HUGE USAF Anti-Ship Attack vs Russia's Black Sea Fleet (WarGames 104A) | DCS

[@grimreapers]

Ukraine-Russia Series: Rus SEAD vs Modernized Patriot: kzbin.info/www/bejne/fJXSqpmBnMaChKc Rus Bombers vs Modernized Patriot: kzbin.info/www/bejne/aoqcZ2SqgbN4Z5o JDAM vs S-400 Network: kzbin.info/www/bejne/rYGXpJl6fJJjZ6c Kinzhal vs Pac-3 & IRIS-T: kzbin.info/www/bejne/n2Gqq5WXn65jo7c F16 or Gripen for Ukraine?: kzbin.info/www/bejne/j17OaGSkm8ajarM Mig-31 vs NATO Black Sea AWACS: kzbin.info/www/bejne/rHeyq52NZ5p8qqs R-37M Long Range Shootdown: kzbin.info/www/bejne/Y2SvfHqCadxsh5Y Drone Swarm vs NATO Defense: kzbin.info/www/bejne/rXWlgIaabtZ2etU Patrio PAC-3/IRIS-T vs Missiles: kzbin.info/www/bejne/hGa9aWSfjJ2MhLs MANPAD/IRIS-T vs Russian Missiles: kzbin.info/www/bejne/hGq1anqLi8iHr80 AGM-158C LRASM vs Sevastopol: kzbin.info/www/bejne/fXW9oHeIna58iNk A-10s Operating in S-400 Nets: kzbin.info/www/bejne/a3Pad5-bqMxnaNE Modernized Su-27 vs Su-35: kzbin.info/www/bejne/bZ3PfXewmrlleNU Modernized F15/F16 vs Su-35: kzbin.info/www/bejne/Y4XSq4d-l6aLjNU Can Su-57 Defend Russia From F-22/35: kzbin.info/www/bejne/e17SdGaEnN12b5Y IMPROVED Stealth vs Russian Bombers: kzbin.info/www/bejne/f5jafYpqjrCpjLc Ukraine Using Hellfire Missile?: kzbin.info/www/bejne/qZCUint6idKDhtk US Harpoons vs Russian Navy: kzbin.info/www/bejne/hZrIlmtpeLyFmac Ukraine Using APKWS?: kzbin.info/www/bejne/fHPbh2yPqqaZl9k Ukraine US HARMs vs Russian S-400: kzbin.info/www/bejne/m4TcdoKOqM-KpZo Patriot/NASAMS vs Supersonic Missiles: kzbin.info/www/bejne/n2LUaKh6ms6hd5Y Fulcrum/Flanker vs Foxbat/Super Flanker: kzbin.info/www/bejne/eJm7l6uZbpl9d7c NASAMS vs Russian Cruise Missiles: kzbin.info/www/bejne/pnuskJVvas-tps0 Russian KH-47M2 vs Polish Air Force: kzbin.info/www/bejne/mZ_Vh6ungZqkb9k Su-27 & Drone vs Snake Island: kzbin.info/www/bejne/ipDSg6KLZ6asnNE Su-25s vs Russian Convoy At Kyiv: kzbin.info/www/bejne/qKq5Z2iYiq-tqNk NATO Eurofighters vs Crimean AWACS: kzbin.info/www/bejne/e5qtY5d8h81sa8k Patriot, Gepard & Gripen vs KH-65: kzbin.info/www/bejne/kJnblaWEn86aZ8k A-10s vs Russian Convoy At Kyiv: kzbin.info/www/bejne/eGHXi6KlZdp_npY USN Tomahawk Strike Kerch Bridge: kzbin.info/www/bejne/ZqfTmmuud96ajJo USAF Stealth Strike Kerch Bridge: kzbin.info/www/bejne/f3vFl2x4mN2hrZI Ukrainian Jets Strike Kerch Bridge: kzbin.info/www/bejne/f2mppqCrj7eYeJY F-22 Raptors vs Russian Fighters: kzbin.info/www/bejne/eaDQg5ajp9x9jc0 Raptor/Eagle vs Super Flanker: kzbin.info/www/bejne/oZbUiqCriKqiY5o USAF Bombers vs Mariupol Defenses: kzbin.info/www/bejne/l3TWk6KFfJWEi5Y Ukraine Bombs Snake Island: kzbin.info/www/bejne/eImZammDgMmemJo Stealth Fighters vs Russian Bombers: kzbin.info/www/bejne/qKrQamOgo7Z3qaM Sinking Of Moskva #3: kzbin.info/www/bejne/hHrNoKx_nsqCsLs Sinking Of Moskva #2: kzbin.info/www/bejne/qZ_Nl5WglKqqjZY Sinking Of Moskva #1: kzbin.info/www/bejne/eKnamWmDfLF9hMU Russia Nukes Britain: kzbin.info/www/bejne/qKvOZWiIe7aqd5o Ukraine Uses Danish F-16s: kzbin.info/www/bejne/Z2izmp6opZWEl7s Ukraine Uses Polish Mig-29s: kzbin.info/www/bejne/sHTMZad3ft-ohbc Russian-Britain Missile Attack: kzbin.info/www/bejne/sKiseJmXl9utfqM Ghost Of Kyiv: kzbin.info/www/bejne/j6PGpWuMadNkY7c Belgorod Raid: kzbin.info/www/bejne/o4LcnIeuqZuZqtk Eurofighter/Fulcrum vs Super Flanker: kzbin.info/www/bejne/g4Hcepymes2aiJI US Strike vs Odessa kzbin.info/www/bejne/gZbMgHudr86WbLs Russian Helo Rocket Lob: kzbin.info/www/bejne/Z2KbeJp9o7WSqa8 Russian Su-25 vs US Patriot SAM: kzbin.info/www/bejne/l6TTZ2yQecSnhZI Understanding Russian SAMs: kzbin.info/www/bejne/iGXbhauCg7-Lmdk Ukrainian Jets Road Operations: kzbin.info/www/bejne/nnPTq4SentODmNk Russian 40 Mile Convoy: kzbin.info/www/bejne/jKPCXmV8gcefeM0 Flanker vs Super Flanker: kzbin.info/www/bejne/jICkpoJ8ga96oZY

[@arsenijearsen3041]

What USA army want in Black Sea?

[@pogo1140]

Remember those iranian speedboats? can they converted to act like those Ukrainian Unmanned boats? low RCS, 80kph top speed, 40knots, 250-400lbs warhead? The Ukrainians say they cost about 250k USD each. How many of those would be needed to take out the Black Sea fleet?

[@Gabriel_McMillan]

It all seems mostly realistic, except you left out the nuclear counter-strike. Every time you launch an LRASM at the Russian fleet, you have to also launch a Poseidon at DC and London, to make it realistic. Did you know the Russian Navy just took possession of the first production run of Poseidon torpedoes? Those will go on the Belgorod subs, the largest subs in the world, which are already at sea. Those likely have a 200 megaton warhead, from what I've read, which will generate a 500 meter high tsunami, covering thousands of miles of coastline, coming dozens of miles inland, entombing every bunker in their wake, and they may very well be salted warheads too, rendering the flooded region uninhabitable for decades or even centuries. Can a mod be made for the Belgorod, I wonder? Russia is not China. The difference is in the nuclear arsenal. You only get one war, Cap, and it's going to have to be with China. That's probably better, really, considering how much farther away it is from Europe.

[@pogo1140]

@@Gabriel_McMillan And yet Harpoons and Neptunes will be launched against said fleet in real life and some time this year Boeing/SAAB Small Diameter bombs will likely make their debut, blowing up S-400 radars and ammo depots 100km behind the Russian lines.

[@Gabriel_McMillan]

P.S. I saw Prof. Clarke on Sky News yesterday, where he was arguing that the Ukrainians had been using HARM missiles to counter the Pantsir systems that were defending supply depots against the HIMARS.

[@bgeigleg2508]

I would be shocked if the LRASM missiles couldn't communicate with each other and at the very least assign an equal number of missiles to each ship to spread out the damage. You would also think it would be possible for F-35 pilots to assign targets to the LRASM as they neared the fleet.

[@zhaloofficial2686]

that's exactly what i was thinking. If the LRASM's communicate with each other would that make target designation easy or at least extremely possible?

[@markbreton1620]

Agree, but this is DCS. ED keeps it stuck in the late '80s.

[@jonathanpfeffer3716]

They can and do.

[@YodaWasSith]

Well, of course it can. It does other things good too. For example, it can be fired from at least a range of 200 miles (Probably much more) and then the pilot can just leave the area, no need for locking or assigning targets. You can tell the missile you're looking for X target where X is whatever ship, and it will seek to destroy that ship using AI to detect multiple different aspects about the ship and compare it to its database of information to ensure a proper kill on an intended target even if the waters are filled with civilians. If the AI is feeling lazy that day, the missile can be remotely controlled via datalink. In a group of them, each missile communicates through low power signal transmission with each other. So, say you assign a primary target and then have all the other missiles seeking any tertiary targets, and if there are none, they can be harmlessly destroyed. The missile is also equipped with sensors to detect the terrain around it with extreme precision, and it compares that data to its database in order to fly efficiently, accurately, and seek targets with battlefield awareness which surpasses the capabilities of human motor control and reflexes. It's also outdated technology and it hasn't even seen combat. Ten year old war technology with fewer kills than a DJI Mavic.

[@SevPlays]

They can do that and as I understand will also arrange themselves to all come in from different angles at the same time. No idea if jamming can stop them doing that but of course if you were jamming a bunch then you might also limit your ability to target them at the same time.

[@emmata98]

I think a full stealth attack would have been noticed way later, so they would scramble way later

[@voidtempering8700]

I think it would be detected earlier. L-band radars can detect stealth aircraft at standard ranges.

[@voidtempering8700]

@@mattseller148 A stealth fighter can get identified at standard engagement ranges with an L-band radar, once identified, aircraft can than be mobilized for an interception. Stealth aircraft have a far lesser effect on low band radar than high band radars.

[@voidtempering8700]

@@mattseller148 Once again, stealth aircraft are very visible on lower band radars. They can be ID based on the radar signature they are outputting. They can only be targeted and locked from close range, they can be detected from a lot farther away.

[@voidtempering8700]

@@mattseller148 It looks like we are. I agree with your statement about only being able to target them at very close range I disagreed with the statement that the detection time would be lower, when low band radars can detect an aircraft from greater ranges.

[@marshalljulie3676]

What you think is not facts though just based on your feelings really 😂. Stealth is not an invisibility cloaking device. They can be detected even by old radar. The Syrian shot and damaged the rear end of an Israeli f-35 this made the News they tried to say it was a bird collision.

[@urielmanzone1772]

I think in such a strike a lot of decoys and at least some bombers would be involved to consume as many defense missile as possible and overwhelm their defenses more easily. Also i think F-15s and Eurofighters would be used rather than F-16 due to their range (they were missing their fuel tanks as well so It wasnt surprising seeing them running out so early). Lastly i guess using vsn f 16 also messed with the ai and a Sead Escort would certainly be used

[@Squirl513]

I was wondering about the lack of decoys as well.

[@Davros-vi4qg]

Numerical limits on unit amounts.

[@urielmanzone1772]

@@Davros-vi4qg you can make bigger strikes in dcs, look at their csg vs csg stuff

[@dougie2631]

F16 has far superior range to a Eurofighter I'm pretty sure

[@dougie2631]

Spot on about decoys, they would play large role as would super hornets

[@ThatJag_guy]

When you see those two planes in a Grim Reapers video, you know this is gonna be epic.

[@matthewshirley4349]

Loving your work Cap. Appreciate the effort it takes to create this content.

[@grimreapers]

thx

[@clangerbasher]

I am always amazed when I discuss fighters on defence forums how many 'experts' aren't aware how short legged these aircraft are. DCS demonstrates this well.

[@BaldHeadedManc]

I guess they think aerial refueling is just for show lol

[@clangerbasher]

@@BaldHeadedManc Yes. It is all very interesting.

[@92HazelMocha]

It's all a matter of perspective, cruising at m.7 at 35k asl, yes they all have a lot of range, but full afterburner down on the deck and that range decreases exponentially.

[@pogo1140]

Afterburners and denser air.

[@clangerbasher]

@@92HazelMocha Yes I hear ya. 🙂

[@dreamhunter2973]

Hey cap... Excellent work as always! But I think it's time you start to do more integrated warfare, have both airforce and naval assets of a country working together.... I know that this will be twice as hard and would require a lot more planning ..... But this type of integrated warfare is the future of warfare and I think it's also the content for the future of this channel.... All the best🥰😍

[@emfournet]

TALDs!

[@pogo1140]

Russians don't seem to do integrated warfare, the Russian AF have been shot down by Russain Army air defense missiles, there is a good chance that the Russian Navy will have a hard time de-conflicting since all of the Navy radars are from before the Russian aircraft were built.

[@Gabriel_McMillan]

Seems pretty realistic, except you left out the nuclear counter-strike. Every time you launch an LRASM at the Russian fleet, you have to also launch a Poseidon at DC and London, to make it realistic. Russia is not China. The difference is in the nuclear arsenal.

[@pogo1140]

@@Gabriel_McMillan What's to keep the LRASM's from being launched from Ukrainian SU-24's and SU-27's or from ground based mobile launchers or from Low RCS unmanned surface warfare vessels?

[@hanrockabrand95]

@@Gabriel_McMillan agreed, but also factor in the entire history of Russian diligence when it comes to maintenance, planning, training, etc. So the nukes would go out, but maybe the London-bound missile lands in Belarus for unspecified reasons.

[@timharkins754]

With the available media sources that I've been able to find, Russia has between 7 & 12 ships left in their Black Sea Fleet. Twelve ships being the Russian number given.

[@TheAmbex]

To help simulate a better deconfliction try splitting the anti-ship force into multiple blobs coming in on different vectors. A blob coming from the NW will choose different ships compared to a blob coming from the SW. Or at least we could expect less duplication.

[@guyincognito3085]

And/or dog-leg the LRASMs so they have different approach vectors. With a little math, you can also use this method to create a simultaneous TOT for the salvos.

[@TheAmbex]

@@guyincognito3085 exactly, I like the dog-leg approach too

[@richardperry4105]

Hey Cap, I know it’s a lot of work great effort. Can I make a couple suggestions? I agree the Raptors should go in 20 miles ahead of the Vipers. I also think some Eagles should’ve been used to carry additional bar missiles to support the Raptors. Would a wild weasel mission be effective in the operation as well? Perhaps try using the Vipers to get in the SAM net, wait for a missile to be fired, the turn cold and go back out range. I think in conjunction with the wild weasel you’ll be able to use up the S400 SAMs with fewer losses to USAF. With the S400s used up it then allows for the Vipers and Eagle EX to get in and support the Raptors in achieving air dominance especially if pulling all Russian resources to the north while the Lighting anti ship comes from the west. Perhaps after the Lightings have fired the LRASMs then squadrons of Eagle E and Vipers with the laser guided bombs at medium altitude can cleanup what the anti ships leave behind. Thanks again.

[@Noble9863]

It'd be baller to see that, but it'd probably be too intensive to run

[@bussolini6307]

the SU-35 is a very capable fighter, no wonder iran was willing to supply thousands of drones and missiles to Russia for just 24 SU-35(and some helicopters and air defense systems), great video as always cap.

[@trazyntheinfinite9895]

Too bad the plane will be shit by the time russia is done cobbling them together in their slumsweatshops.

[@EmmettDia]

I believe it’s the best non stealth fighter with the large load large speed and acceleration and warfare and super maneuverability, it’s so great that China bought about over 20 over them just to copy their engines and their engine thrust vectoring for their new 5th gem fighter J20

[@nick4819]

You act as if Iran is the one taking the loss....fuck no. Iran would be an absolute idiot to not take that deal. Those cheap ass drones they gave them, even in the numbers they did, doesn't come close to the price of the SU35's. Russia got slapped in the face because they were desperate. I'd love to see the terms Russia gave Iran on those jets...like is it a "We will deliver immediately?" or is it "We will deliver as soon as we deem our country is safe" and will never deliver or take 40 years to deliver? What's Iran going to do to Russia if they don't deliver?

[@Davros-vi4qg]

Yep, the chance of a single Su35 getting built at present = 0

[@jamesomalley3566]

Davros you are dumb, Russia is actively building dozens of su 35s. 🤣 Russia makes all of its own parts and processors and chips. You need to stop believing the lying media. You really think Russia can have twice as many successful space launches alone than the entire rest of the world and also have the most advanced nuclear technology and hypersonic technology but suddenly cannot build su 35s or main battle tanks because of "sanctions"? 🤣

[@splatoonistproductions5345]

It’d be interesting to see if the whole uk fleet can defend against a massive attack from Russian fleet and air assets w defending air assets to boot and all, it’d be interesting

[@onefan1249]

What happened to using drones as missile targets? I remember you and Kortana doing that vs the S400.

[@matthiasderoo9133]

Just attack during a rainstom you could do with half the missiles!

[@davidwilliams5749]

LOL

[@buxomborin]

Too soon?

[@BoraHorzaGobuchul]

Wasn't the rainstorm theory debunked? In any case, an attacking fleet is bound to be more alert than guys who though nothing could touch them.

[@manangupta6458]

excited for the future of grim reapers and the campaign mode idea sounds great!!

[@jamison884]

Pre-battle comment (the US could annihilate them for all I know, but my points stand). 1. Any USAF attack would use the USAF bomber force (B-2/B-1B/B-52 outside of the threat range or behind fighter cover) and keep most/all F-35s in full stealth as it is one of the critical advantages on the battlefield. I'm guessing they would use F-35 in stealth and then use F-15/F-16/F-22 for additional fighter cover, F-16 for SEAD and wild wease;. and then F-15E to carry additional anti-ship missiles if needed (to compliment the bomber squadron). This is my best guess. 2. What was the concept behind Russian ships having radar that is apparently (per the description/introduction) the best in DCS and able to detect stealth missiles better than Chinese/US ships? The US is currently in the process of deploying the new SPY-6 AESA radar on Flight III Burkes and multiple Flight IIA Burkes have been selected for retrofitting the new radar onto them. But despite this new radar, I'm fairly certain Russia doesn't have a more powerful or more effective radar than the US/China/most NATO countries. I love the scenario of course. However, this feels a little bit like the Russians were artficially inflated to make the battle more interesting. I'm all for that if this is true to some extent, but I'd rather just be told that if that's indeed the case. Please note this is the internet, and I type alll of this with a smile and my arms wide open for a hug. This is not hatred, just feedback and my opinion. Thank you as always Cap and Co!

[@jamison884]

Also, the US knows the status of the Black Sea fleet just about as well as Russia does (I've seen the historic flight patterns for ISR assets and read reports of US intelligence alerting Ukraine of all sorts of data). They would design an attack mission and launch only if they were very confident in absolutely overwheling the enemy force. Edit now that I'm watching it. - 5% PK of AIM-120D? 38 missiles, 2 hits? Near 50% for R-77? - Where's the Ukrainian SAM system? My reply on real-life ASM deconfliction. I'd bet on my own life the real-life coding of anti-ship missile software outperforms DCS coding by many orders of magnitude. They are datalinked between the missiles and back to the fire control systems that fired/launched them. They have infrared terminal guidance which should be programmed to recognize a ship being hit (massive infrared spike in intensity upon impact), and they have AI-assisted databases with the profile of potential enemy ships to identify their target (and select their target) prior to impact. I'm confident you have tried everything possible with DCS deconfliction. I believe the best and easiest workaround for war games purposes: add ASM hits to the ships, and allow a maximum of two missile hits per ship. So, for example, if you have the scoreboard count 64 LRASM hits against 32 ships and there were a bunch of LRASMs which failed to deconflict and say up to 5-8 hit the same dead target, attribute two LRASM hits for each kill and assume real-world deconfliction would work based on the hundreds of millions worth of development they had. So, 64 LRASM hits on 32 targetted ships = 2 hits attriuted to each ship, all 32 ships counted as eliminated.

[@davidwilliams5749]

Yes, there is no reason to use F35s to deliver ordinance and blow their stealth capability. LOL, the notion that the Russians have even 4 air-worthy Su-57s is a fantasy.

[@grimreapers]

2) well it's interesting, CH programmed the ships and decided the 2015+ ship radars will be good enough to track the LRASM etc. Is that realistic? No one knows, so I say let's roll with it and see where it ends.

[@jamison884]

​@@grimreapers I love CH for the work he has done, but things have to be applied consistently if making such decisions. For example, the "2025/2030" US CSG would have the SPY-6 radars which is new as of 2022. Similarly, all US (and NATO) destroyers to the best of my knowledge have chaff/decoy/countermeasure systems, yet the Chinese 055 appears to be the only ship being given credit for such systems via the work-around "short-range SAM" implementation. I didn't review the video or anything, but it appeared those countermeasures had 100% PK in addition to a range of something like one mile? I'd say emulation of chaff would be more realistic with an even shorter range of a few hundred meters at best (as small a radius as possible given the highest velocity possible, as emulating chaff via this method would ideally be mach 20 with zero spool/ignition time and a range of 20 meters above the ship) and adjusted to a PK of no greater than 75% as a decent guess on the effectiveness of ship countermeasures. I'm certainly not saying just take my word estimates as the way it should be, as with virtually any topic like this, it's probably best to gather the thoughts of multiple individuals who follow this sort of technology and international miliatires. Thanks Cap.

[@daviddenney4447]

I would love to see this again but swap the 16s with 15s or something capable of carrying the American decoy missiles and send those in a couple staggered waves to soak up a lot of the initial S400 and Su-35 missiles. All in all a fantastic video🎉

[@telesto912]

Why wouldn’t you do a full stealth attack? The F-16s telegraph that something is coming. With a full stealth attack they would have a huge surprise advantage

[@92HazelMocha]

It's not really a surprise attack, it's a juicy target in the middle of the world's most active warzone. You're not going to surprise people who are actively looking for an attack, especially since the moskva became a submarine. Also the Russian AWACS can still see the incoming aircraft.

[@snapperface12345]

Technically, (I know cap said no subs) but, the US would have sent their subs In after the air engagement and then surprised them. But, here we are!

[@jonathanpfeffer3716]

@@92HazelMocha There’s a difference between a strategic and tactical surprise attack. On the strategic level, of course an attack will always be expected on a valuable target like that, just like you said. But on a tactical level surprise is of course possible. Giving your enemy as little time as possible to run the OODA loop is the name of the game in modern warfare (especially naval warfare) and having an all-stealth approach would absolutely do that. I’m surprised they chose to send the Vipers in first, since it seems pretty obvious to me how and why 5th gens go first.

[@randlebrowne2048]

@@jonathanpfeffer3716 The US also has a habit of using lots of decoys and jammers to sow confusion (and waste defending missiles and ammo) during it's large-scale attacks.

[@ADTinman]

When you are looking at the scoreboard in terms of economic cost - don't forget the "relative comparison" in cost for Russia and the US. The US GDP was $25 trillion and the Russian GDP was $1.79 trillion. Then there is replacement cost and time. The US replacement cost is higher - but the Russian replacement time may be infinite.

[@williambillcowman]

Would love to see a flight of F-15 E’s come in after the LOASMs just to finish off the stragglers. Long time watcher/subscriber. Love the content Cap. Cheers

[@simonsmotocat2774]

No tactics was involved. 1) Decoys could be used to distract the initial launches of R-77s. This would deplete them well. 2) F-22s could attack from various directions.

[@chuckfarley4130]

Just send in a few cheap Neptune missiles. Works 100 percent of the time.

[@sunkings5972]

Hearing CAP hyperventilate almost as epic as the battle itself. Well done boys and girls.

[@MG_Steve]

It would be interesting to see how different this would be with a Patriot system stationed as far as close to the coast as you could (according to front lines). Likewise, run this with AIM260s as they're supposed to be in service this year. Also you said a B1 got rushed - perhaps run a diversion strike on a different vector to pull the fighters out of position? I know you're a bit restricted with approach routes though, so maybe not feasible. I'd like to see this run again though with your revised F22 positioning, a Patriot site as close to the coast as you think you could get it and AIM260s, think of it as a Q3 2023 operation when all these should be in place.

[@wilsonspicher6690]

And add r37m and mig 31

[@Craeshen]

Patriot would probably be covering Odessa realistically

[@twbones99]

One thing you could do to mitigate the issues with the LRASM missiles deconflicting is have some kind of large target like a carrier that’s set to be invincible but not able to defend itself that acts as the “fleet” in the eyes of the missiles but you place the fleet itself around the carrier and have them operate as they normally would. You then count the hits on your invincible aircraft carrier and apply that to the fleet as destroyed vessels. This of course assumes the LRASM in real life would be able to distinguish a dead ship from a fighting ship. Could be a nice work around for future projects

[@agggrgrg2419]

Interesting, that should mean that Type 055 and the SPY-6 should be able to detect lrasm at similar ranges then.

[@grimreapers]

Yes I am worried about this. a lot.

[@agggrgrg2419]

@@grimreapers well don't worry if you can't get it to work I understand you guys are trying your best with core game limitations. DCS is more suited to modeling Chinese or Russian missiles which tend to rely on more brute force to succeed while lrasm is more of a smart weapon. For example a pair of lrasms may decide to attack from different vectors against the Russian Corvette whose panstir ciws can only attack one vector at a time meaning that one will get through and kill it. Or maybe it will target a Type 055's radar array stopping it from intercepting further missiles, or a carriers arresting gear effectively killing all airborne aircraft. Lrasm is just something you lack capability to model and as such I understand if it is underperforming. Generally I think stealth to represent the evasion tactics it employs and a large damage yield to represent precise targeting of weak spots are probably the best you could do RN.

[@92HazelMocha]

Tbh probably longer ranges, Type 055's radar and SPY-6 are much newer and more sophisticated than Russian ship radars from ten years ago.

[@kevinbryer2425]

In real life, the S-400s would have been prioritized for a SEAD mission by a B-2. The LRASMs would have been dropped by a flight of B-1s, but under cover of a Patriot battery on the Romanian coast, and the LRASMs would have been escorted to within a few dozen miles of the fleet by F-22s. A bunch of joint strike missiles, carried internally by F-35s, could have also encouraged the Fleet to expend much of its defensive ordinance before the main event arrives.

[@chuckfarley4130]

No. In reality a bunch of cheap Neptune missiles would have wiped out the entire fleet.

[@wallyman292]

300k subs!!! Congrats! Love watching you guys play. I'd love to have a set-up to play DCS, but alas, I've already got too many toys. . . ;)

[@ThinBlueLineGuardian]

3:47 literally having a stroke listening to your reactions of what is happening in the battlespace😂🤣

[@edl653]

Another fun and exciting battle. - Another thing you can do to make it realistic is include some Wild Weasels/HARM attacks. I would expect that to be one of the first tactic happening at the beginning of an Air Campaign.

[@jugganaut33]

Why wasn’t Ukraines Sam net taken into account? Just out of curiosity this has SU35’s flying over Odessa. When that entire coast is littered with Manpads and S300 and BUk

[@onefan1249]

I love watching you guys learn how to run a sim. Looking forward to the next version when programming is more lifelike.

[@jackmizell5894]

Love these big battles! Would it be possible to integrate a SEAD element (TALDs perhaps) and give the F-16s tanks?

[@joshuamcbride2814]

F16 with no bags just seems stupid to me , it drinks fuel like crazy

[@Pimps-R-us]

Cap, First off. Great Video, I always love the one's that involve the ships like this. I was wondering though while watching, How many Potential human lives would be lost from the ships being destroyed like that. Is there some way you can program that into you counting script to get an idea?

[@cephal0p0d]

"Black Sea fleet is a very nasty adversary". That didn't age well. =]

[@edwardlittle5686]

Great job Cap as usual - lots of work put into this. I don't know how possible it is in-game, but in real life there would be a SEAD element to suppress those S-400s. That would change the equation massively in favor of the good guys

[@Noble9863]

I was about to comment the same thing. I'd like to see this in another go and maybe with the Fodder-16s congregated north more to better lead the Su-35s away from the F-35s. Of course they could instead do what Cap suggested at the end and have the F-22s spawn ahead and swat the Su's as they pop up. No matter what, I'd definitely like to see this scenario ran again!

[@adamsmith2944]

In real life most of the NATO equipment isnt functional! Lmao

[@krebssfish9370]

@@adamsmith2944 I know you're just a frequent troll here, but it's quite funny what you say, given that most systems were not working or malfunctioning on the Moskva when it was sunk. Or that ruzzia's only aircraft carrier spends most of its time being towed or burning in a dry dock 😆

[@adamsmith2944]

@@krebssfish9370 frequent troll? No. I only know a bit about reality. If you think the western weapons are so strong why don't you go get paid to use them in ukraine? And who did you know on the moskva?

[@krebssfish9370]

@@adamsmith2944 No one, I just read the ruzzian maintenance report on the ship before it became a Ukrainian national heritage site. Who did you know on the Moskva? (Also, nice dodge on the Kuznetsov)

[@robjohnson5872]

Read about 30 comments. I agree the F-16s might have best been used as Wild Weasels, with the f-22s sitting in ambush waiting to jump the S-35s as they pursued the F-16s. Not sure about the range of the F-35s with 4 x 1500 lb. missiles strapped outside, but I do know it would qualify as stealth anymore. I wonder what the range (performance) of the LRASMs are when launched at sea level. And I hope that IRL these $3,000,000 missiles are better able to prioritize and differentiate between targets. If so, the Russian losses in this scenario might have doubled. We have seen before them choosing a cruiser or DD over a within eyesight carrier as well as having seen them hit multiple times on the same sinking target. This would absolutely be worth revisiting with a Grim Reapers tactic change. I know there's only so much you can do with the mods - really appreciate all yous guys efforts !

[@Editzify]

Love your vids cap they make me smile to see how well people can create missions for dcs :)

[@mattbrown4269]

Tactical suggestion: put the Raptors right behind a reduced number of Vipers. Vipers attract SU-35s like a lure; SU-35s bite; Raptors reel them in before they know they’re there.

[@trazyntheinfinite9895]

Raptor pilot in turl voice: While you were learning how to STEALTH YOUR PLANES >I< was taught to darksouls dodgeroll!

[@grimreapers]

It would have been impossible for a human to operate in a 4th gen plane in that fight. too many missiles in the air.

[@markbreton1620]

"...sacrifice F16s..." . I guess you forgot that the USAF has a sacrifice platform called MALD. Or in the case of DCS TALD. Mix in some AGM-88 closely followed by the fighter sweep and they can ignore the SA-400. I tried a similar scenario and the SA-400 ignored everything till the MALDs were dead.

[@cannon3267]

really nice work there cap. just love the boom boom. just a thought.. can you mod the program so when a ship is hit and killed, it is removed from the screen?? that way maybe some deconfliction issues may be reduced.

[@TK199999]

LRASM can differentiate sunk targets for live targets, I believe they have on board computers that can tell by sight (based on image in memory) and on IR, is a ship on fire they move on to another ship in their target list that is not on fire. I believe the latest model Harpoons can too, along with the latest US, UK, French, Russian and Chinese anti-ship missiles. But the system has its limitations and can be effected by enough jamming, like most missiles.

[@BoostedB0i]

is there a way in game to deploy decoy gliders and have a wild weasel team follow along to destroy AA threats? or even just flood the airspace with decoys first

[@randlebrowne2048]

That's actually what the US has done in all of it's more recent large-scale strikes. Lot's of decoys, jamming and stealth.

[@jp1563]

Isn't this why we would take out the SAM net with a barrage of cruise missiles first?

[@AbruptandOffensive]

To be fair, the US would use cruise missiles to destroy the SAM sites before the fast movers even attempted a break through.

[@dowgy177]

Very optimistic of you to assume Russia can gather enough vodka to get one whole fleet actually running.

[@djzoodude]

Some suggestions for improvements: 1) Delete the F-16s from the attack. It was a good idea, but all it seemed to achieve was making the Russians scramble sooner. The F-35, even with external stores, has a much smaller RCS than an F-16. They would have been detected much later and caused the Russians to scramble later. 2) Send the F-22s in well ahead of the anti-ship force. In full stealth mode, they could easily penetrate to within AIM-120D range of the Russian bases without being detected. Then when the Russian fighters scramble, the F-22s can pick them off as they are taking off. 3) The B-21 is not in service yet, but the B-2 is, and it can carry LRASMs. It's not as stealthy as an F-22 or an F-35 in full stealth mode, but it's definitely stealthy enough to get to LRASM range without being picked up on radar. You'd also need fewer planes, since each B-2 can carry a lot more LRASMs than an F-35. 4) Would it be possible to stagger the waves of LRASMs more, so the ships have time to sink before the next wave comes in? You might need to use fewer missiles that way to get around the deconfliction problems.

[@Bys_cniht]

The content which really hooked me to this channel was the star wars stuff. I thought it was so great to see Earth factions taking on the Galactic Empire.

[@laurentii777]

Cap should work as a sportcommentator. This is like watching a sportgame. Great commentary!

[@tonyd.7088]

If you want to properly simulate the black sea fleet, you should disable half their systems due to maintenance issues just like the Moskva

[@epi2045]

That wind up was epic. The fist has rights too.

[@lorentzcoffin4957]

A couple things are missing from this namely that given the presence of sam batteries decoy and jamming drone swarms would be deployed first followed by the f-16s (potentially at a much lower altitude to try and minimize their exposure over the horizon). B-(5)2s or rapid dragon equipped cargo planes would also likely participate in this attack. The resources brought to bear are not commensurate with the exercise.

[@Spartan1-1]

You should do this battle again, I really enjoyed it a lot

[@WWCephas]

You need to add EF-18 Growler jamming

[@ryanfaulkner183]

Simbas defensive work was legendary

[@daszieher]

"Silas, don't tell your mother." Posts it on KZbin Jimmy, we love you 😂

[@jamesohara4295]

48 ships, two Trafalga class submarines rquired :)

[@Debbiebabe69]

Trafalgers are museum pieces, of the 7 built only 1 still sails the rest are retired.

[@randlebrowne2048]

More likely, given the scenario, two (or more) Virginia class subs.

[@jamesohara4295]

@@randlebrowne2048 One would be enough to demorlize them and just the threat of a second would be enough for them to seek safe harbour and end their aggression.

[@henrygibson9613]

Amazing. why i love wargames! appreciate the hardwork so much. thanks!

[@polarking888]

I love the "FIND THAT ANGLE !!"

[@_goobs]

I'd like to see this scenario run again with B-21s, as they would be much less visible to L-band and would have been detected much later.

[@thechadgonehamm]

The rapid dragon program in an C5 bring up the rear

[@someoneonetheinternet]

When tracking costs are you counting unspent ordinance that goes down with the planes or ships that carried them?

[@caliado]

did you see the infographics show video on this? It was "what if Russia launched nukes in Ukraine" and the US response. They had stealth fighters and B52's and the B52's launched decoys causing the Russian naval ships to expend all their defensive missiles against the decoys and then the real cruise missiles fired from B52's utterly annihilate the entire fleet.

[@benelgar-white1174]

With the SU-35s being so close to the F-35's as they were launching, would those missiles be detectable by onboard radar and would the Russian integrated system be able to use that to track them or prepare in some other way (moving AWACS over) so defences could be more effective?

[@jamesmaida47]

Let's be honest here, it would be very easy for the next wave to be B1 Lancers or B52s (yes, I know the LRASM isn't currently operational on the BUFF, but I'm sure they could correct that in no time.) absolutely stacked with LRASM to finish off the fleet. Also, planners would have known about the SAMs and had assets doing more to suppress the enemy air defense. Either way, good show.

[@WTFBODY]

I think one thing was missing if you were basing this on current events. The Ukrainians should have had at least one S300 battery around Odessa to help cover the F-16s and F-35s. It may have made the difference in efficiency overall. Other than that, a really interesting setup and execution.

[@chuckfarley4130]

The Ukrainians used 2 cheap Neptune missiles to take out the Moskva. Recently retrofitted with Russia's best radars and AA missile systems. Fully on alert...it was incapable of taking out the 2 missiles.

[@mechm9728]

I find this an interesting thought experiment on how much more potent a threat russia would be at sea if they were better at actually having a navy. The readiness of the fleet and its relavent combat ability (including detection ability for incoming attack) is highly enhanced in this scenario if the reported condition (from a Russian readiness report mind you!) of the Black Sea Fleet flagship was any indication before she was sunk. This assumes maximum readiness and maintenance that the Russian navy has shown a quite frankly criminal lack of.

[@wilsonspicher6690]

It's not just Russian issue an American light carrier caught fire in Port and was determined to be a total loss

[@mechm9728]

@@wilsonspicher6690 Okay, except that is a dockyard incident, and incidents happen. I'm speaking of the ships themselves and their crews. The Russian navy have shown in numerous instances, both in the current conflict and when they shadowed American ships that patrolled the Black sea before the current hostilities that they have no where near the combat readiness of the standing American Navy. I never said it was only a Russian issue, only that the Russian readiness of its fleet is in severe doubt if they allowed the flagship of the fleet to end up in such a state of disrepair that he couldn't have his radar on without jamming their own radio system, only had one of his six ciws systems operational, and had numerous water tight doors forced open. That is all information that came from a Russian readiness report bare weeks( i don't exactly remember the time frame but I do believe it was at most two weeks) before she sank. Im sorry, if your flagship is in such a state, I doubt any other ship she is supposed to command is in any better. Its also funny you mention carriers, because the only Russian one has proved once more that it is a truly cursed ship, as the drydock SANK around the thing and put a massive hole in its flight deck with a falling crane, once more forcing it into drydock once they FIND one they can actually put him in. All I commented on was COMBAT READINESS, which maintenance is a part of. Dockyard incidents are not always indicative of overall readiness of a nations fleet. Weather the weapons and systems of a ship in that navy ACTUALLY ARE WORKING is, and Russian documentation on his readiness paints a very poor picture for the Moskva before he sank.

[@DAVIDGREGORYKERR]

They are known to be using Over The Horizon Radar which needs to be put out of action.

[@Tenright77]

Super Cap, Could there have been Anti Radiation assignments in the initial strike? The S-400s were the initial issue it seemed... I know 400's are tough targets...

[@chuckfarley4130]

Not in reality if struck with stealth aircraft. The S-400 cant operate its radar in the presence of HARM missiles, otherwise it gets bonked.

[@Tenright77]

@@chuckfarley4130 Exactly, my point. The presence of HARM would not be immediately obvious. Destroyed, or Not Operated, yields same result.

[@chuckfarley4130]

@@Tenright77 I agree. But in DCS those HARM missiles would be blasted out of the sky every time. DCS is a video game, and not very realistic as far as war games are concerned.

[@patricktracy4371]

Col. Bellenda was in charge of Russian forces today.

[@strambino1]

Great job on all the detail Cap! Awesome job on the same reapers!

[@edmorris1437]

How would the new AGM88Gs be used in a scenario like this? I would think shortly before LRASMs are launched. The AGM88G is reported to have double the range of previous variants and capable of reaching Mach4. Wikipedia article also indicated F35A/C can carry them internally. Could they get close enough to launch?

[@VarkDriver]

I like all the coordination involved with setting these up. The F-16s would never go in before the Raptors, they were basically missile fodder.

[@VarkDriver]

@@flashgordon6670 Good for a game, never in real life. The Raptors would sweep first and eliminate the air-air threat, then the Vipers would push to play SEAD.

[@daszieher]

I love it, when a Joe average is part of success. There are a couple of heros out there and they are very important, but the numerous games of throws that we have come to enjoy so much watching this channel show, that no matter how hard the hero carries, if his team is hell bent on clutching defeat from the jaws of victory, there are no shoulders wide and no back strong enough to perform the carrying of beyond epic proportions needed in those cases. I tip my hat to a Dutchman and fellow army-man and I envy him for having been able to drive around in our car-nations heaviest four passenger turbo-diesel sedan. 😉

[@sharpy3453]

i think irl, this attack would have been more one sided if it were to happen tomorrow, b-2 and b-1 would probably be there to drop a bunch, plus the usa would probably have hunter killer subs lurking as well along with a missile attack from surface ships. great video none the less

[@jouniairplanevideos]

This was amazing, could you do this with F15ex instead of f16C? I think it would have a slightly better result for the US and Ukrain of course.

[@grimreapers]

Agree I should have used F-15.

[@Nealetony]

They dont have patriots yet but if the us was doing this ukraine would be moving s300 and other anti air in to screen for the us as well as providing screen with fighters to buy the stealth more time.

[@Anarchy_420]

Yo Cap lol its like I keep saying F-22 Raptor's first then F-15EX's! Lol or B-1R's or my favorite both! Instead of just F-35's hb less maybe half The F-35's and One B-2 and or B-21 Raider!👍

[@kdaltex]

Why are you sending f16s in first? Stealth is always tip of the spear to conduct SEAD.

[@GageEakins]

Yes, it is baffling in the tactics. The stealth can get much closer so that when the SU-35 prepare for their 70 mile shots, they are hit by the stealth aircraft from nowhere.

[@davidwilliams5749]

Very good question.

[@davidwilliams5749]

@@GageEakins Exactly.

[@92HazelMocha]

Because SEAD requires post mission BDA; there would be no anti-ship strike in the first place. The sam sites would be targeted and then the anti-ship flights would take off if that mission was successful, which means no ToT attack. Some F35's would have to be the escort force since the aircraft in the first mission would be returning home which means less anti-ship missiles and a drastic decrease in target destruction. It also means Russia is now at war with the US and knows the US is targeting the black sea fleet which means they'd send more forces (both sams and aircraft) to defend it. A SEAD mission is a totally different scenario.

[@grimreapers]

It made sense in my head.

[@martinpalmer6203]

The F35's who had LRASMs aboard would have had a much higher RCS, which explains why the AI may bypass the ones which had fired, which would lower their RCS.

[@michaelsauer9129]

Cool tactical scenario, but for just the reasons you discovered, its not one the USAF would choose to fight. Realistically there is no reason to attack the BSF so far away from Odesa. Even allowing it to get halfway there would make a huge difference. s-400 range and rus aircraft flight times). The BSF is really only serious enough threat if its threatening an invasion of Odesa. Otherwise its simply not worth risking 4+ trillion dollars of USAF assets, especially the irreplaceable F-22s.

[@fgialcgorge7392]

For the scenario you created I personally think sending in the F22's first with a wave of F35's following from two separate vectors to soften up the air defenses would have been more efficient. Then use F15's as bomb trucks coming in behind another flight of F35's.

[@abcde_fz]

. WOW WHAT A TEAM !!! AS A NON-GAMER, I _LOVE_ TO SEE THE STUFF YOU FOLKS CAN DO !!! WHAT A BLAST !!! 😀😀😀

[@nicholasweis4057]

Can't wait for you guys to put the laser shield pods on the usa jets and run this again

[@tomsmythe4903]

Fuel is always a factor. That said, swinging the F35's further south before turning into the fleet would provide more separation between them and the diversionary forces (which I would bring in from directly north, not north-west). Also, I would bring two F22's before the F35s as cover and the rest before the F16's to fire upon the "discovered" F16's to the north. Finally, hold 1/3 of the F35's 10 minutes after the first wave to give the initial round time to exhaust the seaborn defensive stores firing upon the missiles. At that point, the final wave would find targets still afloat rather than sinking ships - no double-taps that way.

[@corporalsilver6981]

It felt like you were on the verge of having a panic attack but with joy throughout the video, you seemed to get way to excited and forgot what you were saying :D

[@justanotheroglesby2847]

As of right now 153 can’t go look around due to s3-400 on crimea coast. Some drones out of Middle East have gone by. Also a couple subs in Black Sea as well. You can’t deal with that I believe.

[@bruschi8148]

wonder how aim 260s would have done.. I see a redo in the future

[@knightsun2920]

Have a B1 come in to drop a few more AGM-158C LRASM missiles to clear out the rest of the defiance missiles and mop up with GBU-39 Small Diameter Bomb's?

[@mariom1653]

Could have also add some F-15 behind the F-16 as Reinforcements with External fuel so they can last longer in the air

[@chimerancreator9797]

i was mildly hoping for someone to go for a hail mary shot on the enemy awacs lol, even with the f16s getting demolished it is still pretty awesome to watch

[@hgrghost_actual]

Needed to put the Raptors on point, ahead of the Falcons. So by the time the gen 4s are seen, the ghost squad has already engaged. I would put them in a chain saw at the front thinning the herd until the F16s can get in range. F35s would never be seen.

[@deaconpimp]

This would never have happened without a massive SEAD package to tackle those S-400s. F-35s would have been used to penetrate as deep as possible and probably launch JSOWs at the S-400 sites. Then that wave of F-16s would have a fighting chance to be an effective screen. They'd probably also be given a CJ escort for added SEAD protection.

[@gerardpullen9449]

Cap to answer your question about deconfliction, even in the 90s antiship missles would divvy themselves up on ships based on size, more missles, the bigger the ship is. I highly reccomend you give Red Storm Rising by Tom Clancy a read. Its a fictional conflict between the ussr and Nato right before the collapse of the soviet union, and he describes the tech and tactics of both sides in such detail that he was almost brought up on charges of treason because of it.

[@wolf06291980]

Recap of the suggestions: Send in Raptors well ahead of the Vipers. Have some Vipers do SEAD with HARMS to reduce the threat. Mix in Eagle missile trucks on the backline for added defense. Send in a few decoy deployment aircraft. My suggestion with all of that is save the F-35s for A2A or SEAD and bring in a squadron of B2/B21 (depending on if were talking now or near future) with LRASMs. If there was ever a mission these were designed for, THIS is it.

[@Vulcanus3231]

Really like that cost of war box at the top right!

[@kith00000]

If done for real some drones or a lot of drones could be mixed in to create confusion. Also some missile trucks could drop palatized LRASM's as well.

[@theoneneo5024]

I may have missed it but why didn't you have at least some of the ships in port like you've done for other fleet attacks? I think it was the at on the US fleet at San Diego where you had 90% of the fleet in port and basically powered down. That makes a huge difference when it comes to defense.

[@2004dsgb]

Why didn't you add a wild Weasley attack as well?