4 Mistakes Theists Make When Trying to Convert Atheists

[@mgnwill]

People typically confuse “ You’re not listening to me” with “You’re not agreeing with me”.

[@GaymerMajor]

"BECAUSE IF YOU LISTENED THEM YOU'D UNDERSTAND" and since no one can have different opinions on same subject as we ALL know you're not listening to that person

[@b.lonewolf417]

Honestly, to me, *THAT* is the most infuriating part of all! It's such a cheap, B.S. thing to say

[@cyansloth1763]

UGH Absolutely Yes!!!!!

[@SpawnFanboy]

Sadly this is both typical and true for most religious discussions that take place.

[@bbhrdzaz]

Rational argument is an art-form. Died out in the 70's. It went from a person of being of faith to absolutism, but without supporting evidence. The good book tells me so, and that's a fact, foundational reality. Everything you deal with in your life is predicated on your established foundation. When you make the argument towards them, it chips away at the foundation of their very existence. No wonder you get the vehement, defensive response. And here endeth the argument.

[@caroljo420]

I had a friend who was a devoted Christian. When I told her I'm an atheist, she bombarded me with Christian messages, and when I asked her to stop, she told me she was determined to convert me. She called me her project. I haven't spoken to her since.

[@patoconzapatos]

Wow, that's sucks.

[@johnnycanamaso9361]

Same here. I had a Christian friend who passive aggressively tried to convert me. At first, I called myself an atheist, though really I was agnostic, which I still am, yet she thought I was confused.

[@Mikezzz749]

Well, in a sense the Christian thinks they're doing you an eternal favor. And so I do think these conversations are important and should happen. What I'm guessing is that your friend didn't do a lot of listening, and didn't respect your choice or perspective. I'm a Christian, and I actually enjoy talking to atheists. It usually means I might learn something, or hear about some experiences that I can relate with. Even if you're not a brother or sister in Christ, we're all part of the same human family. I'm sorry your friend didn't act like a real friend to you.

[@Hoganply]

Others' minds are pursuaded often by far different things than those which pursuade your own. Given the right circumstances, it's difficult for anyone to even conceive of others not finding something compelling in the same way they do.

[@fishjj76]

I can relate. I ended a friendship for a similar reason. I made one offhand comment in an e-mail that triggered their missionary gene and I was bombarded with questions, reading material and spam links. We've never spoken since but I'm OK with that. Friendships require mutual respect.

[@inf3243]

As an atheist, one of the most frustrating things christians lead with is "but the bible tells us that...". Somehow they can't get around the idea that some people don't see the bible as an authority.

[@JP-JustSayin]

I know right ... like, that might work in arguments between different Christian sects ... but the only way that would work on non- believers would be if the words of the book ACTUALLY had supernatural power in and of themselves ... and that just falls flat, first time, every time.

[@thatpandaz6094]

When I get in these sort of arguments I just ask for proof, they always refer to the bible as if the source material is written on the first page??

[@kenjohnson5124]

Every position has an authority. Do atheists have a Bible to which they can point? There are 3 positions: Atheism, Theism, Pantheism.

[@inf3243]

I'm not sure I agree. Atheism doesn't have an authority - we have a current understanding of the universe. If there's ever evidence for a god, then we have no reason not to switch our stance and start believing. That's not authority, though. My point is fundamentalists can't point to the bible as an argument to try to convince a non-believer, because it's not enough to say "this is divinely-inspired so it must be true". We just see it as a book. There's lots of books out there.

[@JP-JustSayin]

@@kenjohnson5124 I don't think there is a 3rd position. There are a multitude of god claims (and pantheism is one of them) ... and people are either theist or atheist toward each claim individually depending on if they are convinced of it or not. When someone is unconvinced by all God claims that they have been exposed to then we say generally that they are an atheist. But that could change if a new God claim were presented or if new evidence was found that made one claim more convincing than before. But I think it's incorrect to describe pantheism as a 3rd position. It's more like a specific kind of god claim that either convices people or not.

[@slode1693]

I love the "deep down you believe" argument. Heard it a few times. I just respond with "What if deep down you don't believe in God, and you're just denying it" That one makes them actually think.

[@BunniRabbi]

There is a tendency to try to understand anyone by using yourself as a model to start from, and that inclines us to the error where we assume they are working from the same premises, and that inclines us to try to fall back on the same premises we already have. It can be hard to accept that other people really, truly, deeply, see the world differently.

[@paulnash6944]

As a Christian myself, I don’t understand that argument either. Plus, I’m not sure how that’s meant to convert anyone.

[@farttart597]

@@paulnash6944 yeah for real!

[@Qubecumber]

​@@paulnash6944The point isn't that it's a good argument, just that by reversing the question you can point out to them how ridiculous it is to ask that

[@seand.g423]

No, it makes them Blue Screen. Close as they're ever gonna get, but not the same thing.

[@njcodemuskane]

Doing manual labor at customer's houses I often get the old "you are so nice you must be Christian" ... apparently you can't be nice if you aren't Christian.

[@newmeta2668]

Christians tend to think atheists worship satan and are sadistic and have no morals 🤷‍♂️

[@kevinquiroz5384]

@@newmeta2668 A: Look at that jar! B: Yeah it has coins! A: Do you think there is an even number of coins? B: I dunno. A: An odd number then? B: *what*

[@lancelotwhitford6516]

I feel this. I used to work in a soup kitchen that was held in a church for fun and when one of the ladies there asked me about which church I go to and I admitted I’m pagan she scolded me for being “immoral” like wtf

[@chillkenshin9964]

@@newmeta2668 not all

[@Anonymous-md2qp]

It has always been the opposite for me. If someone is religious then I associate them with being highly judgmental and full of hate.

[@Erichwanh]

"Do you believe Batman exists?" "No" "That means you worship The Joker!" "... that's not how this works. That's not how any of this works."

[@ahmadbelial9778]

I'd worship the Joker

[@ziul123]

@@__Luke__ except that many people have heard this exact argument made to their face

[@david82633]

@@__Luke__ calling atheists satan worshippers are very similar to the argument above. Not all theists use this argument, you probably don't use it. The example above isn't at all trying to disprove God or saying that all theists are stupid. It simply shows that that particular argument is flawed

[@moisedieucaryoteescholecte8439]

@@__Luke__ Or maybe he didn't. He talked from the perspective of an atheist being argued by theist, but he did said that it also applied to atheists arguing with theists. Trying to blame all atheists or theists or any other group sharing a common worldview for the way some of them advocate it is ultimately pointless and counterproductive and can only lead to conflict rather than peaceful dialogue. You never talk to the theists or the atheists, you can only talk to a theist or an atheists, and all of them think differently.

[@christian53050]

@@__Luke__ My experience is that atheists in general are very interested in the specifics of what theists think/believe, that is was has driven them to rejecting certain ideas/beliefs. A very large number of atheists have read the bible and other religious text and are often surprisingly knowledgeable, because they are interested. In my experience we can not say the same about theist and their view of non-theists...among the lines of: "you believe no god(s) exist"...nooo. "science is your religion"...noooo.

[@chaoticsilver8442]

"To change someone's mind... you first have to listen." Very well said.

[@tach5884]

But I already stole the launch codes :(

[@MartTLS]

NeOxiT Why do theists ?

[@MartTLS]

Tyler B #2 I’m assuming you believe in every other cult religion then on the off chance that maybe just one of them might be true thereby invoking the concept of Pascal’s Wager which is so obviously flawed just like your own logic .

[@MartTLS]

Tyler B #2 Yes you are and also begging the question. Where’s your proof ? An old book isn’t proof of the supernatural.

[@MartTLS]

Tyler B #2 Magic requires a magician and only creationists believe in magic and man made gods to perform it .

[@JustWasted3HoursHere]

Usually my stance on belief never comes up in conversation, but when it does I usually get around to asking the religious person, "Do you think you would have the same beliefs that you have now if you had been born somewhere else in the world, raised by different parents with a different belief?" After the short circuit happens, that usually ends the conversation.

[@maxwellcorbin4764]

@@alpacawren259 To pre-clarify, I'm atheist. This is a question I've thought about myself growing up without even hearing it from anyone else. Not to be rude or to call you a liar or anything (because I know you likely fully believe this), but frankly speaking, you can think that you'd still believe Jesus is/was the one true messiah or whatever you believe in, but if you were born in Afghanistan or North Korea for example, the possibility that "Jesus" would have any impact on your life whatsoever is very slim to say the least. Whatever god you may believe in, in such a scenario, may have just as much of an impact on that life as Jesus does in your current, but it would be the same thing just a different name and a different religion. To answer the question of if this same thing were applied to an atheist, the answer is the same. In a country where people are even more brainwashed from birth to believe in whatever god the country decided to have, I would be whatever religion I were taught to believe, because that would be my truth and in many cases, there is no choice. Luckily in the U.S and other countries there is more freedom of choice to even have the thought of believing in anything other than the normal. That said, I very much believe that one's experiences in life dictate what they believe in. Even in the same country, if you are born to a different family (even of the same religion), your experiences will be so different that your thoughts on a certain topic can change drastically. So, respectfully, I ask out of curiosity, do you believe people are born with a set belief system that external factors have no control over? If yes, the population/religion ratios of countries seem to argue this point alone. If no, do you believe you are special in some way and would be born in such a way regardless? Again, I know when arguing such points it can sound condescending or as if I'm trying to get one over on you so to speak, but I am sincerely just interested in your thought process and will respect whatever beliefs make you happy.

[@just1luckyguy229]

@@maxwellcorbin4764 as a fellow atheist, i think i disagree with you. No matter where i would be born, i would not follow state religion, just because thats how i am. In my view, fate is a personal trait, every one has it to some capacity, some just lack it (us). I, from a very young age, never believed in santa, or "the angel" who brought the presents. The bible newer was more to me than a book (one with very rich meaning tho). Im an explorer at heart, i feel a need to look behind things, items, ideas, workings, i get bored of the known and yearn for more. The simple answer of god does not satisfy me. Science came easy for me, and i always had a love for biology On the other hand, someone with higher fate would be the opposite. No matter where (like the previous commenter), they would always choose to believe (i think in the regions god, but i agree to disagree on that), because they simpli have a need for it in their life.

[@bodymuezik]

Although I am following a different religion from the one I was born into, I do think it's possible that if I were born to another family in another society I could be following a different religion, and I have my doubts about other theists who say that they'd definitely be following the same religion regardless of life circumstances. However, this is fine, because people don't go to hell or get punished in any way, and aren't inherently inferior or bad, because of not following my religion.

[@bruhmoment341]

@@just1luckyguy229you wouldn’t even be the same person, it’s just a hypothetical if you were there, and had no memory of this life, would you? No it’s impossible. Because your values are based on the way you grew up and experienced life.

[@just1luckyguy229]

@@bruhmoment341 i understand, and youre probably right, but i think my inability to believe stands from a deeper root than my upbringing, or life experience. So in a hypothetical, i will stick with that answer, because thats what i know i can think of myself doing. If i were in a more direct religion, like islam, i could be pressured into it socially, sure, but to truly believe, i dont think i would. Its also just my opinion about myself, so i agree to disagree

[@carolynr570]

I had a friend who constantly tried to convert me. She told me I was never a true Christian despite me not having ever told her anything about my past experience as one, and kept insisting that I pray. The last straw was when I was hospitalized, and I was talking to her on the phone afterwards and instead of asking how I was doing or anything, she started really aggressively saying stuff like, “It’s a fact that God is real and he is your father! Something can’t start from nothing blah blah and you’d be better if you believed in him.” I didn’t even try to argue because I knew she’d claim I was ‘attacking her god’ despite her being the one always bringing religion up, so I calmly asked her how any of that was relevant to the situation. She couldn’t answer the question and kept on with the same fallacious tactics. I haven’t spoken to her since.

[@broken_arrow_1179]

As a Catholic I apologize for people like that, it should never be forced on anyone like she tried

[@lightningmonky7674]

Honestly it sounds like she just wasn't very bright, not necessarily malicious. Still I'd rather not hang out with stupid people so I feel it

[@maxalberts2003]

@@lightningmonky7674 Not only was she not very bright, but she was apparently flat-out insensitive to another person's suffering. And she seems not to have had enough insight to even understand her own behavior. Talk about a barnacle! Carolyn is well rid of her. How embarrassing!

[@how-to-dream]

Their logic is contradictory, if something can't come from nothing where did God come from? Make it make sense

[@lightningmonky7674]

@@how-to-dream legitimately they're whole belief system is on top of a failing foundation, the more science we learn the more that can be explained without God. The more we learn the less we need to say God did it. So far they're banking we never find out exactly how the universe came into being, they better hope it never happens but climate change will probably kill us all before that point

[@bradholcomb3652]

“People say they love truth, but in reality they want to believe that which they love is true.” -Robert J. Ringer

[@dragon-ed1hz]

"A man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest." --Paul Simon

[@bradholcomb3652]

Very true. We strive for our own truth and disregard other truths that fail to align with our own. Much of modern Science filters all of reality through its narrow lens and discredits all other aspects of reality. Science is sufficient for what it can accomplish but it should not be used to answer the parts of reality that it can’t account for.

[@dragon-ed1hz]

@@bradholcomb3652 Wrong. That is the purpose of science: To answer the parts of reality that it can't account for--yet, just as it always has since the scientific method was developed.

[@bradholcomb3652]

Science only measures what it can calculate. There are many things about reality that cannot be calculated. Science cannot account for the meaning of life. Only how to measure life’s unfolding.

[@bradholcomb3652]

Also, I’m willing to be wrong. Truth is greater than my small perspective and I try to expand my small horizon as much as I can.

[@xSpeakerYT]

Wait... you have to come out as atheist? I just one day learned what the word atheist meant and I'm like "yeah, that's me" and went about my life.

[@theyoutubeanalyst3731]

I mean, that's ideal, but if you previously were super religious and then go "fuck, all my family and friends are religious", yeah, you might need to come out in order to explain why you aren't attending church and other stuff. And yes, it can suck, a lot.

[@Bonoboorg]

Y’all have to come out as atheist? Tf

[@amberbydreamsart5467]

I mean my dad took me not being christian anymore about 10x harder than he took me being gay so... like man, i wish it wasn't like that but boy do people in some parts of the usa assume christian until proven nonchristian

[@SreedharPrabhu]

I was born into an extremely Hindu family that was hell bent on traditions and rituals and all that BS. Ironically that made me more of an atheist than I already was. I need to hide it everyday and do the rituals that I am forced to do and am scared to say otherwise. I know for a fact that my brother also is an atheist as when I talk to him on such topics, he demands I lower my voice as I may get caught. He also tries to avoid rituals as much as possible. I don't know whether I should come out, as my ENTIRE family is obsessed with the idea of God.

[@ms.aelanwyr.ilaicos]

Not only is "coming out" as atheist a thing, but from then on you have to keep it a personal matter to avoid judgement in the workplace and public spheres.

[@johncharpie4931]

I spent 14 years in fundamentalist Christian communities as a born-again person. I love this video for its clarity and empathic understanding of compassionate interaction. So often, evangelism becomes ego-vangelism, and the dialogue degenerates into posturing, oneupmanship, and "gotcha" moments rather than sincere active listening. Well done, Drew.

[@witchofredwoods8963]

Ego-vangelism ought to be a word. Though I personally like ego-gelism (same syllable count). But that's irrelevant. Seriously, Christian evangelists ought to watch Drew's videos. They'd be so much better at their jobs if they did.

[@Microplancakes]

I hope you don’t mind, I screenshot your comment as I think it’s the best response I can give to my family member who’s working and praying (preying) on me to become Christian like her. Thank you!!

[@VindensSaga]

Yeah. Some people who tries to convert people are not doing it out of love but out of ego. Having the idea that you can charm people or make them think what you want is an ego boast.

[@greyone40]

ego vangelism is nice concise term.

[@BlacksmithTWD]

That's just human nature, not merely found in fundamentally Christian communities but in any community that is large enough.

[@tayetrotman]

I’m an atheist, I wasn’t raised with any belief. However, when I’ve been in Churches, with the music and the hymns and everything, I’ve felt an energy in the room, a compulsion to join in, to be a part of something larger. Perhaps some theists would consider that a spiritual experience, but if you ask me it’s just natural human behaviour

[@BluePhoenix_]

Yeah, you can feel very similar/the same things on a concert, or a musical or whatever gets you going.

[@benjalucian1515]

What BluePhoenix said. Sensory overload or sensory deprivation can alter your consciousness and make you feel similarly

[@topologyrob]

Human behaviour is very spiritual

[@thechh8297]

@Venosa *tosses salt in your general direction*

[@realme0218]

@venosa7649LMAOOOO

[@f4ptr989]

I was born into an atheistic irreligious family, why does every single Christian expect me to have been previously Christian and had a bad experience?

[@markleavitt3297]

It do be like that sometimes. A lot of other Christians I know can't see out of the box they've made for themselves. They try to protect their beliefs by removing the possibility of anything else. Kind of a weird champ if you're asking me.

[@f4ptr989]

Mark Leavitt Yeah it’s a weird thing to have to constantly be told, truth be I really don’t hate religion or religious people I’ve always been treated well by them. The only problems I face is when they pressure me to tell them what I believe and I have to respond I’m an atheist, mostly they just say oh what’s that? To which J say I don’t believe in god and then they want to debate me, and I have no interest because truthfully no matter what I say or do, it always ends up with them angry and feeling attacked even though they asked and pushed me to tell them... It’s pretty annoying and I don’t believe that religion and science and non-belief can’t all coexist together. However I do get pissed off when people say I have no morals or ethics and I must be a devil worshipper. Seriously duck off with that siht! If I don’t believe in god them how tf do I believe in satan, it’s so stupid and how can you say I’m a bad person just because I don’t believe in the divine...

[@BlacksmithTWD]

@@f4ptr989 Why insist on calling yourself an atheist, why do you 'have to respond I'm an atheist'?, it can be like waving a red flag in front of a bull when doing so with some Christians? Why not inform them of a belief you actually uphold without going into much detail, for instance you could quote the movie characters Bill and Ted by saying "be excellent to each other (and party on dudes)", assuming this is a belief you genuinely uphold. If that still doesn't help you could point out that in the new testament Jesus instructs people not to determine the religion by what someone says about himself/herself but instead to observe them and see how they act, and if that doesn't work you could hint that from a Christian knowing his/her bible you would have expected better than to act contrary to Matthew 7. "I don’t believe that religion and science and non-belief can’t all coexist together." A double negative? why not just say 'I believe that religion and science can coexist' assuming you believe this to be the case, it's a belief you share with the majority of Christians in the world (though perhaps not with the majority of Christians living in the US).

[@Vulcanfaux]

Its probably just cuz its the most common thing for it.

[@f4ptr989]

BlacksmithTWD Because if people ask me a question I’m inclined to answer truthfully, most of the time it’s friends asking because we’re talking about random siht. Quoting the bible isn’t something I do. Saying I’m an atheist is the easiest answer to that question. Why be a smartass to people I like, also a double negative is a positive, the sentence is both logically and linguistically valid.

[@GauravGRocks]

"It’s a strange myth that atheists have nothing to live for. It’s the opposite. We have nothing to die for. We have everything to live for." ~ Ricky Gervais

[@NaNa_W4NT5_F3MNM5]

@Marilyn Newman Yes, I've watched that special multiple times.

[@bernardocarneiro1982]

Exactly. It's a really clever quote too. Because think about it,what does EVERY religious dumbass is always saying,and basing their entire life on? "Oh,when I die,I will go to heaven. When I die,everything will be alright. I do everything I do in this life just so I can be happy....after I die" but we(or atleast I) as an atheist,always think "bro, there's no way to know what happens aftet death,so you can bet your ass Im going to enjoy this life while I can"

[@stephenglasse9756]

That sounds like a strawman argument on Ricky's part. I've never heard/read a theist claim atheists have nothing to live for. In fact apologists like Ravi Zacharias will often quote atheists like Huxley saying they wanted their worldview to be true cos 'it freed him to his political and erotic desires'

[@stephenglasse9756]

@Richard Ball Carlin is entitled to express an opinion as is Gervais. However your incorrect in claiming it's a quote not an argument since when Gervais said it he wasn't quoting but arguing and I explicitly said Gervais s argument! And his argument is a strawman. Everyone knows atheists have got things to live for but nothing to die for..... but they will die...

[@Lerian_V]

@Richard Ball Are you admitting insanity since every human is religious?

[@joysgirl]

My family of 4 used to be Christians, then my two sons broke away, becoming Athiests. We had many calm and interesting discussions, lots of questions, no emotions. We are now a family of 4 Athiests. It was like someone cleared the fog.

[@namenotfound2456]

Can I post this on r/chaoticallygood?😂

[@ronkka9710]

It's sad

[@sean_miller]

@@ronkka9710 Sometimes the truth is sad.

[@SirGreenVine]

​@@sean_miller And there are times when the truth, being sad, brings clarity and joy in the end.

[@sean_miller]

@@SirGreenVine I can see what you're saying, but I'm not there yet. haha.

[@marypatton1122]

Would you be afraid if a Muslim told you that you were going to hell because you weren't Muslim and didn't believe in Allah? No? Why not? Because I don't believe that. Right. So when Christians tell me I am going to hell, I am not worried because I don't believe that any more than you believe in Allah.

[@MrHuntingClaw]

I like to respond that people have gotten to a logical conclusion that hell isn't burning as much as heaven, so I would very much prefer hell.

[@MrHuntingClaw]

@Bwa Bwa Yoshi Wow, that's so inventive, I feel a sudden need to make a book which says why I should want to go to hell rather than heaven. You should know that the so called "entire book" you're referring to has been mistranslated over and over, over the centuries, not to mention that the Romans most likely picked that religion out of many others because it fit the bill best. There's a reason why Christianity and the like are as big as they are, it lies in history, it's not about who's right or who's wrong. It's about who won.

[@williambarnes5023]

*"Would you be afraid if a Muslim told you that you were going to hell because you weren't Muslim and didn't believe in Allah?"* Yeah, because that means they're probably about to swing that scimitar at my neck.

[@williambarnes5023]

*"Unless of course that there is an entire book that tells you you're wrong. Youd rather remain a deer in the headlights that just stands there."* You have an entire fictional book saying I'm wrong. I have an entire factual universe saying you're wrong. You'd rather remain an ostrich with its head in the ground. Oh, and I also have every other religion's fictional book saying you're wrong.

[@christiansanchez1486]

Depending am I in the states or am I in the middle east and before you ask, yes it makes a difference, since In the US. You have a higher chance of reasoning with them but in the middle of you’re being approached you’re probably gonna either get taxed or killed if you answer wrongly in their eyes. Only a fool judges his opponent capabilities without understanding the religious beliefs of the opponent.

[@Keizor1997]

These aren't just mistakes that people make when trying to "convert" someone. Those are all mistakes that people make simply communicating with each other.

[@robp2253]

Very true.

[@tanyanguyen3704]

Yes!

[@VioletJoy]

👏

[@ChrisJones-rd4wb]

Their arguments are coming from a place of attachment, a place of clinging too a specific world view, and trying too force other people too conform too the illusion of the world in their head. This attachment is the cause of all suffering, fear, and anxiety... Starting here can only lead to more suffering.

[@MartTLS]

Dennis Moore Pasta be upon you . Stay safe and always wear your colander .

[@Bravo-Tango-7274]

When I went to church with my family as a kid, I thought we were just respecting the culture and our ancestors beliefs, not that it was something adult people believed in.

[@voidseeker4394]

Yes! Isn't it weird that our civilisation launches missions in interplanetary space, yet many people are seriously convinced that world works like in that ancient fantasy book.

[@Bravo-Tango-7274]

@@voidseeker4394 yes. Tho i do understand that it brings comfort to people. I've also heard about an atheist who converted back to Islam, and he said he was much happier afterwards.

[@voidseeker4394]

@@Bravo-Tango-7274 yes, i understand that. And that understanding made me stop trying to actively spread atheism and trying to "enlighten" people. I live in a post-sovied country, and therefore witnessed the interesting phenomenon when atheism was forced on people that mostly had religious way of thinking. Spoiler: nothing good happened. People continued to think and behave in religious paradigma, and performed religious rithuals, but instead of church there was party. And that's it. Everything else remained pretty much the same. To really become an atheist, person should obtain certain way of thinking, and that only can happen naturally.

[@arrigune]

@@voidseeker4394 Very interesting.

[@voidseeker4394]

@@arrigune indeed. "Atheistic cult" may sound like an oxymoron, but it actually happened in quite a large scale. People in the USSR treated party leaders as prophets, worshipped their pictures as icons... That kind of stuff.

[@popgas3821]

This isn’t only about atheism. What he basically says is, listening is the best way to understand and accept each other. Period.

[@BorchikYes]

Facts

[@alastairtivy-harris8129]

I was going to make this same comment, but you beat me to it. Well said!

[@Comment27560]

athiesm is a sad belief ngl you believe we are born by evolution, accidents of nature...born due to chance which is extremeeely low ...l=so low that itts a miracle...with no meaning for our life..since we all are created by chance nilhist perspective for real theres nothing wrong with hitler or murder if ur an athiest since there is no objective good...just a bunch of subjective opinions which can be different

[@giulialana2815]

Me:”I’m an atheist” Religious relative:”but you were baptized and confirmed, how can you be an atheist?” I was baptized as a baby and confirmed at 12, who doesn’t change their mind from when they were a literal child?

[@ИванСнежков-з9й]

Too late. You've already signed a contract for your soul. Enjoy your eternity in Heaven with all the religious people. ;)

[@ryavix]

This is why we have "age of consent" laws.

[@Lerian_V]

@@ryavix Consent to do what?

[@camelopardalis84]

I am not confirmed because my brother messed properly reacting to a phone call and because after that I was too embarrassed to fix it.

[@Declan-pg8cg]

@@Lerian_V The consent of grown adults to refuse, or engage, in superstitious belief systems unfortunately imposed on the majority of them from birth. A childs mind isn't sufficiently mature enough to make a valid decision regarding that nonsense being imposed upon them.

[@thetsarofall8666]

Quoting holy books is another mistake. Why quote a holy book to someone who doesnt believe in it? Someone might as well quote the quran to a christian, or the hindu vedas to a Buddhist. You might as well hand them a blank piece of paper and say "now agree with me".

[@michaeldlugosch7965]

I as an atheist constantly quote the bible when people try to convert me. For instance, explain the following passages: Exodus 21: 7-8 "When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she will not be freed at the end of six years as the men are. If she does not please the man who bought her, he may allow her to be bought back again." Deuteronomy 21:18-21 "If someone has a stubborn and rebellious son who does not obey his father and mother and will not listen to them when they discipline him, 19 his father and mother shall take hold of him and bring him to the elders at the gate of his town. 20 They shall say to the elders, “This son of ours is stubborn and rebellious. He will not obey us. He is a glutton and a drunkard.” 21 Then all the men of his town are to stone him to death. You must purge the evil from among you. All Israel will hear of it and be afraid." Leviticus 25:44-46 "Your male and female slaves are to come from the nations around you; from them you may buy slaves. 45 You may also buy some of the temporary residents living among you and members of their clans born in your country, and they will become your property. 46 You can bequeath them to your children as inherited property and can make them slaves for life" Numbers 31:17-18 "Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. 18 But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves." Then I ask them to defend the validity and modern relevance of these passages.

[@Gr3nadgr3gory]

This is why I made my own holy book to pull quotes from.

[@mensetens6391]

_Why quote a holy book to someone who doesnt believe in it?_ It might be right. 'Love your neighbor' is not wrong.

[@thetsarofall8666]

@@mensetens6391 certainly that is true, but i recognize i needed to be more clear in my first comment, so i'll fix a mistake i made: why quote a holy book, to someone who does not believe it, as though it has authority? For example, why, when an atheist points out mistakes in the bible, quote at them the passage about how the bible has no mistakes? Or why, when a buddhist points out the violence portrayed in the bible that god commits, point out the passage that states god is all loving and then act like that solves the issue? Why act like any of these passages has authority when presented to someone who does not believe?

[@frank_calvert]

@@michaeldlugosch7965 I love using quotes from religious books against their believers, seeing them try and wrap their head around what it says always makes me smile

[@jonathanleslie9100]

I had an theist friend of mine insist that atheist's were devil worshipers, I assured him that atheist's no more believe that the devil exists than god, bigfoot, or flying unicorns. He said no, no, no, he knows that atheist's are devil worshipers. I then asked him how many actual bonafided athiests he as actually talked to face-to-face, because I'm willing to bet I'm the first one you have actually had a conversation with and I'm telling you that this atheist dismisses the devil in exactly the same way I dismiss god, allah, and zeus. As such 100% of the atheists you have actually spoken to do not believe the devil exists. You could hear the gears and cogs in his brain come to a grinding halt.

[@gearshift7174]

lol its better just to start screaming HAIL SATAN HAIL SATAN and they will fear for their lives

I'm a Pastafarian. No atheist could possibly disagree with my faith.

[@jonathanleslie9100]

@ that's only because I good fria diablo sauce with fried calimari over bow tie is too good to pass up.

[@gearshift7174]

@ thats cuz your faith is just too good

[@gearshift7174]

@ and wear pirate clothes!

[@TravisRichey]

It's so strange for me that you had to "come out" as an atheist. I grew up in a semi-religious family and when I realized there was no evidence for a god, I didn't have to tell anybody. Parents were kinda already there. My grandfather, a Lutheran minister, used to say, "Give your children religion, it will give them something to rebel against other than their parents." Brilliant ;-) ~Trav

[@thatpandaz6094]

Shit, I must remember to fake religion when I get kids!

[@dantheman9795]

Lol same my parents did religion in a very mid low way so when I said that was atheist they were like ok.

[@anggungunara]

It's so strange that you think it's strange. You must have had some ideas how different families are from each other and how religions are the main tool for authorities in many families in this large and colorful world.

[@daddybandit4431]

Just because you don't look for evidence doesn't mean there isn't any. I'd say the biggest piece would be Jesus. If you haven't looked into him and his exploits. I'd highly recommend starting there. Tens of thousands don't just drop their livelihoods and families at the risk of torture and death unless the guy is really up to snuff.

[@bmprimer7809]

@@daddybandit4431 your logic that "Well millions of people do this at the risk of themselves so that must mean its right" is a stupid one, because you could say the exact same thing about literally any other religion. like dude, judaism has several holidays dedicated to failed attempts to kill them. there are people in every religion that are willing to kill themselves for said religion. nothing special about jesus in that regard.

[@danny102m]

I hate it when they say "You're being deceived or you're being blinded by the devil," homie I can use your same arguments for any other religion.

[@GeneticallyModifiedSkeptic]

Oh man, I’ve heard that so many times and used that reply so many times

[@mjolninja9358]

Genetically Modified Skeptic you should repent brother or else kenneth copeland will judge you with his God winds.

[@robp2253]

@@mjolninja9358 He always scared me. He is just crazy.

[@tommy605]

This has been my reply to that for the last 5 or so years. Sure, I might be being deceived by the devil. But let me see if I get you right before I counter. You're saying the devil has the power to deceive me and hundreds of millions of other atheists, right? That's right And what about other religions, powerful enough to deceive them as well? Absolutely. OK, so, if the devil has the power to deceive billions of people into falsely believing or not believing, how can you be sure you're not the one being deceived and the devil created this elaborate story of God and Jesus (or Mohammad if talking to a Muslim or any other god/prophet of another religion) and the bible and then convinced the small group of early Christians so deeply they started the ball rolling to what is now the ultimate deception? Usually, there's a pause, but quite often they will say something like "because God talks to me and tells me" Couldn't the devil pretend to be god, and tell you to keep you deceived? At this point, you can start to see and feel the uncomfortable level rise. That's pretty much the end of the discussion. They now have this little nagging seed of doubt. Sometimes that seed will grow, most often they'll just starve it to death.

[@maripaura4945]

Exactly

[@Momoftwoboysandonecat]

My father in law asked me "What makes you think you're better than Peter?" When I said I just didn't see the evidence for a god. Because Peter who had seen all these things still doubted. I told him, "I don't know Peter, never met the guy, but if you find him or his evidence, let me know."

[@SasukeUchiha-mp2wh]

Quran [45:4] Verily in the heavens and the earth are Signs for those who believe. [45:5] And in your own creation and in that of all the creatures which He scatters in the earth are Signs for a people who possess firm faith. [45:6] And in the alternation of night and day, and the provision that Allah sends down from the sky, whereby He quickens the earth after its death, and in the change of the winds, are Signs for a people who try to understand. [45:7] These are the Signs of Allah which We rehearse unto thee with truth. In what word, then, after rejecting the Word of Allah and His Signs will they believe? [45:8-9] Woe to every sinful liar, Who hears the Signs of Allah recited unto him, and then proudly persists in his disbelief, as though he heard them not. So give him the tidings of a painful punishment. [45:10] And when he learns something of Our Signs, he makes a jest of them. For such there is an humiliating punishment. [45:11] Before them is Hell; and that which they have earned shall avail them not aught, nor shall those whom they have taken for protectors beside Allah. And they will have a dreadful punishment. [45:12] This is true guidance. And for those who disbelieve in the Signs of their Lord is the torture of a painful punishment.

[@yeahno8294]

The fact he tried to imply you thought you were better then anyone simply for believing what you believe or thinking what you think is just more evidence of the manipulation they use to make free thinkers look bad and feel bad.

[@user-ug6kk5ux5q]

who tf is Peter

[@kellkalishvanya3548]

@@user-ug6kk5ux5q exactly

[@carloscastellanosdarkeyesi6126]

@@user-ug6kk5ux5q according to the bible, one of jesus' apostles, who said he wouldn't believe jesus resurrected until he put his hand in the wounds he got from being crucified, then jesus showed up and allowed him to do so

[@TheGoaterGoat]

when i told my old christian friend i’m atheist he looked me in the eye and said at least ik the truth i looked back at him and said your truth he walked away mad when i told my other christian friends this they just said i understand and as long as your happy that’s all that matters and they still talk with me

[@Croiri]

It's one of those times where you know you found the right people to be your friends.

[@mauretaniafan1133]

have you heard of quotation marks?

[@turtlelord8021]

God is supposedly all loving, his true followers should respect you for who you are, and I'm glad to see that most of them did.

[@barstool9156]

They can’t control your faith, so he should not have been so butthurt. On the topic of personal Truths. Are those just opinions.

[@Duckbusinessman]

@@turtlelord8021 if god is real, it’s those who deserve to go to heaven.

[@nathanfish1998]

i have a christian friend. i refer to them as a friend because they're not constantly forcing religion down my throat, and in turn i don't force my atheism down *their* throat. we're both aware of each other's beliefs, and quietly disagree. that is what we call a healthy friendship

[@NotNochos]

Same. I’m an atheist and have a very, *very* good friend I’ve known since infancy who is a Christian and we both know each’s beliefs. Still a great friend.

[@calibcarmichael6356]

I'm proud some people can be healthy with there beliefs and don't just put themselves in an echo chamber

[@nathanfish1998]

@@calibcarmichael6356 unfortunately that friendship ended about a month ago when she started acting rude to my new girlfriend, and then me, and then started talking about her trying to troll us to our friends, who very quickly informed me about the situation. Though that "friend" ended up being toxic in the end, my point still holds firm, as my girlfriend is also Christian

[@calibcarmichael6356]

@@nathanfish1998 well that absolutely sucks, I wish you better friends and better health

[@nathanfish1998]

@@calibcarmichael6356 well hey, it could be worse. besides, friends come and go. i've had many friendships fall apart over the years due to similar things, but compared to other times, this situation was minor at worst. in fact, this only reinforced the relationships i already had, as rather than joining in on her vicious attempt to harm me, they protected me without a second thought. that's true friendship. Anyway, thanks for the well-wishes. hopefully these friendships i have now are long-lasting

[@TheEmber221]

"Did you really think by pushing me I would become what you want me to be? And did you really think by hurting me I'd open up and just hand you the key?" -In This Moment Songwriters understand things that most deists don't.

[@luz_reyes_676]

which song is that one?

[@Dan280974]

@@luz_reyes_676 In this moment

[@marijntenvelde8106]

​@@Dan280974 in this moment is a band

[@kitkat8669]

@@luz_reyes_676 it's Natural Born Sinner

[@Mythraen]

"Deists"? I think you meant "theists." Deists aren't very pushy, usually.

[@Solderius]

A Baptist sunday school teacher once approached me with intent to convert me, "Don't you feel like scum?" Expecting my mental willpower to be weak and using insecurities to break me down and feel guilty about the decisions I make in life or have made. Which then turned into a 2 hour argumentative debate. Ended with neither of us finding compromise. I usually try to avoid those who try to convert me until they push it to another level. Some Christians need to learn to take no for an answer. He also tried come back to my job to continue the argument to convince me I was wrong about how I interpreted his book and his own interpretation. If I went into detail about what was said, would be too long for some people to read. Let's just say when I asked him if he believed in other religious deities/entities and called him an atheist towards their religion, he shut up and left me alone.

[@cheriohalo4674]

Jesus the Only Way to God kzbin.info/www/bejne/qnLSeJ-LbLqsY9k Jesus said, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father, but through Me” (John 14:6, NASB) and, “For unless you believe that I am He, you shall die in your sins” (John 8:24, NASB).

[@novae6584]

@@cheriohalo4674 You ought to watch the video first before commenting this. In fact, GMS specifically addresses this attempt at converting others under "trying to convert with no attempt at listening." Furthermore, referencing the Bible as a source won't convince an atheist of anything. Atheists do not consider the Bible as an authority.The Bible also has no data or methodology to support its conclusions. This means that the only credentials the Bible has is itself. In the same way that I cannot convert you to Islam by referencing the Qur'an, you cannot convince an atheist to become Christian by referencing the Bible.

[@cheriohalo4674]

@@novae6584 spoke to atheist and clearly don't know the Holy Spirit nor the artifacts presented in Christian History , hence why the pagan civilization like Novae as an eye representative of the one side . Have you not read the history nor investigate Qu'ran . Serpents team aren't you Novae for claiming no data or methodology to support its conclusions. Have you not study an once of ancient civilization or Baal pagan worship

[@novae6584]

@@cheriohalo4674 In my goal to discover my religious identity, I studied: Judaism Christianity Islam Hinduism Buddhism Spiritualism before realizing I didn't agree with any of them. There is no data or methodology inside any of the holy texts that belong to the religions that I mentioned (with the exception of Spiritualism, since there is no holy text for said religion). You may accuse me of being a devil-worshiper all you wish (despite that point also being addressed in the video, proving once again you didn't actually watch the video before trying to convert people), but you need to provide irrefutable data and the methodology used to collect that data to convince an atheist that God exists. Neither the Bible nor the video you linked does that.

[@Droemar]

@@cheriohalo4674 "Baal pagan worship." Snrrrk. Baal was a rain god worshiped by the Jewish tribes before they met the Persians. In transition from polytheism to monotheism, the poly gods were cast aside in favor of the "one" god. Outside of the Bible, Baal was a nobody who didn't matter, not a real major player in the grand scheme of things. He looks like he was just a random name that won the lottery to talk about how terrible pagan gods were, because even the term Baal was not the mainstream name of the god. Hadad was, and Hadad has direct ties to the Mesopotamian culture Judaism would borrow all their major stories from. For example, heaven, hell, angels, and demons do not exist in Jewish stories until they make contact with Persia. Not only that, but it shows that the Semites borrowed their PAGAN gods from Mesopotamia! But by the time Christianity got to it, two thousand some odd years later, they'd bitch about how terrible Baal was. Just like they bitched about everything they knew nothing about and wanted to vilify. And what Christianity couldn't vilify enough they adopted as their own, like the winter solstice celebrations. Let's not forget your good Christian folks murdered the shit out of each other constantly and murdered the innocent in witch trials. So really, go ahead: tell me how bad Baal was, and how terrible the worship of him was. Because I can draw up atrocities done in Christianity's name that are just as bad. So maybe you shouldn't be throwing shit unless you want some of your own brought up.

[@chelseav6184]

Ironically, trying to listen and understand how atheists think is what led to me becoming an atheist.

[@davewatson9507]

You mean went back to being an atheist don't you? Everyone is born an atheist. yes?

[@jacksonsmith2955]

@@davewatson9507 You would benefit from watching GMS' video on 4 things athiests should stop saying ;)

[@janusgreenway5137]

@@MatthewChenault sure,keep thinking that whatever path you took is the almighty correct choice. I bet you'd be complaining if an atheist acted as Mucho confident as you though.

[@MatthewChenault]

@@janusgreenway5137, okay. Atheism is still cringe.

[@janusgreenway5137]

@@MatthewChenault ok. Religion is just as cringe though.

[@jonasfermefors]

I'm guessing I'm not the only person who often hears "why are you so angry" a lot of the times when I argue with someone (about anything, not only religion). Somehow disagreements have become a sign of anger. I love arguments and debates.. I'm not angry, I am excited to have a conversation.

[@BunniRabbi]

I try to point out that the anger people associate with atheists is usually really just anger over the actions of theists.

[@trikitrikitriki]

Mother's always trying to reconvert me to Christianity. When I give her my reasons or make an argument against the existence of God, she just gives me a knowing and smug smile. Like, poor child. You'll figure it out soon. She asks me to "pray about it."

[@keriezy]

Mine tells me that praying can happen anywhere even the toilet!

[@ArtistTheClown900]

@@keriezy Wow!

[@ImaginaryMdA]

Hey, she's doing the lord's work in making sure you stay an atheist! So, good for her!

[@thomasmaughan4798]

Her response seems reasonable. Either you figure it out or you don't. Belief cannot be compelled.

[@viktorthevictor6240]

Mine does that too. She doesn't listen to or understand anything I say, she just assumes I'm wrong and that "one day I'll understand".

[@moartems5076]

Le troll: 1. Watch tutorial on converting atheists 2. Approach atheist 3. Listen to atheist 4. ... become atheist Well that backfired.

[@HeavyMetalMouse]

That is, ultimately, the 'danger' of intellectual honesty - in order to convince someone else of something you believe, you have to engage with their position, understand why and how they believe what they do, and also why and how you believe what you yourself do; this places you in a position of vulnerability. You can't just fake-listen, or fake-understand to get to the 'good part' of sharing your 'truth', you have to actually engage... and when you do that, you might realize their position makes more sense than you thought it did; maybe even more sense than your own. When I was in the Church as a youth, they specifically told us *not* to engage with people of other faiths or with atheists, precisely because understanding their position could 'damage our faith'. From discussions with other people in the Church, this seems to be a fairly common teaching, despite being exactly contradictory to the simultaneous command to Spread The Gospel. The implication was "Not you, not yet; wait until you're made ready" i.e. that you're so bought in that your faith is 'incorruptible' by any outside information.

[@AlbaHart]

I once had a Jehovah's Witness knock on my door, and frankly I love to mess with them. On this occasion it was a kid, barely 18, and he was on his own. Normally I'll invite them in for a Black Mass, or I used to keep a home made flyer titled "Satanism Weekly" that I'd trade for their Watchtower magazine. On this occasion, I decided to spend some time talking to the lad as I wasn't busy.... JW: Do you have time to talk about our Lord and Saviour, Jesus. Me: Sure, what would you like to know about him? Ask away. JW: Erm... And it went downhill from there for him as I'd counter point his Bible study quotes with another quote from the Bible that contradicted him. Or if clarify or question a context to change a meaning if it was ambiguous. This went on for nearly 10 minutes. Turns out, he wasn't alone, and there was another JW knocking on doors elsewhere. An older guy, late 30s, early 40s, and he came over to speak as well. He must have been so proud as his young charge was clearly getting through to me. Anyway, he walks up, doesn't say a word, listens and smiles proudly, until he here's one of my counter points. His smile drops, he sees this look of doubt washing over the poor kids face, and quickly he grabs his elbow and as he starts to lead him away is hurriedly saying "well, we have other people to see". The last I saw of them was a limp wave from the second guy as I shouted after them "wait, I've got more to teach you... Come back any time though". Never had a knock on my door again though. I saw them knocking at the neighbour's house a couple of times. But never mine. I think I might have got myself blacklisted.

[@impockets]

@@HeavyMetalMouse let me guess. mormon

[@griffincrump5077]

@@AlbaHart impressive

[@the_minecraft_destroyer]

@@AlbaHart my great grandmother used to get a kick out of inviting in and praying for the souls of Jehovah's witnesses until they got so uncomfortable that they left. I'm honestly disappointed that I've never beed visited (currently live in her old house)

[@trynotdying6599]

I just admitted to my mom that I'm an atheist. She's crying and it took a lot of courage. This video finally helped me do the final step.

[@GeneticallyModifiedSkeptic]

I’m so proud of you! 😊 That DOES take a lot of courage.

[@RonSafreed]

MODERN ISREAL in 1948 is fulfilled Bible prophecy & other things since 1948 til now! Soon Isreal & the Jews will have a temple/priesthood/animal sacrifice, absent nearly 2000 years & this ties into Jesus Christ coming back for the Millenium & MANY CHURCHES TEACH NOTHING ABOUT MODERN ISREAL & JESUS COMING BACK FOR THE MILLENIUM & END-TIMES!!!!!!

[@RonSafreed]

@Shin-Goji 216 Ok you explain the 4000 year history of the Jewish people & how modern Isreal came about & BTW another temple will be built in the future 50 miles north of Jerusalem! The Jews had two temples in their first 2000 year history in Isreal! Soon a third temple will come & a fourth temple mentioned in Ezekiel still to be built in the future!!!!!!

[@cephalonblue5991]

RonSafreed The return of Israel is an unfalsifiable prophecy with no time limit. Given enough time, anything that can possibly happen will eventually happen. Unfalsifiable prophecies are utterly worthless. Find a better one to ramble on about.

[@RonSafreed]

@@cephalonblue5991, OK soon Isreal & the Jews will have a temple/priesthood/animal sacrifice, something absent nearly 2000 years & "in a nutshell" this ties into the Jews finally as a nation accepting Jesus Christ as the Messiah, something they should have done as a nation 2000 years ago but soon they will & that is when J.C./Yeshua comes back to Jerusalem for the Millenium!

[@srirampatnaik9164]

As a (non practising) hindu, I appreciate my religion permitting me to practically be atheist, without missing out on the religious festivities hinduism has to offer

[@jordanbelfort4196]

same i am an atheist hindu.but I never find Hinduism causing trouble as much as islam or Christianity causes.instead many hindu practising friends say me that unless you are doing something bad or doing nothing, God is with you,even if you don't believe in him or worship him same with Sikhism or Buddhism. Only trouble I feel when my family start to talk about unpleasant god and spending too much on pandits or something due to faith.

[@Azure9577]

And this is why i love my religion (hindu) Our god's just say, "yeah i don't care much, do whatever you want lmao"

[@leok_is_here9681]

​@@Azure9577just dont do bad bro and all good👍

[@pane0_018]

​@@leok_is_here9681 Even if you do bad you will be punished appropriately atleast not an eternity in hell, Which is pretty great.

[@Comment27560]

@@leok_is_here9681 you cant dfine good and bad if ur an athiest

[@Noah_McCurry]

I mean... as a theist myself I’d say the first mistake is trying to convert people. Everyone should have the freedom to seek truth and believe whatever they like, so you’re intention should really never be to convert. Having an open minded back and forth dialogue discussing your beliefs is one thing, but if your intention is to change their mind because you think that your view is the “right” one then you’re not coming in good faith imo

[@whiten0648]

U are right my friend, i like this guys videos because it has a different view of what i believe, im still a believer but watching the other side of the coin is always good, everyone is completely free to believe or not and just becuz u dont share the same opinion with other person you should hate them

[@williamhughmurraycissp8405]

It is part of Christian culture to proselytize, to "evangelize," to spread the "good news." To "convert." Consider the "missionary." That is how avowed atheists become someone's "project."

[@timothyvenable3336]

I’m a theist too… but based on your comment it sounds like we worship different gods… I worship the God of the Bible who made heaven and earth and wants all people to come to him, and wants his children to spread his message of salvation. It is a project because it’s a process sometimes, but it’s worth it to see someone come from death to life. Hopefully you find the God I worship, and the angels rejoice over it!

[@Salt_Master_Queue]

Precisely. If all you are with someone is just a friend, not a brother in religion and friend, that's fine. You don't need to convert everyone, just be friendly. And by that friendliness, you may shift their views, even if they still believe one way or another.

[@saundraschaefer]

I wish your way was how all theists were. I was raised Seventh Day Adventist and let me tell you, spreading the faith and preparing for "the time of the end" were like the only two things they seemed to really care about. That and being vegan.

[@KiomonDuck]

I've never been religious. It all seemed like pretend when I was a child and made less and less sense as I got older.

[@KiomonDuck]

@Bwa Bwa Yoshi at the same time all religious texts are man made and man editied over time. They are as real as Harry Potter as far as I'm concerned.

[@robertthebruce6035]

@@KiomonDuck I agree with you wholeheartedly.

[@KiomonDuck]

Just remember that people of faith look at the universe in a different way. They have to discover answers on their own. Also I don't like to do what a lot of religious cults do and tell anyone what to believe, just what I think, if they ask. Don't be like them and look for followers, just be you and learn more about everything, then share what you've learned when the time comes. Be better then you were and learn more then you did the day before. Also I'm a Duck QIACK! QUACK! QUACK!

[@KiomonDuck]

@Dead Archer sweet👍 I'll see you around KZbin sooner or later.

[@DrSilvergun]

@Bwa Bwa Yoshi Where did God come from?

[@dustinharding8941]

I love how you say "come out" because although I'm not LGBT so I don't know how they feel exactly - telling my family I don't believe in God really felt like coming out

[@Persholm1]

Telling mine was like telling it to a brick wall... they didn't care either or, just said "Good for you". Not in a bad way, I assure you. They would've been fine with either or, and both are atheists.

[@wintergray1221]

I'm suppose I'm lucky. I never had to actually say the words. My parents figured it out on their own through discussions and debates we had. They're open-minded enough to accept it for the most part, but they still try to reconvert me from time to time.

[@madmantheepic7278]

@@wintergray1221 how sweet, they disagreed with your beliefs but doesn’t fuss about it, the occasional reconverting is still better than excommunicating you.

[@cass____7907]

I can say as someone who has came out three times, informing your religious parents and family that you aren't is pretty similar.

[@JuxGD]

closets can manifest in many ways in one's life

[@andyl7303]

“Much less animosity among friends, conflict among families, and toxicity in public dialogues…” - Excellent summary of the fruit of genuine, humble listening. Much needed across all sorts of opposing perspectives nowadays…

[@SushanthSomayaji]

I had read somewhere An atheist was asked "What book did you read that made you an atheist?" He replied, "The Bible"

[@christiansargent6053]

One religion made someone throw out the idea of theism?

[@emiliagretzes7488]

The bible is, in fact, the very cure to theism. Times change, and the bible is, shamefully, way too old to accomodate to today's standards, I think

[@Lordpeyre]

I read the Bible several years ago, start to finish. I was slightly nervous about it, thinking it might make me think Christianity makes more sense (no one likes challenges to their way of thinking), but it was so much the other way around! I was telling my brother about some of the biblical stories, such as Lot having drunken sex with his daughters, and kept saying "I am not making this sh*t up!"

[@christiansargent6053]

@@emiliagretzes7488 how is the Bible the cure to theism when theism is an extremely broad belief that ranges way beyond Christianity

[@thomasalegredelasoujeole9998]

My case, precisely ^^

[@RomaTomatoe]

I had a guy try to convince me I would stop being an atheist when my first child was born due to the miracle of birth. Utterly nonsensical, obviously.

[@SwordTune]

Maybe he was implying you'd have a virgin birth? Now that would be pretty wild.

[@writeeat7364]

@@SwordTune Mary was an atheist, confirmed.

[@therobot1080]

@@SwordTune mmm yes, p a r t h e n o g e n e s i s

[@therobot1080]

@@glenneggert8344 yup, next we need to go give creationists a crash course on evolution

[@johnnonamegibbon3580]

Did you know that Atheists have a way higher rate of genetic defects than Theists? You shouldn't have kids if you're an atheists. Let the non-genetic mutants procreate, please.

[@ConnorSentByCyberlif3]

I read this as "4 mistakes Athiests make when trying to convert Athiests" and got really confused

[@WinterPains]

Glad I'm not the only one.

[@VistilShaiteth]

I read convert as comfort for some reason

[@markleavitt3297]

"Counterintuitive Atheism"

[@gabrieladelacruz1057]

Me too

[@Carbon2861996]

Mistake n. 1: converting to JPEG

[@luchem721]

The opposite case happened to me. My ex-partner (atheist) tried to convert me based on humiliation by telling me that religion makes no sense, that I was ignorant; etc. However, to this day faith (not "religion" as an institution) is an important part of my life. I think we have to take the positive aspects of religion (Catholic, Christian, Muslim, Buddhist…) in our lives, accept and love your neighbor, live honestly and without hurting others, and preach a message of peace. So, I don't care what you believe or don't believe, as long as you are happy and don't hurt others, bless you.

[@kenashworth7672]

That just sounds like a shitty miserable person who gets into relationships to spread their shitty-ness to others. If you are getting into a relationship feeling you are entitled to bully your partner into changing to suit you, your relationship can't end up healthy. Sorry, you went through that.

[@VindensSaga]

Yeah. That's just shitty. Good thing that this person is now an ex, sounds like a toxic person. The thing when people say that religion don't make sense it basically means it don't make sense for them but for you (and me) religion makes perfect sense. People that really want to believe in God, they will do it no matter what they're told or "shown." Accepting and respecting differences is always the key.

[@MarBL23563]

Im sorry you had to go through that. It seems like they were just a horrible person. I hope you have recovered from that relationship

[@luchem721]

If you want to know. I married an atheist. But he is the kindest and most understanding person. And he knows that loving me means loving the beliefs that make me who I am, just as I love everything he is. We don't mess with each other's beliefs (or not beliefs). I thank the Lord for bringing him into my life.

[@IamSkyeOrion]

You don't convert someone to atheism.

[@WizardOfWor]

Timestamps: #1 - 2:42: Assuming an atheist thinks like you, but in reverse. #2 - 4:29: Assuming an atheist has never had a spiritual or religious experience. #3 - 7:11: Assuming atheists think the way Theologians say they do. #4 - 9:50: Making arguments or claims without asking questions first.

[@kevinquiroz5384]

The fourth one is basically the result of the third one and the cause of the first two

[@MatthewChenault]

The second one is a contradiction. How can you have a spiritual or religious experience and still maintain atheism? There is an inherent contradiction unless if you rationalize the thing as not being spiritual or religious at all, which would then be perceived as you lying to yourself or not make the event a spiritual or religious experience anymore. It’s self-contradictory, making it a rubbish point.

[@neoqwerty]

@@MatthewChenault I can answer that, as an atheist (apatheist, to be exact: I don't know and I don't care if there's a god or not, it doesn't change me and what I do): I had a moment where I basically met a hippie dude who encouraged me to "connect back with nature" (and crashed the zen moment I had with the solo of Knights of Cydonia but I forgave that) and to do meditation stuff. Dude preached about "finding Jesus through nature and contemplating how marvelous and beautiful the world is" and I admit, there was a really magical moment where I was staring at the lake just the right way and the sun over the waves in my half-closed eyes looked like thousands of sparkling stars. I felt the most ironclad, peaceful calm I ever had and I still bring that state of mind back up when I do my meditations. I don't believe I found Jesus or anything, but I did have something that I'd consider transcendent. If I was inclined toward Bhuddism I guess I'd say that the barriers between mortal self and the universe wavered a bit. Still didn't make me anything but an apatheist, though. But it was nice and I hope nature jesus guy's well wherever he is now.

[@MatthewChenault]

@@neoqwerty, the problem is you’re not an Atheist, which you do admit. You’re closer to being agnostic (I.e. you don’t know God exists or not) than an Atheist (I.e. denying the existence of God outright). An Atheist, in your position, would downplay and outright dismiss the spiritual experience as simply a trick of their mind or as absolute nonsense, since it would contradict their atheism if they were to have a spiritual/religious experience of that type. This is why it’s an inherently contradictory idea for an Atheist to admit to having a religious experience of that type while still maintaining their atheism.

[@stevenredpath9332]

@@MatthewChenault he’s using the language he’s familiar with. As an atheist I have had profound and deeply introspective movements. They are not spiritual to me because I don’t use that terminology. I use the language that fits and no religious terminology is ended.

[@LennyDiPaolo]

When I reveal my Atheism I usually get, “I’m sorry to hear that.”

[@blackcatpirates8134]

Hahahaha 😆

[@JesusLopez-xz3qw]

Yes, I once told to a Christian friend who I considered very close.. "I dont believe in a god"... She just said, "thats very sad, because you havent met him yet." thats how far the conversation went.

[@shiro_mafaalu1540]

@@JesusLopez-xz3qw It would be funny if you replied with “Oh, I’ll help you meet your God”

[@JesusLopez-xz3qw]

@@shiro_mafaalu1540 damn, this went from skeptic to bundy in no time

[@emmanuelsolis7872]

"Don't Worry i will pray for u" obiously whit a condecendent look

[@AyrSpeed]

One of the most telling issues i ran into when talking about my loss of faith was when christians would bring up Pascal's wager (Pascal's Wager boiling down to "Why not act like he does, even if you don't really think so? It's not worth losing heaven over, right?") Would your God really turn away a good person who tried their best over someone who didn't really care, but just went through the motions for the sake of heavenly access? If so, is that really a god worth worshipping?

[@stevenscott2136]

I knew a guy who told me I should go to church even if I thought it was bunk, because God wouldn't know the difference. I pointed out that he was saying his god was a gullible moron. He kind of froze up.

[@AbandonedVoid]

To the second question, yes, absolutely. If worship was really going to grant me eternal paradise and the punishment for not worshiping him is eternal torment, I'd be disingenuously singing my heart out to hymns. If I lived in North Korea, you would never catch me badmouthing the Great Leader, no matter what I thought. I'm not a masochist. Pascal's Wager is a threat to demand obedience, not a bribe.

[@sheadoherty7434]

If we were to fully realise Pascals wager, we'd pray a thousand times a day. A prayer to each god. Just hedging our bets.

[@TheRenofox]

My favorite reply to Pascal's Wager is the Pascal's Mugging: "I'm actually god, so give me your money. Even if it's unlikely I'm telling the truth, whatever you're carrying is nothing compared to the risk of not getting to heaven!"

[@sheadoherty7434]

@Mr Right no, our ignorance of the nature of a being that may or may not exist is not a great reason to believe in one.

[@littlemas2]

As an Evangelical Christian Pastor, I actually totally resonate with this video. I have found myself on both side of the issue of not listening to people. I mean, I have done lots of research of various different systems of viewing the world, and I have at times judged people (Mormons, Muslims, Athiests, Agnostics) by some material that I read rather than listening to them personally. It was actually in conversation with a Mormon friend that I finally figured this point out. I knew more "official" Mormon doctrine than he did, but that doctrine was not what he knew or believed. Therefore, I was in fact not conversing with him, but rather an image of him that I had built in my head. On the other side, I have a very good agnostic friend with whom I have had many conversations over the last 5 years. We care about one another personally to the point of showing up for the real moments of life, such as illness or family problems. But he is so frustrating because sometimes he is arguing a point against some "Christian" that has nothing to do with what I believe. I'll tell him that, and he'll actually answer that of course I believe that, I just don't know it. I mean it's gotten to the point where I don't even want to talk about ideas anymore because I don't think I am being heard. It doesn't even happen in an effort of me trying to convert him (yes, I think I'm right and I'd like him to agree with me, but first we have to be able to have regular conversation), because most of the time it is him bringing up topics. For example, he has some Christian friends who are Trump fans and keeps trying to put that on me as if I'm being inconsistent in my belief system by supporting Trump, which I don't and haven't. Now in one sense this has been good for me because it makes me more aware of my own tendency to judge people by the group that they supposedly belong to, rather than getting to know them individually. I think group classification can be useful, but in conversing with individuals, we should not assume that anyone conforms neatly to any particular group.

[@ronbernardi]

How can you remain an evangelical Christian pastor? I mean Jesus was a man. The god part is just wishful thinking.

[@apinkchameleon]

I think it's really great that you've been willing to debate and hear other sides on this issue! However, as an agnostic, the fact that your friend is trying to tell you what you actually believe in sounds really frustrating. I have a few Christian friends too and I would never say that to them, especially since I know that they have probably thought critically about their religion as well. Also, I most definitely do not think that all Chrstians are Trump supporters by a long shot, it's actually a bit silly that your friend has decided that for you. I think that there's no way to prove or disprove religion, which is why I'm agnostic, but also that we can't chide people for believing in something we think is ridiculous because we don't know if it is or not. So I think it is incredibly disrespectful to make generalizations or belittle people just for being religious, as much as religious people shouldn't mock agnostics/atheists. I honestly hope that more people become a little more like you in terms of hearing other sides too

[@littlemas2]

@@ronbernardi I guess I'd have to know a lot more about you and what you believe to give you a real answer to this question. When you say "the god part" what do you mean? Do you not believe Jesus was god or a god or perhaps that the very idea of the supernatural is wishful thinking or perhap you mean something else altogether?

[@ronbernardi]

@@littlemas2 Jesus is no more god than you or I or a plant. Generally a person's religious belief is based on their birth place. Had you been born in Saudi Arabia you'd be an Imam. Had you been born in Thailand you'd be a monk. The bible, Torah and Quran are error filled books. And yet humans can write error free books and to do it often. Books god whispered, spoken or dictated are full of errors. Joshua stopped the Sun. Jona lived in the belly of a fish. Jobs family, and good used as gambling chips. Muhammad rode a flying horse and split the Moon in two.

[@littlemas2]

@@ronbernardi Well your answer did not exactly get to what I was asking, but I think I understand a little better. Would you say that any belief in a reality outside of the physical world is not justified? Or perhaps another way to say it would be to ask if a belief in any god or any miracle (an event that is caused by some force outside of the material universe) is possible? In more technical terms, I'm asking if you are a philosphical naturalist or materialist? If not how would you describe your belief about the limits of what is or could be real? I'm not trying to be argumentative, but rather to get clarity so that I can better respond to your question.

[@archygrey9093]

"Coming out as atheist" That just sounds really weird, never heard that before

[@GeorgeThoughts]

I'd never considered this as a thing either, but it makes sense tbh. My normal has always been a fairly atheist/agnostic family upbringing, and though I attended a Church of England school I never personally believed in God. It was all just ceremonies and fun songs for me. But now I find myself in a relationship with a mild Catholic, who was raised in Malaysia where Religion is far more culturally engrained and "hard-core". Her family are more hardcore Catholic and tend to relate almost all of their daily experiences back to God. The mother will, for instance, pray to Jesus for a break in traffic so that she can pull out into a busy road, or find a parking space! This seems absurd to me, but I try to understand that for them, being religious is the norm. It's almost like having a favorite hobby. So I may very well have to "come out" to them eventually as Athiest myself, especially when their family friends prod me about whether I'm a good Christian or not...

[@sadkingbilly]

It’s not a thing. Atheism is the natural state for human beings. It’s like being Caucasian, then telling people “I’m coming out as a white (wo)man”.

[@nessa-parmentier]

@@sadkingbilly it *should* not be a thing But it is, i discovered it recently, mainly in very religious countries Being from France, where religion is not really important, being atheist is one of the default options (at the point where when i encounter someone, i assume they're atheist by default), but in the USA for example, depending on the states, it simply doesn't look like it's a normal option

[@eldritchthorne]

​@@sadkingbilly Pfft 'not a thing'. Try living in an area where being an atheist was a tag that meant 'HEY COME HARASS ME CUZ I'M A WRETCH THAT NEEDS SAVING!' For me, it is the Southern Bible Belt, USA, in a small town where Christianity is king and people look down their nose at you if you don't 'pray their way'. If you make the mistake of coming out here, you won't get any peace when certain people find out (if you told the wrong person, word will spread like WILDFIRE) and they will send others, sometimes people you don't know at all, to approach you on the matter to 'show you the errors of your ways'. You will be singled out and forced into uncomfortable situations that you can't avoid when you're in a social setting. Be rude about it or make them believe it was rude, it comes back trifold with other underhanded tactics. Leaning in with wide eyes and a creepy grin and telling you to have a BLESSED day when you're at work and demand that you say it back each time they come in is one of those ways. You may even make someone so irrationally mad about your disbelief that their body language might tell you to duck. Hell, they'll try their best to get you alone and keep you from leaving until you either agree with them or someone else walks in. They may ask questions and seem interested in learning, but they'll cut you off and insert old assumptions we're all used to hearing. That was called 'Thanksgiving/Chrismas Dinner' and/or 'spending time with stepdad's heavily religious family'! There are some seriously entitled people who think they can convert gay people into being straight, atheists are just another one of those situations in their eyes. Been there, done that, got the t-shirt. Don't get me started on how they react if you tell them you're Ace or 'not interested in a relationship'. Got the t-shirt for that too.

[@sadkingbilly]

nathan parmentier I know. One of the reasons I consider the us a third world country. Religion absolutely is a mental illness, and one that doesn’t come naturally. People are bully-brainwashed into it.

[@jayfeather2263]

hey there, man! I'm a Roman Catholic, and wanted to say that I really enjoyed your video! You had some good points and I agree with a lot of what you said, even if we believe in different things. Thanks for making this!

[@Plapp_]

very wholesome comment 10/10

[@rainbowbun8716]

Wow you the nicest catholic I ever met. Thanks for being amazing.

[@svensvensson1085]

Well said

[@El_Presidente_5337]

@@rainbowbun8716 I have the feeling that only the most idiotic ones of us come out in the internet shouting around lmao

[@Plapp_]

@Bwa Bwa Yoshi yeah but like him and half of the views here are people that don't believe in that so we all good

[@AronRa]

Your hair is still two feet too short.

[@WilbertLek]

His mother didn't pass on "his file" to the barber...

[@moseszero3281]

AronRa. You are a fucking legend.

[@abhabh6896]

I dont get it?

[@moseszero3281]

​@@abhabh6896 AronRa likes long hair. :p He is one of the original YT atheists. His "foudational falsehoods of creationism" series and Thunderf00t's "Why do people laugh at creationists?" series are both great.

[@TheReaverOfDarkness]

@@moseszero3281 They also both feature long-haired atheists.

[@witchofredwoods8963]

I am not an atheist (I'm still trying to come up with reasons why the KZbin algorithm decided to show this to me), but as a non-Christian theist, I can definitely relate to a lot of the points you made. This video was very relatable and very well-made. And as you said, this advice applies to anyone trying to convince anyone of anything. Thank you so much for this!

[@kenashworth7672]

I'm sincerely curious what your non-Christian theism (poly-theistic?) looks like. I'm a Buddist, and one of my closest friends is a Zoroastrian, and we often find common ground in our beliefs to chat about.

[@witchofredwoods8963]

@@kenashworth7672 Hi! I'm a Hellenic polytheist (Hellenist or HelPol for short), meaning I worship the Greek gods. I am also an omnist, meaning I believe that all religions are valid and that all gods exist (and yes, that includes the Abrahamic God). But as a Hellenist, I only worship the Greek pantheon. Separate from my religious background, I am a practicing witch. Before I became a Hellenist, I was an eclectic pagan, and my witchcraft and my paganism were closely tied together. Now, I still practice eclectic witchcraft, though the scope of my worship has narrowed down to just the Hellenic gods. On the topic of common ground, I have a lot of Muslim friends, and I can't help but notice the similarities between _wudu_ (I think that's how you spell it?) in Islam and spiritual cleanliness in Hellenism. Different religions may have different specific practices, but many of the overarching concepts are very similar! I love having interfaith conversations and finding all of these similarities!

[@grell5108]

@@witchofredwoods8963 ayo! I'm also an omnist, but I only work with the Norse gods (currently at least). And other than some basic 'magic' that kinda comes with the religion like rune work, I'm not really a witch. It's really fun talking to other polytheists. May I ask what deities you worship or is that too personal?

[@witchofredwoods8963]

​@@grell5108 Yay! And no, it's not too personal for me. I primarily worship Hestia, Dēmētēr, Athēnē, Apollon, and Aphroditē. By any chance, do you listen to pagan folk music?

[@grell5108]

@@witchofredwoods8963 cool. Yeah, I listen to some Skald and technically Brothers of Metal ain't folk but it's reeeaaallly good. You?

[@KingLouisII]

"...deep down you know there's a God. You're just afraid to admit it." No. When I was a Christian, deep down I knew it was all bullshit. I was just to afraid to admit it then.

[@aspitube2515]

It's normal, when you don't read the Bible, don't pray, stay away from God those things happen. satan is at work, he never sleeps

[@este45ful]

@@aspitube2515 idk bro, I used to be extremely religious, read the biblie with my mom at night, went to church every saturday, but I still ended up an atheist

[@j_5244]

Then did you really call on Christ to save you? “Anyone who rejected the law of Moses died without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. How much more severely do you think one deserves to be punished who has trampled on the Son of God, profaned the blood of the covenant that sanctified him, and insulted the Spirit of grace?” -Hebrews 10:28-29 KJV

[@MarcStollmeyer]

@@j_5244 did you actually watch the video?

[@darkomarkovic460]

@@MarcStollmeyer This video isn't really perfect. You should listen to our friend @J W here.

[@LoversAnonymousMusic]

27 years of going to church 3 days a week, going to nearly 20 years of christian schooling, I've read through the bible more than 100 times but every time I talk to a christian or family they think I'm just ignorant to their views...

[@mavrosyvannah]

Fibs.

[@reggieb184]

My story is similar, but it's like they think you slept through all of it. No, we payed attention harder. That's why we left.

[@n_coder]

@@reggieb184 funny thing is that I would almost sleep during church. Even before I started questioning Christianity, I couldn't properly pay attention to it; 1 hour seemed to pass double the slower. Later, I figured it out: no child will have fun staying sit for an hour and listening to an old man talking about God when they can just spend their energy with something else

[@pajamas720]

@@n_coder that would explain why theres so many athiests. Between the crazy stuff in the old testament and the way most preachers rob the novel of all its interesting qualities, its almost like churches are designed to dispell christianity.

[@jamesedwards6173]

I grew up in conservative Christianity, though I've been an atheist for many years now. My experience has been that I know more about Christianity than the vast majority of Christians do---and that includes the contents of the Bible, which I think only a tiny fraction of Christians have ever actually read cover to cover. (I have.) I've even had a work colleague who was very active in his church, and who knew I was an atheist (but came from an upbringing in Christianity), come to work one day and ask if I had any suggestions of stories in the Bible that demonstrate faith! lol ... Though there are some options here, I suggested Gideon. He looked at me and asked, "Who?" *facepalm*

[@JossCard42]

"A man convinced against his will, is of the same opinion still". When I was a missionary, that was a phrase I had to keep repeating to myself as I was tracting. Leaving the church, this phrase is what stopped me from info-dumping on all my friends and relatives.

[@robertwilkins3167]

I'm Catholic and I've always gotten along well with atheists and agnostics. Most of my friends when I was a younger man (I'm closing in on 50) were atheists, agnostics or people from religions other than my own and we got along well. I remember having being asked by the sister of one of my friends, a Wiccan girl, if I was a Christian and she acted like I was a unique creature when I affirmed that I was. I can't remember what she said upon learning that I was a Christian but it amounted to "I've never met (or talked to) a Christian!" 😁 I can't speak for anyone but myself but my life's calling isn't to convert people to Catholicism. Reading the Gospel it's obvious who Jesus associated with. It wasn't the self-righteous and hypocritical that He supped with. I've met many a non-Christian who acts in a more Christlike manner than many who claim to believe.

[@bigpapamagoo8696]

The idea that ‘he who is not with me is against me’ is so wrong. People wonder why religion is so alienating; it’s because the mindset you’re taught is that anyone who disagrees is the enemy and must be changed in order to become good.

[@Augustus-mk1du]

very underrated comment

[@Raka-n3t]

Sorry u feel that way. I wish Christians/Muslims/Jews did not treat atheists this way if they want to spread the word of their God. Christian bible says (Jesus) to love others. No one is perfect, but just know that not all Christians are alike…just like atheists. For example. We’re taught homosexuality is a sin, BUT nowhere does it encourage us to mistreat or hate them. That’s not how loving others works. Btw, it doesn’t mean we’re better either…we’re all sinners in a fallen world. Each of us sins everyday. That’s why church is meant to be a hospital for the spiritually weak, not a temple for the spiritually “perfect.” Good luck, and I hope if u run into Christians in the future they’re more understanding next time

[@Nixinnuendos]

Its the tribalism that goes with being human

[@phoenixc7245]

@@Raka-n3t Jesus was gay though no where in the bible does it say homosexuality is a sin

[@amo_res9266]

@@phoenixc7245 stfu ur very disrespectful

[@The8BitPianist]

"To change someone's mind, you first have to listen." A quote to remember.

[@mattthompson5444]

What?

[@xyrus345]

To change someone's mind they first have to have a mind to change.

[@The8BitPianist]

@@xyrus345 True

[@Firedrake1313]

You also need a valid point that you are trying to get them to see. The problem with religion is that it's simply NOT valid from any perspective at all, it's just all BS so there IS NO argument for it that makes any kind of sense at all. People that believe in religion are simply believing what they want so they feel better about themselves, doesn't matter if that happens to be contrary to reality.

[@captaingr00vy40]

@@Firedrake1313 it's not "valid" because you are choosing it to not be.

[@danwhite5339]

I've been an atheist for about 65 years. As soon as I understood there are many religions with conflicting claims and beliefs, I realized there was no good reason the Christian belief was any more reasonable than any other religion or the religions that are now called myths. They all become fairy-tale like. There are a few snippets of wisdom in all religions, but they the supernatural aspects are not valuable. The power of prayer is real in a sense, but it is not a god listening and granting a prayer. It is the power of positive thinking. If I look out of your window and tell you someone is stealing your car, even if that is a lie, immediately your blood pressure rises, your heartbeat increases and you feel concern and perhaps dread, fear, or anger. The truth is irrelevant for the power of prayer or meditation to work.

[@GodlyDra]

…… is it bad that I would feel excitement if someone said somebody was stealing my car? Like, I don’t own a car so if somebody said that I’d just be excited that I had a car somehow.

[@nenmaster5218]

@@GodlyDra Cody Johnstono, Holy Koolaid, and Telltale-Fireside are 3 Sides of a Coin, so dont miss-out. Just in general, i could say that Unhealthy-Religion like the GOP and Conservatives are a Main-Point-of-Coverage since Forveer for Atheist-KZbinrs in general, and therefore worthy of your Support, but these 2 stick-out, as they have the declared Goal to reduce Hate in the World and inform you while also make you laugh! The new video " Pastor Upset We QUOTED HIM" and the Old, AMAZINGLY FUN Video 'The Great Evangelical Double-Down'

[@GodlyDra]

@@nenmaster5218 You see, the thing is i run on hatred and spite. Happy and jokey people just irritate me.

[@nenmaster5218]

@@GodlyDra Hbomberguy says the same thing about Himself, so try just ONE of his videos (the one abouut Pick Up Artistry) to see if you like his Style.

[@GodlyDra]

@@nenmaster5218 I already have, thus why i said what i did. I don’t like his style

[@ralphandleosmom9075]

I’m in my 50s and was brought up uber Catholic. I had some sort of religious instruction or ceremony every day. At the same time my paternal grandfather was an atheist. He never talked about it but he didn’t hide it either. How I wish I could tell him, “me too, grandpa, and my kids!” Of course I never “came out” to my Mom before she passed away. She had had enough sadness and difficulties in her life. I didn’t want to add to it for her.

[@moshecallen]

Missionaries *always* act like they're giving you new info and that you "really" want to hear it as well as that if you ever do listen that it must be convincing. It's maddening.

[@philaypeephilippotter6532]

Agreed. Look at *Fathom Synth's* attempt to convince me of _creationism_ above.

[@YoSpiff]

That's what they are taught. Kinda like many salespeople are taught that if you haven't walked away or hung up on them, then you really are interested, despite what you may say, so they press on with overcoming objections.

[@Batman-zi5hh]

Yet they can't backup their claims with proper evidence

[@chrisgoblin4857]

Hearing about you coming out as an Atheist reminded me of when I came out as the same. I remember my parent's responses well. My Dad said "Wey aye, all religion is bullshit." Found out that day my whole immediate family happened to think the same. Makes me wonder why I went to a Christian school now.

[@jessica-vl9nw]

I came out to my husband and my two oldest children recently. My husband was questioning his faith (he is now an atheist) and my two oldest kids were already atheist. I was shocked because I had no clue. I think there are many "closet atheist " out there.

[@arson_ruby2403]

@Alex McAuliff that’s pretty much true for “closet” anything though. It’s not about it being “unnatural” it’s about it not being accepted

[@ihopeicanchangethisnamelat7108]

@Alex McAuliff ✨lgbtqia+✨

[@coltonjumalon7482]

It’s because people are still under the impression that despite in invalidity of religion, that somehow it still provides morals; which again is a misnomer because they (religion & morals) aren’t mutually exclusive.

[@PsychoMuffinSDM]

I was talking to my dad about why he denies agnosticism, and why he believes a god exists. After talking for a while I realized he didn't actually understand the definition, and once I told him what that is, acknowledged he must be agnostic.

[@kaylynliossis4222]

One thing I've realized after becoming an atheist who was previously extremely religious is that atheists aren't annoyed by religious people because they are jealous or missing god in their hearts, its because in my experience anyway it is frustrating to see someone become a victim to controlling cult like religions and missing out on life because of it.

[@stevengu1253]

They start to attribute everything to God, and then start judging others through this God thing. It's downright very disorienting for me. It's like they surrendered a part of their reasoning and will. I would like to freely decide upon my own actions, not follow the supposed actions of something.

[@cooldude6651]

it was the same way with me, it hurts me to see people go through pain and hardship and make it through by their own inner strength and then turn around and say that someone they've never met got them through it.

[@timflatus]

Most religions are not cults. Unfortunately cultish behaviour has become normalised in many parts of the world. You got mixed up in a cult. If your religion doesn't enrich your life, sure that's a problem and may explain why these people have a perverse desire to convert others. Surely if your religion was that much fun you'd have people breaking down the doors to get in?

[@cooldude6651]

@@timflatus If any religion tries to make rational thought a sin and blind faith a virtue, I consider it a cult. There's no more common a thing for a cult leader to say than to just trust them and let sensible thought fall by the wayside.

[@timflatus]

@@cooldude6651 absolutely. The problem is coercive charismatic leadership, which goes well beyond religion.

[@YuletideGlory]

I love the message at the end about how you hope that by listening to one another there would be less animosity and toxicity between atheists and theists, and dare I say it's an inspired message. There needs to be more people who strive for peace.

[@grayisgood]

Some people respect others, and some people just want to dominate others.

[@TheatreofPhil]

Rhetorically, what you're describing here is a form of Rogerian argument. I often teach my rhetoric students that Rogerian argument is one of the most effective forms of argumentation because it builds connections with the other person/people when you can restate their position in a way they agree with.

[@GeneticallyModifiedSkeptic]

The true gospel of Carl Rogers 🙏

[@gabrote42]

I have been using this technique for years for arguing things like why salespeople add value to society, and now I know it's name! Much appreciated.

[@toonyandfriends1915]

@@gabrote42 lmao

[@gabrote42]

@@toonyandfriends1915 I know, but it's an actual discussion I had in the Chess Evolved Online discord. I didn't even know French Baguette Intelligence back then

[@toonyandfriends1915]

@@gabrote42 Based FBI watcher

[@charlesmturner]

I was an atheist from the start, before I read the Bible, before I knew there is science. I didn't need to justify or seek a reason. It's my natural state. When I did read the Bible, when I studied science, I appreciated the experiences. Still an atheist eighty years later.

[@Robynhoodlum]

Tabula Rasa. No baby is born believing in any religion or system, they must learn it from others.

[@jdos5643]

@@Robynhoodlum then how do humans unlike animals are born with a moral conscience of right and wrong? Yes no baby is born with knowledge of religion. But imagine a world with none. You would be in North Korea. Either way atheism is a religion. As a human being you grow up having questions about life. No science can answer that for you. Science cannot account for the atrocities committed in history it cant answer that. And atheism cannot help you either. It’s a religion of no hope. Imagine seeing all the bad things in the world and saying it’s normal. imagine living a life with no future prospect. No Christian forces people to convert. To change is up to each individual. Christian’s have a duty to God and that is simply to spread the message worldwide. That work won’t stop until God decides when. It’s when you receive it and still ignore it that’s on you. This way when God decides to act, No person will be with excuses that nobody told them. The end of the world that we have all heard is simply the end of the ungodly. Clearly God detest what is bad and Ppl in the world practicing it deliberately. but atheism offers you nothing not even life. This life is all many will ever get with atheism. If you are content with that then carry on…..

[@Robynhoodlum]

@@jdos5643 You are conflating religious identity with cultural influence, psychology, sociology, and biology. While religion can play a huge part in shaping culture, it is not required. Any ideology can influence culture whether or not it is religious in nature. Politics and consumerism come to mind. You say science can’t account for atrocities but there are many psychological and sociological reasons that people do horrible things to each other. A few famous examples are the Milgram Study and the Stanford Prison Experiment. Also, you seem very keen to say Christians don’t force people to convert when historically, Christians have forcibly indoctrinated the people they conquered and have withheld aid to those who don’t follow their mission. This doesn’t even account for the four wars (“crusades”) Christians fought simply for religious reasons. The very idea of a scapegoat is a Christian tradition that has caused millions of minorities to be targeted with violence. This has led to the saying “There’s no hate like Christian love.” Thankfully most people don’t need religion to teach us morality since we have empathy. Atheists don’t need the fear of hell or the promise of heaven to cajole us into behaving. We choose not to hurt others because we have empathy. We choose to believe in people and society’s ability to do good. And we enjoy our time on Earth and the people we’re with because they’re all we’ll ever get.

[@jdos5643]

@@Robynhoodlum well you say religion is not required. If it was removed you be in North Korea…..

[@Robynhoodlum]

@@jdos5643 North Korea has a religion. They worship their dictators.

[@strawberrana]

I swear this guy looks exactly like theodd1sout

[@nicktheswampert1646]

I have never thought about this but holy crap you're right

[@lerogi4962]

You’re right xD

[@arandomuser9459]

CJGamr01 Holy hell he does

[@ethanwiedman7285]

Oh my

[@unomobisnuit5777]

Thank you , now I can't get this or of my mind

[@ideitbawxproductions1880]

I'm an atheist, and have become friends with a number of Christians over the years. If any religious discussion comes up, we tend to listen to each other, we don't judge one another, and we accept that we have different beliefs. It's nice having friendships that can work with this dynamic. But there's one thing I say that we all tend to agree on: None of us really know what's "on the other side," and we won't find out for sure until we're dead. So until then, let's make the most of the life we have here while we're still alive in *this* existence, and we'll worry about what's next when the time comes.

[@nickstadler1906]

If a theist "wins" in a debate with an atheist, they've converted someone to the flock. If a theist "loses" an argument to an atheist, clearly it's a sign from God that they've just confronted Satan and walked away with their faith intact, so they still "won."

[@andrewharper1609]

Only in their own mind. Back on planet Earth however...

[@wilsons2882]

hey is this cosmic skeptic's other brother from another mother

[@drummerboy737]

Yeah thats correct although it's maybe not a direct conflict.

[@andrewharper1609]

@@drummerboy737 It's only a conflict if there is in fact a Satan to begin with. Otherwise the theist is just being wrong for the sake of it and is choosing to live in a delusional state of mind.

[@drummerboy737]

​@@andrewharper1609 Right so it's possible that the theist is completely in his right mind.

[@thevibe248]

It is amazing to me how this issue includes much more than religion. It encompasses issues with political parties and just information sharing in general. In the past few years with big political arguments, so much miss information was shared because many people believed that they understood exactly what everyone else (the people they were trying to convert) thought because they just know. (Not sure if I worded that perfectly but I think most everyone understands what I am talking about.) For Example: Recently I was at the county fair to show an animal in the very republican dominant place I live in, and I was confronted by a probably 11-year-old boy that I knew. He abruptly asked me if I supported Trump and I said no. He also asked me if I was a republican, I told him that I have not decided yet because I won't make a conclusion until I know enough information on who I support by claiming a 'side'. He then proceeded to call me a rhino throughout the rest of our conversation. He also asked me if I 'liked gays' to which I responded, they are humans just like we are and they deserve respect and kindness. (Also for reference I am 17) He continued to attack me with frivolous and sneaky questions that were created to 'trick' me, somehow as an attempt to convert me to the 'right' way. This young boy also claimed that "One day you will wake up and say. 'That young kid was right about everything and I was very wrong.'" At one point I decided to disengage myself from the conversation because no friendly debate is worthwhile unless both parties are fully listening and considering that they could be wrong about something. He then used the technique of attempting to strike fear into me by ordering me to sit down immediately and to listen to what he has to say. My point is, this was the wrong way for so many reasons. There was no possibility to 'convert' me using his tactics. Most of all this was so sad to see in a young kid that still has so much to learn in his future, and his rock-solid 'conclusion' will block him from learning anything he doesn't already agree with.

[@wintergray1221]

The saddest part is that he had to have learned all of that from his parents/guardians.

[@pallingtontheshrike6374]

yeah, watching chinese and taiwanese news really put a lot of our [murican] claims on democracy and freedom in perspective for me. The shit taiwanese people [esp taiwanese news media] say is incredible. The amount the taiwanese government [at this point, I too support taiwan rejoining mainland china because they really _really_ don't know how to govern themselves] has managed to fuck up with the amazing seed that is Taiwan in a matter of 4 years is truly astounding. There's price and export issues, COVID issues, political freedoms issues [they took a TV channel completely off the air for pretty much just 'they insulted the government,' they've been embroiled in scandal, they've busted into houses of political opponents], basic management issues [power supply used to be pretty steady. then it wasn't, and they had huge shortages], etc. Nobody has heard of any of this outside of mainland and Taiwan. Why? Because it doesn't matter; at the time it was Trump's big 'campaign' to 'defeat' via 'the biggest economic sanctions ever' the 'evil' china. To this day, there is still no concrete evidence, especially evidence without conflict of interest, that there are crimes against humanity in Xinjiang; Adrian Zenz? his report admits that it was just a dozen people's testimony, with no independent confirmation nor large-scale statistics. Every image that pops up? a legitimate, registered company, typically walled because _a decade ago, there were still plenty of terrorists roaming around._ People say 'reeducation is brainwashing,' but then what are you gonna do about the terrorists? Kill them all, even if they haven't done an attack directly? You're right. It does include much more than religion. The problem is, if we actually include political issues and information sharing in general, we'll end up finding that our entire fucking social studies education is half-predicated on lies and manipulation. Who the fuck is gonna foot the bill for that?

[@curiaregis9479]

@@pallingtontheshrike6374 China pays shills. You sound exactly like one of their paid shills. People who infest the internet and leave tens of thousands of comments on social media. First off, the corruptions you attribute to Taiwan are also applicable to China. China is authoritarian and does not respect free speech or personal freedoms. So does this mean the Chinese "really don't know how to govern themselves" and should be controlled by another nation? Absorbed by another nation? What a disgusting shill you are to disrespect the sovereignty of Taiwan in order to further augment the power and control of China. One key benefit of keeping Taiwan a sovereign country is that the people of Taiwan have a much better chance of securing reforms in a small, sovereign country than they ever would if absorbed into authoritarian China. Stop shilling your trash Chinese propaganda.

[@firesnake47]

Part of the problem here is that the kid was 11 years old. Kids think they know everything sometimes.

[@mazerunner7640]

11 year olds are menaces

[@bunnyboo9097]

I'm glad I found this channel. I'm an atheist who was born into a Mormon family so it's nice to hear from people with similar experiences.

[@SpadesGame]

You are playing on hard mode

[@AngryBilleh]

@@SpadesGame with the good ending

[@zebyurd9530]

Same but my family won’t know until I move out.

[@AngryBilleh]

@@zebyurd9530 good luck, luckily I was raise in a family that let me freely choose what to believe, I still became an atheist in the end but that's fine because I no longer fear death

[@greatlondino2407]

Sorry to hear that, note Mormonism is not Christianity... It is a cult.

[@chair547]

I returned to Christianity after being an atheist for years, and the one thing I learned is that my return story is so personal to me and to my specific circumstances and feelings about the world and my specific experience that I can't see how converting others is even possible. I am Christian because the practices and traditions and identity and community and metaphysical beliefs work best for me right now. I don't regret having been an Atheist for the time that I was and I don't think it's morally right or possible to try to convert people from any religion to any other religion

[@chair547]

I suppose if your religion says that you should be shity to gay people then maybe it's right to try to convert you to a religion that says hey maybe don't but outside of that I think that faith is such a personal, arational thing in the conversion is both unlikely to succeed and morally untenable

[@impious4228]

"mom, im an atheist" "ok"

[@Phoenix_The_HeroHater]

Coumfy Lucky mate

[@nicktheswampert1646]

Best case scenario

[@maciejjurczak7258]

@@impious4228 lol are you serious? Couse they belive that that person will go to hell because of that

[@DaveCM]

Not the reaction I received. My mother blamed it on getting an education

[@nicktheswampert1646]

@@maciejjurczak7258 Not all of them do

[@otterchaos666]

You have such a big heart, I’ve gotten to the point where I don’t even want to enter into a conversation with a religious Christian. My Dad actually got angry with me the other day when he asked me if I believed in the theory of evolution, and I said yes. Getting yelled at by your Dad is not my idea of a constructive conversation.

[@charlee_hotel]

What?! What a nasty dad of yours! When I was a kid and found out about the theory of evolution, my dad was all excited and began explaining more to me. He's what's colloquially known as _spiritual but not religious_ .

[@aspiring.creative.person6092]

Ooooo I agree. When I was a freshman I told my dad I was starting to learn about evolution and he just said “don’t believe everything they tell you” which I was honestly surprised by?? Like, I know he’s a Christian and creationist but usually he respects experts I guess? Idk He also thinks he’s a bad parent if we disagree with him on anything related to this stuff. Recently I pretended to be homophobic to his face just to avoid an argument. So yeah.

[@stevenredpath9332]

The great thing about the theory of evolution is that it doesn’t require anyones’ belief as it’s supported by evidence and predicts correctly what is observed. And your dad should know better than yelling but I suspect he was suffering a cognitive dissonance moment. That doesn’t excuse his behaviour though as he’s a fully grown, mature adult.

[@josephrich3509]

Are you over 18? If he yells at you, yell back.

[@aspiring.creative.person6092]

@@josephrich3509 honestly nowadays 18 is still largely dependent on your parents, in a way it makes it more likely they throw you out if you go against them I think

[@Josh-rf9qy]

I'm pretty sure my parents think I'm still Christian and was just "going through a phase"

[@gabbiekangombe240]

Same here 🥲🥲 like no mama I’ve been feeling like this since I was 9 and I’m almost 17 😃

[@astra6137]

Same here, but my parents are Hindu :(

[@jaimelannister1797]

They can’t think I’m going through a phrase if I never tell them I’m an atheist

[@advaygiradkar9708]

@@astra6137 same

[@monkeyporche225]

@@gabbiekangombe240 I've been an atheist since I was 15 and I'm now 38, my mother just pretends that I'm not an atheist and just never brings up the topic or speaks as if I'm just agnostic. Honestly this is sadly the best outcome you'll have with most Christians.

[@frostingfox8180]

A great example of the spiritual experiences is that I have ‘seen ghosts’. As a kid I saw my family’s dead sheep run through the halls and I occasionally ‘see ghosts’ today too. But I don’t believe in ghosts and I recognize it was just an eye trick or any moving object my brain couldn’t categorize so it processed it as something familiar.

[@perfumedgnat9659]

My grandma once sourced the bible as proof that god exists, while also saying god wrote the bible Edit: to clarify, this was the only source she gave

[@The_True_Mx_Pink]

Very, _very_ comedic considering that man wrote the Bible. Which is information written _in_ the Bible. Just in case someone here didn't know.

[@kyo_.]

I've once had a lengthy discussion with a christian who kept trying to convert everyone at work and every point I'd make he'd recite the bible to try and counter it or would just change the goalpost to something he can reference from bible, when i told him i don't believe in the bible to begin with so he can stop quoting it he called me a sinner and that I'm condemned for eternal hell it honestly takes too much effort to even get a response from them that isn't quoting text that doesn't answer the question, let alone to convert them, i then found the source of the problem he said the truth is subjective so he believed religion without question so i told him truth is objective, and gave an example of a cone that if u look at it from the side its a triangle and if u look at it from above/below its a circle, if u ask a person viewing it from the side and another from the bottom what do they see the answers will differ but they're both telling the truth, their objective truth he said nice example but truth is subjective and that was it, even when it wasn't a bible reply he didn't consider that my point had any validity even if he can't disprove it and i knew he just wasn't willing to listen to anything but the written script

[@The_True_Mx_Pink]

@@kyo_. Funnily enough, it's a sin for an imperfect being to judge another imperfect being like that, which he would know if he actually read the Bible.

[@Bazingler]

I find it absurd that people think humans are the main characters. Why are WE made in gods image? Why not squirrels? Rats could be made in gods image. What makes us think we’re so special? There’s a near infinite amount of planets and there’s probably quadrillions of life forms out there, so out of the quadrillions of beings in the universe, we’re the ones god chose to be the main ones? Nothing about us says that we’re special, the odds of us actually being made in gods image are so low it’s practically impossible. Also how come no one mentions how the Bible contradicts itself all the time? It says people tried to get to heaven by building a big tower, but god didn’t like that so he made everyone speak different languages. So that verse is saying heaven is in the clouds, but we flew up to the clouds and even built skyscrapers above the clouds and god didn’t seem to care. And how would we be speaking the same language in the first place? You’re telling me all humans from all over the world learned the exact same language? The way I see it, god either doesn’t exist, is dead, or left to go do something else.

[@The_True_Mx_Pink]

@@Bazingler I like to think God has multiple peoples who worship Him and the reason why so much shit has gone to said shit is because He has to hop between them like you would with a bunch of Clash-of-Clans reskins.

[@L117music]

The mistake people make and seem to never realize is that we are no longer children, but rationale adults who don't really care about other peoples imaginary friends.

[@thereisnosanctuary6184]

Ill pray for you

[@Christionem]

@@thereisnosanctuary6184 I'll sin for you

[@fastertrackcreative]

@@thereisnosanctuary6184 People say that and it's like "I'll talk to myself alone for you." Like, um, who is that helping exactly?

[@rootbeerfloathaspop3301]

apply cold water to the burned area

[@hudsonm360]

@@thereisnosanctuary6184 “I’ll talk to myself later because I’m so bent and brainwashed that I think it will have any effect on your life”

[@Seanwichh]

Literally there's a "christian's arguments against atheist" ad in this video lmfao

[@hollywoodsdestiny7919]

Lol got one too

[@mjolninja9358]

Sean Benz ulol ka gago putanginamo nakita kita humihingi ng delata sa aso puta bobo mo gago tanginamo talaga kunat ng muka mo kahapon muka kang itlog tas ngayon amoy gung-gong deputanga na

[@theuniverse.3080]

yeah i got one at the start and i just *s i g h e d.*

[@jaidev777]

Got one too

[@alt8791]

same

[@fuskefuske8251]

2:44 in my country we have a saying that roughly translates to "theif thinks every man steals" which basically means that people believe that everyone else thinks and acts the exact same way as themselves and sums up this point very well

[@Ruskad]

"coming out as atheist" is a strange phrase. I get the social meaning of admitting to not believe what others around you do. On the other hand, we don't automatically believe in a religion without being taught a religion (or making one up). "Atheism" is the more natural state and shouldn't require "coming out" to anyone.

[@Salsuero]

The traditional use of the phrase "coming out" shouldn't be required of anyone, regardless of its purpose. Nonetheless, we humans are not easy to communicate with when we're not in agreement with each other, so we reveal strongly discordant facts to those closest to us as if they were skeletons hidden in a closet that we've decided to finally emerge from, skeletons in tow. It is what it is... just a phrase that everyone can understand.

[@drewjanus4643]

I feel like agnosticism is the natural state of humans, because atheism still relies on assumptions just like all other religions.

[@jagger1008]

@@drewjanus4643 "Assuming an atheist thinks like you, but in reverse" is one of the topics he covered in the video. It's not the opposite of theism, it's "not-theism" (a-theism.) An atheist is someone who doesn't believe in a god or gods, that's it, there's no assumptions. Gnosticism pertains to what you know, so your average religious person is a "gnostic theist" because they believe in a god and "know" it, and the average atheist is an "agnostic atheist" because they don't believe and don't know. Agnostic on its own isn't a thing, it has to be paired with a believe or disbelief as well. Agnostic Atheist: The majority of atheists, because to be a gnostic atheist requires assumptions (as you said), they disbelieve in a god or gods (as opposed to believe there is not, which are very different), but they don't know since they can't disprove it Gnostic Atheist: Also known as "hard atheism," they believe there are no gods, and they know it. It requires assumptions because you have a burden of proof by making the claim "there are no gods for sure". Agnostic Theist: Typically deists, or people who are "socially theist" for the social aspects, people who think there is a god or gods, but they don't know Gnostic Theist: Average religious people, they think there's a god or gods, and they know it, AKA faith

[@Salsuero]

@@drewjanus4643 I do believe you are confused. You're comparing agnosticism with atheism as if they are in the same domain. They aren't. They are different. They don't rely on each other. You can be one or the other or both. Theism relies on the faith in the existence of a deity. Atheism doesn't rely on anything. That's it. It's wrong to say that atheists "believe" that there is no God. There is NO belief either way. There's a huge difference in the way it is worded. Saying "I don't believe" vs. saying "I believe there isn't" holds two entirely different implications. Atheists have no belief. There's no assumption. And it's certainly NOT comparable to religion in any way.

[@Evil_Teddy]

I feel it's very much a "Coming out" If I don't walk the "Christian" line my friends and family say I should, I lose all monetary support, nearly all what little contact I have with my mother, and will get the sideways glances of a lot of people. I'm atheist. I'm angry I've had this bullshit forced on my mind for decades and I want to tear off from it and people who associate with it. But these "good, moral people" do an awful lot of threatening.

[@rayredondo8160]

As a Christian currently questioning my beliefs, I like having actual intellectual discussion with people. I have a mental model of how most of the world works, but certain things don't add up yet. Whatever the case, it seems like there's more we don't know about, and because of that as well as other factors, I made my current decision. But it's up to every individual person. We are all called to be kind to one another whether by religion or by conscience, so I will never try to force my belief on anyone else. I will only do my best to explain my views once I understand them myself.

[@rayredondo8160]

(also, completely unrelated, I like this haircut personally, idk what anyone else is saying)

[@jasondean88888]

It's unfortunate when good people throw their support behind harmful ideas.

[@rayredondo8160]

@@jasondean88888 I personally think that Christianity, when viewed in the right light, is a helpful idea. The problem is when doctrine is twisted into demeaning other people. On the other hand, atheism is also a helpful idea, but only when in the right light. Some people will use atheism as a way to demean non-atheists, which is equally unhelpful. Whether or not you believe there is or isn't any particular god/God, it is helpful to practice whatever you do with respect to those who don't, and it's especially good to have a reason behind whatever you believe. I currently don't have much for either side, hence what I said at the beginning; I am "a Christian currently questioning my beliefs."

[@jasondean88888]

@Ray Redondo So, a couple things. I wasnt refering to Christianity, but instead the idea that it is totally acceptable for adults to be taken seriously as they go around professing the equivalent of "I believe in magic and I can offer you zero evidence, but I'm going to go home tonight and get on my knees and utter a magical spell in the hopes that I can convince the spirits to work on getting you to accept them into your soul...which I cant prive exists either." My problem isnt that they say this out loud; it's that society accepts this as totally normal....that this level of critical thinking is totally acceptable and is allowed and society will still consider you a serious adult and put you in charge of very dangerous things. If they could get to that belief with something remotely resembling a logical train of thought I would still disagree with them but at least they would be trying. The only people I've seen that even attempt to use logic are professional debaters and apologists. As far as "twisted doctrine"....why would anyone need to twist anything to fine wretchedness in the bible? Just to paraphrase 2 of my favorites "If you beat your slave and they dont die within a day or 2, thats fine and no punishment...because they are your property." or "Slaves obey your masters well, especially your Christian masters." or "I have not come to erase the old law, not one jot or tittle shall disappear." Or we could just go down the oppression of women road if you want those bible passages. The problem with religion isnt people taking it out of context...the problem is the people who DON"T take it out of context and who DON'T run it through their own moral filter while cherry picking the good bits that make them happy....they give cover to the fundamentalists who actually believe the bible when it tells you to stone any friend or family who trys to temp you from your faith. The problem is the critical thinking process of these people....they take these standards and go apply them to the rest of the world and we end up with people I wouldn't trust to mow my lawn thinking they know better than the literal world leading expert on X Y or Z. So, as I said, it's a shame when a decent person puts their support behind damaging ideas. The idea being that this level of critical thinking is normal and acceptable in any area of life. I am asked to "respect the beliefs" of people like you...why? People take a 2000 year old mythology, run it through their own filiter, constantly redefine passages to suit their own needs or match newly observed reality and have no evidence...even if your a good person...why should I not call out this process as unacceptable for arrive and truth? If you can use it, so can anyone else....and they do. And they have historically used it to justify anything and everything they want. I understand you're "questioning" so I'm maybe not the best person to run into right now. I never believed and have thought my entire family idiots since I was 8 and could half way think for myself. I have zero sympathy because I've never understood how someone can swallow this obvious line of shit at any age. If you think the bible is being twisted I am hard pressed to believe youve read it.

[@jasondean88888]

@Ray Redondo Also, your argument kind of falls into "religion is useful because it does good" That is a totally different question than if it is true, first of all. Second, there is no good action that a church takes that can not be taken by an atheist with a good heart. If we are going to start doing an inventory, then I'd throw the Crusades, the Inquisitions, and institutionally church protected child rape on the scale for starters and ask how much good work justified the countless suffering and death of 10s of millions in recent history. I would suggest just not going down that road since the only thing that actually matters at the end of the day is The Major Claim...which is the claim that the bible is true. That's an even bigger claim than jesus rising after 3 days. Nothing else matters. It's either all true or it's human-made mythology that is supportive of dangerous parts of human character. The good advice can be gotten elsewhere and removing the bible as a legit authority that can be pointed to in support of the bad bits is way past due.

[@edelgarddidnothingwrong7994]

I think the comment about this being how anyone who wants to argue with anyone about anything is super important: making assumptions about what another person believes does waste time and breed animosity in conversations. As a Christian who is disappointed in so many Christians' approach to talking to non-believers, I hope more people in general, but especially those types of Christians see this and learn from it. Thanks so much for this video!

[@Dadmarchis]

i was about to comment this!

[@Expyrial]

I absolutely agree

[@CS_Mango]

I disagree. Edelgard attempted something good but chose the war to force a change.

[@edelgarddidnothingwrong7994]

@@CS_Mango Woah, a comment about my name. I was not expecting that here. Ok, so, is Edelgard perfect? By no means, but this position is a much easier starting point for me than any other. I think, in the world of Fodlan, Edelgard had to fight a war to create change at all, and SHE had to be the one to start it to prevent TWSITD from having the war start on their terms. If your argument is that she should have talked it out with Claude and Dimitri, she could not afford to trust either of them during the school years. Claude, she didn't know well enough: he was an outsider who had recently come to Fodlan, and it isn't like Claude was ever particularly forthcoming on where he might stand in relation to Edelgard's cause. Dimitri, on the other hand, would never have been able to work with Edelgard because of TWSITD. That would either force her to try to fight TWSITD and the church simultaneously or, worse, Dimitri would be deceived into thinking Edelgard was part of the Tragedy of Duscur. Not to mention the question of whether Dimitri would have ever allied with Edelgard against the church in the first place. So, while I think it is regrettable that she wasn't able to simply talk the others into agreeing with her, I think war was inevitable from Fodlan's state at the start of the game. Feel free to discuss this if you want, I love talking about Three Houses' story. I don't want a flame war though.

[@CS_Mango]

@@edelgarddidnothingwrong7994 yeah... I'm not so deep into that lore since i tend to just binge watch anything that's just mildly interesting (I was tho). All I really remember is what I said and a bit more. The basics of that whole Edelgard VS rhea vs everyone else, with byleth in between. That comment tho... Too long, Sry won't read it. Perhaps I do if Im not half asleep.

[@SouperWy]

I’ve just learned it’s not worth arguing with people who are trying to convert me because they won’t ever listen.

[@cotos8009]

“Deep down you believe in god your just denying it” is the worst thing you can say that will make an atheist very mad very fast Btw I’m a atheist

[@minimanofiron2501]

deep down you believe in the flying spaghetti monster and Waluigi your just denying it.

[@lunarflare5503]

minimanofiron This one knows the truth

[@cotos8009]

minimanofiron shhhhhh don’t speak his name

[@janwelcastro250]

Who, Voldemo?... ohh..

[@cotos8009]

Janwel Castro you’ve doomed yourself

[@MsTashieMarie]

Your quarantine hair is adorable and everybody sucks

[@GeneticallyModifiedSkeptic]

Aww thank you 😊

[@farahm7801]

i though the same thing + now he kinda looks like alex from cosmic skeptic

[@kevinconrad6156]

@@farahm7801 Only if he dyed it black.

[@TheInevitron]

​@MexTaco710All you did was quote lines from a book. If you want to demonstrate that your preferred flavor of magic is real, you need more than words. Words can never be more than claims. Claims need to be supported by evidence. Like every other theist, you have none. Until the day that changes, you will never convince reasonable people.

[@funvidman]

@MexTaco710 I think no one is engaging with you because they simply don't believe you were ever an atheist.

[@chapo148]

I love how you are not a defensive person. You never attack others which makes me want to listen to you and evaluate your reasoning and arguments. I am a Christian. Thanks for being a human in the sense we were meant to be.

[@llwpeaches]

A reoccurring theme I've found when conversing with Christians, or observing their behavior, is a startling lack of empathy and a real control-centric, fear-based way of existing in the world. And I can't help but notice that these same behavioral and thought patterns, as well as others, are what one would typically observe in narcissism. But then the question for me becomes: Are narcissists attracted to Christian theism or does Christian theism breed narcissism?

[@Memoreism]

Like telling people they're going o he'll if they don't believe in God. That's not going to build a long-lasting conversion, that's just fear based.

[@mammonswallet8592]

@@Memoreismit’s like “God” has a grip on their throats Almost like a toxic relationship but all that energy into a fantasy man 😭

[@billpetersen298]

Good point.

[@DeshCanter]

Your assessment lacks any empathy toward Christians; at the same time you insist on being in control of every conversation and fear the reactions of all those Christians you’ve herded into your convenient holding pens. We agree that there’s a degree of narcissism, while we disagree on where its center is.

[@chuckm1961]

I don’t think I’ve ever met an atheist who was not arrogant about their perceived intellectual superiority over anyone with any religious belief.

[@inkdreaper874]

As an Atheist, I've learned not to try convert people to your view. Just have a sensible conversation with people. Surprisingly enough, my wife was a Christian and I was an Atheist, even after we got married. We never argued about it or anything, but sometimes we would just sit and talk about our views. One day, she came home from work and just said "you know what? You're right. I don't see any reason to believe that there is a god, especially the Christian god." She hasn't labeled herself as an Atheist. She says, like a lot of Atheists, there isn't a name for someone who doesn't believe in unicorns.

[@shaekershaw3036]

Your wife phrased that better than I would’ve ever thought of. ‘There’s not a name for people who don’t believe in unicorns’ Love that. Definitely using it (credit to your wife whoever she is)

[@eugenebelford9087]

"there isn't a name for someone who doesn't believe in unicorns." Perfectly phrased! I'll remember that. 👍

[@gabrote42]

Good policy in general. Mad respects

[@forickgrimaldus8301]

Perhaps she is more Agnostic, people tend to confuse the 2

[@ForumLight]

The mistake people make when trying to convert anyone: not knowing God's Word: thinking they are the ones that save people. *_I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase. So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase._* 1 Corinthians 3:6-7 *_But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God._* John 1:12-13 *_Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again. The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit._* John 3:7-8 *_So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God._* Romans 10:17 People need to stop believing the false claim that they saved themselves by making a decision while they were still spiritually dead (unsaved) and that's what saved them. False teachings: "I gave the increase by choosing to believe.." "It was my will that I was born again, not God's" "I know where it came from that people are born of the Spirit - they were spiritually dead but chose to believe" "Faith comes from hearing and hearing comes from my decision to believe when I was spiritually dead" Some will then falsely claim this means God decided before you were born if you're going to heaven or heII - but we don't know WHEN it is that God saves a person - could be because many others pray for them. So let God be God and just keep preaching the gospel to everyone, as commanded, with grace and truth.

[@markusdammasch9108]

I’m a devout Christian Drew, and I love your rational reasoning - unlike many, I enjoy listening to and understanding others people’s points of view - very good video.

[@iMidnightStorm]

Good on ya', pal.

[@xanthmardon584]

I like to think you are one of the more common type of christians. In my experience as an atheist, a vast majority of christians are very nice and understanding with an annoying few being the exact people portrayed in this video and some who are even worse.

[@iMidnightStorm]

I wouldn't say few, I interact with a lot of Christians that act exactly as Drew describes in this video.

[@carterheekin1974]

i guess it depends on what circle or group you end up with.

[@mr.e8282]

@@__Luke__ I get where you're coming from. But maybe it's not so much a stereotype as it is a retelling of personal experience. In the case of my own, I have met few & far between the genuine Christian that honors his own beliefs w/o trying to push his understanding of life onto others. How many times have I been approached by Christians wearing practiced smiles, dressed neatly w/ open hands offering something for free; Only to find they only behave & dress that way when they're inviting you into their church. Like a child bitten each time he sees a dog learns to be afraid of them, many of us have learned to be skeptical of smiling Christians making friendly claims. The thing is, your Christian brothers have already tread here, many many times. For you to expect to be greeted w/o skepticism, carrying the same banner that those before you did, wearing the same tone of indignation, & w/ the same claim of friendly intent... Maybe you're asking too much.

[@benb1738]

As a Christian who has done his fair share of evangelism, I 100% agree. Arguing gets nowhere if you don't listen to one another. Thank you :)

[@efu2046]

I need to Google "Evangelism" because i thought it's something like Neon Genesis Evangelion lol

[@efu2046]

@slothkingn1 eyy, this guy gets it

[@johncopsey8500]

slothkingn1 are you saying that if a religion is “cool enough” you might consider converting to it?

[@johncopsey8500]

slothkingn1 but that’s not at all the point of conversion, finding the Bible boring is just a subjective opinion and while I will admit finding the Bible interesting would most likely make you more open to Christianity it ultimately has no large part in being a Christian, if you want a good story and not a theological answer to the universe you’re probably better off looking elsewhere. Sorry if that came off sort of argumentative, I was just confused why you seemed to be looking for interesting story in a book that is not setting out to accomplish that goal of one, although in my personal opinion I find some of the stories of the Bible quite riveting though I know that’s just my opinion.

[@johncopsey8500]

slothkingn1 and sorry about the long response, I don’t really have anything to do while waiting for liturgy to start

[@Hi_Im_Akward]

As an athiest I approve of this video. People have tried to convert me and convice me I am actually religious when I'm not a lot. I tend not to talk about my athism because in general I don't find it relevant or even a predominant part of my life. But nothing is more infuriating than having assumptions and accusations thrown at me. My favorite is my "obvious lack of morals" because I don't have anyone to answer to. And ngl I find it incredibly annoying when people take personal offense to me being an athiest. I don't vocalize my offense to you thinking I deserve an eternity of hellfire (thats just a horrible thing to believe in general like wtf). But I get people being like "well I believe in xyz so don't treat on my beliefs ". Idk I think its wrong in general go convert people anyways, I'm not trying to convert you. I'm just letting my beliefs and identity known when its relvent to the conversation.

[@sunriseoath]

Do you believe your friends and family are conscious? This is fundamentally something you believe by faith, and justifiably so. It accords well with your experience of what "conscious" means, and models your reality appropriately. The same applies to Christians! So this is all to say, I believe you are justified in your atheism and that you have good reasons for being an atheist. But I contend that if you can have faith that your loved ones are conscious, you can also have faith that the processes of the world around you are conscious.

[@sunriseoath]

@@Rizz407 Pushy, maybe! But ignorant, I challenge this. I accept the ontology of atheists. I was an atheist til four months ago, and I am still fluent in the atheist worldview.

[@sunriseoath]

@@Rizz407 You don't have to. You are not a Christian for what I presume to be very good reasons.

[@flyingstapler1241]

@@sunriseoath It's the same as how people believe dogs are conscious (there is evidence dogs exist and we can get their reactions), but don't believe that Bigfoot exists because nobody has concrete evidence. Your analogy about consciousness isn't remotely the same because at least one has proof that we see in daily life.

[@sunriseoath]

@@flyingstapler1241 You have no proof about the minds of dogs, any more than you have proof of Bigfoot. Instead, in both cases you have evidence consistent with the model that dogs are conscious and Bigfoot exists. The key insight is that we have first hand physical proof of humans, but not of people. The latter is a form that can only be proven to oneself spiritually, whether that "one" is an individual subject or a society at large.

[@ShionOfRed]

I am a practicing Eastern Orthodox Christian. One of my best friends is a hardcore atheist. This is how our friendship functions and it's definitely one of the most meaningful friendships we have. We don't try to convert one another, but learn from one another and try to understand the other side. Occasionally we even debate our beliefs, but at the end of the day, we still respect each other's thoughts and support each other's decisions ☦⚛

[@phantom2615]

That's sick dude, you both sound like cool people

[@DailyMynt]

This how things should be. Unfortunately this is not how most people are. Having friendly discussions and remaining in a good relationship afterwards. I wish more people both with politics and religion could do this.

[@Katie-The-Bug]

The lil cross and atom you put at the end makes your comment so cute.

[@exmormonroverpaula2319]

ShionOfRed, that sounds great and I wish more people would have that kind of respect for people with differing beliefs. But it leaves me curious as to why you are a Christian.

[@ShionOfRed]

​@@exmormonroverpaula2319 I am a Christian for varying reasons. Fair warning, my explanation isn't short. Looking back to myself as a child, I was a neo-pagan raised in a Mormon household. I didn't worship gods that I could name, just nameless bodies that I could interact with now and again. I would offer them "sacrifices" (primarily stuffed animals and Barbies, since that's all I had). I distinctly remember, as a child no older than 7, wanting to sacrifice goats and sheep to these unnamed gods and bathe and drink their blood. I would look at cow and think about how I could steal one to kill it without anyone noticing. By offering these childish sacrifices, things would be better for a while, and then get worse. Up until late middle school, I believed in these gods side-by-side with God (which, according to the Orthodox faith, isn't entirely wrong). My behaviour was downright violent. I was often in detention for violence and defiance. And things weren't getting better; they were getting much, much worse. I converted to Evangelical Protestantism in the summer of 2012 after what I would describe as an encounter with God. Nothing like, "I was in a bad place so I converted." For me, I didn't see a need to change and I didn't really want to. I was content with where I was. I actually enjoyed it; I had power and I wanted to keep it. Of all places, I converted at a Bible camp my parents had sent me to that summer. It wasn't during anything special or fantastic; just singing campfire songs. I was overwhelmed by the Holy Spirit and I excused myself to the bathroom. I cried out to God and repented the first time. I fully rejected the nameless gods I worshipped and devoted my life to Christ. It was like a light switch. My teachers could hardly believe that the kid who was sent to detention at least once a week for violence, never did their homework, and would scream obscenities... became one of the most well behaved students in the class and almost a straight A student. Other occurrences happened throughout my Christian life, such as knowing a car crash would occur, to having the urge to pray and the next day your coworker comes and tells you about someone trying to break into their house but failed. Or even knowing that someone needs your prayers and it turns out someone close to them has died. Electric candles lighting randomly in front of my icons and it turns out that person is going through a very rough time. Earlier this year I converted to Eastern Orthodoxy. And strange things started happening, from venerating in my sleep to having dreams of baptism. I knew Orthodox concepts before ever hearing about them. And, just like the last time, I didn't really feel the need to convert; I was content with where I was. I could continue ignoring Church Tradition and just live my life the way I wanted. But just as before, I felt the presence Holy Spirit and I knew I couldn't run from the truth anymore. I am not a Christian simply because of faith and belief. Yes, I do believe God is present and that He is the Supreme Lord, the God Most High. I have faith that God is there. But I am also a Christian because I have experienced the spiritual (particularly demonic) world in a very personal way throughout my life. After leaving my neo-pagan ways behind I became an entirely new person, someone almost completely unrecognizable. I've predicted and known about things that I shouldn't have. I can't justify all of this to coincidence.

[@aeon8448]

Honestly, religion was ruined for me because of the people of older generations they think using the bible not their heads. That's why I really appreciate religious people who keep an open mind and understand others who doesn't have the beliefs as them.

[@gaijinkuri684]

Very much this!

[@aeon8448]

I was religious before but after i came out as bisexual to my religious grandmother who was the only one in my family who i could trust the most and the most understanding, all she said with an angry/disappointed face was that it was wrong and that she'll pray for me. That really hurt me and i was never as religious as i was before. I still believe in God but I just can't look at Christianity the same way again.

[@Generic_Gaming_Channel]

Yeah I give this a yeah

[@Generic_Gaming_Channel]

@@aeon8448 I give you a yeah

[@aeon8448]

@Verserer Gred Yes, since I was raised in a religious family it's not that easy for me to just let go of believing in God.

[@avz1865]

I love how this can subtly be taken as a message to atheists about engaging with the religious.

[@brookeboland9711]

lol, you think so? atheists aren't known for being zealots, or stubborn in their beliefs, or even unreasonable in the face of facts, they're also not known for jumping straight to being offended by theist ideas and bullying, degrading, disregarding, devaluing or oppressively harassing others for daring to have a different belief set or lack of one.

[@thecrazyotaku1013]

Very True! Just because someone is theist doesn't mean they're stupid and should be treated like lesser.

[@RinoMacEight]

You are correct. Over the years of learning more about atheism vs. theism, I have become more adamant and outspoken of atheism. People who believe in the supernatural have outdated worldviews and are standing in the way of progression. A lot of theists have a tendency to turn hateful and violent against those who do not believe their fantasy (I have been called so many things by creationists, putting it here might get me flagged). Religion is like the coal industry: sure, it got us where we are now, but we most certainly know that we now have better technology and don't need it anymore. I am not saying, religion should be forbidden or persecuted, and that the majority are doing bad things. If you or anyone else wants to believe in the giant man in the sky and want to spend some time with people on Sunday singing songs about him, that's fine. But when these people try to influence modern politics, economics and ethics, we have a problem - because relgious fantasies have no place in rational decision making and in how we run our societies.

[@forickgrimaldus8301]

@@thecrazyotaku1013 just look at what happened to the USSR, abuse of Religious people especially Hebrews and they later had to losen these laws because they weren't effective at forcing people to be Atheists, just because one is Athiest doesn't mean one is smarter, more reasonable nor more moral than anyone.

[@forickgrimaldus8301]

@@RinoMacEight I disagree, Religion is an ever changing aspect of Humanity, Christianity for example has little in Common with its 1st Century version, Old Pagan rituals and Religions are being recreated into Neo Pagan Religions, Religion may grow old, it may change faces but IMO Religion can never be outdated as it has changed with the times. Athiesm is becoming more accepted and growing but IMO that doesn't mean Religion is ending in the world.

[@zachary5845]

Man, I don't think I could ever tell my family I don't believe in Christianity anymore. I haven't believed in years but I'm too afraid to tell them.

[@dontworryboutit2959]

I tested how they’d react by telling them I’m socialist (they’re heavy conservative) and after that decided it’s best I just wait a minute to drop that bomb

[@Helena-me6mp]

@@dontworryboutit2959 Isnt that testing a bomb with another bomb?

[@vmk2466]

@@Helena-me6mponly if you are insane enough to think ideological differences make normal interaction impossible

[@Helena-me6mp]

@@vmk2466 It definitely can? Isnt that completely and blatantly obvious? Some people cannot be argued with, and arguing only exists because of a difference in opinion.

[@vmk2466]

@@Helena-me6mp you wholeheartedly believe that thinking the world should work differently to someone else would make you unable to interact with them like a normal person?

[@NoNo-xh7ru]

One of the most infuriating exchanges when arguing with a theist: "I live my life the way I want because I don't think there's a heaven so I'm not gonna waste my time praying to no one" "So you want to go to hell?" It's like if I told you that every Thursday night you have to rub your big toe or a unicorn will impale you. Then when you say no, there's no such thing as unicorns, I say, "so you want a unicorn to impale you" I don't want to go to hell. I just don't think there's a hell to send me to. Not to mention, they always say this after I bring up how God should accept all people as long as they loved a good life where they helped others. For some reason, that seems to really jams the gears in their head.

[@DaddyAZTL]

Whats a good life? Why is helping others "Good"? '

[@NoNo-xh7ru]

AZTL A good life is one where you help others. And helping others is good because your helping them. That's as simple as it gets. You'd want others to help you so others would want you to help them. Now are you going to answer *my* question or will that be all?

[@DaddyAZTL]

@@NoNo-xh7ru again why is helping others a good thing? We know its good but why is it good? If a lion can kill anothers cubs and its not evil why is it evil for me to kill another ? Why is murder evil if its just part of nature? If we evolved from monkeys and they kill each other why is it bad or evil for humans to do such a thing? and you assume i would want others to help me and if its good for sake of being good there must be a standard of Goodness out there where does this standard come from if not God?

[@NoNo-xh7ru]

AZTL Two words: fucking biology. People that murdered their whole tribe ended up dying out and those that didn't lived. That's how we ended up with our morals. It happened long before a book told us how we should think. And we didn't evolve from monkeys, we share a common ancestor but if we had evolved from monkeys then all monkeys would have evolved and their would be none left. In conclusion, the standard of morality was created by an evolutionary need and is part of our natural instincts to form bonds with other people. If we had to wait for a book to teach us that we would have never made it this far

[@NoNo-xh7ru]

AZTL that still doesn't answer the question I've presented though. This is a different discussion. So let's say I follow the Bible's version of morality but am an atheist, what happens?

[@GumSkyloard]

Quarantine Drew looks sooooo much younger! He kinds looks like James from TheOdd1sOut-

[@illdie314]

Damn he does

[@MrPogee]

Yeah, he does look good with this haircut. I hope he keeps it.

[@TheKrossRoads]

For a minute, I thought he was just reposting an older video. He does look younger.

[@donsample1002]

I think he's starting to look like Cosmic Sceptic's long lost brother.

[@theuniverse.3080]

i'm new here but i'm so glad someone agrees he looks like james. he's like the calmer version 🤣.

[@lionpazam]

So I myself am an atheist. But my entire friend group is full of people who believe in god, which yeah I know is kinda weird, but I am so so so lucky to have them as my friends. We try to stay away from the topic of religion, no trying to convert or anything. And whenever we do get onto the topic of religion we don’t argue, we just talk through our viewpoints, and why we view it that way, and it has shown me reasons why people are religous, and has helped me understand/respect their religion more than previous. So glad they’re my friends

[@shrekiscool4743]

Same I have a ton of Christian friends and friends with totally different political beliefs and I'm so grateful to have them

[@melancholia-13.]

Same with me… I love my friends and I have a huge friend group where everyone is christian except me. I am too afraid to tell them I am atheist because I don’t want anything to change between us.

[@SillyCar31]

same byt no one knows that im an atheist except for my one and only friend

[@SpaveFrostKing]

Of all people discussing religion (on one side or the other) you come across as having the most empathy for the other side. It's refreshing.

[@the_polish_prince8966]

@Trolltician Damn bro is there something you need to talk about?

[@elim.4204]

@@the_polish_prince8966 the guy's name has troll in it username checks out