Hotchkiss Universal SMG

he Hotchkiss Universal is a pretty interesting submachine gun, despite its rather clumsy appearance. The overriding design intent was to make a very compact folding carbine, and Hotchiss certainly met that objective. However, the gun ended up being too expensive and complex to achieve any real commercial success. Some wound up in Indochina, and some sales were made to Venezuela and Morocco, but that was about the extent of the Universal's production. There are a few of these guns that were imported into the US as live semi-auto carbines, interestingly.
www.forgottenwe...

[@rpena5320]

"... And the designer later moved to Japan and had a successful career designing children's toys; his most successful line being the Transformers"

[@longshot7601]

I was thinking that THIS is the most dangerous Transformer.

[@wolfehoffmann2697]

Transformers is a purely American IP. But it was highly successful in Japan.

[@potatoman1000]

@@wolfehoffmann2697 well yeah because Gundam and Voltron were already HUGE its not a surprise that transformers were a hit

[@darkmanstudios3828]

@@wolfehoffmann2697 well there was diaclone which provided the models that became the transformers

[@Fallen1334]

@@longshot7601 rjot3yi8o}uiktmtkjkm3

[@Ducaso]

The ingenuity of this firearm design is astounding. A modern version would sell like hotcakes.

[@Thelothuo]

+BattleScarGigantica Modern materials and manufacturing processes... The military would want nothing to do with something so complicated or easy to jam, but civilians would eat this shit up.

[@Ne1s0n64]

+Ducaso Pretty sure they would sell like Hotchcakes.... Man, that's not even really funny.

[@Ducaso]

Travis Nelson A for effort

[@trishooty4513]

+Ducaso Actualy, Kel Tec manufactures a similar 9mm carbine with a 16 inch barrel, what folds in half at the reciver, giving it an overall folded length of just over 16 inches.

[@mikeallen8724]

the FMG has a similar magazine folding system. are they actually in production yet? keltec sub2000 is a far simpler alternative to this gun. still very interesting, thanks ian.

[@Warriorcat49]

I'm surprised more stealth/action movies and or video games don't feature this weapon. Seems like the perfect thing to whip out of a briefcase or trench coat. :) Very cool gun.

[@av0-cad03]

probably because it's discrete and not many know about it, and they can use the FMG instead.

[@dannylamb456]

But the thing is the FMG 9 is a tacticool block of black plastic. This thing looks like something a plumber might have. "It's spare parts, sir."

[@av0-cad03]

*****​ and this is a French submachine gun, plus the FMG is really like a glock in a folding box so it can be a discrete pistol carbine

[@dannylamb456]

Dark Angel Dreadnaught Yeah, I suppose so but still. "It's a bunch of pipes, sir. Now let me do my job."

[@SebastianLarsen]

That's clearly not the only thing you've whipped out of a trench coat? :P

[@8digitPDX]

That should have been in one of the classic Bond films as a villain gun.

[@Petrospect]

Maybe the Grandma shooting at Bond in Goldfinger would find some use for it. Well, either that or the Lady Home Companion.

[@ringojsp.sanchex6953]

8digitPDX the smg poppe a Bonner

[@kyle360123]

Bond would cap that mf before he got it unfolded lol

[@ewanwilson1974]

Would have made for better villain confrontations with their henchmen.

[@gulfrelay2249]

chase scene: hero turns corner unarmed, bad guys run into 32 rnds of 9mm.

[@NormanMatchem]

The French don't get enough appreciation for their ingenuity in firearms.

[@NormanMatchem]

Howard Fortyfive Their firearm advancements throughout history are amazing, though.

[@NormanMatchem]

Howard Fortyfive The French designed the flintlock which went on to see widespread use for some of the 17th century, basically the entirety of the 18th century, and the early 19th century. They created the Minié ball which I think could be considered the first good step towards transitioning from musket balls to more aerodynamic bullets. This also improved the reload time for rifled muskets. Then there's the M1886 Lebel, which I think is the first design created from the ground up to be a repeating bolt action using smokeless ammo and FMJ bullets. With the advent of the M1886, all of Military rifles of the time were essentially rendered obsolete, or at least not as effective as the smokeless rifles that were to come. So yes, smokeless powder which is the standard now, almost 130 years later, is a French development. They were also the first to use Spitzer (pointed bullet) ammo, which improved accuracy quite a lot, however that MIGHT have been a Swiss invention I think, Just not used Militarily until the French got hold of it. One of the first true LMGs, the Chauchau or whatever it's called, is French. Also, it wasn't ALL THAT unreliable, it was mostly rechambered examples, like those made in .30-06. Though to be fair, the open mag design didn't help. The first standard issue semi auto rifle, the M1 Rifle, was designed by a French Canadian as well. They were also developing a semi auto rifle around 1940-41 or so, but the plans were hidden away so the Germans couldn't find them when they occupied the country. The M1 Rifle came earlier; 1936, while the Russian's SVT40's roots also come from the earlier SVT38, and I think even before that there was a select fire rifle of some sort in 1936. I don't think it was called the SVT36, though. So we've got the most popular firearm action of the 18th and early 19th centuries, the several advancements in bullet technology, smokeless powder which aided in making firearms FAR more effective, as well as contributing to the development of LMGs and early semi-auto rifles. I'd call that quite significant. By the way, I'm not French, so this info is unbiased.

[@jforozco12]

NormanMatchem That was a rather brief summary haha

[@NormanMatchem]

Jorge Orozco I tried not to go on for too long, gets the point across though.

[@KevinHillofDOOM]

NormanMatchem Or their ingenuity in general. The Citroën DS is still an amazing car 60 years later IMHO

[@Mildcat743]

"This is, unsurprisingly, French." Might be my favorite line of yours, Ian.

[@numberpirate]

Transformer banged an SMG and what do you get?

[@egg19]

Next time on the abused weapons channel...

[@badgerwildgaming6908]

Marcus Taber mega tons shit little brother

[@badgerwildgaming6908]

Mega tron stupid spellcheck

[@nervigeskind3131]

To be exact, an MP40

[@MJuegaES]

Tacticool: The Prototype.

[@enriqueuret]

Oie nomas ese cumbion che prro!! :v

[@ForgottenWeapons]

Yes - the French ended up adopting the MAT-49 for military service. It had a folding magazine well and a collapsing wire stock, but not the collapsing barrel or folding pistol grip of the Hotchkiss design.

[@waynemyers2469]

When folding it does the breech or chamber have to be empty or does the bolt lock because I could imagine that thing going off when your pulling the barrel down to lock it in place...

[@gillesguillaumin6603]

Impressive. I am French 🇨🇵 and I didn’t know it. I used the MAT. 49, and the rifle 49.56. Thank you Ian.🎉

[@zendell37]

I cannot give this video enough thumbs up... Thanks for another good video, Ian. I'm so glad you did the speedy "into action" for us.

[@codyhanna1908]

So...whose idea was it to give the grip the cross section of an oversized strip of staples? That's gotta be horrifically uncomfortable...

[@thomaslawler6904]

You're one of the most under-rated gun channels in this joint

[@AntonAdelson]

This had aged well...

[@yaboig3854]

Anton Adelson indeed

[@vandahm]

@@AntonAdelson I mean, he was right.

[@specnaz1395]

Yeah he " was " right

[@TheRogueWolf]

This looks like something a Bond villain would give his agents in the field. Ridiculously complex, yet cool-looking.

[@Flakfire]

Lol "Is it cute? Then it's French."

[@ForgottenWeapons]

Unfortunately, we aren't able to take that one shooting. :(

[@williamflowers9435]

Ian, I hope you get the part of the weapons supplier in the next John Wick movie🤞 The Universal is the perfect gun for you(playing the part of the exiled Elbonian Armaments Minister hiding in Morocco 🇲🇦 with a large cache of rare and exotic weapons) to hand John Wick after his plane crashed in the desert and he really needs a gun. The Belgian model 1915/27 Chauchat would be my other choice.

[@williamflowers9435]

As someone who’s always had an interest in firearms, especially 1930s-1950s era, I never appreciated French firearms to the extent that I do now. You’ve probably done more to redeem their reputation and spread awareness of the phenomenal innovation of their designs than anyone. Idk if the French have the equivalent of being “Knighted” but if they do, you deserve it!!!

[@robertcolbourne386]

what a great survival weapon for pilots lol

[@kieronwheeler3087]

It would be a good weapon for paratroopers or other airborne troops too. And it would have been pretty good for the police.

[@Hi11is]

@joe8075 You probably wouldn't approve of what the USAF has adopted, the GAU-5A which is based on the M-4/M-16/AR-15. I think evasion is viewed as more important than living off the land.

[@sashimanu]

Paratroopers need to have their weapons ready immediately after landing, so a no-go for them. Insurgents, partisans and stay-behind forces alike, on the other hand, may have liked it.

[@ManetInAEternum]

@@sashimanu The air force uses a m4 type pistol they have to assemble. It's neat, but a folder like this in an m4 type platform or in 9mm, like this would be efficient. One of the first functions to go in a high stress environment is fine motor skills, fumbling with assembling the barrel and making sure it's locked properly could be costly. This, but simplified I.E. ditch the folding magwell, or have it so the magazine locks in the magwell while unfolding would be excellent.

[@Jesses001]

In semi-automatic and some modern materials, this would be the best back-packing rifle ever.

[@grassfuse]

That is a very clever response to the need for a compact carry weapon.I think if I had to use one operationally,I'd carry some kind of a slip on sleeve for that pistol grip though!

[@gillesguillaumin6603]

Generaly paratroopers have leather gloves. They carry their weapon tied on the right thigh, in France

[@DesignatedKitty03-052]

this is like mass effect style gun folding

[@novashnova1232]

Except much worse.

[@luciusquinctiuscincinnatus6627]

A compact MP40 it looks like to me

[@kirbyis4ever]

Iron Drapes After it takes 4 years to fold up the bugger, but 2 seconds to whip out.

[@sethdaboss245]

ZaPhobos not really more like 10 seconds

[@ThommyofThenn]

Correct.

[@averylividmoose3599]

I see what you mean, barrel lug, same shaped magazine we'll, same magazine for 9mm luger and generally probably was inspired from the MP40. Efficient small design

[@thesturm8686]

It totally has the German spirit of complex thing

[@Boeing_hitsquad]

with the recent binge on survival backpack weapons and today's modern composites... something similar could reasonably sell if done correctly.. and maybe made to float in water.. and if the advertisement featured a guy opening it like a butterfly knife :D

[@MrYfrank14]

wouldnt opening it like a butterfly knife be a great scene in an action movie? pulls it out from under his coat and flips it around and it unfolds. we would slow it down and watch it ten times trying to figure out what he was doing.

[@satans-sadist3857]

That thing is cool, minus the uncomfortable looking grips. Could be a good paratrooper gun.

[@ForgottenWeapons]

Nothing (well, almost nothing) is too rare to shoot! :) No, we just had too little time with the owner of this piece, and it wasn't possible to do a range trip with him.

[@SayNoToDemocide1]

I guess this was a predecessor to the Kel-Tec Sub-2000.

[@SayNoToDemocide1]

Thanks for +1ing, Imagrumpy Oldman! =D

[@SayNoToDemocide1]

Thanks for +1ing, +Potatomaster! =D

[@SayNoToDemocide1]

Thanks for +1ing, *****! =D

[@SayNoToDemocide1]

Thanks for +1ing, Michael Weedmark! =D

[@SayNoToDemocide1]

Thanks for +1ing, +aerodog2! =D

[@strangeachep1577]

>germans: FalschirmjägerGewehr >French: this thing they sure learned

[@ForgottenWeapons]

I didn't try that, but I think you probably could (since it fires from a closed bolt). Not sure you'd really want to, though.

[@geGNOME]

Every time you do a video like this, i end up saying to myself; "This gun is completely ridiculous...I must have one."

[@Jay-Bass]

That is SO COOL! In my mind that has to be one of the most quirky SMG's ever produced. While I'm not familiar with it's ruggedness or capabilities, it certainly wins points for being innovative. Thanks for the vid! I may not have found out about this gun unless you uploaded this video!

[@OperationDEEZ]

I like to call this the Sub 2000 Gen 0.

[@yPhil]

Beautiful machine. Ian, I've been following your blog for ages, you are a gentleman and a scholar, merci beaucoup.

[@Leetgrain]

Okay, I would love one of these, they're pretty damn badass.

[@chrismccart1434]

This is beautiful in a James Bond kind of way

[@THR33SIXX3MPYR]

I've always though they could have made the buttstock on this longer so as to better sit in your shoulder. It certainly seems like there is room for it, with that U shape any extra length would clear the barrel on the folded position easily.

[@surft]

The sound the gun makes while you unfold and ready it is quite cool.

[@MK1Panzer]

Transformers! carbines in disguise!

[@braincowlol]

Hi Ian ! You're right this SMG was in competion with the MAT49, some of them were send to french troops during indochina war for field testing. Unfortunately it wasn't chosen, judge to complicate by soldiers with all this button and of course because Hotchkiss-Brandt was a private manufacture of armaments.

[@AFpaleoCon]

I want one.

[@BlackWolf18C]

I want to build them...

[@ericcurrier9215]

Some of the the most neat firearms designs I've ever seen

[@BigWheel.]

If i had one i would shoot it half as much as i would fold it! It's got 2 uses, SMG and Rubix cube!

[@colinsdad1]

What a neat firearm!! I know I seen guns that folded inside of a briefcase (HK PDW),but this takes it to another level

[@GIJeaux1]

I think it looks cool. That said, a US M3/M3A1 was just as compact by removing the magazine.

[@chopwood1998]

Some Madagascan police officers carry these I was confused by what they were carrying, glad the video shed some light on it

[@teamrussia9208]

2:47 That moment when gun jesus pressed the barrel release buttom! Skeeeesh

[@Orion3741]

Fascinating firearm. And masterfully presented to the public by Ian. Thank you.

[@BrianPatronie]

A friend of mine has two de-milled kits for sale if anyone is interested...

[@ForgottenWeapons]

I would be interested, depending on price and condition. Could you ask your friend to email me at [e-mail]?

[@Hennesseycation]

if he mabye still has one I'd be interested

[@grahamlopez6202]

3 years too late and 3 dollars short :(

[@ForgottenWeapons]

I don't know of any others offhand, but I wouldn't be surprised if there's something else out there...

[@FPSSovietNinja]

Finally, a carbine I can conceal carry! I actually want one of these, anyone have any blueprints? I've got a lathe...

[@zbigniewgurak8261]

Carbine ? SMG...

[@michaelstora70]

I've read these have just about every kind of integral safety and interlock imaginable. A really neat gun.

[@ErulianADRaghath]

That is a cool gun!

[@rubenskiii]

France has been in very, very dangerous times in the 1945-60s. I would love to see a movie about it, a bit in the style of Tinker Tailor Soldier Spy, but more grimly. I am totally imagining a scene with a guy in those beautiful clothes of the time period, going into an embassy or some other official building with a leather bag. With this in it. Maybe he's a terrorist, a freedom fighter or a pissed of Frenchman I don't know yet but would probably be a good watch.

[@wallmixer7274]

the concept reminds me of the Kel-tec sub 2000.

[@elsaviolaheart]

I think this video confirmed for me that folding rifles (and folding submachine guns) are my favorite type of firearm.

[@TroopperFoFo]

Looks like a really weird M3 grease gun.

[@kingkong-qt7nm]

look just like a post WW2 submachine gun

[@ArmednSafe]

If the sub-2000 wasn't already out there, these would probably sell. It is a very unique design. Thanks for the video.

[@de0509]

Yeah it seems kinda uncomfortable to hold and all but I really feel this is a gun you that makes you jsut hope for something bad to happen. Just for the pleasure of unfolding the gun. They shouldve put in a carrying handle. This is some Mass Effect kind of shit here.

[@srjohndeans5508]

There is a carrying handle.

[@charlesoconnor6247]

Ahhhh the old classic inro.. still satisfying today

[@CaliPatriot88]

It's the bastard child of an MP40 and a Sten, cool gun though.

[@nimbalo300]

Red Castle I agree wit red here it looks like a grease gun and an mp 40 which isn't that bad if they took the best from both

[@TheBlueMeanie]

WOW. Much faster to deploy than i thought it would be. Awesome as always.

[@anno.nym.faceless]

Am I the only one, that thinks it looks (a bit) like a MP40?

[@BarcodeTeacup]

That thing is pretty slick, took just about 5 seconds to unfold it and be ready to shoot, impressive.

[@JBL_69]

It's folds like that so it's easier to run away (french)

[@reptilesgamers00]

***** I see what you did there... =)

[@ForgottenWeapons]

Actually, it is far from an MP38 copy. The Hotchkiss is hammer-fired from a closed bolt, which is completely different form the MP38's open bolt mechanism.

[@rejmons1]

Really pocket submachine gun... And ugly dude. The constructor have seen too many times german MP40. Of course, it is poorer version. But it's pretty typical: Germans make AUDIs, BMWs and Mercedes. And France - Renaults, Peugeots and Citroens...

[@e.hellbrand9707]

and they also lost the bloody war.

[@rejmons1]

E.Hellbrand No bloody! They called this war "strange". Germans - "sitzkrieg" (war in a sitting position). And then, in the time of spring, Germans army runs through the Ardens and break the back bone of French army. It took only three weeks, and one of the most strong armies in the world was broken into dust by Germans. Then in 50-ties of XX century they lost because of foolishness of generals the war in Vietnam (Dien Bien Hu). And then in Algeria in 60-ties... Definitely, I can not recommend any French weapon, because it's the weapons of very consistent losers...

[@fluffthesergal7640]

Tomasz Wójcik In the past France had failed many-a-time durng and after WW2. It seems like now they are getting a little better, but I will say in Germany VS France today I think Germany would win despite that Germany has a small army (because the old rules are still in place). The only French weapons I know are the FAMAS, FR2 (ugly but powerful sniper) and the Chauchat (failure of a gun, but only reason I remember it).... France is too peaceful now to bother being a war country, but at least they have good food!

[@rejmons1]

Truly, the French cuisine is really excellent! And wines as well.

[@PawelTheShrubber]

Braedon Fisher France is just like an angry child that after napoleonic wars and franco prussian war, decided that he doesnt want to play anymore. But you have to hand it to them, they pretty much ruled europe for a long time before napoleons russian campaign. That may be because of internal weakness of the HRE but still. So no, they are not really consistent losers. Also if you look at the French tanks, at the start of the IIWW they had the strongest armoured division. Their tanks had the best cannons and armour without being so useless as for example british Matilda. Shame they didnt really use them.

[@Octodad1]

Honestly you could put that up for display in an art gallery as a metal working sculpture because when its folded up it takes a serious leap of the imagination for anyone who doesn't know its an SMG to realise its actually a gun.

[@MrGarethG]

That actually looks useful, the things that seem to let it down (hollow hand grip, short butt-plate) would quickly be modified in the field, for example you wouldn't be constantly folding and unfolding once you had dropped into theater so you would make an insert for the hand grip to fill the slot in the front and your armorer would soon make a deeper butt-plate to replace the one fitted.

[@troy9477]

I think i just figured out what Ian's range toy was in the Q&A video on In Range TV. Nice design, pretty well thought out and practical. I could see Secret Service and other plainclothes agencies liking something like this. Great video as always. Thank you

[@uglytruck07]

i like this channel, homage to the lesser known weapons instead of the mainstay of weapons we use now a days.

[@getchasome6230]

I watched this 7 years ago but watched it again today in case I missed something.

[@soyhugo390]

That is a very clever desing for a paratroper gun

[@mklawson83]

A kid in a candy shop. This is the best part of gun culture. Firearms are art.

[@cptreech]

You have to remember, the French eventually adopted the MAT 49 which had some of these features (fold up magazine and fold away but) but was such a good combat SMG the VC preferred it to the Russo/Chinese "Burp" guns or even the Tommy.

[@509Gman]

As seen in the movie "L'Ennemi intime" (Intimate Enemies).

[@SnowRocker88]

VERY VERY cool!! This is the grandfather of the FMG9 concept! I do agree, this would be great for an old paratrooper! Great share!

[@madgameman1]

That's an extremely interesting design, as with everything you show, I would love to have one!

[@jettrooper3rd930]

That barrel pop-out is really nifty, definately didn't see that coming!

[@JamesRPatrick]

It's like a badass FMG-9. Nice work with the deployment.

[@jasonscott8844]

That gun made so many nice clicky sounds.

[@BeefaloBart]

Extreme Awesomeness, and probably the best and coolest weapon you have reviewed yet. This thing was way ahead of its time and the fact it only saw little use is a flat out shame. Modern folders have been in use for many years in the US and until recently some were not known publicly.

[@dr.johnpaladinshow9747]

It's nice to look at old vids of channels that are now BIG. Cell phone cam, no external microphone, off the cuff content... It gives me hope ;-)

[@WhiteCavendish]

Freakin awesome. Other than the magazine having to be pinned, I suspect that the semi-only version of this ought to be non restricted in Canada. I would love to own that thing! Most fun backpack gun ever!

[@calvacoca]

Designing a thing like this without computers was surely a great piece of mind storming.

[@tonyktx44]

That is without a doubt the coolest folder I have ever seen. Kudo's for a great review.

[@gregsummers7350]

Ian thank you yet again. Your presentation style and knowledge is outstanding. Kind regards, Greg

[@brianartillery]

That has to be one of the coolest guns I've ever seen. A perfect movie gun, too - a gunman could shoot somebody, and then walk calmly out through the screaming crowds and armed police, with the gun stowed away in a small bag. It's such a rare gun, nobody would know about it. It's genius.

[@vladpiranha]

This would be harder to justify as a primary weapon, but as a backup weapon for a sniper, I can see it becoming invaluable. There's potential here. It's a pity that it was never fully explored.

[@TheTNK97]

This is one of the coolest things I've ever seen..

[@Chebva]

Awesome design. Wish more guns were like this.

[@rogerwilco2]

I think that's pretty cool. Very functional for what it's designed to do.

[@letmeouttamycage]

Thats so cool how the barrel shoots out

[@jaredneaves7007]

that is probably one of the coolest things I've seen on Forgotten Weapons yet! I can't recall seeing a FMG yet so forgive me if you have done a video on one. it would be cool to see the newer interpretation of a highly compact folding gun.

[@HotCuppaCoffee]

Someone said, "We need a carbine that folds-up, _really, really_ small." Well, the folks at Hotchkiss certainly achieved that! I've never seen a weapon with so many buttons, catches, and springs. The machinist in me, finds it strangely alluring.

[@skullstabber9]

never seen or heard of one of these before. man thats pretty cool thanks for the vid

[@job1181]

You should send this video to Magpul or Kel-tec, either of them probably would love to make that gun since both have created something similar but not nearly as durable. The big seller on this is the spring loaded barrel. It would create the super small package an SBR give you, but none of the tax stamp BS since the gun can't fire until the barrel is extended to it's full 16" length. Amazing little carbine.

[@sharpie443]

My friend Chris who owns American specialty ammo just got a very rare kit for this gun. He's going to be putting it together with another gunsmith and hopefully we will be shooting it on video by the end of the summer.

[@blackmancer]

great engineering, looks really thought through as to its main purpose, that being small, compact and easily stored. maybe not the best gun in terms of outcomes but really interesting. A lot of people would see it and not know it was a gun.

[@ForgottenWeapons]

No, it uses a proprietary mag.

[@LarS1963]

Someone on another of Ian's videos commented upon how French firearms had to be like an abstract painting. Weird, beautiful and cool. :)

[@ColePaquette]

Honestly, I will admit that I think the Hotchkiss Universal, with the exception of the pistol grip, is a really nice looking gun.

[@314299]

Weird and wonderful! Great video as usual.

[@giovannibattistaponzetto5860]

loved the smile on your face at the end.... it really is a funky rifle!!!