GM Gen 3 Speed Density Tuning, Dialing In VE

[@BigEbikesports]

Kyle, I purchased HP tuners a few months ago, unlocked my 2017 silverado LT 5.3 4wd A6. I have learned so much from you! My truck had TCC shudder. I changed the trans fluid/filter, then tuned the TCC lockup to 0 slip and no lock up 1st thru 3rd. I disabled DOD, I also tuned engine side torque management, 10% up 1500-2000 rpm , then 20% up 2000 rpm to end in peak tables and last few bottom tables in DD. I also changed PE tables per your specs and man my truck is a freakin rocket and so smooth now with power delivery and cruising. MPG is better as long as I keep my foot out of it lol. I have made my investment back many times over tuning friends' and neighbors' trucks who were tired of their trucks being held back so much. Just wanted to say thank you sir for being a positive influence to society. God Bless you sir!

[@JakeLoe]

Your videos kick ass. I used them to tune my truck with a screw blower (it rips!) and now I’m teaching my buddy how to do his car. I sent him right here!

[@boosted0079]

I've really enjoyed your way of teaching. I've been able to follow your videos and understand what to do for my setup. Most of your gen 3 stuff is fairly relevant to tuning a series 2 or 3 GM 3800. Great stuff thanks.

[@GoatRopeGarage]

Great to hear!

[@chinoperez422]

Im trying to tune my 04 gtp sc , stock. Any i dea what to start with or settings ?

[@mxguy2438]

Enjoying the series. A couple things i'd like to have seen covered for this video or the next are the usual gen 3 tuning order of ve before maf and why. I'd also like to see you set up some of the powerful slope filters that are available in the scanner to filter out transient data. Also, touching on the number of cell hits and why that can increase your confidence in individual data points to use as anchor points when you do smoothing. Another technique i use when speed density tuning us to create a high resolution (3x the normal resolution) histogram. This allows me to use the data collected fom the center of the cell which minimizes the effect of interpolation from an adjacent cell causing errors in a cell you are trying to tune. Cheers, and the community thanks you.

[@GurjB]

Thank you to continuing providing such valuable information!

[@perkinsrj69]

Awesome job Kyle! Keep up the good work man! Learned a few more things on this series for my gen 3 07 Silverado.

[@SINSTER7THREE]

Great memory refresher vid

[@ericdraper5794]

Definitely like the rehash! Great video. ABT!

[@jaybones3459]

Thanks Kyle that steady state i guessed correctly vs MAF. This is what i needed to know for this weekend. Also i did notice if you just close the window in VE it resets the table to see changes. I didn’t have to keep reloading a tune. Found that out yesterday.

[@stevens1030]

Great video Kyle, this one is going in the tuning bible !!!

[@Marc_Wolfe]

1:46 Aren't the settings in this graph redundant if MAF is failed? Would love to see a compare of this vs the same except MAF codes never fail, the 4 delta values maxed, MAF fail frequencies set to impossible to pass values, VE correction factor min and max set to 1, the default value for MAF and MAP failures set to 0, if that'll even run with those last 2 changes. Getting ready to test that myself to be more sure of some things. But I don't have good logging gear, I just have play with it and listen to the engine and look at the exhaust color.

[@darwinfridgeseals741]

Thanks Kyle

[@wewe3wewe4]

Thanks a lot for the recap !

[@ericdolby1622]

When I am done tuning can I just leave the MAF error out and just run off the MAP and re enable stft

[@allenelfrank2570]

Not sure if you look at these old videos, but just recently started tuning with HP tuner on 98 C5 and was wondering about the AIR pump. Should it be disabled when tuning MAF and VE tables?

[@CompoundKodiak4x4]

Could you do a video about gen 3 tune scaling for boosted applications. Injectors and VE and anything else get dropped by the same percentage. It changes where you are on the spark table so that needs addressed.

[@GoatRopeGarage]

Sure thing!

[@jpaulwhite]

Did you ever make this video? About to crank up my 1st LS swap an LM7 with a 7875 and would love to see one of your videos that goes through tuning that ​@@GoatRopeGarage

[@chrisarriazola1592]

hey Kyle I’m making boots on a gen 3 but as soon as it hits boost it goes into limp mode what do I do? I’ve been researching everywhere and can’t find anything

[@brandonguthrie64]

Great video ,do i need to disable stft also ???? thank you

[@6389033]

Is there a math parameter or formula i can put to give me a mpg caluculation on hpt? Or what other math parameters are their to have?

[@lungsup]

I have a 2002 411 pcm. I don’t see the sensor parameters under airflow like you show. Just MAP. MAF air vs frequency and be table. How do I fall it. Only list of codes under engine diagnosis

[@theperceptionengine]

Hey Kyle what is your opinion about tuning MAF first and then VE, or vice versa? Does it make any difference?

[@jasonn4397]

MAF first only because it takes less time. VE is a much longer process, and if you’re running Dynamic Airflow, the MAF is likely doing the bulk of the calculations throughout the powerband.

[@GoatRopeGarage]

Bingo!

[@fordrangermods9642]

What if I have a primary and secondary but the secondary has different row axis and says it takes over if the maf fails do I adjust both?

[@venomousproductions7539]

i made a graph for secondary but then updated the OS for real time tuning in the editor and that gave me only one VE table...

[@seanshambo9218]

Im starting to dial in my VE but when I am logging, my commanded AFR will not change from 14.68 when just cruising around. Any idea why?

[@venomousproductions7539]

commanded afr will change on throttle position sensor percentage dialed in the power enrichment tables...

[@marior9077]

I need help with my graph i made my graph my afr is reading but when i go log on my afr err graph chart it only populates the first row where it says 15 what could be causing this?

[@chidozperformance5560]

So smaller the number =lean ?

[@EllweinEngines]

Have you noticed that for the Gen 3 that when MAF is failed then the PCM reverts to low octane spark table? That is what I've seen. So I figure that if you are running in speed density then make sure the low octane spark table is tuned too. Is that what you have seen?

[@carguytim9913]

I copied my high octane to the low octane

[@jasonn4397]

I believe he addressed this in the original VE tuning video, but in Speed Density you'll only have the low octane spark table. You can simply copy your high octane into your low octane table while tuning VE, and then copy the low octane table back in from an existing save file when you go back to Dynamic Airflow.

[@chrisbryant1657]

@@jasonn4397 What do you mean by going back to dynamic airflow?

[@mmbop3911]

I run gen 3 speed density only should i leave the steady state off? Or only have it off while tuning VE?

[@Playing_Field]

Hi could you tell me if this kit from amazon " 30-0300 X Series Wideband Uego Air/Fuel Ratio Gauge Kit,Wideband O2 Control Sensor Kit,Air Fuel Ratio Gauge 52mm (2-1/16”) with 4.9 LSU Sensor,Upgraded Digital Afr Controller | 0-5v & Rs232 Output" will work with my PCM for tuning ?

[@unknown33165]

On gen4 code p0420 & p0430 are because of headers right? And i should change them to no error reported

[@35057]

I’ve watched this one a couple times as a refresher. Did you weigh the wide and against commanded AFR? I didn’t catch where you mentioned it.

[@sketchygarage3920]

I have Primary VE and Secondary VE. Could you give some tips on tuning that setup? Should I log and adjust both? When I fail my MAF I believe it reverts to the Secondary VE table. Which has much less data. Do I log secondary and just copy secondary to primary and smooth in-between cells?

[@intolstuning3735]

they look to be the same just the secondary has less map rows but the rows it does have use the same values as the main ve so id just dial in the main ve but also copy the map rows over that suit the secondary so it will operates the same

[@sketchygarage3920]

@@intolstuning3735 I've had problems with this when I adjust the ve then write it back

[@evcass69]

Same here. With MAF disabled, it runs off the Sec VE table. I paste the corrections into Pri VE, then copy with axis from Pri to Sec to update Sec VE. If you add Sec VE table to your graphs, you could copy directly to the Sec VE table. But then you have to copy the less granular Sec table to Pri table and manually massage the untouched cells. For that reason I use the first method. Also, note that the values will be slightly different in the Pri vs Sec VE table if you copy from the Sec VE graph. I believe that's related to how the scanner averages between adjacent cells.

[@GoatRopeGarage]

This right here, I create two graphs one for each table and copy the edits over to both.

[@sketchygarage3920]

@@GoatRopeGarage thank you

[@darwinfridgeseals741]

Love to see a re hash on the gen 4 E40

[@GoatRopeGarage]

Will do!

[@joshlafreniere1589]

When tuning VE, can having the MAF disabled affect the TCC operation? I'm having an issue with my converter not locking while trying to VE tune. Thanks

[@clintonsmith4166]

Hey everybody, I'm just looking for some wisdom and thought maybe somebody here would know. When doing speed density tuning are you supposed to do slow throttle increases or can you go WOT? I've heard different things in different forums and I'm getting logs that I don't think are good after that increased throttle response. Also it seems unavoidable when I get into the higher RPM range in the table. Anybody with info on this would be greatly appreciated not just asking GRG. Thanks

[@venomousproductions7539]

i do from normal driving to hard pulls since i intend of tuning for performance but one thing i learned is never let the afrs get too far from 0... if youre over 15% lean stop your drive and increase your ve table, then go at it again...

[@hydrostaticshocker3048]

why did you max steady state out in this video, but the other gen 3 SD video you made, you didnt? does it need to be maxed when changing to SD or does it not matter? I'm not sure what to do with mine right now.

[@GoatRopeGarage]

Max it

[@Americaparts]

Kyle, I have tuning some cars with HP Tuner, but Im facing a comun problem and Im in doubt with one part of the process. When I Drive with the scanner, should I use the Special functions to reset the fuel trims, and leave it on, all the time Im scanning? Im asking because the engine stalls in idle if I do and Im afraid I don't have the right data if I use it off,. This is LS Gen 3, but would be Gen 4 the same case. Another one is secondary Main VE table, you never mention that and Im afraid we have to do it also or we dont have a balance map with the primary. So when the system reachs the secondary one?

[@GoatRopeGarage]

It’s always a good idea to turn them off and rely on your wideband for tuning, it may stall at first but that goes away quick

[@colemcmeans7809]

thanks for all the help. why are intake temps having an effect on on my afr while in open loop?.... iat goes up afr goes lean, overcompensation sure but why is it effecting it at all if in open loop? i get ses light on maf although it still shows a reading in the scanner. plan on using a break out for iat in the filter and just leaving maf unplugged, good plan? a man that can rope goats can rope anything.

[@GoatRopeGarage]

Fuel delivery takes temps into consideration to try and help for density changes. MAF shouldn't be as effected by it but it will really cause issues with the VE table. You can try to skew them from ECT to IAT readings and see if that helps but at lower RPM's it can cause problems.

[@colemcmeans7809]

i did a little reading on that and i think i will wait for warmer more stable weather to get the ve and maf tuned before i tackle a sd setup.

[@robertbrown3333]

Tuning a Gen3 C5 Corvette with ETC. Set up for VE tuning (MAF, STFT/LTFT, DFCO, etc disabled). From cold starts Ok and runs for 2min 30s (a bit rich but not bad) and gets to 54C ECT, then goes really lean, and shuts down. Has Primary and Secondary VE tables and I know it is running on Secondary, and have created histograms for both for future corrections. It has electronic throttle control. No limp mode code set for Throttle Position Sensor P1514 so not sure if this is related to Calculated Airmass being exceed. Thoughts?

[@GoatRopeGarage]

Doesn't have issues on the maf?

[@robertbrown3333]

I think I got it. I set the OL Enrichment (EQ Ratio) to 1.00 at 60C (140F) and above but did not enrich the VE table by 15% to compensate. Since EQ Ratio enrichment was still in place at low engine temps it ran ok until it got warm, then went too lean. So I have now enriched the VE table and will try once again.

[@oscariam802]

Question I have a 2003 C5 and fail MAF I get reduct power error (Limp mode) so how do you use that to tune over 4k rpm's? Thanks

[@carguytim9913]

I’m running my 01 camaro on speed density, and air/ fuel is dialed in as good as 1-2% error. However sometimes when I start logging my error goes all the way to 40% then starts rapidly dropping. I have to stop logging the start logging again a couple times for it to clear up, but the whole time my actual afr gauges is pretty much spot on where it should be. Have you had this problem and do you know what I can do to fix it? Not a huge deal just annoying

[@larryblanchard2722]

Quick question, I’m very new to tuning. New as in I’m about to buy my wideband and hp tuners setup. I’m curious if you ever use manifold vacuum as a tuning parameter. Thanks

[@GoatRopeGarage]

We do on speed density, that is the primary parameter along with RPM.

[@codybraswell7738]

Can you tune ve table with LTFT and STFT if you don’t have a wideband?

[@intolstuning3735]

only for the CL areas as soon as u go into PE u will need a wideband as u need the enrichment for power and thus loose the 02's feedback

[@dustindeyagher]

Anyone dealing with a 98 Fbody? I'm tuning VE for a 98 Camaro Z28. Logging the second table and applying it to the 1st table and interpolating the extra rows. Anyone else doing this have any tips?

[@jakeh1400]

Don't multiply by half, just use addition and it works great!

[@fotogrfik]

I dunno I might be too much of a noob to understand this but did you mean multiply by full percentage pending we’re still talking about lambda? Because adding directly from that chart seems crazy my dude.

[@cydewaz]

I've learned a lot so far from you but your content is so advanced hard to follow for a beginner. I have been trying for 10+ years to learn to tune my 3rd Gen I love your videos but sometimes you just over my head. At 3:30 you jumped to a log that has all kinds of graphs I don't have and don't have any Idea where to get them. And all the acronyms just to fast. info fly's over the head. thank you for your videos!

[@shakenfake]

You have to create all those graphs and tables. Usually you can tell right away what they are based on the X and Y axis

[@TylerGering]

I’m on step 34 lol

[@beachwoodtire]

disable stft and long term like maf