy887]

Can these changes be logged without a prolink

[@philistineau]

Can you post a sample file with timing tables? What about pulling timing at peak torque?

[@daveh7645]

Should I have fuel trims and all the other stuff I turned off while doing maf tuning re-enabled for this?thanks in advance!

[@GoatRopeGarage]

Yeah, you turn all that back on for this part

[@BoostedMigs]

What if my advance table only has numbers on the top row ? 0.08

[@GoatRopeGarage]

You aren't logging the row parameter

[@Loucfr]

I’m having issues with the histograms I make. I follow the steps exactly and set it up the way he has it set up logging what he said to log but for whatever reason I cant get the histogram to populate any data. Any body else have a similar situation or know what I’m doing wrong? I also have the same issue with any other histogram I try and setup. Any help is greatly appreciated.

[@thatgmc6967]

Does it make a difference to tuning spark if you are running speed density enhanced with maf failed?

[@GoatRopeGarage]

Nope

[@trentdawg2832]

I have a lq9 bored .030 over with 64cc ls3 heads, roughly 11.2:1 compression. ...I'm running a 220/230 cam and lsa supercharger on holley terminator x, just wondering what I should set my wot timing at under 0 boost....I have a 2.45" upper pulley on a good day maybe get 12psi boost.....I pull 1lb per psi but what should I set wot. Timing at??? Any help would be greatly appreciated

[@GoatRopeGarage]

At that compression and boost you probably won't need more than 16-20 degrees at WoT. You running any kind of knock sensors?

[@Bojengle]

why don't these histograms work on the 2001 z28 camaro?

[@bangchamber317]

Kyle, I subtracted 2 from the whole high octane table and got weird things to happen. Like anti theft system enabled, or limp mode. I also noticed that my table (high octane) that I should be adding or subtracting from, has numbers in it with tenths and hundredths. Like 22.08, 32.44 etc ( I'm just making up the values). But why is there a decimal? Should I be adding and subtracting percentages instead of while numbers? I don't know why every time I add or subtract a whole number (so far just + and -2) It feels like I almost bricked my ecm. Any ideas what's happening? I'd like to start dialing in my timing a bit (already did maf and sd).

[@GoatRopeGarage]

You can add or subtract the decimal places, not a big deal. Percentages, whole numbers, how ever you want to do it. The errors happen after flashing sometimes, comms on the vehicle network get messed up

[@bangchamber317]

@@GoatRopeGarage thank you

[@aleksmijakoski4281]

When I'm in WOT my timing stays on 11.5 until I back off. Is this normal for a ls1 with a centrifugal supercharger . Tuned by someone else. I want to street fine tune it.

[@GoatRopeGarage]

Yeah, sounds normal. You are hitting the last row in your timing table and they have it flatlined is my guess.

[@aleksmijakoski4281]

@@GoatRopeGarage Thank you. I'm now just trying to adjust the cold first starts. This is something that takes time.

[@WIESEL607]

👊

[@austinboard1491]

Hey man I’m working on my car and I’m having a weird issue as the car is warming up under idle. Sometimes the car will plummet from 850 RPM to 400-500 RPM. Will stay like that for a second or 2 then will recover back to 850 RPM. Why would it do that?

[@GoatRopeGarage]

Mods?

[@austinboard1491]

Goat Rope Garage 78mm On3performace turbo system. Stage 2 BTR turbo 600 lift cam. 80lbs semiens deka 4 injectors

[@GoatRopeGarage]

@@austinboard1491 Year, make and model? With that much going on there is plenty of reasons. You speed density or do you still have a MAF?

[@austinboard1491]

Goat Rope Garage 02 Camaro SS 5.7. And I’m tuning with SD.

[@GoatRopeGarage]

@@austinboard1491 Watch your manifold pressure when this happens, is it steady when it takes a dive?

[@will485948]

Can you send me the link for part 1 and part 2

[@daveh7645]

I know it’s going to be operator error...for some reason my Advance table isn’t populating fully, just on 1st line...gen 3 p59. Whyyyyyy??? 😜 TIA Ps. Channel reads 138 g/s, rpm is 5600

[@GoatRopeGarage]

Dave, you're not logging one of your other parameters that you used for row and axis

[@daveh7645]

@@GoatRopeGarage yup😂, I get it now, thanks very much!!!

[@daveh7645]

Why the channel list isn’t populated when setting up a table or chart, or at least giving me the option to , is beyond me. That’s my observation anyway. I am obviously wanting to log the data, right?

[@GoatRopeGarage]

@@daveh7645 Dave, make sure you don't have too many parameters logging, you will have some not log if you get too many

[@daveh7645]

@@GoatRopeGarage ah...thanks

[@gary5616]

What if nothing shows up in my kock retard table ?. I am gen 3. 2bar os boosted. I set up table exactly as you show but nothing shows up in the table.

[@gary5616]

It shows it logging but no actual values show up on my table. Spark advance shows lik it should.

[@AtoBPerformanceAndTuning]

I don’t want to sound negative or bash because I do really enjoy most of your videos but blanket adding timing to the entire table is not a good idea. Adding until knock is also not a great idea. Lots of driving and creeping up on the tune up is what I would recommend. NA stuff is probably ok for this method but power adder setups is a good way to make piston soup. I also adjust adder tables so it’s not adding only pulling for safety and optimize high octane and low octane tables. Tune for the fuel you are using and tune individual areas of the table. Thanks for the content man again don’t wanna sound negative just wanted to point out info I didn’t agree with

[@GoatRopeGarage]

No worries man, thanks for the input and you're correct, when dealing with forced induction you definitely want to have light fingers. Part of this attend I from the fact that I blanket pull timing during fuel tuning on fresh setups so we are generally working back towards stock numbers. Thanks for the participation!

[@AtoBPerformanceAndTuning]

Ah yes I do blanket pull timing as well. Sorry if I misunderstood. Thanks again for all the vids.

[@Licklobster]

max timing before knock is a bad idea in general, no matter what the setup is.

[@user-rajput501]

I need hp tuner

[@user-rajput501]

Can you tech me

[@shawnc1716]

I really want to start tuning but this is like Chinese to me im lost but i got one of the diablo tuner and then paid someone for custom tune i feel theres so much more i could get out of my truck i should of bought hp tuner

[@GoatRopeGarage]

It's not that hard, you just have to take it one step at a time and things start to click. The problem is that there is easy more there than you need to tune and that can easily overwhelm.

[@Spinekiller1992]

Pittsburgh pirates like Pittsburg texas?

[@mattwest1457]

I'm having issues with my 01 tahoe cold air intake exhaust cats deleted electric fans I have added some timing and not getting any knock retard until wot

[@joedude5757]

slow down a bit on the how to guides when clicking around a bunch

[@kennymodz420]

Slow down the video lol or pause

[@memobook2010]

Que onda