Grey Knights Unit Tier List in Warhammer 40K 10th Edition- Strongest + Weakest Grey Knight Units

[@tastiGMmaster2099]

Gods I hope GK gets a substantial range update for 10e and not just a character. This edition really showing the limits of their small roster.

[@TheSilverDragon1]

Monkey's paw activate: we get two new units in our codex, but they use the same two kits we already have.

[@thomasbrittain4343]

They will probably redo the strike squad and terminator boxes so that we have to rebuy our whole army

[@GrimonprezB]

Deathwatch and GK are in a garbage...when GW spam 3D marines models for the other "chapters"...sigh

[@spoonsrattling]

Grey knights really just need an updated heavy weapon section. Give em some lascannons or something

[@cowkingkiller]

@@spoonsrattling give us ap 3 on our psy cannons and that would go a long way... S6 ap 2 melee isn't enough.. also nemesis dread needs some ap as well...

[@mellowfellow14]

I play GK, this edition has been hard. They are fun to play, but because you are limited to basically 5 somewhat viable units, it makes them go stale pretty quick.

[@nightwatchm4n]

As a Necron player who plays against his brother's Grey Knights army often, my opinion of GK is they are great for melee & tactics and weak at shooting and anti-vehicle. My apologies if this is redundant -- as far as tips I can say that Champions' fights first ability is brutal so putting one in an alpha strike unit is great. Rhinos and Razorbacks are surprisingly great (and cost effective) at running interference if you need to screen or tie down a nasty unit for a turn or two. I also highly recommend having at least one Strike Squad for sticky objectives. Dreadknights are also hidden gems in my opinion -- they won't solo vehicles in most cases but if you use them in tandem with a 2nd unit of any type supporting it then it can make for some nasty ambushes. Just some musings from someone on the other side of the table.

[@GreatChickenGod]

i was hoping that Grey Knights got a special rule to reflect their Psybolt ammo, kind of like how Deathguard now have virulent rounds making their bolters plague weapons. they always lacked power in the shooting. when they had made Psilencers force weapons in 7th, they were somewhat deadly (not really, but funny to see a Cataphron robot or tyranid big bug die to 1 shot ) in terms of model range, i would like to see Grand Master Modrak get a model

[@obsidanix]

Yeah needs something. Good suggestion I have seen is to make Psilencers sustained hits 2 and make Psycannons devastating wounds. Would make a huge difference to GK

[@fendelphi]

They just need something that can positively interact with the "Psyker" and "Psychic" keywords. Currently, the only one that I remember helps them in that regard, is the Brother Captain, and he can only lead Terminators and Paladins, by giving Psychic weapons in the unit sustained hits 1. In most other cases, being Psyker or having Psychic weapons is a downside for them.

[@DeathInTheSnow]

I think what hurts GK so much is how conditional their rules are. The teleporting stuff is cool, but it can be terrible if your opponent limits the places that they can turn up. Even if you spot that that's what your opponent is doing, it's so easy for them to move everything else that turn, leaving you in a "damned if you do, damned if you don't" situation. Same with the 4+ invulnerable save on their Terminators. It should be amazing. But a savvy CSM player might choose to use Chosen with combi-weapons and an Exalted Champion, allowing them to hit on a 3+. Then 4+ causes devastating wounds, negating the save altogether. Hammerhand would be amazing too if they got it at all times. But only being on the charge leaves them vulnerable to things they couldn't kill, or things that charge them. But hey, we know GW haven't taken Grey Knights seriously ever since they brought out the -baby carrier- Nemesis Dreadknight.

[@fendelphi]

What about Thousand Sons using a stratagem to make all psychic weapons targeting the chosen unit Hazardous? You see that juicy target you want to kill with your Grey Knights Terminators? Well now all your attacks against that unit(in this phase) are Hazardous(except for Stormbolters and Incinerators), and the targeted unit also has a 4+ FNP against Psychic attacks. Or what about Khorne Fleshhounds with a 3+ FNP against Psychic attacks. So the faction meant to hunt down chaos in its purest form, is actually kind of bad at exactly that.

[@obsidanix]

Ah my poor grey boys. 😢 Grandmaster getting once per game free battle strat shows how gimped GK are where most armies get that once oer turn with leaders.

[@RybotTWC]

Not only that, but those free strats are limited to Battle-Tactic only. Meaning we can use 4 total strats with it. Go to Ground, Command Re-Roll, Radiant Strike, and Death from the Warp.

[@HeathRHansen]

@@RybotTWC100% and Mists was the one I used it on most before that change.

[@Killery96]

Yeah. At the onset of the edition, some of our strategems were so strong that people could kinda sorta make sense of the GM's ability being once per battle. Now, though, getting devastating wounds or advance and shoot once per game is pretty weak for a 95pt leader.

[@riccardoforti2765]

Happy new year mate and congrats for the enormous amount of work you’ve produced

[@YesterdaysError]

its sad to see the dreadknight struggle so much, its easily my favourite non-character model in the GK roster. i hope it gets a discount or buff soon

[@cowkingkiller]

it just needs ap since its the same cos as dreadnaughts.

[@fendelphi]

What it needs is an extra ability. I dont mind that the ranged damage is not "amazing". It is pretty good vs infantry with the Heavy Incinerator and Heavy Psycannon, and the amount of shots can "chip" vehicles as well(3-6 wounds). It can use Tank Shock to great effect and maybe that is the extra ability it needs: 0 cost Tank Shock. GK are already pressed in terms of Command Points, as they want to use Stratagems a lot to be effective, but have relatively few of them available(very few characters that reduce or remove cost, compared to other factions). Getting 5-6 MW "for free" when you charge is not bad at all.

[@Jw3694]

I think interceptors and Voldus could be tier 2, but awesome list! Would love some datasheet changes to the NDK with points adjustments as needed.

[@HeathRHansen]

Vehicles are the kryptonite. GKs have anti-tank tools (GMNDK) but melee anti tank can easily be screened… and shot to death. They are also very very CP hungry as they get very free rerolls or free strats natively.

[@vernpwns4143]

Do you think, when their codex comes out, the Grey Knights will get a detachment that lets every unit recover D3 wounds in each command phase?

[@vernpwns4143]

@vultaz345 the joke went straight over your head 😉

[@SwamplordGaming]

The joke is that Necrons got the Hypercrypt detachment for their index which basically copies Grey Knight's teleporting gimmicks, so it'd be funny if Grey Knights got a detachment that copies Necron's recovery!@vultaz345

[@chronovac]

@vultaz345 Necrons are currently Grey Knights but better with their hypercrypt detachment

[@edwardliu111]

​@vultaz345care to explain then?

[@SoulCrusherEx]

I have a feeling we will see a new Stern and Draigo in plastic and some new stuff if the codex hits us this year in 2024

[@Bluegender88]

I don't play Grey knights but they really need more models. I'm baffled by how little they have receive despite being spacemarines.

[@GreyAven]

you neglected to mention that paladins can take two more special weapons upgrades over the termies, 3 instead of 1. And They have a better bs score with them making paladins the best shooting infantry we have. Also you said the champion can only be paired with the strike squad, this isnt true, you can pair him with purgation squad which with 10 guys is a nasty unit, fights first, indirect fire, 4 incimerators, 7 nemesis force weapons. Thats my tech. ;)

[@joshuacrowley8887]

Unfortunately my grey knights went into storage for the foreseeable future. They just arent fun to play even through they were my favorite army. Makes me sad.

[@artemisquinn]

This is where I am at too

[@thomasbrittain4343]

I wish I could put them away. They are my only army right now and I've been working on them for 4 years

[@joshuacrowley8887]

@@thomasbrittain4343 play kill team for a while. Much cheaper to get into and a lot of fun. That's what I'm doing

[@1onebegger]

Same, they lost all of their unique flavor. Even their army rule is something almost every other faction has in some way.

[@joshuacrowley8887]

@@1onebegger yup, their play style is literally to just try to tank as much as possible and hold on as you will get wiped down to one unit left and try to get to objectives via movement. I have played 5 games this year that I had 1-2 half strength units left at the end of the game with my opponent having over 1500 points left. The fact an elite army like grey knights struggle at killing even a rhino is infuriating. It just isn't fun. I know the game isn't about killing, but when the game feels so one sided unless your movement is perfect, it just sucks to play.

[@thebiggestbaz]

I have picked up GK for 10th, before that i was Ad Mech and ultramarines. I have been loving the Knights, at the end of the year i was sitting on 8 wins and 3 loses which is easily my best results ive ever had haha. They are fun to play, flexible, and tough.

[@lemanruss22]

As a whole GK need anti daemon on their weapons. Having a specialist daemon slayer army have near fuck all anti daemon is beyond stupid

[@markberghel275]

I actually genuinely LIKE the standard Nemesis Dread. Having what is effectively 14" flying movement with some good generalist weapon options means it becomes a fast trade piece, and having deep strike means it can just come down somewhere else if the opponent doesn't immediately kill it. Also, I really want to build a purgation squad with max incinerators to wall-hack people xD

[@HeathRHansen]

The problem I find is that a “trade piece” is rarely what I need, as our units are expensive and we need a lot of value out of them, not just a kamikaze.

[@fendelphi]

@@HeathRHansen I dont really think it is a bad "trade piece" though. With Deep Strike, Teleport Assault rules and its high mobility, you can reliable get it to engage the targets you want it to, as well as avoiding most of the bad trades. If ignored by your opponent, it can decimate most types of targets by itself(Fights First units can be an issue, but Tank Shock can potentially remove models before they get to fight). If your opponent tries to take it out by force before it gets to do anything, it is still a 13 Wounds model with a 4+ Invulnerable save, which means most standard anti-vehicle weaponry will have to be used en-masse to deal with it reliably(usually this means spending 200+ points worth of firepower). When those same weapons could be used against your 400+ pts blocks of terminators, that is not a bad situation either. And if you really want to, you can use Stratagems to mitigate or avoid damage as well. All that said, I dont think you want to use it on a list where you have mostly Terminators. Too few targets for the opponent to worry about means they have an easier time concentrating fire on what they think is the most threatening unit at the moment. Instead, use it in lists with a lot of "regular" Grey Knights in Power Armour. And possibly bring 2 of them.

[@ajanderson7170]

Tried the wall hack purgation squad with incinerators in my last game. Killed 2 marines turn 2 and then did basically nothing. Was very disappointing.

[@fendelphi]

@@ajanderson7170 I dont think Incinerators are good for that particular strategy, as they simply lack range to reach enough viable targets in most scenarios.

[@ajanderson7170]

@@fendelphi range is pretty irrelevant for the army as a whole considering you land wherever is needed. The flamers get around indirect fire penalties which is why I tried them out

[@yourbrokengalaxy]

Aussy you wonderful creator you. I just bought my first Grey Knights kit last week to start a new army. Perfect timing. Happy New Year.

[@blairbrook1336]

Psychic keyword needs another passive on the data card.

[@Unit-kp8wm]

Technically Brother Captain Stern's mortal wounds on a critical wound stacks with devastating wounds. So you could use radiant strike to get 3 mortals per critical wound.

[@HeathRHansen]

With no reliable way of getting 6s.

[@WARGORELORD]

The Devil works hard but Auspex works harder

[@Saidan79]

*slurp slurp*

[@jarvisbinks7576]

Having finally started painting my mostly assembled GKs I must say (and I’ve never played the table top though I know I want to eventually) that it’s very confusing assembling everything “correctly” and all. I just chose units that I thought (and have heard from folks like yourself) were “better” than others. Hard to care though when they’re the super secretive demon hunting arm of the Emperor himself.

[@marcusflutist1230]

It's easier now, with all Nemesis force weapons being rolled into one. As for the army, your community is very important. Hyper-competetive one won't allow you to enjoy playing thematic lists, for example. But it's always better to collect an army rather than a roster - this way you won't be dicked by a new codex or balance dataslate as much

[@fendelphi]

I think the standard Nemesis Dreadknight can do well with the Hammer option and Tank Shock strategem. Being able to advance(auto 6), shoot(I go for Heavy Incinerator+Psycannon) AND charge can generate a lot of value, especially if blessed by a Techmarine(+1 to hit on all attack rolls until next command phase). It does have a somewhat unique vulnerability to Overcharged Plasma shots(4+ to wound) and Krak Missiles and Melta shots(3+ to wound) that you do not usually see in vehicles at that price range, but it does also have a 4+ Invulnerable save, which is not that common either. And the high amount of shots and powerful attacks it can make(combined with high mobility and teleportations) can make it quite a threat. Speaking of Techmarine... A Techmarine with a squad of 4 Servitors is fairly cheap(110 pts) and brings a decent amount of "teleporting" firepower. The Servitors get the Techmarine's Deep Strike and Teleport Assault keywords as long as they are led by the Techmarine, as well as a +1 to their BS and WS. This means they have a base BS of 3+. Now combine that with a handful of either Plasma Cannons or Multimeltas, and suddenly you have some very potent firepower that you can bring anywhere on the field. In addition to that, you can put the entire thing into a 5-man Strike Squad(or 10, if you want to, but they take up a lot of space), bolstering the numbers with a good price(5 extra models for 110), which includes a fairly powerful Grey Knight Techmarine and 2 extra heavy weapons. If the unit takes damage from high powered shots(high AP and at least damage 2), you can take the rolls on the Servitors(they are cheaper and have a 6+ invulnerable save). If you take small arms fire, you can try to soak it up with the Strike Squads 2+ Sv.

[@wh40kev98]

How does the brochamp not allow the strikes to scout? Hes the only guy that can join that unit. Youd think an exemplary strike champ would maintain the key fundamentals of his brothers no?

[@fendelphi]

The Techmarine can also join them, and it is the same issue.

[@crayven]

A good fix for the stormraven would be to give it the assault ramp back...

[@panthros7395]

Thank you. I need all the help I can get with my Grey Knights. I wish Land Raiders were more feasible. I wish Psycannons were more powerful. Oh well, does not mean I will not play them but it is a lot harder.

[@AuthIllustrator]

I feel we viewers need to be concerned we’re seeing these videos at 2:40 in the morning and less so about when they’re uploaded 😆

[@stevev9597]

When they eventually get their codes would be nice to see some AP improvements and a change in the army rule relating to psychic rather than a standard move increase. Like the idea about psychic ammo as an all psychic team to be an army rule with some benefits

[@malvatoss5840]

My prediction for our dex. We lose a pip of ap on our nemesis force weapons, the teleport strike rule gets nerfed and all but one of the subfactions will be hot garbage, and the best one will be the one that just makes us better at killing.

[@Skitch213]

Seeing the flyers in Tier 5 kinda hurts my soul. I've been running dual Stormhawks for anti-armour duties in most lists and they've performed pretty well for me.

[@edwardliu111]

How have you gotten them to work well for you when flyers have been so weak?

[@Skitch213]

@@edwardliu111 Usually the opponent's attitude of ignoring them because they're apparently weak. Don't get me wrong, they're not *good* by any means but for GK shooting, you can do worse than two las-talon shots, 3 S8 missile shots and a twin-linked assault cannon for 160 pts.

[@fendelphi]

@@Skitch213 The thing is, none of that firepower really helps when dealing with the "big" problems(things with toughness 11 and above). Even T10 units can be problematic when you rely on a 4+ to wound with your strongest weapon. You get more reliable anti-armor weaponry from a Razorback(twin-linked lascannon, hunter-killer missile) at 85 pts, and they have the same durability(T9, W10, SV3+). Rather, I would say that the Stormhawk is decent at anti-infantry/anti-flier when lending fire support to the Grey Knights, and that is about it.

[@Skitch213]

@fendelphi None of the GK firepower "really helps" if that's the metric you're going by. Fact is, we fucking suck at anti-armour and there's only a few ways to deal with that. Either you take lascannons and talons and still have a shit chance to wound anything that actually has decent toughness or you take a librarian and risk mortal wounds to yourself, and that's about it. GMNK w/ hammer could potentially do some heavy lifting as well but with T8, it melts to anything even remotely geared towards anti-armour. For my lists, I've found that running a flyer or two fits what I'm trying to do what with doubling down on mobility etc. Personally I hate the Razorback and the investment of points that I need to make to fill it with something worthwhile, and it can't teleport. The only GK tank I'd remotely consider is a Land Raider because of the sheer lack of support our vehicles currently have. Teleporting is basically all GK have going for them just now so I try to work with that.

[@fendelphi]

@@Skitch213 There is a notable difference in bringing Strength 10 weapons, and then bringing Strength 12 or 14 weapons, when trying to deal with enemy armour, is all I am saying. Picking the Stormhawk for "anti-armour duty" will not yield good results, but it can do well against fliers and infantry. 160 pts or 320 pts for "anti-armour" that cant reliably deal with most tanks is typically not a good point investment, if that is their intended primary role. That was the point really. I do think that the Stormhawk at least should be higher ranked, as it is a pretty good shooting platform(lots of decent weapons against fliers and various infantry), with the potential to earn its cost back. It could easily be tier 4. Meanwhile the Venerable Dreadnought should be in tier 5(too slow and too vulnerable for the point cost, with not enough damage output, and it cant keep up with your teleporting units, making its aura mostly a waste).

[@KiwiAlexJohnston]

I just hope by the time they get their codex and get good again I will still be keeping happy with my CK and crons. Until then imperial daemons seem kinda meh.

[@artemisquinn]

I had a question. Throughout the video you mention deep strike or teleport assault. My understanding is that while they work functionally the same they are different. Which brings me to my real point draigo…. His rule only lists deep strike as its trigger. So my understanding is his unit has to have started the game in deep strike or gone into reserves with mists of Deimos to get his ability. It would not work pulling him and his unit off the board with the teleport assault rule correct? Just clarifying because in the video you specifically say he can do it off of teleport assault. Love your videos I just want to make sure I am playing right.

[@jean-philippecarrier2216]

when you teleport assault you put back your units in reinforcment, and come back on the battlefield in the reinforcement phase thanks to your deep strike ability. so you can still trigger the draigo abilty because it is said that you use it after deep strike from your reinforcement

[@lemanruss22]

GK in a nutshell. 3x libby Draigo Paladins Fill rest

[@baconwhale6414]

I do wish we got new super heavy/heavy vehicles for the GK. Either a tank or a brand new Dreadknight variant.

[@HeathRHansen]

We need a RANGED tank buster. Right now we have to get into melee to hurt vehicles and even then it's ONLY with Dreadknights that are easily shot off the board.

[@Demolij]

Mate is uploading videos at midnight, what a guy. Apart from the lack of Hammers (which would pretty much fix their anti-tank problem) the worst part about Grey Knights and some other factions is the fact that Psychic attacks have absolutely nothing special about them. A cool and unique way to give Psykers a unique niche would be if all Psychic weapons inflicted -1 on Invuln saves at the cost of having -1 AP (maybe with a few +AP buffs on certain weapons) so they work better as anti-elites without being busted elsewhere. It's also annoying how their detachment rule is so irrelevant since there aren't any Assault weapons and you can just TP around anyways, it would be nice if they swapped it with the Interceptor Squad's ability (move+shoot+move) like how it was in 9th, back when Ethereal Castigation was a thing. Hopefully upcoming detachments include cool mechanics like Temporal Accuracy's "all Bolters become Pistols" and the True Name Shard's "target enemy fights last".

[@TheTommyFrench]

I know you can schedule the time a video goes live after creating it, but I think you can also set it up to go live immediately but it still needs to upload fully and go through YT validation before it posts. My assumption is that he’s not working on it right up to the very moment it’s posted. It’s also quite possible that modern editing software integrates so well with YT that you can set it to export straight to YT and post as soon as it’s done. So he may realistically have a 2-4 hour lag time from final edit to video publish where he’s not actually working. Depending on computer power and internet bandwidth.

[@The_L_God]

I probably would have put the basic grand master higher but overall yea I agree with this list, it just stinks how heavily pushed you feel using the go to units just to have a good list sometimes, Don't get me wrong you can absolutely make fun lists with the vehicles but man does feel like you shouldn't use them

[@shaanreed1680]

Those Damn Heretics look too good! Auspex, Is your health okay?

[@rakisuzuki-burke4148]

Our terminator squads are amazing. 420 points gets an OC30 brick with two heavy weapons and setting up one destroyed model each turn.

[@jsm1978]

Feels bad that the only thing Grey Knights have going for them is teleport shenanigans, and the Necrons take thwir army rule with one of their detachments (and pull 4 instead of the 3 that Grey Knights get).

[@MarcinObuchowski]

Either make them a truly UNIQUE Marine action or just Roll them into agents of inquisition and put them out of their misery

[@Louiscypher93]

*prays for new Draigo model, some new DreadKnights variants and just something new and fun*

[@yoda110]

I’ve got a question, can’t seem to find anything about it in the rules. At 18:10 (T2 Purifiers) there’s talk about a special rule that allows purifiers to drop 3’’ from an enemy unit, can someone please explain how’s that possible. Thank you and you all have a happy new year !

[@MarcinObuchowski]

Its a stratagem

[@Jompsy1]

Yeah, check out "Prognosticated Arrival" stratagem.

[@fendelphi]

It is a Teleport Strike Force Stratagem called Prognosticated Arrival. It allows you to Deep Strike as close as 3" of an enemy unit, but you are not allowed to declare a charge with that unit in that turn. It can be used to get closer to objectives or getting into areas that your opponent had thought they had screened off.

[@jonathannormington9585]

I thought Draigo’s rule didn’t work with the faction rule? Only deep strike?

[@jean-philippecarrier2216]

why though? faction rule put him back in reiforcement, and his abilty let you use it when you come back from reinforcement using deep strike, which teleport assault do

[@adamdavies781]

​@@jean-philippecarrier2216 The wording of teleport assault makes no mention of deep strike, RAW, it's a separate thing. So Drago's ability can only be used on the first turn he appears, unfortunately. There are a few rules/strats which specifically trip off deep strike or arriving from reserves, which teleport assault currently isn't 😔

[@jean-philippecarrier2216]

@@adamdavies781 Its really stupid, unit thant can use teleport assault use it because they have deep strike ability. when you'll come back from reinforcement with teleport assaut it's because of your ability to have deep strike. It's always like this with some people who likes to look for the little dot, and the exact wording. It's not even a wargame, it's a grammar game. you have to wait for the next WTC to clarify stuipidity like this because people find a little trick, even if it's obvisous for everyone else... Anyway personnaly, Draigo starts always the battle in deep strike, So it's not an issue for me, but he should be allowed to use it with teleport assault. it's just plain logic.

[@ericrbacher9371]

Servitors in a rhino, shooting out the hatch. Transport your dreadnought in your stormraven. These fix need for AP.

[@fendelphi]

Transporting the Dreadnought in a Stormraven is a lot of points investment(420 pts) and an even bigger target(no place to hide, usually). While being transported, the Dreadnought's ability is not in effect(no buff) and it cant shoot. If it comes in as reinforcement on turn 2, you cant deploy the dreadnought(since that happens during the movement step, not reinforcement step), so you cant make some grand "mass-teleport assault supported by dreadnought buff" on turn 2. The idea is cool and it would fit the faction, but the rules just wont play well with what the Grey Knights try to do. :( If Grey Knights want a decent "dreadnought" to support their frontline, they, unfortunately, just go with the Armiger Warglaive. It is cheaper, more durable, faster, and overall more effective in combat. As for Servitors in a Rhino. Without a Techmarine, their BS is 4+, so you are paying 125 pts for 2 Plasma Cannons or Multimeltas in a T9, W10, SV3+ mobile platform, hitting on a 4+. It is "ok", but not reliable firepower either, it does not help much against enemy vehicles, and again, it is a fairly big and easy to hit target for enemies to pop. Again, I would rather just take the Warglaive at 150 pts.

[@jongrubka7169]

The brotherhood champion to my opponent is very scary because of the strike first. I had him to every Strike squad. Since I can do almost the same damage output as terminators, And strike first, they become very powerful for the cost. The dredknight character can’t get in the hand hand that easy As the Standard dredknight. So I will rate the standard one just a little higher than the character. We only use I found for Razorbacks is the support that you have with your lascannons.

[@charleystewart8330]

Grand Master Dreadknight is Tier 5. Cost more than the regular Dreadknight with worse rules. 6" less movement because it can't advance and charge. Rerolls vs, monsters and vehicles in melee is not an even trade since, he'll never get there. Most, if not all, GKs vehicles are traps that pay a little more with no army rules. Why is our Brother-Captain once per game when EVERY other character with this rule is once per round. Brotherhood Champions should be able to be added to Interceptors giving them the rule of the squad. Just to give them an option. Tier 2 and Tier 1 is spot on.

[@AngelFluff723]

I miss the Dreadknights being good, they were always the center point of my army when playing against Chaos/Deamon armies.

[@fendelphi]

I dont really think they are "that bad" now that they are 185 pts. I definitely think they are overall better than the Venerable Grey Knight Dreadnought. If they survive long enough to do damage, they can usually squash a squad with a combination of firepower, Tank Shock(almost guaranteed 6 MW) and melee attacks. If they survive another round, they have the mobility to get to a new target. Most high strength attacks are wounding on a 3+(so similar to most other vehicles), but the 4+ Invulnerable Save helps a lot here. What they dont like is massed Strength 8 and 9 weaponry(Overcharged Plasma shots, Krak Missiles and Melta weaponry), which are all weaponry that are also used to kill your infantry blocks. So again, it is all about if they can find a fairly juicy target to squash and earn their cost back, or if they can act as a distraction and attract firepower while your other units secure objectives and kill targets.

[@RockmeHellsing]

I hate that things like servitors will likely fall out , in a such small list. I love the look and lore of them and that they are so costumisalbe , and th interaktion with the tech marine. I still want to playx them its the only cheap thing we have!

[@jameskillbot2867]

As someone who has been delving deep, let’s see if auspex gets this right.

[@troytaylor8225]

Grey knights are gonna get a shooting boost and purgation squads are gonna be a PROBLEM

[@marshallczaplicki5377]

Another Auspex banger

[@lillithara5120]

i just wish the Dreadknight sword was at least str 12, it would make them feel less useless against monsters/vehicles.

[@HeathRHansen]

Sadly the whole index has a STR problem… and an AP problem.

[@ryanmarquez9404]

Just give me my psyker army back.

[@UrielVentris1984]

grey knights badly need an update thats for competitive players and onley represents the very best players. for us casual or average players its prob closer to 30%. like it was in early 8th. hope gw makes them once again the elite of the elite, space marines had genisis of demigods and constand double codex support, this army needs a range refresh and new lore, and thousands of new grey knight chapters, i predict grey knights will evolve well past thier limits here, and be the warriors of legend again.

[@malvatoss5840]

Right now most success Ive had with grey knights has been as alpha strike shooters. Paladins led by librarians, purifiers led by crowe and a few terms to hold points. My experience with trialing a melee focused list with draigo etc was that "nemesis force weapons" are hot garbage and generally failed to kill anything I put them into. As these matches were primarily against gsc, that was incredibly concerning. Alpha strike shooting on the other hand works reasonably well. Paladins can bring a stack of heavy weapons and with their stats can usually do ok at killing any one thing. Melee is there as a backup option but i try to avoid relying on the 9+ roll. I instead prefer to 3" drop and just shoot. My librarians tend to blow themselves up, however I did once absolutely decimate a unit with one so i bring them in hopes of recreating that feeling. If purifiers have an infantry unit to target theyll probably kill it, its a great amount of dice to roll, and if i use the strat i get to hit and wound on 2's. Grey knight surviviability is spectacular. Nemesis dreads consistently underperformed for me in 9e and they are worse in 10e. Gmndk hitting on 3's actually made me mad. I dont really regard anything else in the codex with any significant note, strikes for sticky i guess.

[@jean-philippecarrier2216]

gmndk hitting on 3s and 4s with hammer is the worst in this index...

[@Sokiem99]

Personally I like to put Crowe and the Purifiers in a redeemer, run them up the board and disembark and melt whatever infantry was coming forward. Then when they go to charge them bamph them out with mist of deimos and/or overwatch them to death. Here's my last list that won a local tourney of 22 people ++ Army Roster (Imperium - Grey Knights) [2,000pts] ++ + Configuration + Battle Size: 2. Strike Force (2000 Point limit) Detachment: Teleport Strike Force Show/Hide Options: Agents of the Imperium are visible, Imperial Knights are visible, Legends are visible, Titans are visible, Unaligned Forces are visible, Unaligned Fortifications are visible + Epic Hero + Castellan Crowe [75pts] Kaldor Draigo [125pts]: Warlord + Character + Brotherhood Librarian [130pts]: Combi-Weapon, Sigil of Exigence Brotherhood Librarian [115pts]: Inescapable Wrath, Storm Bolter + Battleline + Brotherhood Terminator Squad [210pts] . 2x Terminator: 2x Nemesis Force Weapon, 2x Storm Bolter . Terminator with Ancient's Banner: Incinerator . Terminator with Narthecium Brotherhood Terminator Squad [210pts] . 2x Terminator: 2x Nemesis Force Weapon, 2x Storm Bolter . Terminator with Ancient's Banner: Incinerator . Terminator with Narthecium Strike Squad [125pts] . 3x Grey Knight: 3x Nemesis Force Weapon, 3x Storm Bolter . Grey Knight with Heavy Weapon: Incinerator . Justicar + Infantry + Paladin Squad [450pts] . 4x Paladin: 4x Nemesis Force Weapon, 4x Storm Bolter . Paladin with Ancient's Banner: Incinerator . Paladin with Heavy Weapon: Incinerator . Paladin with Heavy Weapon: Incinerator . Paladin with Heavy Weapon: Incinerator . Paladin with Heavy Weapon: Incinerator . Paragon Purifier Squad [260pts] . Knight of the Flame . 5x Purifier: 5x Nemesis Force Weapon, 5x Purifying Flame, 5x Storm Bolter . 4x Purifier w/ incinerator: 4x Close combat weapon, 4x Incinerator, 4x Purifying Flame + Vehicle + Grey Knights Land Raider Redeemer [260pts]: Hunter-killer Missile, Multi-melta, Storm Bolter + Allied Units + Inquisitorial Henchmen [40pts] . 2x Inquisitorial Acolyte: 2x Acolyte firearm, 2x Acolyte melee weapon . Inquisitorial Acolyte w/ eviscerator . Inquisitorial Acolyte w/ plasma pistol ++ Total: [2,000pts] ++ Created with BattleScribe (battlescribe.net)

[@malvatoss5840]

@Sokiem99 I might try the land raider, just so many points for movement. On my games with gk, generally I make like 3 normal moves a game lol.

[@Sokiem99]

@@malvatoss5840 Not just that, It's super hard to put down and overwatch for 2d6+6 S6 Ap-2 D2 shots plus whatever else you can land is super good

[@Sokiem99]

@@jean-philippecarrier2216 You have to update your scribe, they hit on 3s with Hammers and 2s with sword...

[@riolufan2249]

A neat tier list, but no decent anti tank weapons. Unplayable against my friends guard tank spam list

[@HeathRHansen]

My local meta is a parking lot with tons of ranged tanks. Makes GKs have a rough time lol

[@ryandemont2738]

Just started playing again and this list is amazing. I'm just a little sad grey knights have fallen so low. They had some of the most interesting flavor and rules in 9th and now they feel like watered down trash. Being able to take terminators as troops was the tits. All weapons options being reduced to psychic force weapons is so ass.

[@W33Bster]

I think the grandmaster should be tier 2, he is run in alot of lists and the ignore modifiers is often very usable, the free strat while not gamebreaking is also quite solid, it is common to run him with 10 paladins

[@jean-philippecarrier2216]

not so much anymore, as you cant ignore damage modifiers etc...

[@HeathRHansen]

@@jean-philippecarrier2216if that is clarified that way in Jan’s patch it for sure benches him.

[@fendelphi]

There are only 4 Stratagems that can be made free. Command Reroll, Go to Ground, Radiant Strike and Death from the Warp. That is rather limited. It might prove worthwhile, and sometimes it will do absolutely nothing.

[@jean-philippecarrier2216]

@@HeathRHansen it has already been clarified, that you can't ignore a damage modifiers because its a weapon characteristic and not a model/unit characteristic... its stupid wording again...

[@HeathRHansen]

That was for a tournament, but GW has not yet said that is their intention through any form of a errata or patch have they? And if that is their intention… Do they just want that character to suck?

[@FredDraigo]

It is sade that we haven't any Anti-psyker, ok Draigo had And no defense against psykers, i mean like the Thousand Sons, there stratagem against psychic attacks is OP against all our Melee and Range weapons 😢

[@Whizzbam]

I love my Grey Knights. But I'm very hesitant to further point upgrade my army when everyone says 'eh you know they're due for a model refurbishment . . . but chapter 666 f demons eh?'

[@wh40kev98]

Tier 3 faction with most of its datasheets in tier 3.

[@NornQueenKya]

Those terminators terminate the competition

[@fendelphi]

So here are the changes I would give the Grey Knights. 1) Give more of the roster 2 abilities rather than just 1. Elite armies need to do special stuff to succeed. Adeptus Custode units have 2+ abilities for their entire roster, except 2 of the vehicles(a Land Raider and a Dreadnought, which both instead have improved stats). Some examples: Nemesis Dreadknight should get an extra ability that allows Tank Shock to be 0 cost. I would prefer if it was once per turn, but even if it was just once per battle, it would still save me a Command Point. Similarly, give Interceptors a once per battle 0 cost Grenades Stratagem to make them more of a threat. Give Strike Squads an ability that improves their performance when fighting on/near objectives. 2) Let the Dreadnought have Deep Strike and be able to use the faction ability. Its aura buff is cool and would be helpful, if you could just get it to where it was needed reliably. 3) Terminators should have a 2+ WS and BS to make them more reliable. They are supposed to be more formiddable than standard Spacemarine Terminators, but currently they are more expensive with nothing to show for it. 4) Characters should be allowed to join a broader selection of units/add more generic characters to join various units. There are no character that can join Interceptors and the only character that can join a Purgation Squad(ranged specialists) is the Champion(melee specialist). This could also be somewhat fixed, if more squads were made Battleline units(as you could then add Inquisitors to them). 5) Make Justicars and Paragons actually do something. Give them access to special gear and equipment, or give the squad a special ability for as long as these models remain alive(see point 1 and 6). 6) Let "Psyker" and "Psychic" do more for the army. For an army full of psykers and psychic weaponry, it is barely utilized. Currently it is mostly a detriment when facing enemies that have "anti-psyker" and "FNP" or "Invulnerable saves" vs Psychic attacks. Example: Psybolts should be available as a Psychic, "one-shot" ranged attack for their Storm Bolters(giving them an alternate fire mode), providing increased Strength and AP(so range 24, Attack 2, Rapid Fire 2, Strength 5, AP-1, Damage 1).

[@crawbag0311]

Techmarine and servitors are good in one thing, ive had very good success with. Take one of each, separate from each other and leave them hidden in table quarters. Have gotten tons of secondary points doing this.

[@spiritofrebellion114]

So if grey knights suck and are boring to play what are some of the funnest Marines to play?

[@donange-louisorsini8062]

I think that GK are not gonna have new units until gw 's gonna refresh every major kit so it is gonna cost😅

[@Damnedlegion40k]

Add a comment...😢 Happy new year 🎊

[@real-lomas-chenko]

Just bought myself a plane 😂

[@obsidanix]

Same I'm about to run a Stormtalon next game 😂

[@real-lomas-chenko]

@obsidanix I'm going with the storm hawk. I think the extra gun, extra toughness and slightly improved cost tips it for me. I know it misses out on +1 vs non flyers but the extra gun makes up for it in my eyes. Plus a lot of scary stuff flies anyway

[@fendelphi]

@@real-lomas-chenko Definitely the Stormhawk over the Stormtalon. Both are somewhat expensive at what they do and does not solve the "anti-tank"/"high toughness" problem(you get more anti-vehicle firepower by bringing 2 Razorbacks with Twin-linked Lascannons and Hunter-Killer missiles), but at least the Stormhawk can reliably hit and wound enemy fliers and the Icarus Stormcannon is not half bad against infantry either.

[@1onebegger]

I could say so much about how GW absolutely butchered the Grey Knights for 10th edition. I have played them since 8th and i had two games and lost all interest. Their index needs a complete rework.

[@starostinpmi13]

Voldus is T1, in worst case in T2 (think about 10 paladins with Voldus) You wrote "good melee" at castelan slide. But he just have same melee as other grey knights.

[@wh40kev98]

I got Crowe into combat for the first time and he was wanting.

[@Jompsy1]

Well, Crowe does have [Devastating Wounds] and [Precision] built in his melee. That's 2CP saved on Radiant Strike I guess. Plus Crowe's ability to nullify first failed save's damage per turn does make a difference..

[@Jompsy1]

On the other hand Voldus seems like the only GK model with really sturdy melee statline at base.

[@starostinpmi13]

@@Jompsy1 what's still "regular" melee cause he hust still A5

[@MrWollollo123]

dreadknight is just bad for what it does and it instantly dies easy against one tau unit for example, defence is a joke (yes 3 people in my group play tau). Venerable dreadnought is useless, 6 inch move and for 155 pts with an ability that is unusable if you play your army right. land raider banisher is pointless. interceptors ability to jump is cool but if i want shooting i won't pick them, so the ablitiy is pointless to me. We have 2 shooting weapons... 2. and we have no ap and no melee weapons to somehow deal with tanks. meaning you always have to pick the same thing. storm bolters are terrible they didn't even give them a psybolt ability or anything. overall i'm just in shock how many rules my opponent has on characters compared.

[@thelegendsmith3063]

Id put grand master dk in tier 5. Regular dreadknight in tier 3 asvance shoot amd charge is a great rule and there is a strat for 1cp that gives it +1 to hit till end of turn so guns on 2s hammer on 3s death from the warp Gmdk cant really use them as it cant use this is it cant advance and charge

[@ericrbacher9371]

Yay grey knights

[@spoonsrattling]

I will say i think grey knights are the single most boring srmy to play against. In my one game against them i think a grand total of two units died.

[@troy6882]

Where the hell are the new tenths and why did they kill magic GW is officially lossing it.....😃😄😁😆😅 5 Smile's. With the Astarte emperor's children and custody OGW????? TENTH???????