How did Stark Future design their battery pack and what it means for the future of battery design

[@EVboi-Kiwi]

It's 360vdc - 100S x 4P 100 x 3.6vdc = 360vdc 4 x 4.5Ah = 18Ah 360vdc x 18Ah = 6480Wh (6.48kWh) Battery rated continuous power (each cell 10C = 45amps) = 64.8kW

[@RIPPERTON]

Yes it IS 100s but at full charge the battery is 420 volts...so At 4 cells in parallel = 180 peak amps makes 75.6 kW of battery power. After the inverter you get 60kW at the wheel. Capacity wise, after the recent update which charges the battery to 4.2volts per cell you get 7.5kWh. The first release didnt charge the battery to a full 4.2v per cell.

[@Doctorbasss]

I design laser welding machines for EV. Many manufacture like Tesla, Lucid and other big players are using what is called SINGLE END welding which consist of welding positive and negative to teh current collecotrs ( busbar) from the same side. This allow using the bottom ( negative ) for cooling. The negative is in fact VERY close to the jelly roll inside which conduct heat very well. Way more than the positive due to the room for venting and CID on top. They place TIM ( Therma Intertface Material) that is also insulator to conduct heat but not electricity to teh aluminum cast. The new 4680 from Tesla is also optimized for that purpose as what they call tabless design. But in fact from now they use side cooling with ribbon cooling chanel between cells row instead of bottom cooling on these.

[@dogdipstick]

just lemme buy one laser. i got 10,000$ cash.

[@BULZZixAGP]

You work for Hesse?

[@motomiles5311]

Great video. You've probably seen that Stark announced last week that they have upgraded the pack, I assume to use the P45B, for nominal 6.5 kW/h instead of the original 6 kW/h. Already looking forward to 500 Wh/kg batteries as announced by Amprius and CATL in the last couple of weeks. That's about double the gravimetric 242 Wh/kg of the P45B. Probably at least a couple of years away, but these could result in a ~15Kg weight saving, or twice the capacity/range.

[@fredericchastro4263]

Hi ,very nice and useful video.I think the same idea that the center of the battery is the main innovation with the negative side close to positive, also impressed by the huge power that be in it, that's 400 cells ( 200 x 2 sides).The total weight with case had to be around 32 kg !! and very few cables length !!

[@electricmotionhawaii]

Thanks for your appreciation of the vid. It would be so cool to be right

[@jani58UTube]

I asked Stark support about the battery and they confirmed the configuration to be 100S4P but didn’t want to disclose the type of cell but there is an announcement on Molicel’s website, so I guess it’s official that the Varg is using the Molicel INR-21700-P45B: Electrifying Milestone for Molicel: Stark Future Makes History as First Electric Vehicle Manufacturer Winning Over Combustion in Motocross Track Racing Championship (YT didn't allow me to paste the link)

[@leoncheck1]

Some information are Not as correct as you think. The battery is an 100 S 4 p configuration splitted in 10 x 10s Module in the BMS an bonded with Aluminium fuse wires. For this the middle of the top is positiv and the top Outside Ring is negativ as well as the side. So Connections are only on the top face of the cell. They use a Double bond insteat of a Single like alta to prevent this battery fault. Cell changes would be difficult like on an alta. The White Cover is only for seperat the two half and isolation.. under this are Slave BMS PCB's with integrated copper Bus Bars to connect and balancing.

[@MotoAlias]

The way the cells sit into the mold you couldnt get to the end to connect to negative thats why theyre connecting to the negative on the side of the cell instead. Very interesting.

[@TravisNobles]

Great analysis!

[@dbc105]

It's about time they get in the market.

[@electricmotionhawaii]

Thanks for subscribing !!

[@RIPPERTON]

You have calculated battery voltage from your theory of 20 cells in series. You only counted half of the pack, theres the other side. so 40 s 10p (4.2Ah cell) 168 volts and 42Ah = 7 kWh so a conservative 6 kWh usable.

[@BULZZixAGP]

10s4p

[@eastwood111]

I don’t think they’re using Molicel cells because they’re only pulling 16 A because of the high voltage. There would be no need for a high discharge battery.

[@electricmotionhawaii]

Good Point. The vid really looks like it but hard to tell. Thanks for subscribing !!

[@sanghapalmangale220]

Great video man..!! just needed this info for some day saying it infornt of Eisher Motors ;)

[@electricmotionhawaii]

Thanks for subscribing !!

[@garbageman3992]

2 big things. the varg actually has 400 cells, not 200. it has 200 on each side of its casings. the other thing is that they claim that their battery is a 400v battery so that is better for efficiency but jeez thats getting dangerous to do anything with. just wait for the bikes to get old and start killing people who try to work on them. but I like how they rated their power output very accurately relative to the batteries output capabilities. now the issue is the inefficiency at low rpm/riding speeds. I could never buy one since trail riding must be incredible hard on these single speed bikes.

[@_electricfox_]

You are wrong with your battery configuration. Its already known that they use a nominal 360V battery, so 420V fully charged. Why? Because Lots of amps mean lots of heat and inefficency. The battery must be a 100S 4P configuration.

[@electricmotionhawaii]

Hmmm, yeah, that make sense too. Where did you find the voltage spec. I don't remember seeing it anywhere?

[@GiovanniEsposito5]

@@electricmotionhawaii You can see the voltage on their display. The battery is 100s4p.

[@federico297]

@@electricmotionhawaii yea, it's confirmed to be a 100s 4p battery

[@MotoAlias]

​@@GiovanniEsposito5 so 360v 16ah... that's interesting. Definitely way u9gher voltage than any other bikes out right now. Seems like they took a play out of Alta redshirt playback with the higher voltage setup.

[@lopnajhardcoremetal7686]

I search from google, 10 vertical 22 horizontal. The voltage of stark is 360v means 100 series of 3.6v batteries. In parallel they use 4.4 parellel, So 4.2 x 4.4 approx 18.48. In total 360s x 18.48 = 6,652.8 of power input. Hi voltage, they create 14,200 of rpm according to google. In this moment i am searching thw gear reduction.😂😂😂😂😂

[@mxriderdakar]

They say that the battery can take 500 charges at 100%, but i am wondering me being in canada and having to store the bike november to march april, how often do i have to charge it during winter? Should i charge it? is there a % of charge that it should be kept exemple under 100%? And when you partially charge, does it affect the 500 charges at 100% of the battery life?

[@ulwur]

Lithium batteries likes to be stored in room temperature and at 3,7 or 3,8 volt per cell to minimize ageing. Storing at 100% charge increases ageing.

[@mxriderdakar]

@ulwur thanks, i was asking myself that question for my yz450f too, but i guess there are no way to do it correctly. I try to charge it back every month to 100% but i guess it is not the best way. Stark replied me for there bike between 30 to 60% but there app will have a storage mode.

[@nobrakes7247]

Nice

[@Doctorbasss]

Even if some level 3 cahrging stations (the DC 400 or 800V charging stations we know) can go as low as 50Vdc on teh AC-DC modules insides these, they software is very rarely allowing chraging below 200Vdc. that's why ZERO which had in the past the Dc level 3 charge station CHADEMO option decided to discontinu it as they were using 102Vdc voltage and most charge stations was not working properly with that because of software limitations on the charge stations. A 400Vdc battery can better exploit the full potential of fast charging and compatibility for the level 3.

[@braaaphawaii]

Did you order one of those bikes?

[@alerodriramos]

Calma em breve teremos a engenharia reversa dos chineses e os segredos serão desvendados 😅

[@ELECTRICMOTOCROSSMACHINE]

Thanks for the killer vid!

[@electricmotionhawaii]

Thanks for subscribing !!

[@BULZZixAGP]

All I care to know is legit range numbers for each power level. There’s 0 info on that…

[@electricmotionhawaii]

yeah its always a toss up on range since there are so many variables

[@zaarkeru3391]

Now we have more info on that from real customer tests, about the range that could be expected. about 10-15% more than a Alta Red MX.

[@ElectricBikeLaboratory]

P45B cells, which is the newer gen. Not P42A. And the P45B are drastically better

[@eastwood111]

They’re not drastically better they’re barely better for about four times the price

[@ElectricBikeLaboratory]

@@eastwood111 Ive tested them pretty thoroughly, the P42s are about 9mohm AC 1khz impedence vs the P45s are about 6mohm. Capacity is only about 10 percent higher. DC sag with a 20A load on a fully charged 4.15V cell goes down to 3.80V on the P42 and 3.90 on the P45 (0.35V vs 0.25V) pretty close to a 30 percent improvement there. Its by far the lowest IR of a cylindrical cell Ive seen, even way lower than VTC4 or other low capacity power cells. Personally I think its a fairly monumental step forward.

[@makingstuffbetter9432]

The battery configuration on the Stark he's 42 amp hours 450 amps 10 x 4.2 is 42 amp hours 10 x 45 amps is 450 peak amps I believe that's how they did it.

[@dogdipstick]

Molicell p42A are weak. I said it. Its true. This will be a very high resistance pack relative to the other packs that OEM makers are using in the EV nowadays.

[@dogdipstick]

Lol @ 7,40 killawatt hours.. er I mean watt hours" ...

[@dogdipstick]

You added up the amps on teh Molicell VERy wrong. 4p can do 180A.. not 900. Its not a 72v bike.. ist a HV bike.

[@dogdipstick]

@@GetLowRacingOfficial Chevy VOlt cells . LGZ-P2.7 and its a 25aH 387A contin 2000A + 1mOh cell. takes 15p of Molicell p42A to make one Chevy cell IR. Lol. You buy them from Chevrolet doood. Destroys the Molicell all day. I leave molicell builds in the dust.

[@eastwood111]

@@dogdipstick Interesting!