Gigacasting // Super Vacuum, Argon Injection, Die Coatings, Thermal Regulation

[@dr-k1667]

Perfect video for Q4 earnings day for Tesla. This is the "under the hood" type of understanding that helps us better understand how and why Tesla is able to do what they are doing that effects their bottom line. Thanks so much for this!

[@cbmusgrave]

Gigacast precision thermal control during casting and alloy innovation that doesn't require annealing significantly limits warp or other processes that limit dimensional precision - thus, basically no need for datums. I also expect they use an optical inspection system that can check each part in 3-D and maybe an x-ray system to check for internal morphology, like voids, similar to how airlines check for cracks in structural components. Great video Jordan - much appreciated!

[@thelimitingfactor]

🤜🤛

[@oof_Dad]

Would it be more accurate to say the no additional reference datums need to be machined as the features in the casting are accurate enough to be the reference point for future steps? A datum is simply a feature that you decide to reference other features from when measuring. Any part that has features to measure has datums by definition. What I think is implied is the casting is precise enough out of the die that the step of machining more features (which are typically critical, high tolerance, and then become datums for measurement) can be skipped.

[@davidwilkie9551]

FSD based programme for Casting Optical System?

[@jamesowens7176]

@@oof_Dad I think you're absolutely correct. For a large component you might have a bolt pattern with fairly large tolerances that could combine to fairly large overall variation at the assembly level. Typically we'd avoid having to keep a super-tight tolerance on the individual holes and the overall pattern by making just one hole a super-tight tolernace in each part, so the parts are assured to mate precisely, minimizing tolerance stack-up in the whole assembly. However, if it's cheap enough to make all the tolerances that tight, it still provides a better overall scenario. But that's *really* hard to do with castings!

[@robertdevereaux8545]

,

[@JoelSapp]

Excellent job Jordan. Looking forward to the cybertruck giga casting video. Will be keenly interested in how the exoskeleton mates with the (structural) battery pack too.

[@JoelSapp]

Also we’d love to hear about you coming back to America.

[@thelimitingfactor]

Yeah man! So much to cover 🤠. I need to give my year 2 update video plus I've been keeping track of everything that happened with batteries in the last quarter, and then of course the Tesla earnings call is coming up. It's a target rich environment, lol.

[@cbmusgrave]

I've been wondering that too and so awaiting Jordan's video with bated breath!

[@kstaxman2]

The quality and detail you provide are amazing. Thanks for your insightful and detailed analysis. It's your love of your craft that puts you head and shoulders above the rest.

[@gi.form2151]

Great video! Less processing, less cost. Targeting an as cast process would lead to a low cost part. Following the casting process you normally trim away supporting structure that feeds the casting( the "biscuit") and all the overflows (small blocks around the perimeter of the casting) that help collect trapped air in the casting as its flushed it out. This scrap material can then be recycled. Ideally you want to minimize machining since its adds cost/cycle time. Cored holes and self tapping fasteners can be used to create fix points with other components. If you can avoid machining, this lowers cost. As for datums, you can use cast surfaces to create 3 separate pads to form a triangle across part and create a plane that helps set the part. A hole and slot will orient. This is the traditional way to check a part. The ability to 3D scan a part could lead to the "no datums comment". These are amazing castings for sure. Very impressive! Thanks for your videos!

[@linmal2242]

Excellent comment !

[@martylawson1638]

Another detail is that the consistently high elongation they're getting on the parts probably lets them use thread forming screws. So a cast hole is all that's needed to bolt to nearby assemblies. The part trimming could use a custom shearing die. You see them in forging production lines.

[@brucec954]

I can see why in the past, big castings like these were not used for auto's as it would have taken a lot of expensive trial and error to get the flow and cooling right so won't warp. With advanced computer modeling, should be much less trial and error. On the other hand, giant cast steel locomotive frames with integral cylinders were being made 100 years ago without computers which shows how much skill they had.

[@debiannebalmer8166]

It’s all about the cooling system used.

[@concinnus]

Partly skill, partly that steel has less than half the expansion coeff and cools much more slowly. Especially in a sand mold.

[@freddielewis2390]

I've recently started learning how to MIG weld. The part about using Argon in the metal process, explains why Argon is used as a shielding gas in MIG welding. Excellent stuff Jordan.

[@thelimitingfactor]

Oh cool! Everything is connected. Love those cross-disciplinary insights

[@thomastercheck2968]

Great information Jordan. I really like the way you dive into the process and explain it very well. So much information and it is easy to get lost in it all. Very interesting stuff👍

[@jebber411]

Great video! Additional flux and wetting agents added to the molten aluminum would also help with cool cracking in the die.

[@vancethefirst]

Hurray! It makes me happy when I see a video of yours pop up! Thanks!

[@thedownwardmachine]

I’m very excited about the upcoming gigacasting/exoskeleton video!

[@whiteknives]

Thanks for your hard work Jordan!

[@thelimitingfactor]

🤜🤛🤠

[@w0ttheh3ll]

If you want to see a mild example of cold shut, take a look at your (or somebody else's) collection of Lego bricks (injection molding plastic is very similar to high pressure die casting in principle). Most parts that have at least one hole will show a line where the fronts of molten plastic met.

[@thelimitingfactor]

Ha! I'll have to look for that!

[@rb8049]

The first thing when Tesla announced HPDC I thought it would be good to use vacuum pumps. Your images confirm.

[@NickGobin]

Great job getting this video out before earnings today Jordan! Excellent material as always.

[@rogerfroud300]

It may be thatTesla uses special self tapping fasteners or avoids using threads in the casting altogether.

[@CKBrew]

Looking forward to the next cybetruck casting video!!!

[@Mrbfgray]

Dang it how'd I miss this earlier.......already know it's going to be very interesting before starting.

[@shouxunji5570]

Thanks for intruduction of our research paper. A lot diffierent considerations need to be taken care when producing extreme large castings.

[@thelimitingfactor]

Hey man! Thanks for stopping by. That was a great paper - super useful!

[@markkoons7488]

This is the first of your gigacasting video series I've happened upon. I liked it and have subscribed. Regardless whether the other videos cover the subject, I'm eager to learn more about Tesla's alloy.

[@thelimitingfactor]

The alloy video is worth a watch 🤠 Thanks for stopping by!

[@jamesengland7461]

Excellent video!

[@calibaba2739]

Looking forward to see the Cybertruck gigapress speculations. I don’t see anyone talk about it.

[@Mari0o0o]

Can’t wait for the next video!

[@RacefanPat68]

I saw somewhere that the new machines next to giga casting machines are stamping machines. I gather that all the non essential tails are able to be, (are) sheared off in one stomp! In Shanghai video you see the robot love the dirty one in to the right, and clean one on the conveyer to the left.

[@calicops951]

Thanks Morgan! 🥰

[@andymacleod2365]

If you are machining a part then the dimensions between holes are usually taken from a datum this can be a machined hole, which would match with the Giga-casting only being fettled

[@cbmusgrave]

Yes, if holes are cast in precisely where they need to be due to the lack of warp, then no need to reference their position wrt a datum. Also makes it easy for a CNC to just machine without adjustments part-by-part because of variable dimensions.

[@fityfive]

Your channel is so high quality, it's such a gift to the world. Thank you for everything!!!!

[@johnthomas5806]

Must take alot of your time to research this information...thanks

[@Finlaymacnab]

Interesting! Thanks for this.

[@larryteslaspacexboringlawr739]

looking forward to quarterly earnings reports and your video analysis

[@ranjansahu11]

High pressure die cast parts have surfaces that are smooth finish - as compared to simple castings- to an extent that they can be used as datums without machining, if used for mounting static parts 0- such as other body parts. however, machining is required for interfaces with moving or rotating parts.

[@thelimitingfactor]

Great insight thanks!

[@zilogfan]

Awesome video!!!

[@thelimitingfactor]

Glad you enjoyed it! 😀

[@teddygreene2000]

Great video. Many thanks

[@wyattboynton3129]

Always 100 Mr. G!

[@elyssalanehome8840]

I have a number of concerns of the processes you discussed, but only two of them stand out as I write this. First is the vacuum technology. I do agree that doping the molten alloy with Ar is (MAY be. I have to take it on faith that this is a proven methodology) an effective way to strip unwanted H+ from the mix. It will, of course, have to be a mechanical bond, as Ar is a noble gas. At any rate, such a process can be effective iff the vacuum occurs within the poured "pot" as well as the mold itself. But how much time is needed for the vacuum to pull all the gas out? How 'tight' a vacuum can occur in that entire package...pour after pour after pour? Such details are important to learn if an outsider (you, me and the others reading this) is to have confidence in its efficacy...otherwise, we're just taking things on faith. Second is that Mazola. Molten Al-alloy not only is YOWZA-hotter than your average skillet surface, it is a supremely reactive substance. I shake my head at what happens when it comes into contact with a bog-standard veggie oil - how does turning that lubricant into a nastily-carbonized substance instantly incorporated into the molten metal not 100% destroy the metal's purity and usefulness? Are we sure the lubricant isn't some fancy Fluoromagical space-age substance?

[@TheEvilmooseofdoom]

Unless you're an insider or a customer for a gigapress I don't know if some of the details you want are going to be easy to find out. You might have to take some of it on faith.

[@elyssalanehome8840]

@@TheEvilmooseofdoom The reason I am going to disagree with your response is that I think we needn't ask this of Tesla or Idra or LK, but of Jordan. It is HE who suggests - very, very strongly suggests - that it is merely that insanely inexpensive vegetable oil that is the Magic Juice solving the corrosive effect of molten aluminum on those multi-million dollar dies. I am contradicting his statement by averring Wesson would compound, not solve, the problem.

[@ZipZoomZip]

If there is a vacuum in the die mold when the aluminum is injected, there wouldn't be any oxygen present for the oil to carbonize. The vegetable oil is likely heated and misted using high pressure air into a very thin layer before the vacuum is pulled. It wouldn't take much oil at all. The mold is then cooled before air is introduced.

[@thelimitingfactor]

The time you spent crafting a lot of that, you could have just looked it up rather than taking it on faith. I provided the research paper on vacuum casting and it's common in the industry. Same goes for argon or nitrogen gas bubbling (quick google search will make the efficacy clear). Not sure on the vegetable oil. But, again, I didn't have to dig deep to find this. If the industry uses its and trusts it, it's good enough for me. There are a lot of different types of die lubricants. Look it up. I'm here as a starting point for you. You shouldn't trust me nor do I want you to. The point here isn't to hand down the gospel of Jordan, but to get people to think and be curious.

[@elyssalanehome8840]

@@thelimitingfactor Fair points, and I ==>do

[@johnthomas5806]

So, talking to Monroe and associates would give you a chance to find out if the end product of casting leaves areas that need machining or not, as they look at all the parts going into the production of these cars..

[@alanmay7929]

The castings will always needs some sort of machining doesn’t matter how precise they are, also the castings needs to be checked/scanned for faults

[@MAESTROLIDER]

Thanks for the video. I am an engineer developer of electric buses)

[@brandoYT]

iDra the leader in making these casting machines.

[@randolphtorres4172]

THANKSGIVING

[@concertautist4474]

Superb.

[@polkijain97]

Thanks for sharing this!

[@shiump]

Thanks!

[@thelimitingfactor]

🤜🤛

[@markrowland1366]

Metal casting has great history. The word for removing flash or parts that allowed molten metal in and gas out, is fettling. The person doing this is a fettler.

[@thelimitingfactor]

Ha! Interesting

[@juansilva851]

great job

[@VenturiLife]

The aluminium alloy used by Tesla (in Giga Press casting) is apparently close to the well-known aluminum alloy AA386. This alloy has a nominal silicon content of 8.5%. This apparently makes it more suitable for moulding and doesn't require additional heat treatment, as it is relatively tough. It offers good corrosion resistance.

[@thelimitingfactor]

See my 'Alloy' video ;)

[@MrFoxRobert]

Thank you!

[@thelimitingfactor]

Sure thing buddy!

[@ericy.2108]

6:43 The Alien Dreadnought feeds on 70kg metal pancakes !

[@thelimitingfactor]

nom nom nom!

[@michelcote]

Casting threads would complexify the mold but it maybe worth it, maybe it's simple holes forpass trough bolt or pressed-in inserts. You can get away without datum by using exising features as datum. This could work well. Anyways you need something to align part in the frame. You need something to position fixations holes relative to the front one. Those holes could very well be the datums.

[@ronblack7870]

doing threads in the tool is complicated. you either need an unscrewing mechanism or some kind of collapsing core in order to release the part. also it may take longer to cool in that area .the mechanism can make the tool much bigger . all these issues increases cycle time . plus it increases scrap rate.

[@PasDeMD]

Is it possible to cast screw holes on steel molds? I don't get how you'd release it from the mold since the mold would at that point be a screw itself.

[@thelimitingfactor]

🔥 An excellent point...so excellent that I feel stupid for not including it, lol

[@briandolbec37]

Great job as usual... My question is, have you come across why they send out rejects for recycling rather than chopping them up locally and re-using it directly in the melting pots? I would think having their own recycling capability would have been a great cost savings considering the amount we have seen coming out of Texas.

[@alanmay7929]

It might with the time affect the quality of the newest made parts, the recycling must made new strictly controlled materials/alloy.

[@jamesengland7461]

Perhaps they're simply designing to not need to recycle.

[@briandolbec37]

@@alanmay7929 The alloy is 100% the same.

[@briandolbec37]

@@jamesengland7461 Possible, but there will always be some scrap. The button and some other trimmings. It might be possible that the normal scrap rate is too low to recycle in-house efficiently. It might also be that the melting pot feeder requires it to use same size ingots. So requires them to be melted down and made into ingots again.

[@thelimitingfactor]

Not sure! Could be as simple as having the equipment to chop/melt or more complex, like the oil/oxygen requires extra treament rather than just a re-melt

[@BigBoneESB]

Very informative video Jordan, thanks, makes me pumped for todays Cybertruck update! Some still think it's gonna be indestructible cause it's stainless steel, but that's just the so-called exoskeleton, the entire lower body will be cast aluminum + structural 4680, right? So if that part meets salt water etc. it'll have regular wear and tear. Do you think there will be issues where steel meets aluminum on the truck due to the different properties of the two? Say expansion and contraction during extreme heat or cold, torsional forces or accidents etc.? Will they weld the steel onto the aluminum casts or something will be between them? Plenty of interesting structural questions.

[@thelimitingfactor]

Yup on the first paragraph! I have a video coming on this. Galvanic corrosion issues can be worked around, just like they have with the other vehicles. No expansion issues. Not sure how they'll marry them.

[@alanmay7929]

The whole lower body won’t be just aluminum, it will have steel reinforcement structures, you don’t want to tow 10,000lbs attached to an aluminum chassis/part lol….

[@morrisg]

@@thelimitingfactor Usually adhesives are used to bond dissimilar metals like aluminum and steel. Non-conductive adhesives would solve the galvanic corrosion issues.

[@ghostindamachine]

Awesome information :)

[@KenLord]

I have no idea what I'm talking about, but maybe they can get around using datums for precisely grabbing the parts during assembly, by crudely setting the part into a jig that precisely aligns the part by gravity, and then consistently / precisely pick up the part for assembly from there.

[@RyanGaroogian]

Great video as always I am just anxious to see some of these Model Y's get produced at Austin and then tear downs being performed.

[@switzerland]

I once read that major advances in society, manufacturing and science can be traced back to improvements in vacuum technology.

[@marlbankian]

Interesting

[@Clark-Mills]

Casting comes out of the GigaPress, gets placed into a cooling bath, then placed into the trimming machine. This has been shown on several YT videos though they edit out the bath for some reason.

[@grahammonk8013]

Really? There is a very commonly shown video which quite clearly shows a casting removed from the machine, and then placed on a surface. I would thought if a cooling bath *was* used, there would be no intermediate stop. Can you provide a link showing the trimming at least?

[@Clark-Mills]

@@grahammonk8013 kzbin.info/www/bejne/r4DCd3-Haa2ljdE You will need to ignore their misleading editing and look at the layout. 0:14 Left: Bath empty with rack raised, Right: Trimmer unit occupied 0:19 Left: Bath loaded with rack submerged, Right: Trimmer unloaded Sequence: Cast -> Quench/Cool -> Trim. You need to look closely at the video and realise that it's been edited cleverly. Look at the casting pre-post-trim. Look at the trimmer and bath occupancy. Look at the big red sliding safety door that appears out of nowhere. I've seen the casting dripping in some clips. I've seen the trimmer unit labeled in other clips though it's fairly obvious that the trimming has been done by the time the casting is placed on the conveyor. HTH... Cheers... Clark (NZ)

[@thelimitingfactor]

A good point, that's something I could have added to the video.

[@entspannter_hase]

Amazing work Jordan! Does you not saying "... And I hope will eventually allow me to do this full time" mean that you indeed went full time or that you scrapped the idea?

[@thelimitingfactor]

I recorded the audio just before I left NZ 🤠. It will be corrected int he next video.

[@entspannter_hase]

@@thelimitingfactor Awwwww shit I was hoping for some big news 😃 enjoy your trip! Do you have direct Lithium extraction on your radar for a video or series? I think there'd be a lot to talk about and a lot for all of us to learn

[@abowden556]

This is really interesting! Even if these techniques obviously are in no way unique, they are still cool to learn about and useful. I wonder what cool tricks they use that we don't know about...

[@dougwedel9484]

This biscuit, shown at 9:36, what stops the shape of this biscuit from being a part that can be used, instead of becoming waste? Same as the runners, there should be simple small parts which can be roughly the size and shape of these runners, so instead of cutting out waste, these biscuits and runners would be cut off of the giga casting and be useful parts instead of wasted material that needs to be melted down and reused. So that would eliminate waste and get these smaller parts technically for free.

[@Digital-Dan]

There was a report in recent days of a large heap of scrap aluminum castings in a scrap yard near Tesla Fremont recently. Perhaps the process is not yet perfected?

[@TheEvilmooseofdoom]

Lots of dialing in goes on.

[@thelimitingfactor]

There's always room for improvement. Particularly if you have idle employees waiting for a ramp.

[@rexprangnell6815]

What was the variables using the argon injection with the vacuum system compared too not using both , or did I miss it

[@pauldesi]

Thoughts on repairability? Will these master parts increase the number of cars that are totaled out in minor accidents? If not, how would a casting like this be repaired or replaced?

[@thelimitingfactor]

I did a video on this

[@simpleton8148]

Can you do a deep dive on the economics of Hydrogen and why not use it to generate electricity for the grid maybe instead of in the car. I’m confused on hydrogen to electricity. Ppl spent lots of money developing this. Is it something for mars colony ? Lots of questions here.

[@AllYouWantAndMore]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe LK owns IDRA.

[@thelimitingfactor]

Correct

[@gacherumburu9958]

👍

[@rare_wubbox360]

Brilliant Jordan! Just brilliant👍🇳🇴

[@jasonburbank2047]

Great video! I learned a lot.

[@imaro2358]

Jordan, would love to get your thoughts on the battery form factor and chemistry. Apparently, Tesla does not plan to use 4680 form factor for LFP batteries. Why is that? Also do you think Tesla will shift to Sodium from Lithium or just go straight solid state?

[@D3kKromb0x]

A big part of why Tesla uses cylindrical cells like the 4680 is for safety reasons. The chemistry used in 4680/2170/18650 is quite volatile and will explode pretty violently when the cell is compromised (punctured, crushed, etc). By making the pack out of a bunch of smaller cylindrical cells each protected in their own individual casing you can reduce the number of cells that would explode if the worst happens and a pack is compromised, while also reducing it from one big explosion to multiple smaller and easier to contain explosions. The likely reason why they don't plan on using 4680 for LFP cells is because the LFP chemistry is much less volatile and doesn't require the same level of protection, so LFP cells can be made in more volume efficient prismatic cells.

[@imaro2358]

@@D3kKromb0x Got it! So does Tesla ever plan to make LFP themselves or contract production out to partners.

[@uonko]

"Tesla unlock the ability to..." I'm sure that you're gamer :) Dyson sphere?

[@Bonjevalien]

It would be interesting to learn if Tesla would insert internally threaded steel or Al tubes while the casting is hot and the insert would be "shrunk on shaft", thus avoiding machining threads. I guess one factor would be how clean the bore is...

[@thelimitingfactor]

In Sandy's video today, it doesn't look like there is a sleeve, but the camera is moving fast. Great points!

[@oof_Dad]

It would be interesting to try and put a type of tap die into the mold and then back it out before the mold opens. Sort of a mold and tap in one operation? Otherwise some sort of heli-coil insert would be interesting? Nothing like trying to add more complexity into to an already complicated and cutting edge machine 😁.

[@morrisg]

@@oof_Dad Thread forming screws are much easier. See the elongation comment earlier which points out that this goes with the greater elongation percentage from the vacuum assisted tech.

[@oof_Dad]

@@morrisg are self tapping fasteners used in the auto industry for this type of thing?

[@morrisg]

@@oof_Dad Any fastener that makes assembly go faster is used, things like torx head, self threading fasteners and self piercing rivets are a few. The fastener industry has made huge strides in developing new fasteners to solve more problems than before. Part of this is that they are seeing adhesives take a chunk of their business away from them. As for this particular application, I don't know what will be used as I am not familiar with the structural strength requirements for an auto body. You can bet that the body structural engineers have analyzed and simulated various fastening solutions and picked the one that performed best overall. It might even be deep stir welding for all I know.

[@platoscavealum902]

👍ℹ️

[@wmartonejr]

A reduction in Variation & Uncertainty = more predictable outcomes - Donald J Wheeler; “Understanding Variation, The Key to Managing Chaos”

[@tommckinney1489]

Good explanation, thanks. I find it fascinating that hydrogen will diffuse into Ar bubbles, thus removing hydrogen from the melt. One quibble: @time 0:53, the casting tree. Mould or Mold? (Sorry, couldn't resist).

[@grandman1701]

Machining was on China Video

[@grahammonk8013]

Really? Which one? Do you have a link?

[@grandman1701]

@@grahammonk8013 kzbin.info/www/bejne/jqukaHuAqql2ptU

[@grandman1701]

Not tesla. But tesla has sumular Video once online

[@richbrandwein9578]

Tesla is generating a seemingly huge number of test casts in both Berlin and Austin, which are all being scrapped/recycled. Any idea if they're seeing porosity issues? It's unclear why they need so many test castings.

[@thelimitingfactor]

No way to tell from here

[@TheEvilmooseofdoom]

My understanding (and it's a limited understanding) is that it takes a bit of time to dial in a casting machine, you don't get production ready parts right out of the box.

[@lordavgustin]

Elon gation

[@JGtheone]

I'm working in vacuum industry. Reading "supervacuum" I had to laugh out loud. 😂

[@thelimitingfactor]

Yeah, they call it a number of things int he research papers and by the companies. Super just makes everything sound cooler, lol

[@HuskyMachining]

I know right. The only low pressure equipment I ever work with we delt in the torr(to the power of)-10 area so I always giggle when I hear Super or Ultra vacuum

[@michaelromose9249]

I would be impressed if they can cast screw threads... Unless the die is split into multiple parts it shouldn't be possible: if the thread can hold a screw, it should hold the die also. So maybe Elon was just referring to reduced machining from strategies like: * avoiding threaded fasteners altogether. * reduced warping means you don't need to drill precision holes after the fact. * other parts attached to the casting have adjustable fastenings. * spacing around the part in the car design reduces the need for deburring

[@kschleic9053]

Thread the die boss out of the cast threads during the extraction process.

[@HuskyMachining]

you can actually design molds to cast parts with internal threads. As long as they are exterial threaded holes pointed towards one of the mold halves. You have a screw in the mold that unscrew its self from the mold seconds or most likely fractions of a second after the material solidifies. Then the half come apart to have the part ejected

[@alanmay7929]

@@kschleic9053 or make the threads after verifying that the casting is structurally ok!!!!!!

[@grahammonk8013]

What I think happens is one 3 things. Some threading is done after, but it's minor work and Elon just didn't consider it needed mention. There is no threading needed, and any physical bolted pieces are achieved by bolting *through* wholes in the casting. Self tapping bolts or screws.

[@BigBoneESB]

Lemme like this before watching... done! Ya think 4680 is in the Pepsemi trucks?

[@thelimitingfactor]

I think so 🤠

[@michaelnurse9089]

Elon-gation. I think I get it now.

[@eugeniustheodidactus8890]

Eating *industrial seed-oils* _( aka: "vegetable oil" )_ is a leading cause of chronic inflammatory disease.

[@hersheykiss9500]

wait i dont get the super vacuum chart. why is only high-elongation data plotted for the vacuumed parts??? EDIT: nvm, brain fart. its elongation at failure. i was thinking stress-strain curve, but this is strength-strain(elongation).

[@thelimitingfactor]

Not sure what you mean, it says conventional versus vaccum.

[@markoverton5858]

The cyber truck will use bonding plus rivets, as in aero frames, this is proven tech

[@alanmay7929]

Why won’t they use something like a frame on the cybertruck!? Aren’t trucks supposed to be modified, to be equipped with various accessories……!

[@grahammonk8013]

Supposed to be modified? It is common for this to happen, it isn't "required". It does mean that Tesla has cut themselves off from part of the potential market, but I don't think this will be significant in terms of profitability.

[@alanmay7929]

@@grahammonk8013 lol….. do you even know the field of applications of trucks!? They are not made for boring daily driving mate, trucks are made to be use for specific purposes. Ford for example sells some models with just the cabin and no bed or just bare chassis with powertrain for conversions into ambulance, rescue truck, dump truck, tool trucks or some other special ones. Even for snow plowing….. they need place to mount those things.

[@grahammonk8013]

@@alanmay7929 True, there is no chassis cab or cutaway versions of Cybertruck, no (easy) way of mounting a fifth wheel. What % of F150/F250 are sold for those uses? I can't find any numbers, but just going by the ones I see driving around, it's probably less than 25% The way I see it, those market segments might be nice for the dealers and upfitters in that market, but they are not the biggest moneymakers for Ford themselves, and it still leaves a pretty big market for Tesla to sell to, as shown by the interest since the announcement, plus the new potential purchasers. Many people are looking at the CT who wouldn't otherwise be buying a pickup. I would expect that quite a lot are now potential buys of the Lightning instead, will be interesting to see how that all shakes out.

[@alanmay7929]

@@grahammonk8013 are you serious!? Who is going to use a fifth wheel on a Ford F-150, the 5th wheel is used from the Ford F-250 and up since they tow more than the cybertruck for example, there is no such things as percentage because not everyone has the same use of their trucks, some buy trucks used and modify them, some companies customizes trucks for their use….

[@TheEvilmooseofdoom]

I think what you want to do with your truck will determine what truck you buy. An exoskeleton means there should be no need for a frame but we have no idea what internal works there will be in the end that could allow for some add on equipment.

[@melvindenny8962]

Over engineer then final machining improves perfection. Normal at Tesla.

[@switzerland]

I can't resist: ELONgate

[@preciousplasticph]

All the same issues as plastic injection molding

[@amimartian]

You meant to say 'cooking poison' (that is vegetable oil). The use in die-casting is about the only use I would personally see for this 'poison'. Nice titbit.

[@Myrslokstok]

Think I heard they use soyoil.

[@scmountaindad2190]

everyone benefits from better Elongation

[@krisvandermeulen253]

The Gigapress is a great machine/tool but you need good engineers to develop the good alloy and define the procedure by itself. This maximises the result of your tool (Gigapress)

[@AWildBard]

Using cooking oil in high tech metal manufacturing? very amusing

[@vigamortezadventures7972]

Just build a giant casting machine on the moon lol

[@markedwards4879]

70kg metal pancakes 🤣

[@jdsimonfpv5867]

All holes and lots of flat surfaces must be machined not on the press, old machinist

[@morkovija]

As much as the engeneering and material science blows the mind, their customer service is going to be their demise

[@kschleic9053]

Nah. The boomers continuing to wail about their inability to talk to a customer service representative will eventually age out of their buyer demographics (they will be the first into MaaS, as their kids take their keys🤣)... Gen X, millennials, and Gen Z are all tech savvy enough to deal with an automated service system.

[@morkovija]

@@kschleic9053 are they tech savy enough for failing main drive units or 6 week appointment wait times on your 60k-120k purchase? Dont think so

[@TheEvilmooseofdoom]

Or it's just getting blown out of proportion. So many in the FUD community like to take one offs and pretend they're the trend. They gull a lot of fools that way.

[@kschleic9053]

@@morkovija 6 week wait times aren't the norm, and would be a supply chain issue, not customer service. Similarly, if there were significant numbers of motor replacements going on (afaik there aren't, outside of very old model S/X) it would be be a manufacturing quality issue, not customer service. Customer service is how easy it is to communicate with the company and make purchases/schedule service.

[@morkovija]

@@kschleic9053 maybe you are right Ken, dont get me wrong - i want tesla to succeed